I had this argument with my Russian friend a few months ago. She says she is not responsible and doesn't accept that all Russians are collectively responsible, as some are opposed and don't have any power anyway to stop things.
We keep saying to reach out to them. Will they reach out to us? Maybe better to not bother, really. So much energy has gone on trying so hard, that they feel no obligation. I'm waiting for a genuine acknowlegement
Yes, every Russian is responsible for this war. As for other wars started by their empire in the past, before Putin. Even the most independent poles showed Putin's raiting dramatically raised after 1) annexing Crimea 2) full-scale invasion in Ukraine.
Putin's war, of course. But Russia was always helped by the West - even during the so called Cold War. For more info read the books and watch videos by Alexander Bensch, Antony Sutton.
Again I'm not saying that these numbers are true but just trying to make you think it is the case by repeating it again, and again, and supporting the idea that it's the case. NO ! It wouldn't be asserting any false things !!! Never !!! I'm a really formal thinker and have the right to say it without saying it to imply it's true but accusing myself of the will I won't to exonerate myself. NEVER !!
Man this video is all about assumptions and mental masturbation. It lead to nothing but these 2 guys getting entitled with theirs own points of view trying to convince themselves of whatever mean nothing or is supported by some bias facts.
Yes, OK, but I didn't think Iraq a was a good idea but remember Saddam attacked Iran, invaded Kuwait, destroyed the oilfields and demonstrated that he was a problem and could have caused more problems unless he was dealt with.
@@stephensuddick1896 OK, but your implied contention that this was entirely understood before the action by America and it's allies is just preposterous. They didn't ask me, but I could have told them, - why ? Because my father was in Iraq in the military in about 1930.I asked him what they were doing there - he told me they were setting up a proper government - I asked him how it went - he said it was a waste of time, " you can't do anyrhing with Arabs, don't you ever go there, son, it'd be pointless and you might get killed !"
Well, although you frame it as collective blame, that is perjorative, I would frame it as collective responsibility, and as such there is no blame because of the reasons I mentioned, and, don't forget, the various dicussions at national and international level, UN etc, it was hardly a deliberate attempt to circumvent democratic processes,, ( although I personally thought a lot of it was contrived ). The worst that can be said is that it didn't go as planned, even though Saddam was deposed. It also had ramifications for the legitimacy of other Arab dictatorships. So I don't think 'blame' is appropriate, that implies someone doing something deliberately knowing that it was the wrong thing to do, ie at fault. Many people didn't sgree with it, and because of our democratic process they share responsibility, but cannot be blamed because it was entirely reasonable to assume a different outcome. Accidents are only blamed on a party that knew, or should have known, better, or acted outside the appropriate laws, otherwise it's a 'no fault' accident. - Is that any clearer ?
Thank you for a very interesting discussion! Would you consider uploading these talks as podcast episodes as well? :)
Thank you! This is something that we are planning to do.
Russian war. They do bear collective responsibility.
Good discussion!
Glad you found it useful!
I had this argument with my Russian friend a few months ago. She says she is not responsible and doesn't accept that all Russians are collectively responsible, as some are opposed and don't have any power anyway to stop things.
We keep saying to reach out to them. Will they reach out to us? Maybe better to not bother, really. So much energy has gone on trying so hard, that they feel no obligation. I'm waiting for a genuine acknowlegement
You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep
Important issue
Yes, every Russian is responsible for this war. As for other wars started by their empire in the past, before Putin. Even the most independent poles showed Putin's raiting dramatically raised after 1) annexing Crimea 2) full-scale invasion in Ukraine.
Wrong
Putin's war, of course. But Russia was always helped by the West - even during the so called Cold War.
For more info read the books and watch videos by Alexander Bensch, Antony Sutton.
Again I'm not saying that these numbers are true but just trying to make you think it is the case by repeating it again, and again, and supporting the idea that it's the case. NO ! It wouldn't be asserting any false things !!! Never !!! I'm a really formal thinker and have the right to say it without saying it to imply it's true but accusing myself of the will I won't to exonerate myself. NEVER !!
Man this video is all about assumptions and mental masturbation. It lead to nothing but these 2 guys getting entitled with theirs own points of view trying to convince themselves of whatever mean nothing or is supported by some bias facts.
of fault and contrition, before I would have the energy to reach out.
I blame the W. Bush administration for the Iraq war, but Americans, as a collective whole, share the blame. The same principle applies here.
Yes, OK, but I didn't think Iraq a was a good idea but remember Saddam attacked Iran, invaded Kuwait, destroyed the oilfields and demonstrated that he was a problem and could have caused more problems unless he was dealt with.
@@ericwillis777 It was an unmitigated geopolitical fiasco.
@@stephensuddick1896 OK, but your implied contention that this was entirely understood before the action by America and it's allies is just preposterous. They didn't ask me, but I could have told them, - why ? Because my father was in Iraq in the military in about 1930.I asked him what they were doing there - he told me they were setting up a proper government - I asked him how it went - he said it was a waste of time, " you can't do anyrhing with Arabs, don't you ever go there, son, it'd be pointless and you might get killed !"
@@ericwillis777 I'm having a hard time understanding where we are in disagreement.
Well, although you frame it as collective blame, that is perjorative, I would frame it as collective responsibility, and as such there is no blame because of the reasons I mentioned, and, don't forget, the various dicussions at national and international level, UN etc, it was hardly a deliberate attempt to circumvent democratic processes,, ( although I personally thought a lot of it was contrived ). The worst that can be said is that it didn't go as planned, even though Saddam was deposed. It also had ramifications for the legitimacy of other Arab dictatorships. So I don't think 'blame' is appropriate, that implies someone doing something deliberately knowing that it was the wrong thing to do, ie at fault. Many people didn't sgree with it, and because of our democratic process they share responsibility, but cannot be blamed because it was entirely reasonable to assume a different outcome. Accidents are only blamed on a party that knew, or should have known, better, or acted outside the appropriate laws, otherwise it's a 'no fault' accident. - Is that any clearer ?