Hurting Your Players but Making it Fun || D&D w/ Dael Kingsmill
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- Опубликовано: 31 июл 2024
- Welcome to MonarchsFactory! On this channel you can find videos covering D&D, mythology, games, ridiculous fun with friends; all kinds of stuff. Today's video is on making medicine checks relevant and giving your players dramatic injuries and battle scars.
Timestamps:
00:00 - Design goals
02:48 - System overview
05:07 - Anatomy of an injury table
08:32 - Examples and injury table details
25:14 - Additional information and links
Here's that link I mentioned:
Major Injury Tables - monarchsfactory.wordpress.com...
Combat Wheelchair - drive.google.com/drive/mobile...
Programming for Beginners - • Computer programming f...
Dusk w/ MCDM and Friends - • Dusk
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If you'd like to support my work and become part of the Patron Pantheon, you can check out my Patreon page here: / daelkingsmill
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Twitter: @DailyDael
Instagram: @daeldaily
Reddit: / monarchsfactory
Discord: / discord
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Music is from www.bensound.com 
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In a past game, every time a character went unconscious, they would get a scar of related relevance. Players loved the consequence!
It depends on the players. I used an injury table once, with temporary scars and injuries. My players hated it.
1st Dm i had had one lasting consequence - making a new character...
This is, I think, one of the better ways to incorporate semi-permanent injuries/maladies from combat. Go down to zero and suffer some kind of penalty until you can rest, perhaps magic can aid you for a time but you really need a LR or an expert healing caster. Going to 0hp in 5e can feel a bit like a nothing burger otherwise and it just adds a few extra stakes to it.
This really depends, in some games players go unconscious every second encounter, it should definitely happen when it is dramatic. My artificer once lost her eye after getting critted with a imps stinger and dropped down a staircase. it was also the second time she went down that day. Ended up with a badass magic Eye laser
@@Neazriel this is a great point. My style is a bit forgiving in that regard so knockdowns are not a common occurrence. Another GM who is less kind might see several per session as you say.
These videos are such ridiculously high quality. Every time a watch one of your D&D videos I'm instantly inspired to do prep. (not that the other ones aren't enjoyable) The fact that you gave us copies of the tables AS WELL as the idea itself for 0 cost... what the heck? Are you insane? Love this channel, thanks so much!
I can say from experience with frostbite, rewarming too fast can actually cause more nerve damage... Sincerely, someone who cant feel their toes much anymore.
Btw I really like this because my main problem with most lingering injury rules are that A) they aren't fun, and B) they occur too often to feel earned or exciting. This feels like a good middle ground like it's a penalty but it shouldn't happen so often that it becomes just annoying. AND it gives players the choice if they want to explore having some permanent injuries rather than just flat out subjecting them to it.
If you like this, wait until you get a load of Star Citizen...
Howdy there Mr. Colville
Star Citizen looks dope as hell but like it would cause my current PC to drop dead on the spot
@@MonarchsFactory Well by the time it's not a bug infested nightmare, it'll be better optimized and run on...well...uh
Anyway, they're about to drop the first draft of their new Actor Status system. Actor includes all PCs and NPCs.
And it's...it's CRAZY. The only way I can pitch it quickly is; imagine if you were playing WoW and your character was alone, in the middle of nowhere, and you fell off a big rock and could break your leg.
You're not dead, but you can't move. You're incapacitated...and alone.
And the game says "Would you like to create a global quest to call for rescue?" And if you do, everyone on the server now sees your SOS in the quest log.
And that's just one tiny part of it.
ruclips.net/video/UQnLAy4D-yo/видео.html
Would be the perfect occasion to get a new PC... I see this as an absolute win!
You mean that big scam game that will never come out?
Ancient Wiseman: What is your spirit animal?
Me: *Looks over at no frills in dressing gown editor Dael*
Ancient Wiseman: Well?
Me: You know the usual. Like ... a Panda?
Ancient Wiseman: ...
Rather than impose a minimum level, I would require it to be a minimum amount of damage, say 10hp. Squishy characters will be protected longer and the tanks will be collecting battle scars earlier.
Not a bad idea at all! I really like that
We just started playing, my lvl 1 cleric's player is a nurse and this is going to blow him away. Thank you very much for putting this out.
Someone else pointed out that I forgot to mention - probably only institute this at 3rd level and beyond, simply because of how few hit points players have at L1. Happy gaming! :)
@@MonarchsFactory Oh no, no no no, he's in a serious survival situation trying to make it off the island with a small group of peasants. It's a solo game at the moment so if he goes down and his DM rules that his commoner minions can still win, then he's going to have to do some self-surgery when he recovers from those death saving throws. Oh yes. Yes yes yes.
@@mostlychimp5715 That sounds hardcore
After additional thought, maybe I'll make it "1/2 max hp or 10, whichever's more." Maybe 9, round numbers get too much fanfare.
"Finally the toxicity table"
Oh no not a comment section table!!!
NOOOOO
This table needs a safe word.
Seriously, though, the complications of magical healing are really a neat addition and visualization of that D&D trope. It grants so much re: why one doesn't just Cure Wounds out of every problem.
Your old injuries table was the best of its kind, and I've been using it ever since you posted it. I cannot express how excited I am that you have expanded it.
This is some inspired stuff, I love it.
Also I can definitely imagine a whole cosmetic industry built around inflicting mana rush and healing it with magic.
The house rule in my games about a natural 1 is that something goes hilariously wrong. It takes some of the sting out of an automatic fail and encourages creativity.
Leaving a comment to satisfy Al Gore Rhythm. But seriously, I love the stuff you make! Glad to see another great video!
I was missing your vids on my feed!!!
And I really like this table.
They don't feet the general pace of the story, but are a match made in heaven for my 2/3 stages boss fights.
I am here for the random, off hand Benedict quote from Much Ado About Nothing. Favorite Shakespeare play.
Glad someone out there appreciated it XD
Hear me out, in my groups homebrew headcanon magical healing doesn't scar while letting an injury heal naturally does. This leads to a sort of visual indication of poverty and access to healing among PCs and NPCs. If someone has scars that becomes significantly more offputting to polite society but makes them blend in with unsavory types like a thieves guild or pirates. It can also be a marker of someone atheistic whose barbarian tribe rejects magical healing.
Unrelated to the above, in settings where magical healing accelerates the natural healing process it might be interesting to keep in mind that telomeres shorten every time cells divide, shortening overall lifespan. Not that adventurers live very long anyway, but it could be interesting to incorporate into the lore of your world.
As a computer scientist, I'm very excited to hear you're learning programming. Also didn't realize you were in that Colville 4e game. Got lots of videos to check out now
This video came out at a perfect time for me. I've been kicking around the idea of a Wound System in order to making healing conscious characters more meaningful/important, and an Injury System like this is another thing I've been looking for! Can't wait to get to use it in my own games.
Yes, she’s back!!!LoL
Dael, I don't know if you'll ever see this, but your S.P.E.R.M. acronym is saving my ass in my Slavic history class, which coincidentally, I was in when this new video dropped.
Shout out to Mr. Kinloch my high school history teacher for saving all our butts!
@@MonarchsFactory Thank you, Mr. Kinloch!
Game I played in: The wizard ritually connected a skeletal arm after having his natural one amputated due to a magical affliction.
Thanks for another great and fun video. It always warms my heart to hear about people learning not only to program but also game programming.
I would like to verify that I do change my avatar and name every month based on a discord poll. Why? Because it was a funny bit that got out of hand and I'm stubborn
I can't stop imagining your bear icon saying this
Okay, yes, this is an injury system that I like. Mostly because while the effects do matter, it is (for most of them) relatively easy to get rid of them at any level - though you might have to make it back to the nearest town if you don't have a field medic on the team.
The results for 14 are interesting because they are actually a 3-round buff, but the 3 levels of exhaustion afterwards are rough because it takes 3 long rests to get rid of it - unless someone knows Greater Restoration and spends the 5th level slot plus 100GP diamond dust to reduce it by 1.
That's actually a good point you bring up - kind of a side effect that I would love to come from the injuries is for a party to be encouraged to slow down for a few in-game days to recuperate! While the injured member is resting up and healing get into some role play and down time and introspection. However, it is interesting that this is more likely with a better injury save result than with a really bad one... Might have to consider some wording and see if I can reshuffle things to encourage that more generally.
This is really interesting--I'm honestly really reminded of the injury system in the old GW game Inquisitor, a sort of weird...TTRPG/wargame hybrid that I love very much. Injury thresholds and location-specific consequences and stuff very much in line with this.
I was just thinking about how much I missed Dael's vids last night!
I would love to see a video on how you would make curses feel fun. Like raid a pharaohs tomb, punishment for your greed curse. Or glancing at the necronomicon and learning just too much.
Aaahhhh! Another Dael video! So long between each video but always worth the wait ☺️
I am in love with these kinds of consequences! A little worried that a roll on one of these tables would be done in just about every fight, at least in the beginning, but if this was held up against the enemies as well, if could potentially make fights much more theatrical and dramatic, and possibly much shorter!
A single good shot from the rogue or a critical from the barbarian against the target, be they man or monster, could potentially severely cripple the enemy within 3 turns!
I also recommend only implementing this after about level 3, or someone else suggested that it could come into effect for each character as they pass 20hp to give the squishy classes more breathing room
AAAAAH!! I was just wondering when you would be able to upload another video! Perfect timing! Thanks for all the content you make!
Hurrah! a new Monarch Mentor video. Always happy to see a new Dael in my feed 👍
Implying that I’m a horse that just found a crown in my hay 🤨
So happy to see a new video from you! I also really like the tables and the idea, even though I would say that if the rolls (the ones you do every turn) are meant to represent you resisting the pain maybe it should be wisdom and in the case where it's like maintaing balance for the inner ear injury it might be dexterity and so on.
Yooo this is awesome. You really actually made it fun and this is the first time I’ve actually felt compelled to add injury mechanics.
This is lovely, this makes different types of damage feel real. Glad you made it, all tho, my players won't be so glad >:)
You're so generous to have looked up these injuries already, but like, are they really that bad? Let's see--OOHH GOODDDD!!!!
Last night I wanted to just confirm how quickly viper myotoxins necrotise muscle. I have learned to feel nothing.
@@MonarchsFactory Your accumulated knowledge resume is gonna look like an encyclopedia of terror. Nice.
[insert Australian wildlife joke]
Wicked. Always glad to see more content from you.
You're almost at 100k subs! That's so cool! Hope you get there soon!
Thank you for posting more DnD content, i really enjoy your videos.
I'm DMing my first game with some players who've only played roll playing focused games so I'm so excited to introduce them to some cool battles.
Needless to say, I've been glued to Dael's videos haha
Thank you for the requisite dose of Missy Higgins, your service is appreciated
She's in focus! I didn't think that I'd see this day!
Neither did I, not even sure I can recreate it, lol
Very good video. This system is madness, I like it 10/10
Of course, Dael uploads when I don't have time to watch anything! :)
I'm now cooking my next campaign with very gritty feel and emphasis on long term consequences (and with magic healing that changes body in way that limits natural healing) and this is godsend.
When I saw your Edditing Mode then must say: You look amazing!
I will defenitly use your tables in my D&D campain on my players. Thx 😁
Thank you so much for this! I loved the concept for your first one but being a new DM I wasn't sure I'd be able to adapt it to the situation well enough in the moment. This will definitely help me.
Also your Materia Media system is also amazing! I would love to see how you would adapt it to also handle general magical potion brewing (or even if that's something you would do) in addition to medicines and poisons.
I love watching the openings to your videos LOL
Yay for Missy Higgins, I love her music.
We've missed your face 😁
as someone running a grave domain cleric whose entire background revolves around coming to worship the raven queen through his time spent as a field medic/combat surgeon: thank you
I just started my new campaign, this is perfect!
(I forgot to mention not to implement this til level 3 so your players don't all immediately become grizzled eyepatch wearers)
Great Much Ado reference, rarefied air
I would love to see how you keep up with all this, a look behind the screen as it were. As a new DM I feel like this, among all the other tables I juggle, is a huge undertaking.
I thought for a moment there'd be no post-outro bit! Fool that I am.
I listened to the 'Mud & Blood podcast' review a game just yesterday (it was largely negative) and these injury tables look better than ones written for a deliberately dark & gritty game! Good research pays off. 😎
I think I'm ready to be a doctor now
This is brilliant work😀 gj
First, I applaud the investigations you did to develop these tables (rather than just making stuff up)! Kudos!
Second, you mention repeatedly in the tables and the RUclips video that magical healing sets these effects permanently, but non-magical healing (i.e. Medicine checks) … wait, nope, no rules for how that applies?
My sorcerer (42 hp) took a 28 pt burn wound from a dragon (actually happened in a recent game). For the sake of argument, I rolled a “2”, +5 on the CON save (14 CON + proficiency), which gives me a 7: third-degree burns to the chest, half-movement, and I’m passing out in 3 rounds. (curiously, no impairment to my attacks, like with result “8-10”)
The dwarven cleric rushes to my side; be has a bevy of magical cures available, but he happens to also be trained in Medicine, and has the Healer feat. The player pauses, looking for rules about “should I use Cure Wounds L3? roll a Medicine check? use the Healer feat?” What should he do? Your proposal seems incomplete here…
Cool idea + didn't know you were editing the 4e streams down, time to watch em
This is excellent.
finally, a new use for Divination Wizard's Portent
Capital-N Nice ideas. Especially with the last point: how you can deal with major, lasting injuries in a fantasy game. (Heboric Ghost-Hands ... well, probably doesn't like this either). I think I'll use an adapted version of this where every damage type runs the risk of losing a limb.
Stay safe, Ms. Kingsmill!
Great video! I’d like to work this into the campaigns I run, though I might rule that it only comes into play once the party hits level 3, otherwise I foresee a lot of poor, maimed first and second level adventurers.
Actually, good point! That was a part of my original version which I totally forgot this time around
You are amazing and you have great ideas!
In my games, HP is just a Stamina Bar - which is why you can just drink something and suddenly be full of energy again.
Scars can only come from the fatal wound that brought you Unconscious (and dmg dealt while Unconscious).
If a character is brought back from Death somehow during a battle I give them 1 lvl of Exhaustion.
& If I critical against my players and they are reduced to 0, they lose a limb.
"Scars are what make a Character," that's what I always say!
I always liked your foraging and medicine system. Now with this I will finally get to use it without devaluing the magical potions. Just going to change some of the effects to heal specific types of wounds. (Which means I am going to have to edit the table... This will be bothersome...)
Yooooooooo new Dael video nice
Yay! Dael's back!!
🥳🎉🥳
Great ideas. I’m totally stealing them!
This is great, I think I'll playtest it with my group to get a feel for it and try to showcase it to my players so that we can maybe implement it on our games. Most important thing is to know if our players are into a rules change, not just how good we feel the rule is. I was maybe thinking to tweak a tiny little something, maybe anyone reading this will be kind enough to tell me what they think:
I really like Dael's idea that a Natural 1 in the damage saving throw should be considered a critical failure and thus ignore any modifier and send you directly to the 1 in the corresponding table, but rules as Written Natural 1's and 20's are only considered Critical in the case of attack rolls, not ability checks nor saving throws. {That's generally why a natural 20 persuasion check is not automatically going to convince a King to gift you their kingdom and a Natural 1 Perception check does not make a character unable to see an enemy directly in front of them in broad daylight (though i don't see the point in rolling checks to resolve actions that should always succeed or always fail)}.
There aren't ground rules for critical failures nor successes built into mechanics that make you roll a saving throw in 5e. Rolling a Natural 20 to escape a Fireball still means you have to add your bonuses (or penalties) to try to make the caster's DC and you will still take half damage if you pass your saving throw. Rolling a Natural 1 to escape said Fireball does not automatically make you take double damage or force any other bad thing to happen. We could certainly try to improvise good and bad things happening with critical fails and successes (a crit fail on a dex save against a fireball could mean that the character trips trying to rush for cover, falling prone on top of taking the damage), but we'd have to be on our toes to improvise on less obvious situations and a certain degree of consistency is needed in the rules adjudication, if you start making random calls whenever you can think of something fast enough but when you can't you simply keep going with the combat then you are making your players experience much less predictable, and that usually makes players less happy with the game. And it would certainly be a lot of pain and bookkeeping to come up with set situations for crit fails and successes for each spell and effect beforehand, and probably not worth it.
Moreover, I have been a 5th edition DM for a while now and of all the PC's i've been DM for I've seen maybe two that had 0 or less in their constitution save modifier, meaning that that if you allow a player who rolls a Natural 1 to add their bonuses it's most likely that you'll never get to see the effects of the worst option in each table, making psychic damage even more terrifying (trust me, PC's with 11 or less Intelligence are quite more likely to exist).
The crux of the matter for me is that I want to use these rules and make rolling a Natural 1 mean that you get a 1 TOTAL, but I feel bad asking players to make a roll that can critically fail but can't critically succeed, I feel a certain degree of fairness is lost there. So, what do any of you think could be a fun way to add a critical success effect to the situations described in this video?
Ah, you mean hurting the player CHARACTERS. I'll watch anyway, hahaha!
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Okay, this is an amazing concept!
It's 4:30am Dael!!
Also video looks great and I agree!
Oops. A tad late this time. *clears throat* ANOTHER WONDERFUL DAY WITH THE LOVELY DAEL KINGSMILL! 🥰
Oh my god i love this
i dont DM like i’ve done it once or twice with modules when i first started playing. your videos make me want to do it more than anything ever
I'd love to see what she thinks of Rolemaster.
woooo I keep thinking about more long lasting damages
very much enjoyed as aways
I like this idea.
Love that editing Dael had to add the * note for the 22 HP wizard taking 22 points of damage and somehow caring that they might fall unconscious in 3 rounds. XD Thanks :)
Curious how you handle healing magic like Heal, which is pretty much just "everything's better now and there is no better healing magic in the universe". Still just temporal manip accelerating the natural process including purging poisons and mental afflictions?
Additionally, at what point do you normally start involving tables like these? I imaging the 2nd level bard with 16 HP taking 8 and then rolling poorly and passing out for the rest of the fight and waking up with a big scar across their negotiating face. Always legit curious.
I start it at 3rd level but forgot to mention it (there's always SOMETHING) aaaand, yeah, basically. So it's kind of a case by case basis for healing magic based on the specific language of the spell, Heal would still risk a lot of complications, maybe even not help with poison depending on how you want to rule "disease". Some of the complications get narratively overwritten by the narrative of some magic and that's fine, coz they're engaged in the moment and if/when it happens again it'll be a new challenge to solve
The way you're using the injuries table seems to be more in line with the DMG's combat optional rule for its System Shock table. Obviously greatly expanded. I'm probably going to build a table that moves untreated system shock damage over to lingering injury, but I do really like the tables you have here.
The Rogue should take the Wyvern's sting as their new arm! Replace that necrotized limb with a monstrous stabby thing!
Stabby stabby rogues just got a lot more stabby
This feels like an improved version of the 2.0 system shock. But this gives a feel of realism instead of a possibility that you instadie even though you still have a lot of hit points left.
Editing Dael seems pretty chill, I don't mind her interruptions.
In a game of Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay, after vanquishing a Troll (and NOT meta gaming that we knew it regen), we started to loot the room and after a couple of minute SUPRISE!!! Troll standing up in my back, it kick me and crit my character. Crit result : Broken spine, roll below Endurance OR be permanently paralysed IF roll succeed, Character cannot walk for 1 month O_O I was glad to pass that Endurance roll... and had to be carried by my team for the rest of the adventure... IT WAS AWESOME!!
I really like the concept and your ideas for consequences. Though I think I'd make it dependent on the Medicine roll, and would make a similar roll for magic healing. Instead of taking for granted it always heals perfectly, just like you roll for damage on spells. Maybe it is harder to avoid the scar with magic healing. I'm thinking while I write.
This is great stuff, and speaking of coding, this is exactly the kind of thing I would strongly value within a crpg, but in a tabletop rpg I feel like this is just slightly to much admin, especially during combat, which is already pretty dense in 5e rules.
Imagining Dael horrifically scarring a player in a dramatic moment and then just *Missy Higgins starts blaring from the speaker as you pickup a microphone and do the entire song*
I would group force damage with thunder on the concussive table. YMMV.
On natural 1s, I got rid of fumbles, but kept my rule that Natural 1s automatically fail (but I also allow Take 10s for non-stressful situations).
Totally going to use this! I have a player who likes botw and wants a prosthetic like link in the new game
If they super want a prosthetic you might just have to fully orchestrate them getting a limb cut off just coz there's no way to guarantee the right roll on the right table for that, but it makes me happy you're communicating with your players like this and wanting to help them live out their character fantasies 🥰
@@MonarchsFactory THEY GET A MAGIC LEG!!! Keep chopping till they loose an arm
Would you also apply this to NPC’s that take damage? Such as causing NPCS to collapse which might be a helpful strategy for your players if they know a high amount of damage could help end the combat sooner
This is quite interesting. 🤔
For long lasting psychic damage scars, I always like to make them roll on the insanity tables
Regarding nat 1s, at my table, a natural 1 is a failure, just like a nat 20 is always a success -- but your modifiers still contribute to the severity of your failure or the magnitude of your success, sometimes even allowing a do-over for some failures. That way, the rogue with a +11 to stealth (and... who doesn't have reliable talent yet...) CAN fail an easy check, but even a horrible fumble might end up with a near miss.
I love everything in this video! But I think it’s funny that an Aussie had to make a Cold Injuries table and didn’t use the word *Frostbite* anywhere.
🍁 bless
lol, yeah - I actually deliberately curated each of the tables so that all the injuries would be things that feel cool to the player suffering them (eg, internal bleeding sounds cool, perforated bowel doesn't). Frostbite being like the hallmark of cold injuries was part of what made it so tricky, because it both sounds minor to someone unfamiliar with how it works, and also doesn't look badass as an injury for people who do know more about it and how it presents. Trying to come up with ways to write a full range of cold injuries without it was a real pain 😩
@@MonarchsFactory that’s very fair, I guess it’s just second nature to me that “frostbite” is an absolutely terrifying possibility, much more frightening than hypothermia.
On a different note, I loved the description of healing cold injuries via magic being excruciatingly painful. Because I could feel that description as I read it and it was perfect.
Ouch dude Clement the Bard, I feel you.
When I was maybe 11 or 12, I pissed off one of my brother's 14- or 15-yo friends, who decided to tackle me, except I had turned away and didn't hear him coming and was in an awkward stance, so I ended up taking the full force of both of us on my left shoulder, snapping my left collarbone. I knew something was really bad and probably broken, and went to the nearest grownup to call my mom to come get me and take me to the doctor. Said grownup was very reassuring that no there wasn't anything wrong, here lift your arm up over your head like thi....
"AAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHGGGGGGG"
"oh yeah let's get you to your mom"
Seriously lifting my arm with an unstabilized clavicle fracture is my 10-out-of-10 on the pain scale. I hope never to have that supplanted from its championship spot. That is some debilitating pain. I coulda done stuff but I'da had disadvantage af
So close to 100k subs!!! Hope it's before Christmas.
I'm adding a few notes for my games to be more unique to specific player abilities- If a character has the Rage Barbarian Feature and rolls an Adrenaline Rush on the injury table, they may instead enter a Frenzy.
If a character has the Sorcerer Spellcasting Feature and rolls a Mana Rush on the injury table, they may create a Wild Magic Surge whenever they cast a spell.
These are fantastic ideas but I feel breaks the conceit of D&D which is that only a wound to zero hp matters.
My idea which meets all your basic goals is that an injury that takes a PC to zero hp leaves a permanent scar or visual injury. The player chooses the scar. If they need help roll 1d6 1 - face, 2 - torso, 3-6 limbs in order. In addition one level of exhaustion which does not stack with any other source of exhaustion or itself.
Yay moar Dael!
I'm curious about how these effects shake up specifically for the ones that trigger after 3 rounds. How often do they actually take place while combat is still happening? I'd imagine it would be a lot more common in bossfights that last 4, 5 rounds and up...
You should put this up on the dungeon masters guild. Also this is what my die were used for.
I love this! Do you have a printer friendly version?
The question I'm wondering is how does the medicinal healing and surgery work, like with the DC for the checks
I think I will add this to the early bronze age setting that I'm trying to DM.