What If Captain Picard Hadn't Actually Been Rescued From the Borg?
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- Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
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Fun Fact: Patrick Stewart once said that he wished he could have been Locutus of Borg for longer, being a recurring enemy for a while before being rescued.
Maybe they could have had a Thomas Riker style transporter accident while rescuing him, allowing Patrick Stewart to play opposite himself in both roles.
good gods, could you imagine a season of Riker as Captain, doing captain things, but having this shadow of his failure to rescue picard hangingg over him? and then in that seasons sweeps week finding out that locutus is still actually alive, and suddenly he has a chance to redeem himself in his own heart.
Imagine Locutus being so heavily indoctrinated by the Collective that he has only a vague, dreamlike memory of having once been an entity named Picard, and vehemently resists being rescued -- only to have Riker tell him "Resistance is futile...Captain."
Following the premise of this video (what if Picard was not rescued from the Borg), how about a "What If..." focusing on Voyager, their encounter with the Borg, and ultimately with Locutus (with the return of Patrick in the role), even on one or two occasion instead of the Borg Queen (as entertaining as Alice Krige and Susanna Thompson were in that role).
Reminds me of one comic where the Enterprise gets contacted by a parallel Enterprise where they didn't manage to get Picard back and everything went bad afterwards. In that timeline Riker is Captain and Shelby his first officer.
Over the story they manage to capture their version of Locutus and try basically the same tricks as in the prime universe, but some things are a bit different and they have to creatively adjust their strategy.
But yeah, having Picard stick with the Borg for the season, only being rescued at the end sounds like a really interesting plot. A bit like Yar of Hell was planned as a full season.
I was in a 3k tent city in the UAE watching this in Desert Storm, with every one flipping out in my tent city.
I think the single visual problem with nu-trek compared to old especially when looking back at TNG is that it's been well established Star Fleet vessels are not simply military ships.
The overwhelming sheer size of star fleet ships comes from the fact that they are mobile cities with warp drives, fitted with tens of thousands of living quarters, research areas, medical facilities, and schools. Without the saucer section, where everyone lives, the ships are barely the size of the Deviant. TNG's bridge alone is visibly a comfortable place to be, with soft lighting and all the controls to the ship accessible while completely leaning back in your seat, and even the standing consoles being just at arms resting position; Compared to even SNW's enterprise where not a single spot looks like you can be at ease other than the Captains chair, and the lighting so harsh it would make using anything other than a tactile control an eyesore. Nu-Trek starships look like warships, without any indicator that civilians are present or even welcome onboard, and with ever aspect made to look important and imposingly hi-tech.
The struggle was real man. I remember that wait.
Ohhh I love this. Would be so down for more "what if" videos in the future!
I was 25 years old and I still have anxiety watching that series finale.
This was my first time experiencing a cliffhanger. I felt so betrayed when my dad told me we wouldn't find out what happens next week
I watched TOS when they first aired on broadcast TV on a 19" Zenith black and white television. I had to wait until "Star Trek: The Motion Picture" for more Star Trek.
Off topic from Star Trek, you may be the only person I ever heard who was will to give Hot Rod/Rodimus Prime a chance. LOL.
My 6 year old delf was totally in denial about what I witnessed at the movies one fateful day in 1986.
Optimus 4 Life!
Sascha Tsar :D Now I'm picturing some Russian Tsar Alexander as chief of security onboard the Starship Enterprise. xD
I always thought it would’ve been interesting just having it for a season, ya know Captain Riker and 1st Commander Shelby fighting Locutus’ assault on the Alpha quadrant over the season and the stresses and issues of the Federation being at war from a virtually unseen and superior enemy being lead by one of their most decorated captains alive at the time.
Then Geordi and Data figure out that attrition is the best offense against the Borg, this strategy pushes the Borg back to beyond the alpha quadrant but not before one last ditch effort, very unusual of the Borg, being the assault at Wolf 359 and the attack of earth, with the finale for the season being Best of Both Worlds.
I figure this way we could get a full season of ass kicking naval battles and high stakes (a la DS9) and not have to change the other seasons episodes.
Riker as captain and what if, and I'm talking hypothetical, a younger Commander portrayed by Kate Mulgrew as first officer. With the success of TNG, her getting Voyager would seem natural. Imagine how much different Voyager would be had an established character continued on in a new series. See Lt. Commander Warf aka the trekaholic.
The Borg literally Broke captain Picard. Made him run back home to earth. Turned Picard into a farmer
Preach it.
Wasn’t there an episode where dianna was actively seeking command? If so seems like she might not be so reluctant, but I can’t remember where that was on the timeline.
The most interesting What If for me, would have been the aftermath of Pikard as a part of the Borg collective. It would have been the perfect way to introduce the Borg, through the eyes of Pickard. Unfortunately Star Trek TNG is an US TV show. So the Borg are unquestionably evil, and Jean-Luc Pickard is as good as dead. Next scene please!
Riker managing to save Picard in First Contact after he had been believed dead by both crew and fans for years could have been a fucking unbelievably awesome moment in Trek history.
His portrayal of post - assimilation, post - recovery honestly was - wait. It was nonexistent. His older brother administered " *tough love* " to help him, more than Troi could or did.
Also Patrick Stewart's ego in the TNG movies would not have allowed for such nonsense
I just showed Best of Both Worlds to my 10 year old daughter for the first time a couple of weeks ago. I hammed it up speculating that Picard may not survive. She told me he'll be fine because Star Trek: Picard. I glared.
steak trek Picard is a different time line. that trumps that
Yoda says: "A childs mind wonderful it is!"
Picard turned into something not-quite-human at the end of first season of ST:P anyways.
10 year olds are just too smart (sometimes cocky depending on the child) for their age these days-lol.
It is funny how everything we watched was on a week by week, often cliffhanger basis (who shot JR). Now many things drop in a full season.
Poor girl I feel sorry for her that was mean
That version of First Contact sounds amazing! Imagine the dramatic opportunities for Frakes as he displays the trauma of going up against the Borg again after they killed his father figure. He would have had even more anger and rage at them. Then after years of not seeing Picard at all we get the scene where Captain Riker has been captured, he wakes up and we hear for the first time in years “Hello number one” but it is the Borg collective voice. Then BAM! We see borg Picard again. That sounds incredible.
I wholeheartedly second this.
You could have done this, rescue him by the end, and the still do the Picard series essentially unchanged.
Also means Picard's trauma would've been deeper as he was longer with the Borg.
That would have been great!! So, would it have been Riker that was captured by the Cardassians and saying "I see four lights" ? That would be interesting.
What if you bring in Ben Sisko as first Officer for a while before spinning him off into DS9. Making Riker his Mentor instead of Picard as the Target of his anger
That is opening an Pandoras box of a whole new timeline - I like it!
@@lexiburrows8127 I'm not sure that would preclude Sisko from being at wolf 359. Could have the next eps be the picking up the pieces kind of thing. Post battle, Riker's in a bar on Earth, drinking away the loss of his captain and Lt Cmdr Sisko, in a semi-drunken rage against Locutus' 1st officer, comes at him. Fists are thrown, tears are shed, Sisko finds a kindred spirit and Riker finds his 1st officer.
Avoids the whole Data as 1st officer issue. That's the technically correct path but has a lot of awkward problems the producers may want to put off and allows Sisko's stoic, almost fatalism to be a foil the vestiges of Riker's more boisterous, playboy nature.
Having a more down to Earth but slightly naive Jake Sisko on board too might make an interesting foil for Wesley's overbearing genius.
Cmrd Shelby could then liase with Cmdr Sisko in designing the Defiant. Maybe work Worf in there somehow to explain the ruthlessly militaristic role the ship fills. It's a starfleet ship built in the Klingon philosophy.
Then when they role out DS9, Sisko leaves, Data or Worf 1st officer, round 2! I think that is post Tasha's daughter and Data commanding a ship? So maybe he'd be a good fit. Not that a Klingon 1st officer wouldn't pose some interesting possibilities.
When they role out the Defiant itself, to tie the series together, Worf is the one to bring it to DS9 with a massive list of issues from its shake down cruise.
Bring the Enterprise too and they've been conducting mock battles all the way from Utopia Planitia. Geordi's been banging his head agaist the plasma conduits for the entire trip but has some ideas.
Reunion with O'Brian & family, Sisko etc. Data can say how much he learned about command from both Riker and Sisko and this is when Worf transfers to stay with the Defiant... As it's captain.
Dianna is torn? They were an item at this point? She would choose the Enterprise as normal and Worf/Dax is still a thing only with the awkwardness of Sisko knowing Worf much better.
Maybe Worf's adventures into the alternate realities can have him appear on DS9 in Sisko's place with Dianna at his side? Assuming the timelines match up. Things may be grim though with no prophets, or he replaced Sisko after he choose to stay in the Wormhole to defend against the Dominion somehow?
Hmmm, afraid I don't think it would work. Sisko's character needed to wallow on Utopia Planitia before being assigned to DS9 for him to travel the arc he needed to. And it would allow him to develop they way he did for us rather than being a known entity like Work and O'Brian.
Though either way, I'm not sure you could have the moment aboard the Enterprise like you did with Pircard. When they first met, Sisko could only see Locutus, and thus his pain of losing Jenifer. Then in the second time, we saw that both were fading at last. Can't see a way to have that with Riker.
@@forestwells5820 I think you're right. Sisko would not have been anywhere near the badass he became without the experiences at Wolf 359. He would not have been up to what he achieved in the Dominion War.
"Oldest, dearest friend..." I thought you were going to end that sentence with "Thomas Riker" :P
same here :D
This should be the next Not Actually Trek Actually. "What if Captain Riker had picked Thomas Riker as his new first officer?"
That would be dope
Capt. Riker would have made the Thomas Riker storyline that much more intense of a difference between the two characters, with one being in the command chair and the other having been stranded
@@MrDepechefan1 imagine how his DS9 venture would've gone with CAPTAIN Will Riker
I can imagine in a alternative timeline where Patrick Stewart did leave and instead I’m watching Steve talk about what if Picard had been rescued from the Borg.
Yeah, that would be the one with hillbilly Riker screaming "the Borg are EVERYWHERE" from a ship which only takes one hit to blow up.
SNAKE, YOU'VE CREATED A TIME PARADOX!
'The Federation's gone! My beard is EVERYWHERE!!'...😉👍
I'd love to see an alternative first contact where it's a second chance to rescue Picard. That sounded so good
I always felt like when Worf says "He IS a Borg" that's the closest we'll ever get to having Worf cry!
I feel like he shed some internal tears of happiness the first time he tried prune juice... the way he said "A Warriors Drink" was clearly filled with joy
It always sounded to me like Worf was about to throw up at that moment.
Agreed 100%
I don't know. I think him realising that the Defiant was a lost cause in FC.
I mean...Ke'hlyr...
Try being an ORIGINAL Star Trek fan growing up in the 70's waiting 10 YEARS for a new Star Trek series...
Steve-- "I was ten years old!" Me, realizing I was in college, "Damn, I am getting old."
I was 16 and about to head into my senior year and that summer just ATE at me. It was the "Who Shot JR" weekend of our nerdy generation.
Ditto
Hell, I was almost 30 and I remember throwing up my hands and yelling at the TV, “TO BE CONTINUED??? WHAT???” I couldn’t believe they’d hang us off a cliff like that!
I remember enjoying the first Trek movie while I was in High School, because after TOS was canceled we hadn’t seen any new Trek for nearly a decade at that point. (Yes I’m old).
And I was 1 yrs old. So didn't watch it live. However I can relate to cliffhangers in the sense other shows (Lost mainly).
Yeah, Riker ordering to fire on Locutus was one of the great season-ending cliff hangers of TV history.
Followed closely by, "Ramming speed" and Wesley gulping and saying, "Aye, Sir." and doing his duty.
I think the best idea you touched on is having Picard be completely absent from the rest of the TNG series, only to pop up in place of the Borg queen in First Contact. It would have been a huge twist! And I love the idea of Picard finally being saved from his assimilation - he would have been in no shape to rejoin Starfleet - but it would have been a lovely story and perfect resolution to Picard's storyline.
Here's how I imagine a version First Contact where Picard stayed a Borg:
It goes a lot like how you described it in your own video. But here are some extra details I think would be really interesting. Much like in the original film Riker is having recurring nightmares about The Borg but they're because of his feelings of survivor's guilt for failing to save Picard. Then he receives a message from Starfleet telling him that the Borg have returned and much like in the original film he defies orders and The Enterprise helps turn the tide in the battle above Earth.
During the fighting The Borg vessel hails The Enterprise and the crew us horrified to discover that the assault is being led by Locutus. He taunts the crew and Riker is consumed by the same rage and obsession with revenge that Picard was consumed by in the original film. This is continually exacerbated because throughout the film Locutus will taunt the crew over the intercom when the Borg infiltrate the ship.
The battle is won and the Borg proceed to travel back in time with The Enterprise in tow. Many details of this new film remain the same, including The Borg abducting Data. The main difference there is that a reason why Locutus took him is that there is still a small piece of his identity as Picard that remains buried and that part wants to see Data again. Data picks up on this and spends his portion of the film trying to reach that piece of Picard, ala Luke trying to reach Anakin in Return of The Jedi.
Meanwhile Riker is set straight by Lily, just like in the real movie. At this point he is contacted by Locutus again and he goes to confront him, giving the crew enough to to escape. During the confrontation Riker and Data are able to help Picard finally break through and he chooses to sacrifice himself to destroy The Borg once and for all. With the future saved Riker and the rest of the crew finally let themselves truly grieve for Picard and they return to the 24th Century.
The more I think about it the more I kinda wanna write this as an AU Fan Fiction.
Will Locutus seduce Data?
Do it, it would be amazing
@@andrewblanchard2398 Honestly I thought she was fine in First Contact. Didn't love her, didn't hate her. Sadly they kept bringing her back
That could have been a fucking awesome movie. Could you imagine how it would have completely blown the minds of fans if they had managed to keep Patrick Stewart's involvement a secret so the reveal is a total surprise?
@@neil3202 It would have been easier then than it would be now since the internet wasn't as much of a juggernaut as it is now.
I think TNG: “Parallels” summarized the possibility of Picard never escaping the Borg. Riker doesn’t get a haircut or a shave for the rest of the run and thus the Borg assimilate the Federation.
Also Worf is first officer and Wesley is promoted to lieutenant and is the enterprise’s security chief 👀
I feel like this whole episode is a version of _Tapestry_ with Steve as Q telling Patrick Stewart how because he left after Season 3 he never became so popular, never got the part of Professor Xavier, never became a cultural icon, etc. etc... Meanwhile Jonathan Frakes ended up straight in the front row of the Head Museum in New New York in the year 3000.
Never got to be in The Emoji Movie...
@@pokepress Or get knighted... 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂 😂
Unification would have been pretty interesting with Riker in command instead of Picard. A conversation between Spock and Will about the shared pain and struggles of losing both a captain and friend could have been an interesting conversation, especially if Will had been having difficulty fitting into the chair full time.
Fun Fact: Johnathan Frakes got to try his take at The Inner Light in the Adventure Time pastiche of it, "Puhoy". He voices the aging version of the main character and does a great job! I have no doubt he would have knocked it out of the park as captain.
I guess I should give Adventure Time a go again. I stopped watching after the fourth or fifth season or something like that. Just got kinda bored of it. But now, it’s finished, so it’s a complete product. And presumably it said whatever it wanted to say.
You have to go with Worf, right? Isn't he officially required to get all promotions via the death of another officer?
Worf receives two promotions in DS9 without anyone dying. Technically, he gets three promotions, but the last one is directly the result of someone dying.
It's part of his Klingon heritage after all!
@@shinyagumon7015 but wouldn't that also be cultural apropriation of Klingon culture by the federation?
Steve, you are such a nerd for exploring what-if scenarios on a by-gone tv show most people have forgotten. Please keep it going!
Have most people forgotten it?
You're a talented actor/story teller Steve. Have you ever looked into become an actor?
I've been waiting a long time for a GOOD "Star Trek" series. Discovery continues to be disappointing. Lower Decks is mediocre and not all that funny. As for Picard, sometimes you don't want to see your heroes doddering about in their old age.
I was about to complain about Steve calling out us newbie Star Trek fans.. then I realized I'm nearly as old as this nerd :(
(Love you Steve, don't give me a scathing remark in a not actually!)
I also assumed that the Riker that went a bit crazy in the multiverse collection episode was from a timeline where Locutus stayed as he was.
I always thought that too. Like to the point where I thought that was stated in the show. Did they not state what specifically what timeline he was from? Is my brain just playing tricks on me?
I absolutely love the idea of First Contact being a final arc or even a redemption arc for Picard. I think that would have made First Contact even better. Riker saving his old friend, and he finally gets to bring him back to his brother after all these years. Finally being able to make up for what he feels was his largest failing. I would imagine that Riker would have stayed in command of the Enterprise after that many years. It still could have led into a new series for Picard. A very DIFFERENT Picard. An episode or two within the new Riker-centric seasons turn out to be caused by Picard and his intimate knowledge of the Federation. Picard sets out to make things right. To redeem himself not in the eyes of the Federation, but to redeem himself in his own eyes.
Some awesome thoughts there! Sadly Riker would never have got to bring Picard back to his brother because Robert and René died just before the start of Generations. Maybe that film could start with Riker finding out about their deaths and grieving the loss of his last connection to the memory of his old captain and friend. When he later rescues Picard from the Borg in First Contact, he has to break it to him that his family is dead. That would have made for more great drama!
@@shibolinemress8913 I have so thoroughly erased Generations (and especially René and Robert's deaths) from my mind because it is that upsetting to me that I genuinely forgot that René and Robert died.
(seriously why did they kill these 2 off-screen? and then have their deaths be a footnote in the movie?)
I love the scene where Riker looks at the captain's office chair and says "What would you do?". It happens so quick but it's such a good introspective moment. In the hypothetical of Picard not returning to captain, I think seeing that side of Riker expanded on would be cool! We'd get to see him having to move past looking to what Picard would do, and thinking about what HE should do.
One of the muses I have heard about this idea is that TNG might have lasted longer than 7 seasons. One there was an established pattern of replacing characters like a "realistic" ship rotating out crew over the years, actors could come and go as a part of the normal cycle of the show - a bit like how Doctor Who manages to stay on the air for decades by swapping out the actors. TNG could eventually have been a 15 year show about "whoever was on the Enterprise" at the time. This would have meant that they would never do Voyager as a spinoff.
I’ve wanted a Captain Riker series my entire life. As much as I love DS9 and Captain Sisko, at the time Avery Brooks was announced as the series lead I felt Frakes should have been the star of any TNG spinoff.
I always wondered if Beverly would have stayed on the ship if Picard was not recovered. While it never played out on screen the way many fans wanted, Beverly had romantic feelings for him there is no denying that. While they were not married or in a romantic relationship, there were those underlying feelings and he was her best friend. I think she would feel his absense in a similar way to how she felt about Jack's death. There is also the additional guilt associated with the fact that she was on the away team that was sent to recover him and she ultimately failed. It always struck me how Beverly was the first to see Locutus. Personally while I think it would have been a loss for the show (and many may see it as reducing Beverly to nothing more than a woman in love with a man) I don't think she would have stayed on the ship, because the Enterprise's mission is not to take down the borg. I can see her going back to medical and throwing herself into research and experimentation of how to reclaim those who have been lost to the borg (obvs we know she can do it as she did it in the show), with her ultimate goal being to find Jean-Luc (who she does not believe is gone) and bring him back.
re Locutus in "First Contact"
Damn you! Now I'm angry we didn't get to see that! ;P
Steve I think you forgot to touch on how *much* this could change the Riker/Troi dynamic and I don't mean this just in a professional way with him becoming her Captain.
The reason that's always given for their breakup was that Will decided to focus on his career with the dream of becoming the captain of a state of the art ship (preferably the Enterprise).
Now with this dream achieved he could realise how much he still loves Deanna and try to court her, deanna is now the reluctant one who wants to focus *on* *her* career. Basically a subversion of their previous dynamic.
I actually love the idea of Troi being Riker’s first officer. Be right back, I have to see if anyone has written that fanfic.
Isn't she first officer in the titan books?
I mean, that cube would have still been defeated. They underestimated Starfleet. Now, if they had sent TWO cubes, that's the end of days.
I still dislike the puny defence force of the main system of the Federation - surely they've learned after that?! Oh, wait... Here comes the news: "In a recent attack on San Francisco the Dominion forces crushed the world renowned Golden Gate bridge!"
or in the news a few centuries earlier: "Today millions died in a Xindi terrorist attack striking the east coast of the American continent!"
It's just the end of Voyager when they gave us a little show of force.
Two Borg cubes wouldn't have been the end of the world IMHO, as the Borg never understood our resourcefulness - they would've never got their grips on Texas! Remember, Borg are not invulnerable against bullets 😎
I've always thought the Borg were merely toying with Starfleet and the Federation by only dispatching a single cube for each attempt at "invasion". Granted, they consider themselves to be completely superior technologically, and are in most ways, but it'd still be far more logical for them to have sent more than a single vessel if they actually planned to assimilate both the Federation and then the Klingon and Romulan Empires. Not to mention the numerous belligerent other powers, including the Tholians, Breen, and Tzenkethi. Perhaps they were secretly planning to provoke the human and humanoid races of the Alpha and Beta Quadrants into developing greater and greater technology over a long period of time for them to eventually harvest decades or even centuries into the future...😳
“... a Black Vulcan. You know who I mean.”
VINCE!
SuperVolt, fool.
“Just because he’s next in line doesn’t mean he automatically gets the job”
Tell that to everyone who says Tilly shouldn’t have been acting first officer on Discovery
Also Tuvok was next in line after the original XO died, but then Janeway went and gave it to Chakotay.
@@kaitlyn__L Chakotay was a commissioned full commander before he left for the Maquis, and was the captain of that crew. It made a lot more sense to make him XO because of his rank and diplomacy.
Well sure, but in general you don't give the job to somebody who was a cadet a year ago...
Well yeah, people get pissed off when they get passed over. Lt Cmdr Stamets initial reaction to being told an Ensign would be his boss is more realistic. A room full of Lieutenants is not going to be smiling and clapping over this either. Not so much a direct next in-line but many more people in-line ahead.
Well, in my all-time favorite episode from TNG, Parallels, we catch a glimpse of the would be Enterprise if Picard had died in "the Borg conflict" (how it is mentioned in the episode), so maybe Riker as captain and Worf as First Officer. Although yes, the episode is all about a 'what can happen will happen', it makes the whole Picard death scenario canon.
I feel your pain, Steve.
I was only 8 when "Best Of Both Worlds" aired, and TNG S3 was my first exposure to the series (thanks to my Dad for introducing me to Star Trek and Star Wars).
"The producers made a purely creative decision."
Damn Steve, you are on fire with these jokes.
I feel your pain. The "Year of Hell" was so traumatizing to me that I was in tears... I was 12. I hadn't figured out the blatantly obvious.
That's okay. Most of us never do
I would've loved to have seen Data as First Officer, but how would that have changed Nemesis? If Picard was unavailable would Shinzon have tried to capture a Borg Cube to get Locutus? Or would Nemesis simply not exist as a movie? And if Data didn't have to save Picard, would he still be "alive" and not stuck in a simulation on "Picard?" In the comic books, Data's upload to B-4 finally worked and Data became Captain of the Enterprise. The possibilities are nearly limitless!
How about this, Riker is captain and right after “Family” we have the episode with his clone, Thomas. And upon discovering him, it’s decided that the only fair thing to do is to make Thomas the first officer of the Enterprise. And so for the rest of the series Jonathan Frakes is both the captain and first officer of the ship. So many possibilities.
And so much cause for confusion - I still would have loved a comedy spin-off of that kind 😂
Just to see Selas or Tomalaks confusion if their chat partner gets mysteriously promoted and demoted
or imagine Q: "Damn, I struggle to tell you both apart!" 😋
Doing something I normally don't do just to let you know I PERSONALLY needed this nostalgia of 10 year old me also especially today remembering the longest summer ever, so thank you for just being you all the time man. Trekkie to trekkie, I ❤ this channel like it's in my soul. Keep on keeping on and fighting the fight.
"StarTrek shouldn't be a comedy! It's wrong!" * Q has entered the chat *
And I hate the Q episodes. They're generally the worst of their respective series.
"But the point is, I was ready, even eager to give the new guy a shot." Noting the date of this video's release, am I the only one that senses possible subtext? Just me? Okay, I'll see myself out. Great video either way Steve! Cheers! :)
I don't think so. Captain Picard was a capable leader, after all.
@@Rognik "The new guy"
"The NEW guy"... In the captain's chair.
Posted on 1/20/21.
New. guy. in. charge...
I see you, @neocelestia
My vote for first officer would have been then-Commander Carol Freeman (his "cha'Dich") 😉
Steve must be going for the Oscar in this opening bit.
Nah... that pain was all totally real, I was there in those same trenches too.
If so, he has a long way to go. A very long way
"FIRE" .....One year later "It had no effect sir"
Cue sad trombone
That's light speed restrictions 😋
It was only 3 months.
The TNG episode "Parallels" could've had an interesting change where Worf ended up on a parallel ship where Picard was rescued by the Borg. Also, how would the DS9 pilot have played out differently, with Sisko not being able to interact with the one he blamed for the death of his wife?
At last, a Trek tuber who doesn't pronounce it Progidy. ;)
No doubt! That's been bothering me. ✌🖖
What if there was a third option? Events stay the same till after the episode "The Family". Picard is offered by Star Fleet position of Commodore and is given a squadron command of ships with Enterprise as the lead ship. Riker is promoted to Captain of the Enterprise and Data first officer. One thing I like about the Discovery series over other Star Trek series is that the flag officers where actually given real part of the narrative outside of just appearing outside quick video chats with the Captain. I love the two -part episode "Redemption" where Picard is given a small fleet to create a blockade and with multiple ships and we see Data take command. A Commodore Picard option allows the show to use as little or as much Patrick Stewart as contract negotiation's allowed. This would also let different characters shine in different roles as the stagnant "nobody but Worf is promoted" chain of command is broken.
We do know that this already did happen. We saw that version of Will when every dimensions' Enterprise appeared in the same space in Worf's adventure.
I like the idea of Locutus appearing in First Contact as the main antagonist, for lots of reasons. But one that just occurred to me is that, if he is rescued and goes on to retire, it would give him an even stronger connection to Hugh and the other XBs if/when he gets to meet them in this alternate universe. Having been a borg for years instead of just hours, he might have been left physically scarred, and presumably would have had a harder time adjusting to individuality again. Maybe he ends up working with Hugh in in the reclamation project instead of hanging around his vineyard.
It's funny that as you were going through the options for first officer and discussed Worf, that you did not include that we indeed see this alternate Star Trek in the episode "Parallels", in which Worf hops between parallel universes due to "space stuff" and Geordi's VISOR. It is this particular universe that Riker is captain, Worf is first officer, Wesley of all people is Security Chief, and there is a cardassian at the helm.
The sad part is I knew what the angle was when you started "You new Trek Fans"😂😂😂
Yes they will never know the struggle & I'm glad they are here though 👏🏾👏🏾
I would've loved to have seen Riker as Captain and Data as first officer on a permanent basis.
If Picard was lost in Best of Both Worlds I could see Q and Riker becoming less frenemies and more akin to old drinking buddies reminiscing over their loss of Captain Picard. As time goes on they might even become, maybe not friends, but understanding towards each other
I mean, Q did try to turn Riker into one of them early on.
Q to Thomas and William Riker: "Damn, I can never tell you both apart!"
I love the idea of lacutis of borg instead of the queen. Re think how voyager could have been as well. Kathryn and Picard striking up a "peace treaty" against spices 639(?) Voyager could have been tons better
"Captain Picard would not approve."
That's the most depressing possibility ever.
Damn, better make sure it will never apply to me.
Picard may not have approved... but what would Gene Roddenberry think of these shows and how his vision of his story being handled? I know, I know... I'm forever stuck in the past. :/
"You want the wait? *YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE WAIT!* Bah, no wait-handler you, I deride your wait-handling ability!"
I remember Wolf 359, I was there man! I remember the long... slow... weeks of reruns leading up to S4!
I read that in Jack Nicholson's voice XD XD XD
The opening monologue explains why Steve has always had that thousand light-year stare
This is the heaviest burden those of us Gen-X geeks carry with us!
It does indeed. And his meltdown is on par with Benny Russell's.
We kinda see one of these possibilities in “Parallels” where Picard was not rescued from the Borg and the Federation was in big trouble because of that.
We saw two. One with Captain Riker where he was the Captain of the Enterprise after Picard died, and the timeline where the Borg had overrun everything.
The pain of that intro is so true. I too can remember how shocked and aghast I was when those dreaded words, "to be continued" first popped up. Having to wait all summer to find out was most anxious I had ever been in my life back then. Conversely though, yes, the excitement was just as real and I can still remember talking with my parents not just about how the crew might get Picard back, but the distinct possibility that he might not get rescued at all.
It's not like TNG had an entirely stable cast up to that point. We'd seen Tasha die and Beverly replaced Pulaski for a season. We'd also seen familiar faces shuffled around, Geordie prompted to chief engineer and Warf promoted to chief of security, not to mention the journey of Wesley snot nosed teen to a acting member of the crew. Oh, and most of all let's not forget the most significant addition to the crew, Riker's beard :-)
The notion that the dynamics were changing once again, that Riker was going to be the new captain and that this new girl would be his new first officer felt entirely plausible, and years later it's still hard not to ponder how TNG would have been if the writers really had decided to commit to that change.
Heck, here's even one more idea how future seasons might have diverged to add to the kettle. If Picard wasn't rescued, maybe the Borg would have become more frequent antagonists with Locutus as their face filling in as an alternative for "friend" turned foe dynamic that that Sela had. As a further extension of that, Maybe Denise Crosbie would have still returned to the series, but with the heightened Borg threat the Romulans and Federation would have to forge an uneasy alliance with Sela acting as a lesson between the two, maybe even with Sela becoming a new addition to the Enterprise crew as part of that alliance.
Another regular often seen in a red starfleet uniform might have bit fit for the first officer position. Someone with far more experience in both exploration and diplomacy than the entire federation combined.
*Q*
On a side note, but staying in the category of "what if;" I always thought a good shake up of characters would have been to have William Riker promoted to Captain of a starship and "leaves the show." Data was promoted to First Officer. Lieutenant Thomas Riker is brought on to man the Ops station.
That'd be something lol.
*"bridge to Riker"*
*"which one [childish chuckles]"*
I seem to recall SFDebris had the same idea in his review of Second Chances. It would have been interesting. I seem to recall Q mentioned in an episode of Voyager he thought they'd have offered the big chair of that ship to him.
Steve: Let me explain something to you youngsters,
Me: Yeah! Let ‘em know Steve!
Steve: Who became fans when the Kelvin movies came out
Me: Oop wait never mind, thats me. Okay i’ll listen.
I was there too Steve... “I was there”...
If Picard had not survived, you would be making this episode 20 years later about "What if Captain Picard HAD survived?".
I actually am a Determinist, but that doesn't stop me from enjoying speculation about what could have been. Maybe it's even part of the reason I enjoy such speculation.
BTW I rarely comment on videos but I thought that first line was an interesting thought worth mentioning. Love your videos and your discussions, please never stop Steve. :)
20 years later? 30? It's nearly 30. I was 2 when Best of Both Worlds aired, crazy!
When I first saw the title of this video, and even through a bit of the beginning of it, I thought you were actually implying that Picard HAD NOT been rescued, that all the episodes after tBoBW was some kind of dream/delusion/fantasy in someones brain or something, and you were going to bring up events in those later episodes as 'evidence' to support this theory/claim.
Hulk Hogan was a heel, and we never knew it, Picard was face, and Kirk was a heel, but a half time heel
It’s amazing, looking back, how often Hogan was the first to use a chair or attack a manager unprovoked, and would still get cheered. Stone Cold’s success feels like an extension of Hogan, from a certain angle
You are the ONLY person I have heard of who loved Roddimus. Then again, I was the only girl in the movie theater watching the transformers movie. Guess we're both weird. 🤣
Make that 3!
Want to know something REALLY interesting? Before they settled on Avery Brooks, one of the actors they auditioned for Sisko was Richard Dean Anderson. Imagine an alternate universe version of DS9 led by him. Would it have ended up being more like Stargate? It would've been a VERY different show for sure, because Avery Brooks defined a LOT of what DS9 became. Obviously the SG-1 we know would not have existed if that had happened, but it's still interesting to think about.
Dude... I do not miss end of season cliff hangers.
For real?? I miss it SO much!! It was awesome to spend months speculating with friends and fellow fans about what was going to happen. One of the most disappointing things about the internet is that the constant (almost unavoidable) spoilers have ruined the ability for shows to give us real tension and anticipation.
We did kind of get one at the end of season 2 of discovery when the crew went into the time portal to the future. And I mean that in the sence that we didn't know what they would find and how much things would have changed when they did so. Same with season 1 when the enterprise showed up at the very end of the finaly
And what was done to the Klingons was an abomination against nonexistent God. You know it was! (smiley face to indicated joking tone)
I actually prefer the updated version of the klingons in Discovery. They're more believable as a people and come off as a lot more alien and threatening.
I also like them in the TOS era because they were like a warped mirror reflection of the Federation; the OG "Terrans".
I find them in the TNG/DS9/VOY era to be rather dull and ludicrous; they're nothing more than a biker gang in space.
@@JanetStarChild I don’t but that’s ok, that fact that we don’t like the exact same things don’t make either us a good or bad person. It’s ok to disagree.
Family would be a riker episode where he considers resigning his commission after failing to save his captain, and his family convince him to stay in Starfleet.
I want that shirt. I NEED that shirt.
You can buy them on Amazon. I just checked for myself.
Sold everywhere business is done
Geordi would have been an excellent choice for XO. I feel like his engineering knowledge would be massively useful and his position as Chief of Engineering would serve as a natural transition into Second-in-Command.
Riker promotes Geordi to first officer. O'Brien becomes chief engineer and never leaves for DS9. The Dominion easily conquers the Alpha Quadrant. Voyager is never launched because the Maquis is never existed.
Yeah it checks out.
I don't think anyone became a fan when Discovery premiered....
I’ve got a better idea re: “Future Imperfect”: Imagine if Patrick Stewart didn’t quite cut off all ties from TNG. What if he was persuaded to show up as a guest star in this episode, as Capt. Picard? The push with the fantasy would be different and more of a brain-fuck: From the time Picard was taken by the Borg to that episode, did the Borg really succeed in assimilating him? It could potentially leave Riker more broken in the end. And how would this influence the episodes after that?
I WAS THERE, Steve, I WAS THERE. I know the pain of waiting that long summer. I was 7, and Star Trek was, and is, important to me.
"And I... hold up my end"
That's the most legitimately humble humblebrag I've ever heard
"It just doesn't feel like Star Trek."
Thank you so much for hitting this Steve. I see this all the time and always say the same things you just did. I always bring this up when people complain online about Trek. I remember all the hate that each series got and how many of those people eventually changed their opinions by the time the next show came along. Anecdotal, but, my experience is that these people tend to be the ones who also only see Star Trek as a military/conservative show and tend to miss a lot of the points of episodes.
I felt the same way when Buffy blew up her high-school and killed the demonic mayor in the closing episode of season 3 .... I never felt more anxious over the waiting for season 4 ... back then, we didn't know whether there would be a season 4 or if Angel would come back.
@@claytonberg721 The whole business with the introduction of "Dawn" and the death of Buffy's mom kinda of ruined the show for me by then
Before I even watch the video here... we did sort of get a hint of what that would be like in the episode where Worf was skipping universes. When all the enterprises were getting pulled into the same area of space, one of the ships tries to attack Worf to stop him from sending everyone home. It's a Riker from an almost destroyed federation, "The Borg are everywhere!".
The bigest change would be: the Borg would have won!
It is my humble duty to inform you that the Borg collective determined that it can not win any Kobayashi Maru scenario involving human interference. The cause of this is still unknown, but for the time being "Resistance is futile!"
I think the whole "it doesn't feel like Trek" argument is akin to a baby bird imprinting on it's mother. We all think the Trek we started with is the "real" Trek. I just turned 7 years old in 1987 when TNG began. I still remember sitting on the floor watching it with my dad (a classic Trekkie), who watched TOS growing up in the 60s. I still remember him offhandedly commenting that the new Trek "doesn't feel like Trek". I'll admit, when I first started watching DISCO, I had the same feeling myself. But, TNG had imprinted on me as "my Trek". I myself have never seen TOS start to finish, but I have seen everything from The Motion Picture to the latest episode of Picard (will be bingeing S3 DISCO this weekend :)). To this day I am still comparing how new Trek makes me feel against how TNG made me feel. TNG is my Trek :). Just my $0.02. Keep it up, Steve! #WeSurvived45
0:41
Give this man an Oscar
A Tommy would suit him just as well. He transmitted the suffering of that poor 10 yo during that loooong summer in a positively Shakesperian manner...