Well done ! I appreciate the great amount of research it takes to cover a little known engine of this period - you have done well and in addition have presented it clearly and in an understandable manner. Thanks very much !
24 cylinders, 48 pistons, 4 crankshafts, 2 stroke, direct injection (no prechamber). Being a 2 stroke dramatically reduces complexity compared to 4 stroke so quite doable. The efficiency would have been incredible. This is how we would be winging our way across the Atlantic and Pacific had the Jet engine no been viable.
@ You need to be up to it though: "The Napier Deltic engine is a British opposed-piston valveless, supercharged uniflow scavenged, two-stroke diesel engine used in marine and locomotive applications,"
@@stevenschiff808 yes I stood under a Vulcan at Newark aviation museum and it occured to me that was designed with a pencil and a slide rule. Engineers who hade ability to think in three dimensions have been replaced by computer modelling, I think we may have lost something along the way.
Used to have a Jumo 205 as a teaching tool. I adore the engineering of that thing. One thing I dont think you mentioned (and may be different on the 223) is the angle offset: The exhaust side piston is 7 degrees ahead of the inlet side. This allows this exhaust to open first, dropping the cylinder pressure before the new charge is let in. It also closes the exhaust first, leaving the inlet open to create overpressure from the compressor. I think the Jumo engines follow in a very German tradition of engineering, like the engine placement of the Porsche 911 or BMW's insistence on a WW1 era motorcycle engine concept for decades, where a fundamentally silly technical concept is worked on with stubbornness and gritted teeth (wearing lab coats, of course) until they make it work.
For the origins of the Porsche / VW engines look at Tatra who made very impressive air cooled engines and motor cars. Porsche improved something that had already been in production but inconvenienced by a certain dictator.
Development began around 1939 and continued until 1942, when the jet engines tied up development capacity and the project was stopped. The Jumo 223 piston engine had four crankshafts arranged at the corners of a diamond with four cylinder banks in between, each with six cylinders and twelve pistons. Two of the 48 pistons worked with a common combustion chamber on opposite crankshafts, as with the other Junkers two-stroke diesels (opposed piston engine).
Yes... The Napier Deltic was originally designed and built to power patrol boats... But the end of WWII pushed those engines into train locomotives. 18 cylinders with 36 pistons. The New York City 1963 MACK super pumper fire truck had a 2,000 horsepower Napier Deltic driving the monster water pump.
@@gerrywalsh5766 Thanks Gerry for stepping in...I will only add that the Deltic worked reliably unlike the Jumo as the dynamic vibrations were managed by British ingenuity and mathematical lateral thinking. Deltic are still in generating sets and locomotives all these years later. King Charles first command HMS Bronington a Ton Class mines sweeper has two 3000 bhp Paxman Deltic 12A07a Diesel engines. The NYC Mack fire truck is rather magnificent and the NYC fire department are very proud of it despite the engine being British.
@WOFFY-qc9te Thank you and it's awesome seeing others interested in the Deltic. British ingenuity is the perfect word for the perfect power package. No valves or cylinder heads to fail. The harmonic balance issue i believe was solved by a bloke telling them to try 2 crankshafts running clockwise and the third one running counter clockwise. The German Jumo kept failing crankshafts because of the harmonics. I love the sound of the Deltic engine... I was once able to see the Deltic that powers the NYC fire department Super Pumper. She definitely ROARS.
@@gerrywalsh5766 Gerry, that pump truck is the dogs nuts must have been a wonderful moment for you to experience such a machine. The Deltic is a masterpiece of ingenuity the only thing it has in common with the Junkers is a shared cylinder which was nothing new. The reverse crankshaft rotation was very much a beer mat moment which by coincidence and mathematics simplified the gear case and significantly reduced the crankshaft harmonics and the torsional vibration. I expect after a few beers is when they discovered the cylinder scavenge could be enhanced later named Uniflow. Lateral thinking is not something that comes easy to German engineers which is why Jumo was not successful or their axial turbine with its poor mean time between failure being a tenth of the simpler Whittle turbine. I used to do dynamic balancing and vibration analysis. The solutions for the Deltic are wonderfully simple and if Junkers looked at their company Logo they would have seen the solution. Odd numbers can be balanced by each other. The power to weight of the Deltic is impressive in fact most of Napier's engines had good P-W. Bristol is another company that made magnificent engines unfortunately any development of them and the Power Jets / Rover Turbine was hobbled by UK giving way to our friends across the pond. Also we gave Russia the turbine to play with and they built the Mig !. British are good at inventing and poor at investing in production. Best to you Gerry
Gerry, that pump truck is the dogs nuts must have been a wonderful moment for you to experience such a machine. The Deltic is a masterpiece of ingenuity the only thing it has in common with the Junkers is a shared cylinder which was nothing new. The reverse crankshaft rotation was very much a beer mat moment which by coincidence and mathematics simplified the gear case and significantly reduced the crankshaft harmonics and the torsional vibration. I expect after a few beers is when they discovered the cylinder scavenge could be enhanced later named Uniflow. Lateral thinking is not something that comes easy to German engineers which is why Jumo was not successful or their axial turbine with its poor mean time between failure being a tenth of the simpler Whittle turbine. I used to do dynamic balancing and vibration analysis. The solutions for the Deltic are wonderfully simple and if Junkers looked at their company Logo they would have seen the solution. Odd numbers can be balanced by each other. The power to weight of the Deltic is impressive in fact most of Napier's engines had good P-W. Bristol is another company that made magnificent engines unfortunately any development of them and the Power Jets / Rover Turbine was hobbled by UK giving way to our friends across the pond. Also we gave Russia the turbine to play with and they built the Mig !. British are good at inventing and poor at investing in production. Best to you Gerry
Really enjoy your unbiased informative videos, even if i probably read the same books than you have :D Sadly I alway have this feeling that there is just not enough information available/lost regarding german engine development. Keep up your good work!
There´s a lot of stuff if you but seek it, books and even channels for those that have problem reading like this guy @AchimEngels that literally wrote the book and built one.
@@flightdojo If you allow me, please just also add metric units for the other 95% of potential viewers that are not fluid in converting from 47/93rd of an cubic left hobbit ell to something that is more meaningful for them 😇🙏
Very interesting, I’m familiar with the Napier Deltic design as they were used in the USN’s PTF NASTY class patrol boats in Vietnam and found the engine wildly different, relatively light and compact for it’s power rating and capable of impressive performance.
Great what if. Though the Jumo 205 was used by Lufthansa in its regular route that crossed the Atlantic from Africa to Brazil, too bad the multiple engine 223 didn't work out.
I have a Junkers two cylinder water cooled opposed piston marine diesel engine, about 15 horsepower. Supposedly made in late 1920s. I last ran it about 30 years ago and it has been in storage ever since. There is a workshop manual with it. The top pistons have very long con rods down to the crankshaft at the bottom. It had been used as a stationary engine in a sugar mill.
@@hiha2108 it’s interesting that the Deltec arrangement wasn’t used for the Napier nomad which used sleeve valves. I suspect that what happened is that the aeroengine people simply adapted their know how from the Napier Sabre and used the sleeve valve. The Deltic valveless arrangement may have been a better aero engine
I have a one cylinder two piston junkers jumo test engine forced air from the 30’s and the hand drawn print. It’s the test engine from what I know is the Delta P 1500 18 cylinder 16 piston. I have one print on that engine. This was awesome seeing this video. This video is the first time I’ve seen anything on it. The name on my print is John Povleca , not sure what the spelling is on the last name the print in the garage and it around 5:00 am or I’d go out there.
@ My finances might afford a loan, say a wrist pin. But if you want one, they were used in U.S. submarines. Brazil, Chile still have a few of our WW2 subs. Also on Coast Guard Cutters. A FB 38 13 3/8 would look great in yr driveway.
2:23 this is clearly taller than a single opposed piston bank in this orientation and the same if orientated as a square and not a diamond. Any school kid can tell you a square's diameter is longer that any one of it's sides The blower is a scavenge pump not a supercharger , just like any uniflow two stroke uses
Never heard of this engine. I wonder if Fairbanks-Morse knew about the Junkers OP diesel, or was this a just coincidence that two different companies on two different continents were developing a similar engine? The FM OPs were never intended for aircraft, they were first used as power sources for industrial and marine use. They ended up in numerous US Navy submarines and ships. The OPs also were used in several diesel locomotive models from 1944 till they ceased locomotive production in 1963. FM is still building OPs today.
Junkers patented his inward punching horizontally opposed engines in the 1890s and they were eventually licensed by both Fairbanks-Morse and Napier. Both these companies then developed the concept further. Napier developed the Deltic (3 shafts) which created an amazingly compact engine that wasn't flat like the Jumo. Junkers explored the box concept. Napier, being in Britain, the home of the sleeve valve, developed the 2 stroked turbo compounded Nomad which used sleave valves. No any more efficient but significantly lighter.
I had to rebuild a detroit 2 stroke as a final exam to leave diese school. One of the students didn't have his fueling set up correctly and his engine ran away. We ran away too. Lol
Hardly a new idea. There is a Leyland tank engine the L60 that was used in the Chieftain tank. It dated from the late 1950's and also heavily borrowed from the Junkers 6 cylinder diesels. You can hear them running on Mr Hews channel.
@@thamesmud Rolls Royce did the K 60 which has a similar set up, also the Commercial TS3, an opposed piston design but with the single crankshaft underneath the cylinders .
One possible drawback of 2 stroke could be an enemy night fighter might use the smell to home in, at least at low altitudes where oxygen wasn't needed.
Most of the problems with particulates come from the diesel fuel itself. Long linear chains such as a kind that were made synthetically by Fisher Tropsch don’t tend to produce salt unlike molecules that are more closed up and less linear. The same applies to jet fuel kerosene. A small amount of additional refining can get rid of much of the soot.
My late Father told me about Otto back in 68, the two stroke gasoline engine, on paper it is not supposed to work, but it does, just like a Bumble Bee does not work on paper, as it's wings are too small, And it is too heavy, yet we all know that is does, I've been subscribed to your channel for years, but don't reply often, thank's for posting.👍🇺🇸
The internal combustion engine changed our world dramatically. If you were European, it meant that a tractor could be used to tow a plough. Steam engine tractors were too heavy for European soils. They’re only used to provide stationary power for thrashing or at best winching the plough. It also meant that miners seeking to extract say tin, gold, zink had a small engine they could pack on day a donkey to drain water from the mine etc. steam engines just don’t work for a lot of applications.
fascinating, was gonna just say it's a nazi deltic, but that final mention of simultaneous existanct of related and independent elements of the Deltic design just make the story all the more interesting.
The complexity of this engine is boggling the mind. Compare it to a gas turbine and its relative simplicity and efficiency. They knew this at the time but could not make turbine blades that could stand the heat. Metallurgic’s is difficult
The Mayo Clinic used to have a HUGE Fairbanks Morse opposed piston engine driving an emergency generator. In the early 1960's they paid 1 million dollars for the engine and another 1 million dollars to ship it from England. My uncle worked and maintained the equipment...as a kid the engine was a monster but it was also a work of fabulous engineering.
@gerrywalsh5766 Fairbanks-Morse made opposed diesel engines that powered America's submarines and mine sweepers in WWII. The submarine USS Drum is on display at Mobile, Al with two of them. Jacques Cousteau's Calypso and John Wayne's Wild Goose were originally mine sweepers that used them.
Commer TS3 is an opposed piston two stroke that uses one crank making it compact and simple , they were in Commer trucks for 25 plus years and the next generation of ts4 motors was only killed when Chrysler bought Roots company in the 1970s and as Chrysler had a deal with cummins they killed the new ts4 8 piston engine.
Diesel is not a cycle. A diesel engine is a detonation engine either two or four stroke, also known as a compression ignition engine. The fuel when injected explodes, unlike petrol/gasoline which burns when ignited. High compression diesel engines when idling emit a sound known as diesel knock which is the sound of the exploding fuel.
Petrol engines have a homogenous charge of petrol/ air so if the propagation of the flame is at subsonic speed it’s called deflagration. If it’s propagated supersonically by infrared radiation it’s called detonation. In the case of a diesel there is no fuel in the air until it’s injected at top dead centre, it can only burn at the rate at which it is injected and that may be over two or three rapid pulses.
@williamzk9083 Mechanical injection doesn't have multiple pulses on any I'm familiar with. It's a spray that the longer it sprays the more fuel is burned over a longer duration.
@@scottwhitcher265 some many modern injection systems inject two or three pulses. The first is a small pulse to stir up the air and create the conditions for dispersal of the second larger pulse. I think these are mostly common rail injection systems.
You correctly say "Jumo" (yoo-moe) but keep mispronouncing his name as Djunkers...it's like "Yoomo"...not with English "j". Jumo means Junkers Motorenwerke. The "u" in Junkers is like "oo" in "foot"
well...v12 got well over 2000hp and this over complex bulky thing didnt even went to 2500hp. sure sure there was much investment into v12 but still. seems this one would get no where even with way more investments
This was just a developmental stepping stone into using the larger engines. Like the 224, the 224 started at 4800hp and went up from there while having a significantly better BSFC than the gas V-12s and significantly better altitude performance.
The Jumo 205 was used successfully with nearly 1000hp using roots type super charger. The Jumo 207 was a version with a turbo super charger added between mechanical supercharger and the engine. A Jumo 207D generated 2340hp as part of a test to confirm that the Jumo 223 and 224 were feasible. It did require water injection. Diesels are ideal for turbo charging because the exhaust is much cooler plus they don’t pre ignite. Water injection was purely to contract the air.
For those of you that would like to know, there is a US company that's doing some amazing work with opposed piston diesel engines today. They put a 3-cylinder/6 piston engine in a Ford F150 pickup truck, and it was getting Kei/city car mileage while having enough torque to power that F-150. The US DOD also has contracts with them. My understanding is that the Biden administration canceled the contract because it wasn't electric. The Biden Administration only has 6 days left now. Perhaps we will see DOD returning to that company.
@ Achates Power is privately owned and backed by Sequoia Capital, RockPort Capital Partners, Madrone Capital Partners, Triangle Peak Partners and Interwest Partners.
I heard that some Englishman at least attempted to build a "Deltic" style engine with 3 GM 60 degree V-6 engine blocks. I'd LOVE to see what his result were. You just have to give that old chap major respect!
I'm a retired mechanical engineer and can't decide if this engine design was an engineering marvel or an engineering nightmare. Thankfully jet engines came along just in time so this recip was just an interesting footnote in history.
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Thanks for mentioning the Deltic
Well done ! I appreciate the great amount of research it takes to cover a little known engine of this period - you have done well and in addition have presented it clearly and in an understandable manner. Thanks very much !
We are all standing on the shoulders of Giants.
24 cylinders, 48 pistons, 4 crankshafts, 2 stroke, direct injection (no prechamber). Being a 2 stroke dramatically reduces complexity compared to 4 stroke so quite doable. The efficiency would have been incredible. This is how we would be winging our way across the Atlantic and Pacific had the Jet engine no been viable.
napier deltics had a triangular layout of opposing pistons and used for trains and boats for some years.
Opposed piston 4 strokes don't exist - nowhere to put poppet valves and only an insane person would attempt to use sleeve valves
@3:22 and @3:42 .. that is NOT 48 cylinders, BUT 24 cylinders with 2 piston in each.
@@PaulG.x
God, l love a challenge. Napier's.
@ You need to be up to it though:
"The Napier Deltic engine is a British opposed-piston valveless, supercharged uniflow scavenged, two-stroke diesel engine used in marine and locomotive applications,"
2 videos in 1 day? This is great!
Gotta get back on my YT hustle
Built in a analog world......crazy to think of the engineering.
I know right! Things like Concorde designed with pencils and protractors just blows my mind.
the people that made these things did not fake they way though life
@@stevenschiff808 yes I stood under a Vulcan at Newark aviation museum and it occured to me that was designed with a pencil and a slide rule. Engineers who hade ability to think in three dimensions have been replaced by computer modelling, I think we may have lost something along the way.
Just a lot more work put in it without computers for same result, knowledge is there
Number of drawings....Holy hell.
Used to have a Jumo 205 as a teaching tool. I adore the engineering of that thing. One thing I dont think you mentioned (and may be different on the 223) is the angle offset: The exhaust side piston is 7 degrees ahead of the inlet side. This allows this exhaust to open first, dropping the cylinder pressure before the new charge is let in. It also closes the exhaust first, leaving the inlet open to create overpressure from the compressor. I think the Jumo engines follow in a very German tradition of engineering, like the engine placement of the Porsche 911 or BMW's insistence on a WW1 era motorcycle engine concept for decades, where a fundamentally silly technical concept is worked on with stubbornness and gritted teeth (wearing lab coats, of course) until they make it work.
For the origins of the Porsche / VW engines look at Tatra who made very impressive air cooled engines and motor cars. Porsche improved something that had already been in production but inconvenienced by a certain dictator.
Kool engine, keep them coming like that pls
Thanks for the encouragement!
Development began around 1939 and continued until 1942, when the jet engines tied up development capacity and the project was stopped.
The Jumo 223 piston engine had four crankshafts arranged at the corners of a diamond with four cylinder banks in between, each with six cylinders and twelve pistons. Two of the 48 pistons worked with a common combustion chamber on opposite crankshafts, as with the other Junkers two-stroke diesels (opposed piston engine).
I love the nerdy nature of these videos, lots of technical info & historical context.
the turbine engine is great and all but man nothing beats the wild peak of aviation piston engines in the 40s and 50s.
And the 30's experiments led to these
Awesome channel. It's great to have this kind of subject matter for a RUclips video.
thank you! please sub!
That's insane! Amazed and gawking in awe.
Subscribe for more guaranteed gawk-worthy content in the future
Love your content and the detailed descriptions you provide I am a blind subscriber and your narration makes all the difference thanks
Cheers
Glad you're enjoying the content!
Great journalism and professional presentation. Thanks.
These and the NAPIER. engines are so different than the usual designs and were very successful
Bonkers. Absolutely bonkers 🤯
Another great vid, always fascinating.
Thanks for your work. Subscribed.
Welcome aboard!
@ talk About A Original Idea.
Almost started with a blank notebook. GENIUS.!
Isn't that what the Deltic was loosely based on?
Yes... The Napier Deltic was originally designed and built to power patrol boats... But the end of WWII pushed those engines into train locomotives. 18 cylinders with 36 pistons. The New York City 1963 MACK super pumper fire truck had a 2,000 horsepower Napier Deltic driving the monster water pump.
@@gerrywalsh5766 Thanks Gerry for stepping in...I will only add that the Deltic worked reliably unlike the Jumo as the dynamic vibrations were managed by British ingenuity and mathematical lateral thinking. Deltic are still in generating sets and locomotives all these years later.
King Charles first command HMS Bronington a Ton Class mines sweeper has two 3000 bhp Paxman Deltic 12A07a Diesel engines. The NYC Mack fire truck is rather magnificent and the NYC fire department are very proud of it despite the engine being British.
@WOFFY-qc9te Thank you and it's awesome seeing others interested in the Deltic. British ingenuity is the perfect word for the perfect power package. No valves or cylinder heads to fail. The harmonic balance issue i believe was solved by a bloke telling them to try 2 crankshafts running clockwise and the third one running counter clockwise. The German Jumo kept failing crankshafts because of the harmonics. I love the sound of the Deltic engine... I was once able to see the Deltic that powers the NYC fire department Super Pumper. She definitely ROARS.
@@gerrywalsh5766 Gerry, that pump truck is the dogs nuts must have been a wonderful moment for you to experience such a machine.
The Deltic is a masterpiece of ingenuity the only thing it has in common with the Junkers is a shared cylinder which was nothing new. The reverse crankshaft rotation was very much a beer mat moment which by coincidence and mathematics simplified the gear case and significantly reduced the crankshaft harmonics and the torsional vibration. I expect after a few beers is when they discovered the cylinder scavenge could be enhanced later named Uniflow.
Lateral thinking is not something that comes easy to German engineers which is why Jumo was not successful or their axial turbine with its poor mean time between failure being a tenth of the simpler Whittle turbine.
I used to do dynamic balancing and vibration analysis. The solutions for the Deltic are wonderfully simple and if Junkers looked at their company Logo they would have seen the solution. Odd numbers can be balanced by each other. The power to weight of the Deltic is impressive in fact most of Napier's engines had good P-W.
Bristol is another company that made magnificent engines unfortunately any development of them and the Power Jets / Rover Turbine was hobbled by UK giving way to our friends across the pond. Also we gave Russia the turbine to play with and they built the Mig !.
British are good at inventing and poor at investing in production.
Best to you Gerry
Gerry, that pump truck is the dogs nuts must have been a wonderful moment for you to experience such a machine.
The Deltic is a masterpiece of ingenuity the only thing it has in common with the Junkers is a shared cylinder which was nothing new. The reverse crankshaft rotation was very much a beer mat moment which by coincidence and mathematics simplified the gear case and significantly reduced the crankshaft harmonics and the torsional vibration. I expect after a few beers is when they discovered the cylinder scavenge could be enhanced later named Uniflow.
Lateral thinking is not something that comes easy to German engineers which is why Jumo was not successful or their axial turbine with its poor mean time between failure being a tenth of the simpler Whittle turbine.
I used to do dynamic balancing and vibration analysis. The solutions for the Deltic are wonderfully simple and if Junkers looked at their company Logo they would have seen the solution. Odd numbers can be balanced by each other. The power to weight of the Deltic is impressive in fact most of Napier's engines had good P-W.
Bristol is another company that made magnificent engines unfortunately any development of them and the Power Jets / Rover Turbine was hobbled by UK giving way to our friends across the pond. Also we gave Russia the turbine to play with and they built the Mig !.
British are good at inventing and poor at investing in production.
Best to you Gerry
these machines really do have a life of their own ❤
Really enjoy your unbiased informative videos, even if i probably read the same books than you have :D Sadly I alway have this feeling that there is just not enough information available/lost regarding german engine development.
Keep up your good work!
There´s a lot of stuff if you but seek it, books and even channels for those that have problem reading like this guy @AchimEngels that literally wrote the book and built one.
Absolutely true. I routinely find the sources lacking. Difficult to get the whole story.
@@flightdojo If you allow me, please just also add metric units for the other 95% of potential viewers that are not fluid in converting from 47/93rd of an cubic left hobbit ell to something that is more meaningful for them 😇🙏
Very interesting, I’m familiar with the Napier Deltic design as they were used in the USN’s PTF NASTY class patrol boats in Vietnam and found the engine wildly different, relatively light and compact for it’s power rating and capable of impressive performance.
Hello ,I always ask me how is the lubrication of the upper crank where is the oil going return ??
Remarkable German Engineering....the Europeans are such innovative people!
thanks for fixing the audio
I hope you like the video!
Great what if. Though the Jumo 205 was used by Lufthansa in its regular route that crossed the Atlantic from Africa to Brazil, too bad the multiple engine 223 didn't work out.
I have a Junkers two cylinder water cooled opposed piston marine diesel engine, about 15 horsepower. Supposedly made in late 1920s. I last ran it about 30 years ago and it has been in storage ever since. There is a workshop manual with it. The top pistons have very long con rods down to the crankshaft at the bottom. It had been used as a stationary engine in a sugar mill.
That sounds like a fascinating piece of history! I'd love to see it someday.
2:22
Did this come before or after the initial design work on the Napier Deltec?
Development of the Deltic started in 1944, Napier held a license from Junkers for opposed piston diesels. The Jumo 223 was stopped around 1942.
@@hiha2108 it’s interesting that the Deltec arrangement wasn’t used for the Napier nomad which used sleeve valves. I suspect that what happened is that the aeroengine people simply adapted their know how from the Napier Sabre and used the sleeve valve. The Deltic valveless arrangement may have been a better aero engine
Please make a metric version !
Yes, I can't easily do cubic inches without getting my calculator, I know most engine capacities in litres.
@@philiphumphrey1548 Can you not google it easily?
Were they working on the turbo jet at the same time?
Nice shiner dude ,bet that hurt !
I have a one cylinder two piston junkers jumo test engine forced air from the 30’s and the hand drawn print. It’s the test engine from what I know is the Delta P 1500 18 cylinder 16 piston. I have one print on that engine. This was awesome seeing this video. This video is the first time I’ve seen anything on it. The name on my print is John Povleca , not sure what the spelling is on the last name the print in the garage and it around 5:00 am or I’d go out there.
Another vid? So soon! Awesome
More to come!
Harmonic vibrations probably aggravated by the quad crank design. The Deltic seemed to be ok maybe because one crank turns in opposite direction.
Fairbanks Morse builds OP diesel engines. Have your checkbook handy?
Can you give me a small loan?
@ My finances might afford a loan, say a wrist pin.
But if you want one, they were used in U.S. submarines. Brazil, Chile still have a few of our WW2 subs. Also on Coast Guard Cutters. A FB 38 13 3/8 would look great in yr driveway.
It's crazy how a jet engine is simple and lighter for the same output
What about the diesel engines for the six engine seaplane?
2:23 this is clearly taller than a single opposed piston bank in this orientation and the same if orientated as a square and not a diamond.
Any school kid can tell you a square's diameter is longer that any one of it's sides
The blower is a scavenge pump not a supercharger , just like any uniflow two stroke uses
Never heard of this engine. I wonder if Fairbanks-Morse knew about the Junkers OP diesel, or was this a just coincidence that two different companies on two different continents were developing a similar engine? The FM OPs were never intended for aircraft, they were first used as power sources for industrial and marine use. They ended up in numerous US Navy submarines and ships. The OPs also were used in several diesel locomotive models from 1944 till they ceased locomotive production in 1963. FM is still building OPs today.
Junkers patented his inward punching horizontally opposed engines in the 1890s and they were eventually licensed by both Fairbanks-Morse and Napier. Both these companies then developed the concept further. Napier developed the Deltic (3 shafts) which created an amazingly compact engine that wasn't flat like the Jumo. Junkers explored the box concept. Napier, being in Britain, the home of the sleeve valve, developed the 2 stroked turbo compounded Nomad which used sleave valves. No any more efficient but significantly lighter.
Imsine the glorious noise.
Any many ways Napier's Deltec was similar
@3:22 and @3:42 .. that is NOT 48 cylinders, BUT 24 cylinders with 2 piston in each.
Thanks
I mean THANKS
I had to rebuild a detroit 2 stroke as a final exam to leave diese school. One of the students didn't have his fueling set up correctly and his engine ran away. We ran away too. Lol
It’s basically a four bank Deltic engine as used in British locomotives. Also the New York fire brigade super pumper.
Dojo, you have to do the Napier Deltic now you've dipped a toe into opposed...
Dojo did already the Deltic about 1,5 years back in time.
Haven’t touched the deltic, only the nomad. I don’t know if I have anything to say about it that wasn’t covered by CuriousDroid!
@flightdojo
Sorry I mixed you two up.🙄
Thank you for not using a ridicuilous AI-generated voice - -- You were easy to listen to.
Cummins is currently developing a 4 cylinder with 8 opposing pistons engine for military use
Think of it, a nearly 100 years design
Hardly a new idea. There is a Leyland tank engine the L60 that was used in the Chieftain tank. It dated from the late 1950's and also heavily borrowed from the Junkers 6 cylinder diesels. You can hear them running on Mr Hews channel.
@@thamesmud Rolls Royce did the K 60 which has a similar set up, also the Commercial TS3, an opposed piston design but with the single crankshaft underneath the cylinders .
@scrumpydrinker I had a roots blower off a T3, never had the nuts to fit it on a car though!
They were considered ventilators until they hit the dragstrip .
I think I see the engineering of the Porsche 914 🧐🇩🇪🏁 !
We buıld ın 2005 a 2 cylınder 1.2 lıter opposed pıston dıesel engıne ın dessau
Produce 100 hp
Carbon pıston
When I saw this I immediately thought Deltic.
One possible drawback of 2 stroke could be an enemy night fighter might use the smell to home in, at least at low altitudes where oxygen wasn't needed.
Most of the problems with particulates come from the diesel fuel itself. Long linear chains such as a kind that were made synthetically by Fisher Tropsch don’t tend to produce salt unlike molecules that are more closed up and less linear. The same applies to jet fuel kerosene. A small amount of additional refining can get rid of much of the soot.
My late Father told me about Otto back in 68, the two stroke gasoline engine, on paper it is not supposed to work, but it does, just like a Bumble Bee does not work on paper, as it's wings are too small, And it is too heavy, yet we all know that is does, I've been subscribed to your channel for years, but don't reply often, thank's for posting.👍🇺🇸
It's fascinating how some things defy conventional logic!
The internal combustion engine changed our world dramatically. If you were European, it meant that a tractor could be used to tow a plough. Steam engine tractors were too heavy for European soils. They’re only used to provide stationary power for thrashing or at best winching the plough.
It also meant that miners seeking to extract say tin, gold, zink had a small engine they could pack on day a donkey to drain water from the mine etc. steam engines just don’t work for a lot of applications.
fascinating, was gonna just say it's a nazi deltic, but that final mention of simultaneous existanct of related and independent elements of the Deltic design just make the story all the more interesting.
2 cycle diesels will not run without a super charger, not a turbo The intake air has to be pushed into the cylinders.
They can be fitted with both, ref rhe Detroit Diesel units, but yes they can’t work without a blower to push the air not the cylenders.
The complexity of this engine is boggling the mind. Compare it to a gas turbine and its relative simplicity and efficiency. They knew this at the time but could not make turbine blades that could stand the heat. Metallurgic’s is difficult
They were definitely pushing the boundaries of what was possible with external combustion
Germany ( and everyone else) was short of nickle and chrome that were needed for turbines.
The Mayo Clinic used to have a HUGE Fairbanks Morse opposed piston engine driving an emergency generator. In the early 1960's they paid 1 million dollars for the engine and another 1 million dollars to ship it from England. My uncle worked and maintained the equipment...as a kid the engine was a monster but it was also a work of fabulous engineering.
That's awesome. Maybe I'll have to look into some of the Fairbanks engines...
@gerrywalsh5766
Fairbanks-Morse made opposed diesel engines that powered America's submarines and mine sweepers in WWII.
The submarine USS Drum is on display at Mobile, Al with two of them. Jacques Cousteau's Calypso and John Wayne's Wild Goose were originally mine sweepers that used them.
@scottwhitcher265 Union Pacific used them in locomotives for a short time because of the overstock that Fairbanks Morse had after the war.
Pronounced "Yoonker"? Comparing with the RR Griffon - it made about the same power as the later Griffons but weighed more than twice as much.
Ports don't open or close, they' are uncovered + covered.
Commer TS3 is an opposed piston two stroke that uses one crank making it compact and simple , they were in Commer trucks for 25 plus years and the next generation of ts4 motors was only killed when Chrysler bought Roots company in the 1970s and as Chrysler had a deal with cummins they killed the new ts4 8 piston engine.
🤔Hmm Grandfather of the post war Napier Deltic .
I thought the Napier Deltic was complicated…
Wtf? Couldn't fit diesel in the title ? I clicked.
Origional layout engine too tall ? Why not turn it through 90 degreea , it would have blended into a wing nicely , Or is that too simple ?
I wondered the same. Probably too wide and would interfere with air over the wings
The original intention was to lay it flat in wings, but it turned out there was an oiling problem.
No computers folks...hence.. " the greatest generation"
Diesel is not a cycle. A diesel engine is a detonation engine either two or four stroke, also known as a compression ignition engine. The fuel when injected explodes, unlike petrol/gasoline which burns when ignited. High compression diesel engines when idling emit a sound known as diesel knock which is the sound of the exploding fuel.
Petrol engines have a homogenous charge of petrol/ air so if the propagation of the flame is at subsonic speed it’s called deflagration. If it’s propagated supersonically by infrared radiation it’s called detonation. In the case of a diesel there is no fuel in the air until it’s injected at top dead centre, it can only burn at the rate at which it is injected and that may be over two or three rapid pulses.
@williamzk9083
Mechanical injection doesn't have multiple pulses on any I'm familiar with. It's a spray that the longer it sprays the more fuel is burned over a longer duration.
@@scottwhitcher265 some many modern injection systems inject two or three pulses. The first is a small pulse to stir up the air and create the conditions for dispersal of the second larger pulse. I think these are mostly common rail injection systems.
You correctly say "Jumo" (yoo-moe) but keep mispronouncing his name as Djunkers...it's like "Yoomo"...not with English "j". Jumo means Junkers Motorenwerke. The "u" in Junkers is like "oo" in "foot"
well...v12 got well over 2000hp and this over complex bulky thing didnt even went to 2500hp. sure sure there was much investment into v12 but still. seems this one would get no where even with way more investments
This was just a developmental stepping stone into using the larger engines. Like the 224, the 224 started at 4800hp and went up from there while having a significantly better BSFC than the gas V-12s and significantly better altitude performance.
The Jumo 205 was used successfully with nearly 1000hp using roots type super charger. The Jumo 207 was a version with a turbo super charger added between mechanical supercharger and the engine. A Jumo 207D generated 2340hp as part of a test to confirm that the Jumo 223 and 224 were feasible. It did require water injection. Diesels are ideal for turbo charging because the exhaust is much cooler plus they don’t pre ignite. Water injection was purely to contract the air.
I think this guy is a AI actor
lol ok buddy
For those of you that would like to know, there is a US company that's doing some amazing work with opposed piston diesel engines today. They put a 3-cylinder/6 piston engine in a Ford F150 pickup truck, and it was getting Kei/city car mileage while having enough torque to power that F-150. The US DOD also has contracts with them. My understanding is that the Biden administration canceled the contract because it wasn't electric. The Biden Administration only has 6 days left now. Perhaps we will see DOD returning to that company.
Is that the (I think) the Achates opec company you're thinking of?
That is interesting! I’ll have to do some research.
@ Achates Power is privately owned and backed by Sequoia Capital, RockPort Capital Partners, Madrone Capital Partners, Triangle Peak Partners and Interwest Partners.
@ en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achates_Power#:~:text=Achates%20Power%20is%20privately%20owned,Peak%20Partners%20and%20Interwest%20Partners.
I heard that some Englishman at least attempted to build a "Deltic" style engine with 3 GM 60 degree V-6 engine blocks. I'd LOVE to see what his result were. You just have to give that old chap major respect!
Whats the deal with the presenter's left eye great vid aside
It’s a shadow
I'm a retired mechanical engineer and can't decide if this engine design was an engineering marvel or an engineering nightmare. Thankfully jet engines came along just in time so this recip was just an interesting footnote in history.
I think it’s both
Boooo, no metric numbers...otherwise good
In America we speak American
@@flightdojoUnless you are a scientist, or working for a large company, then you speak european ;)
and use STANDARD measurements!
Old machine press website
yes, my sources are available in the video description.
The Deltic was the smarter design. Napier did beat Junker at their own game with the reverse rotating crankshaft trick.
Is your hairstyle a poltical statement?
Nah man. Your wife picked it out.
Speak metric you are insulting the designers of this engine
no