I can't imagine having a childhood so devoid of LOVE and feeling that you don't belong to anyone and then the persona you created caused you not to belong to yourself .
@@darrenlloyd4835 interesting how she made herself to how she was in adult life, One must be accountable for their actions She however denied any of this
I had nearly the exact same childhood as her and have pretty much the same exact struggles because of it. From having no father, to a mother so mentally unstable that I had to spend my life in various foster homes, moving from school to school, never having stable relationships and friendships. It caused to me clam up and become insecure. This country needs to take better care of the kids who grew up in the system and check on them as adults and give them support if need be.
I think that Marilyn was more introverted than you give her credit for. Norma Jean learned to switch on her Marilyn persona. She asked a female friend once "do you want to see me do her?" and the friend then witnessed this shift in body language and energy which made heads begin to turn in her direction where moments before she could blend into the crowd on the street in NY. She didn't have a lot of friends. She didn't have anyone to rely on and trust She was easily exploited and her anger about that in unguarded moments was justified and understandable.
Yeah she said in at least one interview that she enjoys being alone and it refreshes her. She said she had to make an effort to socialize and that she perfectly happy spending time alone. I think she was an introvert for sure.
The Czech talented and beautiful artist Iveta Bartošová (brutal suicide at the age of 48) also had a lifestyle like MM, whose life was even more tragic than MM. Couldn't MM have ADHD too...? Many symptoms of BPD, ADHD, BAP overlap. Personally, it feels like she had schizoaffective disorder (ICD10/11) rather than some sub/type of schizophrenia. =========================================== In relation to the case of Marilyn Monroe, a relevant, interesting comparative case study of a typologically very similar famous personality Mrs. Iveta Bartošová (singer, actress, dancer, painter, etc.): Can we ask for your opinions on the video shown here with the lady who was definitely addicted to benzos as well? The lady was born in 1966, died - suicide in 2014 (jumped under the train). Would you be able to guess from the development of her visage, the changes in the character of her voice, what ALL addictive substances she probably used? In various videos and photographs, it can be seen that since 1987 he has continuously had large pupils. The color of her irises was a tinted grey. It is public knowledge that in 1994 she used benzos (mainly diazepam and sleeping pills) and gradually increased the doses with alcohol. Later, she often used painkillers because she had frequent injuries to her body and teeth. Is it even practically possible to heal (heal from dual mental disorders and addictions) a WOMAN who has been addicted, sick for so long...? She herself mentioned in the past that she is hyperactive (ADHD, she probably also used amphetamines when she was young, which was indicated by her colleague), she suffered chronically from dg. GAD, depression, chronic suicidality. She had been chronically addicted to alcohol since about 1997. She was an excellent talented artist. Her life story was very tragic. Currently, her sick appearance in the face is slowly starting to resemble, for example, Britney Spears. We know that Mr. Matthew Perry has probably recovered now, but he is a man who has a bio-stronger organism than a woman. Thank you very much for your opinions! You can find videos with IB analysis texts on our YT channel.
She was an empty shell who got rich in Hollywood, nearly spending her fortune on drugs and worsening the mental state that had plagued her since childhood with an absent mother and father; her mother making her inherit the same issues. The same old cliché.
I certainly miss her. I think I was 15 when her death was announced. I loved her throughout my childhood and her death traumatized me. I always thought she was so beautiful. ❤❤
fuck her, creating drama and pain out of nothing, she hurt others by hurting herself, hope she is in hell burning, she could have lived a luxurious life that many dream about, and drive off into the sunset with a wonderful, instead she chose to make things complicated and painful like Avril.
@@jenniferwilcox9759 Why is it some people feel the need to pick at every little thing? What a wretch you must be. Marilyn had/has millions of admirers, enough to qualify for a "we."
That happens to me too, it's hard to remember other people's trauma, that's why I can't watch documentaries about certain stars. My only hope is that now they shine bright and have no cares.
Was I the only one who started getting emotional?! This video made me make an appointment and actually deal w health issues I’ve been avoiding. I didn’t want my story to be like hers.
She wasn't an extrovert. She was an introvert. She said many times in interviews that she enjoyed and preferred not being so social and time alone re-energized her. That's an introvert.
It looks that way .. I AMA introvert and I walked away from all jobs and other things in life that brings dramas or abuse or over complicated events . In life. Private life path now best life path .. I happy now
5 hour long therapy sessions? Disgusting. I'm sure that therapist was bilking her for money. It's evident that many people exploited Marilyn. She led a tormented life, starved for love and acceptance. Her entire life was very sad. I can only hope she is now at peace. Thanks for sharing, Dr. Grande. I'd love if you could touch on "Mirroring" as it relates to BPD.
I'm not sure what their arrangement was - was she paying him hourly? I don't know. Maybe it was her idea. It's kind of strange to call it disgusting if we don't know what the arrangement was. Maybe she just wanted the company and someone sympathetic to be around. She was a lonely person.
@@shariwelch8760 from what I understand this would be an extremely unhealthy thing for a therapist to indulge, even if Marilyn was interested in that much contact.
Yes, this is correct and honest; as I have know people who were in Marilyn's life in 1962 and she was very happy at the time of the filming of "SOMETHING GOT TO GIVE" she was murdered by some prominent people, who are all dead! This is backed by facts not conspiracy theories!
She was a bully, she would sleep with all these men and then called their wives. She even went as far as to call Jackie Kennedy and harrassed her about JFK. She was a true Gemini.
You are so right. She had no secure attachments to either parent. That is devastating to a person. Then add hardship on top of that and you are just screwed. I have these issues myself. Childhood trauma and loss, and I can understand the issues that people like this develop. Deep insecurity. Fantasy, divorce. Lashing out at people. Reactive behavior.
@@lumiere7216 how so? Judy Garland and Norma Jean Baker were from somewhat deprived backgrounds. Elizabeth Taylor was from a more well-to-do background, her father owned an art gallery.
The way that Dr. Grande was so empathetic towards Marilyn instead of sounding so cold like so many was truely inspiring. I found this so interesting. He never lost sight of the fact she was someone who mattered. I've read book after book over the last 40 years, such an intelligent woman who tried her best and succeeded against all the odds...
People only give a damn about her because she was attractive. Why do people obsess over her honestly? Just another starlet she didn’t ever do anything for anyone.
This was very interesting. I just feel her life was terribly sad and unfulfilled, so defined was she by her sensuality and charisma, which Hollywood exploited to the fullest. Her lack of parents and early trauma made her very vulnerable.
I agree growing up with no parents is very hard for child to deal with look I never really like Marilyn Monroe because of her affairs with married men people stay talking about how pretty she is which she is indeed but being pretty dosent excuse a womans wrong doing she was grown and fully aware of what she was doing when she was having affairs with married men president Kennedy included but knowing how tragic her childhood was inside of orphanages makes me feel really sorry for her and also makes me understand why she was ok with being a mistress she never grew up seeing two people love each other the correct way so of course she's going to be ok with interfering with a married household
She made money from this 'exploitation', you know. It's like saying you're outraged by drug dealers but buying their product. The biggest and most frustrating problem for her was not being able to be a mother, as she had a condition that caused her to miscarry. This certainly deepened the degree of depression and mania. And as a consequence, abuse of prescription drugs. She really wanted to have children, a stable family, and we also don't know what she would be like in raising the child - there may have been a desire to be the opposite of what her mother was. Given her psychological condition, or in spite of it, this child would have an uncertain future.
She also exploited it. We need to stop holding MM like she was without fault. M loved attention and to be sexy. She wanted to do more serious acting roles but she still loved being a sex symbol.
I’m so glad you mentioned her having endometriosis! I also have endo and I think people underestimate the effect it has on one’s mental health, being in in frequent pain, not to mention the trauma of miscarriages and infertility.
Yes.She tried so hard to have a Child. Any woman Will get affected in such circumstances...No matter if they Will succeed in having a baby, in the end...
I had excruciating pain during my periods and even fainted at times. My parents never took me to the doctor. I just suffered every month. I think I had what Marilyn had but no one ever figured it out. I was never able to have children either. I got pregnant 3x and then it would not attach and fall in the toilet when it was the size of my pinkie fingernail. Always made me wonder why I could never have full term. I had a tipped uterus too and thought that was the reason but my mom just told me she had that too and she had three children!
She wasn't an extrovert tho. Multiple actresses in interviews said that she kept to herself,didn't connect with people and had her head in the clouds.Also she was described as a "loner" in highschool.
I read a telling story about Marilyn. It was either another star or one of the "hands" on a movie set who relayed this story. The person said that when Marilyn was not drinking, trying to stay straight and sober, she did not socialize at all with anyone as she was too shy. Once she got on the booze again, she would stick around the set and fraternize and interact with everyone. So she very obviously was a shy person, an insecure person, who needed liquid or chemical "courage" in order to be "one of the gang".
@@Missditabomb oh I didn't read that..who knows..but that girl was traumatized and had deeper issues than just being shy for sure,and fame didn't help either.She mentioned in her diary-book that chasing her dream felt better than actually living it cause It was stressful
@@marilynmarlboroe5164 Thing was, she realized her dream and couldn't accept it!!! She was a success, she was loved, she was world-renowned, she did have her own company, she had some great roles and was a highly gifted comedic actress. She could not accept things as they were and that trait was to her detriment.
Thanks for the deeper understanding of Marilyn. I do believe those health professionals basically did nothing but make her a drug addict. She was an addict, she was def confused about her sexuality, she had childhood issues but she was branded an out of control hysterical female. They basically mocked Marilyn. I can only imagine how unprofessional their behavior was when dealing with her. Especially how they treated women in those days.
In those days, mental halth issues were widely seen as hysteria. The goal of treatment was not necessarily to heal them, it was mainly to make them submissive and agreeable to society and to their men.
@@bisibisbi very true. That's where the word hysteria comes from the word hysterectomy. They would simply claim a woman was hysterical and then slice her open for a hysterectomy. Oh yes!
NO PŘESNĚ TAK. STAČÍ SI VZPOMENOUT NA TALENOVANOU HEREČKU FRANCES FARMER....:-(. ONA SI V TÉ DOBĚ BYLA VAROVNÝM SLAVNÝM PŘIKLADEM PRO ZASTRAŠENÍ OSOBITÝCH LIDí S KRITICKÝM, ANALYTICKÝM MYŠLENÍM.
It is amazing that with all the trauma Marilyn suffered and her heartbreakingly sad childhood, she was still so radiant. She lit up the screen and was incredibly loveable. But how can anyone survive such a childhood and how can any of us judge someone who went through so much. Rest in peace beautiful Marilyn.
Yes my mother coverly sexually abused me when I was very young. There was no love and I was abandoned by both my parents and lived on the street. I'm an addict and I've been struggling for 60 years where it's one day at a time and I do it all with God's power.
@@michaeldundee8300 may God bless and keep you, and take you to be with Him for eternity when it is time. I have many things to relate to you, and Marilyn about and carry so much shame it's debilitating. I truly hope, and will pray, you are okay and will be kept safe under the wings of Our Lord. ☝️🙏💪💕
I was sexually abused as a child. It's hard to recover, but you can. The only way I found out of shame and depression was to forgive my abuser. This isn't easy, and takes yrs, only through the power of JESUS CHRIST was it even possible. You start in your mind, and when you start thinking about it, you say, I'm done with that, I've forgiven him. It took yrs for that prossess to go from my head to my heart, but one day, I realized it did. Forgiveness heals you also.
@@michaeldundee8300 So sad. None of that is your fault. I had a stepfather from hell who abused me in every way possible. I overcame his abuse and hatred and made a nice life and family for myself. It would have been so easy for me to turn to alcohol and drugs and to have probably gone to jail but I didn't. It sometimes amazes me that I was able to escape that and rise above it.
I wish that she could have had a child. She did get pregnant at least five times, but lost the babies through miscarriages, abortions, and physical abnormalities in her uterus and fallopian tubes. I read that when she was married to Arthur Miller, she did have an "ectopic" pregnancy, where the baby was growing in a fallopian tube which finally caused the tube to burst.
@@nancyayers6355 It wouldn't have been so nice for the child to grow up without their mother. But I'm so sorry Marilyn had to go through all that physical pain and heartbreak. She had already suffered far too much in her life.
Part of her attraction was her vulnerability, masked by everyone, including herself, by her outward attention seeking. She had opportunities to just give it up and settle down with several husbands, but her celebrity gave her a validation she needed. The fifties style husbands with the little lady in the background was not going to be enough, which is part of her modern appeal. There she was, career girl, in her mid thirties, by herself. In the early sixties that was huge!
@Patriarchy cult Is the beast system The 50s housewife trope is overdone due to movies and tv shows. Hollywood is to blame. They weren't even allowed to show couples in the same bed on tv sitcoms like I love Lucy and later Dick Van Dyke show. So that's how we vision the 50s. My mother and aunt born in 1942 and 1945 completely disagree on how the 50s look to us today. My grandma was a working mother in an office job (head secretary to the boss at the power company where they lived, which for back then was a very good job). Most of my grandparents friends both worked, husbands and wives. TV and movies really does the 50's a big disservice, all due to what they were allowed to project on the screen.
To add, I have nothing against being a housewife. I was one on and off raising my own kids by my choice. College educated, made my own choices. Just saying it wasn't as stiffling for all women in the 50s as we have been led to believe.
Ja, I know someone who is very similar to Norma-Jean/Marilyn (according to this analysis) . Basically good, intelligent and gentle ppl who experienced recurring trauma from a young age and developed many unhealthy/harmful "coping" mechanisms and attachments. These ppl don't solidify in any meaningful way and seem unable to realise/foresee the impact of how they behave; like a small child with adult capabilities. Ppl tend to ignore the ugliness in the truth of that sort of damage, especially in physically attractive and charming individuals like Norma, denying full humanity and creating a symbol to fulfill their own superficial and selfish desires. It's so tragic, u really want someone like her to come out on top in the end, find clarity, safety and happiness. Maybe she never realised that no one was able to come and save her, and she couldn't see how to do it herself/wasn't willing to. So full of potential, but ultimately just tragic and head-shakey. Be well, take care of yourselves 🌹
She actually felt a lot of shame regarding being late to set, it was her anxiety and need for perfectionism that drove her to uncontrolled worry and need to keep practicing her lines until she was late and then felt such shame that she couldn't perform as needed. This info is in her own words, in a book released with her journal entries and poems and as described by those who were close friends.
Sad how children go through stressful situations, even abuse, and then there's a whole set of professions to deal with the screwed up adults they become. How about stupid-a s s parents stop abusing their children?
Children brought into the world that are abused and unloved often end up battling addiction and emotional problems and worse as adults. Sadly, despite her beauty and talent she was still another wounded child.
@@amygalvin1799 from 62 and I still am hit hard over my upbringing with no love sexual abuse, and verbal and physical abuse. I've got 4 years no alcohol 3 years no prescription meds 2 years no Copenhagen but I'm still battling pornography and masturbation pretty hard.
Rather than her mother being a bad parent, I think she had severe mental issues and just wasn’t capable of raising a child. Like complaining that a diabetic should just “shape up and do right” so they can eat sweets like everyone else.
Very judgemental comment. In many instances, these relationships are cyclical. We don't know what happened to her mother either. Life can be hard, people make mistakes but in the end we just need to understand that most of the time people act out it wasn't to hurt anyone.
I think this good doctor gave a fair assessment. He's the first I've ever heard who directly mentions the crass irresponsibility of her mental health professionals.
@@lumiere7216 And they over-prescribed meds and became involved with her personally. She would drink a bottle of champagne during sessions with Greenson, (at his home), and often stay for dinner. Marilyn and Engleberg began an affair when he separated from his wife and he gave Marilyn the pills she wanted. Engleberg was afraid to lose his license over this, especially once Marilyn died and all the "heat" was on.
@@Missditabomb Psychoanalysis is an intense form of therapy suited for patients with strong egos. It requires breaks over the weekends in order for the patient to process. Greenson had Monroe move in with him to increase number of sessions to 7 per week. Give me a break Dr. Greenson!
@@mrooz9065 Agree, and I honestly believe Marilyn would have been better off, OVERALL, had she not pursued psychoanalysis. Marilyn only became MORE messed up once the doctors started playing with her head. (That goes for her acting coach, Lee Strasberg, as well.) Marilyn was confused about life before "treatment", but she was LOST in life, and TO life, after.
she was drawn to older men as she had daddy issues and I feel like if she were alive today she would realize that she didn't need them. You are enough all by yourself.💔
Dr. Greenson feel in love with Marilyn. That creep moved her into his house, had an affair with her, he taped her for hrs. on a recorder. When she died, he administered a shot trying to revive her. I never trusted his actions, he lost his control over her. There's enough mystery about her death to sink a ship...I will never believe she killed herself. Eunice the housekeeper was a supposed psychiatric nurse. Her story changed several times over about the night Marilyn died. Alot of facts missing here...Marilyn was playing with fire, just tragic.
Exactly MM was murdered, she new too much. She was ready to reveal things. She was very happy, shooting an important movie that would give her career a new impulse, back in a relationship with DiMaggio and proud of her new house that she was furnishing at that time. All kind of things that would not point out to suicidal behaviour....
Elton John said it perfectly when he said she lived her life like a candle in the wind. This poor woman was used and abused her entire life, and then died tragically, far too soon. I hope that she is now at peace
A fascinating read is “Fragments” which are her own letters, poems and writings. In a writing from when she was first married (as a teenager) she describes herself as an introvert who loved people and felt most comfortable with those older or younger than her. It seems like she was extremely intelligent.
I doubt she was actually introverted but can understand she could feel that way due to feeling cut off from others due to her abandonment in early life and history of familial and personal history of mental illness.
Having worked as an actress and a model, I can say that many actors suffer from narcissistic tendencies and a false sense of grandiosity. Being a little bipolar helps an actor to become another character on stage.
Nejtalentovanější herci, zpěváci, kterí kdy existovali byli herci s dg. "emočne nestabilní poruchou osobnosti." Hypersenzibilita, geniální převtělení do postavy, díla.
Chronic insomnia is awful. Mine started when I worked nights as a new nurse and as much as I’ve tried, it’s extremely difficult to get back on track (for me, personally). I’ve tried sleep deprivation, melatonin, meditation, diphenhydramine, I stopped drinking coffee, I had a sleep study done, sleeping pills, exercise, etc. I don’t know what else to do, but it really can mess with your mood regulation even if you’re getting the best therapy ever. I’m glad to see mental health come as far as it has because back then none of that stuff was openly talked about. My dad was 46 when I was born and he came from that era. When he found out I wanted to go to therapy he told me to never tell anyone that I went or “they” will judge me and call me crazy. No, I just had a terrible upbringing and needed to make sense of it all.
I have had insomnia too, since I am 3 years old. Now I am 46, and still struggling with it, sometimes successfully. What is dangerous for me and others with insomnia - too much insuline and cortisol fluctuations, too little progesteron, too much sugar - icnluding sugar in alchohol, white bread, fruit, etc. Chronical stress - too many bad toughts. I must always try to look for positive things even in negative ones. Develop own philosopy.
She came from an unstable mother, was abandoned at 2 weeks old, abused in multiple ways, moved constantly and married very young. Bless her heart. She had a lot to work through for anyone but how could she possibly have gotten better being in the spotlight continually? She just had a tragic life and mental health treatment was still really bad at this point in history.
i feel really icky whenever people suggest Marilyn was either 100% this morose, broken, depressed figure her whole life or 100% just a happy-go-lucky girl with no problems. we didn't know her, we can't know her, and i think this video does a good job at keeping analysis balanced and non-romanticized.
I agree. Dr. Grande's portrayal of her is calm, balanced, and dispassionate. She was fantastically famous in the early Sixties, when I was still young; and she's still a powerful cultural symbol, a legend.
Thank you!! And I definitely agree. People don't think of her as complex person. She did SO many things in her short life. But all Hollywood cares about is portraying her as a child-like sob story. I don't think she lived her life as a helpless victim. I really think people fetishize her struggles and traumas. By that, I mean that they like to think of her at her most vulnerable self instead of seeing her as strong or relatable. She went through the same things that many women experience, yet she still accomplished a LOT in her time. That takes a lot of strength. So, it should be framed as inspirational and nuanced, not depressing. But sadly, the most interesting thing about her for many people is the abuse she suffered from men, not her perseverance after it. That's what I find weird. She actually did things, things didn't just happen to her.
Also wondering how infertility affected her mental health. Not being able to have one's own children after not having a real relationship with one's own parents must have been terribly difficult for her as well.
The medical community does not care about endometriosis, because it is not a money generator. also suffered from it. It is weird what they pay attention too. they love artificial insemination because it is expensive and they make all kinds of money on this procedure. Endometriosis, here is a Pamperin, next.
I'm not knowledgeable in psychology by any means, but I am a huge Monroe fan, so thank you for making this video! The only thing I would vehemently disagree with is the idea that Marilyn's work-ethic was low. While she was often late to shoots, and would show up not on her best game, she still cared deeply about her work. She often kept the crew after hours because of how much she cared about getting the perfect take. Before her fame it was said that she would get up very early to exercise, and take singing, acting, dancing and etiquette lessons. Even after finding fame, she continued to take acting classes, and kept very close relationships with her mentors. She also got very bored in her marriages because she felt that her purpose was to act, and she took the job very seriously, so much so that it scared her to fall into the housewife trope. There are many letters and personal writings from her that go into detail about these topics specifically on the subject of her work. From what I understand, she felt awful about wasting directors' and crews' time but wanted so much to do the perfect job. This was a woman who put her work first and foremost in her life, although I agree that sometimes this was so much so that it actually backfired on her, especially when you add in her substance abuse. In no way am I trying to correct you because I love your videos! Just wanted to add to the conversation based on what I've read and researched about her. Marilyn Monroe lived a fascinating albeit heartbreaking life. Thank you again for making this video!!! And sorry for this totally unwarranted long-ass comment haha.
Thanks for saying this. I agree with much of what Dr. Grande said in this video about Marilyn, but when he said that she had a “poor work ethic” I had to vehemently disagree. She worked very hard at her craft, and indeed took many lessons. If anything, she was too much of a perfectionist and let that fear paralyze her. I think that Marilyn’s insecurity about not being good enough is what caused her to have to do multiple takes and even miss work. And I’ll just say that I once knew someone who had worked with Marilyn in Hollywood, and they said that she was just about the hardest-working actress that they had ever known.
Her extreme perfectionism may have come from an early film, where she stumbles over a line, and it was included in the final edit. I think this would have been intolerable for her, and she took control of her image by insisting on multiple takes until she was satisfied, and by destroying negatives that she wasn't happy with from her photo shoots. She may not have felt that she knew who she was, but she certainly understood what Monroe represented. An extremely intelligent and complex person. She was ahead of her time and her appeal is universal. She won't be easily forgotten.
MM was a manipulated, feel sorry for me type of person, plus the Dr is right, her work ethic was zero, she didn't give a damn how time was wasted & all the money the studio lost because she just didn't feel like going to work, poor baby, she was depressed. Her childhood wasn't good, but millions of other kids lives are great either, they survived, made something out of it, productive & full of happiness, it's called being responsible for your own life . MM actually thought JFK would leave Jackie & marry her?? Unreal, she fooled around with Robert Kennedy too, these were powerful men, she fooled around with the wrong guys! Tony curtis said it was like kissing a dead fish in a movie scene they were in - and, she was a drug addict, making everything even worse! One of her friends invited MM to church, hoping she would love God & turn to Him for help, but MM said she didn't need God, nor was she interested, really sad, I bet now sh wishes she had listened to her friend
"She did act out dramatically in that hospital she didn't like, but that behavior could also be attributed to extreme personality traits or substances." Or...it could be as she described it. We all know those places are horrific and only get worse the further back you go in history. 🙄 ✌💖🖖
Yeah, and I am still being dramatic when I mention how traumatising waking up in psych ward physically restrained was to me... And still faced misogyny, when I asked about the catheter I felt between my legs, the only area I could move then, and I did violently at times, due to desperation and confusion, since no one would talk to me, and only when I asked about that thing, if it could hurt me when I moved like that, I was told by a middle aged man (I was 21 at the time) "Don't worry, you're still a virgin." And this all is my illness and hysteria talking, right?
Dr. Grande, thank you very much for treating this analysis with such a respect. As a long-time-fan of MM, I want to say, that your analysis is the best I have ever heard/read. And I must say, that you have made an excellent research work. Thank you very much.
She was alone in this world. She didn't have a large family. When that happens, you are always searching for love in all the wrong places. People who take advantage of you. All she needed was and ever wanted was a family. She ran into men who only loved her outside.
This held my interest. I like that Dr. Grande holds Marilyn's mental health professionals accountable and talks about doctors being 'star struck' by their celebrity clients. One of the take aways from this, for me, is the importance of rest, especially now that we are under quarantine. I will no longer feel guilty for taking another 20 minute nap.
Psychoanalysis usually requires 4-5 sessions per week which is a lot to process and handle. As if it was not heavy enough, Greenson had Monroe move in with him to have therapy over the weekends as well. Scratching my head.
@David Brian Lantry The mental health professionals involved might have been culpable, however, you're incorrect to say that they were accountable i.e. they faced no redress for their actions.
I was a professional Marilyn Monroe impersonator for 13 years. It was an honor to keep her image alive. I was able to see many of her auctioned garments, including the gorgeous gown she wore while singing to JFK. And I also mingled with some who knew her. One of my last gigs was at The Rainbow Room in NYC. She will always hold a very special place in my heart. May she rest in peace and love.
She had High functioning AUTISM/ Asbergers. PLEASE search Sarah Hendrickx or AUTISM in FEMALES!! YOU WILL learn so much!! and help spread this awareness!!!!!! Its called MASKING!!
Kim Kardashian wore the lovely birthday dress at some function. Kim couldn't fit into it and had to wear a stoll to cover where the zip was open. I thought K should not have worn the dress. She has no talent where as Marilyn had heaps of creativity.
Everytime I look at a picture of her somewhere, I always reflect on how good my life is. She was a woman that was so admired and many women very often say they would love to have had Marilyn's life, I don't know why. Maybe the wish of having her looks or her success I can understand it. However her life was so sad, I don't understands why anyone would want to have a life that she had. My heartaches every time I read or watch documentaries about her, I just wish that her life was beautiful as she was.
The thought of having her life is scary to me. I cherish my beauty, I don't want to be in someone else's shoes but that last line you had is wholesome. "I just wish that her life was as beautiful as she was.", it's so endearing and sweet.
I know. Her childhood was a mess. She said herself,"everyone's childhood plays itself out". So true. You can keep a kid on childhood issues for only so long. It's going manifest
I always find it interesting with people that I know that are big fans of Marilyn.....I find that people who really adore Marilyn often have had traumas in their life and face a lot of darkness. Similar to the pain she carried. I believe Marilyn’s energy attracts them.
Can I just say, you are absolutely killing it on this channel Dr Grande. Scientifically informed, tempered with empathy and covering often sensational cases with the right grounded approach. Keep up the great work, very much enjoying! ✊🏽
She was a unhappy soul in a perfect body... All her life was a continuous struggle to be accepted as she was but one by one, people had dissapoined her, especially those close to her:( Allways trying to shout out her wish, by the time she lost her voice and give up, tired and dissapointed... RIP Marilyn! Thank you, Dr. Gande; a very good analise!
Sentimentality aside, her body couldn't handle substance abuse and there were still other issues she had and I'm not talking about issues of an emotional nature. Of course people love tragic figures, amplifying the idea of this.
Marilyn overcame so many obstacles and is an inspiration to many. Her mother’s schizophrenia was difficult on her, her miscarriages along with her need for love and security. She said she felt like a waif. It was evident she was intelligent, sensitive and was a sweet person. May she rest in peace.
I love her! I started with my obsession with Marilyn when I was 12, I’m 48 now. I don’t think there’s a book about her that I haven’t read or movie I haven’t watched. I think she was pushed over the edge by someone in the mob. She didn’t have any pills in her stomach, no running water in her room or glass of water. Joe DiMaggio really loved her and had red roses delivered to her grave every week until he died.
The Misfits was written by Arthur Miller, Marilyn’s 3rd husband. He wrote it with Marilyn in mind, as a gift to her, and she was not pleased with the character of Roslyn. It added much more of a strain to their crumbling marriage. It was her final completed film.
Well he did leave some choice words for her to find about how she embarrassed him and he was embarrassed to have her around his upper crust intellectual friends. Then he wrote a character that was not intellectual and who couldn’t articulate her feelings to stop animal abuse. Just had her scream. A character that was on the verge of being a washed up sexpot.
Clark was not in good health. Look at the life he lived. His time was down for the count. He didn’t blame MM. he actual treated her fatherly. His widow didn’t blame MM either. So to come in here and say it’s MM’s fault is outrageous and disgusting.
@@madambutterfly7513 I believe Marylin was suffering from withdrawal from drugs. The pills she was taken were controlling her life. Those pills affect the central nervous system. Insommina is a consequence and I'm sure she had hard time sleeping because of the pills... The reason why she showed up late.
I did not expect a complete mini-biography or resume of Monroe's life; I knew all of this. The last four minutes were informative. I also suffer from borderline personality disorder.
the sad thing about Marilyn is that it really seems like the one thing she craved was approval, which she interpreted as love. she wanted it from the public, from people in her life, to feel like she was finally secure and enough. people really underestimate the impact your early years have on your adult behavior
'..Bite me, milk and honey will flow from me..' she said that once. Cant remember when or where. A hell of a character to keep up and make - seem real to the public
exactly!!! tho not a diagnoses at that time. the individual always blamed for not adapting. being beautiful amd talented everyone wants to take from her, including the doctor..
CPTSD is not a disorder by itself, rather an underlying issue present in all the other potential major disorders mentioned by the doctor..and of course she had CPTSD, no doubt...
Wow, doctor Grande, you really had your hands full with this one! I don't think we should underestimate the effect of an ectopic pregnancy and multiple miscarriages. Hormones, especially during pregnancy, do strange things to a woman. I'm a mom, and I can't even begin to imagine how an ectopic pregnancy and multiple miscarriages would affect my behavior and mental health. Aside from that though, she seemed to have a smorgasbord of other mental health issues and I loved your perspective on each of them.
@@madambutterfly7513 yes due to her lack of love and printful attachment she was essentially an addict to anything and everything that would help her self medicate.
Very good presentation of a very complicated personality. Dr, Grande's explanation of the problems inherent in "informal" diagnostic categories is very helpful in understnading the confusion in diagnosing Ms.Monroe. He presents excellent explanations of the limits of those categories. Another very informative presentation.
I fell in love with Marilyn when I was just 11 when I first saw her, and love her just as much now at age 21. She inspired me to become the woman I am today!
@Paul Wieringa She did so many lovely things too. She was one of the first celebrities to stand up for equality, supported many charities, brought attention to the less privileged (and also check out the story about her and Ella Frizgerald!) etc. She clearly had her demons, but with an upbringing like that, it's pretty understandable and I'm almost surprised she did what she did with all that baggage.
I think Little Darling means the good parts of Marilyn's personality: the uncompromising feminine energy, the friendliness, the love, the compassion, the beauty, intelligence and sensitivity.
Her problems started with her mother. Things that happen in our childhood affect our entire lives. The best shot Marilyn could have had would’ve have been if her mother would’ve given her up for adoption. I feel so much for her.
@@pamelahansen5394 That's right. I have seen people posting absolutely horrible comments about her mother online, but honestly, she didn't know better. As Dr. Grande stated, she wasn't all there. It made Marilyn's life hell which is so incredibly sad, but it wasn't her mother's fault she was sick. It's a tough situation for everyone involved...
Re: the weird, irregular diagnoses made by analysts in olden days of shrink yore, one reason for more strict use of DSM 4 diagnosis is that under managed health care a clearly understood diagnosis is needed for purposes of billing. In days prior, a diagnosis was not needed, and care was usually covered by conventional medical insurance, for as long as doc and patient were happy together. Later on, time frames for treatment were imposed, to cut costs, and to better account for results.
@@mmestari Hyperproductivity does not necessitate creation. Jobs efficiently allocated and managed resources to successfully bring many innovative products to market. He led Apple to the largest market cap in the USA, reshaped computing and popularized the smartphone, pioneered computer animated films among a long list of other accomplishments. Very few individuals could even accomplish one of those goals. Downplaying his achievements is objectively bizarre but I understand some cannot separate that from the person he was.
@@pilotpwr What's objectively bizarre is thinking that Steve jobs is "hyperproductive" and doing anything else than taking the credit for other peoples work. Steve Jobs is very much the archetypal example of someone being lucky at being at right place at the right time and knowing the right people, and then screwing them over.
Joe DiMaggio always loved Marilyn, it’s a shame he was such a jealous Italian and couldn’t handle her fearless sexuality, he did not want to share her with the world. I’m grateful he came to her rescue and removed her from that hospital. He was good man at heart, just jealous and possessive.
DiMaggio was jealous, because he knew those Hollywood scumbags didn't care about her and were just using her for their own advantage. He may have been a childish and jealous man, but he truly loved Marilyn and hated to see her being used.
Men know how men think. We know that consciously or subconsciously we are lusting for women we give attention to. Keep it moving guys nothing to see here. But I dont get mad at the guy's. I tell the girl that you didnt put a wall up. So a man trys and its the woman that gives consent with her staying there or giggles.
@Kimberlee Ponson No Kimberlee. It ALL comes down to women not being assertive when approached. A man is selling himself and woman needs to leave things clear. Example if someone is selling watches at the mall asks you to buy do you say. I have one already, oh they look nice but I dont feel like it, maybe later or no thank you? The problem is women leave things open for future interaction. This is also a selfish act to preserve friendships and potential favors from suiter. As you know favors go a long way in a womans life. I wish this could be taught to all women. Sadly everything is not all black and white. In Utah a virtuous woman could be valued but New York seen as not gathering potential resources.
Great video Dr Grande. I feel like Marilyn sought the attention and love she was neglected of as a child through fame. The absence of a father figure no doubt influenced her relationships with men and the abandonment she experienced from her mother left her with self worth and self esteem issues. If the first years of a child's life are the most important than Marilyn had the odds stacked against her. But ironically this need to please and need to be adored and liked is what enabled her to succeed but also what burnt her out. Perhaps her need to protect herself brought out some narcissistic aspects of her nature, unfortunately for her she was also sorrounded by ppl who wanted to exploit her and take advantage, which probably only further highlehted her self preservation in the worst kind of ways. She is a clear example of how no amount of fame and money can fill a hole inside you or buy you happiness. Psychology and psychiatry was probably a big experiment at the time. Maybe if she had access to the kind of psychiatric care we have today she would have done better...but then again look at Britney and Kanye...they don't exactly fill one with confidence about contemporary mental health treatments
As always Dr Grande I truly appreciate the insight about Marilyn Monroe. I believe personally that she was incredibly gifted however, there was much that most of us didn't know about her childhood and growing up. I think your approach to her case I'm sure his spot on. While I can't imagine that life I can imagine she was in fact under a great deal of pressure. I found your analysis incredibly interesting. I read a lot about her over the years your analysis is definitely something I've not heard before.
This was a wonderful analysis! You said that when one has a Cluster B disorder that it's "not unusual that they have symptoms of several," and that really helped me understand these disorders.
She had High functioning AUTISM/ Asbergers. PLEASE search Sarah Hendrickx or AUTISM in FEMALES!! YOU WILL learn so much!! and help spread this awareness!!!!!! Its called MASKING!!
Can you do an analysis on the early 80’s supermodel Gia Marie Carangi? Angelina Jolie played her in a HBO biopic in 1998 and her story is almost similar to Marilyn Monroe’s, except Gia died of AIDS due to her heroin habit resulting to her using unclean needles. Thank you! Love your videos!
This lady was amazing! Marilyn Monroe overcame so many possible pitfalls and had a life that many people envied. She was able to take the gift of her natural beauty, her intelligence and some innate charisma and use these attributes to make herself into her own form of art and make money at it. Wow! She took what she had and turned it into allure. I agree with Dr Grande and my mom who used to say that MM's root problem was being unable to sleep. Imagine having to show up and get your bright eyed, bushy tailed allure on everyday when you really don't feel like it. No wonder she turned to drugs. Time to turn the Marilyn Monroe on! Okay. Now you can turn her off. Being a "personality " can wear you out, I think!
She wasn't really Marilyn. Marilyn was a character she created on her own and without a blueprint. Everyone expected her to be Marilyn all the time. As you posted, it was very tiring for her. But Marilyn is the one I want to see, also. Not interested in Norma Jean that much. She is the most beautiful woman who ever lived and she will remain so. We are lucky to have had such a divinely beautful creature walk among us for a short time. Her early death has only added to her mystique. She will never grow old and wrinkled. Have read one poster who said Marilyn was negatively affected by marrying that creepy ogre Arthur Miller. She said Marilyn lost some of her energy and positiveness because of him and it affected her performances and her life, of course. Miller was a worthless gold digger who used Marilyn and never really loved her. He once said while still married to her that she embarrassed him before his family.
So mucus would be explained by this. So much would be seen in the sympathetic light it needs to be seen in. Things (consensus in psychiatry ) will change in time, we'll get there.
@@mrtwister9002 I had a typo saying mucus instead of much. But the point is that things like narcissistic and histrionic and unstable behavior could be seen in much more sympathetic light, if it was talked as a traumatic reaction instead of bad behavior that exists in a vacuum. In time, this shift might happen in how we see mental illnesses.
Thank you for this. I have felt a kinship to Marilyn since I was little. I have many similar mental issues as her, but I finally have found a great doctor and therapist who actually cares about me. It has helped me tremendously.
An excellent and thoughtful analysis. I think it is remarkable and perhaps a testament to Monroe's inner drive that she still succeeded in her desire to become a movie actress and star despite the traumas she experienced as a child.
Beauty, fame, influence and fortune, and still so much emotional and physical pain, not to mention her addictions. I don't think we can count the many young women who wanted to be just like her...never knowing the truth behind that gorgeous façade. You discussed so many details in a short and captivating video. Thank you, Dr. Grande.
I can't imagine having a childhood so devoid of LOVE and feeling that you don't belong to anyone and then the persona you created caused you not to belong to yourself .
Reminds me of Michael Jackson in a way.
Wow I'd never thought of it like this before.. well put x
@@darrenlloyd4835 interesting how she made herself to how she was in adult life,
One must be accountable for their actions
She however denied any of this
@@yasmineayub5661 I have no idea what your point is
@@proefpa yeah, for me too. Michael Jackson said in some of his interviews, that he has allways been intrigued by Marilyn Monroe.
I had nearly the exact same childhood as her and have pretty much the same exact struggles because of it. From having no father, to a mother so mentally unstable that I had to spend my life in various foster homes, moving from school to school, never having stable relationships and friendships. It caused to me clam up and become insecure. This country needs to take better care of the kids who grew up in the system and check on them as adults and give them support if need be.
I hope you are in a good place now, I wish you a very happy life...❤️
Oh my God I don’t have nothing good to say about her
One of her greatest actress that ever lived
ME TOO🎯 IM 65 AN STILL DRIFT OFF REMEMBERING THINGS...I GUESS IT DONT HELP SMOKING WEED BUT I'VE ALWAYS self medicate.....like a bad movie📽🎬👤👥
💙
I think that Marilyn was more introverted than you give her credit for.
Norma Jean learned to switch on her Marilyn persona. She asked a female friend once "do you want to see me do her?" and the friend then witnessed this shift in body language and energy which made heads begin to turn in her direction where moments before she could blend into the crowd on the street in NY.
She didn't have a lot of friends. She didn't have anyone to rely on and trust
She was easily exploited and her anger about that in unguarded moments was justified and understandable.
Did you read her autobiographical?
Yeah she said in at least one interview that she enjoys being alone and it refreshes her. She said she had to make an effort to socialize and that she perfectly happy spending time alone. I think she was an introvert for sure.
@@WhitneyDahlin correct. She's Infp.
The Czech talented and beautiful artist Iveta Bartošová (brutal suicide at the age of 48) also had a lifestyle like MM, whose life was even more tragic than MM. Couldn't MM have ADHD too...? Many symptoms of BPD, ADHD, BAP overlap. Personally, it feels like she had schizoaffective disorder (ICD10/11) rather than some sub/type of schizophrenia.
===========================================
In relation to the case of Marilyn Monroe, a relevant, interesting comparative case study of a typologically very similar famous personality Mrs. Iveta Bartošová (singer, actress, dancer, painter, etc.):
Can we ask for your opinions on the video shown here with the lady who was definitely addicted to benzos as well? The lady was born in 1966, died - suicide in 2014 (jumped under the train). Would you be able to guess from the development of her visage, the changes in the character of her voice, what ALL addictive substances she probably used? In various videos and photographs, it can be seen that since 1987 he has continuously had large pupils. The color of her irises was a tinted grey. It is public knowledge that in 1994 she used benzos (mainly diazepam and sleeping pills) and gradually increased the doses with alcohol. Later, she often used painkillers because she had frequent injuries to her body and teeth. Is it even practically possible to heal (heal from dual mental disorders and addictions) a WOMAN who has been addicted, sick for so long...? She herself mentioned in the past that she is hyperactive (ADHD, she probably also used amphetamines when she was young, which was indicated by her colleague), she suffered chronically from dg. GAD, depression, chronic suicidality. She had been chronically addicted to alcohol since about 1997. She was an excellent talented artist. Her life story was very tragic.
Currently, her sick appearance in the face is slowly starting to resemble, for example, Britney Spears. We know that Mr. Matthew Perry has probably recovered now, but he is a man who has a bio-stronger organism than a woman. Thank you very much for your opinions!
You can find videos with IB analysis texts on our YT channel.
She was an empty shell who got rich in Hollywood, nearly spending her fortune on drugs and worsening the mental state that had plagued her since childhood with an absent mother and father; her mother making her inherit the same issues. The same old cliché.
She was very troubled, but look what she accomplished despite this. We love you and miss you, Marilyn.
I certainly miss her. I think I was 15 when her death was announced. I loved her throughout my childhood and her death traumatized me. I always thought she was so beautiful. ❤❤
fuck her, creating drama and pain out of nothing, she hurt others by hurting herself, hope she is in hell burning, she could have lived a luxurious life that many dream about, and drive off into the sunset with a wonderful, instead she chose to make things complicated and painful like Avril.
Why is it some people feel the need to speak for others (i.e. "we" instead of "I")?
@@jenniferwilcox9759 Why is it some people feel the need to pick at every little thing? What a wretch you must be. Marilyn had/has millions of admirers, enough to qualify for a "we."
I guess it depends how you define success. Dying of su*c!de at 36 is not much of an accomplishment
"If I'm generally something I'm generally miserable"... Poor Marilyn, it's so sad how lonely and broken she was
truly
Indeed
And yet people make her an idol.
Is this a direct quote?
@@michellethewhoreatthelake936 Yes it is.
I physically feel overwhelmed listening to all of her trauma. It’s honestly so sad.
That happens to me too, it's hard to remember other people's trauma, that's why I can't watch documentaries about certain stars. My only hope is that now they shine bright and have no cares.
Elton John's song...the original version of Candle in the Wind...
Yes I didn't know all these horrible childhood she went through
@@nmc1859 Yes I knew about the foster care but I was horrified to hear of the sexual abuse
Was I the only one who started getting emotional?! This video made me make an appointment and actually deal w health issues I’ve been avoiding. I didn’t want my story to be like hers.
She wasn't an extrovert. She was an introvert. She said many times in interviews that she enjoyed and preferred not being so social and time alone re-energized her. That's an introvert.
It looks that way .. I AMA introvert and I walked away from all jobs and other things in life that brings dramas or abuse or over complicated events . In life. Private life path now best life path .. I happy now
I am an introvert who disguises myself as an extrovert.
@@lovecats6856So true,we do that sometimes.. especially at our jobs
Or autistic
people can be extrovert and introvert depending on their goals, health and people around!
fatigue is the key for me. It triggers everything else: anxiety, depression, altered states of conciousness and poor choices.
5 hour long therapy sessions? Disgusting. I'm sure that therapist was bilking her for money. It's evident that many people exploited Marilyn. She led a tormented life, starved for love and acceptance. Her entire life was very sad. I can only hope she is now at peace. Thanks for sharing, Dr. Grande. I'd love if you could touch on "Mirroring" as it relates to BPD.
And it was every weekday till Greenson had her move in with him to have extra sessions over the weekends as well. Give me a break Dr. Greenson!
I must be going through it because I feel like i need a 5hr session
I'm not sure what their arrangement was - was she paying him hourly? I don't know. Maybe it was her idea. It's kind of strange to call it disgusting if we don't know what the arrangement was. Maybe she just wanted the company and someone sympathetic to be around. She was a lonely person.
@@shariwelch8760 from what I understand this would be an extremely unhealthy thing for a therapist to indulge, even if Marilyn was interested in that much contact.
@@MegaRaaaaaaa Probably, unless he thought it was keeping her out of a mental institution.
I knew a gentleman who actually met her. He said she was the kindest most beautiful woman he had ever spoken to.
Yes, this is correct and honest; as I have know people who were in Marilyn's life in 1962 and she was very happy at the time of the filming of "SOMETHING GOT TO GIVE" she was murdered by some prominent people, who are all dead! This is backed by facts not conspiracy theories!
Having affairs and the other behaviours she was known for are not kind.
@@michelepascoe6068 I think this is more due to being an addict
Likely a gentleman who preferred blondes…
She was a bully, she would sleep with all these men and then called their wives. She even went as far as to call Jackie Kennedy and harrassed her about JFK. She was a true Gemini.
We all need love and stability early in life. If we don't get it, it sets the tone for a life of hardship. Poor Marilyn. May she rest in peace.
My life was it is incredibly difficult I had zero love in my mother was covertly sexually abusive towards me
♥️
@@michaeldundee8300 Sorry 😔 it's very sad. Me too.
Stunningly beautiful outside, tragically broken inside. May she Rest in Peace.
She obviously had severe attachment disorder cascading throughout her life. Broken Infant mother bond is very crippling. So sad.
The uncertainty about her father's identity likely contributed to her confusion.
You are so right. She had no secure attachments to either parent. That is devastating to a person. Then add hardship on top of that and you are just screwed.
I have these issues myself. Childhood trauma and loss, and I can understand the issues that people like this develop. Deep insecurity. Fantasy, divorce. Lashing out at people. Reactive behavior.
I agree. I've seen so many tragic cases like her's; poor souls who never get over the loss and grief of abandonment.
I'm pretty much a carbon copy of her.
How could she not have this?
An analysis of Judy Garland would be interesting Dr Grande. Some sad similarities between her and Marilyn.
Elizabeth Taylor too.
@@lumiere7216 how so? Judy Garland and Norma Jean Baker were from somewhat deprived backgrounds. Elizabeth Taylor was from a more well-to-do background, her father owned an art gallery.
@LEE S I think you mean Elizabeth Taylor, considering this video is about Marilyn. So... Judy Garland would be more interesting than Elizabeth Taylor.
Liza would be interesting after Judy Garland.
There's a documentary about her life on youtube that explains everything.
The way that Dr. Grande was so empathetic towards Marilyn instead of sounding so cold like so many was truely inspiring. I found this so interesting. He never lost sight of the fact she was someone who mattered. I've read book after book over the last 40 years, such an intelligent woman who tried her best and succeeded against all the odds...
People only give a damn about her because she was attractive. Why do people obsess over her honestly? Just another starlet she didn’t ever do anything for anyone.
@@Teal_Moon Oh yeah? Tell that Ella Fitzgerald. You don’t know what you’re talking about.
@@Teal_Moon So because she was attractive, she doesn’t matter? Who ever hurt you that bad, I hope you will heal one day.
Truth. ♥️🙏🏽
@@Teal_Moon How would you know? Go and take a good look at yourself.
This was very interesting. I just feel her life was terribly sad and unfulfilled, so defined was she by her sensuality and charisma, which Hollywood exploited to the fullest. Her lack of parents and early trauma made her very vulnerable.
… yes … so defined by her charisma and sensuality … would lead to an unfulfilled life.
I agree growing up with no parents is very hard for child to deal with look I never really like Marilyn Monroe because of her affairs with married men people stay talking about how pretty she is which she is indeed but being pretty dosent excuse a womans wrong doing she was grown and fully aware of what she was doing when she was having affairs with married men president Kennedy included but knowing how tragic her childhood was inside of orphanages makes me feel really sorry for her and also makes me understand why she was ok with being a mistress she never grew up seeing two people love each other the correct way so of course she's going to be ok with interfering with a married household
Does hollywood continue to exploit their own people?
She made money from this 'exploitation', you know. It's like saying you're outraged by drug dealers but buying their product. The biggest and most frustrating problem for her was not being able to be a mother, as she had a condition that caused her to miscarry. This certainly deepened the degree of depression and mania. And as a consequence, abuse of prescription drugs. She really wanted to have children, a stable family, and we also don't know what she would be like in raising the child - there may have been a desire to be the opposite of what her mother was. Given her psychological condition, or in spite of it, this child would have an uncertain future.
She also exploited it. We need to stop holding MM like she was without fault. M loved attention and to be sexy. She wanted to do more serious acting roles but she still loved being a sex symbol.
I’m so glad you mentioned her having endometriosis! I also have endo and I think people underestimate the effect it has on one’s mental health, being in in frequent pain, not to mention the trauma of miscarriages and infertility.
Same, and I agree with you 100%
Wow it all makes sense now.
Yes.She tried so hard to have a Child. Any woman Will get affected in such circumstances...No matter if they Will succeed in having a baby, in the end...
I had excruciating pain during my periods and even fainted at times. My parents never took me to the doctor. I just suffered every month. I think I had what Marilyn had but no one ever figured it out. I was never able to have children either. I got pregnant 3x and then it would not attach and fall in the toilet when it was the size of my pinkie fingernail. Always made me wonder why I could never have full term. I had a tipped uterus too and thought that was the reason but my mom just told me she had that too and she had three children!
...because you probably have an underlying hormone imbalance causing the
She wasn't an extrovert tho. Multiple actresses in interviews said that she kept to herself,didn't connect with people and had her head in the clouds.Also she was described as a "loner" in highschool.
Marilyn Marlboroe, probably because she had no money, poor self-esteem, and no real parents.
Was she a loner, or someone who was rejected.
I read a telling story about Marilyn. It was either another star or one of the "hands" on a movie set who relayed this story. The person said that when Marilyn was not drinking, trying to stay straight and sober, she did not socialize at all with anyone as she was too shy. Once she got on the booze again, she would stick around the set and fraternize and interact with everyone. So she very obviously was a shy person, an insecure person, who needed liquid or chemical "courage" in order to be "one of the gang".
@@Missditabomb oh I didn't read that..who knows..but that girl was traumatized and had deeper issues than just being shy for sure,and fame didn't help either.She mentioned in her diary-book that chasing her dream felt better than actually living it cause It was stressful
@@marilynmarlboroe5164 Thing was, she realized her dream and couldn't accept it!!! She was a success, she was loved, she was world-renowned, she did have her own company, she had some great roles and was a highly gifted comedic actress. She could not accept things as they were and that trait was to her detriment.
Thanks for the deeper understanding of Marilyn. I do believe those health professionals basically did nothing but make her a drug addict. She was an addict, she was def confused about her sexuality, she had childhood issues but she was branded an out of control hysterical female. They basically mocked Marilyn. I can only imagine how unprofessional their behavior was when dealing with her. Especially how they treated women in those days.
In those days, mental halth issues were widely seen as hysteria. The goal of treatment was not necessarily to heal them, it was mainly to make them submissive and agreeable to society and to their men.
@@bisibisbi very true. That's where the word hysteria comes from the word hysterectomy. They would simply claim a woman was hysterical and then slice her open for a hysterectomy. Oh yes!
NO PŘESNĚ TAK. STAČÍ SI VZPOMENOUT NA TALENOVANOU HEREČKU FRANCES FARMER....:-(. ONA SI V TÉ DOBĚ BYLA VAROVNÝM SLAVNÝM PŘIKLADEM PRO ZASTRAŠENÍ OSOBITÝCH LIDí S KRITICKÝM, ANALYTICKÝM MYŠLENÍM.
Why do some women not want to hear truths when it comes to other women? This comment made me sure that it's not about understanding anything.
It is amazing that with all the trauma Marilyn suffered and her heartbreakingly sad childhood, she was still so radiant. She lit up the screen and was incredibly loveable. But how can anyone survive such a childhood and how can any of us judge someone who went through so much. Rest in peace beautiful Marilyn.
Yes my mother coverly sexually abused me when I was very young. There was no love and I was abandoned by both my parents and lived on the street. I'm an addict and I've been struggling for 60 years where it's one day at a time and I do it all with God's power.
@@michaeldundee8300 may God bless and keep you, and take you to be with Him for eternity when it is time. I have many things to relate to you, and Marilyn about and carry so much shame it's debilitating. I truly hope, and will pray, you are okay and will be kept safe under the wings of Our Lord. ☝️🙏💪💕
I was sev
I was sexually abused as a child. It's hard to recover, but you can. The only way I found out of shame and depression was to forgive my abuser. This isn't easy, and takes yrs, only through the power of JESUS CHRIST was it even possible. You start in your mind, and when you start thinking about it, you say, I'm done with that, I've forgiven him. It took yrs for that prossess to go from my head to my heart, but one day, I realized it did. Forgiveness heals you also.
@@michaeldundee8300 So sad. None of that is your fault. I had a stepfather from hell who abused me in every way possible. I overcame his abuse and hatred and made a nice life and family for myself. It would have been so easy for me to turn to alcohol and drugs and to have probably gone to jail but I didn't. It sometimes amazes me that I was able to escape that and rise above it.
I love her. She was abused, but so smart and strong and beyond her time. I love how she took care of her mother throughout her life. 💜
I completely agree.
I wish that she could have had a child. She did get pregnant at least five times, but lost the babies through miscarriages, abortions, and physical abnormalities in her uterus and fallopian tubes. I read that when she was married to Arthur Miller, she did have an "ectopic" pregnancy, where the baby was growing in a fallopian tube which finally caused the tube to burst.
@@nancyayers6355 It wouldn't have been so nice for the child to grow up without their mother. But I'm so sorry Marilyn had to go through all that physical pain and heartbreak. She had already suffered far too much in her life.
@@nancyayers6355 Trisha Paytas is either her child or her incarnate 😁
@@nancyayers6355 yes it's so unfortunate. Having a child would have made her happier
Part of her attraction was her vulnerability, masked by everyone, including herself, by her outward attention seeking. She had opportunities to just give it up and settle down with several husbands, but her celebrity gave her a validation she needed. The fifties style husbands with the little lady in the background was not going to be enough, which is part of her modern appeal. There she was, career girl, in her mid thirties, by herself. In the early sixties that was huge!
@Patriarchy cult Is the beast system The 50s housewife trope is overdone due to movies and tv shows. Hollywood is to blame. They weren't even allowed to show couples in the same bed on tv sitcoms like I love Lucy and later Dick Van Dyke show. So that's how we vision the 50s. My mother and aunt born in 1942 and 1945 completely disagree on how the 50s look to us today. My grandma was a working mother in an office job (head secretary to the boss at the power company where they lived, which for back then was a very good job). Most of my grandparents friends both worked, husbands and wives.
TV and movies really does the 50's a big disservice, all due to what they were allowed to project on the screen.
To add, I have nothing against being a housewife. I was one on and off raising my own kids by my choice. College educated, made my own choices. Just saying it wasn't as stiffling for all women in the 50s as we have been led to believe.
Not really. Joan crawford did that and so did lillian gish. Ahead of their time.
Ja, I know someone who is very similar to Norma-Jean/Marilyn (according to this analysis) . Basically good, intelligent and gentle ppl who experienced recurring trauma from a young age and developed many unhealthy/harmful "coping" mechanisms and attachments.
These ppl don't solidify in any meaningful way and seem unable to realise/foresee the impact of how they behave; like a small child with adult capabilities. Ppl tend to ignore the ugliness in the truth of that sort of damage, especially in physically attractive and charming individuals like Norma, denying full humanity and creating a symbol to fulfill their own superficial and selfish desires.
It's so tragic, u really want someone like her to come out on top in the end, find clarity, safety and happiness. Maybe she never realised that no one was able to come and save her, and she couldn't see how to do it herself/wasn't willing to. So full of potential, but ultimately just tragic and head-shakey. Be well, take care of yourselves 🌹
@@melodyd6037 I love the Golden Era of Old Hollywood under the Hayes Code.
She actually felt a lot of shame regarding being late to set, it was her anxiety and need for perfectionism that drove her to uncontrolled worry and need to keep practicing her lines until she was late and then felt such shame that she couldn't perform as needed. This info is in her own words, in a book released with her journal entries and poems and as described by those who were close friends.
Sad how children go through stressful situations, even abuse, and then there's a whole set of professions to deal with the screwed up adults they become. How about stupid-a s s parents stop abusing their children?
Children brought into the world that are abused and unloved often end up battling addiction and emotional problems and worse as adults. Sadly, despite her beauty and talent she was still another wounded child.
@@amygalvin1799 from 62 and I still am hit hard over my upbringing with no love sexual abuse, and verbal and physical abuse. I've got 4 years no alcohol 3 years no prescription meds 2 years no Copenhagen but I'm still battling pornography and masturbation pretty hard.
Rather than her mother being a bad parent, I think she had severe mental issues and just wasn’t capable of raising a child. Like complaining that a diabetic should just “shape up and do right” so they can eat sweets like everyone else.
Or don’t have kids
Very judgemental comment. In many instances, these relationships are cyclical. We don't know what happened to her mother either. Life can be hard, people make mistakes but in the end we just need to understand that most of the time people act out it wasn't to hurt anyone.
I think this good doctor gave a fair assessment. He's the first I've ever heard who directly mentions the crass irresponsibility of her mental health professionals.
Yes thanks for saying that. Her mental health professionals were incredibly irresponsible, I feel they egregiously overstepped they authority !
@@lumiere7216 And they over-prescribed meds and became involved with her personally. She would drink a bottle of champagne during sessions with Greenson, (at his home), and often stay for dinner. Marilyn and Engleberg began an affair when he separated from his wife and he gave Marilyn the pills she wanted. Engleberg was afraid to lose his license over this, especially once Marilyn died and all the "heat" was on.
@@Missditabomb Psychoanalysis is an intense form of therapy suited for patients with strong egos. It requires breaks over the weekends in order for the patient to process. Greenson had Monroe move in with him to increase number of sessions to 7 per week. Give me a break Dr. Greenson!
@@mrooz9065 Agree, and I honestly believe Marilyn would have been better off, OVERALL, had she not pursued psychoanalysis. Marilyn only became MORE messed up once the doctors started playing with her head. (That goes for her acting coach, Lee Strasberg, as well.) Marilyn was confused about life before "treatment", but she was LOST in life, and TO life, after.
@@Missditabomb vety possible
I always felt so sorry for Marilyn, she never seemed to find happiness, although she brought happiness to millions.
she was drawn to older men as she had daddy issues and I feel like if she were alive today she would realize that she didn't need them. You are enough all by yourself.💔
Well said.
Dr. Greenson feel in love with Marilyn. That creep moved her into his house, had an affair with her, he taped her for hrs. on a recorder. When she died, he administered a shot trying to revive her. I never trusted his actions, he lost his control over her. There's enough
mystery about her death to sink a ship...I will never believe she killed herself. Eunice the housekeeper was a supposed psychiatric nurse. Her story changed several times over about the night Marilyn died. Alot of facts missing here...Marilyn was playing with fire, just tragic.
Exactly MM was murdered, she new too much. She was ready to reveal things. She was very happy, shooting an important movie that would give her career a new impulse, back in a relationship with DiMaggio and proud of her new house that she was furnishing at that time. All kind of things that would not point out to suicidal behaviour....
Oh God the conspiracy theorists
Here we are on August 5, 2021, and Marilyn is still an icon 💋a kiss to my favorite lady and a hat tip to you Dr. G for covering her...❤
Elton John said it perfectly when he said she lived her life like a candle in the wind. This poor woman was used and abused her entire life, and then died tragically, far too soon. I hope that she is now at peace
But that song was about Lady Diana, no?
@@Stella-cv4mc it was about Marilyn... Elton re did it for Diana after her death.
@@ursulashine2306 wow I really had no idea about that! Where I'm from everyone associates it with Lady Diana, maybe it's a European thing?
Kym Jacobs given her childhood trauma, you can imagine how vulnerable to abuse she was by the misogyny in Hollywood
@@markmyword175 No she wasn't. She was born in Los Angeles
A fascinating read is “Fragments” which are her own letters, poems and writings. In a writing from when she was first married (as a teenager) she describes herself as an introvert who loved people and felt most comfortable with those older or younger than her. It seems like she was extremely intelligent.
♥️
I doubt she was actually introverted but can understand she could feel that way due to feeling cut off from others due to her abandonment in early life and history of familial and personal history of mental illness.
She had Autism/asbergers!!! Please search women with asbergers you will understand her completely
This description sounds like autism.
Sounds like arrested development to me
Having worked as an actress and a model, I can say that many actors suffer from narcissistic tendencies and a false sense of grandiosity. Being a little bipolar helps an actor to become another character on stage.
I don’t think she was narcissistic but I don’t think she had personality disorder.
I completely agree with you...
Nejtalentovanější herci, zpěváci, kterí kdy existovali byli herci s dg. "emočne nestabilní poruchou osobnosti." Hypersenzibilita, geniální převtělení do postavy, díla.
I'm absolutely sure of that. And many don't get their feet on the ground again, their ego high.
Chronic insomnia is awful. Mine started when I worked nights as a new nurse and as much as I’ve tried, it’s extremely difficult to get back on track (for me, personally). I’ve tried sleep deprivation, melatonin, meditation, diphenhydramine, I stopped drinking coffee, I had a sleep study done, sleeping pills, exercise, etc. I don’t know what else to do, but it really can mess with your mood regulation even if you’re getting the best therapy ever. I’m glad to see mental health come as far as it has because back then none of that stuff was openly talked about. My dad was 46 when I was born and he came from that era. When he found out I wanted to go to therapy he told me to never tell anyone that I went or “they” will judge me and call me crazy. No, I just had a terrible upbringing and needed to make sense of it all.
I have had insomnia too, since I am 3 years old. Now I am 46, and still struggling with it, sometimes successfully. What is dangerous for me and others with insomnia - too much insuline and cortisol fluctuations, too little progesteron, too much sugar - icnluding sugar in alchohol, white bread, fruit, etc. Chronical stress - too many bad toughts. I must always try to look for positive things even in negative ones. Develop own philosopy.
She came from an unstable mother, was abandoned at 2 weeks old, abused in multiple ways, moved constantly and married very young. Bless her heart. She had a lot to work through for anyone but how could she possibly have gotten better being in the spotlight continually? She just had a tragic life and mental health treatment was still really bad at this point in history.
i feel really icky whenever people suggest Marilyn was either 100% this morose, broken, depressed figure her whole life or 100% just a happy-go-lucky girl with no problems. we didn't know her, we can't know her, and i think this video does a good job at keeping analysis balanced and non-romanticized.
I agree. Dr. Grande's portrayal of her is calm, balanced, and dispassionate. She was fantastically famous in the early Sixties, when I was still young; and she's still a powerful cultural symbol, a legend.
Exactly. The studio agreed to her terms several times. She had power as well as challenges.
Thank you!! And I definitely agree. People don't think of her as complex person. She did SO many things in her short life. But all Hollywood cares about is portraying her as a child-like sob story. I don't think she lived her life as a helpless victim. I really think people fetishize her struggles and traumas. By that, I mean that they like to think of her at her most vulnerable self instead of seeing her as strong or relatable. She went through the same things that many women experience, yet she still accomplished a LOT in her time. That takes a lot of strength. So, it should be framed as inspirational and nuanced, not depressing. But sadly, the most interesting thing about her for many people is the abuse she suffered from men, not her perseverance after it. That's what I find weird. She actually did things, things didn't just happen to her.
Same!
THANK YOU
No words - it makes sense that she could never quiet her mind. I understand, I am so sorry. Thank you, Dr Grande.
Thank you for this sensitive review of Marilyn's life and mental health. Well done.
Also wondering how infertility affected her mental health. Not being able to have one's own children after not having a real relationship with one's own parents must have been terribly difficult for her as well.
Absolutely!!!! And it's a subject rarely touched upon in connection with her.
She probably would have been a terrible mother.
Endometriosis is incredibly painful, don't forget about that in addition to the insomnia and everything else going on
^^^^^^
The medical community does not care about endometriosis, because it is not a money generator. also suffered from it. It is weird what they pay attention too. they love artificial insemination because it is expensive and they make all kinds of money on this procedure. Endometriosis, here is a Pamperin, next.
My poor beloved. A beautiful person who lived a tragically ugly life. We do not forget you Marilyn. Continue to rest in gentle peace.
You bring such compassion and fairness to your professional analysis of Marilyn, Dr. Todd. She suffered and died much too young.
Wish her Godspeed x
I'm not knowledgeable in psychology by any means, but I am a huge Monroe fan, so thank you for making this video! The only thing I would vehemently disagree with is the idea that Marilyn's work-ethic was low. While she was often late to shoots, and would show up not on her best game, she still cared deeply about her work. She often kept the crew after hours because of how much she cared about getting the perfect take. Before her fame it was said that she would get up very early to exercise, and take singing, acting, dancing and etiquette lessons. Even after finding fame, she continued to take acting classes, and kept very close relationships with her mentors. She also got very bored in her marriages because she felt that her purpose was to act, and she took the job very seriously, so much so that it scared her to fall into the housewife trope. There are many letters and personal writings from her that go into detail about these topics specifically on the subject of her work. From what I understand, she felt awful about wasting directors' and crews' time but wanted so much to do the perfect job. This was a woman who put her work first and foremost in her life, although I agree that sometimes this was so much so that it actually backfired on her, especially when you add in her substance abuse. In no way am I trying to correct you because I love your videos! Just wanted to add to the conversation based on what I've read and researched about her. Marilyn Monroe lived a fascinating albeit heartbreaking life. Thank you again for making this video!!! And sorry for this totally unwarranted long-ass comment haha.
Mary Vaughn Excellent comment
Tell it
Thanks for saying this. I agree with much of what Dr. Grande said in this video about Marilyn, but when he said that she had a “poor work ethic” I had to vehemently disagree. She worked very hard at her craft, and indeed took many lessons. If anything, she was too much of a perfectionist and let that fear paralyze her. I think that Marilyn’s insecurity about not being good enough is what caused her to have to do multiple takes and even miss work. And I’ll just say that I once knew someone who had worked with Marilyn in Hollywood, and they said that she was just about the hardest-working actress that they had ever known.
Her extreme perfectionism may have come from an early film, where she stumbles over a line, and it was included in the final edit. I think this would have been intolerable for her, and she took control of her image by insisting on multiple takes until she was satisfied, and by destroying negatives that she wasn't happy with from her photo shoots. She may not have felt that she knew who she was, but she certainly understood what Monroe represented. An extremely intelligent and complex person. She was ahead of her time and her appeal is universal. She won't be easily forgotten.
MM was a manipulated, feel sorry for me type of person, plus the Dr is right, her work ethic was zero, she didn't give a damn how time was wasted & all the money the studio lost because she just didn't feel like going to work, poor baby, she was depressed. Her childhood wasn't good, but millions of other kids lives are great either, they survived, made something out of it, productive & full of happiness, it's called being responsible for your own life . MM actually thought JFK would leave Jackie & marry her?? Unreal, she fooled around with Robert Kennedy too, these were powerful men, she fooled around with the wrong guys! Tony curtis said it was like kissing a dead fish in a movie scene they were in - and, she was a drug addict, making everything even worse! One of her friends invited MM to church, hoping she would love God & turn to Him for help, but MM said she didn't need God, nor was she interested, really sad, I bet now sh wishes she had listened to her friend
"She did act out dramatically in that hospital she didn't like, but that behavior could also be attributed to extreme personality traits or substances." Or...it could be as she described it. We all know those places are horrific and only get worse the further back you go in history. 🙄 ✌💖🖖
Right! It’s like no one ever believes you
Yeah, and I am still being dramatic when I mention how traumatising waking up in psych ward physically restrained was to me... And still faced misogyny, when I asked about the catheter I felt between my legs, the only area I could move then, and I did violently at times, due to desperation and confusion, since no one would talk to me, and only when I asked about that thing, if it could hurt me when I moved like that, I was told by a middle aged man (I was 21 at the time) "Don't worry, you're still a virgin." And this all is my illness and hysteria talking, right?
@@ninaj6051 Oh my god, I'm so sorry you experienced that!!!
This is the truth.
That’s terrible - what happened Nina J.
Dr. Grande, thank you very much for treating this analysis with such a respect. As a long-time-fan of MM, I want to say, that your analysis is the best I have ever heard/read. And I must say, that you have made an excellent research work. Thank you very much.
I cannot get over how absolutely stunning she is in that thumbnail photo. It's incredible. She's beautiful.
It's A.I. She was beautiful but that's one of those alrered photos you see everywhere
@@infinite10045 oooh. Thanks! 😊
She was alone in this world. She didn't have a large family. When that happens, you are always searching for love in all the wrong places. People who take advantage of you. All she needed was and ever wanted was a family. She ran into men who only loved her outside.
Yes, she was driven into the arms of other men! Having affairs must of been so difficult. Nothing like the clout chasers of tik tok or OF.
🤣😅😂🤡
She didn't have a family full stop
because she didnt know that having a family brings not only joy... We are all alone and need to find happiness in being alone sometimes
This held my interest. I like that Dr. Grande holds Marilyn's mental health professionals accountable and talks about doctors being 'star struck' by their celebrity clients. One of the take aways from this, for me, is the importance of rest, especially now that we are under quarantine. I will no longer feel guilty for taking another 20 minute nap.
Well put!
Psychoanalysis usually requires 4-5 sessions per week which is a lot to process and handle. As if it was not heavy enough, Greenson had Monroe move in with him to have therapy over the weekends as well. Scratching my head.
@David Brian Lantry The mental health professionals involved might have been culpable, however, you're incorrect to say that they were accountable i.e. they faced no redress for their actions.
Siesta, Baby!!
How about an analysis on the rock star Jim Morrison of The Doors.
I was a professional Marilyn Monroe impersonator for 13 years. It was an honor to keep her image alive. I was able to see many of her auctioned garments, including the gorgeous gown she wore while singing to JFK. And I also mingled with some who knew her. One of my last gigs was at The Rainbow Room in NYC. She will always hold a very special place in my heart. May she rest in peace and love.
She had High functioning AUTISM/ Asbergers. PLEASE search Sarah Hendrickx or AUTISM in FEMALES!! YOU WILL learn so much!! and help spread this awareness!!!!!! Its called MASKING!!
Kim Kardashian wore the lovely birthday dress at some function. Kim couldn't fit into it and had to wear a stoll to cover where the zip was open.
I thought K should not have worn the dress. She has no talent where as Marilyn had heaps of creativity.
Creepy
@@RealityRecovery Get a life! No one cares about your opinion of others who are fans of Marilyn.
Everytime I look at a picture of her somewhere, I always reflect on how good my life is. She was a woman that was so admired and many women very often say they would love to have had Marilyn's life, I don't know why. Maybe the wish of having her looks or her success I can understand it. However her life was so sad, I don't understands why anyone would want to have a life that she had. My heartaches every time I read or watch documentaries about her, I just wish that her life was beautiful as she was.
The thought of having her life is scary to me. I cherish my beauty, I don't want to be in someone else's shoes but that last line you had is wholesome. "I just wish that her life was as beautiful as she was.", it's so endearing and sweet.
I know. Her childhood was a mess. She said herself,"everyone's childhood plays itself out". So true. You can keep a kid on childhood issues for only so long. It's going manifest
@@oanaalexia thank you for taking the time to reply. It is always wonderful to hear about someone who are happy with who they are and how they look.
Oana Puha that last line broke me.
I always find it interesting with people that I know that are big fans of Marilyn.....I find that people who really adore Marilyn often have had traumas in their life and face a lot of darkness. Similar to the pain she carried. I believe Marilyn’s energy attracts them.
Can I just say, you are absolutely killing it on this channel Dr Grande. Scientifically informed, tempered with empathy and covering often sensational cases with the right grounded approach. Keep up the great work, very much enjoying! ✊🏽
Great work Dr Grande and some beautiful photographs of Marilyn. Thank you. Rest in peace MM, no-one comes close to the wonder of you.
I would appreciate your analysis of Jean Harlow. Another amazing woman of early Hollywood! Thanks!
She was a unhappy soul in a perfect body... All her life was a continuous struggle to be accepted as she was but one by one, people had dissapoined her, especially those close to her:( Allways trying to shout out her wish, by the time she lost her voice and give up, tired and dissapointed... RIP Marilyn! Thank you, Dr. Gande; a very good analise!
Sentimentality aside, her body couldn't handle substance abuse and there were still other issues she had and I'm not talking about issues of an emotional nature. Of course people love tragic figures, amplifying the idea of this.
Sadly she was a victim of neglect mental abuse and people using her throughout her life which is just so sad
Oh no anyway
Marilyn overcame so many obstacles and is an inspiration to many. Her mother’s schizophrenia was difficult on her, her miscarriages along with her need for love and security. She said she felt like a waif. It was evident she was intelligent, sensitive and was a sweet person. May she rest in peace.
I love her! I started with my obsession with Marilyn when I was 12, I’m 48 now. I don’t think there’s a book about her that I haven’t read or movie I haven’t watched. I think she was pushed over the edge by someone in the mob. She didn’t have any pills in her stomach, no running water in her room or glass of water. Joe DiMaggio really loved her and had red roses delivered to her grave every week until he died.
The Misfits was written by Arthur Miller, Marilyn’s 3rd husband. He wrote it with Marilyn in mind, as a gift to her, and she was not pleased with the character of Roslyn. It added much more of a strain to their crumbling marriage. It was her final completed film.
And, selfish MM, due to her not showing up for work, ended up giving Clark Gable a heart attack, he died 3 months after filming was completed!
Well he did leave some choice words for her to find about how she embarrassed him and he was embarrassed to have her around his upper crust intellectual friends.
Then he wrote a character that was not intellectual and who couldn’t articulate her feelings to stop animal abuse. Just had her scream. A character that was on the verge of being a washed up sexpot.
Clark was not in good health. Look at the life he lived. His time was down for the count.
He didn’t blame MM. he actual treated her fatherly. His widow didn’t blame MM either.
So to come in here and say it’s MM’s fault is outrageous and disgusting.
@@madambutterfly7513 I believe Marylin was suffering from withdrawal from drugs. The pills she was taken were controlling her life.
Those pills affect the central nervous system. Insommina is a consequence and I'm sure she had hard time sleeping because of the pills... The reason why she showed up late.
@@madambutterfly7513 That was not Marilyns fault. Gable was already in poor health.
Do an analysis of princess Diana 😍
Heard she was BPD...and she is related to MM omgoodness!
That would be a good one .
@@franmellor9843 Who had BPD...? Marilyn..?
@@franmellor9843 was she?
Princess Diana, the only thing she had in abundance was money. The Spencers were loaded.
I did not expect a complete mini-biography or resume of Monroe's life; I knew all of this. The last four minutes were informative. I also suffer from borderline personality disorder.
the sad thing about Marilyn is that it really seems like the one thing she craved was approval, which she interpreted as love. she wanted it from the public, from people in her life, to feel like she was finally secure and enough. people really underestimate the impact your early years have on your adult behavior
'..Bite me, milk and honey will flow from me..' she said that once. Cant remember when or where. A hell of a character to keep up and make - seem real to the public
What a great line!
That is an amazing line indeed. Wow. Screenshot worthy. Thanks.
I’m surprised no one has mentioned that she may have had CPTSD.
exactly!!! tho not a diagnoses at that time. the individual always blamed for not adapting. being beautiful amd talented everyone wants to take from her, including the doctor..
CPTSD is not a disorder by itself, rather an underlying issue present in all the other potential major disorders mentioned by the doctor..and of course she had CPTSD, no doubt...
@@suzanahas4740 I know what it is.
@@suzanahas4740; Trauma causing (personality disorders), is not the same thing as C-PTSD being "the thing that lies under all those theories".
@@mrsmaxson4620 Sorry, what is CPSD?
I literally save your videos to listen to as podcasts when I'm doing my assignments!
You explain these stories so well I’ve been watching your videos
Fascinating! TY🌹
Can we hear about Amy Winehouse?
You betcha we're getting it. As I'm writing you've got 55 likes and a Grande!
Yes!
Yes please!!!
I remember being so devastated about Any Winehouse's death. She burned bright
Yes, such a fascinating, talented person, and another tragic story.
Wow, doctor Grande, you really had your hands full with this one! I don't think we should underestimate the effect of an ectopic pregnancy and multiple miscarriages. Hormones, especially during pregnancy, do strange things to a woman. I'm a mom, and I can't even begin to imagine how an ectopic pregnancy and multiple miscarriages would affect my behavior and mental health. Aside from that though, she seemed to have a smorgasbord of other mental health issues and I loved your perspective on each of them.
It didn't help that MM was a drug addict
@@madambutterfly7513 yes due to her lack of love and printful attachment she was essentially an addict to anything and everything that would help her self medicate.
Very good presentation of a very complicated personality. Dr, Grande's explanation of the problems inherent in "informal" diagnostic categories is very helpful in understnading the confusion in diagnosing Ms.Monroe. He presents excellent explanations of the limits of those categories. Another very informative presentation.
Fascinating woman, this is interesting. Thankyou Doc. What a life and history. A real knockout she was.
I fell in love with Marilyn when I was just 11 when I first saw her, and love her just as much now at age 21. She inspired me to become the woman I am today!
@Paul Wieringa She did so many lovely things too. She was one of the first celebrities to stand up for equality, supported many charities, brought attention to the less privileged (and also check out the story about her and Ella Frizgerald!) etc. She clearly had her demons, but with an upbringing like that, it's pretty understandable and I'm almost surprised she did what she did with all that baggage.
I think Little Darling means the good parts of Marilyn's personality: the uncompromising feminine energy, the friendliness, the love, the compassion, the beauty, intelligence and sensitivity.
I love her sooo much too. May daughter is named after her.
Her problems started with her mother. Things that happen in our childhood affect our entire lives. The best shot Marilyn could have had would’ve have been if her mother would’ve given her up for adoption. I feel so much for her.
@@pamelahansen5394 That's right. I have seen people posting absolutely horrible comments about her mother online, but honestly, she didn't know better. As Dr. Grande stated, she wasn't all there. It made Marilyn's life hell which is so incredibly sad, but it wasn't her mother's fault she was sick. It's a tough situation for everyone involved...
Love that you touched on how chronic insomnia can be so disastrous and debilitating 💖 excellent as usual! 💖
Oh yeah, as a layman I would go as far and state that without consistent good sleep you can't be mentally healthy.
@@babblingalong7689 As someone with chronic insomnia I can attest to this.
@@amandas8130 I really hope you find treatment for this.
Re: the weird, irregular diagnoses made by analysts in olden days of shrink yore, one reason for more strict use of DSM 4 diagnosis is that under managed health care a clearly understood diagnosis is needed for purposes of billing. In days prior, a diagnosis was not needed, and care was usually covered by conventional medical insurance, for as long as doc and patient were happy together. Later on, time frames for treatment were imposed, to cut costs, and to better account for results.
Yet another fascinating video, well research and some beautiful pictures of her too. 👍🤔💕🤗
She had a tough life. She had to fight a lot of trauma by herself while (I expect) simultaneously feeling alone and exploited.
I'd like to see your analysis of hyperproductive minds such as Elon Musk and Steve Jobs.
And Jaron Lenier, polymath, pioneer of, "virtual reality" (he coined the term), visual artist, composer of contemporary classical music, writer. philosopher,
How is Steve Jobs "hyperproductive mind"? He's just a guy who took credit for other people's work.
@@mmestari Hyperproductivity does not necessitate creation. Jobs efficiently allocated and managed resources to successfully bring many innovative products to market. He led Apple to the largest market cap in the USA, reshaped computing and popularized the smartphone, pioneered computer animated films among a long list of other accomplishments. Very few individuals could even accomplish one of those goals. Downplaying his achievements is objectively bizarre but I understand some cannot separate that from the person he was.
@@pilotpwr What's objectively bizarre is thinking that Steve jobs is "hyperproductive" and doing anything else than taking the credit for other peoples work.
Steve Jobs is very much the archetypal example of someone being lucky at being at right place at the right time and knowing the right people, and then screwing them over.
@@mmestari
His seems to be the role model for all those who have been too successful, but people love Heroes and don't want to hear what is the truth.
I am diagnosed with BPD and can relate to many of Marlilyns behaviors so I too think it is possible that she had it.
You put up exquisite photoes of her some of which I never saw before. You also provided valuable info about her life I never heard before. Thanks!
Joe DiMaggio always loved Marilyn, it’s a shame he was such a jealous Italian and couldn’t handle her fearless sexuality, he did not want to share her with the world. I’m grateful he came to her rescue and removed her from that hospital. He was good man at heart, just jealous and possessive.
What does his ethnicity have to do with it?
DiMaggio was jealous, because he knew those Hollywood scumbags didn't care about her and were just using her for their own advantage. He may have been a childish and jealous man, but he truly loved Marilyn and hated to see her being used.
Men know how men think. We know that consciously or subconsciously we are lusting for women we give attention to. Keep it moving guys nothing to see here. But I dont get mad at the guy's. I tell the girl that you didnt put a wall up. So a man trys and its the woman that gives consent with her staying there or giggles.
@Kimberlee Ponson No Kimberlee. It ALL comes down to women not being assertive when approached. A man is selling himself and woman needs to leave things clear. Example if someone is selling watches at the mall asks you to buy do you say. I have one already, oh they look nice but I dont feel like it, maybe later or no thank you? The problem is women leave things open for future interaction. This is also a selfish act to preserve friendships and potential favors from suiter. As you know favors go a long way in a womans life. I wish this could be taught to all women. Sadly everything is not all black and white. In Utah a virtuous woman could be valued but New York seen as not gathering potential resources.
He was abusive.
Great video Dr Grande. I feel like Marilyn sought the attention and love she was neglected of as a child through fame. The absence of a father figure no doubt influenced her relationships with men and the abandonment she experienced from her mother left her with self worth and self esteem issues. If the first years of a child's life are the most important than Marilyn had the odds stacked against her. But ironically this need to please and need to be adored and liked is what enabled her to succeed but also what burnt her out. Perhaps her need to protect herself brought out some narcissistic aspects of her nature, unfortunately for her she was also sorrounded by ppl who wanted to exploit her and take advantage, which probably only further highlehted her self preservation in the worst kind of ways. She is a clear example of how no amount of fame and money can fill a hole inside you or buy you happiness. Psychology and psychiatry was probably a big experiment at the time. Maybe if she had access to the kind of psychiatric care we have today she would have done better...but then again look at Britney and Kanye...they don't exactly fill one with confidence about contemporary mental health treatments
Spot on
SHE has FEMALE AUTISM/ASBERGERS please research Sarah Hendrickx and others who help break the stigma and help Autism community!!
As always Dr Grande I truly appreciate the insight about Marilyn Monroe. I believe personally that she was incredibly gifted however, there was much that most of us didn't know about her childhood and growing up. I think your approach to her case I'm sure his spot on. While I can't imagine that life I can imagine she was in fact under a great deal of pressure. I found your analysis incredibly interesting. I read a lot about her over the years your analysis is definitely something I've not heard before.
This was a wonderful analysis! You said that when one has a Cluster B disorder that it's "not unusual that they have symptoms of several," and that really helped me understand these disorders.
She had High functioning AUTISM/ Asbergers. PLEASE search Sarah Hendrickx or AUTISM in FEMALES!! YOU WILL learn so much!! and help spread this awareness!!!!!! Its called MASKING!!
Can you do an analysis on the early 80’s supermodel Gia Marie Carangi? Angelina Jolie played her in a HBO biopic in 1998 and her story is almost similar to Marilyn Monroe’s, except Gia died of AIDS due to her heroin habit resulting to her using unclean needles. Thank you! Love your videos!
This lady was amazing! Marilyn Monroe overcame so many possible pitfalls and had a life that many people envied. She was able to take the gift of her natural beauty, her intelligence and some innate charisma and use these attributes to make herself into her own form of art and make money at it. Wow! She took what she had and turned it into allure. I agree with Dr Grande and my mom who used to say that MM's root problem was being unable to sleep. Imagine having to show up and get your bright eyed, bushy tailed allure on everyday when you really don't feel like it. No wonder she turned to drugs. Time to turn the Marilyn Monroe on! Okay. Now you can turn her off. Being a "personality " can wear you out, I think!
She wasn't really Marilyn. Marilyn was a character she created on her own and without a blueprint. Everyone expected her to be Marilyn all the time. As you posted, it was very tiring for her. But Marilyn is the one I want to see, also. Not interested in Norma Jean that much.
She is the most beautiful woman who ever lived and she will remain so. We are lucky to have had such a divinely beautful creature walk among us for a short time. Her early death has only added to her mystique. She will never grow old and wrinkled.
Have read one poster who said Marilyn was negatively affected by marrying that creepy ogre Arthur Miller. She said Marilyn lost some of her energy and positiveness because of him and it affected her performances and her life, of course. Miller was a worthless gold digger who used Marilyn and never really loved her. He once said while still married to her that she embarrassed him before his family.
I think that CPTSD (complex posttraumatic stress disorder) also can be an explanation.
So mucus would be explained by this. So much would be seen in the sympathetic light it needs to be seen in. Things (consensus in psychiatry ) will change in time, we'll get there.
@@tinymansixsix7128
What? 😂😅🤣
@@mrtwister9002 I had a typo saying mucus instead of much. But the point is that things like narcissistic and histrionic and unstable behavior could be seen in much more sympathetic light, if it was talked as a traumatic reaction instead of bad behavior that exists in a vacuum. In time, this shift might happen in how we see mental illnesses.
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@@tinymansixsix7128 Totally agree with everything you have written here ✨️
Very interesting. Thank you for the video Dr Grande.
Forget diamonds, people who think like doctor Grande Are a Girl's Best Friend. 😍
Absolutely
Lolll awwwwww
✨♈ THANK YOU 🤗✨
lol 😆
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Thank you for this. I have felt a kinship to Marilyn since I was little. I have many similar mental issues as her, but I finally have found a great doctor and therapist who actually cares about me. It has helped me tremendously.
Me too
Thank-you Dr Todd. This was fascinating.❤️🇨🇦❤️🧁🧁
She deserved so much more. She was so intelligent and had such a beautiful soul
It's easy to see your videos don't sway your professional and diagnostic skills at all. That was a very complex and brilliant summary.
I enjoyed this analysis of Marilyn Monroe. She has always been an enigma.
Dear Dr G. another excellent analysis. Marylin is a legend. I watch her movies and they are timeless and brilliant.
An excellent and thoughtful analysis. I think it is remarkable and perhaps a testament to Monroe's inner drive that she still succeeded in her desire to become a movie actress and star despite the traumas she experienced as a child.
Oh, maybe an analysis on how/why some child stars go down a dark path and why others do not? What are the risk and protective factors?
This would be super interesting
Lack of family and a good foundation.
I think thats obvious
This comment reminds me of Aaron Carter.
Upbringing
Hey Dr.Grande just wanted to let you know I appreciate your very interesting, well informed and straightforward content. Keep up the great work!❤️
I think Eunice knew more than she was telling.
You never mentioned Johnny Hide, Marilyn loved him before she met Joe.
she loved him not like a man, but like a human being
I love her. I’ve gone to the house where she last lived in Brentwood ...
Thank you for your gentle analysis of Marilyn Monroe. I’ve always considered her a wounded soul. Well done...again!
Very interesting video! Thank you for sharing!
Beauty, fame, influence and fortune, and still so much emotional and physical pain, not to mention her addictions. I don't think we can count the many young women who wanted to be just like her...never knowing the truth behind that gorgeous façade. You discussed so many details in a short and captivating video. Thank you, Dr. Grande.