I had no idea that you flash before overtaking! If some one flashed me and then over took me I would take that as I had done something wrong, and I think most people will.
I just did an advanced biker course with North Yorkshire police last weekend, they said officially your SUPPOSED to, but they don't recommend it based on how it's perceived. It can be taken as aggressive and/or confuse people
@@Strider9655 If you truly believe that seeing the vehicle behind you flash its lights is somehow an indication that they are giving way that in turn will then lead to an accident, then Welcome to Ashley Neal's channel. Be prepared to learn amazing things.
An Audi driver tailgated me on the A14 - I was doing 85 in the fast lane, but that wasn't fast enough for him. He stuck his grill at most 5 metres from my back end and flashed his lights so much that I thought they were faulty. I had only just passed a guy doing 80 in the middle lane - and was allowing some room before returning to that lane. What a prick. I leisurely gave way a good few seconds later than I was planning. To be honest, I get confusing signals whenever somebody flashes their lights at me. 9 times out of 10, I think they're trying to suggest one of my lights is out at the back!
Around here I have overtaken a car doing 38mph along a 60mph country road.... on the straights, in the corners they slowed to 30mph. When I overtook them, I did it on the longest straight (about a mile) with clear view there was nothing coming, I did it from a sensible distance back and did not exceed 60mph before pulling slowly back in about 6 car lengths in front of them. I remained out longer to aid the car behind me overtaking, letting him, "Come on out, it's still safe". The person I was overtaking however blew a fuse, the started holding the horn down and flashing the lights, waving their arms at me and then again the car behind me. I'm convinced there are some of the older generation who drive at 40mph. Just everywhere. 40mph past schools, 40mph on the country roads and 40mph on the motorway. Anyone going faster is obviously a hooligan.
I can confirm that. I often commute on an A road single carriageway that is national speed limit and the vast majority of bends are easily taken at 60 but has sections at 30 and 40. I so often see people just drive at 40 or 45 the entire way along the road irrespective of speed limit
I’ve observed the magic speed here to be 46 mph. In a 30, in a 40, in a 60… so you have them right in front of you on a main road, then when you enter a village and slow down, they disappear ahead of you… only to find them at the same speed on the other side of the restriction. Or way behind you and then glaring at you in your rear view mirror through the 30, and then you lose them again the other side. It’s as if their cars or brains only have a ‘go’ and a ‘stop’ function and nothing else. Weird.
I always wonder why people get wound up over safe overtakes. They key motto is if its not causing anyone danger and it doesn't effect you, let it go. It pays to kind your business sometimes. Some people are beeping at any and everything
See it alot driving in Derbyshire, the 'isn't it lovely' brigade. Followed more than a few doing 40mph in a NSL, then they get to a village that's 30mph, and their speed doesn't change. Often I'll be saying 'you're not going fast enough to brake' as they slow for every corner. Some will slow for corners without braking, making their speed so inconsistent, you accidently start to tailgate them...
I would add that if someone isn't planning on overtaking a car ahead, please leave the space for someone from behind who might want to overtake both of you. It is safer for others to overtake one by one instead of two cars at once (especially if the straights are not long enough to overtake both cars). Don't close the gap if you are not going to overtake. I've seen so many examples where people drive close to each other but don't overtake even if the person ahead is driving below the speed limit. And then someone loses patience and tries to dangerously overtake a line of cars with no gap between them to go back to the lane if needed.
Absolutely. Driving up through the highlands you get 15 cars nose to tail following a lorry or camper and two or three nutters who force their way back in to the line after an overtake. Be so much easier and safer if people left space. Also be so much easier if people kept a reasonably steady pace instead of doing 70 on straights and 30 on anything resembling a bend. Just pick a speed you can chill at and drive at that speed. You'll arrive at about the same time and be less stressed out.
Very true. I was doing a Riding course in the Yorkshire Dales a few weeks back. People tailgating made finding a safe “landing zone” next to impossible.
“Half the distance that I know is clear.” You can’t stress this point too much, Ashley; I’ve lost count how many people think they have all the distance. As for overtaking strategy, the first thing I consider is the car(s) behind me and whether or not their driving style suggests they are in more of a hurry than I am. Also, I never ever follow another car in an overtake even if that means I miss the only opportunity. As always, a indispensable packet of invaluable info Ashley. Keep up the great work.😌
I definitely agree with the check behind you. I watch drivers in a queue to pass who clearly don't give a toss that the car in front is lining up for an overtake but doing so with more care than they intend to use. Even when the lead car's indicator comes on, Mr Rush will 'go for it' and create a dangerous situation with lots of horn blowing and fist waving. Thankfully, there are not many chances to pass on my commute once off the dual-carriageway so it's not an everyday sight.
I tend not to overtake as I find it quite stressful, so I found this video quite useful. It also reassured me that in most instances it's best not to overtake another vehicle.
A reasonable concern. Your spacing to the car in front is then important as it should allow someone behind to make two safe overtakes rather than be pressed into a more risky double move.
It’s always good to see Ash using lights/horn as they are supposed to be used. I’ve adopted the horn technique to alert people who I think may not have seen me, short ‘friendly’ beeps, but the problem I find is that a lot of people take light flashing/horn use as a trigger to get all ragey. A pity.
That's the problem. People associate flashing lights and beeping horn as aggressive. I'd rather not do it. I did once and the driver took the hump and drove right my back end .... Awful situation to be in.
I'd love the optics of using the horn to change, but I won't risk the road rage that could come from it. For things like blind approaches and narrow bridges though, I think it's suitable.
I know right? I was giving the clear signal to overtake by waving a clenched fist out my window at the car in front of me and they got all agressive about it.
This is the problem with horn/light use. It may be in the highway code, but their use in these overtaking scenarios is not common, therefore I wouldn't do it as I think it causes more confusion and potential anger than not using them.
I’ve been taught 2 second gap while planning the overtake. 1 second gap is your overtake position. The overtake position gives you a safe distance to carry out the manoeuvre but most importantly, the thinking distance to abort if required. I have however, been trained to Road Craft therefore, it may be different in the ADI world when teaching students etc.
I’m also A Fleet trainer and I’m well versed in Roadcraft. Like I say in the video if you can’t overtake from two seconds back you shouldn’t overtake. Many people think techniques used by the police are needed in general driving, and they’re not.
@@ashley_neal I totally agree with you and I am an IAM member myself, well versed in Roadcraft. The latest version of Roadcraft goes into a lot more detail on overtaking and it's pretty useful.
Thank you ashley for this video..made me realise that 90% of the overtakes i have done were generally not worth with the power of hindsight..Unfortunately pressure from tailgaters etc sometimes makes us overtake with no need.
On the flip side, pull in once in a while! I was driving on some 'fun' roads and a load of MX5's come up behind me...I pulled in when I could, got a few beeps and a thanks as they passed and we all continued happy Likewise I was approaching some car in the distance, enjoying the roads, and they pulled in a parking spot, I continued passed then they pulled out again...I thanked them and it just makes driving so much better!
Good point at around 2:50 about seeing the vehicle you've overtaken in both the middle and left mirror before moving back in. I find far too many drivers quite needlessly cut in too early after an overtake. This has become so commonplace now that it's practically become the norm. So much so that if one actually does it properly, it's almost as though anyone behind thinks you are not going to move back in....and no doubt labels you as a lane hogger. I often find myself having to cover the brake when someone moves in too early, as I begin to wonder if they are about to brake test me in some kind of crash for cash attempt. Plus, my view ahead is restricted until the overtaker moves ahead further, especially if it's an SUV or van. It's even worse when someone cuts in when the road surface is wet, sending spray onto my windscreen (and headlights). It also increases the risk of a chipped windscreen / paintwork / headlights etc from loose debris. I find it quite unbelievable that so may drivers do this and think it's perfectly normal. I've also seen YT video whereby if a vehicle cuts in too early on a modern HGV, it sets off the autonomous braking & an audiable alarm. In addition to the dangers of doing this, it must be extremely frustrating for an HGV driver to experience this repeatedly on a journey, Yet it's something that could so easily be avoided if the overtaker were to simply pull further ahead before moving back in to the left.
Good advice, but be aware that flashing headlights/using the horn either prior to or during an overtake is now actively discouraged in police driver training UNLESS it benefits the situation, which on most occasions it doesn't. An example would be if the driver in front appears distracted. Otherwise, the risk of confusing the situation outweighs the potential benefits. This from a class 1 driving instructor...
@@easyspanieltraining They taught you how to ride a motorbike in your class 1, wow. That being said, things do change. I think that flashing will be seen as aggressive or indicating a problem with the average driver these days 😖
@@TheRoverspeed wow? Clearly you don't know what a class 1 is. So what if other motorists meaning you, perceive it as aggressive. What are your driving antecedents apart from passing a basic test?
Autocar published a guide to overtaking about 20 year's ago, which I have always followed, and found it very helpful, and a non stressful way to make progress when the the circumstances present themselves. Glad to Ashley see doing the same, would have been mortified if I had been doing this wrong all those years!
I find it bewildering and frustrating that some motorists get extremely offended at being overtaken, especially when they are driving much slower than the speed limit and it is a good, wide, clear road. I've been flashed and gesticulated at for safe and legal overtaking manoeuvres and even had the overtaken vehicle speed up and tailgate me. Anyway, a good demonstration, as always, of patient overtaking and thought process.
I've had a man in his 60s (at least) shaking his head and gesturing because I tried to overtake on the motorway of all roads - it wasn't as if it was quiet either, there were other cars passing too. The mind boggles at the insecurity.
Tip: if you are moving slowly and you are holding a lot of traffic on a busy road, pull over when it's safe, like a layby or even a side road (if you can turn around, which is useful to cyclists), to avoid frustration as drivers may overtake if its dangerous. This also applies to cyclists. 4:15 would be useful for cyclists as they are very flexible, but not tractors.
Not really@@bobsmith-dn1xw, but the average cyclist does experence alot of intimidation from drivers on nearly every trip. That makes for a defensive outlook. Also getting a cycle back up to speed takes actual physical effort, more than the effort required to just keep moving, and way more than the effort to push the pedals in your car.
Joking aside, one of the things I find disappointing on the roads these days is how many drivers think that overtaking is bad, full stop. I do overtake carefully, when its safe and worth it - but all too often the person being overtaken takes exception, flashes you, or speeds up during the overtake to try to foil you. Sad .....
That's why I drive up behind them as if I'm going to ram them, then swing round after a last check. If they accelerate then cool, I haven't even left the correct side of the road, thanks for speeding up so I don't need to pass. They won't keep up with a 15 mph speed differential. Not Ashley Neal approved but if I try overtaking from 3rd at 27 mph from 2 second gap, I'm going to spend way too long on the wrong side of the road and the chance that another car is coming increases. Whereas if I use second gear, build up to 40 behind them and pull round - with my foot pinned to the floor the whole time - racing gear change if I hit 55. Then the overtake is completed in about 5 seconds.
@@TimpBizkit Ironically, the advice in roadcraft is still to drive closer than the 2 second following distance when intending to overtake to alert the person to your desire to overtake.
@@JulianShagworthy nah, id city car. that is never going round, EVER! although most have 2.0L nowadays but the point still stands that most people dont have cars able to just hang back for ages before overtaking, even dropping down a gear, it just takes ages to catch up to them before you can even go around!
Nicely done, I find most roads, especially with hedgerows that block view, aren't too suitable for overtaking and I'm waiting behind slower drivers for a long time. Always a bit exciting making an overtake but perhaps that's the boy racer in me.
I overtake people sometimes as practise , usually when it's quieter and I know the road layout, as I noticed a while ago I would forget a shoulder check which used to annoy me as I could easily wipe out a bike and ruin a whole lot of everything . So sometimes I'd go to overtake but complete a personal check list which has now become 2nd nature to me. The greatest barrier drivers face, especially in England, is the perceived arrogance of an overtaking driver as opposed to a driver who is able to perform more advanced driving techniques to aid their own and others progress on the road . Side note: Mentioning the distance from the car infront, I always see queues of drivers behind farm vehicles mainly because the 1st vehicle following is within 4 meters of the large farm vehicle and can't see . That extra space gives time to speed up and see further down. Good vid as always Ash !
know your car and your own ability and on country twisty roads go for s overtake coming out of a right hand bend as you see if the road is clear sooner and allways dro a couple of gears as you go into the bend ready to speed out of it and get the job done swiftly and safrly
I was taught to drive by an ex police advanced driver. And the most important thing they said was to make it that you are on the wrong side of the road for as little time as possible. Anticipate the conditions use the 2 second gap to get up to speed in a lower gear and make the pass, and be prepared to bail out and slow back down. But this apparently is no longer the case as most idiots now sit as close to the car/lorry in front. Then just pull out in a high gear with no momentum and take an age to try and get past
Ah I just added a comment about aborting the move or bailing out. Hadn’t read all the comments. Looks like one other person in same boat as me. I think it can be right to do!
Yes, in my IAM course I was taught that an almost motorway-style “flying” overtake is much safer, as it not only minimises time exposed to danger, but also doesn’t really leave any opportunity for the guy you’re passing to drop a gear and make things awkward. A long run up with at least a 20mph speed difference and good offside visibility was always preferable, as you could easily pick out your tuck-in spot (great when overtaking a line of cars) and it’s also easy to abort if required - what’s rare was finding a straight road that is long enough to do it. Second best option was using the 2 second gap to move slightly offside, build the speed difference and identify a return point. Aborting was always a little untidy. Sitting on their shoulder at the same speed and accelerating as you pass was always a terrible idea.
Look were you go. It's so often excluded from car training. You want to move left, look left. It's really simple. When moving back in, look left. Not just the mirror, but the blind spot. "How could there possibly be something there? That's an unnecessary check.", trust me, some day you WILL find someone or something has appeared there. Less so on fast flowing roads, but 100% every single time I move left or right I check my blindspot and in urban environments, commuting in/through the city, there is something there every single morning.
I would think that just as there are people who don't know how to be overtaken, there are those whose overtaking leaves a lot to be desired. How often have I said out loud, 'No way would I try that there'. Mostly, they get away with it, but that does not make it an example worthy of following.
@@PedroConejo1939 They usually get away with it when the vehicle being overtaken slams on just to let them pass. I swear there are so many people who don't accelerate when overtaking it's ridiculous. Or motorways, when people get past you, stop accelerating, pull back in front and then accelerate again. It's an obvious staged process that's alarming to say the least as they don't seem capable of doing more than one thing at a time.
I had a scary overtake once: I drove behind a big truck driving around 5-10mph on a limit of 30mph. Everything was okay for an overtake, but what I did not think about was that the road was just getting a downward inclination of a few %. Behind myself was a few card. I started my overtake normally, but just as I start the cars behind close in, the truck starts to accelerate to 30mph and I get vision of a few cars on the opposite lane in the distance. As I tried to hold myself to the speed limit of 30mph, I could not overtake that truck. I could also not get back to my side as there were cars there now. In order to prevent a collision with the oncoming car, in my mind I had to accelerate to about 50mph to get past that truck. No crash happened as the oncoming vehicle saw the overtake from a distance and stopped to let more space. Looking back the other alternative would been to brake and wait for a spot to get back to my position but a few spots behind in cars. But in that situation, as it had never happened to me before and I was still a new driver, the only thing I was thinking in my mind was that "if I don't speed over the speed limit, then a crash will happen". *So... be careful even when everything checks out to be ideal for an overtake*
It's an issue that comes up quite often when you're trying to overtake somebody who is driving really slowly through the corners on a twisty road. Personally I sometimes employ a 'slingshot manoeuvre' to minimise exposure to oncoming traffic. The involves slowing down before a corner to give the car in front some extra space, allowing you to then coast through the corner carrying a bit more speed than if you were stuck following at a constant 2 seconds behind. You can then accelerate out at corner exit, and follow into an overtake if the road is clear along the straightaway. Or otherwise back out of it again if not safe, and set yourself up for the next corner.
This is why you are taught on police driving courses to use 50/50 of the road to get a view, if cars are behind you as this situation can happen and leave you exposed. Never commit to an overtake unless it is 100%
Definitely don't flash your lights. Ashley's videos are generally superb but unsure why he keeps suggesting people do this. Regardless of whether you're officially suppose to do it, it will almost always be perceived as road rage, which is dangerous.
It's to warn people you are doing something, so that they don't suddenly get scared or something. Similar to beeping the horn on a blind bend to warn people you are coming 👍
Agree with Draggon - many drivers take it as a sign of aggression / intimidation of the driver overtaking and may do something rash like blocking the car from overtaking
100% agree. I hate the idea that we should do this thing in driving because "that's what you're supposed to do" without thinking how the average driver would react to it.
Excellent demonstration. I rarely find it worthwhile to overtake inside a city as we'll all meet again at the next traffic lights. This is a much more complicated maneuver than the parking one we all get tested on to get our licences; go figure.
very good. also the white lines can aid you. long with small gaps = dodgy. small with long gaps = ideal. Following the excellent tutorial by Ashley, of course.
On a motorbike i was told to: Look ahead, Look behind, Life save, Move to the other lane to have a clear View of trafic ahead, if ok to overtake turn on indicator start overtaking, if not come back to lane if overtake, when Overtaking give space , and only pul back into lane when i can see the full overtaken vehicle in the mirror.
I do tend to make decent progress on country roads, especially those I am familiar with. So I do my fair share of overtaking, I am in an older fairly light 1.8 na petrol car these days, after downsizing from a 2.0 TDI Insignia. So I do miss the mid range grunt. Let me be clear, I don't make risky overtaking manoeuvres, just normal safe ones that are well sighted and judged. On occasion I have overtaken multiple vehicles with care and issues. The thing that surprises me the most is how little other road users do overtake, even those that tend to speed. Overtaking really is a lost art these days 😞
Things you must think about when overtaking. The speed of the vehicle your overtaking. The speed of your vehicle and are you up to doing the most dangerous manouver you will ever attempt. The speed of seen or unseen vehicle. If your overtaking legally at 60mph, and an oncomming vehicle is doing 60mph The combine speed is 120mph. The oncoming vehicle will be on you alot sooner than you think. Finally the most import thing you must consider. "Do you really need to do it"
5:45 - Over this end of Europe it is more like "act now, regret later". Meaning that most overtakes I am subjected to are dangerous, and on top of me cooperating in a successful overtake I need to brake or veer outwards so that the one committing the overtake could finish it. This is what really grinds my gears. That now, I need to do my own overtake from another car's POV, which would be somewhat interesting as one can get experience in how another car behaves. But there is the human side; I do not know how the other person reacts. That is the biggest risk, one that I loath the most. Being transparent, calculating, taking measures before taking risks is the golden standard many don't seem to get. We can all get by and reach our destinations, without killing one another.
I often find that these days with the shear volume of cars on the road that there is little to no advantage on overtaking 'slower' vehicles. It's often the case those who are in a rush and overtake (most of the time quite dangerously), I and other slower vehicles catch up to them due to an even slower vehicle up ahead, i.e. a lorry, tractor, etc. and/or we come upon a more built up area such as a village, town, etc.
All depends on the length of the journey. Obviously not worth overtaking on the way to the shops, but if it’s a 4 hour drive through a rural area I’m overtaking anything and everything in my path
Good advice from Ashley. I would add if you are not intending to overtake then do not tail gate the vehicle in front because that forces the person behind you, who wants to progress, to overtake 2 or more vehicles in one go.
Thanks Ashley for high lighting the need to leave room BEFORE pulling in after an overtake. It completely P's me off when I am overtaken then the other vehicle pulls in too soon robbing my stopping distance.
Once they are done with overtaking, they should be travelling faster than you (significantly perhaps) and that 2 second gap will soon be restored. Plus, if they have just overtaken there should be very few hazards ahead. If there are any, they will arrive at them first and faster, taking longer to stop. I don't see any reason to be "completely P's off". Sure, a bigger gap is better but logically, there is not too much increased risk to get triggered about. My scenario of course assumes once done they have a nice clear road ahead, if they are queue-jumping, then by all means ram the *******!🤣
@@peterthompson9854 soon restore the 2 second gap!! Shouldn't pull in before that is in place, otherwise it's an unsafe overtake. Why should the overtaken need to slow down to regain the safe gap, also affecting those behind! Most of these are on motorways when there is absolutely NO excuse the pull in too soon.
@@malcolm6951 Your talking about Motorways. Sorry, I understand your annoyance in this scenario, because there isn't that differential in speed ...mostly 1-2 mph.. Thought you were on a country-type road. Even then, close pull ins are not great.
The decision to overtake is made early but may never present itself. View is everything and most drivers fail to use the road space that is available to them. Nearside, offside, through the other vehicle's windscreen, looking under the vehicle etc can all provide valuable insight into traffic conditions ahead. Things such as hedgerows, telegraph poles can all provide information as to where the road MIGHT go - telling you that there could be a straight after the next bend - that COULD be an overtaking opportunity - although as many a police advanced driver discovered there are roads where the telephone poles disappear into fields - squeaky backsides at high speeds. My key observation here is your distance from the vehicle ahead - I'd be looking to close the gap in anticipation of performing the overtake thus minimising the time taken to pass - but that's how I was trained
First Road is really hard to perform a safe overtake, I know it well. Glad to see that I adopt a reasonable approach to overtaking in that I don't change lane until I can see the car in both left and middle mirrors. that being said, there is always something to learn from your videos! 👍
Also bear in mind that if you're north of about Sheffield the car you're overtaking will change down two gears and accelerate hard as you try to get past. Leave extra room and anticipate the likely performance of their vehicle when planning the move.
Its not just in the UK. It can be like that here in NZ too. Some people think that overtaking them is a personal insult. However, if it means they get their toe down and drive a bit quicker, I'm happy to drop back behind. Then go again when they spool back down to their natural cruising speed again.
I'm saving fuel much more than I used to so overtaking doesn't happen very often for me these days. One thing I do when it becomes necessary, that wasn't mentioned, is pay attention to the length of the lines in the road. As far as I'm concerned, overtaking on the longer lines (not solid, which is illegal), is a no-go. Sometimes it's obvious why they're there, but equally, sometimes it's an unseen hazard. Short lines don't necessarily mean it's clear of course, there are all the other considerations, but with overtaking, I'm looking for reasons to _not_ overtake rather than reasons to do it. Never be afraid to abort the acceleration run if something crops up or becomes marginal; it means you've made an error in planning but no need to compound it. Some drivers react very badly when overtaken, even if it was perfect in every respect.
right now, if I'm going down the road, I burn $5.50 worth of fuel every 10 minutes. gives me an incentive to not be stuck behind someone who is loitering along at 30-40 MPH in a 55 MPH limit.
@@kenbrown2808 I've never heard of fuel-burn being measured by the hour except by Airbus and Boeing. We measure in miles per gallon here and that figure increases (ie. burns less) as speed decreases. I have a 2.0 litre diesel estate and recently got 70.5 mpg by sticking (mostly) to 56 mph GPS on a long run. My average is 52-56 mpg per tank with mixed driving. That means I am driving for longer but use less fuel to travel the same distance. I choose that speed as optimum because most wagons are restricted to that and it means I'm not holding anyone up on a motorway, while simultaneously not requiring me to speed up to pass someone very often.
@@PedroConejo1939 MPG is our default metric, too. but in tracking MPG, I saw a reverse relationship between speed and fuel consumption, that added up to the determination that fuel burn per hour is actually a more accurate measure. in fact, during a a few days of limited maximum fuel flow (filter unit issues) I learned, that it actually takes more fuel flow for me to accelerate from 30-35 MPH than it takes to climb an upgrade at 55 MPH. this is why in the US, cars' declared fuel economy has separate city vs freeway numbers.
If the car in front is going too slow you must, check the mirrors, use lower gears to overtake, then indicate, move out keeping correct separation distance. Don't make any rash decisions so when safe to do so ram the car in front briskly up the arse, and guide the spandex hero on the bike into the hedge.
I would only use my indicators if I have someone who needs to know. The position of my vehicle tells the vehicle I'm overtaking, what my intent is (which is also a Blue Light technique incidentally), and naturally because I am leaving that vehicle behind I don't need to indicate to pull back in. I would indicate to pull out if the vehicle because appeared to have a similar intent by their position in the road or proximity to me, because they 'do' need to know. The way I was taught was indicate if there is someone you need to indicate too, your observations (Information in IPSGA), give you that information. Information, Positions, Speed, Gear, Acceleration. So for the overtake, Information = Mirrors, left right checks and 'have I the space to complete the move in the distance I can see to be clear doubled?' Position = good view to plan the overtake which can be slightly over the centre line to improve visibility as long as your initial visibility is enough to ensure that is safe. Speed is the speed you are accelerating from in this case. Gear is ensure you are in the right gear to accelerate, then accelerate round the vehicle. We even use this for corners, as Accelerate is 'using your accelerator to manage your speed' so in a corner would be a constant speed using a small amount of accelerator to balance the car. Incidentally as advanced drivers we have two positions, off hand I can't remember the first position's name, but following is a good name and is about 4 seconds back. It's signalling to the vehicle ahead we have no intent of overtaking. Contact is about 2s back and indicates to the vehicle ahead we intend to make progress, if on a blue light run our position then indicates HOW we are doing that progress. The Following and contact positions can be used in normal driving and I love the 4s gap for following as it gives more space to use accelerator sense to adjust speed which is smoother than jumping on the brakes all the time.
I tend not to overtake anymore because ive only been passed my test just over 8 months ago and when i came to a situation where i wanted to overtake a lorry ( something i never did while learning) i tried overtaking in 5th when i should have definitely change down to 3rd. During my overtake i noticed a car came around the corner of a roundabout and i was very close to a collision. I lucky passed both the lorry and oncoming car without a hit, it shook me up has it was my first overtake and i messed it up, i was braking hard while on that same roundabout the oncoming car justed left. I definitely learned from my mistake and think twice about overtaking, i don't do it any more unless i absolutely have too.
Ex driving instructor here. It's sad but hardly anyone gets taught how to overtake at speed. It is often difficult to find opportunities, I've been lucky in the locations I taught in, and it takes a few practices to get it right. I used a very wide straight 60mph (newish) road between 2 roundabouts, and would hope to find a slower vehicle BUT if not, we would simulate overtaking if safe and quiet, showing MSM points, a 'box' overtake 'assess' position, acceleration, MSM and back to left. Could go up and down the stretch repeatedly. It's important to avoid the 'accelerate in hope', get too close, swoop out - then nowhere to go if you realise too late there was a good reason to wait. It is the most dangerous manoeuvre and the least taught. You obviously learnt a valuable lesson, but as you gain experience, why not practice, even pretending, these skills, including the gear downshift, and you will be better prepared in every sense next time. Don't be afraid to change your mind as you 'box out" and have that good look ahead before pressing 'go'. Be aware of followers closing your return space though, they don't expect an abandon and return manoeuvre.
Hi Jamie,its good you're watching Ash's videos. Don't be discouraged from overtaking because it didn't go well that first time. Go out and practice, maybe get an experienced driver to sit in with you. Practice the steps Ash goes through, and get some successfull overtakes behind you. It can be pretty stressful when you're in the early days after passing your test, and knowing you can overtake safely when you want to is one way to reduce that stress and build your confidence.
This was an eye-opener for me, all this time I've been following the car in front bumper to bumper, overtaking in fifth gear, two miles per hour faster than the ones I'm overtaking. It's been a bit tricky on those pesky blind bends and corners, never seen a accident in my rear view mirrors, at least not since I had them removed from the car by an oncoming lorry.
The overtaking culture in Malaysia has always been about going back into the lane by being too close to the car that has already been overtaken. Generally, I would do it only if the car I'm overtaking is only visible in the side mirror in its entirety. I would like to do it when the car is visible in the rear view mirror but would leave too much space for speeders to take my intended lane as they see me as "holding them up" (as I mostly stick to the speed limit). In the future, I might save footage from my dashcam to send to you, Ash, if only to show you the difference in driving cultures despite our driving laws being similar.
In my lower powered car, the technique is to start with the two second gap. Then floor it in the lowest gear that does not exceed the rev limiter. Do one last check as you are about 2-3 car lengths behind the driver in front, then pull out (or brake if dangerous and you need to abort) - watching your tachometer in the peripheral so you don't waste time bouncing off the rev limiter and shift up at the prescribed 6400 rpm on my car. Then wait until you're 3 car lengths ahead and pull back in.
This was the method taught many moons ago when cars had less acceleration. Nowadays, with quicker modern cars , I think the recommended method is Ashley's way. It negates the risk of higher closing speeds with the vehicle in front. Your method requires you to judge when the gap will be there while taking into account your own acceleration, plus you are pulling out from a closer position where you have less vision. That's the reason, but I, for one, would certainly not say you were wrong to do it your way in your lower powered car. It has a fair few advantages too.
Although my boy racer days are a distant memory I feel safer to overtake when driving a vehicle with decent power/torque...... It enables you to accomplish the manoeuvre in a shorter distance and time. Of course, there are a few vehicles that just cannot be used to overtake anything; such as the Citroen 2CV. Those have a zero to 60 time - best measured with a Sundial 😁. Knowing your vehicle's capability counts for a lot. I've nearly been involved (as a passenger) in one or two close calls by a driver of limited abilities who very nearly caused a head-on collision and we are talking bare centimetres between ☠ or survival. I never travelled with that bloke again. Stay safe everyone 👍
I was surprised Ashley was even considering an overtake on Catchdale Moss Lane in the first part of the video. Although a country road, it’s very winding, narrow, busy and almost always too short to make an overtake worthwhile. Leading to a dual carriageway, you know there’s a opportunity to much more safely get ahead later. Glad to see it wasn’t attempted. As a nearby resident, I’m aware of a lot of heavy crashes and fatalities on that particular road.
He was making a demonstration video, so needed to talk about when and when not to, following position etc. I don't think he was ever actually considering an overtake.
Tell me I am wrong, but if I am planning an overtake on a stretch that I know and there is a car behind me also itching for an over-take, I will put my indicator on for three blinks, to show to the car behind that I have an intention to overtake and that I'm not just sitting behind the slow moving vehicle. This helps them plan too.
@@WatchesOnWood I'm not sure about the etiquettes and whatnot, but I've only ever done it when I'm the leader, slow, and it's difficult for people to see past me!
A Clean overtake will not affect any other vehicles, pedestrians, cyclists etc so shouldn't be seen as a negative, just someone whose progressing their journey.
Only criticism is failing to explain the slingshot technique, follow and advance position. I’m not 100% sure what car Ashley is in here however it seems to have a decent amount of power. The slingshot is typically winding the power on early so when the view comes, you can move onto the other side of the road with a substantial amount of speed on the car you’re overtaking. This allows you to get out and back in quickly. The follow position is the 2 second time gap however the advance (overtaking) position is a little closer. As you explained, there is typically no need to be in this position unless you’re a emergency services driver. I use this position in unison with the slingshot technique as it was how I was taught by my dad (dad is a Grade A advanced police driver). You never follow in this position however when overtaking you do take this position. Great watch as always Ashley!
Ashley I find your gear choices interesting. I guess it is different for each car, but some would criticise you drive in too high a gear at a normal speed in order to save fuel. A few times you said you were dropping into fourth, I would've only been at fourth at that speed anyway. But I can't tell from behind my keyboard. It's worth a reminder to other drivers not to sit in too high a gear as you will be labouring your engine too much, especially if aiming to accelerate anytime soon. Not to mention it will mean you have less control of the car when it comes to braking too. The best way I measure it in my car (320i) is sitting between 1500-2000 rpm on flat ground. But more like 2000-2500 on slightly inclined or declined roads. 2000-3000 on steeper roads. Once you're used to it you just know by the sound of the engine without looking at the rev counter. I'm sure Ashley knows his car well and was in control but thought it was worth a reminder to other drivers of manual cars.
When you’re learning you don’t get much practice at overtaking so I’ve had to learn the hard way and from my mistakes. Things I’ve learned is when you know it’s 100% clear don’t hesitate, the earlier you overtake the better. Know how powerful your car is and overtake in third gear (my car pulls in 3rd). Never overtake on bends or over hills. Can you overtake in 4th gear? Does it have to be 3rd?
you should start an overtake in one gear below your cruising gear. your cruising gear will vary. when my daily was still configured lightly, it's preferred overtake was to release the torque converter, drop two gears, spool up the turbocharger, take one gear back, and lock the torque converter back in. this would take all of a second and a half for it to do. now it's carrying a bit more weight, and it has adapted to just drop one gear, most of the time.
It very much depends. You need to be in a low enough gear to be able to accelerate quickly through the overtake; however, you don't really want to be so low a gear that the engine runs out of puff and you have to change up part way through the overtake (if you are driving a manual), as it is not advisable to take one hand off the wheel whilst on the "wrong" side of the road. The car will be slightly more unstable as you will have a camber going the opposite way to what you are used to. If you are driving an auto box, it is good to manually select the gear before you start the overtake. It is also worth popping the box in to Sport mode.
based on my experiences on the A1/A1(M) and various motorways (the only places I can regularly do overtaking), either modern cars are severely underpowered, or people drive them as if they're 44 ton wagons; so many drivers of relatively small vehicles take absolutely ages to pass the vehicle they're overtaking
Perhaps it's cos we are all paranoid about doing 70.5mph and getting caught. I feel that the blanket and absolute enforcement of speed limits has cause pockets of congestion where everyone is doing 69.5-70.5mph, 2 meters from each others bumpers. When cars were doing between 60-90mph this didn't happen. The speed differentials created it's own spacing, and you watched your mirror more.
@@peterthompson9854 if that's the case, then their fears are unfounded on the A1/A1(M) between Donny and Newark, which has very few speed cameras, and is also a real hotspot for pathetic overtaking
Admit it, you just don't like being behind silvery coloured cars!🤦🤣😸 My only concern over flashing the headlights is that it alone is enough to trigger a "hothead", then what began as a simple overtake now becomes a perceived challenge by the hotheaded driver you're overtaking. It's a bit of a toss-up between safety in alerting the other driver to your presence, and triggering them into a challenge to a duel.
I can't disagree with anything you say, but I do know that most drivers will interpret flashing lights or horn sounding from someone overtaking to be an act of aggression. They'll assume they've annoyed you in some way, and if they've done nothing wrong, it might trigger them into an aggressive response. I realise you're doing things correctly, but most people seem to drive like racing drivers prior to overtaking: They hang on the rear of the car in front, with a slight rightwards positioning, and wait for a suitable clear run ahead, at which point they hammer it and race off into the distance to try and vindicate their decision to overtake. By leaving a gap in front, drivers behind will assume you have no intention of overtaking and overtake you to occupy the two-second gap you've left between you and the car in front. There's a lot to be said for adopting a zen-like chill and being happy driving slightly slower than you might otherwise have driven behind a slow vehicle.
@Ashley Neal Great info and it would be wonderful if everyone Joe Public was as diligent Remember my ADT course in south wales and was told by retired blue light instructor; that if a clear straight road, mirror position speed and IF necessary position 3&4 to finalise the look and IF STILL CLEAR then overtake If not the drop back to position 2 ( on a straight road of course) and back on drive and continue Do you run ADT courses for anyone other than trainee driving instructors? Thanks Jonathan
French version : Drive up the car in front's backside. Wait until there's no gap, then overtake at the last second, barely missing the back bumper of the car you're overtaking then cutting in quickly whilst speeding off at light speed. ;)
@@1stwalker or do neither? If it's a normal overtake there is no need for either flashing lights or using the horn. I find it odd that flashing the lights is mentioned.
Depends on the situation. As Ashley demonstrated, he did two overtakes, one using a flash, one without. Having done a Bike Safe course with North Yorkshire police last Sunday, they said officially, a quick flash is in the guide, but it's not something they would recommend you do. At least not in most situations.
@@RichO1701e That's a fair enough summary I think. I have to say personally in over 20 years of driving I cannot recall someone flashing me whilst performing an overtake.
Only rely on what you can see - not sat nav - Yes it could be useful also for assessing the severity of upcoming bends but still make sure you rely on what you see, and if there is any doubt that the overtake isn't on then don't take it like you saw hidden junctions, look for gaps in hedges, powerlines across the road, dropped kerbs, dirt marks from agricultural vehicles etc, finger boards, lots of clues
@@Sellinglobs I did say “a useful source of information “ - no sane person would rely solely on their satnav. As you correctly say there are many other clues, but some entries are totally hidden with no clues, so use all the info available to you.
@@Sellinglobs I did say “a useful source of information “ - no sane person would rely solely on their satnav. As you correctly say there are many other clues, but some entries are totally hidden with no clues, so use all the info available to you.
It's just a method of informing another road user that you are there. Consider a dual carriageway where you are doing seventy and approaching a line of vehicles doing sixty. There's a chance a driver ( ? German car not usually equipped with indicators) will suddenly pull out to overtake. Not a flash but a couple of seconds of main beam might draw his attention. Still be ready to slow down as apart from no indicators there may be no mirrors.
On a busy motorway all cars would have full beams on. Don't think it's a good idea. Looking in the rear and side view mirror could obstruct your vision as it would to oncoming vehicles on a single carriageway. They should never be used if there's a vehicle in any of the lanes in front of you.
A key point is the performance of your own car. There are overtakes I would do in my Exige I wouldn't even consider in the wife's Land Rover, or even my old Golf.
@@bobsmith-dn1xw I mean if you consider an 18k Lotus a boast, sure. It's hardly a Ferrari. But sure, continue being toxic online. See how fulfilled that makes you.
I don't often feel the need to overtake anything anything other than a bike or horse, but I tend to feel pressured to overtake a slow driver when a queue is building up behind me and I'm being tail-gated. I just don't want to deal with someone attempting to overtake multiple cars.
There's a reason for the rhyme 'It's number two who makes the queue'. If you don't want to pass, and don't want to hold others up, back off, keep left leave a big gap, and let the others go.
@@Jonc25 sat nav for finding destination not looking at road thats what windscreen for in factyou dont need sat navs at all just learn to read a mapit is easyer and safer
As a retired driving instructor I have always taught a 4 second gap should be maintained at all times. The two second rule does not allow for the one second from seeing problem to the time you start applying the brake, leaving you only one second for braking
I take it you don't live in the southeast of England then? A 4 second rule would mean we'd rarely go above 30 mph. There just isn't enough road space to drive that far apart.
I drive in the South East. Yes, I see a huge number of people breaking the two second rule, but that is *their* problem. I am in control of my vehicle and I intend to drive safely, safely to protect me. If they chose not to, that is their choice, or possibly even their ignorance, and it is they that put themselves at risk. Not my problem! I don't say to myself "I will violate the two second spacing rule because if I don't violate it, we won't fit all the traffic in on the roads".
@@bobsmith-dn1xw I have driven into London every day for 10 years and maintained the 4 second rule, it did not add any time to my daily drive. I often noted the car in front used their brakes every few seconds because of being too close to the vehicle in front and waste of fuel and damaging to the inviroment!!!
I imagine you would agree since having your Tesla that when in an EV (although I know not in this video), having full power of the car immediately available at any time without needing to select gears, makes overtaking easier and safer. I have definitely found that since switching to electric a few years back.
That's just high torque and it's the same with any vehicle, good point though. I'm way more confident on the bike with overtakes than I am in the car as the bike just flies with a flick of the wrist. The car... not so much.
@@54356776 It's not just the torque though. Not needing to change gears before or during and the instant response is a big thing also. I remember driving turbo diesels in the past and they have such a short usable power range you sometimes needed to change gear mid overtake. No such issue in an EV.
@@seanbranagh I don't need to change gears either because of high torque/power and it's the same with any high torque/power vehicle. It's much safer and you feel way more confident when you know you have that extra shove at any speed.
@@54356776 My original point regarding EVs isn't about power and torque though. We have 2 EVs. A Model 3 and a Leaf. Yes, the performance of the Tesla makes overtaking a breeze. Our Leaf has only 109bhp but even in that the power delivery is absolutely instant and uniform making overtaking much easier than in a petrol or diesel car with the same performance figures. In a manual petrol car with 109bhp that peak power is only available within a very narrow rev range, forcing you to work the gears. There are no such issues with electric motors.
@@seanbranagh Yes it is, you just don't want it to be. You feel that EV'S are better but you can't say why. I understand what you're saying, but it is about high torque. You don't need max power to overtake either, that's just dangerous. I get it, you're an EV person, but you don't seem to understand the physics of motor vehicles.
Surely if you flash your lights at the vehicle ahead you are alerting them to an issue or worse? I don't understand why you flash your lights before overtaking. I've never heard of that before.
@@asilver2889 if a car behind me flashed his lights I would be thinking I had a light out. Or I was driving too slow for them. Or they wanted me to stop.
@@CrueLoaf It's not JUST 'flashing 'headlights' though - it would be combined with (possibly) a right signal, plus position and speed. If none of those are also present, maybe there IS some other reason. But at least you would have looked in mirror ....
Great video on overtaking, Ashley. I've had specialist training on overtaking and examination in overtaking techniques to IAM Roadsmart Masters level: what you say and the techniques you use are really sensible. There are circumstances when taking an overtaking position makes sense but I hate seeing drivers rush up too close behind while waiting for an overtake opportunity. Far better to maintain a safe following distance. I would use the SLAP checklist myself: - is it Safe? - is it Legal? - is it Advantageous? - how will the overtake affect Perceptions? I was doing a series of overtakes one time on a country road with long straight stretches. I did my mirror check before an overtake and spotted a guy in a tatty Cavalier storming up behind me. I had recently overtaken him and he was obviously triggered. I aborted my overtake and watched him go past me then do a prolonged multi-car overtake that took him FAR too close to a blind left hander. I deliberately reduced my speed and skipped a couple of overtakes so I did not give him the perception that I was racing him. I was seriously worried that he would cause a head on collision if he felt pushed. Sometimes we have to think of the perceptions of other drivers and plan accordingly. I really like the way you consider use of the horn and/or a flash of the lights, but decided not to use them as the situation did not demand it. I would use a flash of the lights sometimes too, but only if I thought there was a danger that I had not been observed. Sometimes the horn too, I find a quick double toot rather than an imperious prolonged blast avoids triggering drivers. So you are spot on. Nice one.
@@saundersdachicken6197 Ashley did not mention undertaking in this video. There are circumstances when overtaking on the nearside is specifically allowed in the Highway Code: on a one way street, or in queues of traffic, or when the other vehicle is turning right - if I recall correctly. However, overtaking on the nearside is discouraged in the Highway Code as it's potentially dangerous. The Police (and the Court) MAY decide it amounts to driving without due care and attention ie careless driving.
@@R04drunner1 Correct he didn't mention undertaking in this video and that is the reason I replied.. On previous videos he criticises those who do it, like what we can see the blue van do. Yes you can undertake on a one way street, a motorway/dual carraigeway and even a two way street with two lanes in the same direction you are traveling. When it says " when the other vehicle is turning right" that is referring to a street with only one lane in your direction and the vehicle in front of you is turning right . Undertaking may be discouraged in certain circumstances but is NOT classed as dangerous driving. Don't forget DD is illegal, undertaking is not. Any manoeuvre that's carried out in an inappropriate way may be classed by the police or the courts as CD or even DD. That includes overtaking, changing lanes, pulling out from a parking position and so on. So those exceptions that you have given are only advise as nowhere in rule 268 or 163 does it say you must not do it.
It's hard to believe that most drivers think the only way to pass a vehicle that's moving slower in lane 2 or 3 is to move out and pass them on their right, then move back in to lane 1. They actually believe it's the safer option, yet they don't realise that lane changing is one of the leading causes of motorway collisions. Seriously, would you do that if there was a hogger in lane 2 or 3?
@@mikehunter2844 yes I have moved out from lane 1 to lane 3 to overtake a lane 2 lane hog, then moved back to lane 1 in front of them. Surprising how many take the hint and then move into lane 1, but sadly not all do. Doing lane changes, you can manage the risk through correct observations, signalling, positioning, speed, gear and acceleration. When passing on the nearside, the control of the risk lies with the lane hog who may well decide to move back to lane 1 without proper checks or signalling because he (or she) does not expect to be passed on the nearside. I know who I'd prefer to be managing risk, and it isn't the person bumbling along displaying their lack of situational awareness!
You’d think so, but it’s one of the most dangerous manoeuvres you can make. So much needs be right and you must be Damn certain you can clear it as he demonstrates one silly mistake could be catastrophic
I've given up overtaking during the day. Due to the 'worth it' part which I didn't seem to hear you explain during the video. Between 7am-7pm its just often on the more major A-roads not worth the overtake as you can always gurantee. Your going to get stuck behind another slow mover. Or stuck at the lights where the vehicle you overtook catches you up.
To me the most important part of considering an overtake is, 'Is it worthwhile'. If you look carefully at this video after Ashley makes the left turn the car he has overtaken crosses the roundabout about 5 seconds later, net gain 3 seconds. So was the overtake even worthwhile before the planned left turn?
Always give yourself that 2 second run up. It'll give you time to cancel the overtake if something unexpected happens or you see a car you may have missed etc.
I’d like peoples opinions on speed. I often find those drivers that go very slowly around the bends then when you think all the variables are aligned to go past they speed up on a straight section to say 50-55 mph. Of course you could pass at 60 but that feels potentially dangerous often I tend to complete overtakes without looking at my Speedo as all my focus is going on the view ahead for any changes to the conditions. I know here the answer will be if you can’t do it within the speed limit you shouldn’t be doing the overtake but at the next bend and 25 mph again it can be pretty frustrating on a longer A road trip if you are trying to make good progress.
Also would put some hate on the drivers that suddenly speed up when you try to overtake. In my old Skoda Fabia 2007 VRS lots of owners of expensive cars would take issue with being passed by a cheap old box on wheels.
I’d wager that as well intentioned and “by the book” as the headlight flash is here, it’s more likely to be interpreted as an act of frustration than anything else which could cause the driver ahead to become enraged. Perhaps it has the desired effect either way, but do you risk retaliation?
@@ashley_neal it's interesting point though. If say 70% of drivers are uneducated, perhaps better phrased as unaware, then is it necessary or adding any value. Particularly if you have a clear lane to enter and overtake. I can see the merits of it though if more people were aware and maybe more so at night time, I'm just not sure I'd ever do it.
Ashley, I like you're attitude, but sadly you've not been employed to educate the whole country yet! I wouldn't normally flash like that unless I thought they definitly hadn't seen me for risk of enraging the driver. Can we expect an opinion from you on new cyclist laws?
You should be extra extra careful for bikers who may be catching up very quickly to the car behind you. A quick glance in your rear view mirror may not be sufficient. Bikers in general overtake much quicker than cars.
Before you overtake, use your right indicator for a few seconds. If a rear biker ignores that, then that's their own stupid fault. You can't be held responsible for other idiot road users that wilfully chose to ignore your indication. Having said that, you must recognise that wanting to overtake and indicating does not automatically give you the right to overtake.
People driving too slowly or unsure seems to happening a lot more often than it used to. I don't mind people generally being sensible and slowing down around corners if they aren't sure etc. But when the road is 60mph, it's a long clear open road and they're doing 30/40mph you have to question whether they should even be on the road at all.
I cannot remember the last time I did an overtake.... The joys of driving a 450,000 mile van with a 65mph speed limiter. As long as they are doing 50mph or over Im fine I'll stay behind.
Around where I live the council have made it impossible to overtake for mile after mile by changing all the road markings from broken centre lines to a hatched centre with solid lines each side effectively making a three lane width road into two single lanes, everyone's speed is therefore dictated by the driver of slowest vehicle on these roads.
I flash in bad weather conditions, particularly when passing trucks, they may not have seen me pull out with the indicator on due to the spray. Not normally in good weather tho
Flashing your lights. People that are not at your level may not know that this is a friendly signal. In Portugal they use the horn all the time to tell other drivers what they are doing. It works very well once you realise why everyone is honking at you 😂
@@ashley_neal Thanks Ash. So much to see here. Will watch your video later and contribute some comments in due course. Oh and I practised so much of what I've learned from you on the drive from home in Canterbury
I've got a friend going there today. Watch out for a spry looking bloke in his late seventies, almost as deaf as a post, deliberately asking embarrassingly awkward questions of the exhibitors and tell him I said "Hi!".
@@ianmason. Oh really? Haven't met anyone of that description yet. As for myself, you can miss me. Im wearing an over the shoulder messenger bag with a large Canadian flag, as I am dual British and Canadian. It's a great show btw and vast. Was here last year too but this year is even bigger. Had my photo taken with their version of The Stig.
@@ashley_neal One of the booths at this huge show was the DVLA. They were selling all the "standard" driving manuals and I finally bought myself a hard copy of the new Highway Code. They also had the Police Roadcraft manual as well as the Know Your Roadsigns book, though I already have the latest copy of those latter two. Outside, the Surrey police had an exhibition, including two of their patrol cars and even a speed camera van. Had a very interesting talk with them. Elsewhere in the show there were so many cars, both new (including so many EV's) as well as classics. And I got to have a photo with "The Stig", though not the "real" one! Overall, a great show!
What shocked me once i was over taking a car which began to speed up, which then made the situation very dangerous as I then had to speed up so I wouldn't have a head on collision, even after I cleared the car he chased after me, clearly upset.
It's worth adding another reason to leave a decent gap is so the vehicle can reach a speed much closer to overtaking speed prior to overtaking (plus gives you a double check of your cars acceleration potential as it's already pulling). This allows time to abort the manoeuvre safely if required, rather than trying to accelerate whilst passing and especially important for lower powered vehicles. An extreme example might be your car is missing or badly performing whilst you are beside the other car accelerating hard, or perhaps not performing as expected (optical illusion flat road that is actually an incline). Obviously side roads, entrances, cycles bends and other hazards must be assessed, as well as the nature of the other drivers behaviour. A very slow driver "may be looking for a turn, parking space or concealed entrance. Even if that turn is left they may swing out prior to turning. Or their vehicle may have a problem. Following too close prior to overtaking may actually cause a driver to become nervous and do some unusual things prior to the overtake. My personal preference is only to overtake when absolutely necessary and fortunately, it's not usually absolutely necessary. Overtaking is a much more dangerous manoeuvre than some people realise. Many things are concealed or out of your control when overtaking, deep pothole, diesel/oil spill, gravel, mud, water, burst tyre, windscreen shatter, animal etc..The truth of it is, overtaking, always increases risk.
I strongly disagree with your first sentence. Accelerating up to the overtake leaves no time to abort the overtake once a position on the offside has been taken. See Roadcraft page 196. Taking an offside position without accelerating allows you to assess the road ahead and the gap you plan to pull into. If there is any reason to abort then you can just move back nearside again. If it's safe, then you accelerate past.
I'm wondering what the thought process is behind the flash of the lights. I find it's predominantly used as a telling off these days on the road and I wonder if it would potentially anger the driver you're overtaking, and force them to do something silly like speed up.
As I can't read minds, I would use 2 second flash as taught if I felt it necessary. It's not a telling off or an instruction, but I am aware some have this opinion. Just keep all options open - if a headlight warning makes people angry, gawd help us.
It shouldn't be used as telling off though, passing was the original purpose. Motorbikes still have it written on them for the flash button, it says "pass". In my experience flashing lights has always been used as a signal or to get your attention which is fine. I have had someone flash me from behind many times though and I still don't know what their intention was. I get what you're saying though and I've seen this happen more than once. I don't have a perfect solution for communication but it is key to understanding what others are trying to convey.
One thing I do especially in areas that I am not familiar with the roads is leave the sat nav displayed and zoomed out a bit. I have used it to identify where a good opportunity may be coming up but also where its not worth it.
Would also like to question flashing your lights. This is bound to alarm the driver of the car being overtaken and could distract them. Is it advised in the highway code?.
A flash of the lights indicates to the other driver you are present. It should not be used for any other purpose. Horn again, is to alert the other road user you are approaching. Its use when overtaking is not usual and is unnecessary. It is unnecessary because when you are overtaking you are on the wrong side of the road and the vehicle you are overtaking should remain in their lane and not pull over to your lane without mirror-signal-maneuvre and a check over the shoulder process being followed, which means they should see you, and therefore they should not move out of their lane and into you.
Hi ashley, i noticed on your previous videos that there was a scammer pretending to be you with your profile picture saying i “won” something and to text them. I think you should make a video to make people aware 👍
In the 80s and 90's I did many thousands of miles of European motoring. Use of the horn and a flash of the lights was the norm when overtaking. Doing the same in the UK unfortunately produces rage and aggression in a lot of drivers. I would never do it here.
Just overtaking produces rage and aggression in many drivers, including my wife (who happens to drive a fairly quick car). She was rather upset when she was overtaken, so I explained that it wasn’t a personal insult, they have merely chosen to travel faster than her, which they are very entitled to do.
That seemed to me to be a very slow overtake of the Mazda - as long as you feel you've been seen and intentions are clear to the car you're passing, surely it's safer to complete the manoeuvre with a bit of speed and get back in lane. On that subject of power or speed, I can see why some new drivers are involved in serious accidents, they do not have the power to safely overtake things (I know surroundings and awareness are key here). My mother was hit in her Mini, so it's in for repair, the courtesy Corsa given had NO oil in, so they wanted it taken back to be swapped after I heard the engine knocking as damage had already been done, as we sadly lost my gran last week, she asked if I could take it up and collect the other car... 1.2 75 bhp... SCARY - especially when used to a 250bhp Focus ST estate.
@@ivorjones6618 There is no issue glancing at a built in sat nav screen for additional information. Especially when that information allows for a safer overtake.
People afraid to overtake a slower vehicle, keeping others behind, should remember that all vehicles have good brakes and drivers are well trained to use them. I mean, oncoming vehicles would brake to let the overtakers return to their lane. Not trusting other drivers is like not trusting people would not mug you when you go out.
Good video but I never flash when overtaking, and no one ever flashes me. If they did I'd be a bit confused to be honest as no one else does it. Are they pointing something out in my driving? Is there an issue with my car?
The more i plan my to take stress out of my life i find that i no longer need or want overtake anywhere as near as much as i used to. In this case I would have just followed that car at a safe distance and enjoyed the journey .
If somebody deliberately accelerates from driving constantly at less than 40mph, to block me as I'm overtaking (on a 60mph road) is it permissible to kill them?
I also find overtaking can be stressful, because you are depending on the good will and experience of the driver of the car ahead. Many years ago in the highlands I was driving behind a car that was going quite slow for the road conditions. I knew that road very well so as we approached a long stretch of empty road I started to overtake. The driver in front instead of allowing me to pass started to accelerate as I began to pass in the outside lane. So we were both travelling at 60 mph with me in the oncoming lane (It was on the A82). I saw in the distance a huge truck appear in the same lane as me. We closed at a frightening rate and I barely managed to brake and pull into my lane behind the car I had been trying to pass before the truck thundered past with his horn blasting at me. Only then did I realise that the car in front was a hired car with a foreigner at the wheel (a young woman). I still shudder when I think of what could have happened.
Wow, scary situation! I normally do the speed limit, or as close as I safely can, but still get occasionally overtaken. When I am being overtaken in this sort of situation (if theres no one else in my lane just behind me), I make a point to just ease off the throttle slightly once the overtaking car is alongside me, just so they can overtake more quickly and it's safer. Even if I'm doing 60mph in a 60mph zone and the person behind me (illegally and probably unsafely) wants to do 70pmh, it is a lot safer to just let them make the manouvre rather than holding them up to prove a point. This sort of thing is why it's always better to just let an overtaking car by and not a good idea to increase speed while being overtaken.
@@robinthebobin6537 you have to be particularly careful in tourist areas such as the Scottish highlands, where you have foreigners who are driving on the “wrong” side of the road as far as they are concerned. Also, they are concentrating more on the scenery than they are on driving. I also got the impression that the young woman in my case was an inexperienced driver.
Yep, it's that kind of psychopathic behaviour that leads to fatalities. She'd rather endanger your life and the lives of other road users than accept that she's been overtaken.
I've seen sometimes slower drivers pulling left into a hard shoulder to allow drivers to over take. I've mainly seen this on wider national roads with good wide hard shoulders. I've always thought this to be dangerous but interest to hear what more experienced drivers think of this
Dangerous, certainly. Illegal as well, as the hard shoulder is for breakdowns and emergencies only. Although it could technically be done safely, the likelihood is that someone who has such a poor grasp of, and respect for, the rules that they will do this, is also the kind of person who would fail to spot that the hard shoulder disappears in 100 yards to be replaced by the concrete supports for a bridge.
I think it’s a wonderful and considerate thing to do and shows the driver has a heightened awareness of the situation around them. I’m assuming you don’t mean “ hard shoulder “ as you don’t really get them in single carriageway A roads. I assume you mean when cars move to the left when they see you have the opportunity to pass.
In my experience , safe , responsible overtaking very often results in being tailgated by an impatient , aggressive meat - head . This may not be a problem for seasoned motorists but I feel sorry for new drivers who could be doing everything right but feel intimidated by this .
Happened to me with a taxi driver (shocker). I overtook him on a clear straight 60mph road (he was doing about 50-55mph). Poor thing got triggered and went out of his way to speed up and try and overtake me back. Pathetic, really.
@@JimNH777 I would always advise against P plates as people treat you like a dickhead and the people who tend to have P lack confidence and generally don't have great driving ability. If you're a new driver and have a black box fitted I would strongly recomend putting a sticker on the back window stating you have a blackbox as it generally reduces tailgating when you do the speed limit, also advise putting a sticker stating their is a camera fitted to the back regardless of whether there is one for the exact same reason.
@@gravemind6536 thanks but so far after few months I didn't notice that. Plenty of assholes but they would probably overtake me doing 25 in 20 or 37 in 30 only to end up at the same traffic lights as I do anyway. But on the other hand I noticed plenty of people keeping their distance instead of tailgating. But that might also be the fact I'm driving a beater so minor damage to my car won't hurt me as much as them :)
Especially, where are you going after you did the overtake? Quite often I see people overtaking when there's clearly not enough room in front of the car they're overtaking.
I had no idea that you flash before overtaking! If some one flashed me and then over took me I would take that as I had done something wrong, and I think most people will.
I just did an advanced biker course with North Yorkshire police last weekend, they said officially your SUPPOSED to, but they don't recommend it based on how it's perceived. It can be taken as aggressive and/or confuse people
@@RichO1701e Definitely seen the aggressive interpretation, but then I've had that without flashing too. Not often, but a few times.
@@PedroConejo1939 Flashing is taken as you giving way, great if you want to cause an accident.
@@Strider9655 If you truly believe that seeing the vehicle behind you flash its lights is somehow an indication that they are giving way that in turn will then lead to an accident, then Welcome to Ashley Neal's channel. Be prepared to learn amazing things.
An Audi driver tailgated me on the A14 - I was doing 85 in the fast lane, but that wasn't fast enough for him.
He stuck his grill at most 5 metres from my back end and flashed his lights so much that I thought they were faulty.
I had only just passed a guy doing 80 in the middle lane - and was allowing some room before returning to that lane.
What a prick. I leisurely gave way a good few seconds later than I was planning.
To be honest, I get confusing signals whenever somebody flashes their lights at me.
9 times out of 10, I think they're trying to suggest one of my lights is out at the back!
Around here I have overtaken a car doing 38mph along a 60mph country road.... on the straights, in the corners they slowed to 30mph. When I overtook them, I did it on the longest straight (about a mile) with clear view there was nothing coming, I did it from a sensible distance back and did not exceed 60mph before pulling slowly back in about 6 car lengths in front of them. I remained out longer to aid the car behind me overtaking, letting him, "Come on out, it's still safe". The person I was overtaking however blew a fuse, the started holding the horn down and flashing the lights, waving their arms at me and then again the car behind me.
I'm convinced there are some of the older generation who drive at 40mph. Just everywhere. 40mph past schools, 40mph on the country roads and 40mph on the motorway. Anyone going faster is obviously a hooligan.
I can confirm that. I often commute on an A road single carriageway that is national speed limit and the vast majority of bends are easily taken at 60 but has sections at 30 and 40. I so often see people just drive at 40 or 45 the entire way along the road irrespective of speed limit
Your lucky most only leave one car length from the car in front I try to overtake.
I’ve observed the magic speed here to be 46 mph. In a 30, in a 40, in a 60… so you have them right in front of you on a main road, then when you enter a village and slow down, they disappear ahead of you… only to find them at the same speed on the other side of the restriction. Or way behind you and then glaring at you in your rear view mirror through the 30, and then you lose them again the other side. It’s as if their cars or brains only have a ‘go’ and a ‘stop’ function and nothing else. Weird.
I always wonder why people get wound up over safe overtakes. They key motto is if its not causing anyone danger and it doesn't effect you, let it go. It pays to kind your business sometimes. Some people are beeping at any and everything
See it alot driving in Derbyshire, the 'isn't it lovely' brigade. Followed more than a few doing 40mph in a NSL, then they get to a village that's 30mph, and their speed doesn't change. Often I'll be saying 'you're not going fast enough to brake' as they slow for every corner. Some will slow for corners without braking, making their speed so inconsistent, you accidently start to tailgate them...
I would add that if someone isn't planning on overtaking a car ahead, please leave the space for someone from behind who might want to overtake both of you. It is safer for others to overtake one by one instead of two cars at once (especially if the straights are not long enough to overtake both cars). Don't close the gap if you are not going to overtake. I've seen so many examples where people drive close to each other but don't overtake even if the person ahead is driving below the speed limit. And then someone loses patience and tries to dangerously overtake a line of cars with no gap between them to go back to the lane if needed.
Exactly yes, and the best of luck trying to find that one in the highway code.
Absolutely. Driving up through the highlands you get 15 cars nose to tail following a lorry or camper and two or three nutters who force their way back in to the line after an overtake. Be so much easier and safer if people left space. Also be so much easier if people kept a reasonably steady pace instead of doing 70 on straights and 30 on anything resembling a bend. Just pick a speed you can chill at and drive at that speed. You'll arrive at about the same time and be less stressed out.
"Leave a gap for the other chap" was the road safety slogan once used to promote this advice, as I recall.
Safe overtaking has become almost impossible a lot of the time now, simply because people drive too close to each other.
Very true. I was doing a Riding course in the Yorkshire Dales a few weeks back. People tailgating made finding a safe “landing zone” next to impossible.
“Half the distance that I know is clear.”
You can’t stress this point too much, Ashley; I’ve lost count how many people think they have all the distance.
As for overtaking strategy, the first thing I consider is the car(s) behind me and whether or not their driving style suggests they are in more of a hurry than I am.
Also, I never ever follow another car in an overtake even if that means I miss the only opportunity.
As always, a indispensable packet of invaluable info Ashley. Keep up the great work.😌
I definitely agree with the check behind you. I watch drivers in a queue to pass who clearly don't give a toss that the car in front is lining up for an overtake but doing so with more care than they intend to use. Even when the lead car's indicator comes on, Mr Rush will 'go for it' and create a dangerous situation with lots of horn blowing and fist waving. Thankfully, there are not many chances to pass on my commute once off the dual-carriageway so it's not an everyday sight.
I tend not to overtake as I find it quite stressful, so I found this video quite useful. It also reassured me that in most instances it's best not to overtake another vehicle.
I find it annoying it a slow driver forces to put my life at risk by overtaking them
@@andrewstorm8240 it can be annoying.. I just tend to sit back and go slowly behind them for a while until they turn off
@@andrewstorm8240 Bit extreme. If you overtake properly, you're not putting your life at risk are you?
A reasonable concern. Your spacing to the car in front is then important as it should allow someone behind to make two safe overtakes rather than be pressed into a more risky double move.
@@paulharrison6385 Very true. Another reason not to be a tailgater!
It’s always good to see Ash using lights/horn as they are supposed to be used. I’ve adopted the horn technique to alert people who I think may not have seen me, short ‘friendly’ beeps, but the problem I find is that a lot of people take light flashing/horn use as a trigger to get all ragey. A pity.
That's the problem. People associate flashing lights and beeping horn as aggressive. I'd rather not do it. I did once and the driver took the hump and drove right my back end .... Awful situation to be in.
I'd love the optics of using the horn to change, but I won't risk the road rage that could come from it. For things like blind approaches and narrow bridges though, I think it's suitable.
I know right? I was giving the clear signal to overtake by waving a clenched fist out my window at the car in front of me and they got all agressive about it.
There was no need to flash that Ford on the dual carriageway 😂
This is the problem with horn/light use. It may be in the highway code, but their use in these overtaking scenarios is not common, therefore I wouldn't do it as I think it causes more confusion and potential anger than not using them.
I’ve been taught 2 second gap while planning the overtake. 1 second gap is your overtake position. The overtake position gives you a safe distance to carry out the manoeuvre but most importantly, the thinking distance to abort if required. I have however, been trained to Road Craft therefore, it may be different in the ADI world when teaching students etc.
I’m also A Fleet trainer and I’m well versed in Roadcraft. Like I say in the video if you can’t overtake from two seconds back you shouldn’t overtake. Many people think techniques used by the police are needed in general driving, and they’re not.
@@ashley_neal I totally agree with you and I am an IAM member myself, well versed in Roadcraft. The latest version of Roadcraft goes into a lot more detail on overtaking and it's pretty useful.
Thank you ashley for this video..made me realise that 90% of the overtakes i have done were generally not worth with the power of hindsight..Unfortunately pressure from tailgaters etc sometimes makes us overtake with no need.
On the flip side, pull in once in a while! I was driving on some 'fun' roads and a load of MX5's come up behind me...I pulled in when I could, got a few beeps and a thanks as they passed and we all continued happy
Likewise I was approaching some car in the distance, enjoying the roads, and they pulled in a parking spot, I continued passed then they pulled out again...I thanked them and it just makes driving so much better!
Good point at around 2:50 about seeing the vehicle you've overtaken in both the middle and left mirror before moving back in. I find far too many drivers quite needlessly cut in too early after an overtake. This has become so commonplace now that it's practically become the norm. So much so that if one actually does it properly, it's almost as though anyone behind thinks you are not going to move back in....and no doubt labels you as a lane hogger.
I often find myself having to cover the brake when someone moves in too early, as I begin to wonder if they are about to brake test me in some kind of crash for cash attempt. Plus, my view ahead is restricted until the overtaker moves ahead further, especially if it's an SUV or van. It's even worse when someone cuts in when the road surface is wet, sending spray onto my windscreen (and headlights). It also increases the risk of a chipped windscreen / paintwork / headlights etc from loose debris.
I find it quite unbelievable that so may drivers do this and think it's perfectly normal. I've also seen YT video whereby if a vehicle cuts in too early on a modern HGV, it sets off the autonomous braking & an audiable alarm. In addition to the dangers of doing this, it must be extremely frustrating for an HGV driver to experience this repeatedly on a journey, Yet it's something that could so easily be avoided if the overtaker were to simply pull further ahead before moving back in to the left.
Good advice, but be aware that flashing headlights/using the horn either prior to or during an overtake is now actively discouraged in police driver training UNLESS it benefits the situation, which on most occasions it doesn't. An example would be if the driver in front appears distracted. Otherwise, the risk of confusing the situation outweighs the potential benefits. This from a class 1 driving instructor...
Wasn't that what I did?
You'd only flash someone if they're drifting across into your lane or if they're in the outside lane not actually overtaking the traffic
I disagree. I have a Class 1. A proper one. We were taught that you always light them up. Particularly when you are on 2 wheels.
@@easyspanieltraining They taught you how to ride a motorbike in your class 1, wow. That being said, things do change. I think that flashing will be seen as aggressive or indicating a problem with the average driver these days 😖
@@TheRoverspeed wow? Clearly you don't know what a class 1 is. So what if other motorists meaning you, perceive it as aggressive. What are your driving antecedents apart from passing a basic test?
Autocar published a guide to overtaking about 20 year's ago, which I have always followed, and found it very helpful, and a non stressful way to make progress when the the circumstances present themselves.
Glad to Ashley see doing the same, would have been mortified if I had been doing this wrong all those years!
I find it bewildering and frustrating that some motorists get extremely offended at being overtaken, especially when they are driving much slower than the speed limit and it is a good, wide, clear road. I've been flashed and gesticulated at for safe and legal overtaking manoeuvres and even had the overtaken vehicle speed up and tailgate me. Anyway, a good demonstration, as always, of patient overtaking and thought process.
yeah, in my biking days I found quite a few drivers didn't like being overtaken by motorbikes; they'd aggressively speed up when I tried to pass
I've had a man in his 60s (at least) shaking his head and gesturing because I tried to overtake on the motorway of all roads - it wasn't as if it was quiet either, there were other cars passing too. The mind boggles at the insecurity.
Tip: if you are moving slowly and you are holding a lot of traffic on a busy road, pull over when it's safe, like a layby or even a side road (if you can turn around, which is useful to cyclists), to avoid frustration as drivers may overtake if its dangerous. This also applies to cyclists. 4:15 would be useful for cyclists as they are very flexible, but not tractors.
It sounds sensible but from my experience your average cyclist would be appalled at the idea of moving over to let a car pass.
Not really@@bobsmith-dn1xw, but the average cyclist does experence alot of intimidation from drivers on nearly every trip. That makes for a defensive outlook.
Also getting a cycle back up to speed takes actual physical effort, more than the effort required to just keep moving, and way more than the effort to push the pedals in your car.
Unfortunately a lot of people aren’t as considerate as that.
Joking aside, one of the things I find disappointing on the roads these days is how many drivers think that overtaking is bad, full stop. I do overtake carefully, when its safe and worth it - but all too often the person being overtaken takes exception, flashes you, or speeds up during the overtake to try to foil you. Sad .....
The old 'they've found the accelerator!' when you go to overtake - does my head in!
That's why I drive up behind them as if I'm going to ram them, then swing round after a last check. If they accelerate then cool, I haven't even left the correct side of the road, thanks for speeding up so I don't need to pass. They won't keep up with a 15 mph speed differential.
Not Ashley Neal approved but if I try overtaking from 3rd at 27 mph from 2 second gap, I'm going to spend way too long on the wrong side of the road and the chance that another car is coming increases. Whereas if I use second gear, build up to 40 behind them and pull round - with my foot pinned to the floor the whole time - racing gear change if I hit 55. Then the overtake is completed in about 5 seconds.
@@TimpBizkit Ironically, the advice in roadcraft is still to drive closer than the 2 second following distance when intending to overtake to alert the person to your desire to overtake.
@@JulianShagworthy nah, id city car. that is never going round, EVER! although most have 2.0L nowadays but the point still stands that most people dont have cars able to just hang back for ages before overtaking, even dropping down a gear, it just takes ages to catch up to them before you can even go around!
Nicely done, I find most roads, especially with hedgerows that block view, aren't too suitable for overtaking and I'm waiting behind slower drivers for a long time. Always a bit exciting making an overtake but perhaps that's the boy racer in me.
I overtake people sometimes as practise , usually when it's quieter and I know the road layout, as I noticed a while ago I would forget a shoulder check which used to annoy me as I could easily wipe out a bike and ruin a whole lot of everything . So sometimes I'd go to overtake but complete a personal check list which has now become 2nd nature to me. The greatest barrier drivers face, especially in England, is the perceived arrogance of an overtaking driver as opposed to a driver who is able to perform more advanced driving techniques to aid their own and others progress on the road .
Side note: Mentioning the distance from the car infront, I always see queues of drivers behind farm vehicles mainly because the 1st vehicle following is within 4 meters of the large farm vehicle and can't see . That extra space gives time to speed up and see further down. Good vid as always Ash !
know your car and your own ability and on country twisty roads go for s overtake coming out of a right hand bend as you see if the road is clear sooner and allways dro a couple of gears as you go into the bend ready to speed out of it and get the job done swiftly and safrly
I was taught to drive by an ex police advanced driver. And the most important thing they said was to make it that you are on the wrong side of the road for as little time as possible. Anticipate the conditions use the 2 second gap to get up to speed in a lower gear and make the pass, and be prepared to bail out and slow back down.
But this apparently is no longer the case as most idiots now sit as close to the car/lorry in front. Then just pull out in a high gear with no momentum and take an age to try and get past
Think you mean ex serving police not ex serving themselves, in other words you don't become an ex advanced driver looool
Ah I just added a comment about aborting the move or bailing out. Hadn’t read all the comments. Looks like one other person in same boat as me. I think it can be right to do!
Actually a great point I forgot in my spiel above, we position ourselves THEN accelerate so it's easy to abort if we need to.
@@marklittler784 yes but you got the point they were fully trained but no longer in the force
Yes, in my IAM course I was taught that an almost motorway-style “flying” overtake is much safer, as it not only minimises time exposed to danger, but also doesn’t really leave any opportunity for the guy you’re passing to drop a gear and make things awkward.
A long run up with at least a 20mph speed difference and good offside visibility was always preferable, as you could easily pick out your tuck-in spot (great when overtaking a line of cars) and it’s also easy to abort if required - what’s rare was finding a straight road that is long enough to do it.
Second best option was using the 2 second gap to move slightly offside, build the speed difference and identify a return point. Aborting was always a little untidy.
Sitting on their shoulder at the same speed and accelerating as you pass was always a terrible idea.
Look were you go. It's so often excluded from car training. You want to move left, look left. It's really simple. When moving back in, look left. Not just the mirror, but the blind spot. "How could there possibly be something there? That's an unnecessary check.", trust me, some day you WILL find someone or something has appeared there. Less so on fast flowing roads, but 100% every single time I move left or right I check my blindspot and in urban environments, commuting in/through the city, there is something there every single morning.
Ok, having watched this I feel pretty happy that I wasn't being overly cautious and that many people are just making risky overtakes.
I would think that just as there are people who don't know how to be overtaken, there are those whose overtaking leaves a lot to be desired. How often have I said out loud, 'No way would I try that there'. Mostly, they get away with it, but that does not make it an example worthy of following.
@@PedroConejo1939
They usually get away with it when the vehicle being overtaken slams on just to let them pass. I swear there are so many people who don't accelerate when overtaking it's ridiculous. Or motorways, when people get past you, stop accelerating, pull back in front and then accelerate again. It's an obvious staged process that's alarming to say the least as they don't seem capable of doing more than one thing at a time.
I had a scary overtake once: I drove behind a big truck driving around 5-10mph on a limit of 30mph. Everything was okay for an overtake, but what I did not think about was that the road was just getting a downward inclination of a few %. Behind myself was a few card.
I started my overtake normally, but just as I start the cars behind close in, the truck starts to accelerate to 30mph and I get vision of a few cars on the opposite lane in the distance. As I tried to hold myself to the speed limit of 30mph, I could not overtake that truck. I could also not get back to my side as there were cars there now. In order to prevent a collision with the oncoming car, in my mind I had to accelerate to about 50mph to get past that truck. No crash happened as the oncoming vehicle saw the overtake from a distance and stopped to let more space.
Looking back the other alternative would been to brake and wait for a spot to get back to my position but a few spots behind in cars. But in that situation, as it had never happened to me before and I was still a new driver, the only thing I was thinking in my mind was that "if I don't speed over the speed limit, then a crash will happen".
*So... be careful even when everything checks out to be ideal for an overtake*
It's an issue that comes up quite often when you're trying to overtake somebody who is driving really slowly through the corners on a twisty road.
Personally I sometimes employ a 'slingshot manoeuvre' to minimise exposure to oncoming traffic. The involves slowing down before a corner to give the car in front some extra space, allowing you to then coast through the corner carrying a bit more speed than if you were stuck following at a constant 2 seconds behind. You can then accelerate out at corner exit, and follow into an overtake if the road is clear along the straightaway. Or otherwise back out of it again if not safe, and set yourself up for the next corner.
And the cars behind just left you exposed. Sounds about right.
Isn't there a Highway Code rule that says you shouldn't speed up when being overtaken? Not that many people would keep to it.....
@@cmartin_ok Not sure, but I think there is one saying to allow overtaking vehicles back in and keep a safe distance.
This is why you are taught on police driving courses to use 50/50 of the road to get a view, if cars are behind you as this situation can happen and leave you exposed. Never commit to an overtake unless it is 100%
Definitely don't flash your lights. Ashley's videos are generally superb but unsure why he keeps suggesting people do this. Regardless of whether you're officially suppose to do it, it will almost always be perceived as road rage, which is dangerous.
It's to warn people you are doing something, so that they don't suddenly get scared or something. Similar to beeping the horn on a blind bend to warn people you are coming 👍
I thought this was overkill too
Generally someone flashing at you whilst overtaken is being aggressive so I would never do it or advise anyone do it.
Agree with Draggon - many drivers take it as a sign of aggression / intimidation of the driver overtaking and may do something rash like blocking the car from overtaking
100% agree. I hate the idea that we should do this thing in driving because "that's what you're supposed to do" without thinking how the average driver would react to it.
Excellent demonstration. I rarely find it worthwhile to overtake inside a city as we'll all meet again at the next traffic lights. This is a much more complicated maneuver than the parking one we all get tested on to get our licences; go figure.
very good. also the white lines can aid you. long with small gaps = dodgy. small with long gaps = ideal. Following the excellent tutorial by Ashley, of course.
On a motorbike i was told to: Look ahead, Look behind, Life save, Move to the other lane to have a clear View of trafic ahead, if ok to overtake turn on indicator start overtaking, if not come back to lane if overtake, when Overtaking give space , and only pul back into lane when i can see the full overtaken vehicle in the mirror.
I do tend to make decent progress on country roads, especially those I am familiar with. So I do my fair share of overtaking, I am in an older fairly light 1.8 na petrol car these days, after downsizing from a 2.0 TDI Insignia. So I do miss the mid range grunt. Let me be clear, I don't make risky overtaking manoeuvres, just normal safe ones that are well sighted and judged. On occasion I have overtaken multiple vehicles with care and issues. The thing that surprises me the most is how little other road users do overtake, even those that tend to speed. Overtaking really is a lost art these days 😞
that is because to many drivers are not confident in there own ability to drive with confidence
Things you must think about when overtaking. The speed of the vehicle your overtaking. The speed of your vehicle and are you up to doing the most dangerous manouver you will ever attempt. The speed of seen or unseen vehicle. If your overtaking legally at 60mph, and an oncomming vehicle is doing 60mph The combine speed is 120mph. The oncoming vehicle will be on you alot sooner than you think. Finally the most import thing you must consider. "Do you really need to do it"
5:45 - Over this end of Europe it is more like "act now, regret later". Meaning that most overtakes I am subjected to are dangerous, and on top of me cooperating in a successful overtake I need to brake or veer outwards so that the one committing the overtake could finish it. This is what really grinds my gears. That now, I need to do my own overtake from another car's POV, which would be somewhat interesting as one can get experience in how another car behaves. But there is the human side; I do not know how the other person reacts. That is the biggest risk, one that I loath the most.
Being transparent, calculating, taking measures before taking risks is the golden standard many don't seem to get. We can all get by and reach our destinations, without killing one another.
I often find that these days with the shear volume of cars on the road that there is little to no advantage on overtaking 'slower' vehicles. It's often the case those who are in a rush and overtake (most of the time quite dangerously), I and other slower vehicles catch up to them due to an even slower vehicle up ahead, i.e. a lorry, tractor, etc. and/or we come upon a more built up area such as a village, town, etc.
25mph in a 60 ain’t no one got time for that
All depends on the length of the journey. Obviously not worth overtaking on the way to the shops, but if it’s a 4 hour drive through a rural area I’m overtaking anything and everything in my path
@@tomparsons5096 Spoken like a true BMW owner/fan ;)
@@thecraigmachine69 damn straight 😉
Good advice from Ashley. I would add if you are not intending to overtake then do not tail gate the vehicle in front because that forces the person behind you, who wants to progress, to overtake 2 or more vehicles in one go.
Thanks Ashley for high lighting the need to leave room BEFORE pulling in after an overtake. It completely P's me off when I am overtaken then the other vehicle pulls in too soon robbing my stopping distance.
Once they are done with overtaking, they should be travelling faster than you (significantly perhaps) and that 2 second gap will soon be restored. Plus, if they have just overtaken there should be very few hazards ahead. If there are any, they will arrive at them first and faster, taking longer to stop. I don't see any reason to be "completely P's off". Sure, a bigger gap is better but logically, there is not too much increased risk to get triggered about.
My scenario of course assumes once done they have a nice clear road ahead, if they are queue-jumping, then by all means ram the *******!🤣
@@peterthompson9854 soon restore the 2 second gap!! Shouldn't pull in before that is in place, otherwise it's an unsafe overtake. Why should the overtaken need to slow down to regain the safe gap, also affecting those behind! Most of these are on motorways when there is absolutely NO excuse the pull in too soon.
@@malcolm6951 Your talking about Motorways. Sorry, I understand your annoyance in this scenario, because there isn't that differential in speed ...mostly 1-2 mph.. Thought you were on a country-type road. Even then, close pull ins are not great.
The decision to overtake is made early but may never present itself. View is everything and most drivers fail to use the road space that is available to them. Nearside, offside, through the other vehicle's windscreen, looking under the vehicle etc can all provide valuable insight into traffic conditions ahead. Things such as hedgerows, telegraph poles can all provide information as to where the road MIGHT go - telling you that there could be a straight after the next bend - that COULD be an overtaking opportunity - although as many a police advanced driver discovered there are roads where the telephone poles disappear into fields - squeaky backsides at high speeds.
My key observation here is your distance from the vehicle ahead - I'd be looking to close the gap in anticipation of performing the overtake thus minimising the time taken to pass - but that's how I was trained
First Road is really hard to perform a safe overtake, I know it well. Glad to see that I adopt a reasonable approach to overtaking in that I don't change lane until I can see the car in both left and middle mirrors. that being said, there is always something to learn from your videos! 👍
Also bear in mind that if you're north of about Sheffield the car you're overtaking will change down two gears and accelerate hard as you try to get past. Leave extra room and anticipate the likely performance of their vehicle when planning the move.
Had this situation once, a car then came the other way and I was stuck, JUST got back but not before I was milimetres from a big accident
This is particularly common in Leeds when they will also give you additional hand signals
Its not just in the UK. It can be like that here in NZ too. Some people think that overtaking them is a personal insult.
However, if it means they get their toe down and drive a bit quicker, I'm happy to drop back behind. Then go again when they spool back down to their natural cruising speed again.
I'm saving fuel much more than I used to so overtaking doesn't happen very often for me these days. One thing I do when it becomes necessary, that wasn't mentioned, is pay attention to the length of the lines in the road. As far as I'm concerned, overtaking on the longer lines (not solid, which is illegal), is a no-go. Sometimes it's obvious why they're there, but equally, sometimes it's an unseen hazard. Short lines don't necessarily mean it's clear of course, there are all the other considerations, but with overtaking, I'm looking for reasons to _not_ overtake rather than reasons to do it. Never be afraid to abort the acceleration run if something crops up or becomes marginal; it means you've made an error in planning but no need to compound it.
Some drivers react very badly when overtaken, even if it was perfect in every respect.
right now, if I'm going down the road, I burn $5.50 worth of fuel every 10 minutes. gives me an incentive to not be stuck behind someone who is loitering along at 30-40 MPH in a 55 MPH limit.
@@kenbrown2808 I've never heard of fuel-burn being measured by the hour except by Airbus and Boeing. We measure in miles per gallon here and that figure increases (ie. burns less) as speed decreases. I have a 2.0 litre diesel estate and recently got 70.5 mpg by sticking (mostly) to 56 mph GPS on a long run. My average is 52-56 mpg per tank with mixed driving. That means I am driving for longer but use less fuel to travel the same distance. I choose that speed as optimum because most wagons are restricted to that and it means I'm not holding anyone up on a motorway, while simultaneously not requiring me to speed up to pass someone very often.
@@PedroConejo1939 MPG is our default metric, too. but in tracking MPG, I saw a reverse relationship between speed and fuel consumption, that added up to the determination that fuel burn per hour is actually a more accurate measure. in fact, during a a few days of limited maximum fuel flow (filter unit issues) I learned, that it actually takes more fuel flow for me to accelerate from 30-35 MPH than it takes to climb an upgrade at 55 MPH.
this is why in the US, cars' declared fuel economy has separate city vs freeway numbers.
If the car in front is going too slow you must, check the mirrors, use lower gears to overtake, then indicate, move out keeping correct separation distance. Don't make any rash decisions so when safe to do so ram the car in front briskly up the arse, and guide the spandex hero on the bike into the hedge.
I would only use my indicators if I have someone who needs to know. The position of my vehicle tells the vehicle I'm overtaking, what my intent is (which is also a Blue Light technique incidentally), and naturally because I am leaving that vehicle behind I don't need to indicate to pull back in.
I would indicate to pull out if the vehicle because appeared to have a similar intent by their position in the road or proximity to me, because they 'do' need to know. The way I was taught was indicate if there is someone you need to indicate too, your observations (Information in IPSGA), give you that information. Information, Positions, Speed, Gear, Acceleration. So for the overtake, Information = Mirrors, left right checks and 'have I the space to complete the move in the distance I can see to be clear doubled?' Position = good view to plan the overtake which can be slightly over the centre line to improve visibility as long as your initial visibility is enough to ensure that is safe. Speed is the speed you are accelerating from in this case. Gear is ensure you are in the right gear to accelerate, then accelerate round the vehicle.
We even use this for corners, as Accelerate is 'using your accelerator to manage your speed' so in a corner would be a constant speed using a small amount of accelerator to balance the car.
Incidentally as advanced drivers we have two positions, off hand I can't remember the first position's name, but following is a good name and is about 4 seconds back. It's signalling to the vehicle ahead we have no intent of overtaking. Contact is about 2s back and indicates to the vehicle ahead we intend to make progress, if on a blue light run our position then indicates HOW we are doing that progress. The Following and contact positions can be used in normal driving and I love the 4s gap for following as it gives more space to use accelerator sense to adjust speed which is smoother than jumping on the brakes all the time.
I tend not to overtake anymore because ive only been passed my test just over 8 months ago and when i came to a situation where i wanted to overtake a lorry ( something i never did while learning) i tried overtaking in 5th when i should have definitely change down to 3rd. During my overtake i noticed a car came around the corner of a roundabout and i was very close to a collision. I lucky passed both the lorry and oncoming car without a hit, it shook me up has it was my first overtake and i messed it up, i was braking hard while on that same roundabout the oncoming car justed left. I definitely learned from my mistake and think twice about overtaking, i don't do it any more unless i absolutely have too.
Ex driving instructor here. It's sad but hardly anyone gets taught how to overtake at speed. It is often difficult to find opportunities, I've been lucky in the locations I taught in, and it takes a few practices to get it right. I used a very wide straight 60mph (newish) road between 2 roundabouts, and would hope to find a slower vehicle BUT if not, we would simulate overtaking if safe and quiet, showing MSM points, a 'box' overtake 'assess' position, acceleration, MSM and back to left. Could go up and down the stretch repeatedly. It's important to avoid the 'accelerate in hope', get too close, swoop out - then nowhere to go if you realise too late there was a good reason to wait.
It is the most dangerous manoeuvre and the least taught.
You obviously learnt a valuable lesson, but as you gain experience, why not practice, even pretending, these skills, including the gear downshift, and you will be better prepared in every sense next time. Don't be afraid to change your mind as you 'box out" and have that good look ahead before pressing 'go'. Be aware of followers closing your return space though, they don't expect an abandon and return manoeuvre.
Hi Jamie,its good you're watching Ash's videos. Don't be discouraged from overtaking because it didn't go well that first time. Go out and practice, maybe get an experienced driver to sit in with you. Practice the steps Ash goes through, and get some successfull overtakes behind you.
It can be pretty stressful when you're in the early days after passing your test, and knowing you can overtake safely when you want to is one way to reduce that stress and build your confidence.
First step in overtaking is to put on Bob Seger - Shakedown. Make sure to turn it off once the maneuver is complete.
This was an eye-opener for me, all this time I've been following the car in front bumper to bumper, overtaking in fifth gear, two miles per hour faster than the ones I'm overtaking.
It's been a bit tricky on those pesky blind bends and corners, never seen a accident in my rear view mirrors, at least not since I had them removed from the car by an oncoming lorry.
Did you ever get driving lessons?
@@mikehunter2844
Swooosh, went right over your head mate.
The overtaking culture in Malaysia has always been about going back into the lane by being too close to the car that has already been overtaken. Generally, I would do it only if the car I'm overtaking is only visible in the side mirror in its entirety. I would like to do it when the car is visible in the rear view mirror but would leave too much space for speeders to take my intended lane as they see me as "holding them up" (as I mostly stick to the speed limit).
In the future, I might save footage from my dashcam to send to you, Ash, if only to show you the difference in driving cultures despite our driving laws being similar.
In my lower powered car, the technique is to start with the two second gap. Then floor it in the lowest gear that does not exceed the rev limiter. Do one last check as you are about 2-3 car lengths behind the driver in front, then pull out (or brake if dangerous and you need to abort) - watching your tachometer in the peripheral so you don't waste time bouncing off the rev limiter and shift up at the prescribed 6400 rpm on my car. Then wait until you're 3 car lengths ahead and pull back in.
This was the method taught many moons ago when cars had less acceleration. Nowadays, with quicker modern cars , I think the recommended method is Ashley's way. It negates the risk of higher closing speeds with the vehicle in front. Your method requires you to judge when the gap will be there while taking into account your own acceleration, plus you are pulling out from a closer position where you have less vision.
That's the reason, but I, for one, would certainly not say you were wrong to do it your way in your lower powered car. It has a fair few advantages too.
Although my boy racer days are a distant memory I feel safer to overtake when driving a vehicle with decent power/torque...... It enables you to accomplish the manoeuvre in a shorter distance and time. Of course, there are a few vehicles that just cannot be used to overtake anything; such as the Citroen 2CV. Those have a zero to 60 time - best measured with a Sundial 😁.
Knowing your vehicle's capability counts for a lot. I've nearly been involved (as a passenger) in one or two close calls by a driver of limited abilities who very nearly caused a head-on collision and we are talking bare centimetres between ☠ or survival. I never travelled with that bloke again.
Stay safe everyone 👍
agree with all you say a lot of drivers today have zero road craft to busy listening to loud music and watching sat navs all the time
i used to have a rubbish little 1.2 that would make safe overtakes very challenging
I was surprised Ashley was even considering an overtake on Catchdale Moss Lane in the first part of the video. Although a country road, it’s very winding, narrow, busy and almost always too short to make an overtake worthwhile.
Leading to a dual carriageway, you know there’s a opportunity to much more safely get ahead later. Glad to see it wasn’t attempted. As a nearby resident, I’m aware of a lot of heavy crashes and fatalities on that particular road.
He was making a demonstration video, so needed to talk about when and when not to, following position etc. I don't think he was ever actually considering an overtake.
Tell me I am wrong, but if I am planning an overtake on a stretch that I know and there is a car behind me also itching for an over-take, I will put my indicator on for three blinks, to show to the car behind that I have an intention to overtake and that I'm not just sitting behind the slow moving vehicle. This helps them plan too.
The three blinks of the indicator is commonly used in rural areas to say, "It's clear ahead if you wish to overtake" especially used by HGVs.
@@JulianShagworthy ah! Never heard of this. Is this the case even if you're not "the leader of the pack"?
@@WatchesOnWood I'm not sure about the etiquettes and whatnot, but I've only ever done it when I'm the leader, slow, and it's difficult for people to see past me!
A Clean overtake will not affect any other vehicles, pedestrians, cyclists etc so shouldn't be seen as a negative, just someone whose progressing their journey.
agreed
Only criticism is failing to explain the slingshot technique, follow and advance position. I’m not 100% sure what car Ashley is in here however it seems to have a decent amount of power. The slingshot is typically winding the power on early so when the view comes, you can move onto the other side of the road with a substantial amount of speed on the car you’re overtaking. This allows you to get out and back in quickly. The follow position is the 2 second time gap however the advance (overtaking) position is a little closer. As you explained, there is typically no need to be in this position unless you’re a emergency services driver. I use this position in unison with the slingshot technique as it was how I was taught by my dad (dad is a Grade A advanced police driver). You never follow in this position however when overtaking you do take this position. Great watch as always Ashley!
I believe it a golf gti, I’d argue if your In A rush to tuck back in, infront of the car your overtaking it’s not a safe overtake.
Ashley I find your gear choices interesting. I guess it is different for each car, but some would criticise you drive in too high a gear at a normal speed in order to save fuel. A few times you said you were dropping into fourth, I would've only been at fourth at that speed anyway. But I can't tell from behind my keyboard. It's worth a reminder to other drivers not to sit in too high a gear as you will be labouring your engine too much, especially if aiming to accelerate anytime soon. Not to mention it will mean you have less control of the car when it comes to braking too. The best way I measure it in my car (320i) is sitting between 1500-2000 rpm on flat ground. But more like 2000-2500 on slightly inclined or declined roads. 2000-3000 on steeper roads. Once you're used to it you just know by the sound of the engine without looking at the rev counter. I'm sure Ashley knows his car well and was in control but thought it was worth a reminder to other drivers of manual cars.
Unless you know the gearing of the transmission and the power/torgue curve of the engine in question these numbers are fairly meaningless.
It's worth noting that the current GTi has a *six* speed gearbox.
In Manchester using a gear higher than 4 is frowned upon
When you’re learning you don’t get much practice at overtaking so I’ve had to learn the hard way and from my mistakes. Things I’ve learned is when you know it’s 100% clear don’t hesitate, the earlier you overtake the better. Know how powerful your car is and overtake in third gear (my car pulls in 3rd). Never overtake on bends or over hills.
Can you overtake in 4th gear? Does it have to be 3rd?
you should start an overtake in one gear below your cruising gear. your cruising gear will vary. when my daily was still configured lightly, it's preferred overtake was to release the torque converter, drop two gears, spool up the turbocharger, take one gear back, and lock the torque converter back in. this would take all of a second and a half for it to do. now it's carrying a bit more weight, and it has adapted to just drop one gear, most of the time.
It very much depends. You need to be in a low enough gear to be able to accelerate quickly through the overtake; however, you don't really want to be so low a gear that the engine runs out of puff and you have to change up part way through the overtake (if you are driving a manual), as it is not advisable to take one hand off the wheel whilst on the "wrong" side of the road. The car will be slightly more unstable as you will have a camber going the opposite way to what you are used to.
If you are driving an auto box, it is good to manually select the gear before you start the overtake. It is also worth popping the box in to Sport mode.
based on my experiences on the A1/A1(M) and various motorways (the only places I can regularly do overtaking), either modern cars are severely underpowered, or people drive them as if they're 44 ton wagons; so many drivers of relatively small vehicles take absolutely ages to pass the vehicle they're overtaking
Perhaps it's cos we are all paranoid about doing 70.5mph and getting caught. I feel that the blanket and absolute enforcement of speed limits has cause pockets of congestion where everyone is doing 69.5-70.5mph, 2 meters from each others bumpers. When cars were doing between 60-90mph this didn't happen. The speed differentials created it's own spacing, and you watched your mirror more.
@@peterthompson9854 if that's the case, then their fears are unfounded on the A1/A1(M) between Donny and Newark, which has very few speed cameras, and is also a real hotspot for pathetic overtaking
Admit it, you just don't like being behind silvery coloured cars!🤦🤣😸
My only concern over flashing the headlights is that it alone is enough to trigger a "hothead", then what began as a simple overtake now becomes a perceived challenge by the hotheaded driver you're overtaking. It's a bit of a toss-up between safety in alerting the other driver to your presence, and triggering them into a challenge to a duel.
I can't disagree with anything you say, but I do know that most drivers will interpret flashing lights or horn sounding from someone overtaking to be an act of aggression. They'll assume they've annoyed you in some way, and if they've done nothing wrong, it might trigger them into an aggressive response.
I realise you're doing things correctly, but most people seem to drive like racing drivers prior to overtaking: They hang on the rear of the car in front, with a slight rightwards positioning, and wait for a suitable clear run ahead, at which point they hammer it and race off into the distance to try and vindicate their decision to overtake.
By leaving a gap in front, drivers behind will assume you have no intention of overtaking and overtake you to occupy the two-second gap you've left between you and the car in front.
There's a lot to be said for adopting a zen-like chill and being happy driving slightly slower than you might otherwise have driven behind a slow vehicle.
I totally agree.
Public information messages - those were the days ...
Been driving for 17 years. Only realised now we can overtake other than just Motorways.
Are you sure it's not 17 seconds😂
@@JohnFarrell-bc8gt honesty how can they not know the obvious...
@@aggrodriver Yes, hard to believe, especially 17years driving.
@Ashley Neal
Great info and it would be wonderful if everyone Joe Public was as diligent
Remember my ADT course in south wales and was told by retired blue light instructor; that if a clear straight road, mirror position speed and IF necessary position 3&4 to finalise the look and IF STILL CLEAR then overtake
If not the drop back to position 2 ( on a straight road of course) and back on drive and continue
Do you run ADT courses for anyone other than trainee driving instructors?
Thanks
Jonathan
French version : Drive up the car in front's backside. Wait until there's no gap, then overtake at the last second, barely missing the back bumper of the car you're overtaking then cutting in quickly whilst speeding off at light speed. ;)
Always calm, collected and controlled..... which is a shame because I reckon you'd be really good at Road Rage 🤣
Great stuff as usual
Can I ask why you flash the lights when doing the overtake? Given that you say to try and avoid flashing as it can be confusing to other road users.
Wouldn't it be better to use the horn?
@@1stwalker or do neither? If it's a normal overtake there is no need for either flashing lights or using the horn. I find it odd that flashing the lights is mentioned.
Depends on the situation. As Ashley demonstrated, he did two overtakes, one using a flash, one without.
Having done a Bike Safe course with North Yorkshire police last Sunday, they said officially, a quick flash is in the guide, but it's not something they would recommend you do. At least not in most situations.
@@RichO1701e That's a fair enough summary I think. I have to say personally in over 20 years of driving I cannot recall someone flashing me whilst performing an overtake.
It's in the Highway Code - assuming of course that you know what that is...?
For hidden junctions - sat nav can be useful for planning a potential overtake.
Only rely on what you can see - not sat nav - Yes it could be useful also for assessing the severity of upcoming bends but still make sure you rely on what you see, and if there is any doubt that the overtake isn't on then don't take it like you saw hidden junctions, look for gaps in hedges, powerlines across the road, dropped kerbs, dirt marks from agricultural vehicles etc, finger boards, lots of clues
@@Sellinglobs I did say “a useful source of information “ - no sane person would rely solely on their satnav. As you correctly say there are many other clues, but some entries are totally hidden with no clues, so use all the info available to you.
@@Sellinglobs I did say “a useful source of information “ - no sane person would rely solely on their satnav. As you correctly say there are many other clues, but some entries are totally hidden with no clues, so use all the info available to you.
It's just a method of informing another road user that you are there. Consider a dual carriageway where you are doing seventy and approaching a line of vehicles doing sixty. There's a chance a driver ( ? German car not usually equipped with indicators) will suddenly pull out to overtake. Not a flash but a couple of seconds of main beam might draw his attention. Still be ready to slow down as apart from no indicators there may be no mirrors.
On a busy motorway all cars would have full beams on. Don't think it's a good idea. Looking in the rear and side view mirror could obstruct your vision as it would to oncoming vehicles on a single carriageway. They should never be used if there's a vehicle in any of the lanes in front of you.
Yes it did make sense, thanks very much.
A key point is the performance of your own car.
There are overtakes I would do in my Exige I wouldn't even consider in the wife's Land Rover, or even my old Golf.
Do I detect a little stealth boast there?
@@bobsmith-dn1xw I mean if you consider an 18k Lotus a boast, sure. It's hardly a Ferrari.
But sure, continue being toxic online. See how fulfilled that makes you.
I don't often feel the need to overtake anything anything other than a bike or horse, but I tend to feel pressured to overtake a slow driver when a queue is building up behind me and I'm being tail-gated.
I just don't want to deal with someone attempting to overtake multiple cars.
By leaving a 2 second gap, you give the tailgater the option to overtake you first.
There's a reason for the rhyme 'It's number two who makes the queue'. If you don't want to pass, and don't want to hold others up, back off, keep left leave a big gap, and let the others go.
A glance at the sat- nav can be a useful tool for mapping out the road ahead.
As always a useful addition Jon 👊
dont use sat nav in this way
@@ivorjones6618 Reason?
@@Jonc25 sat nav for finding destination not looking at road thats what windscreen for in factyou dont need sat navs at all just learn to read a mapit is easyer and safer
@@ivorjones6618 I'm sure I've done my share of map reading Ivor.
As a retired driving instructor I have always taught a 4 second gap should be maintained at all times. The two second rule does not allow for the one second from seeing problem to the time you start applying the brake, leaving you only one second for braking
I take it you don't live in the southeast of England then? A 4 second rule would mean we'd rarely go above 30 mph. There just isn't enough road space to drive that far apart.
Look at the gap that Ashley uses in this video. A 4 second gap gives you better forward vision and more time to read and plan the speed that is safe.
I drive in the South East. Yes, I see a huge number of people breaking the two second rule, but that is *their* problem. I am in control of my vehicle and I intend to drive safely, safely to protect me. If they chose not to, that is their choice, or possibly even their ignorance, and it is they that put themselves at risk. Not my problem!
I don't say to myself "I will violate the two second spacing rule because if I don't violate it, we won't fit all the traffic in on the roads".
@@deang5622 Are you happy when the car behind you driving is too close to ?
@@bobsmith-dn1xw I have driven into London every day for 10 years and maintained the 4 second rule, it did not add any time to my daily drive. I often noted the car in front used their brakes every few seconds because of being too close to the vehicle in front and waste of fuel and damaging to the inviroment!!!
I imagine you would agree since having your Tesla that when in an EV (although I know not in this video), having full power of the car immediately available at any time without needing to select gears, makes overtaking easier and safer.
I have definitely found that since switching to electric a few years back.
That's just high torque and it's the same with any vehicle, good point though. I'm way more confident on the bike with overtakes than I am in the car as the bike just flies with a flick of the wrist. The car... not so much.
@@54356776 It's not just the torque though. Not needing to change gears before or during and the instant response is a big thing also. I remember driving turbo diesels in the past and they have such a short usable power range you sometimes needed to change gear mid overtake. No such issue in an EV.
@@seanbranagh
I don't need to change gears either because of high torque/power and it's the same with any high torque/power vehicle. It's much safer and you feel way more confident when you know you have that extra shove at any speed.
@@54356776 My original point regarding EVs isn't about power and torque though.
We have 2 EVs. A Model 3 and a Leaf.
Yes, the performance of the Tesla makes overtaking a breeze.
Our Leaf has only 109bhp but even in that the power delivery is absolutely instant and uniform making overtaking much easier than in a petrol or diesel car with the same performance figures.
In a manual petrol car with 109bhp that peak power is only available within a very narrow rev range, forcing you to work the gears.
There are no such issues with electric motors.
@@seanbranagh
Yes it is, you just don't want it to be. You feel that EV'S are better but you can't say why. I understand what you're saying, but it is about high torque.
You don't need max power to overtake either, that's just dangerous.
I get it, you're an EV person, but you don't seem to understand the physics of motor vehicles.
Surely if you flash your lights at the vehicle ahead you are alerting them to an issue or worse? I don't understand why you flash your lights before overtaking. I've never heard of that before.
Really? HC says it is a warning to alert others of your presence.
@@asilver2889 if a car behind me flashed his lights I would be thinking I had a light out. Or I was driving too slow for them. Or they wanted me to stop.
And does HC suggest these?
@@CrueLoaf It's not JUST 'flashing 'headlights' though - it would be combined with (possibly) a right signal, plus position and speed. If none of those are also present, maybe there IS some other reason. But at least you would have looked in mirror ....
@@asilver2889 it’s probably me but for the rest of my journey, I’d be wondering what his issue with me was. :)
Great video on overtaking, Ashley. I've had specialist training on overtaking and examination in overtaking techniques to IAM Roadsmart Masters level: what you say and the techniques you use are really sensible. There are circumstances when taking an overtaking position makes sense but I hate seeing drivers rush up too close behind while waiting for an overtake opportunity. Far better to maintain a safe following distance.
I would use the SLAP checklist myself:
- is it Safe?
- is it Legal?
- is it Advantageous?
- how will the overtake affect Perceptions?
I was doing a series of overtakes one time on a country road with long straight stretches. I did my mirror check before an overtake and spotted a guy in a tatty Cavalier storming up behind me. I had recently overtaken him and he was obviously triggered. I aborted my overtake and watched him go past me then do a prolonged multi-car overtake that took him FAR too close to a blind left hander. I deliberately reduced my speed and skipped a couple of overtakes so I did not give him the perception that I was racing him. I was seriously worried that he would cause a head on collision if he felt pushed. Sometimes we have to think of the perceptions of other drivers and plan accordingly.
I really like the way you consider use of the horn and/or a flash of the lights, but decided not to use them as the situation did not demand it. I would use a flash of the lights sometimes too, but only if I thought there was a danger that I had not been observed. Sometimes the horn too, I find a quick double toot rather than an imperious prolonged blast avoids triggering drivers. So you are spot on. Nice one.
And do you agree with Ashley saying undertaking is classed as careless driving?
@@saundersdachicken6197 Ashley did not mention undertaking in this video.
There are circumstances when overtaking on the nearside is specifically allowed in the Highway Code: on a one way street, or in queues of traffic, or when the other vehicle is turning right - if I recall correctly.
However, overtaking on the nearside is discouraged in the Highway Code as it's potentially dangerous. The Police (and the Court) MAY decide it amounts to driving without due care and attention ie careless driving.
@@R04drunner1 Correct he didn't mention undertaking in this video and that is the reason I replied.. On previous videos he criticises those who do it, like what we can see the blue van do.
Yes you can undertake on a one way street, a motorway/dual carraigeway and even a two way street with two lanes in the same direction you are traveling. When it says " when the other vehicle is turning right" that is referring to a street with only one lane in your direction and the vehicle in front of you is turning right .
Undertaking may be discouraged in certain circumstances but is NOT classed as dangerous driving. Don't forget DD is illegal, undertaking is not.
Any manoeuvre that's carried out in an inappropriate way may be classed by the police or the courts as CD or even DD. That includes overtaking, changing lanes, pulling out from a parking position and so on.
So those exceptions that you have given are only advise as nowhere in rule 268 or 163 does it say you must not do it.
It's hard to believe that most drivers think the only way to pass a vehicle that's moving slower in lane 2 or 3 is to move out and pass them on their right, then move back in to lane 1. They actually believe it's the safer option, yet they don't realise that lane changing is one of the leading causes of motorway collisions.
Seriously, would you do that if there was a hogger in lane 2 or 3?
@@mikehunter2844 yes I have moved out from lane 1 to lane 3 to overtake a lane 2 lane hog, then moved back to lane 1 in front of them. Surprising how many take the hint and then move into lane 1, but sadly not all do.
Doing lane changes, you can manage the risk through correct observations, signalling, positioning, speed, gear and acceleration. When passing on the nearside, the control of the risk lies with the lane hog who may well decide to move back to lane 1 without proper checks or signalling because he (or she) does not expect to be passed on the nearside. I know who I'd prefer to be managing risk, and it isn't the person bumbling along displaying their lack of situational awareness!
I was a bit confused by this one. Surely overtaking is a simple thing. It's probably one of those things that is more complicated than you think.
You’d think so, but it’s one of the most dangerous manoeuvres you can make. So much needs be right and you must be Damn certain you can clear it as he demonstrates one silly mistake could be catastrophic
I've given up overtaking during the day. Due to the 'worth it' part which I didn't seem to hear you explain during the video. Between 7am-7pm its just often on the more major A-roads not worth the overtake as you can always gurantee. Your going to get stuck behind another slow mover. Or stuck at the lights where the vehicle you overtook catches you up.
25 years ago I always used to overtake on country roads. But they were empty then. Full now.
To me the most important part of considering an overtake is, 'Is it worthwhile'. If you look carefully at this video after Ashley makes the left turn the car he has overtaken crosses the roundabout about 5 seconds later, net gain 3 seconds. So was the overtake even worthwhile before the planned left turn?
Because it was a demonstration.
@@magikjoe3789 as was my comment
Always give yourself that 2 second run up. It'll give you time to cancel the overtake if something unexpected happens or you see a car you may have missed etc.
I’d like peoples opinions on speed. I often find those drivers that go very slowly around the bends then when you think all the variables are aligned to go past they speed up on a straight section to say 50-55 mph. Of course you could pass at 60 but that feels potentially dangerous often I tend to complete overtakes without looking at my Speedo as all my focus is going on the view ahead for any changes to the conditions. I know here the answer will be if you can’t do it within the speed limit you shouldn’t be doing the overtake but at the next bend and 25 mph again it can be pretty frustrating on a longer A road trip if you are trying to make good progress.
Also would put some hate on the drivers that suddenly speed up when you try to overtake. In my old Skoda Fabia 2007 VRS lots of owners of expensive cars would take issue with being passed by a cheap old box on wheels.
I’d wager that as well intentioned and “by the book” as the headlight flash is here, it’s more likely to be interpreted as an act of frustration than anything else which could cause the driver ahead to become enraged. Perhaps it has the desired effect either way, but do you risk retaliation?
especially on dual carriageway
If the uneducated wish to perceive it in that way, that's their problem.
@@ashley_neal it's interesting point though. If say 70% of drivers are uneducated, perhaps better phrased as unaware, then is it necessary or adding any value. Particularly if you have a clear lane to enter and overtake. I can see the merits of it though if more people were aware and maybe more so at night time, I'm just not sure I'd ever do it.
@THE SLIME HIVE Why do you think I keep showing correct use examples of it?
Ashley, I like you're attitude, but sadly you've not been employed to educate the whole country yet! I wouldn't normally flash like that unless I thought they definitly hadn't seen me for risk of enraging the driver. Can we expect an opinion from you on new cyclist laws?
You should be extra extra careful for bikers who may be catching up very quickly to the car behind you. A quick glance in your rear view mirror may not be sufficient. Bikers in general overtake much quicker than cars.
Totally agree, Mike! The quick look behind over the right shoulder isn’t called a “life saver” for nothing! 👍
Before you overtake, use your right indicator for a few seconds. If a rear biker ignores that, then that's their own stupid fault.
You can't be held responsible for other idiot road users that wilfully chose to ignore your indication. Having said that, you must recognise that wanting to overtake and indicating does not automatically give you the right to overtake.
@@deang5622 You MUST give way to whatever is in the lane you are about to enter.
People driving too slowly or unsure seems to happening a lot more often than it used to. I don't mind people generally being sensible and slowing down around corners if they aren't sure etc. But when the road is 60mph, it's a long clear open road and they're doing 30/40mph you have to question whether they should even be on the road at all.
I cannot remember the last time I did an overtake....
The joys of driving a 450,000 mile van with a 65mph speed limiter. As long as they are doing 50mph or over Im fine I'll stay behind.
Around where I live the council have made it impossible to overtake for mile after mile by changing all the road markings from broken centre lines to a hatched centre with solid lines each side effectively making a three lane width road into two single lanes, everyone's speed is therefore dictated by the driver of slowest vehicle on these roads.
I flash in bad weather conditions, particularly when passing trucks, they may not have seen me pull out with the indicator on due to the spray. Not normally in good weather tho
Flashing your lights. People that are not at your level may not know that this is a friendly signal. In Portugal they use the horn all the time to tell other drivers what they are doing. It works very well once you realise why everyone is honking at you 😂
Personally the flashing of lights to me is always misinterpreted, other than that agree with all said and great lesson as ever.
Greetings from the British Motor Show in Farnborough
👋 Enjoy and thanks for still tuning in 👍
@@ashley_neal Thanks Ash. So much to see here. Will watch your video later and contribute some comments in due course. Oh and I practised so much of what I've learned from you on the drive from home in Canterbury
I've got a friend going there today. Watch out for a spry looking bloke in his late seventies, almost as deaf as a post, deliberately asking embarrassingly awkward questions of the exhibitors and tell him I said "Hi!".
@@ianmason. Oh really? Haven't met anyone of that description yet. As for myself, you can miss me. Im wearing an over the shoulder messenger bag with a large Canadian flag, as I am dual British and Canadian. It's a great show btw and vast. Was here last year too but this year is even bigger. Had my photo taken with their version of The Stig.
@@ashley_neal One of the booths at this huge show was the DVLA. They were selling all the "standard" driving manuals and I finally bought myself a hard copy of the new Highway Code. They also had the Police Roadcraft manual as well as the Know Your Roadsigns book, though I already have the latest copy of those latter two. Outside, the Surrey police had an exhibition, including two of their patrol cars and even a speed camera van. Had a very interesting talk with them. Elsewhere in the show there were so many cars, both new (including so many EV's) as well as classics. And I got to have a photo with "The Stig", though not the "real" one! Overall, a great show!
What shocked me once i was over taking a car which began to speed up, which then made the situation very dangerous as I then had to speed up so I wouldn't have a head on collision, even after I cleared the car he chased after me, clearly upset.
It's worth adding another reason to leave a decent gap is so the vehicle can reach a speed much closer to overtaking speed prior to overtaking (plus gives you a double check of your cars acceleration potential as it's already pulling). This allows time to abort the manoeuvre safely if required, rather than trying to accelerate whilst passing and especially important for lower powered vehicles. An extreme example might be your car is missing or badly performing whilst you are beside the other car accelerating hard, or perhaps not performing as expected (optical illusion flat road that is actually an incline).
Obviously side roads, entrances, cycles bends and other hazards must be assessed, as well as the nature of the other drivers behaviour. A very slow driver "may be looking for a turn, parking space or concealed entrance. Even if that turn is left they may swing out prior to turning. Or their vehicle may have a problem. Following too close prior to overtaking may actually cause a driver to become nervous and do some unusual things prior to the overtake.
My personal preference is only to overtake when absolutely necessary and fortunately, it's not usually absolutely necessary. Overtaking is a much more dangerous manoeuvre than some people realise. Many things are concealed or out of your control when overtaking, deep pothole, diesel/oil spill, gravel, mud, water, burst tyre, windscreen shatter, animal etc..The truth of it is, overtaking, always increases risk.
I strongly disagree with your first sentence. Accelerating up to the overtake leaves no time to abort the overtake once a position on the offside has been taken. See Roadcraft page 196. Taking an offside position without accelerating allows you to assess the road ahead and the gap you plan to pull into. If there is any reason to abort then you can just move back nearside again. If it's safe, then you accelerate past.
I'm wondering what the thought process is behind the flash of the lights. I find it's predominantly used as a telling off these days on the road and I wonder if it would potentially anger the driver you're overtaking, and force them to do something silly like speed up.
As I can't read minds, I would use 2 second flash as taught if I felt it necessary. It's not a telling off or an instruction, but I am aware some have this opinion. Just keep all options open - if a headlight warning makes people angry, gawd help us.
It shouldn't be used as telling off though, passing was the original purpose. Motorbikes still have it written on them for the flash button, it says "pass".
In my experience flashing lights has always been used as a signal or to get your attention which is fine. I have had someone flash me from behind many times though and I still don't know what their intention was.
I get what you're saying though and I've seen this happen more than once. I don't have a perfect solution for communication but it is key to understanding what others are trying to convey.
One thing I do especially in areas that I am not familiar with the roads is leave the sat nav displayed and zoomed out a bit. I have used it to identify where a good opportunity may be coming up but also where its not worth it.
Would also like to question flashing your lights. This is bound to alarm the driver of the car being overtaken and could distract them. Is it advised in the highway code?.
A flash of the lights indicates to the other driver you are present. It should not be used for any other purpose.
Horn again, is to alert the other road user you are approaching. Its use when overtaking is not usual and is unnecessary.
It is unnecessary because when you are overtaking you are on the wrong side of the road and the vehicle you are overtaking should remain in their lane and not pull over to your lane without mirror-signal-maneuvre and a check over the shoulder process being followed, which means they should see you, and therefore they should not move out of their lane and into you.
Hi ashley, i noticed on your previous videos that there was a scammer pretending to be you with your profile picture saying i “won” something and to text them. I think you should make a video to make people aware 👍
In the 80s and 90's I did many thousands of miles of European motoring. Use of the horn and a flash of the lights was the norm when overtaking. Doing the same in the UK unfortunately produces rage and aggression in a lot of drivers. I would never do it here.
Just overtaking produces rage and aggression in many drivers, including my wife (who happens to drive a fairly quick car). She was rather upset when she was overtaken, so I explained that it wasn’t a personal insult, they have merely chosen to travel faster than her, which they are very entitled to do.
That seemed to me to be a very slow overtake of the Mazda - as long as you feel you've been seen and intentions are clear to the car you're passing, surely it's safer to complete the manoeuvre with a bit of speed and get back in lane.
On that subject of power or speed, I can see why some new drivers are involved in serious accidents, they do not have the power to safely overtake things (I know surroundings and awareness are key here). My mother was hit in her Mini, so it's in for repair, the courtesy Corsa given had NO oil in, so they wanted it taken back to be swapped after I heard the engine knocking as damage had already been done, as we sadly lost my gran last week, she asked if I could take it up and collect the other car... 1.2 75 bhp... SCARY - especially when used to a 250bhp Focus ST estate.
On unfamiliar roads I use satnav to look for bends and long straights to make my decision easier
you should NOT be looking at a sat nav look at all times at the road and mirrors
@@ivorjones6618 There is no issue glancing at a built in sat nav screen for additional information. Especially when that information allows for a safer overtake.
@@ryanmitcham5522 all the information you need is on the road in front of you
People afraid to overtake a slower vehicle, keeping others behind, should remember that all vehicles have good brakes and drivers are well trained to use them. I mean, oncoming vehicles would brake to let the overtakers return to their lane.
Not trusting other drivers is like not trusting people would not mug you when you go out.
Good video but I never flash when overtaking, and no one ever flashes me. If they did I'd be a bit confused to be honest as no one else does it. Are they pointing something out in my driving? Is there an issue with my car?
The more i plan my to take stress out of my life i find that i no longer need or want overtake anywhere as near as much as i used to. In this case I would have just followed that car at a safe distance and enjoyed the journey .
This is probably the best advice really.
If somebody deliberately accelerates from driving constantly at less than 40mph, to block me as I'm overtaking (on a 60mph road) is it permissible to kill them?
I also find overtaking can be stressful, because you are depending on the good will and experience of the driver of the car ahead. Many years ago in the highlands I was driving behind a car that was going quite slow for the road conditions. I knew that road very well so as we approached a long stretch of empty road I started to overtake. The driver in front instead of allowing me to pass started to accelerate as I began to pass in the outside lane.
So we were both travelling at 60 mph with me in the oncoming lane (It was on the A82). I saw in the distance a huge truck appear in the same lane as me. We closed at a frightening rate and I barely managed to brake and pull into my lane behind the car I had been trying to pass before the truck thundered past with his horn blasting at me.
Only then did I realise that the car in front was a hired car with a foreigner at the wheel (a young woman). I still shudder when I think of what could have happened.
Not so much a hire and a foreigner - more a moron who didn't want to be overtaken!
Wow, scary situation! I normally do the speed limit, or as close as I safely can, but still get occasionally overtaken.
When I am being overtaken in this sort of situation (if theres no one else in my lane just behind me), I make a point to just ease off the throttle slightly once the overtaking car is alongside me, just so they can overtake more quickly and it's safer. Even if I'm doing 60mph in a 60mph zone and the person behind me (illegally and probably unsafely) wants to do 70pmh, it is a lot safer to just let them make the manouvre rather than holding them up to prove a point.
This sort of thing is why it's always better to just let an overtaking car by and not a good idea to increase speed while being overtaken.
@@robinthebobin6537 you have to be particularly careful in tourist areas such as the Scottish highlands, where you have foreigners who are driving on the “wrong” side of the road as far as they are concerned. Also, they are concentrating more on the scenery than they are on driving. I also got the impression that the young woman in my case was an inexperienced driver.
Yep, it's that kind of psychopathic behaviour that leads to fatalities. She'd rather endanger your life and the lives of other road users than accept that she's been overtaken.
The answer is more power lol.
Overtaking on left with 2 lanes in your side (undertake). How would you do it?
You don't. Undertaking is illegal.
@@deang5622 who said so?
I've seen sometimes slower drivers pulling left into a hard shoulder to allow drivers to over take. I've mainly seen this on wider national roads with good wide hard shoulders. I've always thought this to be dangerous but interest to hear what more experienced drivers think of this
Dangerous, certainly. Illegal as well, as the hard shoulder is for breakdowns and emergencies only. Although it could technically be done safely, the likelihood is that someone who has such a poor grasp of, and respect for, the rules that they will do this, is also the kind of person who would fail to spot that the hard shoulder disappears in 100 yards to be replaced by the concrete supports for a bridge.
I think it’s a wonderful and considerate thing to do and shows the driver has a heightened awareness of the situation around them. I’m assuming you don’t mean “ hard shoulder “ as you don’t really get them in single carriageway A roads. I assume you mean when cars move to the left when they see you have the opportunity to pass.
Tractors...ooohhh arrhhhh
In my experience , safe , responsible overtaking very often results in being tailgated by an impatient , aggressive meat - head . This may not be a problem for seasoned motorists but I feel sorry for new drivers who could be doing everything right but feel intimidated by this .
Happened to me with a taxi driver (shocker). I overtook him on a clear straight 60mph road (he was doing about 50-55mph). Poor thing got triggered and went out of his way to speed up and try and overtake me back. Pathetic, really.
yeah... especially if you have a P-plates on ... Suddenly they feel offended how dared you to get in front of them.
@@JimNH777 I would always advise against P plates as people treat you like a dickhead and the people who tend to have P lack confidence and generally don't have great driving ability. If you're a new driver and have a black box fitted I would strongly recomend putting a sticker on the back window stating you have a blackbox as it generally reduces tailgating when you do the speed limit, also advise putting a sticker stating their is a camera fitted to the back regardless of whether there is one for the exact same reason.
@@gravemind6536 thanks but so far after few months I didn't notice that. Plenty of assholes but they would probably overtake me doing 25 in 20 or 37 in 30 only to end up at the same traffic lights as I do anyway. But on the other hand I noticed plenty of people keeping their distance instead of tailgating. But that might also be the fact I'm driving a beater so minor damage to my car won't hurt me as much as them :)
Especially, where are you going after you did the overtake? Quite often I see people overtaking when there's clearly not enough room in front of the car they're overtaking.