I should also add the difference between trademark and copyright, trademark infringement is something that is going to be protected far more regularly and strictly, this is the use of official logos /titles pretty much anything where a product is trying to pretend to be official merch or could be confused for official merch in some cases. like many bootleg products. In short don’t commit trademark infringement. There is little artistic merit in my opinion on this. And is clearly direct competition to the IP holder, which makes a much clearer legal case against those individuals. And typically has little value to the fan community.
i do have a question when it is based on a concept art of an established property is it possible to be used in fair use in say, fan art or illustration or videogame assets?
As someone who used to make fan art. I'd say, make it to build an audience online, you can sell it in small amounts but also make sure to push original artwork. if you make fan art in a style people like, they will eventually want to buy your original artwork. but be aware there will companies who will take down you work. Some of the companies wont even check that its the correct IP when sending a takedown, which is a thing that happened to me. but if you are posting them for free they wont do anything, post it just on you social media to build an following who enjoys you are style is the best way to go and sell your original work.
There are some companies who don't mind/encourage fanart. Stardew valley and genshin impact (I'm not 100% sure on the latter tho). What IPs did you deem "worth it"?
@@pinkmuffin9842I remember reading Genshin really encourages fan art and doesn't mind selling it. I think the only catch is after a certain amount of sales you have to start reporting it. Which explains beside the game's popularity why so much of it is sold at cons
9:20 Viz media are the folks who will copyright strike someone selling stickers they drew and designed themselves but will leave the people selling bootleg posters of official art alone 😢
Looking back, all of my biggest clients hired me from seeing my fanart at shows or online. I've wanted to get away from it, but I can't argue with the results!
This video reminded me of the fanart purge of Otakon's artist alley in 2008, thanks to one artist using their family members to buy up something like 18 tables to sell fanart at. I was there, but the memories are hazy at this point. The con nearly got shut down because the artists complained and Otakon brought in a lawyer, thus sparking a decade+ of strict fanart ratio rules at Otakon.
I worked Artist Alley from 2006-2022, and the stories I could tell. Just found your channel, loved the transparency of this video and will definitely be going through the others while I draw at my games 9-5 now. Sometimes I miss the chaos, but not enough to go back any time soon.
Here’s the thing. It’s legal until it ain’t. There was an artist making Tintin fanart (either directly of the character or characters like Indiana Jones in that same Hergé style) and it was fine until the copyright holder said take it down. He wasn’t even selling anything. I would hate to put a lot of time in effort into making products only for someone to say “nope!” And furthermore, if it were *my* characters, I would feel weird to see someone else making products with them Edit: to be clear, I’m not anti-fan art. I’m just saying know the risk. And also when you think about fan art from an indie standpoint, it can get complicated
@@TonyTylerDraws from an indie standpoint yeah. I have it in my commissions ToS that I will refuse service to anyone wanting to commission fanart of small creators works. I also refuse to make fan merch of small creators works.
From a strict USA copyright point of view.....you are 100% correct. The rights holder has total control over who can profit off of their work, and thus fan work is a violation of copyright. That said most companies understand that fan works are good for them, so as long as you don't get to loud and proud they'll leave you alone. Probably. Maybe.
And on the AI item, I agree that's a bad faith argument. I am pro AI mind you, but that argument is just bleh. I can't draw, so having the ability to use AI to get rough character sketches of my characters is a life saver. Its that or scour the net and right-click steal *cough* I mean save image for references. But I'm not a lost sale, I'm not going to pay hundreds of dollars for artwork for characters who's story might never see the light of day. But if I ever sell my stories you'd better believe I'll hire some artists to do official drawings of the characters.
@@RichardFleming it's roughly the same thing. AI just mashes together patterns from already existing images somebody else right clicked on the internet. concept can be anything from anywhere tho, it's only used to pin down some ideas
great video!! Picolo also got his job drawing official teen tittans from his fanarts, and I have a few animators friends who got positions in studios by animating fanart
I enjoyed this video, a lot of the things you say make a lot of sense and seem "quite obvious" once you've said them, but honestly it never crossed my mind that tagging one's products in a certain way on online shops could be a double-edge sword thanks to the attorneys going out on a hunt for materials they aren't even well acquainted with! Keep up the awesome video content!! I love watching your videos even though I'm not a professional artist!😄
My suspect ever since I've started reflecting about this selling fanart for profit thing is exactly the same: that a lot of companies don't want to hit independent artists too hard because they are producing merch that they themselves can't justify making/can't be bothered to make but that is fulfilling fans' requests, helping them stay relevant. Basically they're making the fan artists do the dirty work for them I've also seen official merch that was very clearly similar to pre-existing fan merch, so the last hypothesis is a very concrete one
Super insightful topic as someone looking to start tabling! I've really been enjoying the videos lately, feels like you are really getting used to RUclips and the editing has been great!
Any company is perfectly within their rights to remove any unoffical content they deem damaging or infringing on their IPs. This is the danger any artist willingly enters when trying to peddle goods containing trademarked things.
i've always cared more about my original work than fan art, but sadly fan art is what gets attention. i think of it as being "symbiotic": the original IPs get advertising and the indie artist gets exposure and maybe a small amount of profit. it's good for getting your name out there but building your entire business model around fan art is a bad idea. sooner or later you're going to get hit with takedown notices.
I know it's not the focus but your Messmer piece is amazing! I've been hoping to see a creator make a video discussing this. I've only ever done very small local shows so the dangers are not very strong there and I've been very curious as to what to prepare for in the bigger ones. Also we appreciate Sang's acting !!
Recently a lot of Sleep Token fanartists have been getting their listings taken down. While it is true that a band's main (often sole) source of income is merch, I think going after fanartists is silly. They're not competitors, Sleep Token don't (and probably will never) sell acrylic keychains of their members as kittens, they don't sell prints or cards or anything like that. What merch bands do offer is often only available in limited quantities anyway. It seems to me they're just weakening their fanbase by discouraging engagement from artists. They might be growing a TikTok following now, but those people will forget they exist the minute they take a hiatus. You need a strong fan community to keep people interested in you when you aren't working. Let the artists build a following for you. Maybe release some official catboy stickers designed by a fanartist. Your income still won't be great, but it certainly won't be worse.
this whole fan art thing is a headache for me so i always avoid making fanart (plus im really not inclined to make them) but this video was such a great in-depth view of the topic!! great job!
As to the last point on some people saying AI art is the same as fan art, that is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. One is people using their own skills to draw someone else's character, generally because they love the character or design, etc.; the other is people putting prompts into a machine who has stolen all its skills from the internet at large with zero concern for or credit to the people it has stolen from and creating mostly subpar, soulless 'content'. UGH. Also, I don't know what IP the fan art painting in this video is from, but that pumpkin will haunt me lol. :)
It's only stupid because you don't want to accept the fact that alot of you people have similarities with ai bros both of you have no problem financially profiting off the backs of hard working people you people don't care about copyright infringement because the company is large but when a large company does the same you wanna play victim and poor little me I'm just a small guy your punching down
it definitely is and always has been a grey area. I just think as long as you don't make things look official, draw things in your own distinct style (dont be a tracer/person who overly references...) dont use official titles or logos, and don't sell so much product that youre actually redirecting money that would go towards the rights holders towards yourself, generally they arent gonna go out of their way to smack ppl making like. less than a couple thousand on fanwork that no one would remotely assume is official. I'm sure people can and have but, it also helps to not be a one trick pony. if you are gonna have an overabundance of any ip, make sure it is your own so it doesnt hurt when you have to take it all down hahah. I could definitely follow my own advice more, I basically only draw what Im inspired to. I like drawing fanart after cracking my brain open and making a bunch of original designs that I hate now for the years I was in college. It's also helped me develop my style after taking a nearly 2 yr hiatus from art without also having the burden of making my own top tier character designs or something. Plus, I've been a con goer for year and like to use fanart as a way to connect with people who have similar interests. There's a few series that are so rare, so niche and have like zero official merch so when I see an artist drawing fanart for it I get sooo happy. Im usually fine with the exhibitor vs artist alley distinction too, again, if youre making enough stuff that it actively competes with the companies that own rights, tread carefully. if you are making fanart in your own style, you're probably fine in most cases. I think people whose aim is to make a lot of money should invest in their own IP over fanart, it's just a way better idea long term. (but these are just my thoughts, as someone who likes to draw a decent amount of fanart ^^;)
I rarely do fan art, but it has gotten me some freelance gigs from the companies I was doing fan art of. I thankfully didn't have to deal with a C&D but rather some curious art directors were perusing online art sites and I guess they were searching for their IP, not to litigate but to see what the fans were doing. It was pretty fun, made some cash, and moved on. 99% of my work is still personal OC stuff but on rare occasion I'll risk the ire of a rights holder and make something fun. Except for Naruto or One Piece, those generally aren't my jam either.
See and I’d be totally fine paying an annual limited use license for those ips that are really aggressive about cnd, but also love how some larger ip companies have included fan art being totally cool with them up to a certain point
Most important things first 1. I feel the same - One-Piece sucks... 2. Give your cat a cuddle from me. 3. Okay, now to my opinion. It is a tricky thing. I personally would like people making fanart of my stuff, however when they only or overly rely fanart of my work to make their living I would not appreciate it. And of course when my art would get very distorted in a way "not so nice" - misused - it is a no-no and overall a lack of respect towards the artist; at least in my opinion. Some years back I reached out to Konami, because of Yu-Gi-Oh, and they kindly replied it would be totaly okay when I do sell some fan art here and there. My mother has a permission, to create a limited amount of work with products, from a well known company that created childrens books and shows (even with official licence text). Often companies are quite open when it comes to selling fan-art in small quantities. As you said it is a way for the brand to get free advertising. But it truly is hard to draw a line. What quantities are okay? Where does fan-art-appreciation ends and the misuse starts? It is all very relative. In general I recomment to mainly create your own art and only do fan art of showns, books and alike when you really feel connected to it and not only because you may will reach more people. This way one can definitly avoid trouble.
this was a really good video! im trying to build inventory to start selling at conventions, and this has been a huge concern of mine. i love making fanart and am really passionate about it! but i also want to make sure im not crossing any lines that will make lawyers look my way lol. thank you for the clear explanations!! :)
@@Inkwell I think what shows this even further is how Fate's series and art is by fans too. The gag series, Koha/Ace is drawn by someone who really loves Fate's Medusa. A number of Fate Grand Order's in game cards have been drawn by fan artists.
Not true at all stop lying you make fan art because it's already popular fate fan art has never made me like Fate it was the actual products from the official source did you people love lying to justify selling fan art
@@luxuriousmindset1906 Fate isn't THAT popular, it has more of a cult following; the fanart that circulates allows it to grab the attention of people who might not have seen it otherwise.
Well dang! my mind has been on this just recently and it became a topic discussed with some of my friends about this. So this is perfect timing! 😆 thank you for putting this out
16:01 I follow an artist who has had contradictory statements given to them before They were told in person once it was okay to sell their fanart But when they put their leftover merch from cons in their online store same company gave them copyright strikes
I agree with One Piece. I tried multiple times to get into one piece, I thought I didn't like it for the 4 kids censorship, I thought I didn't like it for the silly opening, I watched subs got to baroque works and it just wasn't hitting. I've listened to over views of the entire series thinking, it would make me like it, no dice. My friend liked the manga I foundit a bit too cluttered for my taste, I respect the mangaka oda for going as long as he is, it's insanely admirable- I think certain animation and the gear system is pretty cool. I just don't like the story and find it cliche and a bit childish in some areas, the characters do not resonate with me.
15:00 FIRST OFF i'm not an artist and AI isn't art BUT, i do sell anime figures and merchandise and have made artist and vendor friends alike. From what I've seen (and common sense really) is, the bigger the con, the bigger the risk of you being taken down. I knew a vendor that sold bootleg figures at ALA this year and ALL of their merchandise got recycled on Day 2 by staff at the request of Bandai Namco. I'm not sure what the sign-up process for artists are (my first sentence of this comment). But, for MOST big conventions to sign-up for an exhibitor space you need a business license from whatever state you're from and for AX you need event and business insurance. I know because I had a mutual approved for a spot at AX this year, but they didn't have insurance, tried to make some imaginary insurance for their business, and they rightfully got denied of their spot. On top of that, exhibitor spots are EXPENSIVE so once you've done all that, I'm assuming that's why legal teams and staff hunt down exhibitors and hand them cease's compared to go around artist alley. PERSONALLY, I think it's fucked up, but that's the legal game you're getting yourself into and you just gotta be careful.
Some companies too are completely chill with fan art as well. Hoyo that makes star rail and genshin have stated they’re okay with artists making and selling fan art. But I agree that it should be about balance I think you take a massive risk if all you sell is fan art becuase if something gets shut down, it might all get shut down. Plus, not just IPs can take you down, but Etsy or selling platforms too. I think too your point about a studio vs company wanting it as well plays a big role. I know the same is true for vtubers and streamers. People make fan art of them and many love it and are fine, but if they work under a company often they crack down on it. It’s very complex.
One of the problems with companies being "chill" about allowing fanart is that their statements do not constitute an _actual_ license (even a revocable one), since one is a generalized statement while the other one is (by necessity) specific to individual usecases. So, "it's only legal until it's not."
@@Stratelier ah I didn’t think of that! It’s even more of a confusing gray area. So even companies who’ve given what seems to be a green light should still be a proceed with caution type of case then.
@@artbyinky Legally speaking, yes. Most companies who are "chill" with fanart are that way because most fanart is, statistically and pragmatically, "too small to sue".
extra points and likes for having your kitties at the end of video. it is MY OPINION that AI "art"/"artist" are neither. AI fanboys go out and steal . . . yes steal . . . others work, put no actual artistic effort into it other than typing in the AI parameters for pieces they want and then call it their own art/fanboy work. I do not see this as a double standard from fan art that one actually creates by digital art or traditional art means. you put time and effort into it. you may or may not make an actual reproduciton of said piece but you still do it in YOUR style. and therein is the difference, AI doesn't have a style, they utilize styles of others and art from others. I could be missing the point entirely. Did I say extra points and likes for having your, so very cute, kitties in your video
I always ask other artists if they need a license to make fanart or if they just do it. I don't want to get slapped with a lawsuit if it ever comes down to that.
sega made me pay a settlement for the amount i earned on sonic stickers. it surprised me since sega is normally so lax about fan projects. it also tarnished my love of sega properties forever.
I think fan art should be just that, art made by a fan. Any commercial activity based around fan art gets pretty scummy if you ask me, in many cases these artists are undercutting sales of the genuine article. It’s a grey area for sure, but in my opinion aside from one offs produced for pleasure and to share with fellow fans, profiting from established IPs is ethically dodgy and generally in direct breach of copyright law, as well as giving AI bros legitimate grounds on which to point to artistic hypocrisy, whether it’s total bullshit or not (it is, but you take my point). Long story short if you want to be a commercial artist in any real sense of the word make your own stuff.
Thank you for being a fellow One Piece hater 🙏 re: AI. If they spent any time in the art community they're trying to displace, AI proponents would know that discourse has been done to death in the form of artists who "heavily referenced" photos of models or, you know, other artist's works. And even then, people like Ilya Kushinov and Ross Draws still had to put a monumental amount of work into honing their skills and producing their pieces. Which then in turn were so popular as to have filled the AI blender until it's overflowing and now every AI generated piece looks like their styles. I don't really have any respect for most AI fanatics, of which I'll include LLM users, since almost none of them can even code or really understand much of anything about tech that's not in a marketing blurb. If it weren't for pre-made services, they wouldn't be able to do much of anything. Can't code, can't draw, only skill is mouthing off on social media.
Fanarts and fanmerch are for Artist Alley only, and it supposed to stay there, that's why VIZ didn't do anything to them. Exhibitor Hall is for official stuff only. I think AX did bad job checking the exhibitor vendors's stuff and it's legality. That one artist who started this drama was selling bootlegs VIZ stuff in Exhibitor Hall, and after VIZ took them down, this artist started fear mongering in twitter saying VIZ targeting all fanarts including the ones in AA. Imagine (just example) Bandai Namco has official booth and selling official stuff in Exhibitor Hall and in the same Hall there are fanmerch and fanarts of Gundam. It's like shoving the bootlegs stuff to the copyright holder's face. That isn't smart move. Also the positive side of separating original stuff and fanmerch to different spaces is artists can level up from AA to Exhibitor Hall when they have enough original stuff and fanbase of it, and this is so cool!
Am I safe to conclude that making fanart non-commercially (aka, drawing it because I love the character/franchise) puts me on the safer end of thing? This topic about copyright and fair-use has me real confused. Great video, all in all. Made me think that things are not precisely black and white.
I feel that fan art is best kept for when you need to grow your account, it gives you reach. But if you're serious about being an artist you NEED to push out original content, not just from a business/law perspective, it's important for your personal development! In my opinion, too many artists on social media rely too much on fan art. Especially now that AI stands to disrupt this mutually beneficial balance that you mentioned in this video...
So theroretically if i made an original sketch/pen drawing on the back of each print (Ala MTG Artist proofs) i could sell each as a one off, and potentially not worrie about the legalities? (Id definitely need to check with an ip lawyer if it would hold up but. interesting thought)
@@Brenilla I mean intention often times is a big factor when it come to legal matters. Example- murder vs manslaughter or tax fraud vs a fine for mis calculating your taxes. I wouldn’t think that would hold up on a large scale, but I’m also not a lawyer so idk
Great video, touching on a subject many artists at shows/Cons I’ve tabled at. Big, Big walls of prints for sale of licensed properties. I have done prints for sale of licensed characters also, when starting out. One particular bad girl vampire character, that an artist ( working for the company ) copied my illustration of said character pose, and used it for their cover art, for that company - too bad I wasn’t commissioned by that company instead.🤪 You nailed the way companies handle character copyrighted material on the head. The IP holder can bring down the legal hammer any time, at any time they want. And if that company is, say, Disney? They have deep, deep, deep pockets. P.S. I did work for Disney, best to be off their radar; Bob’s your Uncle.
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I should also add the difference between trademark and copyright, trademark infringement is something that is going to be protected far more regularly and strictly, this is the use of official logos /titles pretty much anything where a product is trying to pretend to be official merch or could be confused for official merch in some cases. like many bootleg products. In short don’t commit trademark infringement. There is little artistic merit in my opinion on this. And is clearly direct competition to the IP holder, which makes a much clearer legal case against those individuals. And typically has little value to the fan community.
i do have a question when it is based on a concept art of an established property is it possible to be used in fair use in say, fan art or illustration or videogame assets?
@@darkman452 that would not be fair use to my understanding, but I would need more information on the use case to say for sure
As someone who used to make fan art. I'd say, make it to build an audience online, you can sell it in small amounts but also make sure to push original artwork. if you make fan art in a style people like, they will eventually want to buy your original artwork. but be aware there will companies who will take down you work. Some of the companies wont even check that its the correct IP when sending a takedown, which is a thing that happened to me. but if you are posting them for free they wont do anything, post it just on you social media to build an following who enjoys you are style is the best way to go and sell your original work.
I have a similar approach! I think this is solid advice ⬆️
There are some companies who don't mind/encourage fanart. Stardew valley and genshin impact (I'm not 100% sure on the latter tho). What IPs did you deem "worth it"?
@@pinkmuffin9842I remember reading Genshin really encourages fan art and doesn't mind selling it. I think the only catch is after a certain amount of sales you have to start reporting it. Which explains beside the game's popularity why so much of it is sold at cons
9:20 Viz media are the folks who will copyright strike someone selling stickers they drew and designed themselves but will leave the people selling bootleg posters of official art alone 😢
Looking back, all of my biggest clients hired me from seeing my fanart at shows or online. I've wanted to get away from it, but I can't argue with the results!
This is how I got some of my first clients as well 🤫
it's nice seeing your painting process
your gonna like the next video i have planned then! 🐸
This video reminded me of the fanart purge of Otakon's artist alley in 2008, thanks to one artist using their family members to buy up something like 18 tables to sell fanart at. I was there, but the memories are hazy at this point. The con nearly got shut down because the artists complained and Otakon brought in a lawyer, thus sparking a decade+ of strict fanart ratio rules at Otakon.
What the hack that’s crazy 😰
I worked Artist Alley from 2006-2022, and the stories I could tell. Just found your channel, loved the transparency of this video and will definitely be going through the others while I draw at my games 9-5 now. Sometimes I miss the chaos, but not enough to go back any time soon.
Here’s the thing. It’s legal until it ain’t.
There was an artist making Tintin fanart (either directly of the character or characters like Indiana Jones in that same Hergé style) and it was fine until the copyright holder said take it down. He wasn’t even selling anything.
I would hate to put a lot of time in effort into making products only for someone to say “nope!”
And furthermore, if it were *my* characters, I would feel weird to see someone else making products with them
Edit: to be clear, I’m not anti-fan art. I’m just saying know the risk. And also when you think about fan art from an indie standpoint, it can get complicated
@@TonyTylerDraws from an indie standpoint yeah. I have it in my commissions ToS that I will refuse service to anyone wanting to commission fanart of small creators works. I also refuse to make fan merch of small creators works.
Trying so hard to listen intently but also just staring at the art process waiting for the “your” to get fixed ☠️☠️☠️
🤣🤣🤣 you were waiting a while
From a strict USA copyright point of view.....you are 100% correct. The rights holder has total control over who can profit off of their work, and thus fan work is a violation of copyright. That said most companies understand that fan works are good for them, so as long as you don't get to loud and proud they'll leave you alone. Probably. Maybe.
And on the AI item, I agree that's a bad faith argument. I am pro AI mind you, but that argument is just bleh. I can't draw, so having the ability to use AI to get rough character sketches of my characters is a life saver. Its that or scour the net and right-click steal *cough* I mean save image for references. But I'm not a lost sale, I'm not going to pay hundreds of dollars for artwork for characters who's story might never see the light of day. But if I ever sell my stories you'd better believe I'll hire some artists to do official drawings of the characters.
@@RichardFleming it's roughly the same thing. AI just mashes together patterns from already existing images somebody else right clicked on the internet.
concept can be anything from anywhere tho, it's only used to pin down some ideas
great video!! Picolo also got his job drawing official teen tittans from his fanarts, and I have a few animators friends who got positions in studios by animating fanart
Another banger of a video. Can't wait for your One Piece fan art career to blow up.
its gonna be wild for sure!
This is precisely the video I’ve been wanting to watch and have been intensely curious about. Thank you!
Thanks for watching
im here for the cat at the end
Perfect boys
I enjoyed this video, a lot of the things you say make a lot of sense and seem "quite obvious" once you've said them, but honestly it never crossed my mind that tagging one's products in a certain way on online shops could be a double-edge sword thanks to the attorneys going out on a hunt for materials they aren't even well acquainted with! Keep up the awesome video content!! I love watching your videos even though I'm not a professional artist!😄
My suspect ever since I've started reflecting about this selling fanart for profit thing is exactly the same: that a lot of companies don't want to hit independent artists too hard because they are producing merch that they themselves can't justify making/can't be bothered to make but that is fulfilling fans' requests, helping them stay relevant. Basically they're making the fan artists do the dirty work for them
I've also seen official merch that was very clearly similar to pre-existing fan merch, so the last hypothesis is a very concrete one
Super insightful topic as someone looking to start tabling! I've really been enjoying the videos lately, feels like you are really getting used to RUclips and the editing has been great!
It’s a learning process for sure! Best of luck at your future shows!
Any company is perfectly within their rights to remove any unoffical content they deem damaging or infringing on their IPs. This is the danger any artist willingly enters when trying to peddle goods containing trademarked things.
Disney will crack down if you put mickey on anything and sell it. Nintendo is not far behind. Especially image of that red italian man.
Except for the Steamboat Mickey version. It's now in Public Domain, so it's free game now by independent studios and artists.
i've always cared more about my original work than fan art, but sadly fan art is what gets attention. i think of it as being "symbiotic": the original IPs get advertising and the indie artist gets exposure and maybe a small amount of profit.
it's good for getting your name out there but building your entire business model around fan art is a bad idea. sooner or later you're going to get hit with takedown notices.
6:56 also I’ve heard some of the folks who got notices were selling bootlegs or were scalpers
And *that* makes *sooo* much sense
I know it's not the focus but your Messmer piece is amazing! I've been hoping to see a creator make a video discussing this. I've only ever done very small local shows so the dangers are not very strong there and I've been very curious as to what to prepare for in the bigger ones. Also we appreciate Sang's acting !!
Sang is still running 🤣
I wondered about this topic just recently and YT immediately recommended this so early too ahhhhh!!!!
Recently a lot of Sleep Token fanartists have been getting their listings taken down. While it is true that a band's main (often sole) source of income is merch, I think going after fanartists is silly. They're not competitors, Sleep Token don't (and probably will never) sell acrylic keychains of their members as kittens, they don't sell prints or cards or anything like that. What merch bands do offer is often only available in limited quantities anyway. It seems to me they're just weakening their fanbase by discouraging engagement from artists. They might be growing a TikTok following now, but those people will forget they exist the minute they take a hiatus. You need a strong fan community to keep people interested in you when you aren't working. Let the artists build a following for you. Maybe release some official catboy stickers designed by a fanartist. Your income still won't be great, but it certainly won't be worse.
this whole fan art thing is a headache for me so i always avoid making fanart (plus im really not inclined to make them) but this video was such a great in-depth view of the topic!! great job!
i love hearing ur perspective on this kinda stuff, all these topics are ones i would never tend to think about myself
As to the last point on some people saying AI art is the same as fan art, that is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. One is people using their own skills to draw someone else's character, generally because they love the character or design, etc.; the other is people putting prompts into a machine who has stolen all its skills from the internet at large with zero concern for or credit to the people it has stolen from and creating mostly subpar, soulless 'content'. UGH.
Also, I don't know what IP the fan art painting in this video is from, but that pumpkin will haunt me lol. :)
It's only stupid because you don't want to accept the fact that alot of you people have similarities with ai bros both of you have no problem financially profiting off the backs of hard working people you people don't care about copyright infringement because the company is large but when a large company does the same you wanna play victim and poor little me I'm just a small guy your punching down
it definitely is and always has been a grey area. I just think as long as you don't make things look official, draw things in your own distinct style (dont be a tracer/person who overly references...) dont use official titles or logos, and don't sell so much product that youre actually redirecting money that would go towards the rights holders towards yourself, generally they arent gonna go out of their way to smack ppl making like. less than a couple thousand on fanwork that no one would remotely assume is official. I'm sure people can and have but, it also helps to not be a one trick pony. if you are gonna have an overabundance of any ip, make sure it is your own so it doesnt hurt when you have to take it all down hahah.
I could definitely follow my own advice more, I basically only draw what Im inspired to. I like drawing fanart after cracking my brain open and making a bunch of original designs that I hate now for the years I was in college. It's also helped me develop my style after taking a nearly 2 yr hiatus from art without also having the burden of making my own top tier character designs or something. Plus, I've been a con goer for year and like to use fanart as a way to connect with people who have similar interests. There's a few series that are so rare, so niche and have like zero official merch so when I see an artist drawing fanart for it I get sooo happy.
Im usually fine with the exhibitor vs artist alley distinction too, again, if youre making enough stuff that it actively competes with the companies that own rights, tread carefully. if you are making fanart in your own style, you're probably fine in most cases. I think people whose aim is to make a lot of money should invest in their own IP over fanart, it's just a way better idea long term.
(but these are just my thoughts, as someone who likes to draw a decent amount of fanart ^^;)
The argument in favor of AI images by criticizing fan art is craaaaazy
I rarely do fan art, but it has gotten me some freelance gigs from the companies I was doing fan art of. I thankfully didn't have to deal with a C&D but rather some curious art directors were perusing online art sites and I guess they were searching for their IP, not to litigate but to see what the fans were doing. It was pretty fun, made some cash, and moved on.
99% of my work is still personal OC stuff but on rare occasion I'll risk the ire of a rights holder and make something fun. Except for Naruto or One Piece, those generally aren't my jam either.
This is an interesting concept. Thanks for the great video. Hope you have a great day or night.
@@rune3700 thanks so much!
See and I’d be totally fine paying an annual limited use license for those ips that are really aggressive about cnd, but also love how some larger ip companies have included fan art being totally cool with them up to a certain point
Oh ny God how do you make those embossed prints?! Those are gorgeous
Most important things first
1. I feel the same - One-Piece sucks...
2. Give your cat a cuddle from me.
3. Okay, now to my opinion. It is a tricky thing. I personally would like people making fanart of my stuff, however when they only or overly rely fanart of my work to make their living I would not appreciate it. And of course when my art would get very distorted in a way "not so nice" - misused - it is a no-no and overall a lack of respect towards the artist; at least in my opinion.
Some years back I reached out to Konami, because of Yu-Gi-Oh, and they kindly replied it would be totaly okay when I do sell some fan art here and there. My mother has a permission, to create a limited amount of work with products, from a well known company that created childrens books and shows (even with official licence text).
Often companies are quite open when it comes to selling fan-art in small quantities.
As you said it is a way for the brand to get free advertising.
But it truly is hard to draw a line. What quantities are okay? Where does fan-art-appreciation ends and the misuse starts? It is all very relative.
In general I recomment to mainly create your own art and only do fan art of showns, books and alike when you really feel connected to it and not only because you may will reach more people. This way one can definitly avoid trouble.
this was a really good video! im trying to build inventory to start selling at conventions, and this has been a huge concern of mine. i love making fanart and am really passionate about it! but i also want to make sure im not crossing any lines that will make lawyers look my way lol. thank you for the clear explanations!! :)
Hope it helps and best of luck!
Without fanart the Fate franchise wouldn't be even half as popular as it is today
Sooo true, I do t think I ever see official merch from them, the only reason I know anything about fate is all fan made stuff.
@@Inkwell I think what shows this even further is how Fate's series and art is by fans too.
The gag series, Koha/Ace is drawn by someone who really loves Fate's Medusa.
A number of Fate Grand Order's in game cards have been drawn by fan artists.
Not true at all stop lying you make fan art because it's already popular fate fan art has never made me like Fate it was the actual products from the official source did you people love lying to justify selling fan art
@@luxuriousmindset1906 Fate isn't THAT popular, it has more of a cult following; the fanart that circulates allows it to grab the attention of people who might not have seen it otherwise.
Well dang! my mind has been on this just recently and it became a topic discussed with some of my friends about this. So this is perfect timing! 😆 thank you for putting this out
16:01 I follow an artist who has had contradictory statements given to them before
They were told in person once it was okay to sell their fanart
But when they put their leftover merch from cons in their online store same company gave them copyright strikes
Hoyoverse you may not know what Pantone 18-1438 is, but you made it perfectly legal for artists to live off of your franchise.
I agree with One Piece. I tried multiple times to get into one piece, I thought I didn't like it for the 4 kids censorship, I thought I didn't like it for the silly opening, I watched subs got to baroque works and it just wasn't hitting. I've listened to over views of the entire series thinking, it would make me like it, no dice. My friend liked the manga I foundit a bit too cluttered for my taste, I respect the mangaka oda for going as long as he is, it's insanely admirable- I think certain animation and the gear system is pretty cool. I just don't like the story and find it cliche and a bit childish in some areas, the characters do not resonate with me.
15:00 FIRST OFF i'm not an artist and AI isn't art BUT, i do sell anime figures and merchandise and have made artist and vendor friends alike. From what I've seen (and common sense really) is, the bigger the con, the bigger the risk of you being taken down. I knew a vendor that sold bootleg figures at ALA this year and ALL of their merchandise got recycled on Day 2 by staff at the request of Bandai Namco.
I'm not sure what the sign-up process for artists are (my first sentence of this comment). But, for MOST big conventions to sign-up for an exhibitor space you need a business license from whatever state you're from and for AX you need event and business insurance. I know because I had a mutual approved for a spot at AX this year, but they didn't have insurance, tried to make some imaginary insurance for their business, and they rightfully got denied of their spot. On top of that, exhibitor spots are EXPENSIVE so once you've done all that, I'm assuming that's why legal teams and staff hunt down exhibitors and hand them cease's compared to go around artist alley. PERSONALLY, I think it's fucked up, but that's the legal game you're getting yourself into and you just gotta be careful.
Some companies too are completely chill with fan art as well. Hoyo that makes star rail and genshin have stated they’re okay with artists making and selling fan art.
But I agree that it should be about balance I think you take a massive risk if all you sell is fan art becuase if something gets shut down, it might all get shut down. Plus, not just IPs can take you down, but Etsy or selling platforms too.
I think too your point about a studio vs company wanting it as well plays a big role. I know the same is true for vtubers and streamers. People make fan art of them and many love it and are fine, but if they work under a company often they crack down on it. It’s very complex.
One of the problems with companies being "chill" about allowing fanart is that their statements do not constitute an _actual_ license (even a revocable one), since one is a generalized statement while the other one is (by necessity) specific to individual usecases. So, "it's only legal until it's not."
@@Stratelier ah I didn’t think of that! It’s even more of a confusing gray area. So even companies who’ve given what seems to be a green light should still be a proceed with caution type of case then.
@@artbyinky Legally speaking, yes. Most companies who are "chill" with fanart are that way because most fanart is, statistically and pragmatically, "too small to sue".
@@Stratelier that makes a lot of sense tbh. 🤔
extra points and likes for having your kitties at the end of video.
it is MY OPINION that AI "art"/"artist" are neither. AI fanboys go out and steal . . . yes steal . . . others work, put no actual artistic effort into it other than typing in the AI parameters for pieces they want and then call it their own art/fanboy work. I do not see this as a double standard from fan art that one actually creates by digital art or traditional art means. you put time and effort into it. you may or may not make an actual reproduciton of said piece but you still do it in YOUR style. and therein is the difference, AI doesn't have a style, they utilize styles of others and art from others.
I could be missing the point entirely. Did I say extra points and likes for having your, so very cute, kitties in your video
I very much agree with you, it's crazy the desperate arguments on that topic in particular
I always ask other artists if they need a license to make fanart or if they just do it. I don't want to get slapped with a lawsuit if it ever comes down to that.
If you watch till the end, you get to see cats.
Thank you for this reward.
🐈💅🐈⬛
sega made me pay a settlement for the amount i earned on sonic stickers. it surprised me since sega is normally so lax about fan projects. it also tarnished my love of sega properties forever.
I think fan art should be just that, art made by a fan. Any commercial activity based around fan art gets pretty scummy if you ask me, in many cases these artists are undercutting sales of the genuine article. It’s a grey area for sure, but in my opinion aside from one offs produced for pleasure and to share with fellow fans, profiting from established IPs is ethically dodgy and generally in direct breach of copyright law, as well as giving AI bros legitimate grounds on which to point to artistic hypocrisy, whether it’s total bullshit or not (it is, but you take my point). Long story short if you want to be a commercial artist in any real sense of the word make your own stuff.
Personally, I still want to legally sell images of Dororo from Keroro Gunso in The Little Mermaid Parody Art style someday.
Personally, I still want to legally draw Dororo from Keroro Gunso anime in The Little Mermaid Parody Art Style someday.
Oh yeah.
I enjoyed this topic
Thank you for being a fellow One Piece hater 🙏
re: AI. If they spent any time in the art community they're trying to displace, AI proponents would know that discourse has been done to death in the form of artists who "heavily referenced" photos of models or, you know, other artist's works. And even then, people like Ilya Kushinov and Ross Draws still had to put a monumental amount of work into honing their skills and producing their pieces. Which then in turn were so popular as to have filled the AI blender until it's overflowing and now every AI generated piece looks like their styles.
I don't really have any respect for most AI fanatics, of which I'll include LLM users, since almost none of them can even code or really understand much of anything about tech that's not in a marketing blurb. If it weren't for pre-made services, they wouldn't be able to do much of anything. Can't code, can't draw, only skill is mouthing off on social media.
Delicious in Dungeon is a great choice. Draw Senshi as Wilford Brimley.
great vid as always!!... and absolutely a propos of nothing....where did you get your glasses from? 🤔 they are lovely!
also also loved seeing the dunmeshi + messmer speedpaints at the same time as the discussion, i was sorta entranced
I get my glasses from eye buy direct ! 🤣
@@Inkwell thanks for the answer!! im like 90% sure i ordered cosplay glasses from there once lmao!
Fanarts and fanmerch are for Artist Alley only, and it supposed to stay there, that's why VIZ didn't do anything to them. Exhibitor Hall is for official stuff only. I think AX did bad job checking the exhibitor vendors's stuff and it's legality. That one artist who started this drama was selling bootlegs VIZ stuff in Exhibitor Hall, and after VIZ took them down, this artist started fear mongering in twitter saying VIZ targeting all fanarts including the ones in AA. Imagine (just example) Bandai Namco has official booth and selling official stuff in Exhibitor Hall and in the same Hall there are fanmerch and fanarts of Gundam. It's like shoving the bootlegs stuff to the copyright holder's face. That isn't smart move. Also the positive side of separating original stuff and fanmerch to different spaces is artists can level up from AA to Exhibitor Hall when they have enough original stuff and fanbase of it, and this is so cool!
i'd eat that fish.
That’s all I wanted to hear!
Am I safe to conclude that making fanart non-commercially (aka, drawing it because I love the character/franchise) puts me on the safer end of thing? This topic about copyright and fair-use has me real confused.
Great video, all in all. Made me think that things are not precisely black and white.
Most likely yes
I feel that fan art is best kept for when you need to grow your account, it gives you reach. But if you're serious about being an artist you NEED to push out original content, not just from a business/law perspective, it's important for your personal development!
In my opinion, too many artists on social media rely too much on fan art. Especially now that AI stands to disrupt this mutually beneficial balance that you mentioned in this video...
What game is that clip at 19:10 from? It looks so great.
Deaths Door, it’s very good
@@Inkwell Thank you! And thanks for the great content!!
💀💀 My inner art student is still waiting for that bus to hit me, for the tuition pay off.
We can only pray 🙏🫡
Using ppl ip's is against the law. Ai will def like to have a word about that one
commenting for the luck engine
i love your content!
Thank you!
Fifty shades of gray grey for sure 👍😎😮🍑🌎🥷
hataraku saibou mentioned
So theroretically if i made an original sketch/pen drawing on the back of each print (Ala MTG Artist proofs) i could sell each as a one off, and potentially not worrie about the legalities?
(Id definitely need to check with an ip lawyer if it would hold up but. interesting thought)
@@Brenilla I mean intention often times is a big factor when it come to legal matters. Example- murder vs manslaughter or tax fraud vs a fine for mis calculating your taxes. I wouldn’t think that would hold up on a large scale, but I’m also not a lawyer so idk
I rather draw my own stuff and make it of mass appeal.
I´m just here cause of hair
14:30 are you sure about that? Do you remember a pregnant elsa x spiderman content on youtube?
I got too good at making fanart, can you pay my bail
@@thenekobean oh snap, no prob just wait for my next pay check 🤫
sakimichan still safe for copyrights
I'm sure they have had issues, i think they probably are just not public about it, if i had to guess. but who knows
you're right, one piece sucks. thanks for the info!!
I am here to help!
BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
😘😘😘
ONE PIECE SUCKS!
omg am i the first (epic channel and topic btw)
#1 👌
Great video, touching on a subject many artists at shows/Cons I’ve tabled at. Big, Big walls of prints for sale of licensed properties. I have done prints for sale of licensed characters also, when starting out. One particular bad girl vampire character, that an artist ( working for the company ) copied my illustration of said character pose, and used it for their cover art, for that company - too bad I wasn’t commissioned by that company instead.🤪
You nailed the way companies handle character copyrighted material on the head. The IP holder can bring down the legal hammer any time, at any time they want. And if that company is, say, Disney? They have deep, deep, deep pockets.
P.S. I did work for Disney, best to be off their radar; Bob’s your Uncle.
6:56 also I’ve heard some of the folks who got notices were selling bootlegs or were scalpers
And *that* makes *sooo* much sense