5 Reasons I "HATE" D&D! (and why I switched to Savage Worlds!)
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- Опубликовано: 17 июн 2024
- Are you tired of playing D&D and looking for a better alternative? Do you want to know why Savage Worlds is the best tabletop RPG system out there? Then this video is for you!
In this video, I will share 5 reasons why I do not like D&D and why I think Savage Worlds is better.
If you are a fan of Savage Worlds or curious about it, you will enjoy this video. If you are a fan of D&D, then you might want to watch this video with an open mind and see if you agree or disagree with me. Either way, I hope you will find this video informative and entertaining.
Please like, comment, share, and subscribe to my channel for more videos on Savage Worlds and other tabletop RPGs. Thank you for watching, and stay savage!
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This video references the Savage Worlds game system, available from Pinnacle Entertainment Group at www.peginc.com. It is unofficial Media Content permitted under the Media Network Content Agreement. Pinnacle Entertainment Group does not manage, approve, or endorse this content. Certain portions of the materials used are the intellectual property of Pinnacle, and all rights are reserved. Savage Worlds, all related settings, and unique characters, locations, characters, logos, and trademarks are copyrights of Pinnacle Entertainment Group.
0:00 - Intro & Disclaimer
0:44 - #1 Hit Points
2:18 - #2 Classes
3:56 - #3 Inspiration
5:12 - #4 Magic System
6:55 - #5 Ready Action
#DnDvsSavageWorlds #WhyIDontLikeDnD #SavageWorldsRocks #TabletopRPGs #RoleplayingGames #SavageWorldsRules #SavageWorldsIsBetter #SavageWorldsFan #SavageWorldsTips #SavageWorldsReview 
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I switched from 5e to Savage Worlds myself after OGL/Pinkterons issues. My group has been patient as we transition to the new system. I like it for a lot of reasons, but primarily because it makes writing scenarios a lot easier for planning out the pacing.
I'm still doing one advancement a session, and it forces the Ranks (5e Tiers) to be considered as the chapters of a campaign. Tells you how often you should be placing the Boss fight Sessions, when to focus on Leads and Allies, when to do the Underlings & Opposition kinda scenes, and when its Grand Melee time.
And there's so many tools which are just there for when you want to beef things up without getting specific or giving the Party a future weapon to use against their foes (at least not right away). Use the rules you need and no more. Loving the system so far.
The silver lining of WOTC's recent mistakes is that now a bunch of people are considering other options. I hear people complain about 5e players not trying anything new, but in the last year I've seen a large positive shift towards variety & novelty.
The Savage Worlds Reddit is flooded with "D&D Refugees" lately, which is great, as long as people actually accept them and be happy they are there. I have seen some rudeness of "this question gets asked every week" which I get, but also, guys, new people, help them out.
The Loyalty hindrance can really enhance role playing outside of combat. Loyal to a friend? What if they cheat on a test or run up a gambling debt or commit murder? What if they're not loyal back, or anything but abusive? I love Savage Worlds because it really makes room for the story.
I agree. I think Savage Worlds just has a better mechanical focus on storytelling.
I still enjoy playing D&D (it helps I have a good group)
But when it comes to me RUNNING games (which I tend to do a lot)? I have gone full Savage Worlds and have never looked back. For all the reasons you said. It's *SO* much easier to make fun encounters that feel good in Savage Worlds because of the simple Wound System, and the fact that most enemies go down on the first wound. Combat rarely drags on.
I'm also a HUGE fan of having all the options that I do. Testing your foe, tricky on-hold strategies, Wild Attacks, etc etc allow for a lot more than D&D's "I do this thing, which does damage in this one specific way, roll d20".
Finally, Ace chains (getting a new dice when you roll the max number) is always fun to see, whether it's a player doing something cool, or the enemy about to ruin a character's day. :P
...Finally Finally, Bennies are just plain fun.
I think D&D, especially 5e, has so much momentum because most TTRPG players learned how to play because of it and very few people try any other system. D&D deserves some respect for being the gateway TTRPG, but I think people see with the eyes of nostalgia/first love and therefore refuse to look at it critically.
Absolutely! I started technically on 4, but then immediately started playing 3.5, but when 5e started I jumped on it right away. It was great, but I think knowing more now, it has some issues that took me some time to realize. I think if I run 5e though, I am not using some of the newer stuff. BUT overall, I enjoy Savage Worlds so much more now.
Try running it and it'll just keep giving the DM more work
While players demand more privileges
I started playing with the White books then moved to AD&D. I've played all the versions of D&D but wanted something that gave me the flexibility to move between settings with more grace so I started looking for a different game for my public table that I run weekly. I was narrowing in on SWADE when Hasbro/WOTC started making noises regarding the OGL I decided just to pull the trigger.
Now, this is our primary system and I have two or three players that rotate through the GM seat pretty regularly. They do their own settings and I've written my own fantasy setting and also do a couple of other settings. In my humble opinion SWADE is superior for our style of play.
The difficulty/near impossibility of convincing the average player to give a genuine shot to _literally anything else_ has always been my primary point of frustration with D&D.
There's plenty else I don't like about it but simply getting past that initial hurdle is generally more than enough by itself.
@@BlindMarksman if they refuse to play anything else, try anything else, you can jsut leave them with what they want. if they wont move with you they dont play.
Yeah, someone else covering my favorite TTRPG! I whole heatedly agree with all your reasons.
What are your favorite things about Savage Worlds?
Oh, I do agree, absolutely. However, my main reasons for not being very fond of DnD are two very generic features of it: 1) it's so freaking huge and complex. Spells and classes are two elements you mentioned, I'd also add the myriad of races, weapons and other equipments, and techniques for non-casters, all of which you have to read about and learn to mix well, to build a balanced character. It takes ages to create it, and then to learn to play it, and honestly, also quite a bit of old hard coin to access all the materials, since the portfolio of resources is huge too. 2) The focus on combat. I know, that's a polarizing opinion, becuase there's nothing inherently wrong with it. But IMHO, if you take the unspoken rule to have combat in almost every session, add the fact leveling up mostly increases combat skills, the unrealistic HP mechanics, the long turns (and waiting times), and everyone's favourite pauses to check how stuff works... the resulting blow can send any actual role playing down to proverbial death rolls in a flash. Yes, of course, the style of play depends on the GM and players, I'm sure there'll be a bunch of people personally offended by what I just said XD. I'm not saying DnD players can't get into character, only that - when plainly comparing systems - DnD is, perhaps surprisingly, not a particularly role-oriented rpg.
I hate Armor Class, personally. Armor doesn't make you harder to hit, it makes GETTING hit hurt less.
That is another thing I like about Savage Worlds with Parry vs Toughness.
Fantastic video. I hope you continue! I’m desperate for more quality Savage Worlds channels.
Working on editing a "How to make a savage Worlds Character" video currently. I am hoping to make more, just need to sit down and wite some scripts.
Happy to hear any video ideas as well to add to my list.
@@TheSavageGoose Awesome! This is my biggest struggle right now: As a D&D-refugee-wannabe, after decades of playing my players and I can create a D&D character from 3.5e, Pathfinder, and 5E in minutes. We know what to pick, and what it "means" when we pick what we do in D&D. We're not there in Savage Worlds, as we don't have enough behind-the-wheel time. So, things like: I know what 10 vs. 18 in an attribute in D&D means, and what a good level 1 value is, but I don't have a feel for the equivalent in SW. And, the breadth of edges is an advantage -- up until it leads to decision paralysis. I know a beginning 3.5e Fighter should choose the Power Attack feat if they don't know what else to choose, but how do I guide my players when they don't know what to choose in SW? It is starting from scratch, relearning for SW all the institutional knowledge that we've accumulated from D&D, that I'm hoping to be able to smooth out for my players so that there's less reasons to stick with the old and broken, but familiar, systems.
@@FlashBIOS Ah, I see. The character creation video may help with that, but this sounds more like another video idea I had, which is something like "D&D habits to forget when you play Savage Worlds."
I would remember these essential things. Savage Worlds characters start at level 4 and end at level 8. Then they get an advance; they don't tend to get more powerful, or if they do, not by a lot, and instead tend to get more interesting.
I find that the extended time it takes me to create a character in Savage Worlds is not because I don't know what to do; it's more that I am trying to decide what fits best thematically for what I am trying to accomplish. You will notice that in the character creation video once I finish it.
@@TheSavageGoose Wonderful! I’m looking forward to it.
@@TheSavageGoose there are a lot of videos about the basics of creating a savage world's character. I hope you'll skip ahead to some of the more intermediate topics. And maybe for a real challenge, how to run a heist in Savage worlds.
these reasons by and large are why I switched to pf2e. I liked 5e but too many things within it felt too restricting. I like the mechanical depth that pf2e has, and having more control over my stats (groups I was in with 5e were fairly optimization heavy)
pf2e has more classes (and seem to be regularly releasing new classes), my favorite being the magus because I hadn't been able to get the kind of magic swordsman I wanted in 5e.
Hero points are sort of like inspiration but RAW you start the session with 1 and can have up to three, which I like. Inspiration always irked me because it never seemed to be rewarded, so having something you can start with is nice.
The magic system I think is a little better than 5e's. Each class pulls from 1 of 4 spell sources (Primal, Arcane, Occult and Divine). Some classes can choose between certain spell traditions, and focus spells means you can have access to a few leveled spells when your slots run out.
You can delay your turn similarly to how you described in savage worlds but I don't think you can interrupt a turn with it.
I'm still fairly new to pf2e, but I'll look into Savage Worlds as well. I'm always looking for new systems to try out.
The little I played of Pf2E that I played I really enjoyed. I liked that there was options when I leveld up, and I did not necessarily just had to take the next option from my class.
However, I have heard that as you get to higher levels things can bog down, or something of the sort.
Good video! I also completely left the 5th Edition scene a long time ago, (started DMing when 3.5 was brand new when I was a teenager), but instead joined the OSR movement (B/X and AD&D 1st Ed in particular, plus Mork Borg and other games like that).
I played in a Savage Worlds game and while the system didn't really click for me overall, I totally found a lot of value in some of the rules. Like "trappings" to customize individual spells are something I've always house-ruled into my games anyhow (to a limited extent) so it was cool to see them codified. And the ability to spend extra points to add flair to your spells is highly reminiscent of the Psionics system from 3.5, actually, which is cool too.
I also run Hold Action / Ready Actions the same way as in Savage Worlds now having played it.
That's my favorite thing about the rules-light, slightly more pulpy takes on retro D&D, they're great engines that you can overlay customized rules onto super nicely to fit the style of game that you and your players want.
Of course I'd take Savage Worlds over 5th Ed any day though!
Thanks for sharing your experience !
I agree with what you said, but I found using Index Card RPG as a tool kit with some of what I liked about d20 games made for a much smoother, versatile and easy to hack game than Savage Worlds. I wanted to like Savage Worlds so badly, even bought the Savage Pathfinder box, but the separate mechanics for melee/ranged combat, the high whiff factor, and keeping track of all the edges/hindrances, power points, and more was making the game go much slower than I like.
I am not familiar with Index Card RPG, though it accurately describes a few RPGs I have read. I will have to investigate it.
The fact that you have a high whiff factor is interesting. I find that most players have the reverse feeling, that players almost never miss.
@@TheSavageGoose Thanks to your videos I am going to give Savage Worlds another try and am excited about it! By whiff factor I meant that it was a bummer to "hit" but not penetrate toughness.
I’m an old school D&D guy (because I’m old), and I also enjoyed 5e. Experienced and entertained by a variety of games and systems, I played around with Savage Worlds several years ago and wasn’t too smitten. However, I picked up SWAdE on a whim a few months ago and now it’s a whole different story. I recently started running a Rifts campaign and I have to say, Savage Worlds might be my favorite system now for the majority of settings/genres. I love it. Great videos, btw!
Years ago a friend ran a game of Savage Worlds and I was not impressed. That changed when I looked into SWADE. Now it is my favorite system.
It's like I've been saying....for forty years!
I played D&D back in the BECMI days and I, too, hated hit points. The example that I always gave was of a high-level fighter being stabbed with a dagger 25 times, dropping from 60 HP to 1, and still fighting as effectively as if they were uninjured. Then they could take a 1 HP papercut and fall over dead. Of course, I was younger and less experienced back then and now understand that HP represents luck, skill, fatigue, and more. This makes HP much more palatable, but still less than ideal. I like how SW handles wounds, but overall, I think that the best approach to health injury is Fate's system of Stress and Consequences, with SW coming in close behind..
I used to be bothered by Classes, as it made it seem boring that every 5th-level fighter was the same as every other 5th-level fighter. Yes, they would vary in their attributes, HP, and gear, but that didn't really differentiate them enough in my mind. But again, with a more experienced perspective, I don't mind it as much because the intent was to encourage team play. We can look at comics in a similar manner. The Fantastic Four, for example, have a strong guy, a flying, ranged attack guy, a smart guy, and the Invisible Woman bringing defence and stealth. If each of them could tackle every role, there wouldn't be as much need for a team.
But the big thing for me was always magic. I always hated Vancian magic. "I know just the perfect spell for this occasion! Let me cast it!" *Poof* "Aaaand... now I don't know that spell anymore." That irritated me to no end, though now I look at it not as memorizing the spells, but as preparing the necessary reagents, so that once you cast the spell and use the reagents, you still remember the spell, but can't cast it again because you have used your prepared supplies.
SW is a great game and I would say it's better than D&D in most ways, but I don't dislike D&D the way I used to. I have a much better appreciation for it now.
In Vance's Dying Earth stories, the idea behind magic is that the human brain can barely comprehend/handle magic, as they are tapping into forces of nature/other dimensions that humans are simply not compatible with. Casting magic does damage to the brain which wipes out knowledge on how to cast it again. In a game it's tedious as hell, but thematically I find it awesome.
@@GeneralRenz that's pretty cool. I have conflicting views on magic, depending on the setting. In some cases/ settings, I like the idea of the mage simply twisting the fabric of reality as they desire. So rather than using specific spells, they simply decide "I want to do this thing," and if they have a strong understanding of reality and magical forces, along with sufficient willpower, they can.
On the other hand, I also like the cliche wizard who carries around his spellbook and is constantly studying and learning new things But as I mentioned, I am not a fan of forgetting spells. I like the idea that you have knowledge or you don''t, so one approach I sometimes use is this: magic is fluid and constantly changing, so a mage must study their spells every single day to understand the method of casting *for that day* (alignment of the stars, the season, etc). Then they roll against a certain difficulty when they want to cast. If they fail a roll, then either they didn't understand/ studied incorrectly, or something has shifted that invalidated the method they studied and they need to study it anew before another casting attempt.
I get the whole "HP represents more than just injury" argument and it makes some amount of sense, but overall I don't buy it because D&D contradicts that take all the time. The rules on HP are very incongruent with themselves, overall.
If you want to enforce that theme a bit more strongly consider games with a "grit" system. In Mausritter your HP is 1-1 based on your strength stat and only goes up when your strength does. But, every level-up gives you an additional d6 in Grit, which functions like HP and regenerates after a night of rest. So, early fights function like D&D, but if it drags on or your forced into multiple fights it functions more like a wounds system, where every hp lost adds a negative condition and you'll need a long time to recover. It makes sense that when you level up you don't literally become more durable, but your combat expertise keeps you alive and uninjured longer in a fight.
@@ardentdropsthat sounds somewhat similar to a house rule I had. I used Hit Points (which would fully heal after a night's rest) and Body Points (which healed 1/ day). Loss of body points inflicted penalties to physical rolls and a critical hit would go straight to BP, meaning one solid crit could potentially kill you instantly.
@@jcraigwilliams70 Yes that is pretty similar. In Mausritter any attack that would not be affected by combat expertise goes straight to your current strength, such as poison or being stabbed while unconscious or tied up. Every point below the maximum adds a condition that takes up an inventory slot, forcing you to drop gear if you're too wounded.
I would have added #6 Tests. Savage Worlds lets you try stunts from the movies. Throw sand in an enemies face, taunt them, use your polished shield to direct sunlight into their eyes. Savage Worlds does this so smoothly with the test mechanic and encourages all sorts of creativity in combat.
My reason for Savage Worlds is it has Deadlands. That alone is enough.
But having a simple system that lets you do literally anything you want with balanced mechanics helps too.
I agree with all of your points, but I'd add an even bigger one than any you mentioned : I hate D&D Combat. In D&D, everything is combat. 99% of all class abilities, spells, equipment, is geared towards Combat. I don't want to FIGHT all the time! There's so many interesting stories to be told that don't involve violence, and SWADE gives you the leverage to not only build effective non-combat characters, but also to run a variety of encounters that aren't combat-based.
I completely agree. You look at class abilities and it is all about fighting.
One thing I love most about Powers' Trappings, its great narrative element. The same Power can be wield differently just because of its Trapping. Fireball may be problematic inside a forest, but your good elfish friend is a bard. His Blast is pure sound, unplesant but wont cause entriovemental hazard... right?
I didn't read through all the comments so I might be repeating... #1 Hate that you have to declare Inspiration usage before the roll. Insp. is rare enough and you might just waste it on a double high roll. Bennies can be used after a bad roll : a lot better. #2 hate the fixed initiative in DnD. Go round and round always in the same order. Rolling a high initiative is only usefull in the first round. SW keeps you on the edge of your seat 'cause you never know exactly when you will go + gives a way better result value to someone who's actually Quick (edge).
Agree, expecelly with ready and hold action
Bennies are very useful if you don't make them too strong. I often handle situations where players have good ideas (consistent with the logic of the world but too strong) with letting them pay a bennie for it. Because if you refuse every good idea they get frustrated, if you give in every time it gets to easy. With a bennie they pay a price but still can continue.
I totally agree with most of your points. As someone who's been playing a wizard in 5e, the spells are a freaking nightmare. My next character in 5e is gonna be a basic ass fighter for this exact reason.
Personally, I'm trying out Dungeon World for future games, but I do have a lot of respect for Savage Worlds, because it does a lot of things I like.
Point 1: A static target number for most checks. Did you roll a 4 or higher? Awesome, you do the thing. Easily beats coming up with a fluid DC, and speeds up the game considerably.
Point 2: Exploding Dice. I love, love, LOVE exploding dice. I loved them ever since I bought Savage Worlds for $10 on a whim, and I love them in any game that has them. Queation, what's better than rolling a Natural 20? Succeeding on an unskilled d4 roll with a total of 24. *mic drop*
Bennies are great. And the initiative system using a deck of cards has a nice little interaction with Bennies built in there. Besides being able to spend a Benny to draw a new Action Card.
For those not yet in the know - Jokers are indeed WILD; providing the recipient, and their team, some interesting, well, benefits.
I appreciate these points. I have included some similar things in my in my own RPG for a many years.
I do want to comment on the On Hold action, though. While it may be more cinematic, once players grasp the tactical power of the action, it gives higher initiative players a little too much power. Placing some restrictions helps to keep this from becoming everyone's go-to. People over using it also can be a real pain to track. I have a way to hold actions in my game as well that is a good bit more flexible than D&D's method, but with some restrictions still. I originally was wide open, like Savage Worlds, but it just proved to be OP. Most players were holding for tactical advantage and I couldn't realistically have all the bad guys holding all the time in response and keep the game progressing at all.
I have yet to see this, but I can understand the possibility.
Class-based systems make sense in a game world that assumes a pseudo-medieval social structure, like in D&D. The medieval world was a place where guilds and apprenticeships were everything, and occupations were so specialized that most people spent their entire lives dedicating themselves to one particular craft. We take things like social mobility and widespread education for granted, when they would really not be assumed in a typical D&D milieu. In a modern or futuristic setting, a skill-based system is much better than a class-based one.
Secondly, there are plenty of ways to make D&D combat more dangerous and terrifying. The critical hit system used in Combat & Tactics (written for 2e, which I still play) has plenty of ways to seriously impair the PCs and their enemies. I also did away with the saving throw, and upped the severity by one die category. So watch out!
With all of this said, I think the D&D game is fairly limited in its applicability. It can cover high fantasy, sword & sorcery, new weird, sword & sandal, stone & sorcery, historical fantasy, and even flintlock fantasy pretty well. But anything else is pushing it. Re-skinning D&D to fit a vastly different sort of game is usually a poor idea. Just use another system made for that genre instead.
I like Savage Worlds, but the swingyness of combat (Because dice explode and all) Can be frustrating. I’d play it more, but one of my gaming group doesn’t like the system because he feels the sense of progression isn’t as good as D&D because you don’t gain as much every time you ‘level up’.
The swingyness takes some getting used to because it does change how you play the game compared to others. The swingyness is a feature of the game, but it can take some time for people to get that.
The levels ups are slower, but also you don't really become more powerful as the game progresses, or at least not much, but that is also part of the point of the style of the game. One quote I use often is that in Savage Worlds you don't become more powerful, you become more interesting.
On Hold is such an awesome mechanic. At first I was treating it like Hold Action but once I learned how good it is, especially if used to get first action next round, my baddies aren't just punching bags for the players anymore. Using Defend, Aim and Cover can turn Edgeless Extras into a challenging encounter.
Aim and cover are great if working with Range combat. Hold also works great when utilizing cover
I'm full on noob, like never really played one game, but I am leaning towards savage worlds, and that is partially because of "me, myself, and die".
I've switched to GMing SW mostly because of your reason number 1, hit points. On 5e (but I also felt this problem back in my 3.x days), the incredible amount of hp a creature can have may give rise to annoying situations, such as a player coming up with a good plan to surprise some elite draconic guards/mages and another player answering "That's all good, but they'll still have a good chunk of hit points, so why bother with a complicate plan when we can just attack them frontally?". The steep rise of hp from 2e onward has, in my opinion, contributed to this and I was looking for a system that, while still retaining a certain advantage for PC and bosses, kept the whole thing in check. Though I suspect that a similar result could be reached by lowering the hp amounts in D&D 5e, following the suggestions provided by Professor DM on his channel, for example.
Reason number 3 (check your summary at top of the video, reason 3 is named as "Classes" but I should be "Inspiration") is also a good one. I have made some experiments with 5e because I felt that 1 inspiration only was too low and I ended up fixing its limit to 3. But SW Bennie are definitely better, though I must say that their mechanics (most of them at least) could be applied to D&D as well.
As for classes and magic system, I haven't got any problem with their D&D versions, to the point that I use SWPF for classes (but of course classes are "a bit" different there if compared to D&D ones) and Zandmar's slot magic system for magic (yes, I love the incredibile amount of spells, the strategic planning that comes with them and I couldn't imagine Elminster or Raistlin using Powers, though I wouldn't have any problem with them in non D&D settings).
On the Hold action, I've no particular complain or appreciation.
In the end, I too like very much SW, to the point where I am currently running a mini campaign in the Realms for my D&D group, to make them acquainted with its rules, before shifting to a longer one. So far, they seem to like it, expecially the whole deadly thing of combats that force them to use more their brains and less their dice.
I love Savage Worlds. Glad to see content for it. I still haven't played the newer version. I'm gonna go check out the channel.
I have played every edition of D&D/D20 including first edition Gamma World and Cypher system. Although my reasons for abandoning D&D/D20 are different from yours, (with the exception of hitpoints) I totally agree with you. I will never go back. Playing D&D/D20 feels like going backwards..... and not in a good way. Did I mention how much I loathe tracking hitpoints, especially as a GM?
I cut my teeth on D&D 3.5 and the D20 Star Wars RPG...probably the crunchiest systems ever! I'm thankful for all the happy times with those games, but rules-light systems are way more fun for me now.
I see “Dusk City Outlaws” on the shelf and greatly approve. 👍🏻
I agree with everything you said. SW is my go-to now. I still play other things, but nothing beats SW for flexibility, especially with magic!
It's a great one shot heist game. I don't think I'd run a campaign in it.
@@TheSavageGoose agreed. It can do a great procedural world build, but it’s not necessary. I highly recommend “Spectaculars” for a great supers game that’s very cool with an emergent world.
So, favorite SW setting? I’d have to say Weird West, if forced to choose.
You have good and valid points (even if I don't agree with all of it), and Savage Worlds does solve many issues you raise. That said, D&D can offer a couple playstyles that Savage Worlds struggles to replicate, regarding crunch and scenarios where players contemplate deeply about their character's gear, powers, build and so on.
I'm not sure I entirely agree, but I understand the general sentiment.
I've tried d&d around 8 times and it frustrates me how much I want to like it compared to how much I actually don't like it. Rolling 10 times to do one thing is never going to be fun to me I guess. All the rolling just ruins and breaks up any kind of enjoyable immersion.
What was the thing you were trying to do?
Those things don't necessarily bother me. For me it's the overreliance of dice. I feel like it takes away player agency. Not just in combat, but combat is definitely a big one. If you compare a table top game to any kind of video game, usually unless it's pay to win, the player who des win is the one who has faster reactions and has spent more time playing the game. But Dungeons and Dragons, luck of the roll plays a huge factor.
Now, what's even worse are roll checks. Especially charisma, but wisdom and intelligence aren't that better. You shouldn't just be able to roll a dice and convince someone to do something. Likewise when trying to discover something in your setting. Persuasion should actually be persuasion. Meaning, you should have to talk to the NPC, learn more about them and their values and beliefs and find out what motivates them in order to be able to persuade someone. Like, finding out that a thief breaking into a stronghold to rob the gold of the barron only to feed his family would make it easier to convince him not to go through with it if you can help him find an alternative means of feeding his family. Likewise, if you're looking for a hidden door, instead of just rolling for a perception check, exploring the room looking for any kind of lever or pulling out books to discover one opens the hidden door would give players a much deeper experience.
um no not all players are good at persuasion but like the idea of playing the face of the group. this game is about playing a person that's not you.
I agree with your reasoning, although I chose to play Cypher System instead. Both CS and SWADE are great in their own ways, and if I had a lot more free time I'd probably play both.
What do you like about Cypher? I have not played a game in Cypher
@@TheSavageGoose setting-agnostic Cypher System's base gameplay loop is incredibly simple and elegant: GM assigns every task/enemy/NPC a level between 0 and 10. 0 is reliably doable to the point where it doesn't need a roll--e.g. flipping a light switch--where level 1-10 gives you a target number to meet-or-beat with a d20 roll.
Your target number is the level of the task times 3. Obviously, you can't roll a 21 through 30 on a d20, so task level 7 through 10 are impossible without modifications. The real beauty here is that you don't adjust the die roll, you only modify the task level upward or downward ("easing" or "hindering" in Cypher System game terms) which changes the target number. If you have a tool that aids you in a Climbing task, maybe you ease the task by 1 or 2 levels. If the lock you're trying to pick is particularly rusty, maybe it hinders the task by 1 or 2 steps. This allows you to adjust the difficulty base on circumstance very easily--akin to changing the DC on a D&D/Pathfinder roll, but without needing a bevy of modifiers to add or subtract.
I should also add that the GM does not, by default, roll dice in Cypher. The player rolls attack against an enemy, and they roll defense against the same enemy's attacks. This is one facet which helps lighten the cognitive load on the GM, so they may focus on the narrative and NPCs.
Additionally, character creation is wonderful. You build a PC with a sentence, e.g. "Onuma is a Resilient Warrior who Bears A Halo Of Fire". Resilient is the "descriptor," Warrior is the "type," and Bears A Halo Of Fire is the "focus." Each section consists of skills and abilities which you can use to customize your character's capabilities. Type is adjacent to class, but it is nowhere near as limiting as within D&D, Pathfinder, etc. You can also make entirely custom combinations of things, working between players & GMs to determine acceptability for the setting and table.
Since I'm risking turning this comment into a love letter to Cypher System and Monte Cook Games, I'll just state that you should check out the Cypher System rules primer (free on the MCG website) and/or tutorial vids from MCG, or channels such as Qedhup or RPG Elite.
We're trying SW now. Deadlands Noir. Great video, thank you.
Awesome! I heard a rumor they are making an updated version of Deadlands Noir for SWAdE
I run OSE but it’s heavily modified. Some new players are really lost by this, but through agreed decision making with regular players we have simplified the game. I think the DM has ultimate authority and every game should have house rules. But it really throws off new players who prepped.
I think that is one reason I like Savage Worlds, because modifying it usually just means adding certain Setting Rules, or using sub-systems in creative ways.
@@TheSavageGoose I like the wound system. Although I try to target my players by giving them disadvantages and dilemma as well as violence. I would prefer a simpler system like the cypher system. But D&D is where all the poaching is to be done. No one wants to play a brand new unheard of system when they a actually show up with a D&D starter kit.
You've articulated nearly every reason I have for playing games other than d&d. White Wolf has a similar wounds system that feels very visceral. My preferred system GURPS still uses HP but flips it on it's head by burying the vast majority of your HP in the negatives. You really don't want to get hit in that game.
I'm also not a fan of the d20. Way too swingy with no bell curve. Makes the game feel so arbitrary and capricious, and devalues all your stats.
It's also frustrating that every subsystem in d&d works differently. Like, they feel like they need to come up with a brand new mechanic for everything. Folks accuse GURPS of being complex, but the reality is every subsystem works nearly the same way, so once you've learned one, you've learned them all. It "rhymes" so to speak.
Maybe this is more of a preference than a criticism, but the cartoonish physics of d&d really take me out of the moment. It's so distracting. I get how more simulationist games can bog down some players who just want to roll and I don't blame them, but that framework helps solidify the world in my mind.
Did I mention HP already? D&D-style games have hit-dice and an HP pool that grows wildly out of control. It gets really hard to die and the combat stops feeling dangerous and more like a chore. If there's no threat I check out. Even if the threat is real the sheer number of HP involved turns combat into a slug-fest and it only gets interesting at the end. PF2e claims to fix this, but I'd rather play games where this isn't an issue to begin with.
Homebrew claims to fix anything, but if you build on a shaky foundation you'll be patching holes your whole life. 5e has a vibrant homebrewing community in no small part due to the flawed source material they work with. There's a lot of great innovation there but so much energy will continue to be wasted on arguing over the rules. The changes needed to "fix" d&d require dissolving much of the core identity of the game and are sacrosanct to its players. It can't happen because it means making a game that isn't d&d, and that's functionally equivalent to jumping ship.
Hit points are stamina, building fatigue, luck, etc. They're not physical damage, they're an avstraction for everything yjay leads up to actual physical damage.
Personally, I use exhaustion as a 'wound' system. Dropping to 0 HP gives you a cumulative -1 all d20 tests, save DC, and 5' of movement. While at 0, you make a DC 10 CON save every round, and fails give you an additional exhaustion. Exceed 10 exhaustion, and you die. 10 isn't a high DC, but remember you're getting a -1 to -10 on the CON save, so there's a death spiral effect. Three successes on the CON saves and you stabilize, and begin a short reat.
Getting rid of exhaustion requires a long rest, though rangers can recover 1 exhaustion per day with a short rest. If someon hits exhaustion 10 or more, Revivify and other resurrection effects sets them to 9 exhaustion. Lesser Restoration and Greater Restoration each remove as many exhaustion as their respective spell levels, but only on living characters who don't exceed 10 exhaustion.
Good reasons. there is also the fact that Savage Worlds works for most settings in a way that D&D does not
That is true. I do enjoy having one system for any kind of game I want to play. I have played Sci-Fi (Last Parsec), Victorian Horror (Rippers), Modern Horror (ETU), Fantasy (Pathfinder), Modern cthulhu (homebrew). The options are vast and wonderful.
I had a player whose bolt was a small swarm of vicious bees.
Love it!
This game sounds awesome. ;) (Thanks for the kind words!)
I've been playing and GMing (mostly GMing these days) D&D since 3.5 days and honestly the main thing I appreciate about Savage Worlds is combat speed. Combat in a lot of systems takes a long time, but my two favorites (Call of Cthulhu and Savage Worlds) typically keep the combat more punchy and quick which I appreciate. Games where it can take 20-30 minutes between a given player's turn drive me nuts. I've got literally every Pathfinder adventure path but hadn't had much motivation to run any of them until Savage Pathfinder released.
I also appreciate that Savage Worlds is built on taking hinderances at the start. I really loved Merits and Flaws, and that system getting lost along the way was unfortunate.
Don't have this system, can enemies NOT use the Hold action or something? Seems like a perfect way to just not do anything at all in a turn because both the enemy and the PCs are waiting for the other to do something. I'll probably get it next month (I've been meaning to), but if that's how the Hold action works, I'd probably have to change it so that the one declaring a Hold action needs to declare what they're holding for and if that doesn't happen, they just dither for that turn.
No. Enemies can go on hold too. That being said I rarely see that situation come up. If all sides go on hold and everyone is waiting, it usually devolves into a roleplay situation.
Terrific video! Nicely done!
Thank you!
Yeah. Played a bit of 3.5, a bit of 4E, then played a lot of 5E.
Now I just can't play it anymore. Grown old isn't the right term I guess. I used to love it but now that I have more experience in TTRPGs the things I dislike in 5e are too noticeable and I ended up starting the search for something else.
What I dislike the most in 5e are the classes. It sometimes feel like people play classes and not characters.
I might grab Savage world and test it out. So far I've tried Cypher System, Fate, BRP and Genesys... It's fun trying out new stuff and figuring out what I like an dislike about them.
Excellent information!! Thanks for the video.
Stumbled across this... and yep... except that I came to that conclusion back when 3rd Ed hit, and I don't think Savage Worlds was yet a thing. Deadlands was, though, and that's what Savage Worlds came out of. But that was also when I realized I like more narrative systems (but not very heavy narrative systems like FATE or PbtA), like Storyteller and now Storypath. I have run Savage worlds, though, and I do enjoy it enough that it's my default Generic system when I don't think I have a system that supports the particular narrative I want to explore.
Every week, I participate in a game of each. I love them both.
I've been enjoying the WEG Star Wars and Cyberpunk for many of these reasons.
I highly recommend to adapt the savage worlds system to have a combination of hitpoints and wounds. You still get a wound if you are over the limit, so it simulates being wounded - but very frequent weak blows can put you out of the fight also. I really hated it when you hit enemies very often but it wouldn't affect them at all. The mit of HP and wounds plays awesome and just as simple 👌
I strongly advice against this.
It will most certainly will NOT work good in the existing system.
And is completely unnecessary. And additional bookkeeping.
And if you had frequent hits that did nothing you were doing it wrong. Period.
Have you thought about house rules to change things ? Groups have used a wound system for D&D or something similar to bennies instead of inspiration. I think the real problem comes from players trying video games first where have much damage you take doesn't affect what you can do and dying is almost a joke
While I haven't tried them yet, there are some Savage Worlds mechanics I'm going to start using in my D&D games.
I'm also a SW convert. They got me when they adapted RIFTS.
I backed the first Rifts for Savage Worlds Kickstarter, but have yet to run it.
@@TheSavageGoose It's so fun. I played a Psi-Stalker Cyber-knight for an 8-month campaign.
Totally agree with most of this. There are pros to dnd however, especially if hacked. I hacked mine to get rid of classes, and gittibg rid of hitpoints atm. May end up just using s.v. some of the time xD
What about using house rules to incorporate things you like from two or more systems to create a unique game experience for your group?
Or, modify the parts of D&D that you don't quite like, and make them into something that you do like...and use that as your house rule on a given part of the game.
There's nothing preventing you from blending game systems to make something new, unless you just want to play an established game that someone has already done that with...your call.
Absolutely. If I run a game of 5e again, I am definitely using Savage Worlds Hold system. The only thing I am not sure about is how to handle Initiative. Rolling each time seems like it may take up too much time.
@@TheSavageGoose why not use the Savage Worlds method for initiative also?
I've played games where initiative is rolled every round, and I've seen videos of 5e games where they roll once for the entire combat encounter, which is much faster, but does break the pace of what's happening.
Remember, it's your table, so your rules apply. If you don't like their initiative system, use something from another system or make up your own.
hell i am currently playing 2 5e campaigns 1 weird war 2 campaign in sw, and a pathfinder 3.5e game. i enjoy them all.
Good! That's great to hear!
Reason for me:
WotC and Ha$bro. Left after 3.5, tried 4e and 5e. Just not for me.
Picked up Savage Worlds recently. But before that I was a big player of DCC RPG, CoC, Traveller, The One Ring, Forbidden Lands and B/X.
What brought you to Savage Worlds?
@@TheSavageGoose always was interested in it and followed the game for years, but never picked it up until recently I decided I want to grab a copy.
Not too sure when I will run it, but planning on using the Vermilium setting, looks cool.
I haven't purchased it yet, but it's #1 on my wishlist. waiting for the Kickstarter for the new adventure for it.
3rd edition with some house rules. No Haste spell, re-do Wish / miracle and timestop. AND Crit is 20's only. 3 total "classes" Martial, Mage, or Expert. All feats available to every class so no multiclassing. DM and player communication focused that go along with the story/world.
Agree, there were awesome games fixing all those problems already in the early 90's like, for instance, vampire the masquerade. And still most people choose dnd, despite all its flaws, because its simple and easy. Roll d20, hit CA, roll damage. After all role games are more about role playing then rolling dice.. This being said, vtm is my absolute favorite game (despite its clunkiness) and still play it to this day, alternating it with dnd campaings..
I have a coworker who really likes VtM. The worlds/lore sounds super interesting, but I don't think we have talked game mechanics. I wiull have to ask him about that next time I see him.
@@TheSavageGooseFrom what I read (briefly) there are some similiarities between Salvage World and VtM. Like the fact that checks are done by combining attibutes and skills. Also the wound system is similar (vampires become incapacitated after receiving 7 damage levels, with progressive penalties to the checks..). I find this type of game mechanics very fun and certainly more realistic than dnd's. On the flipside, the more realistic you get, the more complicated and clunky the game becomes. I will check savage world anyway, it sounds fun..
You don't combine Attributes and Skills in Savage Worlds. They both exist, but Attributes rarely get rolled except to resist something.
Attributes affect your Skills, but it's more about how high it can go without costing you anything.
I will eventually work on a basic how-to-play video, but that may be a while. It will take too long to edit if it is anything like today's character creation video.
I love Savage Worlds, the Deadlands settings are all excellent, but for a fantasy RPG I prefer Pathfinder 2e.
I don't know if we were doing something wrong, but when I tried SW with my group I found the Wound and Toughness system very frustrating. Almost no successful attacks (from PCs or NPCs alike), and when there was one it was absorbed or ended in just shaken. It was like there was no progress at all. It made me miss hit points.
Thanks for sharing!
In my experience, combat is shorter in Savage Worlds, so it's possible something wasn't clicking, but I couldn't say without seeing it and knowing how things were going.
You most certainly missed something.
Did your players invest a reasonable amount into their combat skills?
Did you play with exploding dice?
Usually it takes not that many hits until a damage die explodes (aces) and it causes one or more wounds with one attack.
I've been curious about Savage Worlds for a while, but I think I prefer GURPS overall.
Btw, check out Genesys when you get a chance.
Both systems are on my list to check out at some point. I may need someone to run a game for me so I can learn without having to buy the books and read the cover to cover.
@@TheSavageGoose
Genesys uses all the features you mentioned here, so that easily puts it in line with what you love about Savage Worlds, but what really sets Genesys apart is the Narrative Dice system. Worth taking a look at for sure, one of the most creative and intuitive game features I've seen in a while (and I've been playing a long time).
GURPS, on the other hand, is it's own beast, there's nothing else like it. I'm not here to give a sales pitch about it, but definitely be warned, unbounded freedom in a TTRPG is a double edged sword, especially for the poor GM. If you play GURPS, try to find an experienced Game master to run it, it can be overwhelming.
Good luck out there, and hey, if you happen to be in Seattle I'd be glad to run a game or two.
Don't waste your time with GURPS. Savage is way better than GURPS. It's basically an evolved version of GURPS that's pretty much better in every way.
GURPS has this awful bloated skill list where it looks like they brainstormed every possible skill they could ever think of and more, where Savage Worlds skill list is relatively tight and compact. GURPS skill list is massive. It tries to make you think it's a skill-based game, because obviously the designers put a ton of thought into skills but it really isn't, not in practice. The thing is that because there's so many skills, most of those GURPS skills you'll never make a roll on in a real game, they're purely sacrifices burned at the altar of the simulationist gods. Lets look at something basic like history, cause maybe you want to know some of the setting's lore. Unlike most RPGs you don't just make the guy who knows a general history skill and anytime you hear an important historic name, you get a roll and maybe you know some cool backstory and lore. Not in GURPS. In GURPS, you have to choose a specific Historic period. So you might choose Roman Empire or the Renaissance Europe. And if it doesn't fall in your area of expertise, well you're screwed. So you have to burn points on this hyperspecialized stuff and then hope to be lucky enough to align with anything the GM includes in his game. The sadistic GURPS GM will of course never tier of saying stuff like "Did anyone take Paleontology( Micropaleontology specialization)? No? Oh well I guess you don't get a roll." then laughing to themselves when nobody has it (because of course they don't). Lesser gotchas include reminding the rogue that shoplifting is a separate skill from picking pockets.
So what happens? Well you wise up and basically ignore the vast majority of the skills and just take your go-to "murder people" skill. As you might expect, GURPS is anal about that too and you have to actually pick broadsword or shotgun, but that's not that big a deal because you make a character that has a broadsword or a shotgun and that's all you ever plan on using. Unlike the history checks, you get to control what gear you bring, so having to specialize isn't all that limiting. Sure it's boring to always use the same weapon, but it gets your enemies dead. And speaking of that, Savage Worlds has sensible limits on raising skills and traits, with a good balance of what trait does what, where as GURPS just basically lets you put all your points into one sword skill.
As for combat, GURPS is resolved in one second rounds where you need multiple combat turns to just stand from prone or to recover something from your backpack. It's not the worst tactical combat system, but it is very slow.
I played GURPS for several years, and ended up hating it. Their setting and source books are great and full of ideas, but I have no desire to ever play the system again.
My two biggest companies:
1) Combat takes too long because you can't do squat in its one-second combat rounds.
2) Skills and Advantages are overly specific and precise, giving the GM much too much to remember. Every game session, we would be in the middle of a combat (which was already slow enough) when suddenly the game came to a screeching halt for ten minutes because the GM had to search through half a dozen books to find a specific rule. When the rules are overly-specific, it makes you feel like you have to get all the details precisely right when you play, and it only serves to bog things down. Fewer but broader skills are definitely better than hundreds of narrowly-defined skills.
It's a pity, because the setting and source books really are great and are worth getting just to borrow their ideas.
One more thing. Here's a story to illustrate the difference between the GURPS mindset and the Savage Worlds mindset:
The first time I GMed Savage Worlds, one of my player's entire previous RPG experience was with GURPS. The PC's car got a flat tire for narrative purposes. There was no urgency to get the tire changed quickly.
The former GURPS player kept asking me what dice to roll to change the tire! I had to tell him 3 or 4 times before he got the point that no rolls were necessary, because in Savage Worlds, you don't roll dice unless failure is consequential or your time to succeed is very limited. We don't bog the game down with rolling for every little thing.
He finally got the point, and he ended up loving the freedom from overly-constraining rules that Savage Worlds offers.
I really like the wounds in Savage Worlds too, of course I'm a silly old bugger with a penchant for melodrama, so I would. Plus, much like yourself, I've always found scratching off hit points to be a bit of a chore.
Glad to discover a new channel to subscribe to.
Gurps is also really good and was the first system to make your character how you want to make them.
I agree with you the Hit Point systems are bad, but honestly, I dislike Wound Penalty systems also. I have no issues with classes per se, even though I prefer them more as guidelines to get easily to an iconic archetype and not so strict as D&D has them. D&D and Savage Worlds both go for a hard magic system, which of course is what most TTRPG systems do, but I prefer soft magic. The holding of an action is also of no real concern to me, since I am ot really into combat focused play either. Thus overall, neither game is for me.
Thanks for sharing!
Just curious, which systems do you play? How do they emulate the 'soft magic' thing?
I agree with everything but my switch to Savage Worlds is mostly driven by WOTC politics and terrible decisions made since January of this year. I am glad they screwed up because it broke their hold on me for what a Roleplaying game should be and allowed me to branch out and look for alternatives. I found SWADE and haven't looked back. It was a pain to rewrite all of my campaign guide material for my setting to the SWADE engine but once I got it done I was golden.
Welcome to Savage Worlds and the Savage Community!
Pretty much all the same reasons I switched from dnd to call of cthulhu
I've enjoyed the One Shots I've played of that game, but I don't think I could run a campaign for it.
@TheSavageGoose that is how a lot of people run it. I prefer long mysteries or monster of the week style and both those work for me any my table.
@@TheSavageGoose Pulp Cthulhu makes running a campaign a little more manageable. The heroes are typically a little more sturdy and less likely to die at the drop of a hat, as well as more differentiated. I've run several years-long Pulp Cthulhu campaigns without the normal CoC character revolving door. Give it a shot sometime!
I really agree with you thank you for videos
Thanks for watching!
This is a good list, but definitely not exhaustive.
I find the advancement or level system restrictive, especially if your DM is stingy with xp.
SW has a nice fluid advancement, save the xp spend it when you have enough to get what you want.
These among many other flaws.
Agreed
Can’t disagree on any point. DnD being the only game in town here has been immensely frustrating.
EXPLODING DICE EXPLODE!! 1!
Wow, now that you put it that way, the "hold" action is dumb as bricks. I'm currently playing Pathifinder (1st e.) and we had a whole thing around the "brace" action for pole weapons. It's entirely useless. RAW according to my GM, I have to use a redied action to brace my weapon _against a charge speciffically_ , so there goes my turn. Now if any characters does anything BUT charge, it's wasted. NPCs never charge. They see me bracing and just "walk" towards me and hit me. So I wasted my turn bracing and I wasted a readied action that I could have redied for something like "If an enemy moves into my melee area" (still wouldn't get the benefits of brace)
That's because Brace should be a reaction.
@@cellphone7223 It's either that or just double damage against "mounted enemies or enemies one size larger tha you" on _any_ readied attack if the idea is to emulate the advantage against cavalry or using their weight against them or whatever...
@@Rodrigo_Vega Yeah I get that but if your Initiative is after the Charger it makes Brace redundant. As a reaction you can Brace when the target charges you, as long as you have the reaction to burn to do so. Make your rolls to hit, double damage, possible unseat? etc etc....
@@cellphone7223 Yea that seems simple and fun enough.
Great conversation guys. No matter the system, helpful tips are great.
Savage Worlds replaced 4th edition DnD for me. Its a good game
Oh boy. 4th edition is technically the first D&D I played before quickly switching to 3.5.
The skill/ability/feature management of the game was too much for me in 4e and it felt way too focused on combat. I started with the 4e red box and that's all I ever bought.
IDK if your into video games but to anyone who shares these criticisms and enjoys strategic combat/survival elements in their RPG's , I highly recommend Stoneshard.
Yes more Savage worlds content please
Sorry it's been slow going. Almost done editing my next one
No worries I will wait patiently :)@@TheSavageGoose
Ummm... You cannot "Grow old of" something. But I like you video.
You are absolutely right. The phrase I was looking for was grown tired of. Oh well. Thanks for watching!
Hey, I momentarily forgot my moderator's name last night. :)@@TheSavageGoose
7:00. You mean the READY action . It's NOT called the Hold action in D&D. It's the Hold action in Savage Worlds, but it's the READY action in D&D.
Bennies are your hit points.
That is definitely one way to look at it. They are the attrition system of Savage Worlds, although at the same time, you want players to have them all of them time.
So hitpoints with damage resistance???
I mostly agree. SW's exploding dice are a downside you didn't touch on, and WotC's business behavior is probably the most compelling reason to leave 5e behind. Other than that, sure.
I disagree that exploding dice are a downside. They are one of my favorite things about Savage Worlds.
How do you acknowledge multiclassing and still claim that when you pick a class "you are stuck with it for the rest of the game and you can't change your mind or try something different."?
Its a good generic system, but I rather play old editions of dnd if I want to play high fantasy, it seem good for a kitchen sink setting.
It definitely is good for kitchen sink (see Rifts) but I think it's good for fantasy as well. However, it does play very differently
So I'm genuinely asking this in good faith, but what is it about specifically d&d players and calling "I'm playing another game" "switching".
It feels like the community assumes you only play 1 game, and it's a big deal to play a different game.
While a lot of players have multiple systems they play, most people have the one system that they assume unless specifically playing a different game.
Whether 5e, GURPS, Savage Worlds, etc. I have other systems I run and play, but my default is Savage Worlds when it used to be 5e. Part of it is just the monetary investment. People have put money into a system and don't want to switch or play something else. It's about getting a return. This is why, IMO, a lot of people are nervous about One D&D. They've already invested a lot into 5e, and don't want to lose that investment.
So when someone does make a switch, and abandons their investment, the idea is that they are making a big change that was worth it.
This is not true for everyone. I know plenty of people who have lots and lots of systems. But there are also some people who just stick to one. You could call them the more casual players, and I mean nothing negative about that. Overall, compared to a lot of people, I'm a casual TTRPG player, but maybe not as casual as others.
I have two main systems on my shelves. 5e and Savage Worlds, and I haven't touched 5e in awhile. I also have Dread and Dusk City Outlaws on my shelf, and various systems in PDF form.
On Hold cinched it, never liked the DnD mechanic.
I just can’t get out of the dnd mindset. I love classes and leveling. 2E forever
I think everyone loves leveling, and I definitely had a hard time understanding not having classes when I first started with Savage Worlds back in the early 2010s. This is why I think the new Savage Pathfinder books are helpful.
Wait till you find out about GURPS. You're gonna shit your pants.
I will admit that GURPS is something that I should look into as well, but every time someome describes it to me it feels daunting and too crunchy.
Not into it. Appreciate you explaining it tho!
Hey, not for everyone. The beauty of the hobby is that there are SO many games out there to find something you and your table can enjoy together.
I love D &D, I also love SW. What I do not like, is antagonistic RUclips channels who make money on wizards of the Coast’s coat tails.
Thanks for watching!
You got savage in your name, bias take :)
That's one way to see it. :P
@TheSavageGoose ima check out Savage worlds anyway...despite the shillery ;) jk thanks for the video.
I won't play anything but Savage Worlds. Those d20 systems seem too clunky after you have played Savage Worlds for awhile.
Or try an edition with a bit more crunch. Maybe give 3.5 a try.
Personally 3.5 has too much crunch. Savage Worlds is a bit lighter. I enjoy the more pulpy nature of Savage Worlds.
But I did start with 3.5.
@@TheSavageGoose yeah it can definately be as much of a detriment as a benefit in some cases. Personally I just use core + the complete X books and allow feats and classes from other sources on a case by case as they fot with the setting and power level. Definately helps filter a lot of the more silly stuff.
Ooohh Savage Worlds. I thought you saved Savage Whor.... err nevermind.
I hate D&D too (I don't even think "hate" is too strong a word for it), but I really don't grok how these changes fix any of the fundamental problems that D&D has. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Most of these points are basically side-grades or half-measures. The real questions are:
• Is Savage Worlds making combat mesh with the rest of the game so that fights and non-fights aren't these two completely separated modes of play?
• Does Savage Worlds procedurally generate stories and conflicts, or do I have to prep them myself?
• How often do Savage Worlds' mechanics result in a player repeating the same action/roll (or the same general sequence of actions/rolls) more than twice in a row?
The fact that nobody seems to bring these topics up when comparing the games is creating the strong impression that SW is basically a loose clone of D&D.
For comparison in understanding what you mean, what games think so this well?
@@TheSavageGoose I'd say that 'Apocalypse World', 'Blades in the Dark', 'Alice Is Missing', and 'Lasers & Feelings' are good examples. I also have the impression that 'Fiasco' and 'Dream Askew' are good examples, but I have not played them yet.
@@0bscure42 okay. I'll look into it just to make sure I understand what you mean
damage to players via hit point damage is SIMPLE. the DM just assigns a damn wound ..... easy. LOL !!
You can hate 5e. You won't be alone.
I would disagree about customization in D&D. I see your points and I mostly agree, but I would say that it's false to say there isn't customization in 5e. I mean, you could make two characters of the same class and have them both be completely unique and different from one another.