Tinning Copper Cookware Process and Visual
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- Опубликовано: 15 сен 2024
- What exactly is happening during the tinning process when creating tin-lined copper cookware?
Here's a brief explanation of flux, handle heat conductivity and distribution during tinning, and molecular bonding. In short, it's the fast version of the science of tinning copper cookware, plus a bit of a visual of the actual process.
Any questions, thoughts, or clarifications needed? Comment below!
Bravo baby !
Our honest girl.
Finally someone was brave and honest enough to talkabout the hole presses of tinning copper.
Thank you
You are so welcome!
This is the first great description of the process
Oh thank you! So thrilled you think so!!!
Tinning Copper and Brass utensils for cooking has been used for ages in India. There is lot of information on it and several youtube videos. The process is called 'Kalhai' or 'Kalai' in most Indian languages, so using that as keyword may bring up results. Offcourse, modern day india uses non-stick and stainless, so copper/brass has become obsolete and so have the 'artisans' dependent on tinning cookware for livelihood. Sadly, those 'artisans' never made nearly as much money as someone in the west. Anyway, the flux used in Ammonium chloride (I think).
Thanks for the video. A medium sized fry pan can be tinned in India for say $2 (Yes). I have no idea how much it would cost in the US.. thanks again..this video brought back memories...
Thank you for the info/history! I love learning that!!! And yes, it's so sad when artisans lose their work because of lack of demand for it!
This a a some video, you are a great teacher, I do not think you will get many questions as you explain everything thoroughly
These videos never gets old…👏👏
Brilliant Madame simply Brilliant…
Thank you my dearest - you're too wonderfully kind! xoxoxo
Just bought unlined copper pan..Thanks for video demo..
thanks for watching!
Thank you for this video! I bought a bottle of Harris Stay Clean flux and used insulation same as you. It worked great!
Saltyfries hurrah!!! What a great and wonderful thing to hear!!!
@@housecopper what is the best way to strip the old tin from the pan completely to have a fresh surface to work with? By the way thank you for all your videos😀
@@utuber2940 Thank you for watching! :) You can check out a video on stripping that I did here: ruclips.net/video/-DBrcE0Q3o0/видео.html
@@utuber2940 I retinned some pots without removing the old tin. It worked out perfect, and saved me a lot of time. The pots were used, had black spots, but were not carbonised.
...and after trying this method with brass: worked like a charm:) thank you very much indeed for sharing your knowledge:) I tried with ammonium chloride with some interesting results; after washing the metal (brass) with citric acid water solution it worked as well.
HUZZAH! So happy it worked like a charm!! Great to hear - and thank you for discovering your findings / experiements!
Do you put anything on the outside of the copper pot to protect it before tinning? (I saw a video where the guy put whiting paste - ground marble) to protect the outside but I can't find any more info on it.
I do, every time! Sometimes I'll use lime powder (like what you put in your garden) mixed with water. Or you can use drywall mud watered down.
Nice video. I tin my own copper cookware and this video was helpful.
Steven Rook thank you!!! Glad to hear it!!
Good job explaining !
Thank you so much!!!!
Fantastic video, thank youi
Thank you for watching!
Ahhhh latices and structures....Engineering mechanical of materials. Hate that class with a passion. Awesome video. Thanks
Why do I watch these videos? Now I want to buy an old cooper pan and restore it.
I know - so much science!! I probably only enjoy it because I didn't have to take that class!!! lolol. Thank you for watching. And you should totally get a copper pan and restore it!
Kia ora from New Zealand! Do you typically wipe something onto the outside of the pans while running? I’ve seen a few other videos of people that do. What are they pasting on there? Thanks!
Yes, I use a very thinned out drywall mud. You can also use lime paste. I have seen a few other things, but these two are my first go-tos.
Excellent vid. I have a large copper pot they we bought at a flea market in France. What little tin left in the inside has turned dark. Must I remove all the old tin before I try re tinning it? Thanks.
Yes, you'll want to remove all the old, dark tin or the new tin will very likely not stick to those spots.
thank you for this video.
My pleasure! Thank you for watching!
Dear,Thanks for your help,getting back tome,Thanks a million,Take Care...
I have just bought some old copper pans and would like to know whether there is a way to know if the tin lining is lead free.
Thank you.
Best way is to get lead testing swabs from home depot or Lowe's etc. I have used them to check my pots and pans half of them had lead!!!
So really like your videos and knowledge of the trade, watching your tinning video I can't help but toss in my two cents worth.
I see you tuck you jeans into your boots and you are sitting down if any of the hot tin splashes out you could get a hot foot or leg. Should have on boots with no laces and leather chaps with a leather apron, just mt two cents worth. Cheers.
HA - this video is several years old, and you're right - it took only once for tin to sneak in and I no longer tuck them in. Most of the time I tin in steel toe high-tops, rugged pants from Duluth Trading and my very aged leather apron. :)
Nice video
Thanks!!
welcome😇
Hello Sarah is Mel here from South Africa. I have some things to re tin and its not as easy as the video.I prepaired the pan and then brushed the flux on and then heated the pan with the tin which melted.I then used the fibre glass cloth to wipe the tin.Its abit rough and when i see your video s yours are smooth.What am i doing wrong.Thanks Mel
It's ok, give yourself a break. Tinning is hard and takes YEARS of practice; you won't get it smooth and nice the first several tries. It's ok if it is rough - my first ones were not super either. You'll get the hang of it with practice! And you can do it! :)
I buy and sell a lot of copper pans and pots and I was wondering if you could tell me what is the best process for cleaning copper and polishing? I really enjoyed your video and learned a lot.
Hey John - so happy you watched and learned a bunch! Yay! To be honest, the best process for cleaning and polishing depends so much on how dirty the copper is!! If it's just patina, then some Tarnax and then basic copper polish by hand works just fine. But if you have a ton of grime and dirt and age, then you might need that Tarnax followed by a buffing wheel and then some hand polishing. Hope that helps!
nice video, the thing i dont get is since tin melts that easy, doesnt that mean that it melts while you cook food inside the pot? and if so doesnt that mean that eating that food you are consuming tin metal aswell? thanks
Totally common question! And a good one! The tin does not melt during cooking because the food or liquid absorbs the heat...and tin melts at 450F (water boils a bit over 200) so you're seldom getting the pan hot enough to melt tin anyway...but even if you do get it very hot, you should have food/liquid in to absorb the heat, which means the tin does not melt at all, and you are safe! :)
@@housecopper thanks! cool info, so where does the old tin go ?
@@livanolimanolania4340 When I'm retinning, I sand out the oxidized stuff and then put new tin over the remainder. Otherwise, it slowly wears down over years with cleaning/scrubbing.
@@housecopper i see now, thanks!
Is tin safe to ingest? I assume some of it will end up in the food.
Good question. It really doesn't end up in food in the way you think, if it does at all (like, hunks aren't coming off) - it's like the miniscule molecules of tin slowly wear off with cleaning - or if it does come "off" it's the same way iron "gets in your food" from cast iron - it's molecular, it's tiny, and tin is an essential micromineral for us (just like copper is) so in such tiny amounts, yes, it's safe.
Could you specify or give a time frame in how much time the tin wear out? Of course this would depend on the use/scrubbing and other factors. However, if I wear to use it every alternate day, then how quickly or (at earliest) would the tin start wearing off. Hope this is answerable. Thanks in advance
The general rule among us coppersmiths/re-tinners is that a good coat of tin should last 12 - 15 years with daily use, ONLY if proper care (hand wash only, never in the dishwasher, proper heating/cooling use, and only using wood or silicon to cook with and only clean with soft rag and soap and hot water).
how hot is the copper when you do that? every use a laser thermometer ? Is there such a thing as too hot?
You need the whole copper body to be hot enough to take the tin and not frost it, so usually 500 - 600F. Yes, if you get the copper too hot, you'll burn your flux and scorch your tin and the whole thing will need to be cooled and re-prepped for tinning. The laser thermometers don't work for this process - the reflection of the copper and tin make it mis-read. It's one of those things you can't use technology for - you just have to do/learn/try!
Do you take re-tinning orders?
Yes I do. You can email my assistant at copperassistant AT gmail.com
Should copper ladles be tinned also
They definitely don't have to be. You're not cooking in the ladle. :)
thank you for posting these videos I have a lot of copper cookware but not a lot of money but I am handy and can do this thanks to you what is that spray you are using...
Hello from Sweden! And thanks for your videos!
I’m wondering - if retinning is needed from time to time - what happens with the worn away tin? Does it go in our food and is it a health risk?
Thanks
Hello Daniel! The tin is worn away mostly with the cleaning process - scrubbing and washing over many years. It is bonded molecularly to the copper, so it doesn't break off in our food. Tiny molecules may slowly erode and could end up in your food...over decades. If that did happen, it would not be a health risk as tin is a micronutrient for humans, just like copper. We need a little in our systems anyway.
How do I fix an only 2 inch raw copper spot
Dear Sara
I tried tinning my pot the tin melts but it doesn’t bond. It stays liquid drops?
Can you advise please
Regards
Hello - well, it's hard for me to exactly help you as I am not there when you are tinning and I don't know your process. It could be any number of things. My top three guesses are one or two of the following things are happening: 1. Your copper is not hot enough 2. You are not spraying or using enough flux or 3. Your copper is not clean enough to take the tin
Thanks for the reply
Hi! Is it possible to get the heat high enough with propane or do you have to use acetylene to get the copper and tin hot enough to bond?
Totally possible to get the heat high enough with propane. The only time I have to use acetylene is when I need to do brazing work. Otherwise, you can get it hot enough for sure!!
@@housecopper Thank you! That's what I thought.
Sure thing and yay! :)
I really like you videos. I have a traditional heavy bottom Indian cooking copper utensil. Tin coating is fading off. If I need to retin the vessel do I have to scrap off old tin layer before retinning new layer ?
Yes, you should sand down the old tin (at the very least, remove the darker oxidized tin) before retinning. :)
@@housecopper Cheers
Can we use normal tin blocks available online....or there is some other form of tin used during tinning
I only use the tin from Johnson Mfg out of Iowa - they make the tin and it's the only food-grade tin I've found on the market. You have to call to order and they only sell in big spools, but it's nice to know you're using food-grade tin.
@@housecopper thnx a lot for ur reply...but I'm from India, so i can't order from there... anyways I'll look after that😀
Hi, i cant find harris flux where i live. Can i use rosin diluted in alcohol?
You would not want to dilute the rosin in alcohol! It won't work then! Just use it straight, powdered, and that should help.
@@housecopper thanks, I'll try.
Hey Sarah, Thanks for your videos. I'm curious if pewter is commonly used for tinning. Thanks in advance for your response!
Thanks for watching! No, pewter is not commonly used for tinning. That is to say you could do it, but it melts at a far lower temp than tin (330F vs tin's 450F) so you might have more issues actually cooking in pewter-lined copper. I have a lot of super old books on copper and tinsmithing, and pewter as a lining isn't mentioned anywhere, which leads me to believe pewter was just not used traditionally - unless, of course, in pewter casting itself. :) Also...you have the lead issue. So you have to be really careful with anything pewter because of the lead, too...so many things to consider! :)
Could an electric stove top plate be hot enough to heat the pots before tinning? Great tutorial.
Thank you, I appreciate it!! I don't think an electric plate would give you quite enough heat - you need that fire to heat it up and all over nice and even. Just my opinion, though - you could try it, one never knows!
hey, many thanks for sharing your copper tinning experience with us.... i have one question.... which cotton should i use and where can i find it.... i am really struggling to find the right cotton to do copper tinning
is any insolation ok ?
You're welcome. :) You can use basic cotton batting, like from a fabric store or supplier. Otherwise yeah, the basic pink panther insulation is perfect!
Hi, nice explanations. I have some questions if I may:
1. Can tin come off(melt) if I heat the pan with stove high flames?
2. Can tin come off if I accidentally scratch the pan a little hard with a metal spatula?
Of course! Ask away always! To answer your questions: 1. If you have food in the pot, your tin won't melt off on high heat - the heat will transfer into the food and the tin will stay intact. If you heat a pot on high empty, then you do run the risk of making the tin soft or run. The tin itself is bonded to the copper, so it won't completely make the copper show and will mostly just pool in the bottom, but it will make it splotchy and the thickness and evenness of the tin will leave and the tin will pool in the bottom. It is possible to kind of fix the issue, if it happens, with the heat and some soap as flux, a glove and a piece of cotton, but I don't recommend it unless someone just wants to try. :) And you need the whole pot HOT for a while, empty, for the tin to run happen - close to 500degrees. Not sure what someone would need to cook at 500 degrees. :) But there you go. As for 2. Yes, you can scratch off tin if you scrape around with a metal instrument. Does not always happen, but it can. Tin is soft, but it conducts the copper's heat SO well it makes sense (personally) to use it so you are actually using copper to the best of its ability. That all said, until 30% of the copper is showing, if you have scratches, etc, it's ok. The pot is still usable, likely for years and years and years, before you'd need repairs.
Wao, thanks for the fast response and dedication in your explanation. It's very useful information. I think you are ready to be a mentor/master. :-D
Experimentando en la cocina oh you are so welcome - my pleasure. And that’s a lovely compliment. I think I still need some years of working before I could say mentor or master but you are very kind. :)
What kind of cloth are you using to spread the tin? (Nevermind, it's fiberglass) I wonder if you could use one of the point-and-shoot IR thermometers and take several reading around the pan to know when it has reached the right temperature. Roughly how many inches of the tin bar were used for one pan? Thanks. Great video.
Ha - yes, fiberglass. You can also use pure cotton wading for the same effect, it just is a bit more flammable, of course, than fiberglass. You could do the thermometer trick, but you'd have to be pretty quick on some of the thinner pans, which can get super fast all of a sudden, and then the flux can burn and then tinning gets annoying. If I get my hands on one, I'll try it - great idea! In terms of the tin bar...it would be easier to measure in mm - it doesn't take much tin, and usually I end up pouring some out. The best way to figure out how much tin you use is to weigh the pan unlined, and then again when the tin is in. Bob and I have done that before, and we are absolutely astounded with how little tin is used (by weight, which is really the best way to measure tin - it is sold by the pound as it is in bulk). You need a really smart scale to note the difference. The cost for tinning is not only for the tin itself, but for the labor/skill to apply it properly and well, and all the material costs (gas/fuel, flux, lime paste, cleaning materials, buff and polish, compounds, wheels, etc). Anyway, sorry, that was a long answer for your question!
Sorry, one more question - do you ever accidentally get the tin somewhere unintended, like the outside of a pan and how do you remove it if that happens?
Yes, it can happen - usually just some small drips on the upper edge wherever the excess tin is poured out - if the lime paste isn't there. Removal includes several steps of sanding using a handheld sander, but you have to be really careful with the grit so you don't scratch the copper irreparably (or making your job harder), so you start with 220 at the harshest and work your way down, and then I go to the drumel and do another sanding and then a little wire polishing wheel, and then hand paper, and then the buffing wheel with the hard wheel, etc...
Nice video ..!
How clean does the pot need to be and is it possible to overheat the pot and discolour it ?
Thank you!
The pot should be very clean - either the tin sanded to dull shine with all black/oxidized tin layers removed, or have the interior completely stripped down to the bare copper. Yes. It's possible to overheat and burn or discolor the tin. The copper exterior discoloration during tinning is expected and can be cleaned up.
@@housecopper thank you so much for your videos ! I have been buying pots at flea markets in France for a few dollars . I refinished two of them , with your help ,and I’m looking forward to going back to France to find more as soon as the “ Plague”
Is over ....
Derek
In the tinning process video, is the fiberglass next to you what you are using as your swab?
Yes. You can also use cotton wadding, like really soft fluffy stuff. The old school smiths in the 1800s used flax bound tightly together and filled with sal ammoniac. :)
I know - you'd think that, but the cotton isn't actually in contact with the fire. Also, if it's 100% cotton, it's actually a bit fire retardant (for re-enactors, we have to make sure our clothes are 100% cotton broadcloth so we don't catch fire when we cook. Anything with polyester will totally go up in flames!). Thanks for asking and watching! I do love what I do, totally!! It's awesome fun and always a challenge. :)
@@housecopper I purchased raw cotton batting, but tried it today and it got charred. So I'll have to figure out why or switch to fiberglass. Maybe binding balling it up, using sal ammoniac, and making sure it is spreading tin and not contacting bare copper will help.
Hi! I'm just starting out and I want to start by making some copper mugs. Can I use silver solder wire in lieu of tin to line the inside of the cup? I haven't a forge, but I was hoping to either use a propane torch or the coals of a campfire. I was also planning to 'tin' the metal before shaping the cup from sheet copper. Any wisdom is appreciated, thanks!
You may find the silver solder needs too high a temp for the thinner gauge of copper you sound like you're using. I use 100% pure tin solder because of the lower melting point. Especially if you are only using propane or campfire coals to tin...then stay away from the silver, which will need a much higher temp to melt (and a different flux) - silver solder will probably need acetylene vs propane or coals. And yes, when forming from the flat, it is way easier to tin the copper in the flat/sheets before building the cup. Especially if you only plan to use lap seams, which won't hold up over fire.
Do they make just tin tea pots ?
No, they don't - tin is too soft to be used solely / alone. There may be some steel tea pots that are electroplated with tin out there, and in the very old days, the same steel sheet dipped in tin was used to make tea pots, but they would rust out so many didn't survive the centuries. I hope this answers your question! :)
can I just use the tin without flux?
No sir! You need a flux to facilitate the molecular bond between the two metals. You'll notice the tin won't "stick" or, best case, will cold solder and pop off.
Hey, great know-how video. Thank you so much for taking the time to make it. There’s not a lot out there on this subject, so kudos to you! I just purchased my first vintage, French, copper sauté pan - cranking my culinary ventures up a gear - and I’ve realised I’m going to have to re-tin it. I’m very practical so I’d happily tackle it myself, however, I’m in Scotland and I’m finding it hard to find in the UK the tin bars you use in your video. Searches just bring up solder for soldering here... Is there a specific name for those tin bars you use that might help me narrow my search results? Also, can ordinary plumbing flux also be used as the one you use seams to be only available in the U.S.? Thank you so much in advance for your time!
Very best regards,
David
Thank you so much for watching!! I agree -there's not much out there! I kinda am hoping more people get into the trade because the guys that I learn from are a dying breed, and there's not enough people grasping and saving and putting down all the oral history and knowledge they carry around. But anyway, congrats on your first piece of copper!!!! You'll love it! :) So, since you're of a mind to tackle the re-tinning yourself, you must first figure out how you'll remove all the old tin - you have to, or your new layer won't stick, it'll flake off. As for the tin, you can use lead-free solder if that's all you have access to (which is odd considering how much tin has come out of Wales over the centuries - I would think you could find tin!). The tin bars don't have a name, it's just what I get from Johnson. But you could try ACRO - they might ship overseas? They have both flux (which you'd want to water down to be able to spray out of a spray bottle, like 2:1) and lead-free solder. stores.acrosales.com/flux/ I don't know if you'd want to use ordinary plumbing flux. I mean, you probably maybe could? For yourself? I just don't know how much of it will burn off during the tinning process. I know for sure Harris and Acro are food-safe. Not that any of this truly helps. You might also look up Steve of Newlyn Tinning in Cornwall. He'd be able to help you with local sources for flux and tin, I'm sure! You can tell him I sent ya! Best of luck!
House Copper & Cookware Thank you for taking the time to reply! I’ve got the striping covered, so no problem there, and I actually finally found 100% pure tin - the key search word I was missing is “ingot”... I’ve seen Newlyn Tinning selling their stuff on eBay here. I did think to contact some of the tin smiths here but I wasn’t sure how open they’d be to answering questions... I’ve done a lot of pipe work soldering and I obviously know you drink water from and cook with tap water, so I figured it should be food safe, but then again, you’re not heating your water pipes with naked flames! I’ll research some more and hope for some great results. Thank you again! Have a great week!
Congrats on finding the tin! And you'll find the tinsmith community (and coppersmith) are for the most part relatively open and inclusive - at least, they are here in the States (there's not many of us, though, and we don't live close to one another at all). But regardless, feel free to ask anything else here! And that's a good point about pipe flux. It probably *is* food safe, it's just a matter of the heating during tinning and how it reacts to food and heat, as you say. If you call the makers/manufacturers of the flux, usually they are more than happy to help you out. Seriously - just pick up the phone and start asking questions. It's how I usually roll myself. :) Have a good Monday!
House Copper & Cookware Hi, I thought you'd like to know that Steve got back to me, and this is what he's recommended, off-the-shelf - rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F251865113321 - He said he makes his own... Thank you again!
Howdy.
Where do you get your supplies?
Which supplies do you need? My more recent videos list out what I use and links on where to buy in the description. :)
Hi, what flux could be used that is food safe?
The most "food safe" flux out there would be the very traditional, old fashioned dried pine tree sap (rosin). Flux does burn off during the process, though, so there's no chemical residue after the whole process is done.
@@housecopper Interesting! Thanks I will look into it! Helps a lot
I need to re tin a old pot, do you have to totally remove all the previous tin from the pot or can you layer it on top of the existing tin? my pot only has some section were the tin is wore out. Love your video
666 the witch Jasso yes you do need to completely remove all previous tin. Otherwise the new layer of tin won’t really bond and it will bubble up and flake off in short notice.
666 the witch Jasso and thanks for watching!! :)
Great teaching but I strongly recommend a charcoal filtered respirator. Stay Clean has zinc chloride in it and that has a ph of about 4. It's an acid. Thank you, great work but please be careful!
Thank you for your sweet concern! I have actually, about 2 years ago or more, switched over to a full face, charcoal filtered respirator, so I'm all set and safe!
Thank you very much for this video! I have searched everywhere for exactly this type of demonstration,with explanation....in English. I have searched for literature and even offered to pay someone to teach me to re-tin my own copper.
Thanks to you, yesterday I successfully lined a small ladle as a practice before tackling my sauce pots, sauté pans and finally my large stock pot, all from Mauviel. I have had these for over 30 years and had them re-tinned several times but have lost contact with my tinsmith.
Just two questions please: do I need to remove the faint tin lining that remains in some of my pots or can I build on top of it? If so, what is the best way to remove it?
Thank you again!
Robert Bennett
Philadelphia,PA.
Hi Robert! So thrilled it was so helpful for you! I agree - there's not a lot in English out there for tinning, so I'm going to make a few more. :) I'm always happy to chat and offer book sources, so feel free to email me at housecopper@gmail.com with any specific questions. So excited to hear how your re-tinning goes! As for your question about removing the tin, yes, you do want to remove the last bit of tin before doing a new retinning. Otherwise, what happens is the new tin will quickly or soon flake off and your new tinning job will be ruined. You want really clean copper. I usually bead blast in the blasting cabin, and then stubborn chunks I take off with a sanding accessory on the drummel. You also could use a grinding wheel if it was small enough and you had a tight enough hold on the pot, but I'd personally be nervous about bounce within the piece unless your wheel was set up for this particularly. Hope this helps!! I'll post another video on cleaning copper before tinning soon!!
House Copper & Cookware Thank you for your quick response! Looking forward to more videos!
Thanks you Sara, your videos are very helpful. How do you refurbish old rusted iron handles? The corrosion can be very severe, but well-refurbished pans have lovely smooth, shiny, and blackened or dark grey handles. What is the process?
Thanks for watching! If the handles are really bad, I will make sure they get a bath in muriatic with the copper before I retin, and then actually will, with bad cases, do a session in the bead blaster. If you don't have one, wash the handles in vinegar and scrub with the vinegar and a wire brush. Wash off, dry really well, and then you can do one of two things: buff with the wheel and let compound get in or rub old fashioned stove blacking, or rub in food-grade oil. It's always an experiment!
Where do you get your flux and tin? do you have a website or do you just find it at home depot, Also I have an antique copper pot that has a boiling plate on the inside that is loose, do you have any advice on how to do that? Also it already has tinning in it, but its old and gross at this point, do I need to completely strip the tin?
I have the links to flux and tin sources in more recent videos - check those and you can link straight through to all those products. They work so fabulously! (No, Home Depot doesn't carry - you have to go direct to the manufacturers.) Totally impossible to diagnose your boiling plate blind but I'd say clean it up good with mechanical and chemical means and then re-solder it...good luck!
@@housecopper thanks! I have been really debating whether I should do it myself or pay someone to do it. What are your prices like?
@@ohmahgawdfilms Depending on your set-up, it may be cheaper for you to have someone do the work than to buy all the materials, safety gear, and tools. I start at $3.95/linear inch. :)
@@housecopper well I am a blacksmith, so I have the tools, I just chose to own a weird little kettle haha
@@ohmahgawdfilms I love that you chose that! :)
Thank you for this!
You're welcome! Thanks for watching!
Where do i obtain tin?Ar’nt the vapours toxic?What are u using to apply the tin and at what temperatures?
Do you make your own lime paste or buy it? I haven't been able to find any.
Peter Pauly I make my own. I saw your email and will get you all the info soon-it’s like trying to compress a 3-year apprenticeship into a few paragraphs though!
Dear Sara
Can you kindly send a picture of Harris flux Please.
Your videos are excellent.
I learned a lot from it.
Thanks
I can't attach photos on RUclips chats. You can search on Google. Type in Harris Stay Clean flux. Thanks for watching and best of luck!
Can you use the same flux you would use for soldering? The green paste stuff
andy dennis hey! In theory yes I’d think so but as it is a paste it will be really hard to apply quickly when the pan is hot, so you might have a more tricky time of it than you’d need to. Also I don’t know if you could apply it in advance as it would possibly burn and be useless during the heating of the copper before you tin. I have used paste but not for tinning large pieces with a ton of tin at once. It just doesn’t move well. Does that make sense?
@@housecopper that makes sense I'm trying to tin a copper cup I made. So I'm trying to figure out all the logistics before I try it, also do you know if I'd have to worry about the solder melting during the tinning?
If the cup isn't very big, you could use that paste, but use a soldering iron on high with your biggest tip, and maybe a second heat source, like a heat gun or a small blow torch to heat the exterior, and put the paste in, then use the soldering iron, and heat the copper at the same time with the other heat source. A cup is small, and you should not need to do the bigger method. And then the paste should work. If you have already soldered seams, then yes, the solder will melt during tinning. Usually Bob and I tin in the flat before we form the pieces, and then add solder for the seams at the very end. If the seams losing solder will cause the whole piece to pop apart during tinning or heating of the piece (has totally happened to me), use a clamp right on the seam to hold it before heating and tinning and see if that helps.
Hello sara
I want to know where to buy the correct tinning product in UK
I need the full name of it please
Hello! I'm not sure where you'd buy any of this in the UK. Yikes! I'm not sure what you mean by the tinning product. Do you mean the flux? If so, it's Harris Stay Clean. If it's the tin, it's pure tin solder (lead-free) and usually 99.6% pure tin with .4% copper, through Johnson Mfg based in the Midwest in the USA. That's what I use.
House Copper & Cookware
Dear Sara thanks for the reply
Where I can buy this flux in the UK please?
On eBay there’s two types of Harris flux
Thanks
I'm curious about silver plated Cooper, is that done?
It used to be, but the only person doing it...isn't anymore. One needs a furnace SO hot it almost melts copper/smelts to melt the silver due to silver's extremely high melting point vs tin's.
@@housecopper do you do repairs? I've a small copper 8in saute with brass handle that needs tin
@@jeeppayton Yes sir I do! You can email us at copperassistant AT gmail.com and Katie or I will get ya an estimate. :)
Hi can you please tell me where to buy tin bar & spray & also provide the brand name of spray.
thanks for video.
I typically buy my tin from Johnson Manufacturing - you can buy online in many different size tin bars, just be sure it is lead-free/food grade. The brand name of the flux is Harris, which you can find many places. I have also used Acro for flux.
@@housecopper Can you please post a link? Ive searched Johnsons site and cant find the tin bar.
Okay, time for a stupid question:
As you well know, the bottoms and corners of cookware tend to lose their tin first...
What's to stop a nincompoop from just taking their worn cookware, smoothing and cleaning the bottom, sticking it on their stove, melting some tin pellets inside it, and wiping?
Like, I'm sure it would be ugly and suboptimal, but would it technically *work*?
(I may or may not have found an enormous stockpot which has lost some tin only at the base... 😬)
lol, it is not a stupid question, it is a GREAT question!! And here's the answer: NOTHING is stopping you from smoothing and cleaning the interior (use sandpaper and wash it really good!), getting some flux, melting pellets, heating and wiping! I don't know what you have on hand for flux that is food safe, but if you can get your hands on it and some lead-free food safe solder, you can totally do this! (Use paper towel to wipe if you don't have cotton swabbing or insulation) Because yes, it won't be insanely pretty but it will totally work!! I want to hear how it goes!!!
@@housecopper you rock for answering! However, I think you've overestimated my intelligence 🤣
I was asking if it were technically possible to completely eschew flux-to literally just plop some tin pellets on the bottom of a freshly-sanded pan bottom, heat it on the kitchen stove, and spread out the tin as it melts.
I ask because it sounds like most flux compounds are *not* going to be things I'd want to risk breathing in, which means working on a kitchen stove would be potentially dangerous.
@@DGFishRfine1 OH!! lololol! You are intelligent! You are getting this! :)
Anyway, no, it is not really possible to patch without flux of some kind - you need it to facilitate the molecular bonding between copper and tin or even tin and tin. Without it, it sort of frosts off, or "cold solders" so it pops off.
You can try something super old school that isn't chemical as flux...soap! Like Borax!! Or pine tree rosin - which is the original 1700s flux, and is literally dried pine sap. There will be some brown residue, but you can remove that with rubbing alcohol. And it would be all natural! :)
Have you or your mentor ever tinned a colander? How would you avoid tinning the outside as well?
Curtis McCartney yes-we have done colander-like projects. While I haven’t done a big colander, I’d recommend lining the outside with a lime (like powdered garden lime) and water paste, letting it dry, and then tinning the inside. It’s not going to be easy or perfect, but that should help for the most part. :)
Thanks for the advice! I have access to Johnson J 33 flux at work, would that be suitable?
I personally wouldn't use the 33 - it's still active after you're done heating I believe, and not sure it's considered food safe in case you leave any residue, etc. If you can get your hands on some original Johnson's, you might be better off. Also, isn't the 33 for galvanized? I would worry it etches the copper, too. I mean, I have never used the 33 myself, but I wouldn't personally. Just my two cents!
I don't know what 33 is made for, but nothing works better for soldering zinc, which is what we use it for. I think we may have a bottle of the original around, Have you used it? How about tallow? that's food safe for sure.
I believe the 33 is for galvanized tin or steel, and obviously it works for zinc LOL. I haven't used the original myself, (I use Harris Stay Clean or Acro, as does Bob) but it seems like the most likely of Johnson's to be food safe. You could always call them - they are awesome and helpful. As for tallow, I have heard of it used as a natural flux for welding/stained glass. I'm more familiar with rosin / pine resin as a flux, which is traditional and also food safe. Just be aware the rosin (and likely the tallow) leaves behind a tough brown residue that you need to remove with your fingernail or alcohol. :)
Do you have a recommendation for where I can get a tinning rod?
A tinning rod? No - I don't use them and none of the tinner's I work with use them. Unless you're talking about a bar/rod of pure tin solder? Then go to Johnson Manufacturing.
@@housecopper yes, a bar or rod of tin. Thank you for the recommendation.
@@housecopper which tin rod would you recommend from Johnson mfg to tin a large copper bowl? Thank you again.
@@dk4130bmx You need less than you probably think you need. If this is the only thing you're doing, go to a local hardware store and get a small spool of 100% pure tin solder and use those thin lengths as your own mini-rods.
@@housecopper that makes sense. Thank you again for your time
Professionally perfect presentation.
Rob Radencic awesome alliteration:) and...Thank you!!
Love the videos, thank you for sharing your knowledge. How can i remove the old tin if i don't have access to a media blaster?
You can use a hand drill with a metal removing attachment. It takes a bit longer and you have to be careful not to overload your drill motor, but an attachment like this from Home Depot works: www.homedepot.com/p/Avanti-Pro-4-in-x-1-in-Non-Woven-Drill-Mount-Quick-Strip-Disc-PNW040100D01G/202830913. I also have used a Dremel with different attachments to get into the cracks around the rivets and in the radii of the bases.
@@housecopper thank you . The drill attachment looks very aggressive would i finish with a finer grit and clean with acid? Looks like a dream job for you, but im sure you work very hard.
You don't need to unless you want. It's not as aggressive as you think. You'll have to use some elbow grease, I promise. :) It won't leave as much of a residual mark as you think, either, but you could always finish with a sand flap, like this: www.homedepot.com/p/Lincoln-Electric-3-in-x-1-in-80-Grit-MTD-Flap-Wheel-KH156/202938567 or just a scotch-brite pad. After it's ready and before you tin, clean with water, dry, then a muriatic acid or something along those lines before starting to tin. And yes, it's a wonderful job, but a heck of a lot of physical work. :) Thanks for watching!
@@housecopper Is it entirely necessary to remove the old tin before retinning? I am in the process of trying to retin an old pot and am having trouble getting a nice even finish. I will be getting a better liquid flux (been using a paste), and some fiberglass wadding. However, I am wondering if the tin that is left in the pot may be causing a problem?
It's necessary to get most of the old tin out - any dark oxidized tin should be out at the very least. Also, if you don't have a blaster, you could use caustic acid, then go to an orbital sander, or some 80 grit paper, then muriatic acid, then tin. You need to get around the rivets, and you need to get all the dark out so it looks light and the copper is showing out in some places. Sometimes you're battling the grade of the copper itself - some copper isn't as pure and doesn't hold the tin as well. Sometimes it's the flux. Lots of times there is not enough flux, or the pot gets too hot, or the pot isn't hot enough. It's a huge learning curve, so give yourself some slack. :) As long as the copper is covered up, it is food safe and usable. If you want it to look smooth and perfect, that takes time and lots of practice and you'll always have wipe marks or swirls, or little drips even after 20 years. Liquid flux is definitely better than a past for this, too. And yes, if there's old build up, it can give you a little trouble. Every pot is different. :) Good luck!
Let me join the chorus of thankful people:) Will this work on brass the same way?
So appreciate the thanks! And yes, tinning works on brass, too (it is nonferrous, just like copper). I have tinned brass pots before and it works exactly the same!
please come to india u will see people doing this thing without gloves .this is an age old process in india .this is called "kalai" here
I love learning that it is a called "Kalai". Though I would not feel OK without using proper protection! Yikes!
@@housecopper it is called Kalhai or Kalai. its been done literally 100s of years. Use that as youtube keyword search and there are several videos of how they do it. Sadly, the people doing it never made much money, and now, due to switch to nonstick and stainless cookware, these workers cannot make living wage tinning.
no toxic fumes? while tinning..
As long as you have ventilation, don't worry about it. Doing it outside helps tremendously. And the toxicity happens just when you spray the flux and all the white comes up. I usually just hold my breath until those white plumes disappear. If I'm doing a ton of tinning at one time, I wear a respirator (you can get breathing masks on Amazon for inexpensive).
we have respirators left from the lava gases....
Well there you go.... :)
Hllo
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