Is Art Useless? / Reading Oscar Wilde's Preface Together
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- Опубликовано: 23 июл 2024
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Happy reading!
0:00 the obscenity trial of Oscar Wilde
1:00 the artist is the creator of beautiful things
1:20 beauty vs sublime
1:40 Plato and Socratic dialogues
2:10 to reveal art and conceal the artist is the artist's aim
2:30 Tolstoy and Anna Karenina
3:00 Victor Hugo, Sterne, Fielding, Austen
4:20 the critic of beautiful things
5:30 the need for positive critics
6:00 art criticism as the highest mode of autobiography
6:40 finding ugly meanings in beautiful things
9:30 James Baldwin's Notes of a Native Son
10:30 art for art's sake, symbolism, fin de siècle
11:20 protest novels and social utility
12:00 Tolstoy's What Is Art?
12:00 there is no such thing as an immoral book
13:00 the rage of Caliban
15:00 le mot juste, Joyce, Conrad, and the tension in art
16:00 ethical sympathies as unpardonable mannerisms of style
17:00 the condition of music and novel as highest art form
18:00 surface and symbol
19:20 disagreement about literature
20:00 the only excuse for making a useless thing
Hardcore Literature Book Club: / hardcoreliterature
Oscar Wilde Podcast: benjaminmcevoy.com/oscar-wild...
“All art aspires to the condition of music.” I don’t think that means it aspires to be energetic and frenzied (although some do), but more that it aspires to flow like music: every word, sentence, paragraph, scene, chapter integrated in the right place and having their own part to play. A musical book flows very beautifully and makes you keep reading. The novella Hadji Murat by Tolstoy, for example (which he worked on for 8 years, I think), is perfectly ordered in a musical way, as is The Brothers Karamazov.
Beautifully crystallised. Yes, I think you're right. I suppose there is "harmony" in all the arts - from painting to figure-skating. Hadji Murat is a wonderful example of a "musical" book. Tolstoy's masterpiece, and perhaps the book Hemingway wished he could have written? Thanks for the amazing comment :)
Are you sure that the brothers karamasov? Nabokov reproaches Dostoevsky's style, I have read in Spanish and it does not carry such a musicality :o
Also music can be enjoyed without understanding the words. Some of my favorite songs are spanish for example even though I don't know a word in spanish. So there is something about music that stands even above words.
This was so interesting! I haven't read much Wilde before (I really should change that), and this preface alone has so much to say. I also love 'The only excuse for making a useless thing is that one admires it intensely.' I'll have to get to The Picture of Dorian Gray soon :)
Thank you, Rhianna :) I think you'll love Wilde's novel - or, indeed, any of his works. I've been rereading The Importance of Being Earnest before bed recently and it does not fail to put a smile on my face. Do let me know what you make of Dorian Gray when you come to it!
Excellent video. I haven't read Wilde but I do want to. On the perfect use of an imperfect medium, you reminded me of this: “Perception of an object costs / Precise the Object's loss.”
Wow. Very nice comparison there - some Emily Dickinson :) Her and Nietzsche are the two foremost authorities on being unable to express in words what they hold in their soul. Thank you, Michael!
Really insightful. Thanks again. I’m working hard on writing, book reviews in particular for now. Your work is very helpful.
I'm so happy to hear that :) Happy writing, my friend!
17:45 Completely disagree. Words are the easiest way to say something. The most direct, the simplest way to convey an idea or sentiment. Now, being able to transmit the same through an arrangement of sounds or images... That's another level, that's art
ahhh I'm so happy that you did a video on this! I just finished the Picture Of Dorian Gray and love how Wilde explores morality and the layers and dimensions which it posseses, it's so fascinating. This might sound a bit odd but it also reminded me of Frankenstein in the sense that it investigates how as humans we have the ability to construct morally problematic and destructive beings. For example, Victor Frankenstein builds a monster comparable to how Lord Henry (and to an extent Basil) evoke the monster within Dorian Gray through their influence. Not sure though, just a thought. What did you think of the novel? :)
Thank you :) You know I don't think that's odd at all, because I drew the same comparison. You've put it beautifully - "it investigates how as humans we have the ability to construct morally problematic and destructive beings" - and they are both very much deep in the Gothic tradition. I know for a fact that Wilde was a disciple of Percy Bysshe Shelley's - who I believe had a strong hand in Mary's Frankenstein. At the least, he would have been a great first reader and strong Romantic/sublime influence upon my favourite horror novel of all time. I personally think Dorian Gray is a masterpiece - we have a Hardcore Literature Podcast episode out breaking it down. What a shame Wilde received such public scorn for such a beautiful, intensely moral work.
Oscar Wilde was not only controversial, but also contradictory, because if we accept that all the characters in his novel, plays, and short stories speak with the wit and the voice of Wilde, then he himself failed to conceal the artist, although he very much revealed Art.
He questions this though Basil I think? I chuckled at your comment because it made me look at Basil as breaking the 4th wall? 😅😅 I say this because of the preface that ‘to reveal art and conceal the artist is the point of art’ but we can hear Wilde all through the book with Basil being the most self aware of how much his soul could affect his audience? To the degree that he immediately is aware of what he has done by putting out his best, most honest work by sharing his passion for Dorian and knowing he doesn’t wish that level of honesty on anyone but still desires and chases after it
Haven't read any Wilde, but I just love listening to you.
Thank you :)
I loved this! The picture of Dorian Gray is the only classic that I have read and enjoyed to this day! And your thoughts on the preface were really interesting also how eloquent you are! I strive to be so clear and thoughtful with my reading and in life in general
Thank you, Kashish! Oscar Wilde is tremendous. If you enjoyed his Dorian Gray, you might like Stevenson's Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde and the short stories of Sherlock Holmes (similar atmosphere). Happy reading, my friend :)
@@BenjaminMcEvoy Thanks for the recommendation Benjamin! Would give it a shot btw I am new to this channel and to the world of reading fiction as well. If possible can you make a video about your fav non-fiction reads that aren’t the basic ‘self-help’ ones.
Ugly paintings that elicit an emotional response are art, it does not have to be a beautiful thing, Goya and Picasso's response to war are not pretty, but they are definitely art. Slaughterhouse 5 and Catch 22 are not easy reads but Vonnegut and Heller were artists. I loved The Picture of Dorian Gray, it was like a morality play. It is in being selfish, underhanded and dishonest in relationship that etched his attic appearance. Being indulgent in drink and drugs may pickle one for a brief time but everyone pays the piper eventually. Laurence Sterne, there is someone you don't hear about, I liked Tristam Shandy, but the one about the journey, not so much.
You're so right. And such wonderful examples - those Goya and Picasso paintings are brutal. And morality play is a really nice comparison. It's funny that Wilde ostensibly protests that art is not moral or immoral when Dorian Gray reads like a thoroughly moral tract.
Great comprehensive coverage
Thanks 😮
Thank you, Vanessa! :)
I am reading The Importance of Being Earnest by Oscar wilde and Zane eyre by Charlotte Bronte now.Any tips you want to give which can help me to read these?
For Earnest, you might want to listen to the John Gielgud radio play. But my main tip is to smile and enjoy the humour :)
I just finished reading the Uncensored version. Is there a difference between the Uncensored and the regular book?
I love your take on negativity. I realized lately that I don't like sharing my negativity with others but I like to write it down and look at it through this autobiographical lens. What this negativity says about myself? That's a fascinating question for me.
I have just started reading Dorian Gray. Three chapters in .. :) and found the preface quite interesting!
Let me know what you think of it :)
Very much appreciated this video. I'm about halfway through Picture of Dorian Gray, my first foray into the Oscar Wilde canon. I read the preface before launching into the novel but now, halfway into the book and hearing bits of the preface again here in your video, I believe he wrote the preface after the book and is giving us a lens in which to view the characters and the story,. I don't believe Art is useless or serves merely as something to be admired. I think Art can, and has, changed the world at times. Anyway, I take the preface in the context of the story and not as an independent essay about ART in the greater sense. I do have a question. Maybe it is because I am simultaneously working through Sharkespeare's sonnets at the same time I'm reading Dorian Gray...but I see a tremendous amount of parallel ideas between the two. I'm on Sonnet 31 so right in the midst of the Young Man sonnets. 29-30-31 seems so influencial to Oscar Wilde. Do you know if Oscar Wilde was a Shakespeare scholar ? Is this a common and obvious thing that I'm just discovering ?
You are brillian i was looking for someone I could understand try other channel they talk about book but I was bored listening to then just going through RUclips and I found you I say thank god
Thank you, Tommy. I really appreciate that and glad you're enjoying the videos :)
Hard to find an artist who’s relaxed about cultural critics. I wonder why. Even the ones that are well aware of the perfection and high worth of their own work are deeply hurt when unfairly criticised by any unqualified nobody. This foreword though I think is a bit tactical, a cunning plea of defense in a truly dangerous situation. Cunning and witty. I can’t take it all at face value but certainly each sentence is thought provoking and so is each of your comments that your quick brain produced. I’m always wondering how Wilde could be so openly camp and different and not only been tolerated but adored by the society of London and also by the crude American miners of Leadville. The fearlessness and discipline to maintain the spell over the people of his time for so long. The “gross indecency” that brought him down finally was with him all the way but suddenly the benevolence had been withdrawn from him. Why that? Certainly not because of Bosie’s father, who wasn’t popular at all neither a big beast in society. Was Oscar tired of his success and role? Did he want the smashing finale? Or was the society tired of her generosity or of himself?
“The artist is the creator of beautiful things.” His first line. I agreed with you before you said what I thought. (Somehow Wildesque this, what?)
Or would have disagreed with the author had I believed him here. My spontaneous thought went to Pasolini, another gay artist, whose film “Saló” (1976)can not possibly be said to be beautiful. Art though of highest quality it is. It forces the spectator to mirror the cruel sadistic parts of oneself in it. Because it is seductive, immoral, sexy and next thing extremely repulsive. Half of the public would leave the cinema in the middle of the film each time I watched it. Not sure if they were disgusted by what they’d watched on the screen or what unknown territory of their own shadow they had been thrown into with no warning.
Thank you for the video, I’ll be reading it for the second time after 4 decades, the first time in its original language. I’d love if you continued to grant us your company throughout.
I completely agree - I struggle to take it at face value too, and reads more like a self-conscious exemption from all charges. I think the lovely Oscar believed it all thoroughly at one point, but perhaps not post-trial. Beautiful meditations on the nature of camp and being adored. It is a truth, perhaps not universally acknowledged but most certainly true, that the overwhelming majority of our most treasured and dearly beloved artists since the dawn of time have not been heterosexual - but our definitions and cultural attitudes shift around us. I struggle to name a favourite writer who doesn't have a nuanced sexual identity: Wilde, Shakespeare, Baldwin, Aristotle, Whitman, Mishima, Proust. Thank you as always, Florian :)
This guys knows his books. I like how he pulls from all the classics
Thank you, Adam! I really appreciate that! :)
Fantastic! How did you become so articulate and eloquently spoken??
Thank you, Tom :) Hundreds and hundreds of hours of video and audio at this point means I've had a lot of practice. I've been speaking in public in different capacities for around a decade now.
last yr, i made a goal to read novels especially classics before i reach 30 🤭🤭🤫 i never read but i've been challenging myself, i'm starting to read classics now with dorian gray... this video is a great help... 😅
Wow :) Well done! That's such a great goal!
Then there is the transcendent moment when one suddenly sees the beauty in the ugly.
I have read for Oscar Wilde The fan of Windmair which is brilliant.
I agree :)
Thanks for this very useful and thorough video. Regarding the statement "the nineteenth century dislike of Romanticism is the rage of Caliban not seeing his own face in a glass", why did critics not like it or not recognise themselves in Romanticism?
I enjoyed especially your references to Nietzsche and Solzhenitsyn. A powerful interpretation of the preface. Here’s the confusing part. Why would one require forgiveness for the creation of a useful thing if the creator admires his work? The reason I ask is that the sentence seems a bit nonsensical and only seems to serve a a kind of poetic counter to to the next line, leading to the startling crescendo of the last line. Seems odd, or I’m obtuse. I don’t know. I loved your rendition and appreciate your work, sincerely.
Anything thought provoking is worthwhile.
I love they way broken it down little by little they mean it was brilliant I love oscar Wilde written I think he is brilliant he is my favourite poet
i love this video, but i'm curious as to why you say film is a lower art form? i agree that film is a more external art form, especially in recent years. inherently, films require a lot of people to create which does add to the separation. but that's precisely what i like about film (and tv as well), that it's a combination of different types of artists' skills that unite to create a cohesive whole. every single element, the directing, the writing, the acting, the cinematography, the sound, the score, etc., all done by different people, contributes to the final piece. it's less personal and there's a higher degree of separation, yes, but the collaborative nature of film is part of what makes it so fascinating to me. when all of these parts successfully work in harmony, i think that can create something quite remarkable.
film is simply a different art form with different goals and different capabilities, in my opinion. it's also rather new, barely being a hundred years old, while literature, music, and painting have existed for millennia. plus, film IS a combination of all of these different art forms. for example, movie scripts, just like play scripts, are considered literature and can be engaged with as such. colors, compositions, and symbolism in film have been analyzed and carefully considered just as paintings have. i'm less familiar with music, but i don't quite understand how a piece being composed for a film makes it lesser than if it was composed for a ballet or whatnot (if i'm getting your point)? i'm also a bit confused about how you say that you can't fully understand everything you see on screen in film, to be honest. frankly, i think that movies can be analyzed and engaged with just as literature, or paintings, or music can.
for me, really, there is no such thing as a 'highest' form of art, since they're all so different and they're all very valuable in their own right.
this is still a fantastic video however, i loved the picture of dorian gray, and the preface is a work of art in and of itself. thank you for sharing your thoughts, i'll definitely watch more
The morality of art consists in the perfect use of an imperfect medium - Oscar Wilde
ruclips.net/user/shortspDxZvHEmdqA?feature=shared
Have you ever tried writing a short story?
I have! There was a period of a few years where I'd write and publish several short stories per week. It was a lot of fun and I'd like to return to writing again sometime :)
@@BenjaminMcEvoy are they published and available? I’d love to read some of your fiction
The existence of political correctness means Lord Henry lost interests and leaves us.
Every culture will die like Dorian, while "The Picture of Dorian Gray" hoards its beauty and keeps smiling at us.
Beautifully put!
I disagree with Wilde that art is useless. Art fulfils a function - to redeem us from life, to help us with the burden of existence and self-knowledge in the face of life's terrible truths, as Nietzsche argues in The Gay Science.
I'm sure Oscar Wilde would agree with you. Very seldom does he express what he really feels about what he writes. Intelligent sarcasm was Oscar Wilde's weapon he used in a brilliant way to quieten all those who didn't understand, then, how sensitive an artist he really was.
Finished it today.
Perhaps the greatest experience of my life to date - loved it, every page, just the most beautiful novel I’ve ever read.
The end.
Indeed, art should be useless. If art is practical then it's not really art.
No, it's not, and I don't think any artist genuinely thinks so, but they might use this argument rhetorically so they don't have to defend the implications of their work.
you should review 120 days of sodom?
Why do so many people call it Portrait of Dorian Gray. It actually sounds better imo
I think Art is useless but essential.
Art is not a prerequisite for survival but it is what gives mea meaning to that survival and makes it worth living. Humans explore countless subject like science, maths, economics etc. But ultimately they can only ensure a prolonged existence but Art is the purpose of living. I also think that literature is art that is both emotional and intellectual. Whereas music, film and painting are purely emotional in relation to the audience of course. You only engage intellectually with these art forms if you are an expert or student of the said art, whereas a person who is not an artist of any kind, if they read, even something as simple as highlighting a quote or looking up a word in the dictionary is engagement of the intellectual kind and not purely emotional.
Every time I try to read Wilde, I get a few sentences or paragraphs in then want to prosecute him all over again for homosexuality, for aesthetic reasons.
God, how I would love to hear Wilde’s opinion on the woke insanity we are enduring right now. What would he say about great authors being ‘cancelled’ for having written something vaguely sexist or racist? Or the way we award prizes just because the author ticks a certain box, even though their work is mediocre (or even bad)? Things are worse than Wilde could have imagined in his worst nightmares.
I’m not sure Wilde would be.. with you on that.
@@word42069Let alone when with more awareness, now, outside of incarnation, if so? Ask a for a channeled message on that in the spiritual community?
He was a gay socialist, sooo…