5 Ways to Deal with Katana Binds (But Why You Shouldn't Do it)
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- Опубликовано: 11 сен 2023
- Some people in the comments have insisted that you would often come to a Tsubazeriai (binding) situation with the opponent in a real-life situation. But then, is there no way to fight back from this situation? Of course not.
So today, Seki sensei, the 22nd headmaster of Kobudo Asayama Ichiden Ryu with 400 years of history, will explain to us 5 ways of how to win from a Tsubazeriai situation. If you are a Kendo practitioner, you may be familiar with Tsubazeriai. However, how you deal with it is completely different in the world of Kenjutsu. I’m sure you’ll learn shocking new techniques, so please watch this video to the end.
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The last part was very interesting knowing how the Sakuradamon Incident in the 1860 went down. Swordsmen on the both side, trained in the delicate distance game actually ended up fighting mainly with binds at tsubamoto. After the fight, a lot of fingers, noses and ears were left rolling on the floor. Truly an important page in history of swordsmanship.
Each era has its special situation.
That’s disturbing to imagine
@@anas-432 even more when you realize they just had to keep fighting. no medics back then
Fencing from the bind was one of the very first things I was taught when I started with Lichtenauer (German Longsword). I've watched a fair amount of videos on this channel now and was often surprised by the many similiarities between the Katana and Longsword, but this episode was quite interesting as it showed something truly different from what I'm used to, and I really enjoyed it! I suspect the lack of a large crossguard is a significant factor in how the bind is approached.
I personally think context is more important. Three scenarios: battlefield, judicial duel, civilian life.
Of course on the battlefield you have armor and so you bring polearms that transfer force and probably a short blade to finish off someone who's been downed.
Judicial duel: you have armor, but you have to use a sword. Cutting from afar is largely ineffective, so you have to get close and end up in a lot of binds. Winning the bind becomes extremely important.
Civilian life: no armor, carrying a sword that is sized for daily carry (Too long and you're banging it all over the place and can't draw quickly in case of an attacker, too big of a guard and it's likely to get caught on things). Here's where the bind is at its least attractive. Even if you decide to go for a basket hilt and it protected your fingers, you're likely going to lose an ear and have other light cuts all over you by the time you're done. Why take that risk when you can cut and poke at your unarmored opponent from farther away?
I was just about to comment this - Meyerist here, and the bind is just as important in the later German systems as well!
@@flamezombie1Hello fellow vulgar fencer! there were several times in the video where I was thinking that with a longsword, you'd just snap in a Zwerch or a short edge cut to the crown.
@@Ruizg559 The presence of the short edge is probably the single biggest reason for the differences between longsword and katana fencing. It’s easy to overlook just how much it changes the technique and approach.
Tbh as someone who is a Fiore fun I was pleasantly surprised that in the end it does come to wrestling here too
I've learned some swordwork through my Aikido, so I've never minded going to the bind. It comes up in some kata too, but the phrase 'There were fingers everywhere' will make me seriously reconsider how safe I thought it was lol.
Remember and understand that although the hand is more exposed than users of basket hilt, the sword guard does not even increase in size. And people are not wearing gauntlets or metallic gloves for increase of protection.
The problem with kendo is that you mainly focus on the far end of the blade, while the katana is quite obviously by design a cutting oriented weapon from the tip to the tsuba. The way they practice the sport doesn't take into account many techniques you would see in a real duel or battlefield situation.
Its not meant to, it's a sport
Master Seki is a treasure of knowledge 😮 We always learn something new when we watch him 👍 Thank you so much Master Seki and Tsukada Sensei, Kurosawa Sensei (camera guy Sensei) and Shogo San for bringing him to the world 🙏 Take care. Stay safe 🙏
John and Kate
As a kendoka (1. dan) I had a sparring session with a kenjutsu practitioner earlier this year.
While I overall did manage to win most exchanges, the top way in which he managed to get me, was that first technique of just cutting at the neck in tsubazeriai.
I even knew ahead of time, that going into tsubazeriai against a kenjutsu practitioner is bad idea, but if he managed to block my initial attack, I'd very often end up there.
And under the new rules in kendo, tsubazeriai is time limited, so practitioners shouldn't stay in that position for more than about 3 seconds. So I was used to getting out of it quickly. But should be noted, not nearly fast enough. That technique is pretty much instant as soon as you're in range.
Honestly, I suspect that tendency kendo has to end in tsubazeriai and not account for an immediate cut for the neck, is probably its single biggest weakness as a sword martial art.
I think it's biggest weakness is how it seems there is a complete disregard for after-blows, but it's probably close.
@@Wishuponapancake There isn't really a "complete disregard for after-blows", as there is a requirement for demonstrating "zanshin" or continued awareness after a strike, in order for the strike to even be counted as valid.
It's why we usually proceed to run past the opponents after striking. If done right, it does a pretty good job of getting you out of opponent's range.
That said, it often isn't done right, for the simple reason that doing it properly is quite tiresome and that makes it really difficult to keep doing it over and over.
At higher levels, or among older practitioners, it's often even accepted if one just indicates starting that move past to just sort of show that he knows he should run past in actual combat (continues to be aware), but without the full requirement to entirelly follow through.
Still, I think most of us know how to do it right if necessary.
From that sparring session I mentioned, I tended to use that running past quite a bit, and it seemed to work pretty well.
Also, any strike that isn't the type to instantly incapacitate is unlikely to get counted as a point anyway.
The situation where I think there is some sort of disregard for after blows is where two opponents hit each other almost simultaneously, but one is a fraction of a second faster and thus gets the point. But those are somewhat less common.
Oh, and there's another way of showing that zanshin thing, which is immediately moving into tsubazerai. Which works to prevents afterstrikes pretty well in kendo, but against a kenjutsu practitioner gets you instantly cut across the neck.
Did hitting him with tai atari and taking his sword work?
@@Wishuponapancake "After-blow" ippons exist. I myself have lost often in competition by receiving an after-blow after hitting first: I hit debana-kote (or what I thought was debana-kote at the time) first, but received a men immediately after, which scored.
(Btw. when debana-kote is done with the correct timing, one will not receive an after-blow in that manner..)
So there is no *complete* disregard for after-blows, although it's valued and taken into account differently than in, say, HEMA.
Because you can't know for sure if the hit you made is deemed an ippon by the shinpan (before looking at them, which is risky if it wasn't an ippon), it is intelligent to not get hit in any case in competition, which is ideally also a part of how you do zanshin.
I think this lesson conveys the importance of preparing to deal with unfavorable situations. Even though blade binding at such close distance is optimally avoided, if there is a likelihood that it will occur between resisting opponents then it is logical to adress it in training.
斬り合いの恐ろしさが良く分かります。
剣道経験者ですが、目から鱗の動画でした。
とても勉強になりました、ありがとうございました。
Having mostly done Kendo (and a bit of Iai) it's interesting to see hiki-kote being performed this way. I've been taught of the neck push but as something to avoid in keiko. Hands and tuska getting tangled up in tsubazeriai would be something to be avoided and sorted out, but it is very interesting to see techniques that uses them in clever ways. That said, I am (and I think most people are) happy with the recent rule change that discourages fighting from tsubazeriai.
But the rules change does not discourages fighting from tsubazeriai. It is discouraging wasting time in tsubazeriai.
@04:05
>timing
>"“There is timing in everything. Timing in strategy cannot be mastered without a great deal of practice.”
― Miyamoto Musashi
As always, Seki先生 demonstrating that he's a master.
I love that Seki Sensei is a master of this Martial Art and yet demonstrating different techniques still brings a smile to his face. What a great teacher!
Seki sensei! You are amazing!
Thank you for these techniques! It's not often I see so many concepts that are new to me.
Ah yes. The old Bind training. Always loved teaching my students these in my younger years. They never see em coming but always enjoy the experience of learning. Thanks again for the amazing Lesson!
Jeez, Seki-sensei is a close-quarters combat monster😮
I want to learn and practice everything I've seen him do.
These are very interesting techniques! In principle, I also learned it in European sword fighting with the long sword. Don't stay in the binding, but release your sword and counterattack.
This channel is my favorite on youtube by far! Thank you so much for sharing this knowledge.
I would like to give a shout out to the gentleman who keeps playing Seki Sensei's punching bag in your videos. Definite props to him for being willing to always be the fall guy. 😁❤
I think it would be interesting to see his thoughts on practical ways to use your environment. Like using a wall to protect your back when facing multiple opponents or how to use obstacles to your advantage
Can't remember if Seki-Sensei's training partner was introduced, and if he was I'm embarassed to not remember his name. Huge credit to him though, almost everytime he ends up on his back he remembers to cross his ankle at the knee.
His name is Tsukada Sensei, he is in the top rank under Seki Sensei, a Shihandai (sub-instructor)!
That was very interesting to see. Great video
Wow, thank you for this video. It is very informative.
German 16thC. longsword fencing is heavily focused on the bind. Interesting to see the Japanese counterpart to that!
Great video! Thanks!
Fascinating to watch this and compare it to HEMA. Looking at the parallels described in fiore/Liechtenauer.
Thank you for teaching. 🙏 Great Video’s 👍
great great video. thx for all the effort
The take away is to avoid the bind... What I'll remember the most from this video... fingers everywhere!
I really like these techniques, Seki-sho moves so fluidly with the techniques thank for sharing this now more techniques to follow but the best technique is never get in that position to begin with.
One thing they teach us in HEMA is to never bind that close to the hilt. It’s actually very bad fencing because your weapon is no longer useful at that range and you will be forced into using techniques like grappling, which are not optimal.
I heard that from a different friend who trains HEMA too! The differences are really interesting…
@@letsasksekisensei It’s always cool to see how other styles use similar concepts. Seki-sensei makes it very clear in this video that a close bind is very dangerous, and uses similar principles, but the actual techniques are so different.
Binds are an essential part when training longsword, but that's why longswords have cross guards. Maybe you could make binds way more safer with bigger and wider tsuba.
Either way binds that get that close in unarmored encounters are quite risky and unnecessary; you would usually want to close the distance and halfsword your way into a gap when there's armor involved, but not when you can finish the fight at a safe distance and quickly move out of the way, so in the context of Edo Jidai Japan binds are indeed a dangerous gamble to make.
Gauntlets would be an easy solution, and they work pretty well in HEMA too.
i think in older times the stuba we’re much bigger
@@TONEDEAFSOUNDin some instances, yes. Problem is most of these techniques and other dueling schools focus on the short edo jidai katana that your average Samurai would carry in his daily life.
O-katanas, Nodachis and Nagamakis were used in the battlefield.
@Wanderer2769 that’s one of the coolest aspects of katana is how the blade can keep going with new fittings
Thank you for giving a presentation on this.
From the explanation, I now understand and agree that tsuba-zuriai is dangerous for both sides and therefore should be avoided.
However I still have some confusion as to how someone should approach the other sword when the very tips of the swords connect, so as to have a dominant or safer position. Could you please also tell me if there is anything to consider to be safer/more dominant starting from the neutral first contact at the tip of the sword?
This video is awesome as always shogo, thank you very much. I have a question, can you ask Seki Sensei; What are the connections between aikido and kenjutsu. Because lots of sword techniques are looks like armed aikido techniques. I want to learn from Seki Sensei. And you are doing great videos Shogo Thank you for everything.
Thank you.
thank you
I love the song used in the intro, is there a full version of it?
Geeez, that warning at the end was sobering. I think a lot of us forget these lessons from the past, or think ourselves immune to them because we now have X, Y and Z. There are so many lessons from the more ancient martial arts that we would REALLY never want to learn for ourselves.
The grab reminds me of one of Fiore's disarms in the Armizare.
I wish I could learn from him.
Would love to see you guys react to some Medieval MMA clips. Could be interesting to get your perspective on european style weapons combat.
Words of wisdom from this video:
__
You should do your best to avoid it (Katana Binds) because you wouldn’t be able to win cleanly.
In the Bakmutsa era when there were a lot of fights with katana, it is said there were fingers everywhere. Your fingers will easily come off
__
😲😬
"Wear chainmail gloves", got it
Very nice use of uke's energy. Just a question about the kote. Have you tried ice hockey goalie gloves? We use them in Aiki weapons training. So when it comes time to attack the hand or wrist, you get a lot more padding than you would from your standard kendo kote.
I'm curious to know more about the fukuroshinai shown here 🙂 It looks like a Yagyu Shinkage Ryu fukuroshinai, but I haven't seen one with a tsuba before. Is this a regular kendo shinai tsuba/tsubadome? And the reason for the Kote with fukuroshinai? Perhaps because the tsuba could do some damage to the fingers during keiko?
Hello shogo, hello seki sensei, can you make a video showing how to tie the belt around your waist and how to tie the saya around your waist too? I never found a tutorial that really helps, thanks, bye
We have pretty similar moves when binding with europian swords while using the guards as well, but I guess it is only natural for similarity to exists when it works.
Where do you get those nice shinai?
It is said that the lack of resources can encourage creative thinking. Without a crossguard to protect your hands, you have to find other ways to make it out in one piece.
Could you try to knee someone in the groin or knock their feet out from under them with a low kick in that situation?
How many of these techniques would this applied to tsuba-zerai
wowie!
Whats the intro music
Can seki Sensei weild a double bladed end kantana
I find this quite interesting considering a lot of European swordmanship emphasises the bind, though I guess the presence of having 2 edges on their straight bladed sword instead of only 1 edge like on a katana with a curved blade, meaning causing damage is as simple as using the other side of the blade to cut their head, which would just end result with hitting the opponent with the katana's spine, or just stabbing them which is easier with a European longsword than a katana.
This probably means that trying to cause damage in a bind with a katana would mean having to maneuver it more which is much riskier than just stabbing them or cutting with the other side like with longsword.
I've got to try this out one day.
BTW: Sabres due to their curvature have different techniques in binds and langmesser due to their short length and long handle. Both are predominantly single edged too!
Bind means something different in fencing terms which is based on "European swordmanship" you mentioned. Bind is one of the blade transfers with the goal of moving the opponent's blade to a place you can attack. It's not meant to statically lock the blade but rather to find the balancing point and control the opponent's blade. European swords (especially if you get to the epee duelling), have significantly more hand protection compared to katanas, which needs to be taken into consideration. Even the cross guards from the long sword are significantly better in hand protection compared to Tsuba.
@@hiddenbunny7205 I wouldn't say that crossguards are much better than a tsuba. Messer had a Nagel or sidering because the hand got injured too often. Later, the crossguard became a D-guard and multiple bars appeared to further protect the hand...
@@hiddenbunny7205 don't forget that tsuba used to be much wider in diameter when katana were actually used, they were made smaller when katana became more of a display item iirc
also, there's nothing stopping anyone from just using a bigger tsuba
👍
For those of us just beginning...and are older (Late 60's) Can you teach us the Sword Naming Ritual? I assume it is not like naming a dog or so. My wife and I have our swords coming so we want to honor the tradition of naming our swords.
Didn't Musashi also remind people you can always punch them in the face if you get close enough? 🙂
Joint locks with sword?
does this ryuha also use atemi in CQC?
No, we don’t have any Atemi!
I often wonder how swordsmen got to a level like Seki-sensei in the old days when the only way to really experience all these nuances was in actual swordfights where every little mistake meant death (judging from those cuts sensei did in this video)?
That's why having masters who survived those fights was hugely important, who learned from other masters who survived fights and so on and so forth.
@@Nala15-Artist yeah but how did they become masters then? I mean you’d have to survive a lot of fights to become a master…
@@TheCptStriker well, first they did train with wooden swords, or sticks for sparing
@@stefthorman8548 I know. I’m left wondering how realistic these katas are in depicting real life fights? I mean it often looks like the opponent is willingly going down and going along with the moves of the master instead of actually putting up a fight. Or is this just because it’s a kata to show certain techniques and not a free form sparring fight?
@@TheCptStriker Generally a kata is used to practice the movements and commit them to muscle memory. Once they are in your muscle memory, you use actual spars to work out the specifics of when to use them 'live', so to speak. A kata is a stepping stone to learning a technique, but not the end of the technique. Most martial arts and kung fu styles have 'forms' or 'drills' that fulfil the same purpose. Until you've worked out how to do it live during a spar, you haven't actually finished learning the technique.
In older days, samurai and other warriors also trained on condemned criminals to learn how their weapons interacted with the body, which is a crucial measure of practice most modern styles just don't contain anymore (and it wouldn't be ethical to anyway). So from that angle, the old masters had a better understanding of how their weapon would react when hitting the correct target, too.
Kind of funny that it's not ideal for katana to bind. In european swordsmanship binding is a big part of fighting. Maybe it's just the way the guards work
Please, tell me how...
If you cut my neck, how is my dodge?
What I am going to ask might sound ridiculous, but I wonder, are there "sword magic" in Japanese culture? I mean, magic related to sword or swordmanship. In my culture, there are keris magic, believe it or not, it is still widely believed today. Usually there are spirits, evil or good, reside in the keris to make it magical. The magic include flying keris, "self aware" keris, invulnerability to wielder, protection against evil spirits/magic, healing, weather/climate changing, ect...in short, keris in my culture not only a dagger/sword but also a conduit for magical abilities.
There is definitely a kind of 'sword magic' in Japan. Japanese myth has a long history of magic-imbued items. From a simple umbrella coming to life after existing for a hundred years all the way up to Japans 3 sacred treasures (of which one is a sword). Japanese swords are also often enshrined as holy objects at Shrines as well. You also get TONS of stories of cursed blades that bring their owners misfortune, or kill anything indiscriminately... like the famous tales of the cursed Muramasa blades.
@@Krescentwolf I am watching some movies and animes, of course they all might be just imaginations and exaggerations, but I wonder if it based on some truth. if it does, there must be some sword magic practitioners today in Japan as there are a lot of keris magic practitioners in my country (and neighborng countries). Magic is a part of our lives no matter how we're trying to deny it.
@@MizanQistina The big difference between Japanese myths and alot of other cultures is that Japan's focus is on the objects.
In Japanese myth its the sword itself that has magic, not necessarily the person using it.
So there wouldn't be many 'practitioners.' But tons of stories about famous swords instead.
There's a concept of Tsukumogami in Japanese folklore. It's a type of yokai that is basically a household item that turned into some sort of good or evil spirit and became self-aware to a degree. Unsurprisingly, with massive symbolism that swords carry throughout the history - sword Tsukumogami were quite numerous.
Japanese longsword practitioners: Avoid entering a bind!
English longsword practitioners: Avoid entering a bind!
German longsword practitioners: Avoid entering a bind!
Italian longsword practitioners: (͡ ° ͜ʖ ͡ °)
:)
He is realy skilled. Bravo!
I’m always astonished at the level of sophistication there is in Japanese swordsmanship. While the rest of the world sought perfection in technological developments. The Samurai sought perfect in the art of swordsmanship. It’s a very different mentality when you essentially have the same basic sword design for almost a millennia.
3:15: ooOOooOoooH
3:18 also ooOOooOoooH
Young elder Master teach good lessons 👏