Just to highlight...The traction control was completely off. It randomly turns back on mid corner and thats the issue. The traction control when on is way more aggressive than anything else ive driven which is the second issue.
Are you sure there is not a fault on this specific car? Jackie ding and numerous others are competing in time attack with this car and not having these issues. There’s videos of his stock car racing a M2c doing multiple laps with no TC issues... Edit: they did have problems but seemed to have found away around it. Check out the supra forums.
@@guypascua8848 It really does :D I once had a brit sitting next to me in the train, just complaining about the "deutsche Bahn" for 50 min straight and I enjoyed every second of it ^^
That's so f..king dangerous electronics turning on when you've turned it off, no wonder that its out of the Apex fleet, don't worry about the language the car tried to kill you, looking forward to hearing what Robert thinks, Rj in Oz
Great video mate. Honesty is the best policy👍 Also, can we just take a minute to appreciate the driver of the Mondeo Estate at the beginning of the video! He/she was really pedalling that!
Constantly impressed with your extremely smooth drive style. I can’t wait to watch your style in a very fast car. I keep working to develop smoothness, you have it in spades! Love your videos.
The 3.0 l Supra has 340 PS stock (at least in Germany). And there are some circumstances that force the TCS to kick in unexpectedly - has to do with tire pressures, and/or ride height or EDC: www.supramkv.com/threads/electronics-affecting-traction-control.2993/#post-62936
@@TwistedSymmetryUK Oops - then maybe you should talk to the people at "sport auto". AFAIK they have a an excellent relationship with APEX and did an extensive testing recently with the Supra and its driver aid systems.
My experience having gone down the route of looking for both TC/SC coding solutions and ABS solutions, is that it's basically impossible - you have to run a completely different system that bypasses the OE system. I have a 997.GT3.mk1 and use to track a complete prepped 2001 Audi Twin Turbo S4 (I was lucky that in my 2001.5 S4 off is fully off) - but on the GT3, once you start running really sticky rubber, the ABS control unit will freak out and go ice-mode - the only solution is to pull the until and install the Motorsport ABS controller - you can then go crazy deep into corners and not worry about the ABS until sending you into a wall. Would appreciate a contact if you find someone that can provably show they have done this. Thanks
Im going to do some digging for sure and see what can be done, The new VW systems can be coded down so theyre not so aggressive...hopefully this is the same at the very least
I’m really enjoying these videos. The traction control on my 2020 Ford Focus automatic is far more aggressive than anything I’ve ever driven. There is a “slight” bend in a road I drive daily and this is the only car where traction control kicks in.
Toyota will soon have inflating and deflating airbags system so that if the ABS kicks on the airbags will deploy then go back into the steering wheel when ABS traction turns back off. Its called the Holy Fuck What's Happening System.. or HFWH for short.
My corolla hatchback does the same shit with the assists. Moving from PS4S's to PSAS4's the traction control assists totally fuck with the steering and feeling of stability into corners. I'm sad to see that this is carried into a car I would consider as my next potential purchase. I am glad to see that you have found a solution for the bump steer but T/C has got to go or at least be modified in both platforms. I'm worried now that the new GR Corolla is going to have the same issue.
In your video you mention that the TC randomly turns back on. I recently heard that it can come back if you enter the corner with ABS. ABS would be the cause of that TC turning back on... Any thoughts ?
The Supra seems so quick and capable, why make it unstable on the track. Seems weird that Toyota would not allow for better track manners. Thanks George and looking forward to the next drive and overview.
Please, Good Sir, swear and speak your mind. There's enough "feel good" channels as it is. And if you are a public persona, half the people hate you anyway. Your comment section will fill with fan-boy circlejerk though, given enough time. Do what you love with honesty and you'll find your audience. Godspeed.
Hi George, really like ur vids n speach. Misha and Robert cover all "what to do", maybe u can help us with "where to get" to help us, who are not so deep in the car world.
Borre needs a lapel mic. But from how he was gripping the seat, I think is was either forcing himself not to scream or not to swear. To be honest, when the French swear, it almost sounds like music! LOL
Yeah, that car needs a quaife diff or similar, solid aluminium bushes on the subframe to the body, and then that car will start to handle a bit.. the diff, will combat alot of DSC/ESP enterfering. But it's to bad that it isnt possible to completely take out the DSC/ESP, even with a long press on the button.
Strange to see how Toyoya got this car which was so hyped so wrong, and yet knock it out the park with the Yaris. The traction system is just wrong, would be interesting to see how you would stand should something happen as a direct result, pitching off line when a bike is alongside for example doesn't even bare thinking about
I’m not surprised you were swearing George, that electronic intervention when pushing on must be unnerving to say the least. Car goes pretty well otherwise.
how does this tc esp system behave on a bmw Z4 then? should be the same shouldnt it? there must be a solution. there are so many bmw experts around the ring.
Sounds like Toyota just stuck the same traction control system in that they use in the Camry. You really shouldn't have to be dealing with re-flashing to fix issues like this in something which is being sold as a sports car. Even my cheap little Fiesta turns all the systems off when i tell it to.
You clearly don’t have the systems turned off. Your driver assistance systems are beeping away as you approach vehicles. Push it down and hold it. Also push down on TC and hold it, your stability control is still on. Myself and numerous people track this vehicle with zero issues. User error on your part.
I know how to operate the car the lap started with systems off. Theres common issues with level sensors and TPMS causing traction control systems to come back on in certain conditions. But thanks for your concern
That's just stupid, market a sports car and then have it make itself worse by overdoing the traction control.... Or did Toyota know about the bump steer and instead of taking the expensive route of re-engineering the suspension properly they just took the cheap way out of dialling up the traction control? ..... Bit like Boeing did with MCAS on the 737 max.
don't know what the fuck u are doing with ur supra, but i NEVER had the tsc comming back up, and i trash this fucking car every day, it's a 2019 on mhd tune, the only way i got the tsc back on, is when i turn it off and tire pressure is to low, it will come back up ONE TIME after i drive faster like 20kph, then i can turn if off and it will NEVER turn back on bay itself EVER, if tire pressure a good this will NEVER happen, had mutiple track day on this car, never happen, and the car is lowered as well
Just to highlight...The traction control was completely off. It randomly turns back on mid corner and thats the issue. The traction control when on is way more aggressive than anything else ive driven which is the second issue.
Wow. That's a huge disaster right there
Video Part: 2:13
🤬🤬Toyota sort it out you 🤬😂 proper English! George swearing is part of are vocabulary!👌🏻🤟🏻
Cool lap George.👌🏻🤟🏻
I've had that issue in every Toyota I've owned so far, TCS is never FULLY off...
Are you sure there is not a fault on this specific car? Jackie ding and numerous others are competing in time attack with this car and not having these issues. There’s videos of his stock car racing a M2c doing multiple laps with no TC issues...
Edit: they did have problems but seemed to have found away around it. Check out the supra forums.
I actually like your swearing and accent, gives your videos a nice touch ^^
Difficult for a mechanic not to swear lol
When a Brit swears, it sounds poetic. When an American swears, it's just guttural sounding.
@@sub-vibes yeah :D
@@TwistedSymmetryUK think you got a point there^^ Didnt read it in the job description but seems mandatory
@@guypascua8848 It really does :D I once had a brit sitting next to me in the train, just complaining about the "deutsche Bahn" for 50 min straight and I enjoyed every second of it ^^
Hey Borre
Hey Mitchell
Hey Robert, how is life?
That's so f..king dangerous electronics turning on when you've turned it off, no wonder that its out of the Apex fleet, don't worry about the language the car tried to kill you, looking forward to hearing what Robert thinks, Rj in Oz
Exactly! all of our rentals are setup so theyre safe for anyone to drive..this was near impossible to do so with stuff like this interfering
I didnt delete shit...but you're boring AF 🥱
@@thereisagiantcubeinthesun5500 Sad and pathetic? says the boy hiding behind a youtube name 👍🏽
@@thereisagiantcubeinthesun5500 no one likes you
Great video mate. Honesty is the best policy👍
Also, can we just take a minute to appreciate the driver of the Mondeo Estate at the beginning of the video! He/she was really pedalling that!
I know right! lol i sat behind him for abit in my head i was applauding haha
How are you meant to drift the car if the traction control keeps coming back on if its turned off?
Great detailed video. Which verkline suspension products did you use to fix the bump steer?
We used the complete verkline kit, once setup the difference was night and day!
Constantly impressed with your extremely smooth drive style. I can’t wait to watch your style in a very fast car. I keep working to develop smoothness, you have it in spades! Love your videos.
The 3.0 l Supra has 340 PS stock (at least in Germany). And there are some circumstances that force the TCS to kick in unexpectedly - has to do with tire pressures, and/or ride height or EDC:
www.supramkv.com/threads/electronics-affecting-traction-control.2993/#post-62936
Nice find. In Toyota's defence, how were they supposed to know that people would lower their cars 🤦♂️
@@happybeerlove I for one would have never predicted that the tuner special vehicle that I marketed as a sports car would be modified.
I found this yesterday while doing some digging 👌🏽
@@happybeerlove Id agree but we had the same issue when the car was stock...along with a fair few other people
@@TwistedSymmetryUK Oops - then maybe you should talk to the people at "sport auto". AFAIK they have a an excellent relationship with APEX and did an extensive testing recently with the Supra and its driver aid systems.
Good video
So have they sorted this issue with the 2024 supra?
My experience having gone down the route of looking for both TC/SC coding solutions and ABS solutions, is that it's basically impossible - you have to run a completely different system that bypasses the OE system. I have a 997.GT3.mk1 and use to track a complete prepped 2001 Audi Twin Turbo S4 (I was lucky that in my 2001.5 S4 off is fully off) - but on the GT3, once you start running really sticky rubber, the ABS control unit will freak out and go ice-mode - the only solution is to pull the until and install the Motorsport ABS controller - you can then go crazy deep into corners and not worry about the ABS until sending you into a wall. Would appreciate a contact if you find someone that can provably show they have done this. Thanks
Im going to do some digging for sure and see what can be done, The new VW systems can be coded down so theyre not so aggressive...hopefully this is the same at the very least
I’m really enjoying these videos. The traction control on my 2020 Ford Focus automatic is far more aggressive than anything I’ve ever driven. There is a “slight” bend in a road I drive daily and this is the only car where traction control kicks in.
Is this only related to the Supra or also the Z4 M40i since it shares the same platform and all?
I believe G series BMWs are having a similar issue
Sweet little trifecta from the ring with you Robert and Mischa.
Toyota will soon have inflating and deflating airbags system so that if the ABS kicks on the airbags will deploy then go back into the steering wheel when ABS traction turns back off. Its called the Holy Fuck What's Happening System.. or HFWH for short.
Lmao
LOL.
lol
My corolla hatchback does the same shit with the assists. Moving from PS4S's to PSAS4's the traction control assists totally fuck with the steering and feeling of stability into corners.
I'm sad to see that this is carried into a car I would consider as my next potential purchase. I am glad to see that you have found a solution for the bump steer but T/C has got to go or at least
be modified in both platforms. I'm worried now that the new GR Corolla is going to have the same issue.
In your video you mention that the TC randomly turns back on. I recently heard that it can come back if you enter the corner with ABS. ABS would be the cause of that TC turning back on... Any thoughts ?
It comes back on due to tyre pressure monitoring flaging a change in pressure and also because of the ride height change the sensor detects an error
this video should go viral for peoples' safety
Do you have any hopes for the coming GR Supra ? Track ability, etc
Id like to give it a try and see how it compares but i do have some hope lol
The Supra seems so quick and capable, why make it unstable on the track. Seems weird that Toyota would not allow for better track manners. Thanks George and looking forward to the next drive and overview.
Its very quick now the bump steer is almost perfect not M4 level yet tho
@@TwistedSymmetryUK which m4 f82 or g82?
@TwistedSymmetry - good to see another video! Did you have a chance to drive the Giulia btw? Wouldn't the QV make an AWESOME track car?
I would tell you if Alfa gave us one to try lol
Is the Z4 stock as bad as the supra stock? Is it excatly the same?
Not sure i havnt driven it, id asume the same
Good job guys
Aw yes, 60fps Nurburgring squad!
Time to set up the editing rig and run a GR v. GR lap comparison ... a bang for the buck show down. Thanks for the butt dyno ride along!!!
Could be cool on a track day
Please, Good Sir, swear and speak your mind. There's enough "feel good" channels as it is. And if you are a public persona, half the people hate you anyway. Your comment section will fill with fan-boy circlejerk though, given enough time. Do what you love with honesty and you'll find your audience. Godspeed.
Hi George, really like ur vids n speach. Misha and Robert cover all "what to do", maybe u can help us with "where to get" to help us, who are not so deep in the car world.
www.verkline.com/product-category/toyota-gr-supra-a90-a91/ this Verkline set used in the car
Will mention this when i do some walk around vids of the cars :)
Are you sure it’s not just your driving?
+1
Come on then Hamilton get your gloves on....
So how does the bmw fell like?
Borre needs a lapel mic. But from how he was gripping the seat, I think is was either forcing himself not to scream or not to swear. To be honest, when the French swear, it almost sounds like music! LOL
I read that the ride height sensors can cause the TC turning back on
Can't you get rid off the problem in the software?
I hope so
How did they okay this? Surely they would have tested it on a track.
Zis is german RUclips... so feel free to swear when ever you like.
Cheers m8
Yeah, that car needs a quaife diff or similar, solid aluminium bushes on the subframe to the body, and then that car will start to handle a bit.. the diff, will combat alot of DSC/ESP enterfering. But it's to bad that it isnt possible to completely take out the DSC/ESP, even with a long press on the button.
Thanks for the video
Moran is oooooooff!
Hahaha
Does it start without the ABS fuse? :D
If only haha them days are long gone
Strange to see how Toyoya got this car which was so hyped so wrong, and yet knock it out the park with the Yaris. The traction system is just wrong, would be interesting to see how you would stand should something happen as a direct result, pitching off line when a bike is alongside for example doesn't even bare thinking about
Exactly! this happened on other laps where i dont have footage and its put us in an awkward situation
Bad points for it trying to kill you... good points the looks 😍 Let’s hope they can sort that issue!
I’m not surprised you were swearing George, that electronic intervention when pushing on must be unnerving to say the least. Car goes pretty well otherwise.
yes and yes lol
Here before Misha and Robert
(Congrats with 3210 subs geo!)
2 hours in and no dislikes so far! You rockin!!!!
how does this tc esp system behave on a bmw Z4 then? should be the same shouldnt it? there must be a solution. there are so many bmw experts around the ring.
that legit looks terrifying
That is why so many manufacturers test their cars on the Nordschleife. Toyota obviously didn't do that properly.
That's was nice and stressful 🙃
Enlighten video!
Would be interesting to know, If the new Z4 hast the same issue......
Hope you find a solution for this.....
Nice driving style 👍👍
Polestar tries to suffocate Misha and the Supra tries to put George into the marshal post
When that kicks in it does it in such a way that if your not awake it will take your head off, how the hell did that get past as being safe.
Hope you remembered the rear wheel balance mate 👍
All 4 ;)
Huh... I didn’t see this issue tho. I had track day and canyon runs very often.
One of the very few lucky ones i think lol
@@TwistedSymmetryUK Did you check the tire setup and the EDC sensor yet?
Holy crap, seeing the car twitch about like that, especially at speed, is... not confidence inspiring.
Yep assists coming on automatically is a joke.
Scary AF
Sounds like Toyota just stuck the same traction control system in that they use in the Camry. You really shouldn't have to be dealing with re-flashing to fix issues like this in something which is being sold as a sports car. Even my cheap little Fiesta turns all the systems off when i tell it to.
I guess it has nothing to do with the Camry as it's a BMW TCS system (maybe retuned by Toyota). ;-)
Hi Borre!
7:46 BRUH
You clearly don’t have the systems turned off. Your driver assistance systems are beeping away as you approach vehicles. Push it down and hold it. Also push down on TC and hold it, your stability control is still on. Myself and numerous people track this vehicle with zero issues. User error on your part.
I know how to operate the car the lap started with systems off. Theres common issues with level sensors and TPMS causing traction control systems to come back on in certain conditions. But thanks for your concern
I though it was set up by the Masters of the Nürburgring?? Or better leave it to BMW?
Setup as in Geometry or setup as in factory assist systems?
@@TwistedSymmetryUK as I heard Toyota did both a tinkering to the geometry and certainly the assists.
First
No George is first
That square front plate is doing the car no favours.
I agree, Thats on the new owner tho lol
That's just stupid, market a sports car and then have it make itself worse by overdoing the traction control.... Or did Toyota know about the bump steer and instead of taking the expensive route of re-engineering the suspension properly they just took the cheap way out of dialling up the traction control? ..... Bit like Boeing did with MCAS on the 737 max.
Could very well be the case
Lmao this is worse than on the Up. My TC only tries to kill me once a lap.
Haha
Its as if two companies married, one speaking German and the other Japanese. An unholy alliance to be sure.
I blame BMW...Toyotas other track focused cars dont have this bullshit
don't know what the fuck u are doing with ur supra, but i NEVER had the tsc comming back up, and i trash this fucking car every day, it's a 2019 on mhd tune, the only way i got the tsc back on, is when i turn it off and tire pressure is to low, it will come back up ONE TIME after i drive faster like 20kph, then i can turn if off and it will NEVER turn back on bay itself EVER, if tire pressure a good this will NEVER happen, had mutiple track day on this car, never happen, and the car is lowered as well
Supra’s are overrated junk.
In factory form yes, once you fix some issues and appearances its actually fairly good. I hated this when we got it but its growing on me now
@@TwistedSymmetryUK why is junk from factory. I find the steering way too light and lacks feel