Falcon Paladin casted this strategy this weekend and asked if anybody had done it to Artosis yet, I'm so glad the community wasted no time in doing it.
@@CanariasCanariass No, 100%. I would love to see you clowns defend this while the lings are also hitting the barracks and depots. This is complete bullshit period.
@@goergebobicles1351 and besides people who decline updates for a game have no right to complain about balance or claim something is broken or bullshit imo
Yeah this does seem like a silly map, I get it's for Zerg to defend, but it shouldn't let them get a new attack option not normally available to their race. It's not as bad, but it's like when they put the Holy War map in the Korean league where there was a neutral Terran command center than Zerg could infest that fucked over Protoss in the ZvP matchup.
But such map features are actually interesting on maps that last for like a season. It shakes some matchups and provides something special. If you truly hate the map, you can Veto it.
This is a sort of map feature that low level players complain about because they lack the ability or the motivation to figure out how to counter it. It's as simple as that. There are counters, and executing them doesn't take unachievable levels of micro. The difference between executing them is literally just "some people learn how to make these strategies completely ineffective and some people decide they're just gonna get their shit rocked every single time an opponent uses that strat on them, hands down, just like artosis."
@@tyfhg1 This sort of map feature is fucking trash because it looks like shit, and is difficult to even see that the sunken is there let alone click it. This is completely unprofessional as a ladder map and there's no justification for it being produced by Blizzard. I'm more unimpressed with this than the infamous Crazy Critters. At least that map doesn't attack your UI.
Gotta say, I agree with Artosis on that one. No reason for those neutral cocoons to be there. If they wanted chokes, they should use landscape/tiling or map sprites to do that. For a casual map, this would be fine, but for a ladder map it just seems stupid...
it is there so zergs can build in their own base sunkens. since in that map your neutral is in the back and the opening is somewhat wide and distant from creep, zergs would usually be unable to stop vultures from coming in and destroying all they love, the goal of the cacoons is to let zergs make spines to defend themselves. the sunken rush is another result of this somewhat silly design though
@@wizardcat7407 that is a good point. One solution they could have done as an alternative is to have neutral creep tiles (available with the special editor maps) near wide chokes around the main instead of giant cocoon walls that block melee characters from sunkens. The trade off would be that the tiles would be permanent, but it would prevent stupid cheese sunken rushes like this to even be a thing.
@@andressantamaria5329 I believe you actually can attack the sunken though you need to click a specific part of the overmind coccoon. I could be wrong though
Flash would of talked with the map makers and politely ask they take those doodads out. Then he'd open his umbrella and fly the into the sky like mary fucking poopins
Because Blizzard wants to create new features for SC:BW without actually putting in any effort to create new features, so they put lazy UMS hacks into ladder maps. Won't be long until we have light switches, flying drones, and stack cannons.
@@waltercapa5265 Blizzard put the map on the ladder??? This is an official map, not some random user-made thing. Are you trying to say it's not Blizzard's fault they're too lazy to make content nor disciplined enough to decide to not make new content, and instead steal hacky workarounds from the usermade UMS scene to put in official content?
@@ddshocktrooper5604 So what? They didn't invent it. Map makers have been doing it for decades. The fact that some map makers are working for blizzard doesn't mean shit. This is an old thing. Dude, read the question again. Why are there those things there? Because the map maker decided it.
i remember arty being so happy about the new map pool too. Zerg on ringing bloom is just stupid though. one time i didnt wall and i just built a bunker between my CC and the overminds. It turns out marines in a bunker with ranged upgrade can still be outranged by sunkens if they are placed at weird angles. what a fun way to just lose the game.
When your game is old enough to have graduated college, this is the kind of shit done to "spice" it up. Fair or not, it is indeed spicy. Or is it salty...?
Pretty sure you could hit that with SCV's. He clicked on it a moment before it finished so you could directly order your SCV's to attack. Building stack is common on UMS but the trick is to find the area where the building you want to select is exposed. Maybe it's not balanced but it's doable.
well, its kinda why they are there. For zergs to be able to have some defencive sunkens on HG vs early teran pushes. Since your 2nd base is behind your main, you dont have the typycaal choke to defend in front of t2, and this ramp is the place you need to def. And the creep from main hatch dosent go there
i didnt even know this was a thing, how is that overmind cacoon even in the maps, just replace it with some protoss singler player building or something, so dumb lol
Am I missing something? the mini overminds are neutrals so if you just attack move you should be able to hit the sunken under it since it's an enemy unit? or even just hold position?
I'm guessing it's actually inside the overmind so SCVs don't have the range to hit it. the marine was shooting it but you need several marines to take down a sunken.
kinda 2 years late but ... couldn't you a-click the ground for the marines to auto target the sunken? from what i remember of BW, it should still have standard RTS controls, so the marines AI should still prioritize the sunken which is hostile, over the neutral cocoon
[25.11.20] SC:R 1v1 (FPVOD) royaL (T) vs Yoon (Z) [2 Games] at Home of Starcraft youtube channel, Royal easily counters this sunken rush on this map no problem.
I don't get why Zergs always need special treatment on the maps. They already get cheap, fast units. Defend the ramp w that. Just like the stupid double gas on Sparkle. No one begs for Zergs to be limited like the constant mass of unbuildable terrain to prevent mass turrets. No, they get whatever they need to shore up disadvantages... Odd.
Well Sparkle was justified, but they ended up fcking up ZvT, and still didn't fix ZvP enough. I think with Flash and Last gone they will go back making better maps for Terran
His scvs can't attack it, and it's therefore guaranteed to finish building. That's what he was referring to. If the scvs are able to attack the sunken building, he probably kills it and holds off the rush
Falcon Paladin casted this strategy this weekend and asked if anybody had done it to Artosis yet, I'm so glad the community wasted no time in doing it.
Link plz
I'm still waiting for a high level Protoss to mass recall shuttles on his base with zealots inside.
@DeadInfested If true you are doing the Lord's work.
Flash would've attacked it.
The Artosis salt is actually completely justified for once
Not completely but 70%
@@CanariasCanariass No, 100%.
I would love to see you clowns defend this while the lings are also hitting the barracks and depots.
This is complete bullshit period.
@@qcdoomqc if it wins the game it wins the game, broodwar is "fair and balanced" after all.
@@goergebobicles1351 and besides people who decline updates for a game have no right to complain about balance or claim something is broken or bullshit imo
only fair considering that on normal maps Zerg can't wall in
Flash would've had nukes by the time the colony finished and would've been able to attack it.
i'm with artosis on this one, this is indeed unfair
Flash could have hit it.
Not even flash could have
If you do something despicable near a fjord, it is only appropriate for your opponent to say "fujck you".
great game design BTW, being able to hide a sunken inside a cocoon
Balanced and fair
look closer, it's actually behind the cocoon.
It's so easy to hold this, tosis misplaying hard
how did he build a sunken without creep? is this hax?
Yeah this does seem like a silly map, I get it's for Zerg to defend, but it shouldn't let them get a new attack option not normally available to their race. It's not as bad, but it's like when they put the Holy War map in the Korean league where there was a neutral Terran command center than Zerg could infest that fucked over Protoss in the ZvP matchup.
the map was called Holy World, and there literally was one pro game where it happened.
But such map features are actually interesting on maps that last for like a season.
It shakes some matchups and provides something special.
If you truly hate the map, you can Veto it.
This is a sort of map feature that low level players complain about because they lack the ability or the motivation to figure out how to counter it. It's as simple as that. There are counters, and executing them doesn't take unachievable levels of micro. The difference between executing them is literally just "some people learn how to make these strategies completely ineffective and some people decide they're just gonna get their shit rocked every single time an opponent uses that strat on them, hands down, just like artosis."
Do you see this game? Have you seen Terran lose to sunken push? Not silly at all, it's genius.
@@tyfhg1 This sort of map feature is fucking trash because it looks like shit, and is difficult to even see that the sunken is there let alone click it. This is completely unprofessional as a ladder map and there's no justification for it being produced by Blizzard. I'm more unimpressed with this than the infamous Crazy Critters. At least that map doesn't attack your UI.
Gotta say, I agree with Artosis on that one. No reason for those neutral cocoons to be there. If they wanted chokes, they should use landscape/tiling or map sprites to do that. For a casual map, this would be fine, but for a ladder map it just seems stupid...
it is there so zergs can build in their own base sunkens. since in that map your neutral is in the back and the opening is somewhat wide and distant from creep, zergs would usually be unable to stop vultures from coming in and destroying all they love, the goal of the cacoons is to let zergs make spines to defend themselves. the sunken rush is another result of this somewhat silly design though
@@wizardcat7407 that is a good point. One solution they could have done as an alternative is to have neutral creep tiles (available with the special editor maps) near wide chokes around the main instead of giant cocoon walls that block melee characters from sunkens. The trade off would be that the tiles would be permanent, but it would prevent stupid cheese sunken rushes like this to even be a thing.
Yea sunken rushing Terran shouldn’t be a thing. Not even sure how you’re supposed to defend against that.
@@ericyang8474 if there is permanent creep there then terran and protoss cannot wall
@@TheSuperappelflap a 2×2 creep tile could easily be placed behind some tiling or sprites that would make walling still possible.
Why are there Overmind cocoons on Artosis’ base ?
it's a feature of the map; zerg can build underneath it so they can wall off even though the ramp is really wide. it also allows sunken rushes.
This is really broken though
@@mercilessmoop5093 what a shitty map then.
@@andressantamaria5329 I believe you actually can attack the sunken though you need to click a specific part of the overmind coccoon. I could be wrong though
@@joeyjoestar472 Don't you just have to attack move the ground?
Flash would of talked with the map makers and politely ask they take those doodads out. Then he'd open his umbrella and fly the into the sky like mary fucking poopins
Arty: How did this happen?
Artosis. For your sake. Take a break. And come back stronger. You can do it!
I feel bad for Artosis's poor wife, and what she has to deal with every day 😂😂😂
Flash would only have a 99% chance to go B if this happened to him
Why is there an Overmind Cocoon in a multiplayer?
Feature of the map
Because Blizzard wants to create new features for SC:BW without actually putting in any effort to create new features, so they put lazy UMS hacks into ladder maps. Won't be long until we have light switches, flying drones, and stack cannons.
@@ddshocktrooper5604 lmao. Map creators have been doing this shit for decades. Has nothing to do with blizzard.
@@waltercapa5265 Blizzard put the map on the ladder??? This is an official map, not some random user-made thing. Are you trying to say it's not Blizzard's fault they're too lazy to make content nor disciplined enough to decide to not make new content, and instead steal hacky workarounds from the usermade UMS scene to put in official content?
@@ddshocktrooper5604 So what? They didn't invent it. Map makers have been doing it for decades. The fact that some map makers are working for blizzard doesn't mean shit. This is an old thing. Dude, read the question again. Why are there those things there? Because the map maker decided it.
Let's try something new... "Scan could show him how to attack it"
Scan would have taught him how Flash does it.
Wait this is an official ladder map? Damn that's wack.
Flash would have approved maps that didn't have game breaking mechanics.
Zerg: *Gets a tool outside of 4 pool that lets them apply pressure to Terran before Mutalisks*
Terran: "Wait a minute, that's illegal"
No, this isn't even close to legitimate. Everybody loses their minds when Protoss does something a fraction as vile as this.
damn his face is so mad
i remember arty being so happy about the new map pool too. Zerg on ringing bloom is just stupid though. one time i didnt wall and i just built a bunker between my CC and the overminds. It turns out marines in a bunker with ranged upgrade can still be outranged by sunkens if they are placed at weird angles. what a fun way to just lose the game.
Fast build vultures and lay mines around the area
Ok I actually feel for him this time.
That's a pretty whacky strat.
Sunkentosis
Jesus christ 75% of this comment section has never played a ladder game and you can tell
THERES NO WORDS ON IT!!!!
*nervous laughter*
Flash would have hit it. And it would have turned the other cheek.
Arty memes aside, his rage was kinda justified for this one lol
Working as intended. Please email blizzard support if you don’t like it
FLASH WOOD OF WON
Flash wouldn’t quit
did he hit it
That's messed up lol
Holy shit the face at 0:30 XD
When your game is old enough to have graduated college, this is the kind of shit done to "spice" it up.
Fair or not, it is indeed spicy. Or is it salty...?
Funny this is you can attack it.
Just......*laughs out loud*
What am I watching lolol I didn’t realize he had this in him.
Pretty sure you could hit that with SCV's. He clicked on it a moment before it finished so you could directly order your SCV's to attack. Building stack is common on UMS but the trick is to find the area where the building you want to select is exposed. Maybe it's not balanced but it's doable.
I like this map, but those blockers in the front ramp should not allow zerg to build under it
well, its kinda why they are there. For zergs to be able to have some defencive sunkens on HG vs early teran pushes. Since your 2nd base is behind your main, you dont have the typycaal choke to defend in front of t2, and this ramp is the place you need to def. And the creep from main hatch dosent go there
doesn't the AI attack the enemy over a neutral building?
i didnt see how it all went down, but that seemed bad
Just do it!!!!
How does this even work??? Can you build the sunken right on top of the overmind cocoons?
and another gem
i kinda feel bad for him in this one
wow, i didn´t even see the zerg attacking behind the structure... =p
i didnt even know this was a thing, how is that overmind cacoon even in the maps, just replace it with some protoss singler player building or something, so dumb lol
Am I missing something? the mini overminds are neutrals so if you just attack move you should be able to hit the sunken under it since it's an enemy unit? or even just hold position?
I'm guessing it's actually inside the overmind so SCVs don't have the range to hit it. the marine was shooting it but you need several marines to take down a sunken.
He can’t not target fire sunken when the ling show up. Not that it matter anyway since sunken outrange marine and he does not have enough marine
0:27 I kekd hard
kinda 2 years late but ... couldn't you a-click the ground for the marines to auto target the sunken? from what i remember of BW, it should still have standard RTS controls, so the marines AI should still prioritize the sunken which is hostile, over the neutral cocoon
sounds like willem dafoe yelling :D
That seems broken.
how are you actually supposed to hold this?
Flash would go S with that
Can someone give me the rundown on this and what the fuck happened?
Doesn't attack move work?
Yes and no, since the zerglings came, he couldn't focus sunken
Flash wouldnt have hit it because Flash would have designed a better map to begin with
Flash would've been able to hit it
Oh man this is funny
yepp that's broken
I mean, that IS bullsh¡t.
I do have to agree with Artosis that the ladder maps are just pure garbage
Подгорел Артосис аааааааа!1
I made an insane amount of salt off this game. This player was much lower rated lol
[25.11.20] SC:R 1v1 (FPVOD) royaL (T) vs Yoon (Z) [2 Games] at Home of Starcraft youtube channel, Royal easily counters this sunken rush on this map no problem.
this is a process?
I don't get why Zergs always need special treatment on the maps. They already get cheap, fast units. Defend the ramp w that.
Just like the stupid double gas on Sparkle. No one begs for Zergs to be limited like the constant mass of unbuildable terrain to prevent mass turrets. No, they get whatever they need to shore up disadvantages...
Odd.
perhaps they want more players to pick up zerg since it seems to be the least popular race in BW. this map is probably a step too far though lol
Well Sparkle was justified, but they ended up fcking up ZvT, and still didn't fix ZvP enough. I think with Flash and Last gone they will go back making better maps for Terran
While the rage is hilarious, ringing bloom is a garbage map
how is it possible not counting this as a cheat and make him being banned ?
Omg this is funny
Flash would've have would have winned
This map does suck
Flash would have hit it.
Balanced :)
What map is this?
ringing bloom
that's a weird way to spell GG
Player_Blizzard haha
wtf is this zerg build?
he very angri i'm only sad he didn't do the >:( face only he can make
Maps come, maps go. This sucks but thankfully is just map based.
Flash could hit it
Artosis gets so mad cause in his mind he's as goood as the pros but keeps losing to randos on ladder
I would kind of agree, though what is happening in this video is complete and utter bullshit..
@@qcdoomqc see I dont think so cause this match is played all the time by pros and I never see this, arto himself casts this map all the time
This isn't bullshit when the counter to the play is spending literally five minutes on google researching how to stop it from happening
Zesagi
I'm really wondering how fucking trash the maps are that Artosis did ban if this is on his list.
I can't french I can't english I can't hit it....
is there a video of someone defending this ?
Flash would've killed it with 3 SCV long before sunken completed.
But he was attacking it was clearly half HP...
His scvs can't attack it, and it's therefore guaranteed to finish building. That's what he was referring to. If the scvs are able to attack the sunken building, he probably kills it and holds off the rush
@@blizzfreak245 Melee can't hit it? Thats truly busted then lol.
Isn't it worth it to keep playing since he might be bad?
Do you really figure Flash would have lost a single unit to that cheese no brainer garbage strat?
You HAVE to fight it or else your base is wide open and full of creep. Watch what you call "no brainer".
Wait is this a mod?
Artosis chose the worst possible game to play, so much is weird and broken.
Jajajaja
rank C
Just a+ click on the groUnd kid, E rank playerd know that 🙄
doesnt work with scvs, even E rank players know that, you must be F rank
@@yuunpaan580 does it still not work if you have a marine in the selection as well?
Boo! You lack sportsmanship in this game. 😢😢