I gotta agree with you on the whiplash of the fandom, although I loved the spoon fight I agree that we went from one extreme to another, I think thats due to Into the Dalek being incredibly misplaced, if Into the Dalek was later in the series maybe Robot of Sherwood would of worked so much better- Matthew
Well, it's the TARDIS. She gets the Doctor where he needs to be in exactly the right time and place to see what he has to see to save the day. That he lands more or less on top of Robin Hood is no surprise at all, and it would be out of character for the TARDIS *not* to land him right there. So that's not really a valid gripe.
Enjoyed your review, but: "Capaldi is acting out of character." *Moments later* "I don't know who Capaldi's Doctor is supposed to be." Continuity, who needs it?
I love how you absolutely rip the shot out of this episode but still recognise that its entertaining. I completely agree. Episode makes no sense but is still good, this is why you are my favourite reviewer trilbee!
I really don't get a "Matt Smith script" vibe from this script at all. I don't get why anyone thinks 11 would try to prove Robin Hood fake and rub it into his face the way 12 did. I'm sorry but I really can't imagine this script feeling in character for 11. Also, yeah the Sheriff is a cliche. That's the joke. I think you're really just nitpicking the hell out of this episode. Judging it more for what you want out of it then what it actually is, as they say.
No. Capaldi really did feel like he was playing the Eleventh Doctor in this episode. Hopefully he'll be fantastic again next week like he was in the first 2 episodes.
That's fine if you think that, but I can't see Eleven showing nearly as much animosity as Twelve does, nor can I see him trying so desperately to prove Robin fake or being quite so vehement about the idea that he isn't a hero.
Nicholas Moore It's goofy as all hell. Also series 8 was rewritten to fit Capaldi because they were expecting Smith to continue. It's far too goofy for Capaldi's Doctor and clashes violently with the tone of the previous two episodes and with what the Doctor is supposed to be.
Eh, to each their own but I don't really get the vibe that it's TOO goofy. That might just be cause the whole season had a tone that was all over the goddamn place, but even in the more serious stories 12's personality was played pretty consistently for humor. If anything, I think it fits better with the idea of a "darker" Doctor to have his humor come more from rampant egotism than just being clueless about people like the other episodes.
I thought "I want Enlightenment" was another one of the classic who references, alongside futuristic theme park, miniscope and robots in disguise: The Doctor was checking if he was dealing with Eternals - that was my take on the line anyway. And the hat-thing - these are the middleages - people don't know what Robin Hood looks like, unless they've actually met him in person beforehand, which this Sheriff hadn't done yet appearantly
I think this episode is paying homage to every adaptation of the tale of robin hood i have no problem with the sheriff being a cliche villain because the sheriff is a cliche villain in the legend
I personally sided with The Doctor when it came to his cynicism about Robin Hood. Robin Hood is no more real than Dr. Frankenstein or the Pied Piper. It *should* take more than just "Hey, you've seen a lot of weird stuff. Have faith!" for him to accept this. Despite how much historical oddness The Doctor has seen, he doesn't just casually discover that fictional characters exist. (By the way, I'm almost certain that his previous allusions to Father Christmas were jokes.) Frankly, the one who comes off as unreasonable/crazy here is Clara, who just sheds all doubt immediately and demands to meet Robin Hood. I would understand if she was simply suggesting the *idea* that the Robin Hood legend was inspired by a real person, but no, she believes he definitely exists 100% for no other reason than because she wants to, and considers The Doctor a doubting Thomas for displaying completely normal scepticism at this idea. Which "historical celebrity" is Clara going to want to meet next week? Sherlock Holmes? Long John Silver? Mickey Mouse? Noddy?! Tell me there's no Noddy... Though the major problem with this isn't that Clara was vindicated for her lunacy; it's that Robin Hood's story here (if it weren't for the intervention of time-traveling robots) would have been *exactly* like the legend. The whole point of legends is that they're always several degrees removed from the truth; details are exaggerated, distorted, mistaken, embellished or forgotten completely through retellings, but not this time. This is just the traditional Robin Hood story + aliens. I call BS. This is related to a big problem with the story. It's set up as a mystery - How can Robin Hood be real? Who is this guy really? - but its resolution was "There is no mystery. He is Robin Hood, and there is no difference between him and his fictional counterpart whatsoever.". This is completely unsatisfying and makes the "clues" - like the warm weather and the robots' Robin Hood database - into red herrings that don't make sense on their own. I at least wanted to find out *something* interesting or surprising about the real Robin Hood, but the episode gave me nothing. However, I did enjoy the Sheriff matter-of-factly explaining to The Doctor that it makes no sense to invent Robin Hood. For all my gripes, it was a pretty enjoyable episode overall. It was just incredibly ill-conceived.
This is one of those episodes where I can sincerely, honestly, fully understand your point of view, but it's also one where I disagree with you. You see, this episode works for me for the same reasons that I can appreciate and love Timelash. Now, this is nowhere near as terrible/spectacular as Timelash, but this sort of is so bad at times it's actually fun. Also, how could you miss "HAIK!" ???
So let's see, this season we've had The episode with the clockwork robots remade. "Dalek" - the episode that got me into the show- remade. And the episode with the roman volcano aliens remade. And despite the season feeling like a bunch of rehash, I'm having a great time.
Coolman Hahn in short- 1) a group/single person using alien powers/weapons to enforce their rule. 2) a group of aliens that look like something that the people of the era wouldn't question (titans of fire, knights) 3) said aliens only using the humans to fix their ship.
Just rewatching this episode, court a blooper I thought be funny to mention, when the Dr and robin are chained and robin pretending to be sick, when the Dr lores the guard back in the room, you notice the Dr rubbing under his nose with his hand, like he did in deep breath whenever he was questioning himself.
The idea of the hidden spaceship on historical earth, the collecting of gold and the use of an actual human leader is taken from a Fifth Doctor audio adventure, The Destroyer of Delights. I think sometimes they missed some things that they needed to 'bring along' once they chose to go with that plot. No 'final arrow' in that story though.
One thing that is common in this story that I see in your review is the fact that it is a safe story. The cliches (THE WORLD!), the hat disguise/Clark Kent glasses, the characterization of Robin Hood, the missing the fact that Robin and Clara are alive. It is safe and cliche, and I think that was the intention. As for the golden arrow, they had to use it because that it what the legend was. You also mention the robots being dumb. I wonder if this is a theme because we had that in Deep Breath too and Clara yelling "The robots are dumb!"
The Doctor doubts Robin Hood exists, because he just learned heroes are an illusion ("You are a good Dalek"). IMHO, the main character trait of 14/13/12 (damn you numbering!) is being conflicted about his own heroism/villainy. Also, I still think fixed points are those the time traveller has a 100% certain knowledge of how it played out, thus changing it causes a pre-knowledge paradox which is why you can't change those events. So no event is fixed in itself, it is fixed relative to the time traveller(s) involved.
Oh, also the map is of England and Wales, upside-down. In the shot you used in this video, you can see Cornwall in the upper right, the bay of London is partially concealed under the Sheriff's right arm. His left hand rests on Wales.
As far as I'm concerned, you should keep plugging Meatspace. It's clear you're going places and this is your freaking channel. I was out of town for the first two broadcasts but I'll try to catch any future ones :)
I believe that the spoon seen as a direct link to the 7th and the gold arrow was a link to this story the silver nemesis. The reason I think this is in that episode they used gold arrows the kill the cybermen and in the finally we are going to see the cybermen.
Well, the robots *were* dumb enough to think they could repair their ship when in reality it was doomed to blow up anyway. So you can't really blame them for being dumb enough to give away the golden arrow.
The version of the episode I watched did have the beheading scene in it. I guess that's a fringe benefit of living outside the actual broadcast area...
***** Well you're very inconsiderate. Also, there is no plot hole, it's still revealed he is a robot in the episode thanks to one of his lines, and also when he landed in the pot, if you looked at his hands, they were clearly goldish metal. So there is no plot hole. I find it sad that you care more for a `plot hole` rather than someone's life.
No I am not inconsiderate, I was ignorant of the entire thing until it was revealed to me in this video. Also, of course they're gold colored, he fell into a pot of molten gold, they're not gold colored, they're covered in solid gold.
No, that's not what I am getting at, I mean if it was a real body, his hands would have melted, but they didn't, because he's a robot. Also what does being ignorant have to do with you being inconsiderate?
I have to agree with you there. It's a good episode and really funny, but it's only truly great as long as you don't think about it. When I watched it, I'd just gotten back from Kennywood, and I was tired, so my brain wasn't working at full capacity. It really did like it should have been an Eleventh Doctor story, with how the Doctor was acting. Peter Capaldi can be great as his own Doctor, but he feels really unfitting and uncomfortable when you try to make him act like Matt Smith. Also, I like your comment about the "meat feast doughnut" and the "pink frosting pizza".
I understand your point about the scripts changing that fast, however, Moffat did want each episode to be able to stand alone aswell as work together. I agree that The episode could have done this far better, but I believe this was an episode that they didn't know where to place it as one of the stand-alones, so they just plopped it in the episode 3 slot.
Clara's answer to "Am I a good man?" makes perfect sense. Clara doesn't know him yet and neither do we. As for this episode, I enjoyed it more than 'Into the Dalek'.
One reason why Robin didn't wear a good disguise could be that the budget for that story was so tight that they couldn't actually afford a disguise for Robin to wear
I think what I disliked most about this episode was the realisation that the sonic screwdriver has no set purpose anymore. It's no longer a tool for opening doors or re-calibrating. It can make things blow up. What happened to the days when the Doctor and Jack argued over the Doctor's carrying a screwdriver rather than a gun?
Mr. Tardis, also agree that the Van Gogh episode was wonderful. Again, purely episodic, solid story. No need for ridiculous references for 'heaven' and 'the promised land'. Really, I already strongly suspect the reveal is going to be ridiculous.
totally agree with all this, especially the stupid stuff about the golden arrow.. The past 3 eps have just been SO frustrating for me, each episode has had great potential, and we all know Capaldi has the potential to be one of the greatest Doctor's of all, but it's all been so inconsistent and non sensical that it just really really hasn't lived up tp any of this potential. Everyone's going "typical Moffatt etc etc," I think with season 8 so far it seems like Moffatt's actually just done nothing, and I do wonder if the Head writer still does rewrites of other writers scripts before they go into production, like RTD did, cos this has felt so disjointed. People complain about season 5 and 7 but I do think they still felt like a cohesive whole...Anyway, I really hope things improve with Listen, Robot of Sherwood is the most I've cringed at an episode of Dr Who since Journeys End, with the TARDIS towing planet Earth through space
with 12's personality in this episode, i think this episode would be better if it was the second episode, and him dealing with the dalek would show him finding himself as the doctor.
The Doctor does not show Robin Hood the middle finger. It looks like he does if you pause it, but it's just the way he folds his fist. The seventh Doctor at one point uses his middle finger to check for wind, would that be McCoy showing his middle finger to the audience? Of course not!
***** It doesn't matter what Capaldi wanted it to be, it matters how it looks on screen. It isn't noticable. That being said, I'm disapointed with Capaldi.
I liked this alot i feel it will be one of the ep i just put on i feel bad or just want something to make me smile true not the greatest but i would good and cheesy over bad and boring any day and with the golden arrow i think tehy was planning on taking the arrow [gold ] back once they had got robin hood
I can't fault Mark Gatiss for meeting my expectations. I expected an average episode. And I got an average episode. Thank you Mark. First weak episode of the season.
I actually didn't mind this episode ass much as the others so far this season for 2 reasons: 1) no trying to sound smart and failing epically, 2) The Doctor being wrong about something and trying to wriggle out of it. I'm rather bored with the Doctor knowing EVERYTHING in perfect detail about human history. He was never that way in the past. There were always some things he didn't know. We had another note of the 'Promised Land', which I am totally uninterested in, as I suspect it's going to be another meta-plot thread that's going to leave a very bad taste in my mouth when all is said and done. It was a silly episode and fun, and one that won't leave us with season-spanning questions that will frustrate the heck out of us when the reveal turns out to be awful (like the Silence). Frankly, I'd like the series go back to this sort of story rather than the big story arcs that try to deal with subjects far too unwieldy for the creators' abilities. Tennant NEVER had a season-long arc, and his series was fantastic. Doctor Who has NEVER needed season-long arcs. And with the previous couple of seasons, it's very clear that doing so doesn't work.
They made it too tounge and cheek / cheesy episode, I think that fails it,, also the fact that its probably is originally made for Matt smith, thats not new as the james corden episode where Matts dr stays in his apartment. that was originally made for ether david or chris eclson. capaldi should get mature darker themes, hes the angry no nonsense - old guy dr. (or Malcom Tucker,,hopefully) I think we got a taster of that in the Dalek episode. also they change his screwdriver as thats goofy.
Doctor Who had nothing to do with ISIS or the beheadings. Cutting out the scene was stupid, there was absolutely no reason. I don't blame the BBC, though, because you just know some idiots out there would complain. It's still fucking stupid. I mean, they didn't edit out the organ-stealing robots from Deep Breath out of respect for all those people in Mexico who had their organs harvested. They didnt cut the deaths of the soldiers from Into the Dalek out of respect for all those soldiers that died in battle, why is *this* the only time that they just had to censor something "out of respect"??? If they're cutting things out of respect than why not edit out all death scenes? And all scenes that might be similar to real world events? It's not like the scene would have been disrespectful, anyway! And they didnt cut out the scene where the robot is beheaded, they didnt cut out the Doctor talking about Ronin's head being cut off and "rolling on the floor", so why cut this particular scene? Why is *that* scene offensive while the others aren't? Not to mention the fact that it made the "half man half engine" line make absolutely no sense, so it DID hurt the episode.
How would the family of that girl that was kidnapped and had her internal organs removed in Mexico feel about Deep Breath? How would the family of that boy who was run over and would never walk again feel about the fact that people are am walking around on screen? The episode was made before the beheadings, it has no connection to the beheading at all, the weapon was different, the setting, the situation, the nationalities of the people, the circumstances, the time period, the place it happened... There was literally NOTHING except for the fact that it was a beheading. According to your logic, we should censor EVERYTHING on television just so we wouldn't offend anyone, and that's just stupid. What happened to the journalists was a tragedy, but what the fuck does it have to do with this???
Just because the episode was made before the beheadings, it still had to be edited for audiences. Also, your points are stupid, especially the one about the run over boy. How would seeing people walk around on screen be any different to seeing people walk around in public?
Exactly! So you *do* see why this was pointless! How do you think the families would react when they turn on the news and see an article about ISIS? Or go out and hear people talking about ISIS? Everything would remind them of it! So what? Do we need to put our entire life on hold until those people die? Dover just never mention anything that is somewhat related? Because this scene is as relevant as it would have been if they mentioned the Middle East in the episode. No difference at all. I mean, if we need to censor something that's barely related, where do you draw the line? Once again, I have to mention that girl in Mexico, why was Deep Breath not heavily censored for her familie's sake? And there were episode set during the Blitz in WWII, a lot if people died there, so why didnt they censor that too? Or the episode with Hitler? and what about "The Visitation"? Some people died in the fire if London, why not censor that? And it just goes in and on until there is no more Doctor Who, or any TV show, actually.
I said that seeing people walk around in public would be no different to walking around on a screen. I said nothing about it being pointless that they removed a scene that would cause public uproar and lots of people getting upset.
I really enjoyed this episode. I think Deep Breath is incredibly mediocre, watching it was like eating tofu. Watching Into the Dalek was like eating a delicious stir fry, and watching this episode was like eating a take-away pizza. It was great, but nothing to brag about or remember. I disagree to an extent about the Twelfth Doctor feeling out-of-character. Only some parts felt like they were written for Matt Smith, majority of the time I've felt that his Doctor was consistent.
I HATED THIS EPISODE! not because of the acting, it was good as ever, not because of the characters, they where amusing not because of the plot, it was decent and not because of the antagonists, they worked fine not because of the spoon, the spoon was hilarious but because this is a freaking Robin Hood episode where no one handles a bow even slightly in the right way. The standing position was never right, no one ever used an anchor point, they closed one eye and how they held their Bows was just ridiculous. the worst was seing the shot in the last scene, when they all shot together at the spaceship....cringeworthy. it is not that hard to find someone who does archery, be it modern sport or traditional or reenactment. even the wikipedia page about arcery describes everything accurate enough for them to at least notice that they are doing things wrong. It would have cost them litterally nothing more than ten minutes on the internet to do it much better, and an episode about Robin Hood deserves nothing less than an accurate depiction of archery. tl;dr? The depiction of arcery in this Episode was just wrong on many levels and it could have easily have been made much better.
TomWasAlone We are not all native speakers, you know. Tell me again that I made a stupid little spelling error, when you can write, read and speak three languages fluently.
well so far series 8 hasn't been that good Deep Breath was just all over the place, In The Dalek was just stupid, Robot Of Sherwood was badly written, and as for Listen that so boaring Stephen Moffet needs to write better stories or go I could write better what happend to the days the doctor and his friends arrive whether it is in the past the present the future or to planets and became involved in the events there plenty stuff out there that could a Doctor Who story like Cowboys vs Aliens, Lucy, or what about a Dr Who version of The Purge 2 with edge of the seat action
I believe that the spoon seen as a direct link to the 7th and the gold arrow was a link to this story the silver nemesis. The reason I think this is in that episode they used gold arrows the kill the cybermen and in the finally we are going to see the cybermen.
I gotta agree with you on the whiplash of the fandom, although I loved the spoon fight I agree that we went from one extreme to another, I think thats due to Into the Dalek being incredibly misplaced, if Into the Dalek was later in the series maybe Robot of Sherwood would of worked so much better- Matthew
Actually, I think it would have been better if Robot of Sherwood came after we found out who the Doctor is.
Wow Matthew, I wasn't expecting you here!
2:58 for reaction.
"This feels like a Matt Smith script" I agreed so much. 11 would be the jealous type while trying to impress his Impossible Girl
Well, it's the TARDIS. She gets the Doctor where he needs to be in exactly the right time and place to see what he has to see to save the day.
That he lands more or less on top of Robin Hood is no surprise at all, and it would be out of character for the TARDIS *not* to land him right there. So that's not really a valid gripe.
Enjoyed your review, but:
"Capaldi is acting out of character."
*Moments later*
"I don't know who Capaldi's Doctor is supposed to be."
Continuity, who needs it?
He means that the inconsistency makes it hard for him to understand who Capaldi's Doctor is meant to be.
I love how you absolutely rip the shot out of this episode but still recognise that its entertaining. I completely agree. Episode makes no sense but is still good, this is why you are my favourite reviewer trilbee!
I really don't get a "Matt Smith script" vibe from this script at all. I don't get why anyone thinks 11 would try to prove Robin Hood fake and rub it into his face the way 12 did. I'm sorry but I really can't imagine this script feeling in character for 11.
Also, yeah the Sheriff is a cliche. That's the joke.
I think you're really just nitpicking the hell out of this episode. Judging it more for what you want out of it then what it actually is, as they say.
Got to agree. I don't really disagree with nitpicking as such, but the episode was a lot of fun. And I tend to prefer the serious episodes generally.
No. Capaldi really did feel like he was playing the Eleventh Doctor in this episode. Hopefully he'll be fantastic again next week like he was in the first 2 episodes.
That's fine if you think that, but I can't see Eleven showing nearly as much animosity as Twelve does, nor can I see him trying so desperately to prove Robin fake or being quite so vehement about the idea that he isn't a hero.
Nicholas Moore It's goofy as all hell. Also series 8 was rewritten to fit Capaldi because they were expecting Smith to continue. It's far too goofy for Capaldi's Doctor and clashes violently with the tone of the previous two episodes and with what the Doctor is supposed to be.
Eh, to each their own but I don't really get the vibe that it's TOO goofy. That might just be cause the whole season had a tone that was all over the goddamn place, but even in the more serious stories 12's personality was played pretty consistently for humor. If anything, I think it fits better with the idea of a "darker" Doctor to have his humor come more from rampant egotism than just being clueless about people like the other episodes.
I thought "I want Enlightenment" was another one of the classic who references, alongside futuristic theme park, miniscope and robots in disguise: The Doctor was checking if he was dealing with Eternals - that was my take on the line anyway. And the hat-thing - these are the middleages - people don't know what Robin Hood looks like, unless they've actually met him in person beforehand, which this Sheriff hadn't done yet appearantly
Miniscope.
But yeah, that line really clicked for me, I actually thought the reference was really good since the Eternals do that sort of thing.
***** Sorry, yeah, I meant Miniscope. I edited it, thanks
Robots in disguise? You mean the Doctor's met the Transformers? (Just kidding)
I think this episode is paying homage to every adaptation of the tale of robin hood
i have no problem with the sheriff being a cliche villain because the sheriff is a cliche villain in the legend
I personally sided with The Doctor when it came to his cynicism about Robin Hood. Robin Hood is no more real than Dr. Frankenstein or the Pied Piper. It *should* take more than just "Hey, you've seen a lot of weird stuff. Have faith!" for him to accept this. Despite how much historical oddness The Doctor has seen, he doesn't just casually discover that fictional characters exist. (By the way, I'm almost certain that his previous allusions to Father Christmas were jokes.)
Frankly, the one who comes off as unreasonable/crazy here is Clara, who just sheds all doubt immediately and demands to meet Robin Hood. I would understand if she was simply suggesting the *idea* that the Robin Hood legend was inspired by a real person, but no, she believes he definitely exists 100% for no other reason than because she wants to, and considers The Doctor a doubting Thomas for displaying completely normal scepticism at this idea. Which "historical celebrity" is Clara going to want to meet next week? Sherlock Holmes? Long John Silver? Mickey Mouse? Noddy?! Tell me there's no Noddy...
Though the major problem with this isn't that Clara was vindicated for her lunacy; it's that Robin Hood's story here (if it weren't for the intervention of time-traveling robots) would have been *exactly* like the legend. The whole point of legends is that they're always several degrees removed from the truth; details are exaggerated, distorted, mistaken, embellished or forgotten completely through retellings, but not this time. This is just the traditional Robin Hood story + aliens. I call BS.
This is related to a big problem with the story. It's set up as a mystery - How can Robin Hood be real? Who is this guy really? - but its resolution was "There is no mystery. He is Robin Hood, and there is no difference between him and his fictional counterpart whatsoever.". This is completely unsatisfying and makes the "clues" - like the warm weather and the robots' Robin Hood database - into red herrings that don't make sense on their own. I at least wanted to find out *something* interesting or surprising about the real Robin Hood, but the episode gave me nothing.
However, I did enjoy the Sheriff matter-of-factly explaining to The Doctor that it makes no sense to invent Robin Hood. For all my gripes, it was a pretty enjoyable episode overall. It was just incredibly ill-conceived.
This is one of those episodes where I can sincerely, honestly, fully understand your point of view, but it's also one where I disagree with you. You see, this episode works for me for the same reasons that I can appreciate and love Timelash. Now, this is nowhere near as terrible/spectacular as Timelash, but this sort of is so bad at times it's actually fun. Also, how could you miss "HAIK!" ???
I liked this episode. It's nice to sometimes just kick back and enjoy some popcorn fun
So let's see, this season we've had
The episode with the clockwork robots remade.
"Dalek" - the episode that got me into the show- remade.
And the episode with the roman volcano aliens remade.
And despite the season feeling like a bunch of rehash, I'm having a great time.
MrSplodgeySplodge
m'kay, thanks. Didn't remember their names because... well, they didn't hit me as hard as Dalek.
How in the hell was this episode anything like Fires of pompeii
Coolman Hahn in short-
1) a group/single person using alien powers/weapons to enforce their rule.
2) a group of aliens that look like something that the people of the era wouldn't question (titans of fire, knights)
3) said aliens only using the humans to fix their ship.
Just rewatching this episode, court a blooper I thought be funny to mention, when the Dr and robin are chained and robin pretending to be sick, when the Dr lores the guard back in the room, you notice the Dr rubbing under his nose with his hand, like he did in deep breath whenever he was questioning himself.
The idea of the hidden spaceship on historical earth, the collecting of gold and the use of an actual human leader is taken from a Fifth Doctor audio adventure, The Destroyer of Delights. I think sometimes they missed some things that they needed to 'bring along' once they chose to go with that plot. No 'final arrow' in that story though.
Meat Feast Doughnut and Pink Frosted Pizza? WHAT?
One thing that is common in this story that I see in your review is the fact that it is a safe story. The cliches (THE WORLD!), the hat disguise/Clark Kent glasses, the characterization of Robin Hood, the missing the fact that Robin and Clara are alive. It is safe and cliche, and I think that was the intention.
As for the golden arrow, they had to use it because that it what the legend was.
You also mention the robots being dumb. I wonder if this is a theme because we had that in Deep Breath too and Clara yelling "The robots are dumb!"
The Doctor doubts Robin Hood exists, because he just learned heroes are an illusion ("You are a good Dalek"). IMHO, the main character trait of 14/13/12 (damn you numbering!) is being conflicted about his own heroism/villainy.
Also, I still think fixed points are those the time traveller has a 100% certain knowledge of how it played out, thus changing it causes a pre-knowledge paradox which is why you can't change those events. So no event is fixed in itself, it is fixed relative to the time traveller(s) involved.
Oh, also the map is of England and Wales, upside-down. In the shot you used in this video, you can see Cornwall in the upper right, the bay of London is partially concealed under the Sheriff's right arm. His left hand rests on Wales.
Hmm, these contradictions -- almost like a completely new man is trying to find out who he is...
'Mr Sheriff Man' I'm ashamed to say how amusing I found the way you said that xD
As far as I'm concerned, you should keep plugging Meatspace. It's clear you're going places and this is your freaking channel. I was out of town for the first two broadcasts but I'll try to catch any future ones :)
I believe that the spoon seen as a direct link to the 7th and the gold arrow was a link to this story the silver nemesis. The reason I think this is in that episode they used gold arrows the kill the cybermen and in the finally we are going to see the cybermen.
Well, the robots *were* dumb enough to think they could repair their ship when in reality it was doomed to blow up anyway. So you can't really blame them for being dumb enough to give away the golden arrow.
Yeah, I thought that Matt Smith's personality was all over this episode, and the spoon part was taken from mask of Zorro
This was 100% a throwaway episode. I'll forget about it completely within a few months.
The version of the episode I watched did have the beheading scene in it. I guess that's a fringe benefit of living outside the actual broadcast area...
Yup, you get the benefit of seeing a scene which would cause much upset and public out roar due to the ISS beheadings. That's TOTALLY a benefit.
Exactly, since I am not upset about it in any way and that scene fills in a plot hole.
***** Well you're very inconsiderate. Also, there is no plot hole, it's still revealed he is a robot in the episode thanks to one of his lines, and also when he landed in the pot, if you looked at his hands, they were clearly goldish metal. So there is no plot hole. I find it sad that you care more for a `plot hole` rather than someone's life.
No I am not inconsiderate, I was ignorant of the entire thing until it was revealed to me in this video.
Also, of course they're gold colored, he fell into a pot of molten gold, they're not gold colored, they're covered in solid gold.
No, that's not what I am getting at, I mean if it was a real body, his hands would have melted, but they didn't, because he's a robot. Also what does being ignorant have to do with you being inconsiderate?
I have to agree with you there. It's a good episode and really funny, but it's only truly great as long as you don't think about it. When I watched it, I'd just gotten back from Kennywood, and I was tired, so my brain wasn't working at full capacity. It really did like it should have been an Eleventh Doctor story, with how the Doctor was acting. Peter Capaldi can be great as his own Doctor, but he feels really unfitting and uncomfortable when you try to make him act like Matt Smith. Also, I like your comment about the "meat feast doughnut" and the "pink frosting pizza".
Mr. Tardis: YES!! The guy was so friggin identical to Anthony Ainley, I fully expected the Doctor to sidle up and go, "Sooooo... Master, wazzup?"
I understand your point about the scripts changing that fast, however, Moffat did want each episode to be able to stand alone aswell as work together. I agree that The episode could have done this far better, but I believe this was an episode that they didn't know where to place it as one of the stand-alones, so they just plopped it in the episode 3 slot.
Clara's answer to "Am I a good man?" makes perfect sense. Clara doesn't know him yet and neither do we. As for this episode, I enjoyed it more than 'Into the Dalek'.
One reason why Robin didn't wear a good disguise could be that the budget for that story was so tight that they couldn't actually afford a disguise for Robin to wear
Agree about the Matt Smith feel to the episode
I think what I disliked most about this episode was the realisation that the sonic screwdriver has no set purpose anymore. It's no longer a tool for opening doors or re-calibrating. It can make things blow up. What happened to the days when the Doctor and Jack argued over the Doctor's carrying a screwdriver rather than a gun?
Mr. Tardis, also agree that the Van Gogh episode was wonderful. Again, purely episodic, solid story. No need for ridiculous references for 'heaven' and 'the promised land'. Really, I already strongly suspect the reveal is going to be ridiculous.
totally agree with all this, especially the stupid stuff about the golden arrow.. The past 3 eps have just been SO frustrating for me, each episode has had great potential, and we all know Capaldi has the potential to be one of the greatest Doctor's of all, but it's all been so inconsistent and non sensical that it just really really hasn't lived up tp any of this potential. Everyone's going "typical Moffatt etc etc," I think with season 8 so far it seems like Moffatt's actually just done nothing, and I do wonder if the Head writer still does rewrites of other writers scripts before they go into production, like RTD did, cos this has felt so disjointed. People complain about season 5 and 7 but I do think they still felt like a cohesive whole...Anyway, I really hope things improve with Listen, Robot of Sherwood is the most I've cringed at an episode of Dr Who since Journeys End, with the TARDIS towing planet Earth through space
I would certainly have ordered a pink frosting pizza. That sounds amazing, and I hope you said it on purpose.
Why you miss where Peter Capaldi saying ''HAIK'' and karate chopping Robin. Hasn't done that since Jon Pertwee.
with 12's personality in this episode, i think this episode would be better if it was the second episode, and him dealing with the dalek would show him finding himself as the doctor.
The Doctor does not show Robin Hood the middle finger. It looks like he does if you pause it, but it's just the way he folds his fist. The seventh Doctor at one point uses his middle finger to check for wind, would that be McCoy showing his middle finger to the audience? Of course not!
***** It doesn't matter what Capaldi wanted it to be, it matters how it looks on screen. It isn't noticable. That being said, I'm disapointed with Capaldi.
Do a review on into the dalek and this mess plz
I liked this alot i feel it will be one of the ep i just put on i feel bad or just want something to make me smile true not the greatest but i would good and cheesy over bad and boring any day
and with the golden arrow i think tehy was planning on taking the arrow [gold ] back once they had got robin hood
I can't fault Mark Gatiss for meeting my expectations. I expected an average episode. And I got an average episode. Thank you Mark. First weak episode of the season.
Robert Lythgoe HOLD IT!
Is the episode average, or is it weak? It can't be both! Unless you're suggesting that Doctor Who's average quality is poor...
I actually didn't mind this episode ass much as the others so far this season for 2 reasons: 1) no trying to sound smart and failing epically, 2) The Doctor being wrong about something and trying to wriggle out of it. I'm rather bored with the Doctor knowing EVERYTHING in perfect detail about human history. He was never that way in the past. There were always some things he didn't know.
We had another note of the 'Promised Land', which I am totally uninterested in, as I suspect it's going to be another meta-plot thread that's going to leave a very bad taste in my mouth when all is said and done.
It was a silly episode and fun, and one that won't leave us with season-spanning questions that will frustrate the heck out of us when the reveal turns out to be awful (like the Silence).
Frankly, I'd like the series go back to this sort of story rather than the big story arcs that try to deal with subjects far too unwieldy for the creators' abilities.
Tennant NEVER had a season-long arc, and his series was fantastic. Doctor Who has NEVER needed season-long arcs. And with the previous couple of seasons, it's very clear that doing so doesn't work.
I think you were WAY too easy on this episode, but that's just my opinion.
If Clara would have acted the way you described it, she would have been Romana.
There, I said it.
No behading scene was a good idea science doctor who is a kids show
They made it too tounge and cheek / cheesy episode, I think that fails it,, also the fact that its probably is originally made for Matt smith, thats not new as the james corden episode where Matts dr stays in his apartment. that was originally made for ether david or chris eclson. capaldi should get mature darker themes, hes the angry no nonsense - old guy dr. (or Malcom Tucker,,hopefully) I think we got a taster of that in the Dalek episode. also they change his screwdriver as thats goofy.
The ship sort of looks like my ships in KSP
Doctor Who had nothing to do with ISIS or the beheadings. Cutting out the scene was stupid, there was absolutely no reason.
I don't blame the BBC, though, because you just know some idiots out there would complain.
It's still fucking stupid. I mean, they didn't edit out the organ-stealing robots from Deep Breath out of respect for all those people in Mexico who had their organs harvested. They didnt cut the deaths of the soldiers from Into the Dalek out of respect for all those soldiers that died in battle, why is *this* the only time that they just had to censor something "out of respect"??? If they're cutting things out of respect than why not edit out all death scenes? And all scenes that might be similar to real world events? It's not like the scene would have been disrespectful, anyway!
And they didnt cut out the scene where the robot is beheaded, they didnt cut out the Doctor talking about Ronin's head being cut off and "rolling on the floor", so why cut this particular scene? Why is *that* scene offensive while the others aren't?
Not to mention the fact that it made the "half man half engine" line make absolutely no sense, so it DID hurt the episode.
So what if the family of the journalists watched the episode, huh? How do you think they would feel.
How would the family of that girl that was kidnapped and had her internal organs removed in Mexico feel about Deep Breath? How would the family of that boy who was run over and would never walk again feel about the fact that people are am walking around on screen?
The episode was made before the beheadings, it has no connection to the beheading at all, the weapon was different, the setting, the situation, the nationalities of the people, the circumstances, the time period, the place it happened... There was literally NOTHING except for the fact that it was a beheading.
According to your logic, we should censor EVERYTHING on television just so we wouldn't offend anyone, and that's just stupid.
What happened to the journalists was a tragedy, but what the fuck does it have to do with this???
Just because the episode was made before the beheadings, it still had to be edited for audiences. Also, your points are stupid, especially the one about the run over boy. How would seeing people walk around on screen be any different to seeing people walk around in public?
Exactly! So you *do* see why this was pointless!
How do you think the families would react when they turn on the news and see an article about ISIS? Or go out and hear people talking about ISIS? Everything would remind them of it! So what? Do we need to put our entire life on hold until those people die? Dover just never mention anything that is somewhat related? Because this scene is as relevant as it would have been if they mentioned the Middle East in the episode. No difference at all.
I mean, if we need to censor something that's barely related, where do you draw the line? Once again, I have to mention that girl in Mexico, why was Deep Breath not heavily censored for her familie's sake?
And there were episode set during the Blitz in WWII, a lot if people died there, so why didnt they censor that too? Or the episode with Hitler? and what about "The Visitation"? Some people died in the fire if London, why not censor that? And it just goes in and on until there is no more Doctor Who, or any TV show, actually.
I said that seeing people walk around in public would be no different to walking around on a screen. I said nothing about it being pointless that they removed a scene that would cause public uproar and lots of people getting upset.
I really enjoyed this episode. I think Deep Breath is incredibly mediocre, watching it was like eating tofu. Watching Into the Dalek was like eating a delicious stir fry, and watching this episode was like eating a take-away pizza. It was great, but nothing to brag about or remember. I disagree to an extent about the Twelfth Doctor feeling out-of-character. Only some parts felt like they were written for Matt Smith, majority of the time I've felt that his Doctor was consistent.
I liked 12 using Venasun Akido.
I don't completly agree but you make good point so I'll give you a like :)
HURRY UP AND REACT TO LISTEN!!!
Wait, am I being impatient? Nah, I'm sure it's fine.
I think you missed the point entirely for this episode
Or three of these🌚
I HATED THIS EPISODE!
not because of the acting, it was good as ever,
not because of the characters, they where amusing
not because of the plot, it was decent and
not because of the antagonists, they worked fine
not because of the spoon, the spoon was hilarious
but because this is a freaking Robin Hood episode where no one handles a bow even slightly in the right way. The standing position was never right, no one ever used an anchor point, they closed one eye and how they held their Bows was just ridiculous. the worst was seing the shot in the last scene, when they all shot together at the spaceship....cringeworthy.
it is not that hard to find someone who does archery, be it modern sport or traditional or reenactment. even the wikipedia page about arcery describes everything accurate enough for them to at least notice that they are doing things wrong. It would have cost them litterally nothing more than ten minutes on the internet to do it much better, and an episode about Robin Hood deserves nothing less than an accurate depiction of archery.
tl;dr?
The depiction of arcery in this Episode was just wrong on many levels and it could have easily have been made much better.
MrSplodgeySplodge It shows how much efford is put into the episodes...or better, how much is not put into it.
TheCassiusTain Oh the irony, the *effort* you put into spelling....or better, how much is not put into it.
TomWasAlone We are not all native speakers, you know. Tell me again that I made a stupid little spelling error, when you can write, read and speak three languages fluently.
well so far series 8 hasn't been that good Deep Breath was just all over the place, In The Dalek was just stupid, Robot Of Sherwood was badly written, and as for Listen that so boaring Stephen Moffet needs to write better stories or go I could write better what happend to the days the doctor and his friends arrive whether it is in the past the present the future or to planets and became involved in the events there plenty stuff out there that could a Doctor Who story like Cowboys vs Aliens, Lucy, or what about a Dr Who version of The Purge 2 with edge of the seat action
Worst episode ever
I believe that the spoon seen as a direct link to the 7th and the gold arrow was a link to this story the silver nemesis. The reason I think this is in that episode they used gold arrows the kill the cybermen and in the finally we are going to see the cybermen.