you can buy a decent gamma ray spectrometer for far less than this PoS sells for. Take a look at the Radiacode or Measall products as two good examples...
@@project-326 For more fun, I just finished putting together an Open Gamma Detector. It's not as polished as a Radiacode, but I enjoy the DIY aspect and having it all open source hardware and software.
@@OpenGL4ever No chance of that. Despite the media hype in the west, that kind of thing is pretty rare these days and it only ever happened on products that had huge production volumes (Geiger counters are really small quantities). Real or fake, products need expensive things like tooling to be produced. It would have been impressive to made a fake Gamma Scout, given that the MCU went obsolete years ago...
A fun review. Seemed like a lot of chemistry for this result, although interesting to see anyway. While carbide may be hard to get there, I had the idea plain old firecrackers were not...? I was surprised to find carbide sold in the local K-mart store where I grew up. Apparently it had been sold for use in the old-style acetylene miner's lamps, and I guess no one at the store noticed that the local coal mines had shut down about two generations ago, and all the current customers for this product were sort of furtive looking kids, for some reason.
I wish you would have shown activity in counts instead of dose rates as that is what a Geiger Muller tube measures. All does rates using a GM tube are achieved by multiplying the count rate by an assumed energy (usually from a gamma from CS-137) to arrive at a does rate. As such all events detected by the GM regardless of type or energy are treated the same and show an incorrect does rate. For a proper rate you need to measure energy per time unit using an ion chamber or a spectrometer. Sorry to complain, this is just a pet peeve of mine as I have to do dose rates for safety. Thank you for your entertaining content. I genuinely respect you.
Yes, I totally agree with you. There are a couple of points: 1) I'm not sure that the Gamma Scout can display CPS, the UI is just horrible and if it is possible, I didn't figure it out. The keys didn't really work either, so even if there was a way to get this device to display in counts, the stupid buttons might have stopped me. 2) I used 3 different spectrometers to compare, so those instruments have full energy compensation. I looked at the spectra for alpha, beta and gamma. In addition, I did compare to some cheap GM tube devices and the conclusions were pretty much the same, Gamma reads low, very low. Alpha reads very high, Beta was a bit of a shit show with the values all over the place, but the average of the isotopes I tested was within 50%. 3) I will keep the second one and perhaps do some more testing in later videos, hopefully for comic effect. I really appreciate the feedback, especially when someone takes the time to create long comments with well thought through points. Thanks!
That's a good point, many people completely ignore that and it's a shame, but I think the author realizes this fact. We can be sure that the conversion ratio stays the same regardless the shielding position, so we can use the presented μSv/h values as arbitrary unit values.
13 years ago I was also thinking about getting the GammaScout and thought it was a great meter to have. I don't regret not buying it. Actually I must say that when it comes to accuracy, many post Chernobyl era civil Geiger counters (Bella, Anri Sosna, Pripyat) do much better than GammaScout. Some people would stupidly laugh at them for not using MCUs and relying on TTL or analog circuits instead, but what are the data storage and connectivity options good for when the data is nonsense?
Wow awesome video! Saved me from wasting my money! Thanks :) I was saving up to buy a "creaky example" but then I came across your channel. Now I'm pondering the Radiacode or the Kc761B. Haha or both as together they would be about the same as the lovely old yellow $%##@!! :) Thanks for your efforts !!! :)
My only input on your purchasing dilemma is this. The RC103 is better for those who want a plug-n-play experience. The KC761B is best for those who are going to be doing some more serious home-lab type experiments.
@@project-326 Wow thanks good point. when thinking about it. I'm interested in searching out old artifacts in second hand and op shops that maybe radioactive . So I'll take your point and reach for the 103 :). Again thanks for saving us money! !! 👍
This was gonna be my first toy thanks to bionerd23. But after years of waiting I went with a gmc 300. Then onto radiacode 102. I'm glad to see this vid as I thought the scout looked cheap.
A lot of the big RUclipsr's have this product, Bionard23, Brainiac75, Thunderf00t, SurvivalLily, etc. It is a part of the marketing strategy that the company has used to get sales. It seems that Studio326 wasn't in their plan, for some reason ;-)
I've always been interested in radiation and after a colleague at work bought a Radex Obsidian, I was also looking for something Geiger counter-like. I also had my eye on the Gamma Scout. After all, it appears in many “ray treasure hunters” videos. Fortunately, I found this channel here and watched this and a few other videos. It has since become a Radiacode 103 and the two of us have a lot of fun together. So thank you for your videos and to all those interested: Leave the Gamma Scout to the radioactivity influencers. Better buy something clever. 👍
The RC103 is a great product, there is just so much more to learn from a spectrometer than a basic counter... Glad you got something from the video, personally I got a lot of satisfaction from being able to destroy an old foe...
When I hit the exposed filament with 9 volts from 6 AA cells in series, it is an instantaneous reaction, basically as close as you can get to an exploding bridge-wire without the need to charge a capacitor up to a few kV.
@@project-326 dude, you do *not* need kilovovolts to torch a 1/4W 0805 resistor, even a 9V battery can do this...amateur rocketeers have been using them for decades. There's even something called a MEPIC resistor, which is specifically made to be an igniter, but those might be hard to get in single qty. p.s. actual exploding bridgewire igniters are several orders of magnitude faster then a busted lightbulb, unless you're building an implosion type nuke, there's no need for them :D
@@AKAtheA I will try that on my next attempt to detonate a shitty device. After this, I am now planning to get some redemption on a few other devices.... Frankly, the Gamma Scout is about the only product that fully deserves an "implosion type nuke" to perform a FULL tear-down. 🙂 I used EBD's in a previous life, they are not just used for nuclear applications, lower energy verients are used in many kinetic applications for the military. According to my old friends, who are still in the game, their use is expanding all the time as the specialist applications become more mainstream (such as air defense warheads that feature steerable energy patterns).
@@AKAtheA just as an aside, when launching a model rocket, the delay from 'decision' to 'initiation' is not so vital, when trying to capture slow motion footage on a cell phone, latency is a killer. I did a whole bunch of experiments before the final "BANG" and it was the variability that really was crucial aspect. I just looked through the 13 practice video sequences (thank you for prompting me to do that) I captured to get the timing right, I was lucky to get usable video from any of the cell phones I had positioned to capture footage. It was pure luck to be really honest!
The reason why Gamma Scout shows different values compared to other meters is also the different geometry used, this has the biggest influence while measuring point sources creating non-uniform radiation field in their vicinity. Especially if they face the window, the radiation intensity inside the tube significantly changes and the result is an effective value. I wouldn't mind the manufacturer not changing the design for a long time, but the price is insane.
When you compare different devices it’s better to make sure field is isotropic. With point sources it is hard to achieve (except very strong source from a distance).
I agree, cps is better from a pure measurement point of view. At some point, that does need to be converted back with a device that is sold as a personal dosimeter...
It makes sense to calculate Sieverts from alpha only when it gets inhaled/ingested and in such a case you have to know the activity, chemical form of the nuclide and other factors. Beta under about 60keV is the same case as it can't penetrate the layer of dead skin. Above this energy level (and maybe 7.5MeV in the case of alpha) it makes sense to calculate the skin dose (rate), but for this you need the flux density and energy of particles forming that flux. GM tube can be used for this purpose, but it requires doing some calculations to know how it responds.
@@Ales.2000 you will have some trouble reading internal doses with a GM. Seriously though, Alpha and Beta even at low energy levels can cause burns to the skin causing it to turn red and get sore if there is enough of it. For proper exposure rates an ion chamber instrument should be used and deep dose / shallow dose rates calculated. See section 4.0 (page 55) of this pdf for an example on how to do so. www.pnnl.gov/main/publications/external/technical_reports/PNNL-14135rev1.pdf
I bought a Gamma Scout many, many years ago. It had an old style serial port so there has been an upgrade ... to USB. I concur with your scatological description. I had the unit for less than a month and returned it for a refund. The unit lacked ESD protection so it wiped it's log often and the clock had to be reset. The radiation counts were affected by exposure to bright light. The case was quite meh and the door to the serial port was very flimsy. It was a costly purchase but the loss was only my time, foreign exchange conversion (twice) and shipping. I think the programming for the unit was in battery backed memory (may still be) so changing the battery required a return to the manufacturer OR soldering a new battery in parallel before removing the old battery. I have never regretted returning the unit.
God I hate this device so much. I've owned one for years and suddently the battery died. I have experience with soldering so I tried to replace it, but I suspect that my soldering iron caused a current spike that fried the MCU. Now this piece of shit always displays 0.00 uSv. Luckily I discovered the radiacode shortly after so now I have one of those and it's several orders of magnitude better, even if it's not really a geiger counter. Anyways, speaking of the lack of clicking sound, I found out that on my model, even if it wasnt the version w/ alert, you could click the pc conn button to have clicking sounds, but you couldnt see the dose or counts. I agree that this "product" is a disgrace to the manufactoring capabilities of Germany.
It's not cheap (not at all) , it's inconvenient, it's not precise, it's ugly. I remember, when looking back on evaluating readers, Gamma Scout was amongst those and I thought back then: Why can I not change the battery? does it have to be open like that on the front and, how strangely ugly this looked. But then again, if ugly, it might be precise - it thought back. I'm happy, not to have ever bought this yellow turdish thing. thanks for confirming this... Going for a Radiacode...
Nice video, I liked the deserved rapid dissambly part! Now that went as actually expected! Hilarious! I initially actually thought that window thingy was a good idea but without a connection to the electronics it makes it more useless... I think it's actually dangerous, giving bad readings and has to be declared an official POS. P. S what did the owner of the rented house say about the hole in his Balkon floor🤣?
I 100% agree with your point regarding shoddy products that just have a 'Made in Germany' sticker on them, and have that drive sales instead of good engineering and design. Its unfortunately far to common.
A GammaScout is something I almost got over a decade ago. I'm glad I didn't buy one. A good ol' + 60 year-old US-made CD V-700 would put a GammaScout to shame!
Indeed! CD V-700's are very nice, energy-compensated G-M counters. I'm glad I have one! They may be bulky and heavy, but they work great! They can withstand EMPs, too!
I wanted to buy it today, thanks for review! I prefer more modern products like Radiacode/Raysid but wanted to get an additional meter for alpha radiation (just a hobbyist), so will probably get sth cheap or build one myself.
Alpha tubes are really expensive, it drives me nuts that I can buy a fully fledged gamma ray spectrometer for the price of an alpha sensitive Geiger counter... If you get the Raysid, please do let us all know your thoughts on the device, I have not tested one of those yet... The form factor is great.
@@project-326 True, I think I’ll get Raysid. I’m lucky to be Polish, Raysid is produced in Poland and there’s one second hand offer for 420 EUR. I can make a blog post to compare it to my 103, as a hobbyist.
Realy cool review! By the way: Are you using the same AI voice like YJK Audiobooks or are I am embarassing right now and you are a realy good narrator?
Finally someone has the guts to say the truth, I’ve despised this product for a while I can’t believe I wanted to buy this junk, what stopped me is detailed reviews of others where I saw the poor quality. It literally costs about $20 to manufacture probably even less. All similar units of the era come with the metal mesh to protect the myca coating on top of the lens, they make this crap so cheap that’s they didn’t even bother installing the mesh!
@@GamingAmbienceLive I have just purchased a product that might actually be worse - far worse than the Gamma Scout and will reviewing it soon. The product is called the Nukalert...
You've turned my thoughts into a nice movie. But I have only one thing pro GS: comparing to other BS GM counters available its USB connection to a PC software is more functional than the ones of GQ Electronics, that simply call their costumers dumbs when they ask for help connecting the garbage.
I bought one many decades ago and I can attest its a total POS! You have to agree though that they did a pretty good job on the battery consumption lasting for several years.
I'm kind of assuming that you mean "best performing" relative to its pricing, which is always a fair comparison. That said, it is about the cheapest alpha capable GM tube (I always ignore eBay pricing or other used supplies for a pricing reference) so it's being compared to what? The alpha threshold is around 4 MeV, which is pretty poor (compared to alpha specialized tubes), gamma is specified at 1.5 cps/uSv/h(Co60), which is only slightly higher than a $10 glass tube such as the J321. The issue with the LND712 (and the Centronix equivalent) is that the gamma sensitivity is all over the place with regards to energy and that is probably due to the argon in the gas mix when most tubes use helium to balance the low energy 'bloom'. The LND 712 has a 5:1 ratio for energy sensitivity between, say, the Am-241 59 KeV peak and the 661 of Cs-137 and even then, that is specified through the side of the tube, which is stainless steel and acts as a compensation element. Via the mica window, the ratio will be much higher. If you were just buying a tube for Beta-gamma sensitivity and wanted a reasonable energy balance, then you would buy something else (He-Ne). The only reason that this tube sees any sales is because it it has 'alpha' in the spec. I'm kind of hoping that you can refute some of my data or assumptions, I always enjoy learning and have a pretty high tolerance to ego, so I won't be offended if you can educate me. But please, I would be very grateful if you can back up the expression " one of the best performing tubes on the market" with some hard data.
@@project-326 Yes, I should have said all-round price-performance. The LND712 has a very good reputation in geiger diy/enthusiast circles. It is highly sought after and commands premium prices, especially compared to the very popular SBM-20/STS5, M4011, J321 etc. And yes, there are more sensitive and more linear pancake style alpha tubes but the small form factor and relative robustness of the LND712 are an advantage in a hand-held device. Its only real competitors in that application are the (scarce) SBT-9 and the ZP1401. All ancient by tech standards, and slowly being supplanted by solid state devices. I have an interest in alpha because of my paraffin pressure lamp restoration hobby. The best mantles for those are thoriated and exposure to mantle dust is a health concern.
5:51 What microcontroller is in this Gamma Scout? Please tell the complete name of the chip. What's on the chip's label? If it is from Texas Instrument, then i would assume it's an MSP430. If i am correct, this is not an old microchip! There are many new microchip generations of that microcontroller architecture available. That would also explain the low power consumption of the Gamma Scout, because the MSP430 from Texas Instruments has one of the lowest power consumption of all microcontrollers. The 32 bit ARM-based microcontrollers require significantly more power and drain the battery much faster, even if they can do more, like addressing larger displays and such, but if you don't need that more performance power, it's a waste to use an ARM based microcontroller. In addition, 16 bit is not bad, but rather it saves transistors compared to a 32 bit microcontroller and that in turn saves electrical energy. That's why it is a 16 bit microcontroller. The MSP430 was designed to save as much energy as possible and the architecture is from the 90s. Over time, however, there have been new generations of chips with this architecture. And for the data you get from a Geigercounter tube, 16 bits are more than enough. Especially since you can also calculate with higher integer or fixed point floating point accuracy by using software, if needed. The calculations just take a little longer, but as a human you don't even notice that. A typical MSP430 runs at 16 MHz and a Geiger counter doesn't have to do large calculations, it's not a 3D graphics card. 13:10 Scintillation counters, which can be used as gamma ray spectrometers, are more sensitive than Geiger counter tubes. Therefore they measure higher values than normal Geiger counters and this should be taken into account. For this reason, their disadvantage is that they are easier to overload with a strong source and high activity, thus a short half-life.
@@project-326 BTW, the MSP430P325 is certified for a temperature range of -40 to +85 °C, this is the temperature range for industrial devices. Military range is -55 to +150 °C. It would be interesting to know for which temperature range the microcontrollers used in the other Geiger counters are suitable. Microcontrollers for consumer devices are only certified for a temperature range of 0 to +70 °C. If it's cold outside, there would be a problem with these.
they are a weird range of devices in terms of price and performance. They aren't cheap, but then again, they aren't hugely expensive. They do seem to be very well built and function well, at least from the information I have seen, but for the same kind of money I can buy a Radiacode 102 gamma ray spectrometer...
Me too! We are just finishing up Chinese New Year here and I have some questions I need to ask the company before I get on with that video. The product is very new, there seem to be some bugs that are probably very simple to fix, so I want to give them a chance to fix those before making the video.
I have a Gamma Scout that I bought 25 years ago. The first battery lasted about 12 years. Other than that I couldn't agree more with every single statement in this video. This counter is an absolute piece of s#!t. Offered mine to my young son who is interested very much in nuclear physics and he refused it! A cheap counter made from kit is vastly superior to this garbage. I should have known they didn't know shit about the subject when I saw that they named the CPS button "Bq" for Becquerel thus giving the less knowledgeable users impression that the instrument can measure the activity in Bq. The LND712 tube is not a terrible tube but the Gamma Scout gave it a bad reputation. I've been thinking about shooting mine with a rifle after salvaging the tube.
I have an interesting relationship with the manufacturers of radiation detection equipment. This is a hobby channel so I get to say what I think about products. None of the companies that make products like me but they treat me in one of 3 ways: 1) Respect the honestly but hold their breath when I tell them that I am reviewing their product. 2) Scared $hitless when I tell that that I am going to review their latest product and hope the video flops. 3) Wishing I was dead already. There is only one company in this category, you guessed it, Gamma Scout Gmbh... Should you decide to shoot the device, please video it and, if possible, borrow a slow motion camera to get it's demise in all its gory glory!
![A Small, Cheap Micro-Spectrometer - Review [Pt 1]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/MOXryggwr_Q/mqdefault.jpg)
What a disappointing piece of equipment. Glad I never sunk any money into one. Thanks for the thorough review!
you can buy a decent gamma ray spectrometer for far less than this PoS sells for. Take a look at the Radiacode or Measall products as two good examples...
@@project-326 For more fun, I just finished putting together an Open Gamma Detector. It's not as polished as a Radiacode, but I enjoy the DIY aspect and having it all open source hardware and software.
@@feraloid awesome, absolutely awesome!
Please let everyone know where we can find your work, lots of the folk here would really love to know more!
@@project-326 Is it possible that you bought a Chinese plagiarism? Read my other comment for more details.
@@OpenGL4ever No chance of that. Despite the media hype in the west, that kind of thing is pretty rare these days and it only ever happened on products that had huge production volumes (Geiger counters are really small quantities). Real or fake, products need expensive things like tooling to be produced. It would have been impressive to made a fake Gamma Scout, given that the MCU went obsolete years ago...
A fun review. Seemed like a lot of chemistry for this result, although interesting to see anyway. While carbide may be hard to get there, I had the idea plain old firecrackers were not...? I was surprised to find carbide sold in the local K-mart store where I grew up. Apparently it had been sold for use in the old-style acetylene miner's lamps, and I guess no one at the store noticed that the local coal mines had shut down about two generations ago, and all the current customers for this product were sort of furtive looking kids, for some reason.
For sure it was the long way around to get this result - but it was such a great chemistry lesson for my three kids, I just had to do it...
Mad respect for DIYing kablammo powder!!!
I'm torn between saying "I've been waiting for a chocolate fireguard teardown video" and "WONT SOMEBODY PLEASE THINK OF THE "VOID" TAPE!?!?!?!?!"
I wish you would have shown activity in counts instead of dose rates as that is what a Geiger Muller tube measures. All does rates using a GM tube are achieved by multiplying the count rate by an assumed energy (usually from a gamma from CS-137) to arrive at a does rate. As such all events detected by the GM regardless of type or energy are treated the same and show an incorrect does rate. For a proper rate you need to measure energy per time unit using an ion chamber or a spectrometer. Sorry to complain, this is just a pet peeve of mine as I have to do dose rates for safety. Thank you for your entertaining content. I genuinely respect you.
Yes, I totally agree with you. There are a couple of points:
1) I'm not sure that the Gamma Scout can display CPS, the UI is just horrible and if it is possible, I didn't figure it out. The keys didn't really work either, so even if there was a way to get this device to display in counts, the stupid buttons might have stopped me.
2) I used 3 different spectrometers to compare, so those instruments have full energy compensation. I looked at the spectra for alpha, beta and gamma. In addition, I did compare to some cheap GM tube devices and the conclusions were pretty much the same, Gamma reads low, very low. Alpha reads very high, Beta was a bit of a shit show with the values all over the place, but the average of the isotopes I tested was within 50%.
3) I will keep the second one and perhaps do some more testing in later videos, hopefully for comic effect.
I really appreciate the feedback, especially when someone takes the time to create long comments with well thought through points. Thanks!
That's a good point, many people completely ignore that and it's a shame, but I think the author realizes this fact. We can be sure that the conversion ratio stays the same regardless the shielding position, so we can use the presented μSv/h values as arbitrary unit values.
I'm from Germany, and I can only say: this piece of equipment is a real disgrace to our country
13 years ago I was also thinking about getting the GammaScout and thought it was a great meter to have. I don't regret not buying it. Actually I must say that when it comes to accuracy, many post Chernobyl era civil Geiger counters (Bella, Anri Sosna, Pripyat) do much better than GammaScout. Some people would stupidly laugh at them for not using MCUs and relying on TTL or analog circuits instead, but what are the data storage and connectivity options good for when the data is nonsense?
Take a look at my type 77 video, just 2 transistors...
Wow awesome video! Saved me from wasting my money! Thanks :) I was saving up to buy a "creaky example" but then I came across your channel. Now I'm pondering the Radiacode or the Kc761B. Haha or both as together they would be about the same as the lovely old yellow $%##@!! :) Thanks for your efforts !!! :)
My only input on your purchasing dilemma is this. The RC103 is better for those who want a plug-n-play experience. The KC761B is best for those who are going to be doing some more serious home-lab type experiments.
@@project-326 Wow thanks good point. when thinking about it. I'm interested in searching out old artifacts in second hand and op shops that maybe radioactive . So I'll take your point and reach for the 103 :). Again thanks for saving us money! !!
👍
@@TheFastday You are most welcome!
This was gonna be my first toy thanks to bionerd23. But after years of waiting I went with a gmc 300. Then onto radiacode 102. I'm glad to see this vid as I thought the scout looked cheap.
A lot of the big RUclipsr's have this product, Bionard23, Brainiac75, Thunderf00t, SurvivalLily, etc. It is a part of the marketing strategy that the company has used to get sales. It seems that Studio326 wasn't in their plan, for some reason ;-)
I've always been interested in radiation and after a colleague at work bought a Radex Obsidian, I was also looking for something Geiger counter-like. I also had my eye on the Gamma Scout. After all, it appears in many “ray treasure hunters” videos.
Fortunately, I found this channel here and watched this and a few other videos. It has since become a Radiacode 103 and the two of us have a lot of fun together.
So thank you for your videos and to all those interested: Leave the Gamma Scout to the radioactivity influencers. Better buy something clever. 👍
The RC103 is a great product, there is just so much more to learn from a spectrometer than a basic counter...
Glad you got something from the video, personally I got a lot of satisfaction from being able to destroy an old foe...
FYI a 0-5 ohm SMD resistor is a smaller and more available initiator for supersonic disassembly ;-)
But it required much higher current, bulb filament is thin and few tens of mA are enough.
When I hit the exposed filament with 9 volts from 6 AA cells in series, it is an instantaneous reaction, basically as close as you can get to an exploding bridge-wire without the need to charge a capacitor up to a few kV.
@@project-326 dude, you do *not* need kilovovolts to torch a 1/4W 0805 resistor, even a 9V battery can do this...amateur rocketeers have been using them for decades.
There's even something called a MEPIC resistor, which is specifically made to be an igniter, but those might be hard to get in single qty.
p.s. actual exploding bridgewire igniters are several orders of magnitude faster then a busted lightbulb, unless you're building an implosion type nuke, there's no need for them :D
@@AKAtheA I will try that on my next attempt to detonate a shitty device. After this, I am now planning to get some redemption on a few other devices.... Frankly, the Gamma Scout is about the only product that fully deserves an "implosion type nuke" to perform a FULL tear-down. 🙂
I used EBD's in a previous life, they are not just used for nuclear applications, lower energy verients are used in many kinetic applications for the military. According to my old friends, who are still in the game, their use is expanding all the time as the specialist applications become more mainstream (such as air defense warheads that feature steerable energy patterns).
@@AKAtheA just as an aside, when launching a model rocket, the delay from 'decision' to 'initiation' is not so vital, when trying to capture slow motion footage on a cell phone, latency is a killer. I did a whole bunch of experiments before the final "BANG" and it was the variability that really was crucial aspect. I just looked through the 13 practice video sequences (thank you for prompting me to do that) I captured to get the timing right, I was lucky to get usable video from any of the cell phones I had positioned to capture footage. It was pure luck to be really honest!
I faintly remember that there were beeps in the non-beeping one, but only if the cable was plugged in.
I haven't watched it but I've already liked it :). I am sure its gonna be EPIC :).
The reason why Gamma Scout shows different values compared to other meters is also the different geometry used, this has the biggest influence while measuring point sources creating non-uniform radiation field in their vicinity. Especially if they face the window, the radiation intensity inside the tube significantly changes and the result is an effective value.
I wouldn't mind the manufacturer not changing the design for a long time, but the price is insane.
When you compare different devices it’s better to make sure field is isotropic. With point sources it is hard to achieve (except very strong source from a distance).
Yes, I agree with you again! A point source is very subject to geometry considerations.
Measuring alpha and beta in uSv/h is also wrong, I think. But it’s a question to device itself.
I agree, cps is better from a pure measurement point of view. At some point, that does need to be converted back with a device that is sold as a personal dosimeter...
If you have enough Alpha and/or Beta dose rates are appropriate with the right instrument. Is a Gamma Scout an appropriate instrument for this? No!
@@connclark2154 Quite what situation is appropriate for the Gamma Scout? As far as I can see, there is only one - RED (rapid explosive disassembly)
It makes sense to calculate Sieverts from alpha only when it gets inhaled/ingested and in such a case you have to know the activity, chemical form of the nuclide and other factors. Beta under about 60keV is the same case as it can't penetrate the layer of dead skin. Above this energy level (and maybe 7.5MeV in the case of alpha) it makes sense to calculate the skin dose (rate), but for this you need the flux density and energy of particles forming that flux. GM tube can be used for this purpose, but it requires doing some calculations to know how it responds.
@@Ales.2000 you will have some trouble reading internal doses with a GM. Seriously though, Alpha and Beta even at low energy levels can cause burns to the skin causing it to turn red and get sore if there is enough of it. For proper exposure rates an ion chamber instrument should be used and deep dose / shallow dose rates calculated. See section 4.0 (page 55) of this pdf for an example on how to do so. www.pnnl.gov/main/publications/external/technical_reports/PNNL-14135rev1.pdf
I bought a Gamma Scout many, many years ago. It had an old style serial port so there has been an upgrade ... to USB. I concur with your scatological description. I had the unit for less than a month and returned it for a refund. The unit lacked ESD protection so it wiped it's log often and the clock had to be reset. The radiation counts were affected by exposure to bright light. The case was quite meh and the door to the serial port was very flimsy. It was a costly purchase but the loss was only my time, foreign exchange conversion (twice) and shipping. I think the programming for the unit was in battery backed memory (may still be) so changing the battery required a return to the manufacturer OR soldering a new battery in parallel before removing the old battery. I have never regretted returning the unit.
God I hate this device so much. I've owned one for years and suddently the battery died. I have experience with soldering so I tried to replace it, but I suspect that my soldering iron caused a current spike that fried the MCU. Now this piece of shit always displays 0.00 uSv. Luckily I discovered the radiacode shortly after so now I have one of those and it's several orders of magnitude better, even if it's not really a geiger counter.
Anyways, speaking of the lack of clicking sound, I found out that on my model, even if it wasnt the version w/ alert, you could click the pc conn button to have clicking sounds, but you couldnt see the dose or counts.
I agree that this "product" is a disgrace to the manufactoring capabilities of Germany.
I am thinking that the gamma scout could have a regular 'guest appearance' in new videos...
Finally you met your nemesis
met it and destroyed it...
Interestingly, in Russia, calcium carbide can be bought freely (somehow used for septic tanks). You can also buy acetylene in a steel cylinder.
It's not cheap (not at all) , it's inconvenient, it's not precise, it's ugly. I remember, when looking back on evaluating readers, Gamma Scout was amongst those and I thought back then: Why can I not change the battery? does it have to be open like that on the front and, how strangely ugly this looked. But then again, if ugly, it might be precise - it thought back. I'm happy, not to have ever bought this yellow turdish thing. thanks for confirming this... Going for a Radiacode...
Nice video, I liked the deserved rapid dissambly part! Now that went as actually expected! Hilarious! I initially actually thought that window thingy was a good idea but without a connection to the electronics it makes it more useless... I think it's actually dangerous, giving bad readings and has to be declared an official POS.
P. S what did the owner of the rented house say about the hole in his Balkon floor🤣?
It was a table and it was rotten through, no problem.
I 100% agree with your point regarding shoddy products that just have a 'Made in Germany' sticker on them, and have that drive sales instead of good engineering and design. Its unfortunately far to common.
A GammaScout is something I almost got over a decade ago. I'm glad I didn't buy one. A good ol' + 60 year-old US-made CD V-700 would put a GammaScout to shame!
I agree, those CD series devices are in very high demand these days.
Indeed! CD V-700's are very nice, energy-compensated G-M counters. I'm glad I have one! They may be bulky and heavy, but they work great! They can withstand EMPs, too!
Thanks bro.
I used to modify these to have a recharible battery and an internsl test source.❤
I normally skip ANY A video that uses AI voices. Glad i didn't slip yours.
Wow, thanks
I wanted to buy it today, thanks for review! I prefer more modern products like Radiacode/Raysid but wanted to get an additional meter for alpha radiation (just a hobbyist), so will probably get sth cheap or build one myself.
Alpha tubes are really expensive, it drives me nuts that I can buy a fully fledged gamma ray spectrometer for the price of an alpha sensitive Geiger counter...
If you get the Raysid, please do let us all know your thoughts on the device, I have not tested one of those yet... The form factor is great.
@@project-326 True, I think I’ll get Raysid. I’m lucky to be Polish, Raysid is produced in Poland and there’s one second hand offer for 420 EUR. I can make a blog post to compare it to my 103, as a hobbyist.
Realy cool review!
By the way: Are you using the same AI voice like YJK Audiobooks or are I am embarassing right now and you are a realy good narrator?
I'm not sure who YJK Audiobooks is, but yes I am using a text to voice.
Where did you get the Cs137?
Spectrum Techniques...
Finally someone has the guts to say the truth, I’ve despised this product for a while I can’t believe I wanted to buy this junk, what stopped me is detailed reviews of others where I saw the poor quality. It literally costs about $20 to manufacture probably even less. All similar units of the era come with the metal mesh to protect the myca coating on top of the lens, they make this crap so cheap that’s they didn’t even bother installing the mesh!
Glad you enjoyed it, I really enjoyed the rapid disassembly - my 3 kids helped and it was a memorable activity for them.
@@project-326 i loved that lol! that product deserves it
@@GamingAmbienceLive I have just purchased a product that might actually be worse - far worse than the Gamma Scout and will reviewing it soon. The product is called the Nukalert...
Don't decent Geiger counters indicate if they are overloading? Seems like a hazardous product if anyone were to depend on it for personal safety.
Yes, and the key word is "decent" which doesn't apply to the Gamma Scout in any shape or form.
You've turned my thoughts into a nice movie. But I have only one thing pro GS: comparing to other BS GM counters available its USB connection to a PC software is more functional than the ones of GQ Electronics, that simply call their costumers dumbs when they ask for help connecting the garbage.
My one was too old to get the app to work, I tried...
I bought one many decades ago and I can attest its a total POS! You have to agree though that they did a pretty good job on the battery consumption lasting for several years.
Yes, the low power operation was pretty good considering the age of the design.
Uses a comon 400V tube inside. Same one in s RM4. Replscethat battery with a 18560 lithoum and a charge regulator.❤
I almost threw up after seeing you touch the POS without a glove. I hope you washed your hands after touching it without a glove 😂
I'm already taking penicillin after that irresponsible lapse of judgment.
well then what is a decent detector do you recommend
take a look on this channel, there are quite a few reviews for different low-cost options.
I concur with your evaluation of the device, but the LND712 GM tube is one of the best performing tubes on the market.
I'm kind of assuming that you mean "best performing" relative to its pricing, which is always a fair comparison. That said, it is about the cheapest alpha capable GM tube (I always ignore eBay pricing or other used supplies for a pricing reference) so it's being compared to what?
The alpha threshold is around 4 MeV, which is pretty poor (compared to alpha specialized tubes), gamma is specified at 1.5 cps/uSv/h(Co60), which is only slightly higher than a $10 glass tube such as the J321. The issue with the LND712 (and the Centronix equivalent) is that the gamma sensitivity is all over the place with regards to energy and that is probably due to the argon in the gas mix when most tubes use helium to balance the low energy 'bloom'. The LND 712 has a 5:1 ratio for energy sensitivity between, say, the Am-241 59 KeV peak and the 661 of Cs-137 and even then, that is specified through the side of the tube, which is stainless steel and acts as a compensation element. Via the mica window, the ratio will be much higher.
If you were just buying a tube for Beta-gamma sensitivity and wanted a reasonable energy balance, then you would buy something else (He-Ne). The only reason that this tube sees any sales is because it it has 'alpha' in the spec.
I'm kind of hoping that you can refute some of my data or assumptions, I always enjoy learning and have a pretty high tolerance to ego, so I won't be offended if you can educate me. But please, I would be very grateful if you can back up the expression " one of the best performing tubes on the market" with some hard data.
@@project-326 Yes, I should have said all-round price-performance. The LND712 has a very good reputation in geiger diy/enthusiast circles. It is highly sought after and commands premium prices, especially compared to the very popular SBM-20/STS5, M4011, J321 etc. And yes, there are more sensitive and more linear pancake style alpha tubes but the small form factor and relative robustness of the LND712 are an advantage in a hand-held device. Its only real competitors in that application are the (scarce) SBT-9 and the ZP1401. All ancient by tech standards, and slowly being supplanted by solid state devices. I have an interest in alpha because of my paraffin pressure lamp restoration hobby. The best mantles for those are thoriated and exposure to mantle dust is a health concern.
I had one with a RS232 interface that worked...
5:51 What microcontroller is in this Gamma Scout? Please tell the complete name of the chip. What's on the chip's label? If it is from Texas Instrument, then i would assume it's an MSP430. If i am correct, this is not an old microchip! There are many new microchip generations of that microcontroller architecture available. That would also explain the low power consumption of the Gamma Scout, because the MSP430 from Texas Instruments has one of the lowest power consumption of all microcontrollers. The 32 bit ARM-based microcontrollers require significantly more power and drain the battery much faster, even if they can do more, like addressing larger displays and such, but if you don't need that more performance power, it's a waste to use an ARM based microcontroller.
In addition, 16 bit is not bad, but rather it saves transistors compared to a 32 bit microcontroller and that in turn saves electrical energy. That's why it is a 16 bit microcontroller. The MSP430 was designed to save as much energy as possible and the architecture is from the 90s. Over time, however, there have been new generations of chips with this architecture.
And for the data you get from a Geigercounter tube, 16 bits are more than enough. Especially since you can also calculate with higher integer or fixed point floating point accuracy by using software, if needed. The calculations just take a little longer, but as a human you don't even notice that. A typical MSP430 runs at 16 MHz and a Geiger counter doesn't have to do large calculations, it's not a 3D graphics card.
13:10 Scintillation counters, which can be used as gamma ray spectrometers, are more sensitive than Geiger counter tubes. Therefore they measure higher values than normal Geiger counters and this should be taken into account. For this reason, their disadvantage is that they are easier to overload with a strong source and high activity, thus a short half-life.
www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/texas-instruments/MSP430P325IPM/372488
@@project-326 Thanks.
@@project-326 BTW, the MSP430P325 is certified for a temperature range of -40 to +85 °C, this is the temperature range for industrial devices. Military range is -55 to +150 °C. It would be interesting to know for which temperature range the microcontrollers used in the other Geiger counters are suitable. Microcontrollers for consumer devices are only certified for a temperature range of 0 to +70 °C. If it's cold outside, there would be a problem with these.
About that energetic part, I almost thought you'd make HMTD for this XD
I did consider it, and a few others but the kids really enjoyed helping to make the Carbide - lots of fire and noise.
I'd love to see a review of the Ecotest Terra-P models. Regards.
they are a weird range of devices in terms of price and performance. They aren't cheap, but then again, they aren't hugely expensive. They do seem to be very well built and function well, at least from the information I have seen, but for the same kind of money I can buy a Radiacode 102 gamma ray spectrometer...
20:08 So they're like TI with the graphing calculator TI-8x series.
no where near that good!
So Gamma Scout says that Weapons guy is safe handling the Strontium? Right? RIIIIGHT?!?!
based chemistry lesson.
This thing looks like "Made in China" (prejudice alarm).
They are listed 400 € each - much too expensive.
Much too expensive and really shitty too.
Yes, it looks like old-school (15 years ago) "MiC" but is actually made in Germany.
The MCU is slightly wonky. WHHHYYYYYY?
Yup, just made badly...
well done..!!
And this costs 530 euro minimum
Yup, a total rip-off.
I'm waiting KC761B review
Me too!
We are just finishing up Chinese New Year here and I have some questions I need to ask the company before I get on with that video. The product is very new, there seem to be some bugs that are probably very simple to fix, so I want to give them a chance to fix those before making the video.
@@project-326 Thanks , I hope to see full detail of testing with many radioisotopes
How much it costs ?
Nearly 600 Euros for a rechargeable one. Ouch. 💩💩
It costs more than the KC761 which is a full alpha/beta/gamma spectrometer...
I have a Gamma Scout that I bought 25 years ago. The first battery lasted about 12 years. Other than that I couldn't agree more with every single statement in this video. This counter is an absolute piece of s#!t. Offered mine to my young son who is interested very much in nuclear physics and he refused it! A cheap counter made from kit is vastly superior to this garbage. I should have known they didn't know shit about the subject when I saw that they named the CPS button "Bq" for Becquerel thus giving the less knowledgeable users impression that the instrument can measure the activity in Bq. The LND712 tube is not a terrible tube but the Gamma Scout gave it a bad reputation. I've been thinking about shooting mine with a rifle after salvaging the tube.
I have an interesting relationship with the manufacturers of radiation detection equipment. This is a hobby channel so I get to say what I think about products. None of the companies that make products like me but they treat me in one of 3 ways:
1) Respect the honestly but hold their breath when I tell them that I am reviewing their product.
2) Scared $hitless when I tell that that I am going to review their latest product and hope the video flops.
3) Wishing I was dead already. There is only one company in this category, you guessed it, Gamma Scout Gmbh...
Should you decide to shoot the device, please video it and, if possible, borrow a slow motion camera to get it's demise in all its gory glory!
I'll watch it if you upload a version with a human voice
could be worse though, it could be a video without any voice!
;-)
@@project-326 Yeah it's slightly better than what a 14-year old uploaded in 2010
Good, I will not buy that gammascout shit