Fireless steam locomotives are actually still useful in many parts of the modern world, mainly in factories and industrial facilities that produce a lot of excess steam but deal with dangerous chemicals that could be ignited by an internal combustion engine, such as a diesel or petrol engine, or cause an unexpected spark, such as with an electrical engine. Most of the time they do not venture far from their source so range is not an issue, and the purpose-built ones can sit for hours without losing their pressure, making them more economical than, say, an idling diesel engine.
Hmm I understand why this has been done. But of course such locomotives unless fitted with reducing valves, square cylinder dimensions etc etc. Will never be as effective as conventional fireless locomotives. But of course they are available and cheap. I know that a couple of O& K fireless locomotives went to PG Semboro Sugar Mill. But I am not sure if they are still at work. Interestingly the largest user of fireless locomotives on Java historically was the BTM (Batavia Steam Tramway) which between the 1880's and the 1930's had a fleet of Hohenzollern built 0-4-0 fireless tram engines. (Hohenzollern built the first industrial fireless for SKODA in mid 1880's. A very similar locomotive built in 1888 which was supplied to Grube Fohnsdorf near Judenberg in Austria. When the Colliery closed in 1978 the locomotive was preserved at the pit). The last conventional Fireless locomotives to be built were the 202 'FLC' 52t 0-6-0F locomotives built in the DDR at the DR works at Meiningen in Thuringia between 12/1983 and 3/1988. These locomotives were based on an LKM design the last examples being built in 1970. The design being originally a pre WW II O&K design (LKM being the old O&K works in Babelsberg, Berlin). The "Plan" originally was to build 250 standard gauge locomotives between 1983 & 1989. With a further 50 5' gauge locomotives for the USSR in 1990-1991. But of course the DDR and the USSR collapsed before the programme was completed. At least five survive in service in Germany with a solitary example 'WALTER' working at the Mondi Buisness Paper AG Mill in Ulmerfeld-Hausmeining in Austria. I noticed that you mention compressed air locomotives. I only know of two compressed air locomotives being used in Java. Both of which were built by H.K.Porter in Pittsburgh, USA. They were supplied to a gold mine (as I am in bed now I don't have access to my notes !) Compressed Air locomotives were used extensively in the mining industry both in North America and in Europe. The last new examples being the 9 Konstal Lpd45 locomotives built in Chorzow, Upper Sielesia, Poland. For the local coal industry between 1988 and 1992. (Basically these locomotives were only built by Konstal because Arn Jung had ceased building the their Pz45 design in 1987. Again the last Jung compressed air locomotives were built for the Polish coal industry. Also the Lpd45 used the same Jung 4-cylinder air motor as the Pz45 ). It is possible that a few of the Jung Pz45 locomotives are still capable of working in Upper Sielesian Collieries. In the early 1960's the Czechoslovakian builder CKD/TSM copied the Jung Pz45 design and between 1964 and 1974 the BVD40 was built in Slovakia by ZTS and PHS (who were subsidiary companies of TSM). These locomotives were supplied not only to the Czechoslovakian mining industry. As examples were supplied to Poland and to the USSR and it is believed that some may still be at work in the deep mines in the Donbass in Russia and Ukraine.
Perhaps the same time as a conventional steam locomotive, bearing in mind that not all the water drops its total capacity of about 3/4 of the cilinder as the remainder is superheated steam. Meanwhile note that this locomotive is converted from a conventional and might need more regular charges as it seams to waste much more steam than a originally built fireless engine, due to conections to smoke box and others not been sealed. Hope it helps.
I remember when 1973 74 I was born at Dolopo Madiun not so far from Pagotan every morning little train use their way on the Ward of my grand mother house in mbatil PLN Dolopo Madiun east java
Again an amazing video from you. Again very well filmed and edited. Sad to hear, that they are stopping step by step to use steam. Hopefully some of the engines can be saved. Thumbs up! :) Greetings Mega
How do they stop the steam turning back into water while in the boiler cause if the steam hits the cold boiler then it will condense back into water but they can’t use a fire in the loco as 1 there would be no point in converting them and 2 if they had a fire in the loco still it would melt the fuseable plugs or cause the crown to bow
In the netherlands is a loc also running running onze a museum line Wat is the working press of this loc Gr from the netherlands HSM steam line Hoorn Medemblik
As stated in the description above, these were conventional steam engines built in the 1920's that were converted to fireless working in 2011. It was just simply left on.
No. Although some fireless locomotives run on compressed air, these run on steam. These fireless steam locomotives have had their boilers converted to a reservoir called a steam accumulator. This reservoir is charged with superheated water under pressure from a stationary boiler. The engines work like a conventional steam engine using the high pressure steam above the water in the accumulator. As the steam is used and pressure drops, the superheated water boils, replacing the used steam. The locomotive can work like this until the pressure has dropped to a minimum useful level or the water runs out, after which it has to be recharged.
Depends on how much work they are doing. It looked like they re-charged when convenient which was after they had completed a shunt of a rake of wagons into the mill.
@@EvenFurtherRail people there called them lunggus/angus/awu. I used to play by passing by or kicking that because it's so dusty..it's really fun to passing by that bagasse although it's actually dangerous..some people ever told me that bagasee still save some heat/fire spark inside
@@EvenFurtherRail thank you for uploading these loco, knowing that they are still functioning just make me glad...i hope that they will have their steam forever unlike their other friends in nearest northern neighborhood (Kanigoro sugar factory)
Pagotan Sugar Mill (PG) is operated by state-owned firm PT Perkebunan Nusantara (PTPN) XI. It is not thought to be the original Dutch East India Company Mill, but occupies the same site.
Pabrik gula pagotan adalah pabrik peningalan belanda yang ingin menguasai indonesia sebelum merdeka lalu dimanfaatkan oleh masyarakat agar tidak terbengkalai sekaligus menjadi monumen bahwa belanda pernah menjajah indonesia ada banyak pabrik gula di madiun karena madiun adalah tempat sterategis
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Fireless steam locomotives are actually still useful in many parts of the modern world, mainly in factories and industrial facilities that produce a lot of excess steam but deal with dangerous chemicals that could be ignited by an internal combustion engine, such as a diesel or petrol engine, or cause an unexpected spark, such as with an electrical engine. Most of the time they do not venture far from their source so range is not an issue, and the purpose-built ones can sit for hours without losing their pressure, making them more economical than, say, an idling diesel engine.
Hmm I understand why this has been done. But of course such locomotives unless fitted with reducing valves, square cylinder dimensions etc etc. Will never be as effective as conventional fireless locomotives. But of course they are available and cheap. I know that a couple of O& K fireless locomotives went to PG Semboro Sugar Mill.
But I am not sure if they are still at work.
Interestingly the largest user of fireless locomotives on Java historically was the BTM (Batavia Steam Tramway) which between the 1880's and the 1930's had a fleet of Hohenzollern built 0-4-0 fireless tram engines.
(Hohenzollern built the first industrial fireless for SKODA in mid 1880's. A very similar locomotive built in 1888 which was supplied to Grube Fohnsdorf near Judenberg in Austria. When the Colliery closed in 1978 the locomotive was preserved at the pit). The last conventional Fireless locomotives to be built were the 202 'FLC' 52t 0-6-0F locomotives built in the DDR at the DR works at Meiningen in Thuringia between 12/1983 and 3/1988.
These locomotives were based on an LKM design the last examples being built in 1970. The design being originally a pre WW II O&K design (LKM being the old O&K works in Babelsberg, Berlin).
The "Plan" originally was to build 250 standard gauge locomotives between 1983 & 1989.
With a further 50 5' gauge locomotives for the USSR in 1990-1991. But of course the DDR and the USSR collapsed before the programme was completed.
At least five survive in service in Germany with a solitary example 'WALTER' working at the Mondi Buisness Paper AG Mill in Ulmerfeld-Hausmeining in Austria.
I noticed that you mention compressed air locomotives.
I only know of two compressed air locomotives being used in Java.
Both of which were built by H.K.Porter in Pittsburgh, USA.
They were supplied to a gold mine (as I am in bed now I don't have access to my notes !)
Compressed Air locomotives were used extensively in the mining industry both in North America and in Europe. The last new examples being the 9 Konstal Lpd45 locomotives built in Chorzow, Upper Sielesia, Poland.
For the local coal industry between 1988 and 1992.
(Basically these locomotives were only built by Konstal because Arn Jung had ceased building the their Pz45 design in 1987. Again the last Jung compressed air locomotives were built for the Polish coal industry. Also the Lpd45 used the same Jung 4-cylinder air motor as the Pz45 ). It is possible that a few of the Jung Pz45 locomotives are still capable of working in Upper Sielesian Collieries.
In the early 1960's the Czechoslovakian builder CKD/TSM copied the Jung Pz45 design and between 1964 and 1974 the BVD40 was built in Slovakia by ZTS and PHS (who were subsidiary companies of TSM).
These locomotives were supplied not only to the Czechoslovakian mining industry. As examples were supplied to Poland and to the USSR and it is believed that some may still be at work in the deep mines in the Donbass in Russia and Ukraine.
How often does the boiler/tank need to be recharged? How long does that process take? Inquiring minds want to know.
Perhaps the same time as a conventional steam locomotive, bearing in mind that not all the water drops its total capacity of about 3/4 of the cilinder as the remainder is superheated steam. Meanwhile note that this locomotive is converted from a conventional and might need more regular charges as it seams to waste much more steam than a originally built fireless engine, due to conections to smoke box and others not been sealed. Hope it helps.
Interesting
I always watching this train passing by when i was kid, there were more steam loco back then
I remember when 1973 74 I was born at Dolopo Madiun not so far from Pagotan every morning little train use their way on the Ward of my grand mother house in mbatil PLN Dolopo Madiun east java
Love the racing stripes
Again an amazing video from you. Again very well filmed and edited. Sad to hear, that they are stopping step by step to use steam. Hopefully some of the engines can be saved. Thumbs up! :)
Greetings
Mega
Some....
No, all of them are worth it!
Pagotan 8 is used to have superheater components inside the boiler until converted to fireless in 2011, if I not wrong
How do they stop the steam turning back into water while in the boiler cause if the steam hits the cold boiler then it will condense back into water but they can’t use a fire in the loco as 1 there would be no point in converting them and 2 if they had a fire in the loco still it would melt the fuseable plugs or cause the crown to bow
Its extra superheated water that is injected into the boiler evaporates into steam if I remember,
I hope to be rich when they're retired, so I can buy one
Get that lottery ticket now!
In the netherlands is a loc also running running onze a museum line
Wat is the working press of this loc
Gr from the netherlands
HSM steam line Hoorn Medemblik
Steam is always reliable
Fireless Steam locomotives can save Earth it doesn’t need coal
Why does the engine have a spark arrester if it's fireless?
As stated in the description above, these were conventional steam engines built in the 1920's that were converted to fireless working in 2011. It was just simply left on.
Basically now running on compressed air.
No. Although some fireless locomotives run on compressed air, these run on steam. These fireless steam locomotives have had their boilers converted to a reservoir called a steam accumulator. This reservoir is charged with superheated water under pressure from a stationary boiler. The engines work like a conventional steam engine using the high pressure steam above the water in the accumulator. As the steam is used and pressure drops, the superheated water boils, replacing the used steam. The locomotive can work like this until the pressure has dropped to a minimum useful level or the water runs out, after which it has to be recharged.
@@EvenFurtherRail
thanks
I wonder how long these last between charges, being as they are not designed to run as fireless locomotives...
Depends on how much work they are doing. It looked like they re-charged when convenient which was after they had completed a shunt of a rake of wagons into the mill.
Rifleman Moore strange
Rifleman Moore i
How is that loco drunk again its always steamin
kool
if these were 3 foot gauges I'd want one to return to coal fired
They'd be harder to operate then
yep a novel idea for limited use, and, you get rid of your waste, cuba uses alcohol to run its cars
What's baggasse? Great video, btw.
It is the dry fibrous matter that remains after sugarcane stalks are crushed to extract their juice.
@@EvenFurtherRail people there called them lunggus/angus/awu. I used to play by passing by or kicking that because it's so dusty..it's really fun to passing by that bagasse although it's actually dangerous..some people ever told me that bagasee still save some heat/fire spark inside
I hope it has brought back happy memories.
@@EvenFurtherRail thank you for uploading these loco, knowing that they are still functioning just make me glad...i hope that they will have their steam forever unlike their other friends in nearest northern neighborhood (Kanigoro sugar factory)
@@farhanalifadhani6407 Filmed at Kanigoro just before it closed :-
ruclips.net/video/KAcsdbyDLGU/видео.html
They don't look like they started out as fireless steam locomotives.
They are conversions. The details are are described above.
Oh yea, I must have skipped that, I usually don't skip the video details, my bad sorry!
I guess they stayboats in the firebox corroded so they decided to just seal them off and make them fireless!
Raymond Leggs the stays will still have to be there... they use it as fireless to prevent fires.
PG PAGOTAN IS THE BEST
Is this the old sugar company called Pagottan from somewhere 1850 (?), then I like to know more about it. Can someone inform me?
Pagotan Sugar Mill (PG) is operated by state-owned firm PT Perkebunan Nusantara (PTPN) XI. It is not thought to be the original Dutch East India Company Mill, but occupies the same site.
Thanks.
Pabrik gula pagotan adalah pabrik peningalan belanda yang ingin menguasai indonesia sebelum merdeka lalu dimanfaatkan oleh masyarakat agar tidak terbengkalai sekaligus menjadi monumen bahwa belanda pernah menjajah indonesia ada banyak pabrik gula di madiun karena madiun adalah tempat sterategis
I bet runing outa steam happens a lot.
Probably not. the drivers know how much they can do and make sure not to embarrass themselves.
A regular fireless loco can run for 8 hours.
Masuk ke bagian dalam pabrik pg pagotan ruclips.net/video/KaHnivb6SAI/видео.html
How many people, when they read the title of this video, thought "Coffee powered locomotives"?
Atomsk102 not going to lie, I had a moment for a second.