Year 2018. Is PHP dying? NO Year 2019. Is PHP dying? NO Year 2020. Is PHP dying? NO Year 2021. Is PHP dying? NO Year 2022. Is PHP dying? NO Year 2023. Is PHP dying? NO Year 2024. Is PHP dying? NOOOO! Year 2025. Is PHP dying? 🥱
My man, the sky is falling for PHP. So let it fall on Chicken Little's cranium and it's a free meal next to a solid pay check. What I would've adjusted to your timeline: Year 2018. Is PHP dying? "YES" according to 'creator' A Year 2019. Is PHP dying? "YES" according to 'creator' B Year .... Is PHP dying? "YES" according to 'creator' ....
In Germany, PHP is also still pretty good for entry level jobs. Symfony seems very popular here, so probably a good thing to learn. Also I've seen a suspicious amount of job ads that ask for TYPO3 knowledge, which according to some friends is the CMS of choice for masochists.
100% accurate. I've done some debugging with 4 large sites based on typo3 and it was a disaster! I quickly handed it over to a specialist company and just pushed some minor changes. I'll never step into that trap ever again.
Php was my second programming language after javascript. i think php is the best language for backend web develoment because it is similar to javascript. and has inbuilt features that make backend development easy and straightforward.
Modern PHP performs much better with FastCGI and PHP-FPM. And Laravel allows you to build well-organized and scalable web apps. These contributions have given the language staying power.
@@dyto2287 I think you may need to revisit PHP, my friend. While it operates synchronously by design, PHP is built to handle many concurrent requests with no overlap, making it ideal for a wide range of applications. 1. Transaction integrity: Synchronous architecture makes it easier to avoid race conditions, which can be critical for tasks like database operations. 2. Simplicity: Coding in PHP can be simpler as you don't need to manage the complexity of asynchronous events, callbacks, or promises. 3. Error handling: Debugging in a synchronous environment tends to be more intuitive, saving significant time and effort. While JavaScript (Node.js) has improved its performance, PHP remains an excellent solution, particularly for small to medium-sized businesses. It scales efficiently, especially when combined with load balancing, and is well-suited for traditional web apps that don’t require complex asynchronous patterns. When businesses outgrow PHP, they usually look to languages like C++, Java, .NET, or newer contenders like Go and Rust. JavaScript is less frequently the first choice for backend services at that scale. Frameworks like Next.js and Remix provide an amazing developer experience early on, but the rapid pace of change in the JavaScript ecosystem can make long-term maintenance more challenging. In my 17+ years of experience using various backend languages like C#, C++, Java, JavaScript, Go, and PHP, I continually come back to PHP. It offers a fast development cycle, is easy to maintain, and is reliable. For cases where PHP isn’t ideal, I simply add Go to handle specific tasks. Both can coexist on the same server or communicate via APIs, ensuring that I don’t need to rewrite entire applications.
@@dyto2287 You can still do anything you want with that combination. Sky is the limit. Browsers have got significantly better since then to, removing the annoying flickering when you change large parts of the page using pure javascript or jquery. You could feasibly make an SPA with that stack.
I don't know why so many folks are using Javascript as a backend when PHP was built from the ground up for that very purpose and is miles ahead of Javascript in that regard, still to this day.
Thats true. Programming languages are only tools in your toolbox and should be used for specific usecases. I used PHP in my last job, and it was quite fun, to be honest. BUT here in Germany, there are a lot of PHP developers that learned directly Laravel instead of native PHP. The problem here was that if you ask them questions about PSR, for example, they don't even know that something like a PSR exists. Laravel teaches way too much magic instead of real PHP. Most of them don't even know the patterns that are used by that framework. So it's hard to find a good PHP developer. And in Europe, PHP developers are underpaid in comparison to other languages. I know a lot of php devs that are switching from php to golang, java, rust, because of that
PHP isn't going down, some 'you-have-to-try-this-technologies' like RUST skyrocket. But these figures are deceptive as these 'you-have-to-try-this-technologies' also drop in popularity as fast as they rose in popularity. PHP is great!
I don't like JavaScript. If I can Thanos it away, I would. As for PHP, it's a decent language. One of my issues with PHP is the syntax - it's a scary-looking mess. I'd get rid of the $ sign for variables... it makes my eyes bleed. I would get rid for of the array syntax... array['index'] is ridiculous... 4 extra characters to access an index! The syntax for array('index' => 'value') also needs to go. Maybe replace it with array.index = value Same goes for objects.... I don't like (new Class)->method() ... which I believe version 8.4 will address this. If PHP makes arrays and objects first class citizens, and removes the $ for variables, it will go a long way. On the other hand, it's a very flexible language with tons of libraries.
Excellently based video, as usual. Just got 2 questions that are relevant to me as I should get settled by September. A) What do you mean with PHP design patterns? b) Does your course dive into getting (remote) work? I'm saving up in Europe and would love a job in North America that I can (eventually) fulfill from Latin America. Seeing how employers here are bitching about "experience", even for what they call a "starter job", I'm somewhat losing faith tbh. I don't mind investing blood, sweat and tears. I just want to have a good chance at the other side of it.
Moving backend to frontend has been going on for a long time. It's also because frontend frameworks fall out of fashion much quicker than backend frameworks and needs refactoring more. Percentage wise more people are working on frontend but in absolute sense I don't see php dropping that much. And since data and functionality is key for most companies it's expensive to migrate to newly built apps and doesn't really offer you that much more. So most are stuck with what they have. One thing that doesn't show in surveys is that php is used in intranets in companies as well. I've worked on migrating 20 apps from php 5.4 to 7.4 a couple of years back all from the same company for example. Many enterprise companies also have custom software running php, and have been stuck on 'maintenance mode' for years and try and fail to migrate them to java or c#. They get stuck in the planning phase and management don't want to commit to a risky and expensive migration. Php could be the next COBOL since COBOL is not going away either.
the most universal language - php - you write everything what other languages separately can do - in other words - there are tons of various languages but all they do is to improve one another while php already has all of those improvements available - also dont forget you do need php sooner or later due to the fact that 89% of servers run php by default - so 89% of the world will not want to change to anything else but php default - why? - because it costs a hefty chunk of money to change that default as well as to keep all changes up to date - so yeah! people prefer saving money - a saved dollar is an earned dollar as they say -
What does the "Usage" really mean? PHP and frameworks like Laravel and Symfony are super capable and mature, requiring very little code from you when implementing your business. Same can not be said of frameworks for some other popular languages. There's really not even comparisons in Py and Js world where everyone builds their own "framework" from hundreds of different packages and modules etc. When you get such project, you can never know beforehand what kind of project it is. With Laravel, does not matter, you'll know it. If "Usage" is writing new code and inventing the wheel again and again, then yes PHP no longer has usage, pretty much everything has been done already.
Php drop in popularoty has prpblems in my opinion because: - google still gives shitty responses sometimes - the php foundation guys were developer forst and not doing presentations and hype train stuff - JavaScript in the past 10 years has had a lot of people and companies push functionality and buzz words in all directions, heck there isnt a day where i don't hear something new in JS That beeing said, languages like C# arent doing that great either, but i think its the same reason as for PHP, its an older langiage woth no hype train. On another note companies did a mess of things since the pandemic with hiring staff. Popularity doesn't mean the lack of prejects though. At the moment investment is down sooo new projects have problems. At the same time i did see a pot of prokects done jn JS but have basically no userbase and im like "yeah cute project, tell me when people use it". At the moment i can say that after a few years of working with PHP on the backend its good to also learn pther languages as well. People already knew JS, so seasy to shit some things. Other lamguage i recently looked into is GO and kotlin so yeah good to learn things in advance especially if you have the time
Reading the New Stack article shows how far behind the times Wordpress development really is. They were far behind PHP development for a very long time (dropped support for PHP 5.2 eight years after it reached EOL) and now they're talking about moving processing to the frontend. At the same time solutions like HTMX are moving processing back to the backend after a decade of people moving the processing to frontend libraries such as Angular and React.
🖖🏼 Thank you Uncle Stef for using the analogy of "a carpenter with his toolbox" for a web developer & his many languages. Puts it into a highly elevated perspective & absolutely more relateable than the previous analogy of "a swinger dev using many languages". 😆🤦🏻♀ GOD HAVE MERCY for this crazy world we live in.
wordpress may be replaced with something more modern, up to date code base filling in that niche ( large one ) , porting the plugins over would take more time for sure, but if the interface became more modern and flexible, this could be an interesting story
Exactly. Unfortunately companies choose to develop in PHP because it's "easy to get started" and they can get cheap devs from india, but then build insanely complex and big applications with it it where PHPs shortcomings really are like throwing sand into your own gears. I am a PHP dev and ALL my jobs in the last 5 years were for large scale applications. I'm sick and tired and learning a language that is actually suited for scalable applications
@@holonautIf php 8 is not scalable for your application you either have a site with more traffic than Facebook or it was developed by really really bad developers. That is not the fault of the language. Bad developers can make C slow to a crawl.
Declined doesnt mean dying. It was just shifting toward new trend, and its for good. Unfortunately while php good for web development, many programming languages also have strong footprint in this field, and they compete each other.
IMO its probably relates to AI coming in the game. I saw the survey of backend frameworks. The Djungo is almost over passing Laravel position. But its still most cheaper to use Laravel on shared hostings
PHP isnt going down. Wordpress is based on PHP and that's 40% of the websites in the world. I think PHP is a great way to deploy stuff like sites, mvps, mobile apps apis or web apps apis.
Coding has always been pretty trendy.. There's always a percentage of coders following the new big thing, which in turn tends to influence others.. Nothings really changed that much..
I have less than 40 hours in a framework I’m building, it has pretty much all the generic things I’ve done in my career: OOP and MVC, routing, sharding support (I can set DB connections in controllers and have them propagate in the models for all CRUD), dynamic subdomain support, language support, custom session management, Ajax for all pages (real one, not just refreshing DOM for aparent faster loads). It can do anything and does it better, it’s at 0.004s when all done on a hosting I am paying 1.5E/month. Honestly, with all the economic problems that will come after these years of general bashing (PHP included) I think we’re up for smooth sailing in many years to come. I know C# coders with gastritis from building some sh!t API and they haven’t even started getting into full-stack so yea 😂
It definitely seems to dieing here in the UK. The number of php jobs in my area has declined massively and of those jobs most are garbage. The wages for php is far lower now than other languages and much lower than c#. People just don't seem to want to take php seriously. It's just not cool. I've had people scoff at me when I mentioned php.
77% of all live websites use PHP is irrelevant, most of it are personal websites, or small blogs that you never visit and are not even maintained. What's more important is what's the share of the whole internet traffic that is served by PHP; because typically the websites with the most traffic are also the biggest employers on earth.
Uncle Stef I’m pretty new here and I’m in my early 40s trying to transition from QA engr to software dev. Any advice on what courses(affordable) that I could take? Most of the udemy courses are outdated. Thanks in advance ✌🏽✌🏽✌🏽
I am biased but I think my own courses are best! :) That said, I have an interactive platform that I built and leverage in my bootcamp / mentoring program: unclestef.com. I also have standalone courses if you want to work solo.
I hope it's not. Php is way more better than react-next.js, their developer experience is awfull. Doing silly things for front-end you have to struggle like you were building a space ship. Html is the most simplest way to build ui's still.
Just today I was thinking that PHP might make a comeback. People are realizing that the newest toy is not necessary the one that will make you money, but the simplest one to use and deploy. Also, frontend masters just released a PHP course, crazy
Yeah, Jetbrains' biggest competitor is free, which is hard. I'm part of a team of seven developers, and only two of us ( both very senior ) use PHPStorm instead of VSCode. I've been using PHPStorm about a decade, and don't think I could work without it.
@@rtothec1234 "commercial" - is that a bad thing? I don't even know what that means. VSCode is from Microsoft - is there any company more "commercial" than Microsoft? I use PHPStorm on a mid-tier MacMini M2 and have no issues with performance - speed or RAM. I get more problems with Docker. I haven't seen what VSCode does that Storm does not - is there anything? "Free" is relative. I have been using PHPStorm for quite a while, and switching to anything else would be a time sink for me.
wordpress tho a mature code base, is terribly old code, yes it is being kept up, but wordpress needs a new gen rewrite , just to keep it usable, the ca
That first negative post with that percentage chart doesn't make sense when they added HTML/CSS as a language which shaves off the percentage of PHP and all the other server-side languages. That publication must hate PHP with a burning passion. It's so hilarious to me. It's only code. I don't know how anybody uses anything else other than PHP
The accuracy of those statistics is questionable due to the use of AI. Why wait for replies on forums when you have access to tools like Copilot and others? PHP is twice as fast as Python for tokenizing big data, and PHP 8 is vastly different from 7.4.
Not sure about the decline as it seems to be used extensively. There are upcoming frameworks out there for PHP like Trongate that are being adopted as well.
I am enjoying the PHP (WordPress, TALL stack) world right now, coz I am really tired of React, which is why I'm baffled why Automattic drank the Kool-aid and went with React.
JS is the only language compiled and executed in the web browser. Anything with an interactive UI such as writing this comment is in JS. You can build full stack applications using SSR with Next JS and BaaS like Firebase or Supabase. It’s a very convenient language. It’s not going anywhere. I hated it too at one point, but now I have tremendous respect for it.
How cares about Wordpress. It was a shithole of bad coding decisions and patterns, and still is. Database design, backend and whatever hook system and overwriting, non existent templating engine( which gives “freedom” and breaks and coding standards in the ecosystem ) css and js in PHP like 2000’s. Slow, I mean with WPML you can get up to 300 queries a page, ffs. So no, Wordpress going towards JS is not PHP related. The blur the line here FE vs Backend. Yeah PHP for FE in 2024 is not an option for an admin panel ( good morning Wordpress ), but PHP for microservices, APIs and so on is golden
here is one thing I would like to add, I don't think php usage declined due to WordPress although it can be a cause, but I think it is due to better alternatives!
@@wixmich08 I’ve seen JS, Python & Java. 5 years ago I’ve seen Ruby, but now less and less use it. Some startups do use Wordpress though but never a php framework .
@@wixmich08 Of course, I can't speak for all startups, but I know some larger companies here in Germany/Austria/Switzerland that are building their microservice landscape with Golang. Some companies have rewritten their product from php to springboot/node/rust. I talked to some recruiters on LinkedIn and they told me that most junior php developers learn Laravel, but not php. I know it sounds weird but many are no longer learning the native php behind the frameworks but just the magic of the frameworks. Finding good PHP developers is therefore difficult.
I’ve been using PHP for 5 years, and it is a great language for backend development. However, in the era of AI, another factor kicks in, which is how easily and flawlessly AI can generate code. In terms of that, PHP is not great at it because it’s a dynamically typed language. I’m not saying that AI can write bug-free TypeScript or Go code immediately, but the number of coding iterations will be fewer with these languages. And sadly, I am now trying to transition away from PHP.
2 Billion website and only 33 million uses PHP? if that is the case PHP is almost irrelevant, with less than 1.65% of websites using php. The significant percentage of sites using old versions of PHP show that is basically legacy. The web grow on the shoulders of LAMP, with P being PHP far more than PERL. PHP toke to long to fix issues, but more than issues was unable to control the narrative. We know a good part of WordPress movement is to lower hosting costs, but there are other interesting, and valid, technical reasons. WP declarations could be the le coup de grâce for PHP. People are learning Phython for AI and will build Websites with Python.
He is the kind of guy that ewen if there would be just 10 PHP programmers on the world including your uncle's company, he would say you that there are still some people who do it, and you can still get a job in ur uncle's company so still far away from dying
yes , yes it's dying and useless now , i was a php developper and it is and i'm sorry !! and it's not like before , i'm sorry stefan , but coding now is a whole new game , it's not about snippets of algorithm and being smart anymore , AI can help there , now the challenge is to navigate all the phylosophy of a certain frame work and they are not the same !! angular and react are miles appart , and each it's own ocean ! that's the painful truth , and learning them won't get you any closer to learning springboot or symfony , every thing is it's own island and it's easy to waste time now ! choose wisely your tech and focus on it for the rest of your time !!
All of these do things in their own way, but you can for sure jump from one to another as the concepts are similar. You have to work it out and understand it, but those are islands on the same planet.
Uncle Stef, the RUclips dad to all aspiring devs and business people. The last remaining voice of reason honestly. God bless
God Bless.
Year 2018. Is PHP dying? NO
Year 2019. Is PHP dying? NO
Year 2020. Is PHP dying? NO
Year 2021. Is PHP dying? NO
Year 2022. Is PHP dying? NO
Year 2023. Is PHP dying? NO
Year 2024. Is PHP dying? NOOOO!
Year 2025. Is PHP dying? 🥱
I wonder if it’s trendy to say PHP is dying or something? Clearly it’s here to stay for quite some years to come.
My man, the sky is falling for PHP. So let it fall on Chicken Little's cranium and it's a free meal next to a solid pay check.
What I would've adjusted to your timeline:
Year 2018. Is PHP dying? "YES" according to 'creator' A
Year 2019. Is PHP dying? "YES" according to 'creator' B
Year .... Is PHP dying? "YES" according to 'creator' ....
Year 2026. no body wants to work anymore!!!!
It's already dead though. PHP jobs are bottom of the barrel.
@@dyto2287 Not my job lol
In Germany, PHP is also still pretty good for entry level jobs. Symfony seems very popular here, so probably a good thing to learn. Also I've seen a suspicious amount of job ads that ask for TYPO3 knowledge, which according to some friends is the CMS of choice for masochists.
TYPO3 is used by companies stuck deep in legacy
100% accurate. I've done some debugging with 4 large sites based on typo3 and it was a disaster! I quickly handed it over to a specialist company and just pushed some minor changes.
I'll never step into that trap ever again.
@@hendrx Do you have a source of this statement?
@@woodyc79 no but I've been working as a webdev here for 14 years
I'm glad I love php and not typescript
Laravel is making php even sweeter
Php was my second programming language after javascript. i think php is the best language for backend web develoment because it is similar to javascript. and has inbuilt features that make backend development easy and straightforward.
php is not similar to javascript at all. its not async.
Modern PHP performs much better with FastCGI and PHP-FPM. And Laravel allows you to build well-organized and scalable web apps. These contributions have given the language staying power.
Performance issue is not in the runtime but in design how PHP is executed.
@@dyto2287 I think you may need to revisit PHP, my friend. While it operates synchronously by design, PHP is built to handle many concurrent requests with no overlap, making it ideal for a wide range of applications.
1. Transaction integrity: Synchronous architecture makes it easier to avoid race conditions, which can be critical for tasks like database operations.
2. Simplicity: Coding in PHP can be simpler as you don't need to manage the complexity of asynchronous events, callbacks, or promises.
3. Error handling: Debugging in a synchronous environment tends to be more intuitive, saving significant time and effort.
While JavaScript (Node.js) has improved its performance, PHP remains an excellent solution, particularly for small to medium-sized businesses. It scales efficiently, especially when combined with load balancing, and is well-suited for traditional web apps that don’t require complex asynchronous patterns.
When businesses outgrow PHP, they usually look to languages like C++, Java, .NET, or newer contenders like Go and Rust. JavaScript is less frequently the first choice for backend services at that scale.
Frameworks like Next.js and Remix provide an amazing developer experience early on, but the rapid pace of change in the JavaScript ecosystem can make long-term maintenance more challenging.
In my 17+ years of experience using various backend languages like C#, C++, Java, JavaScript, Go, and PHP, I continually come back to PHP. It offers a fast development cycle, is easy to maintain, and is reliable. For cases where PHP isn’t ideal, I simply add Go to handle specific tasks. Both can coexist on the same server or communicate via APIs, ensuring that I don’t need to rewrite entire applications.
Once a language reaches critical mass, it stays around because of its large code base. PHP will be with us for a long time.
HTML5, CSS3, PHP, JavaScript, jQuery, and Ajax 🎉 Powerhouse
Did you go into coma in 2010s and just woke up?
@@dyto2287 You can still do anything you want with that combination. Sky is the limit. Browsers have got significantly better since then to, removing the annoying flickering when you change large parts of the page using pure javascript or jquery. You could feasibly make an SPA with that stack.
Hey uncle steff ! I just wanted you to know the course I bought from you a few months ago helped me a lot. I'm learning php now & I love it.
Cool! Congrats on your progress!
thx for your comments Stef. good luck!
I don't know why so many folks are using Javascript as a backend when PHP was built from the ground up for that very purpose and is miles ahead of Javascript in that regard, still to this day.
Thats true. Programming languages are only tools in your toolbox and should be used for specific usecases. I used PHP in my last job, and it was quite fun, to be honest.
BUT here in Germany, there are a lot of PHP developers that learned directly Laravel instead of native PHP. The problem here was that if you ask them questions about PSR, for example, they don't even know that something like a PSR exists. Laravel teaches way too much magic instead of real PHP. Most of them don't even know the patterns that are used by that framework. So it's hard to find a good PHP developer. And in Europe, PHP developers are underpaid in comparison to other languages.
I know a lot of php devs that are switching from php to golang, java, rust, because of that
PHP 8 is not just a "marginal" improvement over 7. Its speed improved significantly
PHP isn't going down, some 'you-have-to-try-this-technologies' like RUST skyrocket. But these figures are deceptive as these 'you-have-to-try-this-technologies' also drop in popularity as fast as they rose in popularity. PHP is great!
because companies stay with bullshit technologies and are afraid to innovate.
I don't like JavaScript. If I can Thanos it away, I would.
As for PHP, it's a decent language. One of my issues with PHP is the syntax - it's a scary-looking mess. I'd get rid of the $ sign for variables... it makes my eyes bleed.
I would get rid for of the array syntax... array['index'] is ridiculous... 4 extra characters to access an index! The syntax for array('index' => 'value') also needs to go. Maybe replace it with array.index = value
Same goes for objects.... I don't like (new Class)->method() ... which I believe version 8.4 will address this.
If PHP makes arrays and objects first class citizens, and removes the $ for variables, it will go a long way.
On the other hand, it's a very flexible language with tons of libraries.
Excellently based video, as usual.
Just got 2 questions that are relevant to me as I should get settled by September.
A) What do you mean with PHP design patterns?
b) Does your course dive into getting (remote) work? I'm saving up in Europe and would love a job in North America that I can (eventually) fulfill from Latin America. Seeing how employers here are bitching about "experience", even for what they call a "starter job", I'm somewhat losing faith tbh.
I don't mind investing blood, sweat and tears. I just want to have a good chance at the other side of it.
Every year in the last 20 years I heard that PHP is dying! :)) I had enough!
Yeah, was thinking the same - every single year since I started with PHP3 😀
In sweden, php is strong imo
Cool
I love php. My first love when building a website
Someone I know makes most of her freelance money updating PHP 5 or lower sites to PHP 8. Definitely still a lot of legacy work, even for freelancers.
Indeed
Moving backend to frontend has been going on for a long time. It's also because frontend frameworks fall out of fashion much quicker than backend frameworks and needs refactoring more. Percentage wise more people are working on frontend but in absolute sense I don't see php dropping that much.
And since data and functionality is key for most companies it's expensive to migrate to newly built apps and doesn't really offer you that much more. So most are stuck with what they have.
One thing that doesn't show in surveys is that php is used in intranets in companies as well. I've worked on migrating 20 apps from php 5.4 to 7.4 a couple of years back all from the same company for example. Many enterprise companies also have custom software running php, and have been stuck on 'maintenance mode' for years and try and fail to migrate them to java or c#. They get stuck in the planning phase and management don't want to commit to a risky and expensive migration.
Php could be the next COBOL since COBOL is not going away either.
the most universal language - php - you write everything what other languages separately can do - in other words - there are tons of various languages but all they do is to improve one another while php already has all of those improvements available - also dont forget you do need php sooner or later due to the fact that 89% of servers run php by default - so 89% of the world will not want to change to anything else but php default - why? - because it costs a hefty chunk of money to change that default as well as to keep all changes up to date - so yeah! people prefer saving money - a saved dollar is an earned dollar as they say -
What does the "Usage" really mean? PHP and frameworks like Laravel and Symfony are super capable and mature, requiring very little code from you when implementing your business. Same can not be said of frameworks for some other popular languages. There's really not even comparisons in Py and Js world where everyone builds their own "framework" from hundreds of different packages and modules etc. When you get such project, you can never know beforehand what kind of project it is. With Laravel, does not matter, you'll know it. If "Usage" is writing new code and inventing the wheel again and again, then yes PHP no longer has usage, pretty much everything has been done already.
Also there are languages as COBOL or Haskell that are very old, but still used in many applications that are key to industry.
COBOL very likely will die, but Haskell does not. They are training a LLM to rewrite COBOL to java
Haskell? No one is using that
@@andreilucasgoncalves1416not likely at all while ibm still exists.
Php drop in popularoty has prpblems in my opinion because:
- google still gives shitty responses sometimes
- the php foundation guys were developer forst and not doing presentations and hype train stuff
- JavaScript in the past 10 years has had a lot of people and companies push functionality and buzz words in all directions, heck there isnt a day where i don't hear something new in JS
That beeing said, languages like C# arent doing that great either, but i think its the same reason as for PHP, its an older langiage woth no hype train.
On another note companies did a mess of things since the pandemic with hiring staff.
Popularity doesn't mean the lack of prejects though. At the moment investment is down sooo new projects have problems. At the same time i did see a pot of prokects done jn JS but have basically no userbase and im like "yeah cute project, tell me when people use it".
At the moment i can say that after a few years of working with PHP on the backend its good to also learn pther languages as well. People already knew JS, so seasy to shit some things. Other lamguage i recently looked into is GO and kotlin so yeah good to learn things in advance especially if you have the time
I see uncle stef,I click,simple.
that hoodie looks comfy af
Reading the New Stack article shows how far behind the times Wordpress development really is. They were far behind PHP development for a very long time (dropped support for PHP 5.2 eight years after it reached EOL) and now they're talking about moving processing to the frontend. At the same time solutions like HTMX are moving processing back to the backend after a decade of people moving the processing to frontend libraries such as Angular and React.
🖖🏼 Thank you Uncle Stef for using the analogy of "a carpenter with his toolbox" for a web developer & his many languages. Puts it into a highly elevated perspective & absolutely more relateable than the previous analogy of "a swinger dev using many languages". 😆🤦🏻♀ GOD HAVE MERCY for this crazy world we live in.
😂
@StefanMischook - I really thought that there was a chance you were going to delete my comment. Very relieved that you found it amuzing 😅😁
wordpress may be replaced with something more modern, up to date code base filling in that niche ( large one ) , porting the plugins over would take more time for sure, but if the interface became more modern and flexible, this could be an interesting story
Honestly in terms of ease of use, features and ecosystem .. for spinning up MVPs PHP is a first class citizen
A related question would be, is Perl dying?
Learning PHP and moving on to add Laravel. PHP seems to do what I need it to do, websites for small to medium applications.
Exactly. Unfortunately companies choose to develop in PHP because it's "easy to get started" and they can get cheap devs from india, but then build insanely complex and big applications with it it where PHPs shortcomings really are like throwing sand into your own gears. I am a PHP dev and ALL my jobs in the last 5 years were for large scale applications. I'm sick and tired and learning a language that is actually suited for scalable applications
@@holonautIf php 8 is not scalable for your application you either have a site with more traffic than Facebook or it was developed by really really bad developers. That is not the fault of the language. Bad developers can make C slow to a crawl.
Which programming is in high demand for Blockchain
😂 PHP has been dying since forever, yet Laravel seems to be making a comeback. People are burned out with Next.js and the rest of the JS ecosystem.
I see PHP knowledge vacancies only for the projects where you need to migrate old legacy PHP code to Next.js. At least in my country.
Declined doesnt mean dying. It was just shifting toward new trend, and its for good. Unfortunately while php good for web development, many programming languages also have strong footprint in this field, and they compete each other.
IMO its probably relates to AI coming in the game. I saw the survey of backend frameworks. The Djungo is almost over passing Laravel position. But its still most cheaper to use Laravel on shared hostings
PHP isnt going down. Wordpress is based on PHP and that's 40% of the websites in the world. I think PHP is a great way to deploy stuff like sites, mvps, mobile apps apis or web apps apis.
php is my fav for web apps
Real easy to get up and running and documents easy to understand
It's more about new projects. What are people using for new projects.
Coding has always been pretty trendy.. There's always a percentage of coders following the new big thing, which in turn tends to influence others.. Nothings really changed that much..
Is there a langauage that has better web frameworks (Symfony, Laravel) and CMSs (Drupal etc.) than PHP?
Should i learn c# now?
Wordpress, and Laravel won't let PHP down.
I have less than 40 hours in a framework I’m building, it has pretty much all the generic things I’ve done in my career: OOP and MVC, routing, sharding support (I can set DB connections in controllers and have them propagate in the models for all CRUD), dynamic subdomain support, language support, custom session management, Ajax for all pages (real one, not just refreshing DOM for aparent faster loads). It can do anything and does it better, it’s at 0.004s when all done on a hosting I am paying 1.5E/month. Honestly, with all the economic problems that will come after these years of general bashing (PHP included) I think we’re up for smooth sailing in many years to come. I know C# coders with gastritis from building some sh!t API and they haven’t even started getting into full-stack so yea 😂
It definitely seems to dieing here in the UK. The number of php jobs in my area has declined massively and of those jobs most are garbage. The wages for php is far lower now than other languages and much lower than c#. People just don't seem to want to take php seriously. It's just not cool. I've had people scoff at me when I mentioned php.
77% of all live websites use PHP is irrelevant, most of it are personal websites, or small blogs that you never visit and are not even maintained. What's more important is what's the share of the whole internet traffic that is served by PHP; because typically the websites with the most traffic are also the biggest employers on earth.
That would be pr0n and torrenting. Traffic is not a good measure of usage. I would say number of jobs is better.
Uncle Stef I’m pretty new here and I’m in my early 40s trying to transition from QA engr to software dev. Any advice on what courses(affordable) that I could take? Most of the udemy courses are outdated. Thanks in advance ✌🏽✌🏽✌🏽
I am biased but I think my own courses are best! :) That said, I have an interactive platform that I built and leverage in my bootcamp / mentoring program: unclestef.com. I also have standalone courses if you want to work solo.
Sir m start using wordpress backend and react front end is that goog
How are you doing buddy?
I hope it's not. Php is way more better than react-next.js, their developer experience is awfull. Doing silly things for front-end you have to struggle like you were building a space ship. Html is the most simplest way to build ui's still.
Just today I was thinking that PHP might make a comeback. People are realizing that the newest toy is not necessary the one that will make you money, but the simplest one to use and deploy.
Also, frontend masters just released a PHP course, crazy
Link, please?
php is super competent.
Many devs move from JetBrains to VSCode
Yeah, Jetbrains' biggest competitor is free, which is hard. I'm part of a team of seven developers, and only two of us ( both very senior ) use PHPStorm instead of VSCode. I've been using PHPStorm about a decade, and don't think I could work without it.
@@rtothec1234 "commercial" - is that a bad thing? I don't even know what that means. VSCode is from Microsoft - is there any company more "commercial" than Microsoft?
I use PHPStorm on a mid-tier MacMini M2 and have no issues with performance - speed or RAM. I get more problems with Docker. I haven't seen what VSCode does that Storm does not - is there anything?
"Free" is relative. I have been using PHPStorm for quite a while, and switching to anything else would be a time sink for me.
As I understand this chanel is dedicated to the topic - `Is PHP Dying in ${YEAR}?`
PHP isn't dying. Far from it
@ 6:13 that .. THAT ..
I have 20
people are moving over to managed services like shopify and wix
It's not going down. Though am a Pythonista.❤
For typical non-commercial application PHP will always be there.
laravel is so cool
wordpress tho a mature code base, is terribly old code, yes it is being kept up, but wordpress needs a new gen rewrite , just to keep it usable, the ca
PHP died in 2000. Then agian in 2001, then 2002 and then kept dying every single year.
Big tech try to bring it down but people logic is stronger
it wont go down ,its great
That first negative post with that percentage chart doesn't make sense when they added HTML/CSS as a language which shaves off the percentage of PHP and all the other server-side languages. That publication must hate PHP with a burning passion. It's so hilarious to me. It's only code. I don't know how anybody uses anything else other than PHP
The accuracy of those statistics is questionable due to the use of AI. Why wait for replies on forums when you have access to tools like Copilot and others? PHP is twice as fast as Python for tokenizing big data, and PHP 8 is vastly different from 7.4.
2:32
You should do more C# and .NET videos.
Especially now that new .NETs are coming.
Not sure about the decline as it seems to be used extensively. There are upcoming frameworks out there for PHP like Trongate that are being adopted as well.
Davis Shirley Perez Lisa Jackson Robert
Love php
Plenty of php based ecommerce move to shopify
I am enjoying the PHP (WordPress, TALL stack) world right now, coz I am really tired of React, which is why I'm baffled why Automattic drank the Kool-aid and went with React.
PHP and C# are kings in UK Node and Javascript follows then Java is not popular
C# is soulless like every microsoft product apart from windows and office
People should stop using JavaScript so much, it’s a bad language , this is the bad part of our tech world, people jump into the hype
What do you expect the guy wrote it in 10 days.
@@nobodynever7884 lol
JS is the only language compiled and executed in the web browser. Anything with an interactive UI such as writing this comment is in JS. You can build full stack applications using SSR with Next JS and BaaS like Firebase or Supabase. It’s a very convenient language. It’s not going anywhere. I hated it too at one point, but now I have tremendous respect for it.
Man I'm currently learning PHP 😢
PHP is great! Lots of work! Keep learning!
@@StefanMischook Thank you sir, I Will continue learning it 🫡
PHP is still great, we make big systems on it. Very stable, very mature, very big documentation. New languages are unstable.
Why people so hate php
Because of their personal hangups from 25+ years ago
Because they were told to.
No
Legros Circle
If PHP is dying then it's need another WordPress
👍
Next video: maybe php will live more than me
PHP is dying and good riddance. But at least it keeps my incident response business profitable!😂
If a language is crappy then it will be around for a long time
LARAVEL is booming
PHP is dying, but not Laravel
0:34 no.. can you please explain what a swinging coder is 😂😂
Why do you enjoy throwing jabs at Ruby specifically? 😂😂
She cheated on me.
@@StefanMischook little wonder 🤣🤣
What is dead may never die😂
I hate javascript.
A WordPress 'developer' LOL
How cares about Wordpress. It was a shithole of bad coding decisions and patterns, and still is. Database design, backend and whatever hook system and overwriting, non existent templating engine( which gives “freedom” and breaks and coding standards in the ecosystem ) css and js in PHP like 2000’s. Slow, I mean with WPML you can get up to 300 queries a page, ffs. So no, Wordpress going towards JS is not PHP related. The blur the line here FE vs Backend. Yeah PHP for FE in 2024 is not an option for an admin panel ( good morning Wordpress ), but PHP for microservices, APIs and so on is golden
php is always dying. ruby is also dying, cobol is in life support, a decade from now, programming is dying
here is one thing I would like to add, I don't think php usage declined due to WordPress although it can be a cause, but I think it is due to better alternatives!
PHP is not dying lol 😂
It is dying lol. Only freelancers use it. No serious tech start up use
@@train_xc What do start up's use?
@@wixmich08 I’ve seen JS, Python & Java. 5 years ago I’ve seen Ruby, but now less and less use it.
Some startups do use Wordpress though but never a php framework .
@@wixmich08 Of course, I can't speak for all startups, but I know some larger companies here in Germany/Austria/Switzerland that are building their microservice landscape with Golang.
Some companies have rewritten their product from php to springboot/node/rust.
I talked to some recruiters on LinkedIn and they told me that most junior php developers learn Laravel, but not php. I know it sounds weird but many are no longer learning the native php behind the frameworks but just the magic of the frameworks. Finding good PHP developers is therefore difficult.
@@train_xc”serious” and “startup” are mutually exclusive.
I’ve been using PHP for 5 years, and it is a great language for backend development. However, in the era of AI, another factor kicks in, which is how easily and flawlessly AI can generate code. In terms of that, PHP is not great at it because it’s a dynamically typed language. I’m not saying that AI can write bug-free TypeScript or Go code immediately, but the number of coding iterations will be fewer with these languages. And sadly, I am now trying to transition away from PHP.
Ruby is dead. Get over it!
Just kidding 😅
White Karen Davis Charles Allen Sharon
2 Billion website and only 33 million uses PHP? if that is the case PHP is almost irrelevant, with less than 1.65% of websites using php. The significant percentage of sites using old versions of PHP show that is basically legacy. The web grow on the shoulders of LAMP, with P being PHP far more than PERL. PHP toke to long to fix issues, but more than issues was unable to control the narrative. We know a good part of WordPress movement is to lower hosting costs, but there are other interesting, and valid, technical reasons. WP declarations could be the le coup de grâce for PHP. People are learning Phython for AI and will build Websites with Python.
He is the kind of guy that ewen if there would be just 10 PHP programmers on the world including your uncle's company, he would say you that there are still some people who do it, and you can still get a job in ur uncle's company so still far away from dying
yes , yes it's dying and useless now , i was a php developper and it is and i'm sorry !!
and it's not like before , i'm sorry stefan , but coding now is a whole new game , it's not about snippets of algorithm and being smart anymore , AI can help there , now the challenge is to navigate all the phylosophy of a certain frame work and they are not the same !! angular and react are miles appart , and each it's own ocean ! that's the painful truth , and learning them won't get you any closer to learning springboot or symfony , every thing is it's own island and it's easy to waste time now ! choose wisely your tech and focus on it for the rest of your time !!
Damn… okay, 🙏 😊
Im an Angular/.Net dev btw 😁
All of these do things in their own way, but you can for sure jump from one to another as the concepts are similar. You have to work it out and understand it, but those are islands on the same planet.