First time I actually subbed because someone told me to. I realized "I watched 8 minutes and enjoyed it, might as well" you make good content, I hope you become sucessful
I love the point you made about stages feeling smaller because less places matter. That’s a very good insight, if only 40% of the map is important, it’s going to feel 60% smaller because you don’t ever use that portion. I do wish you elaborated more on the older maps that did this well like Flounder Heights and Urchin Underpass, it would be good to have a way to compare and contrast what the maps were like and how they are today because I do feel as if there was a significant downgrade between games beyond the movement changing. The factoid that the maps aren’t much smaller than they’ve been in the past with the statistics showing the points per smallest map in each game was very thought provoking and informed the overall video a lot. The chess analogy was initially a bit confusing but it gave the video an overall theme and a quick and easy way to explain game design. Overall, good video!
@@maplemiles3381 while I acknowledge that this is subjective, (after all, they feel small, they aren’t any smaller than they have been) but a lot of the community thinks that the maps are small even though that’s not the case. This video explains why
The one thing I would say is faster weapons are not exactly better, weapons that control space while being seen and can effect people ahead of them do, such as chargers. I like the overall approach and the comparison between paint total and relevant areas hits it. Mentioning the decrease in paintable walls could also be good. Nice job
@ProChara Translated by Google: I COMPLETELY HATED IT! 😡😡 That I support painting and maintaining control of the map, most of the times that I get blown up are chargers 👁️ because there is almost no cover. And I am also extremely tired that most of the time the chargers in professional hands literally have 100% control of the map because of how flat they are
What also needs to be addressed are the =horrific= bottlenecks in the S3 maps. In S2, you ALWAYS had at least two ways to get into enemy turf. Now, there's maybe one small ramp AT BEST that can be easily defended, with Scorch Gorge's suicide grate being about as wide as a SHOE at the end, meaning that battles are determined by an extremely easily flippable mid that can lead to a turnaround win in the last five seconds. It doesn't reward skill, tactics, or patience like it used to.
S3 maps mostly have multiple ways to get into enemy turf too though and most battles are determined by a lot of things and it usually rewards skill, tactics, or patience, but there are exceptions.
@@Jdudec367there’s hardly any options for flanking. If you’re in disadvantage in a splatoon 3 game, you’re best bet really is to turn the tides with a special or a clean push. There’s hardly any option for flanking, if at all. Back in 1 and 2, even if you were alone against 4, you could flank the other team and hide in corners to have your team jump to you and ambush the other team from the side or from behind. You can’t really do that in splatoon 3 since every part of the stages are out in the open and leave less tactical potential there
@@stevenmcburney8167 No there is. Or flank across, I don't see the issue with that really There is options for flanking though. Um no you can not every part of every stage is out in the open, and of course you can alternative between flanking and going into ink too.
So I guess the main solution is… wider maps I guess. Most maps tend to be linear, leading to mid with few good ways to circumvent this. A wider map would allow for that, or it would divide mid into 3 different sections, sort of turning the map into a 3x3 grid of sections rather than a 1x3 rectangle. Even a plus sign shape would be better, with spawn being one section, true mid being in the middle, and 2 side sections to flank around, each section having about the same percentage of turf to ink/control.
Also don’t make the flanking areas on the sides only accessible from one side. Makes it more interesting when you know that at any moment, that area of the side of the map could be taken by an enemy and forces you to stay on your guard more. With splatoon 3, I don’t feel any incentive to stay on my guard unless I’m in mid and even then, all the enemies are usually in front of me since it’s a straight lined map
very interesting video, i liked the chess analogies even if they were a bit confusing to me at first. also isnt it funny how they added a whole new mechanic dedicated to climbing walls and yet they added so many uninkable walls? brinewater has NO inkable walls apart from the block in the middle. it’s ridiculous 💀 they also added squid rolls and yet so many maps are incredibly flat. scorch gorge mid is just a huge flat open area, its so uninteresting. and lets not even get into hammerhead i wish the map design was able to make the most of the movement system, bc splatoons movement is so cool and has been improved even more in this game with the new mechanics. they havent truly taken advantage of it yet, i hope we see some improvements soon
I’m an Ink Brush main, so these map issues are felt severely for me. The massive favoring of map designs towards backliners makes seeing a splatling or charger more of a “Guess I won’t be able to have fun today” feeling instead of “Time to find fun ways to pressure the snipers!” Being outranged by every other weapons means that on some maps with even just barely competent opponents, I can barely move anywhere without getting splatted even when I’m doing my best to maneuver or creatively flank/ambush
I may not use inkbrush as much, but I feel this sentiment just as much. Flank routes can be used by all sorts of weapons to pressure backliners or take pressure off of friendly backliners when covered . . . and the lack of them in 3 really shows how much of a dimension they added to play. Sure Splooshes and similar weapons are less annoying now, but they're nowhere near as oppressive at their worst as backliners are now.
Ive had way too many matches where we just get locked out at spawn. Its not fun when everyone dies and then nobody can recover. in Splatoon 2, this rarely happened, even in ranked modes
I really do miss how huge and vertical the Splatoon 1 map’s were. Seeing flounder heights and Mahi Mahi resort getting essentially massacred in 3 really wasn’t necessary.
It beats the point of brining maps from 1 just to butcher them like that. They easily could of made original maps instead of butchering maps from 1 where they funnel everyone to the middle.
Not only are the lack of Flank routes a problem, but also the clear advantage to chargers with the large open areas and lots of high ground is also an issue, making many matches for closer ranged weapons a nightmare if any e liter is on the opposing team
Another thing I noticed as a Brella enjoyer: Though you could theoretically use the canopy to take some backliner pressure off yourself/your team (assuming of course the game decides it's hit detection will work that match), the sheer open space you're left with once the canopy's gone (alongside the ink deficit) make you a sitting duck since the backliner can just snap to any of the predictable escape routes you'd have in that scenario and pick you before you even have a chance to get to relative safety. I'd imagine it's a similar story with splash walls and any other player-created cover.
Thank you for explaining the issues of Splatoon 3's map design better than I could. This kind of level design makes the game feels so much smaller. A lot of the maps have what I call Walleye Warehouse syndrome. Just three places you can move, and incredibly easy to get trapped in. As long as the team can cover those three areas then they have the whole game. It makes the game too Charger and Splatling friendly as well because all they have to do is control those three areas without having to deal with any flank points. This makes the special roster even worse because specials like the Baller and even Bomb Rush could give the team the ability to push through. There were more options inside of Splatoon 2 than in 3 and I don't know if many really understand why some still prefer 2 over 3. 3 does have improvements over 2, but 3 limits the amount of options, flanks and positioning you could do towards the other team thanks to the difference in specials and the boxy, three way map design. It makes 3 a hassle to play and even somewhat boring. I hope they improve this with time as I've been playing Splatoon since the first game, and the second game is my most played Switch game. Excellent video!
i’ve played all three games and another problem i’ve felt with 3 is that the maps cater toward keeping players on specific set routes. uninkable walls, uninkable floors, and hazard areas that could lend themselves to smarter plays and better overall map coverage could in theory elevate the maps, but unfortunately with how many uninkables there are, it feels so controlling and limited. The maps feel forgettable and like any other shooting game with the severe lack of creativity they’ve put in. What’s the point of playing a game where you can paint walls and climb up them if the only paintable walls are the mandatory high ground in mid? Flounder Heights lends itself to such fun and varied gameplay because almost the entirety of mid is a flank route with how many walls you can climb. Unfortunately, with a portion of it being uninkable it has severely limited both the right and left side, but even then the map remains the best in the game
Splatoon 1 surprised me when i played it last month with how many walls you can climb up and how many different options you can take. it felt like everytime i played a map there was a new way i was able to approach that i didn’t figure out beforehand. they felt unique with their layouts and even if i can’t stand some of them (Arowana/Kelp Dome/Moray Towers/Saltspray) they each have their own unique identity and layout that sets them apart from one another. Spla2n also had unique identities with their maps, although the layouts were lackluster and felt convoluted. Splatoon 3 took what was bad about Spla2n maps and straight up crushed them into their lowest common denominator. Mahi Mahi 3 is a good example. I can never imagine a map like Mincemeat or Undertow coming back in future installments either, no one will ever want them
Ive been replaying Splat1 a lot recently and I'm amazed at just how fun it is. It was incredibly unbalanced and stupid, but it was still incredibly enjoyable, maybe even more so than Splatoon 3.
Flounder heights is by far the best in the game. Only issue I see with it tho is it heavily caters to the advantage state in ranked due to the mid being the highest point in the map meaning it’s harder for the losing team to make a comeback in say tower control or rainmaker
Thanks for this explanation, I noticed I was having a lot less fun and a lot more rage when playing _any_ Splat 3 despite the improvements . . . and at least now I can put words to why. I just miss alternate routes man.
Honestly, splatoon 2 maps just feel the best now that I've played splatoon 3. But now I think that yeah, the gameplay was still a bit slower in 2, though even slower in the wackier maps of 1. It feels like 2's maps in 3 are really hitting a sweet spot in how big they feel vs how fast the game is. And also maps generally in 3 are really lacking in gimmicks (mahi is executed badly), they all feel samey, whereas 2 still had a variety of maps even though some were tight like 3's more-than-just-some new maps.
See, I'm glad I'm not the only one who felt this about the maps. I didn't play Splat 1, and not much of Splat 2 but from what I've played, I felt the maps played better in Splat 2 because the places you went, mattered. All routes goes to mid map destination isn't good design. Flounder Heights is the only map that doesn't feel too congested
This is a really interesting take. I never thought to consider that it was the pacing of the game that made the maps feel smaller and not the maps themselves. As fun as the game is, I do think the map design really makes it suffer at times. Right now, e-liters and long-range weapons dominate because there aren't many reliable ways to get to them. Hopefully the design team takes this into consideration when modifying current maps or creating new ones.
@Jeff Logan um, I'm not sure if you're trolling, but I'm not ripping on the game. I personally still find it a lot of fun, even if some of the maps are a bit wonky. This is just my personal take on the map design. Overall, the maps play just fine, I just noticed a few issues is all. If the game never changes, then I'm fine cause it's still a great and fun game and I'll definitely still play. This is just my opinion man. No need to get so aggressive. Also, my profile pic is from a video game. Just sayin...
@@roboking1020 that is one thing about this game their is just so much good and even if you find the maps odd some of these stuff over shadow the cons. I like to see a new casual mode called "Splat match" which is a death match in its 3 minutes and the goal is score the most total splats the total splats from each player will at the end of the match are subtracted of how many times each has been splatted and who has the highest points wins and they can share the same rotation as the current rotating Turf War maps.
@@maplemiles3381 love this. that's actually a really interesting idea. I've always wondered what a more classical style deathmatch sort of gamemode would be like in splatoon.
@@roboking1020 well from the video "better map" designs I don't see any problem with them and I do like meshi meshi, hammerhead, and flounder heights well I'm not picky with maps and it looks like their making more balance and size with it being 3rd person gives you better surrounding of where their coming from. Well what I'm saying is the current map design are good and the upgrade to hammerhead is not bad and a upgrade from splatoon 1 despite the absence of roots to flank people. The game is the most content pack since Nintendo in the past and other devs have done a games that are bare content in the base and add season pass battle pass and Nintendo still found a way with splatoon 1 and 2 to work at launch and the 3rd game has a lot of content at launch within the base game. Well I'm not part of a splatoon community and have zero interest to join but I'm glad the game is relevant and has been selling with maybe 10-12 by next earning and has gotten great reviews. But the biggest flaw is not maps or meta but it's been posted everywhere when I look up the game and that is its net code. It has seen some improvements but it got slightly worse with new players from Christmas from what I've seen. I'm confident that these will get iron out and Splatoon does have good online experience from Nintendo or any per 2 per but the you cold play against a host with McDonald's wifi. It is great game overall and can't wait to join in but as big the game is in Japan Nintendo should start giving this game more exposure to get new players the future is bright with the support but Nintendo with that "Splat match" should bring in new people since earlier people on twitch what it and a person said to me. People don't know how to play it and left and never heard of it despite the fact it's a new big new system selling ip from Nintendo and their in house dev team.
@@maplemiles3381 I totally agree dude. Maps aside, the game is still great, and honestly a breath of fresh air. Like you said a lot of games these days are selling with the bare minimum of required content in the game and the rest is locked behind a paywall as dlc or a season pass. The fact that this game as an in-house season pass that is simply a part of the game rather than a paid add on is beautiful imo. If you ever choose to pick up the game, I don't doubt that you'll have a lot of fun. It is super niche however (at least competitively) so I understand how its not every ones cup of te, but overall lots of fun things to do still.
One massive impact ive noticed over the last two games is that you can no longer storm the enemy base. There is nearly always an uninkable wall, sponge, or other obstacle that will stop the enemy from entering the base. While that is good in theory to limit spawn camping… it creates a whole area of the game that isnt touched after you initially ink it. In splatoon 1, iirc, the ONLY map in the game in which you couldnt reach the enemy base was saltspray rig. This map at least did it well, by having multiple areas in the general map which you could funnel into. If the enemy cannot even enter your base, is there any point in having one? Each team is just going to have the same amount of turf there, and then the only important space in the map is the mid. Just something that sort of bothers me in 2 and 3, could be nostalgia but i really feel like it impacts the gameplay.
A characteristic to the Splatoon 3's map design is to use the peak hight of a squid roll (h) and make everything with that in mind. Also, Wave Breaker and Tacticooler are double that hight (2×h) which is the same with most of drops and ledges in this game. It helps to function properly those two specials, with Wave Breaker stopping at that hight and Tacticooler not getting destroyed by the rotating platforms on Museum for example. Unfortunately though, it makes everything short to the point that you lose cover just by standing. This is more well pronounced in Bridge, Hagglefish Market and 2 Star Hotel (Mahi). The absolute pinnacle of flat and boring in the game right now. I mean… we have squid surge and we can't use it by design. Great video! At first I didn't understood why you brought up chess but you nailed it. It's a comparison that seams random at first but makes so much sense!
honestly i feel like another problem is just ...... its small. It feels like everything in splatoon 3 shrunk while we grew. comparing maps that are still the “same” ie flounder heights i feel like you can kind of tell what i mean
5:34 Translated by Google: Hey, I agree with you with what you said. If the chargers were a nightmare in Splatoon 2 but only on some maps since you had cover to protect yourself. In Splatoon 3 they are a thousand times worse, because add the new maps and some redesigns that most of them are flat, the chargers in professional hands literally have complete control because it will destroy your allies in an April and blink of an eye because there is almost no coverage to protect yourself. Splatoon 3 needs to redesign the maps so that there is more coverage and so that the magazines in professional hands are not broken at all times that is currently happening.
4:25 Translated by Google: That map is HORRIBLE! because it is so small that it creates total chaos that almost all players cannot fit in the small size. The platforms is also another thing that he hated because the shot type weapons get in the way a lot. I prefer a thousand times that they return to the original because this redesign is TERRIBLE!
Really all we need is more verticality and flank route options. We should also provide areas where chargers and splatlings can benefit, but make it so their team has to cover their flanks.
it appears that the devs hated spawncamping so much that they just made it near impossible to reach anywhere that wasnt mid. and that alone gave backline a massive advantage
Splatoon has always been a mobility focused shooter though, map size isn't really an issue, it's the map layouts. Flanks and alt routes is what splatoon maps actually lack, stands out more when you play a map that does have alt routes and flanks into center. Don't believe me go look into quake and unreal tournament. They were also mobility focused shooters and their maps were also pretty small, but they had corridors alternative passages and more to let you get around the maps while still being mostly in cover, now to also be fair unlike other shooters, splatoon doesn't have weapons thatcan shoot clear across the entire map, every weapon has limited range. Meaning every weapon can only really control a certain section around it.
another key difference with those arena shooters is that a lot of the movement isn't informed by the map as much as splatoon is, you can rocket jump and bunny hop wherever you want in those old school arena shooters but in splatoon, if you can't paint that wall then you're not scaling that wall. a map in quake or unreal or even in TF2 has to actively go out of it's way to constrain your ability to move around the map. whereas splatoon has to provide that mobility through inkable walls and rails and such.
If you go back to the pre-release trailers you can see completely different versions of Eeltail and Scorch Gorge that have a bunch of alternate routes that were just completely removed in the final game just like with Mahi Mahi and Hammerhead. Which means this isn't a mistake that needs education, but a deliberate choice the devs made. They have versions of these maps that are good, and could revert them, but don't want to. Why? What's wrong with them?
Nintendo is a company that is very behind the times, and when they try to get in the times, it usually goes poorly. It appears as if many parts of our current times aren't so great.
The problem with 3 is it’s mostly rehashed maps from 2 and the maps from 1 are butchered to be like ever other map from 2 and 3 where you are tunnelled to the middle. Butchering the maps from 1 just beats the point of bringing them back in the first place if there going to be made the same.
The maps are smaller in 3 you don’t really use all of the map space given to you because of how spawning works and how on most maps you aren’t really playing in the spawn area. And another method showing the scale of maps is how big it spaced out the props and groundwork Is on the maps you can have a big space with tons of massive obstacles in them that make the maps feel smaller
Ive never considered the map situation like this, great video! Honestly, i have zero faith in nintendo to make the best decisions for this game, since the new season cycle is already showing its flaws, but some splattubers have said that splat2 was in a great state toward the END… so will they keep us all invested?
its either small maps or wat i call rush down maps. wall eye, new hammerhead bridge, arowanna mall, etc. theres not as many maps nowadays that give u flanking options or just different routes in general. lots of maps force u to either go straight to mid or just give u an "option" thats just a tiny side area going to mid. so theres barely any choice in the matter. i may hate saltspray rig but atleast it gives u SOME options that matter. new mahi mahi and inkblot for example are pretty bad for this. paltry side area that honestly doesnt change anything about the game. maybe ink matters a bit more but not by much. both side areas just take u to mid. thats probably my biggest issue with the map design as a whole. barely any choices that just takes u to mid. that might be better for competitive matches. but wat about THE mode nintendo advertises? idk, i feel like we need more openness of maps like old hammerhead and the reef where ur choices actually matter. new flounder heights are exempt cuz that still gives u options that matter but the maps an exception. having small maps and rushdown maps are fine in moderation. but i feel like having maps that give u some space and options for the majority of the map selection would be way better in my opionion.
As a hero shooter main since Wii U I do not have an issue with the stages in three except mahi mahi zones. It is the most cluster stage in the whole title. I just need to learn the stage layout. How do I enter solo recon mode?
Talk to the fish lady in the plaza, in the initial area where you spawn in when entering the game. You have to choose your weapon and gear before talking to her, you can do so without entering the lobby.
I really enjoy the map design of Splatoon 3. It's very fast paced and works well with the new specials imo. One hell of a step up from walleye warehouse and moray towers.
Id agree except ive actually had more fun on walleye and moray compared to some of the maps in this game like undertow. Granted not saying much moray and walleye were still bad but i did enjoy them more And specal wise the only 2 id day dont work with splatoon 3's maps are bug bubbler and crab tank. Crab tank because its overtuned and controls far too much of the map and bubbler because its too tanky
ive been playing since the first game and i love turf war. it gives me an alternative to just attacking and getting stuck in battles. splatoon 3 kind of diminished this aspect. weapons that favor ground cover over damage are practically useless now! everyone cheeses on aerosprays for dying in mid but there is nothing to do but fight in mid. it's a headache.
Here’s the thing: Splatoon is still getting updates to give some extra features, so maybe we’ll eventually get an update about this if Nintendo sees this video or just how they said, considering it themselves.
I’ve never really understood the stages bad thing cause, well I’m pretty dumb and just fling mortars everywhere like an idiot. but the chess analogies really helped me, starting to see it!
My issue with mahi mahi is how useless water level become The underwater area is sooooo fucking small compared to splatoon 2, and the lakc of inkable turf just makes it useless
ngl my favorite moments in splatoon 3 is close combat with hectic movement like one time i had a jr and o was just rolling all around my enemy inching him closer to death with each bullet, that close combat is so thrilling and i kinda understand why they designed the map to make it happen more, but the thing is this sort of combat can happen in an open stage, just not as often but you know other kind of combat that is just as fun can happen like sneaking or flanking so i dont understand why they didnt just get the best of both worlds
How about Nintendo does something interesting and unique with their maps for once and adds a stage where the tide changes through the game, meaning at times, certain areas won’t be accessible to ink until the tide rises again, which also would open new areas to go to. I know they did this in one splatoon 3 map, but it could have been done better instead of “the tide goes down, that’s it” like have the players fear that the tide could rise again and kill them. Also how about some underground flanking tunnels where it’s almost pitch black and the target on enemies doesn’t appear in that area meaning chargers can’t easily camp that area and also have cover down there to get through
@@maplemiles3381 "Entitled teenager" for making a harmless opinion video? Cut the crap. The only reason why you're saying that is because you personally don't find a problem with the map design. It's fine if you like it, but don't hand wave someone else's criticism towards something they see an issue with because *you* don't see eye to eye. You're acting more like an entitled teenager than they are.
I feel as though Splatoon 3 is almost just a different/worse version of Splatoon 2, like a glorified rom hack of sorts. Lots of things were changed for the sake of changing them (stage design, all the unnecessary currencies, muddier lighting etc.), as opposed to implementing new ideas and fixing genuine problems to provide an actually unique experience...
When I saw Brinewater springs I had low hopes, but then I was somehow more disappointed because I counted literally 0 climbable walls. It's like nintendo is completely disregarding the fact that Splatoon is the only shooter with climbable walls. Splatoon 1 actually embraced the unique movement mechanics. 2 and 3 feel slower because of the lack of utilization of those mechanics despite having more controls/movement.
The devs could’ve done a completely easy thing. Keep the maps big and have an unreachable area to not be spawn camped and then have 2nd section that can be navigated with at least 3 different ways. Simple use big maps. Salmon run has big maps why not multiplayer.
Can Splatoon players stop using chess in their arguments? I play both chess and Splatoon and I can say that while things from chess do carry over, it is not what Splatoon players think carry over. Here is what you need to know: There are two sides of the board: Queenside (files A,B,C,D) and Kingside (files E,F,G,H) with the center files being C-F, but mostly D and E. So yes, a square has more flank rotes than Splatoon maps. What you describe chess as is just one half of chess: the positional element. There is a tactical element where yes you can run into the enemy camp and attack. You can't just place your knights wherever you want and expect your opponent not to capture. If you are trying to argue that there is more action when you make the knights faster, actually show practical use cases that would make me want to give up my close-range beast. Ok I said enough. Thank you for listening to my TED-talk.
The map design definitely was built around turf war (WOW!!!! shocker!! Splatoon never cares about turf war!!!!!!!) I really wish nintendo would try to put more focus on other modes though, coming from a turf war main too lmao.
interesting concept, but id argue your analysis of both chess and splatoon are inaccurate here (but not blunders at least). it doesnt matter how many spaces a pawn can move if it can only move in a straight line, a bishop only needs to stay on the same diagonal with line of sight to promotion square to prevent the promotion from ever happening. likewise, the problem with many of splat3 maps is that you only ever need to watch 1 or maybe 2 paths which a charger can safely maintain line of sight on at all times. this isnt a problem in chess because if you have a bishop and your opponent only has a pawn, then you must have taken more relevant pieces than your opponent in several complex interactions to reach this gamestate to begin with. your advantage is your reward for outplaying your opponent. whereas in splat3, this is the natural state of the game as soon as 1 team coinflips past the singular choke on mid and gets to lockout the other team for the rest of the game. the mid sections of the map promote stalemates that are often only broken by random chance, and the team that wins that coinflip is rewarded with an advantage that can prevent the other team from leaving spawn entirely. THAT is what makes splat3 maps feel bad to play on. the number and effectiveness of the movement options are NOT the primary contributing factors to the maps playing out this way. we actually know this with certainty, because zipcaster and inkjet exist in the game to create (temporary) gamebreaking movement, and yet theyre pretty underrepresented in all levels of play and dont exacerbate the issues of the map design. if movement is whats breaking the map design, youd expect inkjet and zipcaster to be meta defining. crabs cant turn fast enough to hit either of these specials if theyre placed right. in fact, these specials are some of the very few options you can use to manually create flanking options against charger in spite of the map design, yet they still dont break the map design, nor do they feel like temporary solutions to the map design. id argue these specials, despite vastly increasing movement options, have very little influence on the way the map design currently feels. the added movement in splat3 doesnt even influence the map design all that much, imo. squid roll is more of a combat trick that sometimes enables minor shortcuts, but not enough to greatly influence what paths you can take and how quickly you can get to key areas of the map (squid rolling is slower than swimming, enough that the minor shortcuts they enable likely dont change the pace of the game on their own). squid surge has almost no relevant gameplay impact because its so slow. you could argue that both of these mechanics contribute indirectly to fewer paintable walls because maybe the devs thought these mechanics would result in abuse of those paintable walls, but thats a very different argument than the one you make in the video that points out movement freedom as a direct cause of the map design not being compatible with the increased pace of the game. the actual core issue with the design is the number of relevant sightlines, paths (both flank routes and objective routes included), and points of interest on the map. this is exacerbated by the fact that displacement specials are significantly weaker than in splat2. you do mention these as issues, but you inaccurately characterize them as symptoms of increased movement options, rather than as the main problems with the maps themselves. if you dumped splat3 maps into splat1, they would be slightly less problematic because of the slower pace of the game and the number of blowout specials to break stalemates that exist there, but i would expect they would still feel noticeably worse than the good stages in splat1, regardless of the vast difference in movement options. they might feel fine in splat2, but only because the strength of displacement specials prevents stalemates at mid from existing for too long, and force other parts of the map to be relevant because youre forced to move all the time, and notably this wouldnt be the result of the lack of squidroll or squid surge. a small nitpick perhaps, but one that kinda undermines one of the main premises of the video. that being said, very well written video tho, hope to see more from you in the future.
Have you considered the current maps are designed in such a way that lets players, both new and experienced but moreso new, get used to the new mechanics and weapons? We are already seeing "better designed" maps with Brinewater and Founder so I think the devs understand what they are doing with the map design. I think weapon balance is far more important than map design.
A poorly designed weapon is certainly not fun, but at least you don’t have to play with it, if there’s a terribly designed map still in rotation, then EVERYONE has to play on it on that mode. Map design is more important than weapon balance (which is still important) because of the fact that maps in general are more integral to the core gameplay compared to weapons
Save negative competitive Splatoon content for when we have a sizable English community that is relevant, so that videos like this can actually improve the community's knowledge, rather than get recommended and turn some off from getting into the scene
![BLACK BAG - Official Trailer [HD] - Only in Theaters March 14](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Du0Xp8WX_7I/mqdefault.jpg)
Thank you so much for watching this video!
As always, please comment any ideas down below.
Also, please like and subscribe if you enjoyed :D
First time I actually subbed because someone told me to. I realized "I watched 8 minutes and enjoyed it, might as well" you make good content, I hope you become sucessful
Gem from Squid School put it best, imo:
"When did Splatoon become a game with so many uninkable walls?"
I love the point you made about stages feeling smaller because less places matter. That’s a very good insight, if only 40% of the map is important, it’s going to feel 60% smaller because you don’t ever use that portion. I do wish you elaborated more on the older maps that did this well like Flounder Heights and Urchin Underpass, it would be good to have a way to compare and contrast what the maps were like and how they are today because I do feel as if there was a significant downgrade between games beyond the movement changing. The factoid that the maps aren’t much smaller than they’ve been in the past with the statistics showing the points per smallest map in each game was very thought provoking and informed the overall video a lot. The chess analogy was initially a bit confusing but it gave the video an overall theme and a quick and easy way to explain game design. Overall, good video!
Thank you so much! Love this comment, one of the best I've ever received :D
@@maplemiles3381 while I acknowledge that this is subjective, (after all, they feel small, they aren’t any smaller than they have been) but a lot of the community thinks that the maps are small even though that’s not the case. This video explains why
The one thing I would say is faster weapons are not exactly better, weapons that control space while being seen and can effect people ahead of them do, such as chargers. I like the overall approach and the comparison between paint total and relevant areas hits it. Mentioning the decrease in paintable walls could also be good. Nice job
Thank you so much! Also, Hi Chara :D
@ProChara
Translated by Google:
I COMPLETELY HATED IT! 😡😡 That I support painting and maintaining control of the map, most of the times that I get blown up are chargers 👁️ because there is almost no cover. And I am also extremely tired that most of the time the chargers in professional hands literally have 100% control of the map because of how flat they are
"If I move around him or bring him down to me, I'll be able to easily fight him. 😼"
*dies*
My brain has expanded to that of a nebula
What also needs to be addressed are the =horrific= bottlenecks in the S3 maps. In S2, you ALWAYS had at least two ways to get into enemy turf. Now, there's maybe one small ramp AT BEST that can be easily defended, with Scorch Gorge's suicide grate being about as wide as a SHOE at the end, meaning that battles are determined by an extremely easily flippable mid that can lead to a turnaround win in the last five seconds. It doesn't reward skill, tactics, or patience like it used to.
S3 maps mostly have multiple ways to get into enemy turf too though and most battles are determined by a lot of things and it usually rewards skill, tactics, or patience, but there are exceptions.
@@Jdudec367 In ranked, not turf.
@@Kiruklee In both actually.
@@Jdudec367there’s hardly any options for flanking. If you’re in disadvantage in a splatoon 3 game, you’re best bet really is to turn the tides with a special or a clean push. There’s hardly any option for flanking, if at all. Back in 1 and 2, even if you were alone against 4, you could flank the other team and hide in corners to have your team jump to you and ambush the other team from the side or from behind. You can’t really do that in splatoon 3 since every part of the stages are out in the open and leave less tactical potential there
@@stevenmcburney8167 No there is. Or flank across, I don't see the issue with that really There is options for flanking though. Um no you can not every part of every stage is out in the open, and of course you can alternative between flanking and going into ink too.
So I guess the main solution is… wider maps I guess. Most maps tend to be linear, leading to mid with few good ways to circumvent this. A wider map would allow for that, or it would divide mid into 3 different sections, sort of turning the map into a 3x3 grid of sections rather than a 1x3 rectangle. Even a plus sign shape would be better, with spawn being one section, true mid being in the middle, and 2 side sections to flank around, each section having about the same percentage of turf to ink/control.
Seriously, that and maybe a little more cover in the really open areas and some more inkable surfaces.
They should look at the design of Splatoon 1 maps.
Also don’t make the flanking areas on the sides only accessible from one side. Makes it more interesting when you know that at any moment, that area of the side of the map could be taken by an enemy and forces you to stay on your guard more. With splatoon 3, I don’t feel any incentive to stay on my guard unless I’m in mid and even then, all the enemies are usually in front of me since it’s a straight lined map
very interesting video, i liked the chess analogies even if they were a bit confusing to me at first. also isnt it funny how they added a whole new mechanic dedicated to climbing walls and yet they added so many uninkable walls? brinewater has NO inkable walls apart from the block in the middle. it’s ridiculous 💀 they also added squid rolls and yet so many maps are incredibly flat. scorch gorge mid is just a huge flat open area, its so uninteresting. and lets not even get into hammerhead
i wish the map design was able to make the most of the movement system, bc splatoons movement is so cool and has been improved even more in this game with the new mechanics. they havent truly taken advantage of it yet, i hope we see some improvements soon
They need to re-do a ton of stages, like they did with Starfish Mainstage in Splatoon 2
I’m an Ink Brush main, so these map issues are felt severely for me. The massive favoring of map designs towards backliners makes seeing a splatling or charger more of a “Guess I won’t be able to have fun today” feeling instead of “Time to find fun ways to pressure the snipers!” Being outranged by every other weapons means that on some maps with even just barely competent opponents, I can barely move anywhere without getting splatted even when I’m doing my best to maneuver or creatively flank/ambush
I may not use inkbrush as much, but I feel this sentiment just as much. Flank routes can be used by all sorts of weapons to pressure backliners or take pressure off of friendly backliners when covered . . . and the lack of them in 3 really shows how much of a dimension they added to play. Sure Splooshes and similar weapons are less annoying now, but they're nowhere near as oppressive at their worst as backliners are now.
I feel the same way, I’m a dapple duelies main and I’m outranged by everything.
Ive had way too many matches where we just get locked out at spawn. Its not fun when everyone dies and then nobody can recover. in Splatoon 2, this rarely happened, even in ranked modes
I really do miss how huge and vertical the Splatoon 1 map’s were. Seeing flounder heights and Mahi Mahi resort getting essentially massacred in 3 really wasn’t necessary.
Also the bridge map got gutted
@@abisk I know Nintendo said hammerhead bridge is now “complete” in Splatoon 3 but man I miss how it was in Splatoon 1
@Jeff Logan hardly nostalgia when overall the maps in Splatoon 1 were bigger and had way more options for going to the centre.
It beats the point of brining maps from 1 just to butcher them like that. They easily could of made original maps instead of butchering maps from 1 where they funnel everyone to the middle.
Not only are the lack of Flank routes a problem, but also the clear advantage to chargers with the large open areas and lots of high ground is also an issue, making many matches for closer ranged weapons a nightmare if any e liter is on the opposing team
This goes for any long range backline weapons
Another thing I noticed as a Brella enjoyer:
Though you could theoretically use the canopy to take some backliner pressure off yourself/your team (assuming of course the game decides it's hit detection will work that match), the sheer open space you're left with once the canopy's gone (alongside the ink deficit) make you a sitting duck since the backliner can just snap to any of the predictable escape routes you'd have in that scenario and pick you before you even have a chance to get to relative safety. I'd imagine it's a similar story with splash walls and any other player-created cover.
Thank you for explaining the issues of Splatoon 3's map design better than I could. This kind of level design makes the game feels so much smaller. A lot of the maps have what I call Walleye Warehouse syndrome. Just three places you can move, and incredibly easy to get trapped in. As long as the team can cover those three areas then they have the whole game. It makes the game too Charger and Splatling friendly as well because all they have to do is control those three areas without having to deal with any flank points.
This makes the special roster even worse because specials like the Baller and even Bomb Rush could give the team the ability to push through. There were more options inside of Splatoon 2 than in 3 and I don't know if many really understand why some still prefer 2 over 3. 3 does have improvements over 2, but 3 limits the amount of options, flanks and positioning you could do towards the other team thanks to the difference in specials and the boxy, three way map design. It makes 3 a hassle to play and even somewhat boring. I hope they improve this with time as I've been playing Splatoon since the first game, and the second game is my most played Switch game. Excellent video!
i’ve played all three games and another problem i’ve felt with 3 is that the maps cater toward keeping players on specific set routes. uninkable walls, uninkable floors, and hazard areas that could lend themselves to smarter plays and better overall map coverage could in theory elevate the maps, but unfortunately with how many uninkables there are, it feels so controlling and limited. The maps feel forgettable and like any other shooting game with the severe lack of creativity they’ve put in. What’s the point of playing a game where you can paint walls and climb up them if the only paintable walls are the mandatory high ground in mid? Flounder Heights lends itself to such fun and varied gameplay because almost the entirety of mid is a flank route with how many walls you can climb. Unfortunately, with a portion of it being uninkable it has severely limited both the right and left side, but even then the map remains the best in the game
Splatoon 1 surprised me when i played it last month with how many walls you can climb up and how many different options you can take. it felt like everytime i played a map there was a new way i was able to approach that i didn’t figure out beforehand. they felt unique with their layouts and even if i can’t stand some of them (Arowana/Kelp Dome/Moray Towers/Saltspray) they each have their own unique identity and layout that sets them apart from one another. Spla2n also had unique identities with their maps, although the layouts were lackluster and felt convoluted. Splatoon 3 took what was bad about Spla2n maps and straight up crushed them into their lowest common denominator. Mahi Mahi 3 is a good example. I can never imagine a map like Mincemeat or Undertow coming back in future installments either, no one will ever want them
@@Fridgemasters Gyahahaaa, more people are using "Spla2n"... I heavily approve.
Ive been replaying Splat1 a lot recently and I'm amazed at just how fun it is. It was incredibly unbalanced and stupid, but it was still incredibly enjoyable, maybe even more so than Splatoon 3.
Flounder heights is by far the best in the game. Only issue I see with it tho is it heavily caters to the advantage state in ranked due to the mid being the highest point in the map meaning it’s harder for the losing team to make a comeback in say tower control or rainmaker
Thanks for this explanation, I noticed I was having a lot less fun and a lot more rage when playing _any_ Splat 3 despite the improvements . . . and at least now I can put words to why. I just miss alternate routes man.
Honestly, splatoon 2 maps just feel the best now that I've played splatoon 3. But now I think that yeah, the gameplay was still a bit slower in 2, though even slower in the wackier maps of 1. It feels like 2's maps in 3 are really hitting a sweet spot in how big they feel vs how fast the game is. And also maps generally in 3 are really lacking in gimmicks (mahi is executed badly), they all feel samey, whereas 2 still had a variety of maps even though some were tight like 3's more-than-just-some new maps.
Maybe that was the intention of the developers to make the previous maps look better by designing crap maps for 3.
See, I'm glad I'm not the only one who felt this about the maps. I didn't play Splat 1, and not much of Splat 2 but from what I've played, I felt the maps played better in Splat 2 because the places you went, mattered. All routes goes to mid map destination isn't good design. Flounder Heights is the only map that doesn't feel too congested
This is a really interesting take. I never thought to consider that it was the pacing of the game that made the maps feel smaller and not the maps themselves. As fun as the game is, I do think the map design really makes it suffer at times. Right now, e-liters and long-range weapons dominate because there aren't many reliable ways to get to them. Hopefully the design team takes this into consideration when modifying current maps or creating new ones.
@Jeff Logan um, I'm not sure if you're trolling, but I'm not ripping on the game. I personally still find it a lot of fun, even if some of the maps are a bit wonky. This is just my personal take on the map design. Overall, the maps play just fine, I just noticed a few issues is all. If the game never changes, then I'm fine cause it's still a great and fun game and I'll definitely still play. This is just my opinion man. No need to get so aggressive.
Also, my profile pic is from a video game. Just sayin...
@@roboking1020 that is one thing about this game their is just so much good and even if you find the maps odd some of these stuff over shadow the cons. I like to see a new casual mode called "Splat match" which is a death match in its 3 minutes and the goal is score the most total splats the total splats from each player will at the end of the match are subtracted of how many times each has been splatted and who has the highest points wins and they can share the same rotation as the current rotating Turf War maps.
@@maplemiles3381 love this. that's actually a really interesting idea. I've always wondered what a more classical style deathmatch sort of gamemode would be like in splatoon.
@@roboking1020 well from the video "better map" designs I don't see any problem with them and I do like meshi meshi, hammerhead, and flounder heights well I'm not picky with maps and it looks like their making more balance and size with it being 3rd person gives you better surrounding of where their coming from. Well what I'm saying is the current map design are good and the upgrade to hammerhead is not bad and a upgrade from splatoon 1 despite the absence of roots to flank people.
The game is the most content pack since Nintendo in the past and other devs have done a games that are bare content in the base and add season pass battle pass and Nintendo still found a way with splatoon 1 and 2 to work at launch and the 3rd game has a lot of content at launch within the base game. Well I'm not part of a splatoon community and have zero interest to join but I'm glad the game is relevant and has been selling with maybe 10-12 by next earning and has gotten great reviews. But the biggest flaw is not maps or meta but it's been posted everywhere when I look up the game and that is its net code. It has seen some improvements but it got slightly worse with new players from Christmas from what I've seen. I'm confident that these will get iron out and Splatoon does have good online experience from Nintendo or any per 2 per but the you cold play against a host with McDonald's wifi. It is great game overall and can't wait to join in but as big the game is in Japan Nintendo should start giving this game more exposure to get new players the future is bright with the support but Nintendo with that "Splat match" should bring in new people since earlier people on twitch what it and a person said to me. People don't know how to play it and left and never heard of it despite the fact it's a new big new system selling ip from Nintendo and their in house dev team.
@@maplemiles3381 I totally agree dude. Maps aside, the game is still great, and honestly a breath of fresh air. Like you said a lot of games these days are selling with the bare minimum of required content in the game and the rest is locked behind a paywall as dlc or a season pass. The fact that this game as an in-house season pass that is simply a part of the game rather than a paid add on is beautiful imo.
If you ever choose to pick up the game, I don't doubt that you'll have a lot of fun. It is super niche however (at least competitively) so I understand how its not every ones cup of te, but overall lots of fun things to do still.
One massive impact ive noticed over the last two games is that you can no longer storm the enemy base. There is nearly always an uninkable wall, sponge, or other obstacle that will stop the enemy from entering the base.
While that is good in theory to limit spawn camping… it creates a whole area of the game that isnt touched after you initially ink it.
In splatoon 1, iirc, the ONLY map in the game in which you couldnt reach the enemy base was saltspray rig. This map at least did it well, by having multiple areas in the general map which you could funnel into.
If the enemy cannot even enter your base, is there any point in having one? Each team is just going to have the same amount of turf there, and then the only important space in the map is the mid.
Just something that sort of bothers me in 2 and 3, could be nostalgia but i really feel like it impacts the gameplay.
'I would be able to easily fight him'
Proceeds to die
A characteristic to the Splatoon 3's map design is to use the peak hight of a squid roll (h) and make everything with that in mind. Also, Wave Breaker and Tacticooler are double that hight (2×h) which is the same with most of drops and ledges in this game. It helps to function properly those two specials, with Wave Breaker stopping at that hight and Tacticooler not getting destroyed by the rotating platforms on Museum for example. Unfortunately though, it makes everything short to the point that you lose cover just by standing.
This is more well pronounced in Bridge, Hagglefish Market and 2 Star Hotel (Mahi). The absolute pinnacle of flat and boring in the game right now.
I mean… we have squid surge and we can't use it by design.
Great video! At first I didn't understood why you brought up chess but you nailed it. It's a comparison that seams random at first but makes so much sense!
honestly i feel like another problem is just ...... its small. It feels like everything in splatoon 3 shrunk while we grew. comparing maps that are still the “same” ie flounder heights i feel like you can kind of tell what i mean
5:34
Translated by Google:
Hey, I agree with you with what you said. If the chargers were a nightmare in Splatoon 2 but only on some maps since you had cover to protect yourself. In Splatoon 3 they are a thousand times worse, because add the new maps and some redesigns that most of them are flat, the chargers in professional hands literally have complete control because it will destroy your allies in an April and blink of an eye because there is almost no coverage to protect yourself. Splatoon 3 needs to redesign the maps so that there is more coverage and so that the magazines in professional hands are not broken at all times that is currently happening.
4:25
Translated by Google:
That map is HORRIBLE! because it is so small that it creates total chaos that almost all players cannot fit in the small size. The platforms is also another thing that he hated because the shot type weapons get in the way a lot. I prefer a thousand times that they return to the original because this redesign is TERRIBLE!
Really all we need is more verticality and flank route options. We should also provide areas where chargers and splatlings can benefit, but make it so their team has to cover their flanks.
it appears that the devs hated spawncamping so much that they just made it near impossible to reach anywhere that wasnt mid. and that alone gave backline a massive advantage
Which I stupid because they already fixed spawn camping by giving the losing team an opportunity to shoot in different areas while having armour
Splatoon has always been a mobility focused shooter though, map size isn't really an issue, it's the map layouts. Flanks and alt routes is what splatoon maps actually lack, stands out more when you play a map that does have alt routes and flanks into center. Don't believe me go look into quake and unreal tournament. They were also mobility focused shooters and their maps were also pretty small, but they had corridors alternative passages and more to let you get around the maps while still being mostly in cover, now to also be fair unlike other shooters, splatoon doesn't have weapons thatcan shoot clear across the entire map, every weapon has limited range. Meaning every weapon can only really control a certain section around it.
another key difference with those arena shooters is that a lot of the movement isn't informed by the map as much as splatoon is, you can rocket jump and bunny hop wherever you want in those old school arena shooters but in splatoon, if you can't paint that wall then you're not scaling that wall.
a map in quake or unreal or even in TF2 has to actively go out of it's way to constrain your ability to move around the map. whereas splatoon has to provide that mobility through inkable walls and rails and such.
Remember when they removed a whole flank zone?
If you go back to the pre-release trailers you can see completely different versions of Eeltail and Scorch Gorge that have a bunch of alternate routes that were just completely removed in the final game just like with Mahi Mahi and Hammerhead. Which means this isn't a mistake that needs education, but a deliberate choice the devs made. They have versions of these maps that are good, and could revert them, but don't want to. Why? What's wrong with them?
Nintendo is a company that is very behind the times, and when they try to get in the times, it usually goes poorly.
It appears as if many parts of our current times aren't so great.
@@abisk Yes, but I don’t see any old fashioned or modern trend that would suggest “make all the maps one single choke point”
The problem with 3 is it’s mostly rehashed maps from 2 and the maps from 1 are butchered to be like ever other map from 2 and 3 where you are tunnelled to the middle.
Butchering the maps from 1 just beats the point of bringing them back in the first place if there going to be made the same.
4:35 i felt that in my soul
I think maps are easier to change than we think but it’s hard to imagine them fixing it.
The maps are smaller in 3 you don’t really use all of the map space given to you because of how spawning works and how on most maps you aren’t really playing in the spawn area. And another method showing the scale of maps is how big it spaced out the props and groundwork Is on the maps you can have a big space with tons of massive obstacles in them that make the maps feel smaller
This video is great, truly a nice suprise after some other... interesting, takes ive seen in other videos
great video hope it gets more attention. I like the comparisons to chess a lot
Ive never considered the map situation like this, great video!
Honestly, i have zero faith in nintendo to make the best decisions for this game, since the new season cycle is already showing its flaws, but some splattubers have said that splat2 was in a great state toward the END… so will they keep us all invested?
Toward the end? Wasn't that Ink Armor/Tenta Missiles meta?
So glad to see someone putting it into words
its either small maps or wat i call rush down maps. wall eye, new hammerhead bridge, arowanna mall, etc. theres not as many maps nowadays that give u flanking options or just different routes in general. lots of maps force u to either go straight to mid or just give u an "option" thats just a tiny side area going to mid. so theres barely any choice in the matter. i may hate saltspray rig but atleast it gives u SOME options that matter. new mahi mahi and inkblot for example are pretty bad for this. paltry side area that honestly doesnt change anything about the game. maybe ink matters a bit more but not by much. both side areas just take u to mid. thats probably my biggest issue with the map design as a whole. barely any choices that just takes u to mid. that might be better for competitive matches. but wat about THE mode nintendo advertises? idk, i feel like we need more openness of maps like old hammerhead and the reef where ur choices actually matter. new flounder heights are exempt cuz that still gives u options that matter but the maps an exception. having small maps and rushdown maps are fine in moderation. but i feel like having maps that give u some space and options for the majority of the map selection would be way better in my opionion.
As a hero shooter main since Wii U I do not have an issue with the stages in three except mahi mahi zones. It is the most cluster stage in the whole title. I just need to learn the stage layout.
How do I enter solo recon mode?
Talk to the fish lady in the plaza, in the initial area where you spawn in when entering the game. You have to choose your weapon and gear before talking to her, you can do so without entering the lobby.
I really enjoy the map design of Splatoon 3. It's very fast paced and works well with the new specials imo. One hell of a step up from walleye warehouse and moray towers.
Id agree except ive actually had more fun on walleye and moray compared to some of the maps in this game like undertow. Granted not saying much moray and walleye were still bad but i did enjoy them more
And specal wise the only 2 id day dont work with splatoon 3's maps are bug bubbler and crab tank. Crab tank because its overtuned and controls far too much of the map and bubbler because its too tanky
congratulations tiny channel, you have wound up on my home page
ive been playing since the first game and i love turf war. it gives me an alternative to just attacking and getting stuck in battles. splatoon 3 kind of diminished this aspect. weapons that favor ground cover over damage are practically useless now! everyone cheeses on aerosprays for dying in mid but there is nothing to do but fight in mid. it's a headache.
Here’s the thing: Splatoon is still getting updates to give some extra features, so maybe we’ll eventually get an update about this if Nintendo sees this video or just how they said, considering it themselves.
Good video!
0:40 bruh don’t cut the clip we all know you died
Yeah i died but so did he. I honestly didn't realize I cut the clip early
@@abisk honestly it’s good comedy, I approve
@@abisk it was funny dw lol
I’ve never really understood the stages bad thing cause, well I’m pretty dumb and just fling mortars everywhere like an idiot. but the chess analogies really helped me, starting to see it!
@7:03 while I never played splatoon 1 online, I can see that this is easily the best stage in the series, if not then top 3
My issue with mahi mahi is how useless water level become
The underwater area is sooooo fucking small compared to splatoon 2, and the lakc of inkable turf just makes it useless
ngl my favorite moments in splatoon 3 is close combat with hectic movement
like one time i had a jr and o was just rolling all around my enemy inching him closer to death with each bullet, that close combat is so thrilling and i kinda understand why they designed the map to make it happen more, but the thing is this sort of combat can happen in an open stage, just not as often but you know other kind of combat that is just as fun can happen like sneaking or flanking so i dont understand why they didnt just get the best of both worlds
This video is a prime example of how to sound smart without saying anything.
How about Nintendo does something interesting and unique with their maps for once and adds a stage where the tide changes through the game, meaning at times, certain areas won’t be accessible to ink until the tide rises again, which also would open new areas to go to. I know they did this in one splatoon 3 map, but it could have been done better instead of “the tide goes down, that’s it” like have the players fear that the tide could rise again and kill them. Also how about some underground flanking tunnels where it’s almost pitch black and the target on enemies doesn’t appear in that area meaning chargers can’t easily camp that area and also have cover down there to get through
What in God's blessedly cursed earth was that chess opening?!?
I think I lost all of my brain cells at that chess game at the start lol
Cool vid, most of this i did not understand, im new to the series so yea...
That is bad on your part just jumped into a video of a entitled teenager having a pointless belly ache
@@maplemiles3381 "Entitled teenager" for making a harmless opinion video? Cut the crap. The only reason why you're saying that is because you personally don't find a problem with the map design. It's fine if you like it, but don't hand wave someone else's criticism towards something they see an issue with because *you* don't see eye to eye. You're acting more like an entitled teenager than they are.
The Splatoon points are well constructed but that chess footage at the beginning hurts my soul to watch
Yeah, I wasn't even trying, I just kinda moved pieces around to get footage
Am I the only one who has been kicked out 26 times because of a connection error today?
Before some people say I have bad internet, I do not. Maybe my internet isn't 100% perfect but it is pretty decent
Splatoon 3 moment
@@NotSnak I wonder how much Nintendo pays for their networking engineers 💀
5 airplane peanut bags
@@abisk I just played for 3 hours and got disconnected about 30 times this day wtf
I like the chess analogy a lot here
0:44. Did the Hydra win?
Trade because its my first time playing Sploosh in eyars
I feel as though Splatoon 3 is almost just a different/worse version of Splatoon 2, like a glorified rom hack of sorts. Lots of things were changed for the sake of changing them (stage design, all the unnecessary currencies, muddier lighting etc.), as opposed to implementing new ideas and fixing genuine problems to provide an actually unique experience...
Yeah I really noticed that the lighting in this game is awful compared to Splatoon 2
I took a charger on mahi mahi and was able to almost wipe the whole enemy team multiple times…
Chess and Splatoon, I like it.
When I saw Brinewater springs I had low hopes, but then I was somehow more disappointed because I counted literally 0 climbable walls. It's like nintendo is completely disregarding the fact that Splatoon is the only shooter with climbable walls. Splatoon 1 actually embraced the unique movement mechanics. 2 and 3 feel slower because of the lack of utilization of those mechanics despite having more controls/movement.
Wait brinewater has SOME climbable walls, right?
as far as i know it has 1 in zones nvm this is odl
The devs could’ve done a completely easy thing. Keep the maps big and have an unreachable area to not be spawn camped and then have 2nd section that can be navigated with at least 3 different ways. Simple use big maps. Salmon run has big maps why not multiplayer.
0:42 He says as he dies to the Hydra.
I know right it's kind of embarrassing
@@masonhyde9411 I find it funny.
no, no - the maps are also smaller dude. it's baaaddd.. they can't be so tiny!
*Me regretting my decision to not join chess club:*
I don't see any problem with the map design and i really don't think they need to fixed at all its not even "game breaking"
Splatoon is not Chess, it’s strange to think the game should lean toward the way of Chess…
Hi, I thought we were watching a documentary about Splatoon, not chess
0:17 tell that to the 400 elo people who think Wayward Queen is a good opening lmao
41-46 "i can easily splat him"
0:40 bro definitely died
Can Splatoon players stop using chess in their arguments? I play both chess and Splatoon and I can say that while things from chess do carry over, it is not what Splatoon players think carry over.
Here is what you need to know:
There are two sides of the board: Queenside (files A,B,C,D) and Kingside (files E,F,G,H) with the center files being C-F, but mostly D and E. So yes, a square has more flank rotes than Splatoon maps.
What you describe chess as is just one half of chess: the positional element. There is a tactical element where yes you can run into the enemy camp and attack.
You can't just place your knights wherever you want and expect your opponent not to capture. If you are trying to argue that there is more action when you make the knights faster, actually show practical use cases that would make me want to give up my close-range beast.
Ok I said enough. Thank you for listening to my TED-talk.
The map design definitely was built around turf war (WOW!!!! shocker!! Splatoon never cares about turf war!!!!!!!) I really wish nintendo would try to put more focus on other modes though, coming from a turf war main too lmao.
Dude cut the clip of him being fully splatted on 0:45 when that was an easy kill lol
Don’t worry, I also end up getting splatted there
Wait your the guy in the video????
@@abisk Probably
interesting concept, but id argue your analysis of both chess and splatoon are inaccurate here (but not blunders at least).
it doesnt matter how many spaces a pawn can move if it can only move in a straight line, a bishop only needs to stay on the same diagonal with line of sight to promotion square to prevent the promotion from ever happening. likewise, the problem with many of splat3 maps is that you only ever need to watch 1 or maybe 2 paths which a charger can safely maintain line of sight on at all times. this isnt a problem in chess because if you have a bishop and your opponent only has a pawn, then you must have taken more relevant pieces than your opponent in several complex interactions to reach this gamestate to begin with. your advantage is your reward for outplaying your opponent. whereas in splat3, this is the natural state of the game as soon as 1 team coinflips past the singular choke on mid and gets to lockout the other team for the rest of the game. the mid sections of the map promote stalemates that are often only broken by random chance, and the team that wins that coinflip is rewarded with an advantage that can prevent the other team from leaving spawn entirely. THAT is what makes splat3 maps feel bad to play on.
the number and effectiveness of the movement options are NOT the primary contributing factors to the maps playing out this way. we actually know this with certainty, because zipcaster and inkjet exist in the game to create (temporary) gamebreaking movement, and yet theyre pretty underrepresented in all levels of play and dont exacerbate the issues of the map design. if movement is whats breaking the map design, youd expect inkjet and zipcaster to be meta defining. crabs cant turn fast enough to hit either of these specials if theyre placed right. in fact, these specials are some of the very few options you can use to manually create flanking options against charger in spite of the map design, yet they still dont break the map design, nor do they feel like temporary solutions to the map design. id argue these specials, despite vastly increasing movement options, have very little influence on the way the map design currently feels.
the added movement in splat3 doesnt even influence the map design all that much, imo. squid roll is more of a combat trick that sometimes enables minor shortcuts, but not enough to greatly influence what paths you can take and how quickly you can get to key areas of the map (squid rolling is slower than swimming, enough that the minor shortcuts they enable likely dont change the pace of the game on their own). squid surge has almost no relevant gameplay impact because its so slow. you could argue that both of these mechanics contribute indirectly to fewer paintable walls because maybe the devs thought these mechanics would result in abuse of those paintable walls, but thats a very different argument than the one you make in the video that points out movement freedom as a direct cause of the map design not being compatible with the increased pace of the game.
the actual core issue with the design is the number of relevant sightlines, paths (both flank routes and objective routes included), and points of interest on the map. this is exacerbated by the fact that displacement specials are significantly weaker than in splat2. you do mention these as issues, but you inaccurately characterize them as symptoms of increased movement options, rather than as the main problems with the maps themselves. if you dumped splat3 maps into splat1, they would be slightly less problematic because of the slower pace of the game and the number of blowout specials to break stalemates that exist there, but i would expect they would still feel noticeably worse than the good stages in splat1, regardless of the vast difference in movement options. they might feel fine in splat2, but only because the strength of displacement specials prevents stalemates at mid from existing for too long, and force other parts of the map to be relevant because youre forced to move all the time, and notably this wouldnt be the result of the lack of squidroll or squid surge. a small nitpick perhaps, but one that kinda undermines one of the main premises of the video.
that being said, very well written video tho, hope to see more from you in the future.
Of course. What isn't similar to Chess💀
Have you considered the current maps are designed in such a way that lets players, both new and experienced but moreso new, get used to the new mechanics and weapons? We are already seeing "better designed" maps with Brinewater and Founder so I think the devs understand what they are doing with the map design. I think weapon balance is far more important than map design.
A poorly designed weapon is certainly not fun, but at least you don’t have to play with it, if there’s a terribly designed map still in rotation, then EVERYONE has to play on it on that mode. Map design is more important than weapon balance (which is still important) because of the fact that maps in general are more integral to the core gameplay compared to weapons
Brinewater is not well designed lol its only good on zones and clams and even then its not that great
Rm and tc brinewater is a mistake
Save negative competitive Splatoon content for when we have a sizable English community that is relevant, so that videos like this can actually improve the community's knowledge, rather than get recommended and turn some off from getting into the scene
This goes for all btw, not just you, (ProChara especially guilty)
Lol don’t think it’s that complicated. Just run around and shoot people and paint sh!t
you've clearly never played splatoon
Bro it’s a game not that deep😹