Can You Stop My Turn 4 Infinite Vesuvan Duplimancy Combo? | Standard
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- Опубликовано: 4 июн 2024
- How good is the turn four infinite combo of Vesuvan Duplimancy and Outcaster Trailblazer in Standard? Let's find out!
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11:07 I think the game was lost here when you didn’t use open mana to cast the otherworldly gaze to dig for lands.
Thought so as well, bummer
He could have cast the Duplimancy off the mana from the free plotted card ETB. One block was enough to prevent lethal, then he could combo off next turn.
Came here to say this. He's right that he lost because he didn't find the 4th land but didn't realise that that was actually his fault XD
Couldn’t he have at around 11:50 used the plotted trailblazer to have the 4 mana for the duplimamcy then combo on the next turn
Yeah, it's awkward to Gaze when you already know you want the top card of your deck, but in this case it was probably worth it even though we weren't getting full value.
When you target your own stuff with Fading Hope, hold full control so you can respond to the trigger and cast another spell to maximize draws / minimize fizzles.
20:40 That awkward moment when Timely Interference ruins your whole combo. I had some nasty bombs incoming 😁. Glad it made you laugh. Also nice innovative deck! GGs
Seth: "Lets find out if this deck is competitive"
Also Seth: * plays best of one. *
"Destroy target creature" and "destroy target enchantment" at instant speed and the deck loses
Totentanz is not totenzan. I blame Phil for not correcting this.
literally couldnt bear listening to that mispronunciation lol
tottnzän
Since when has correcting Seth worked?
Germans have entered the chat
im starting to think they’re mispronouncing things on purpose
Glad to see you pilot this combo! I rode it a few days to mythic. The one tweak I figured out for sure after I brewed it was that Homestead Courage is a must-have, it allows a guaranteed double cast
I think you conceded early at 12:40. You could have blocked a 1/1 and the recruiter. Then if you draw a land you can go duplimancy plus spell in the next turn
yeah I don't know what he was thinking there
As a limited player just going to point out that both take the fall and timely interference are both highly playable cards in their respective formats. Take the fall is a crime enabler that can often let you win a combat and go up a card (-4/-0 if you control an outlaw) and timely interference was in DMU which had a potent aggro UR spells deck as well as the 5/5 ward 2 serpent that got cheaper for every instant and sorcery in your graveyard. I've run upwards of 4 or 5 timely interferences and often play two in dimir decks to cantrip and drop early serpents
21:49 Props to Fellow Mtg RUclipsr Xaero staying in and taking the beats
😆
Hey Seth, what are the odds that the person who sent the email and the one who made that reddit post was the same person?
9:43 he mentions it here
I thought that at first, but the two lists were different, so I'm guessing it was to different people (although maybe it was the email person and they updated their build before putting it on reddit).
I wouldn't say it's necessarily against the odds but...
@@MTGGoldfish I made a few tweaks inbetween, and some after that, I'm always brewing
Isn't Duplimancy staying in standard still(Around 35 minutes in)? I though it was the Innistrad, Kamigawa and Capenna sets rotating out in July? Regardless, this was a glorious combo. Excellent work Seth!
Try Curator of Sun's Creation + Vesuvan Duplimancy
You’re right. DMU is not part of the rotation. Duplimancy, Sheoldred and friends are staying a while
You're right, aside from the month they rotate. They rotate when Duskmourn releases, Q4.
@@bondeulv wrong DMU rotates next year
@@bondeulv rotation is with Bloomburrow
When Seth said take the fall wasn’t limited playable, I cried internally
Timely interference was also great in it's format (the U spells deck)
8:49 if you had played a land and cast one of the Otherworldly Gazes, you would have found the song to give out haste.
20:05 looks like your cantrips turned out to be can'trips
Such fun cards. I cooked some people in limited with a Calamity, Galloping Inferno and Outcaster Trailblazer. Definitely strong potential.
I wonder if the deck should play Bitter Reunion in it. The deck seems like it doesn't really do anything until you start to combo off, but you still need ways to get to the combo. Bitter Reunion helps you dig to your combo pieces and then when you go off, you just sac the enchantment to give your creatures haste.
As currently constructed, it doesn't need any red mana in the land base. Whereas, Bitter Reunion would likely force the deck to go to a full Temur land base. It only gets the red for Song and Ascestral from the Outlawers. I see where you're coing from, but I'm not sure if the extra strain on the land base is worth fitting in the copies of Bitter Reunion.
@@blueredlover1060 it’s not like you need a ton of red to go off with the deck as is and with the way lands are in standard right now, adding a few dual lands isn’t going to kill the deck especially if it’s for a card that makes the deck more consistent.
Probably just didn't want to play any red lands
@@dashkataey1740 true, but even a seemingly small change can completely screw up the dynamic of the deck. You may only need 4 or 5 lands, but each one of them adds a point of failure to the deck overall. Because there's always the chance that you won't be able to cast your spells on time to get there. Once again, I like the idea, but I'm not sure if making that change is worth while, especially when several cards in the current build are rotating out with Bloomburrow.
@@blueredlover1060 I’m not saying you have to take out song, but just adding a few cards to make it more consistent would be good. Bitter reunion isn’t a must play card for the deck, but just having a turn two play to set yourself up for a minimum cost isn’t bad.
Who is Totenzan? Is he a friend of Sir Cootious Route?
Fr I hate it
Don't forget Throon and Niko Bow-less
11:07 should’ve used an Otherworldly Gaze here, to try to get a land under the Trailblazer. You had the mana, you had 3 of them, better than risking it on the top-deck!
Yeah that poison control game, shoulda ran out the duplimancy after playing your 7th land on 2 poison counters. That makes a single bring the ending useless.
Right, he could have paid the 2 for most counters in standard
This is a hilarious deck! Also, that punt against toxic control hurt XD
I would love to see more of that land destruction artifact deck you showed a while back!
This is awesome. I'm definitely going to feature this on my channel at some point.
I think it's normally right to bounce the real trailblazer with fading hope, especially if you had to make it smaller with some of the cantrips
This is a neat concept. I want to try and find a home for this in Commander.
This deck strikes me as not so much "glass cannon" as "talcum powder cannon."
So about the problem of finding the haste enabler; I think that if you are careful about what you do, you should always be able to virtually draw exactly your deck because of fading hopes and non cantrips.
To prove it mathematically would be quite complex, but you can choose to draw less or more cards by either playing a cantrip or fading hope. Normally if you play 9 spells you'll be drawing 45 cards +1 for each cantrip. However if you fading hope as your Xth spell you can draw 9-X cards less. Unless you're very unlucky and both your fading hopes and haste enabler are on the bottom of your library, you should be able to control how many cards you're drawing and plan it all out.
Edit: for example with a turn 4 combo, after the 5th spell, the most difficult number would be 25 cards, which would require 3 consecutive fading hopes + a non-cantrip to draw exactly 25.
You *may* have had it at 33:30 , the only counterspells they run are quenches unless you have 3 or more poison counters, and you were only at 2. I think it was probably your only out
2:46 it feels a little risky to have only one copy of Song, if it’s at the very bottom, you could deck yourself trying to draw it. Sure you could have all copies of it on the bottom if you had multiple, but it massively decreases the odds and gives you a buffer.
Edit: well then, didn’t expect it to happen in the first match
This guys delivery reminds me so much of chills
Been playing duplimancy since domunited. Stoked to finally see the card finally get some respect
The Soul Partion game reminds me how much new players really need to learn “see weird card, destroy weird card”. If you don’t understand why your opponent is playing a strange card, the more you should respect it!
I'm just watching the Tech Deck, and I'm already laughing hard... This is so fun to watch
How do you get the cards you need for these matches in Arena? Is there a way to buy singles in Arena?
In game 1 you had 13 cards in deck with 8 draws off trailblazer and access to a land play for 1 more mana if you used the mana from a land to play a gaze and milled 3 if song wasnt among them then used a cantriping target that would have drawn all but 1 card in your deck maximizing the chances of hitting song.
I'm wondering if the Surveil lands might be helpful in this deck, especially for the digging
This combo is nuts, I love it
Been playing the Duplimancy in jank Pioneer decks, and it does go crazy. Also, Outcaster in the Dopplegang Ping deck is OUTRAGEOUS!! People are sleeping on this card!
I’ve used Duplimancy to make tons of Urabrask for tons of mana and also with tons of Annointed Peacekeeper to lock out the opponent.
This looks awesome
I run a copy in my Rotpriest deck. So much fun
That sounds sweet!
@@MTGGoldfish I can't get the deck out right now, but it's similar to this. Sultai colors with the goal of getting a Rotpriest down with the duplimancy. We have Storm chaser Drakes to help draw cards, Ivy, the legendary fairy, to help apply more Rotpriest triggers, and some protection spells. Royal treatment is really good with an Ivy on board. I main 3 march of swirling mist for sweeper protection or just to get that extra Rotpriest trigger or to take things off the board for a turn. I also run some scam cards. Had to use Fake your own death because my shop didn't have Not dead after all. But the treasure has come in clutch. Another filler, but still scam, is necrogene communion. Black enchantment that gives Toxic 2 and brings back the creature when it dies. A lot of fun.
I once played against a deck that was a Zur Duplimancy deck. The Deck was based around Zur and a bunch of instant speed protection. Once zur and duplimancy is down you make duplimancy a creature and target it with a spell and it makes a copy of it which multiplies exponentially with each targeting and aslong as you protect zur with the spells you cant interact with the duplimancys. It caught me completely off guard and seemed like i fun brew i always wanted to make a deck similar to it.
I've been using this deck for a little while, too, and I found that white works as a much better splash than red because of Homestead Courage, which flashes back in case you don't draw another targeting card.
Keep in mind you don't actually need to splash any white mana to cast it. Since trailblazer makes a mana of any color, and that's the only mana you'll use to cast it. Splashing white just helps you restart a fizzled combo or in some very janky scenarios to scrape a desperate win, which might matter less than diluting the mana base. Conduit Pylons is a great option since it surveils to dig for pieces but is also untapped so you can turn 1 island gaze, turn 2 pylons flashback gaze and surveil 7 instead of 6
@@goomshill True. Great point.
Could you put Ivy into the deck for multiple targets per cast?
I like Vesuvan Duplimancy with Rox, the new Cat Druid. I use Witness the future to get the little targeting spells back into the deck, and eventually get Paradox engine out. Don't even need to go for a Jace win... the metorites usually are enough damage to kill if the opponent doesn't just scoop right away. I was using Garruk enchantment (trample is nice if it had to come to that) but Trailblazer could be fine too. All the Rox mana buffs stack so after a couple casts you can tap mana tokens for 3+ each... makes for fun big cost stuff too.
Reminds me of my old blistercoil weird jeskai ascendancy combo deck in modern
Okay, first off: I love this show!!! Bought the signed Tokens already :)
And since it's immensely funny to me (for I know how to pronounce german) I wanted to point out: It's not totensan. it's toten tanz. as in tanzania. hahaha thanks and have a great day
Reminds me of my shorecrash copy deck for explore
this deck looks Hella similar too the venerated rotpiest deck you made a while back. I wonder if they got any legs together.
Seth calling Totentanz Tottenzan is so triggering as a German as "Totentanz" means dance of the dead which is pretty metal, but his pronunciation makes it sound like a word from Sims
At 14:58, you can Fading hope the smallest one to have enough damage to kill
I love seeing these extremely niche combo decks go off
Once the chain gets going you have to mind the cantrips in such a way that they draw to hit you to zero
35 cards in deck?
2nd TB - 1 card
3rd TB - 2 cards (3 total)
4th TB - 3 cards (6 total)
5th TB - 4 cards (10)
6th - 5 (15)
7th - 6 (21)
8th - 7 (28)
So along this chain you need 7 card draw cantrips to gaurantee hitting the haste
So even though this was uploaded 2 days ago, arena won't let me play it, and I have no clue why, any ideas?
If you have the chance, ask Phil how he pronounces 'Totentanz' and ask him About the 'Ratcatcher from Hameln' that story must be the origin, lore wise :)
My favorite deck vs. Sparky is a Duplimancy combo with Wingmantle Chaplain. It's too slow for competitive play, but man when Moonshaker Cavalry hits with max tokens, it's... well, usually a crashed game, but the most damage I've been able to achieve with it is a little over 500k. It also duplicates the Duplimancies, so shenanigans all around!
Save you can trips for the end targeting opponent creatures.
tried this deck for an hour and never once had the combo go off lol
Why not add venerated rot priest to speed up the clock with poison counter's?
in game 2 I think you could've played otherworldly gaze on untap to find the land and then draw and won but im not too sure
clicked on this video because i thought it sounded interesting. saw the gameplay going on in the first 5 seconds. understood what was happening and started laughing uncontrollably. 5/5 stars
I love this spell!
Could there be a Venerated Rotpriest hybrid version of this deck?
Yeah, there could be. It would slightly weekend the main combo because we'd have to cut some one mana targeting spells, but it would give us another way to win the game. Could be cool to try.
"Song of Totenzan"
its song of totentanz
never change seth i love you this wway
It feels like game 2 could've gone better.
He used Falling Hope at sorcery speed (could've waited and bounce something next turn)
Didn't use Otherwordly Gaze with 2 mana open (could've dumped the 2 cards after Diplomacy); that would've let him draw Boseiju 2 turns earlier.
Isn’t rotation only rotating out the 4 oldest sets? If so that’s only the two innistrad sets, kamigawa, and new capana. So this combo is still going to be in standard.
Maybe splice in white for Idyllic Tutor? Definitely could fizzle the combo at some points, but it would be a few more psudo copies of at least Duplomancy.
This is a cool combo but i hate non deterministic wincons which you demonstrated quite nicely this is
I would add Analyze the pollen maybe? More consistant to find the Trailblazer if you can't find it and it's one mana
To control draw so you don't deck out just return your own tokens to hand once you have enough to oneshot the opponent. You are still getting the new token as you targeted your own permanent but the card draw does not get out of hand.
Ivy in the deck to double up on casts seems fine
I feel like this deck gets much better with adventure creatures whose adventure works with the duplimancy combo.
What about the convoke. There is a blue draw card that can fit into the deck and help you get the combo.
It took me until, like, your fourth game to realize you're just casting Song for the Haste. I couldn't figure out the play without a positive mana gain.
Yo I have been working on a jeskai Knights/humans (runs 1 human matters card but all Knights that matter are human) deck for explorer and it's been going pretty hard. It's a super lord deck with 4 different lords. And blue gives counters
The human payoff is coppercoq5 vanguard
in the game against the poison deck i think you should have gone for it when you only had 2 poison because you could have paid the 2 for bring the ending, but once you had 4 poison its just a hard counterspell, so that was your best shot. thats my opinion at least as someone who played the poison deck for a while.
I think the deck would really benefit from incedental scry, just to pad out the bottom of the deck with non song cards
Need this for brawl
Gaia's blessing would work strangely well for mill issues
Second game I feel that if you had played the guy from plot and used the mana to play the duplicate. Then blocked with him, the following turn you'd be at 3 with a guy in hand and duplicate on the table. Dropping the guy gives you the mana to go off.
you should add bitter reuinion. it's card draw and gives haste
Nice Modest Mouse Tee
11:40 you could have won that game by casting the plotted Trailblazer to make the fourth mana to cast the Duplimancy, and that gives you one blocker. Next turn you cast the Trailblazer in hand, which gives you the one mana to combo off
so the deck really went 7-4, for a 63.6% win rate.
I want to see Slogurk plus flipped invasion of kaldheim
I think you should add rot priest to this deck. Alternate win condition
How does Totentanz turn into Totenzan?
If you combine this deck with a Venerated Rotpriest & Ivy Spellthief deck… it works real good!
I just built something similar and I'm yet to try this in ranked for more than a couple of games but when it goes off it goes off. You can also run one or two croaking counterparts, to either copy your rotpriest or opponent's atraxa or etali or whatever, and then copy it a few more times
Totentanz! It means “Death Dance” of “Dance of Death” in German.
33:16 you know they run the poison counter, which only taxes if they don't have 3 infect. i would have gone for it
Seth isn't Dominaria United rotating Next year? So Duplimancy is in for another year
This is one of those decks that that looks really good but whenever i try to play it I'll never see the combo and when I do iam either mana flooded or screwed 😂
Yeah I think the "2 songs" call is 100% right after that first game
That 3rd opponent was misplaying so much, its hilarious how no one on Arena knows how to play control
If you want to guard against your Totentanz being at the bottom of your deck, I suggest Loran's Escape, Daring Escape and/or Boon of Safety for their scrys. This way, you'll know what's on the bottom of your deck.
Vesuvan might work a lot better with buyback targeting cards
You can draw more/less cards with fading hope to target your whole deck. Also when you want more, not less, keep the fading on the bottom of the stack, don't resolve it...
This deck is great if you get a the vesuvan diplomacy and Outcaster Trailblazer in opening hand or in the first 4 draws. otherwise this is rough.
Couldn't you have still conboed off at 20:02 and attacked through their board?
Pausing early in the video to wonder if his real opponent is going to be the timer.
So what you're saying is that Control decks tend to match up well against Combo decks? :D
Also btw it's TotenTANZ... you know.. because you can Tanz if you want to, you can leave your friends behind...
I thought vesuvan diplomacy stayed after rotation?
Lost to this yesterday