It's possible to buy already in the socket, not easy to find like this one, but possible: www.newegg.com/supermicro-mbd-h11dsi-n702-ma015-o-dual-amd-epyc-7000-series/p/N82E16813183691
@@charlesselrachski34 In this board I do think so, this one was just an example, I think that with enough search we can find these processors pre installed in good motherboards for them, but it isn't easy to find
I was recently asked to spec out a server for a data analyst group. They had some money that they had to spend, and a dedicated server was one of their options. I speced a server similar to the ones we already had, but since they had a fair bit of money to spend, I also speced an AMD Epyc system. Nothing even close to what he was talking here, but I'm crossing my fingers that they want to spend the extra money for the hopped up AMD system!
Super high quality and well explained video, thank you STH! Started watching after your first ltt appearance and it's been great to see your youtube videos and qualities get so much better!
Great review as always. This made me realise I don’t have a very clear grasp on differences between server memory types. Perhaps a good topic for a video.
We are actually running a lot of HPC-type applications, and what we have found is that not even the current Rome parts are capable of providing enough memory BW. It is a very obscure fact, but unlike DT/HEDT parts, for EPYC AMD limits the FCLK to 2933 MHz/2, and as a consequence running 3200 MHz RAM can run into diminishing returns compared to the gains found by going from 2666 to 2933. One more thing: as a consequence, we believe that for our specific use case, going beyond 32C/socket is not really worth it. Also, operating in single-socket means the high-speed XGMI links are off, which can free up some package power budget. PS: We have no per-core nor per socket licensing costs, so this is a question of "not worth it" in terms of CapEx.
Always wondered about that. Perhaps this processor is better suited to running rediculous amounts of VMs? I wonder what the performance looks like between a 32 vs a 64 in compiling.
@@ethograb I think one of the bigger markets for this processor, at least right now would be 3D render farms. Massive 3D animation studies or even CGI studios would have a field day with this much processing power, assuming the software they use doesn't have GPU acceleration. Interestingly enough, these processors already have nearly the same raw processing power as some higher end GPUs, which is pretty mind-blowing. Another application could be for movie and TV studies that are adopting 12K filming standards. Processing those raw video files would require the processing power this processor could provide. When you add the PCI lane and memory flexibility, it would make perfect sense for high end media creators. I guess that market segment is still tiny in comparison to other corporate markets that would need this much processing power.
The 7H12 does appear to be listed on Ebay for about $5000 new, now that you mention it Patrick...I'm not trying to crash the server market but that seems like a good deal
TSMC is also at capacity. Granted they've freed up some fab space recently by dumping huawei and several other chinese integrators, but none of it has been 7nm capacity.
@@dcorbe .. They're just going to build more facilities. I've heard that Nvidia is about to dump Samsung and go back to TSMC even midstream with their 30 series _(personal footnote: I'm not going to be too happy if there's a better GPU core after my nearly $2K EVGA RTX 3090 purchase)._ Also I've heard rumors Apple is looking to purchase TSMC, so who knows. I don't have a crystal ball.
@@DJaquithFL The Taiwanese government will never allow TSMC to be swallowed up by Apple. Taiwan's tech sector is one of the few defenses they have against being swallwed whole by mainland China; that is to say, Taiwan knows they'll get protection from the western world for as long as there's a dependence for Taiwanese goods and services. Also if you want a TSMC process 3090 I'll buy your Samsung fab'd card from you :P
@@dcorbe .. I feel like I'm unicorn hunting. Just got the EVGA FTW yesterday .. all I can say is wow! It poops on my friend's RTX 3080, a heck of a lot more than 10%. Now if I can only find an AMD 5950X.
It does and runs very well if you use it with 4 TB of RAM and you pair the CPU with a Quadro RTX A6000 graphic card and you have it in dual socket (128 cores, 256 threads)
Most medium size companies could probably run their entire data center with one of these CPUs in a virtualized server environment. AMD has a higher performance home market version of this CPU as well in the Threadripper lineup...the highest end Threadripper is also 64 core/128 thread CPU.
@@morosis82 It's only non-registerd ECC memory that's so expensive (and also not available at high clock speeds). If you don't care about ECC memory Threadripper is indeed a great option.
Love the review. Maybe someday I will get 7742 once the price drops. The problem with OEMs is no matter what how fast AMD Epyc, Ryzen and Threadripper processors are they will never invest too much on making the AMD system hardware and sell to customers. We have to build AMD system ourselves. Intel has large sum of money for r&d by investing with OEMs to make their system. Even when Intel has gold and platinum nearly double or quadruple of their price against Epyc but with lesser performance OEMs will still go for Intel. Maybe someday it will change.
@@timerertim In applications that rely on heavily threaded computational power, but that aren't memory limited, the Threadripper performs better. It has a higher all core boost clock and the same amount of cores, but only half the memory bandwidth and 1/16 of the maximum memory capacity.
I have asked Lenovo and AMD. We do cover the professional workstation market since that has been a Xeon segment. We shall see. Still, I am not sure about doing it with the 4th gen Zen 3 Threadripper coming
I was looking at buying a P620 and the base price was somewhat ludicrous. What I'm really hoping for is enthusiast availability of the platform that's competitive with Epyc pricing.
ok now i know all i want is a "simple" rack of 4x cpus each with 64 cores 256mb chache with 8 channel ram.... liquid cooled..... just rack guys... just a nice rack....
19:52 sorry to tell you but you're totally wrong on that aspect , the server market are hungry for more cores and power for each core , specially with all craziness with virtualization that trend more last ~5-10 years e.g Docker LXC Amazon ECS they're sell like crazy. an EPYC system like this is good investment to them .
@@ServeTheHomeVideo I don't own server or sell them , but I watch a lot of hosting webforums spicily LEB latest AMD CPU's like Ryzen 3900x sold out immediately last year , people wanted to build cloud system with fastest cores(not CPU) as they could have , + for security reason some companies spread their applications/systems on multiple nodes , I know 64 beast cores are a lot but for 110K$ server price clearly it had it niche market , for someone like me witnesses the era of first Xeon's and lather on Opteron it's like dream comes true
I agree with both points to a degree. I think the issue here is that the high core count parts are a bit ahead of the "main stream" market. Higher core parts have use cases, and this is where I agree with the other point, those "niche" use cases are where the market trend is headed, it's just at the beginning phase. I run a lot VM's, but have been converting the VM's over to containers for the efficiency gains, I can run much more containers with much less resources, which reduces the need for higher core part servers. If anyone wonders, I have not fully done the calculations on the efficiency gains so I cannot yet give a value. I definitely agree that the high core parts are like a dream, however at this time I'd rather use another server to scale up rather than consolidate with a beefier higher core density server, too expensive and incremental scaling is too coarse grained to justify. I can see the density equation change down the road, but not now, but that's just my estimation, others may have a different view.
@@geekinasuit8333 I don't understand fully everything you guys are talking about. But I'm so proud that between the start of last month and now. I have gone from not knowing anything other than RAM size and i9 > i7... To understanding the comments on a video about HPC parts
Why does Intel have such an enormous market share, even after Epyc launch? Does Intel have better bios and drivers, better memory support, better customer service? Or do they just own the OEM market? 🤷🏼♂️
Being the incumbent with over 97% market share for years means that the ecosystem uses you as a standard. It is hard to move that. An example of why it matters is with PCIe Gen3 in EPYC 7001 "Naples" generation we saw things like no hot-swap NVMe SSDs for a long time. The industry used Intel Xeon as standard so it did not work out of the box with AMD. These little things add up over time.
@@ServeTheHomeVideo the other thing is likely contracts. Intel likely has many long term contracts out with system integrators and OEMs that are years in the making already. Companies are ordering their servers for next year or 2 years out now, and making purchase decisions based on market share and performance per therm of heat produced.
@Agent Smith A big part of it has to do with Server upgrade cycle. If all your servers are already Intel it has less of a time cost to just upgrade CPUs in your existing servers rather than validating all your hardware with Epyc. Now the thing is that AMD is actually so much higher efficiency that it is worth it for some companies, eg Amazon, to make the switch over. And AMD was actually such a better deal that if you do need all those cores its definitely worthwhile. For smaller scale servers the 7F72 is seeing a lot of use due to the 3.2ghz base and 3.7ghz boost clocks while having 192mb of cache.
You will be driving down the highway and see a cooling tower exactly like a nuclear power station and think. Oh a supercomputer cluster might be attached to this thing. And you might not be wrong.
@@butisitlogical3096 In most workloads the 2P 7H12 was out-performing the quad Platinum 8280 systems by a good margin. The 8380H may do a bit better because of higher UPI bandwidth. Still working on getting a proper Cooper Lake setup and deciding if #1 I want to do it, and #2 if we do Cooper Lake is it a one-off system, or are we going to do multiple systems.
I wrote this in the last 4 hours as a reply to another video, but I think it fits well here. Compare & contrast ~ The next 3 years are not dire for Intel, they're just not. Intel have a supply problem, They are using all their available 14nm silicon, so they can't meet the orders they have in the home user + gamer_boi space. Why? Because they have a problem with side-channel attacks, and their server space Xeons are threatened, so server_bois have had to apply mitigations, through Windows or far more often, through Linux. That has knocked the performance of the virtual-machine so badly they need about as many extra servers as they already have. If that shop has a thousand Xeons, they've got an extreme mission critical panic to get another thousand Xeons into the building in the next week. So they're all doing the same thing and moving to EPYCs, right? No, as a matter of fact, they're ordering another thousand Xeons, which have has some slight revision to the hardware but they're still on 14nm and they still have side channel vulnerabilities. But to move to EPYC, they'd have to maybe revise some of their software, and this application was written in COBOL in 1973 by our founder, and it's mission critical - it's company central - if this 200 lines of 50 year old code doesn't run the same way, in every possible variation, then four billion dollars worth of Roger's Rat Traps and General PR Company Title is going to vanish without a trace. How do you transition? Well you get onto your IT experts and ask them. So the Intel experts consult other Intel experts who use Intel Intelligence to talk to the Intel developers, who consult the Intel spreadsheet and talk to the Intel accountants, who go back to the Intel rep and tell him to tell his Intel Clients that Intel is still the best, and to certify Intel code to run on some other (poxy) company's chips, would take about 75 years. And so the captains of the IT industry, who are smart enough to run data centres, take that at face value. And so the price of Intel gaming rigs for Gamer_Bois are high, because Intel has a supply problem, because they can't make enough 10-900K gamer chips (which sell for maybe $600) because their entire capacity and 14nm fabs is frantically churning out Xeon chips, which sell for $6,ooo a chip, to fill the back-orders they've already got. And the financial penalty for this catastrophe is that Intel has taken about $60 billion this year in gross revenue instead of AMD, who has take about 6 bil. Intel has taken record profits from record revenue because they've made a huge security and design and engineering blunder, and now it's costing their customers double, so their customers are buying twice as many Xeons. So who exactly took those Polaroids of the Chairman chock-a-block up an Alsatian at the Christmas party? Either that, or how the fk did these people become the boss of all those IT companies? How the F U C K can this be going on? And how can anybody look at this and say Intel are looking at a bleak future for the next 3 ~ 5 years? Are you kidding? Intel are laughing like Vlad Putin! The world is fking stupid! Here ~ I'll show you....
Looking embarrassingly over at my pathetic 2990wx, and saying, "Why? Why? Why couldn't you be more like your bigger brother, I had such high hopes for you." LMFAO. Mind you, I only paid $850 for the 2990wx.
You can also look in the used market depending where you live and if you want to deal with dead platforms, but I don't recommend something that is not on AM4 or the newest intel platform (Tbh AM4 is probably in a dead end with ryzen 5000 now, but it's not a huge deal, zen 2 and zen 3 are really good)
They do. That is why we focused more on AMD to AMD comparisons talking about TDP. Still, there are practical limits for what you can cool in a given footprint.
This chip does a great job holding turbo frequencies, but the other aspect is memory bandwidth. If the application is memory bandwidth limited, having 8 channel memory is a big benefit. The 3990X is often faster in very small micro benchmarks such as c-ray/ Cinebench or in single threaded workloads. With bigger workloads, the 7H12 has more memory bandwidth and can scale to dual socket which the Threadripper cannot.
That probably needs an asterisk *buget allowing since they are high-end parts. But at the end of 2019 practically the only way to get these required building a supercomputer.
You are a bit off when it comes to Intel TDP. 250W - 8380HL - ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/205684/intel-xeon-platinum-8380hl-processor-38-5m-cache-2-90-ghz.html [Cooper Lake] 300W - 3110X - No longer in sale / no follow on product 400W - 9282 - ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/194146/intel-xeon-platinum-9282-processor-77m-cache-2-60-ghz.html [Cascade Lake]
We actually just got a Cooper Lake system in. All three of those are not mainstream 2-socket platforms. Cooper is really 4S/8S focused only (basically no reason to use in 2-socket but it can be done.) Xeon Phi is discontinued. We did some content on that. The Cascade-AP is not even socketed. It is only sold on Intel motherboards and has limited system functionality. Intel has higher TDP parts outside of CPUs as well. Here we were looking at mainstream sockets. Ice Lake Xeons will go much higher than 205W TDP.
3990x: 1TB max, 95.37GB/s. 7H12: 4TB max, 190.7GB/s. Up to the point where your workload bottlenecks the threadripper on memory, the threadripper wins. From there on, it loses.
How to power it? How to cool it? Motherboard support? Lol.. 8k for just a cpu lol My used altima was 9950... it’s almost as much as my bruiser.. I don’t think you could pull off a 2 u that would be able to move the heat. 280watt.. you are going to be loading 1/4 of your 1000watt power supply. This is going to heat everything in the 2u.. electrons hate heat.. I think the smallest platform is 3u. This gives extra heat capacity. On paper.. it might work but we all know there are many factors that can kill lab performance figures.. (dust bunnies love server rooms) You are right about to many cores. Even 32 is almost way to many.. database applications you can use all. Search engine spiders. Vps rentals..
Yes and you get 128 cores and 256 threads which seems overkill, however you will have to use Windows 10 Pro for Workstation or Enterprise because Windows 10 Home or Pro doesn’t like processors with 128 threads or more
15:57 Holy sht AMD not swap the floor with intel but they wipe them out the universe , I can't understand why AMD sever market still on ~10% market share cap .
I believe those 10% is the installed base, not sales. Considering they where effectively 0% just a couple years ago, and how large the server market is, I say this is a huge feat. Also, Intel's server sales dropped a whopping 40% year-to-year, according to their last investors call. You can bet AMD is selling Epic chips as fast as they can produce.
@magoid the precnetag are from market demand for new server(quarter/yearly based) , + servers market are huge very huge , but it's moves very slowly when it's comes to adopting new products (they're kinda traditional people) who knows business only, and have tighten relationship with intel , (Intel have effective lobby on OEM and servers market since long time specially overseas ) . Believe it or not DIY PC market aren't that big up to to 20% only , that's why intel still have very strong quarter revenue (1 quarter is double what AMD make's in whole year ) , AMD even lost big market share on GPU market (which is more DIY than PC) to nVIDIA after VEGA disaster )
Good examples are that these can take up to 4TB of memory in 8-channel mode. They also have 128x PCIe lanes. The 7H12 can also be used in dual socket servers.
Totally, but we are assuming we are still a quarter-ish from volume EPYC 7003 shipments. Part of why this is getting published now is that we wanted to give a baseline that folks can add an IPC uplift to.
this is BY FAR the most HYPED Patrick has ever been in an intro. DAMN he's excited for this CPU
He was actually so hyped his image went faster than his voice
he is on drugs! EPYC
At 7k USD, I'd be too scared to socket the damn thing.
It's possible to buy already in the socket, not easy to find like this one, but possible:
www.newegg.com/supermicro-mbd-h11dsi-n702-ma015-o-dual-amd-epyc-7000-series/p/N82E16813183691
@@belther7 but you will get your pcie chopped to pcie30 ?
@@charlesselrachski34 In this board I do think so, this one was just an example, I think that with enough search we can find these processors pre installed in good motherboards for them, but it isn't easy to find
I almost feel good about getting my 2990wx for $850, even if it is way slower!
It actually pretty cheap cause it pretty much on the similar market as xeons. And you know xeons. Modern model is very very expensive
As a hardware fetishist I approve 8 of this monster in a 2U system 😆
We may do a liquid cooled 2U4N EPYC system. I have told companies I want to wait for EPYC 7003 series chips
@@ServeTheHomeVideo until the 7h13 comes :)
@Ashish Gupta indian man cant afford the chip?
I was recently asked to spec out a server for a data analyst group. They had some money that they had to spend, and a dedicated server was one of their options. I speced a server similar to the ones we already had, but since they had a fair bit of money to spend, I also speced an AMD Epyc system. Nothing even close to what he was talking here, but I'm crossing my fingers that they want to spend the extra money for the hopped up AMD system!
@3:37 - Very nice to include price, i donlt normally see price in your articles, which is a pain. So thanks for that.
Super high quality and well explained video, thank you STH!
Started watching after your first ltt appearance and it's been great to see your youtube videos and qualities get so much better!
Thanks for the kind words Julien!
Great review as always. This made me realise I don’t have a very clear grasp on differences between server memory types. Perhaps a good topic for a video.
Super idea. This one is coming up on being 10 years old on STH www.servethehome.com/unbuffered-registered-ecc-memory-difference-ecc-udimms-rdimms/
Well it would seem im talking to my suppliers on monday :D thank you Patrick for making me aware of this beast
We are actually running a lot of HPC-type applications, and what we have found is that not even the current Rome parts are capable of providing enough memory BW. It is a very obscure fact, but unlike DT/HEDT parts, for EPYC AMD limits the FCLK to 2933 MHz/2, and as a consequence running 3200 MHz RAM can run into diminishing returns compared to the gains found by going from 2666 to 2933.
One more thing: as a consequence, we believe that for our specific use case, going beyond 32C/socket is not really worth it. Also, operating in single-socket means the high-speed XGMI links are off, which can free up some package power budget.
PS: We have no per-core nor per socket licensing costs, so this is a question of "not worth it" in terms of CapEx.
Always wondered about that. Perhaps this processor is better suited to running rediculous amounts of VMs? I wonder what the performance looks like between a 32 vs a 64 in compiling.
@@ethograb I think one of the bigger markets for this processor, at least right now would be 3D render farms.
Massive 3D animation studies or even CGI studios would have a field day with this much processing power, assuming the software they use doesn't have GPU acceleration.
Interestingly enough, these processors already have nearly the same raw processing power as some higher end GPUs, which is pretty mind-blowing.
Another application could be for movie and TV studies that are adopting 12K filming standards. Processing those raw video files would require the processing power this processor could provide.
When you add the PCI lane and memory flexibility, it would make perfect sense for high end media creators.
I guess that market segment is still tiny in comparison to other corporate markets that would need this much processing power.
The 7H12 does appear to be listed on Ebay for about $5000 new, now that you mention it Patrick...I'm not trying to crash the server market but that seems like a good deal
$2250 used
Dont buy anything that is listed as brand new on ebay... never do that!
I can't believe AMD wouldn't sample you with its halo product.
I do not think they sampled them to anyone since they were designed for the HPC market specifically.
Epyc is not halo product ryzen 9 is halo product
There was so much hype in that intro that I had to make sure I wasn't on 2x.
It has taken a year to get to be able to do this.
I would imagine if this $4,000 CPU becomes wildly popular AMD will find a way. TSMC pumps out a lot of silicon.
TSMC is also at capacity. Granted they've freed up some fab space recently by dumping huawei and several other chinese integrators, but none of it has been 7nm capacity.
@@dcorbe .. They're just going to build more facilities. I've heard that Nvidia is about to dump Samsung and go back to TSMC even midstream with their 30 series _(personal footnote: I'm not going to be too happy if there's a better GPU core after my nearly $2K EVGA RTX 3090 purchase)._ Also I've heard rumors Apple is looking to purchase TSMC, so who knows. I don't have a crystal ball.
@@DJaquithFL The Taiwanese government will never allow TSMC to be swallowed up by Apple. Taiwan's tech sector is one of the few defenses they have against being swallwed whole by mainland China; that is to say, Taiwan knows they'll get protection from the western world for as long as there's a dependence for Taiwanese goods and services.
Also if you want a TSMC process 3090 I'll buy your Samsung fab'd card from you :P
@@dcorbe .. I feel like I'm unicorn hunting.
Just got the EVGA FTW yesterday .. all I can say is wow! It poops on my friend's RTX 3080, a heck of a lot more than 10%. Now if I can only find an AMD 5950X.
@@DJaquithFL You definitely are a unicorn. There's less than 10,000 of them in the wild and the demand for them is out of this world.
We got a few of these dual 7H12 R7525s. The CPU bars on htop don't leave any space for process info XD
Already ordered. It's on way to me. Excited to test this bad ass CPU. :)
I like how your enthusiasm is at 11 for the first 10 seconds of the video then drops down to 8. Every. Single. Video.
Enthusiasm boost clock time limit. Gotta stay within that power budget.
@@zxcvb_bvcxz The tau limit is strong in this one.
Patrick is so hyped. LOVE IT!
I looked this up on Amazon and the 1 Star review on it was pretty funny 😄
I need to win the lottery. Great overview.
Thank you for talking about the price.
The millon dollar question is: Does it run Microsoft Flight Simulator 2020? xD
Spoiler : it does but it runs horribly because of the game's poor optimisations and DX11
It can render it 😁
If Threadripper can bruteforce itself into running Crysis, I would say probably.
Barely, just barely!
It does and runs very well if you use it with 4 TB of RAM and you pair the CPU with a Quadro RTX A6000 graphic card and you have it in dual socket (128 cores, 256 threads)
AMD Milan 2P systems are going to be absolutely NASTY.
Most medium size companies could probably run their entire data center with one of these CPUs in a virtualized server environment.
AMD has a higher performance home market version of this CPU as well in the Threadripper lineup...the highest end Threadripper is also 64 core/128 thread CPU.
Subscribed what a great video thanks!
Thank you!
The level of excitement is intense
in a good way
Very informative video. Thankyou 👍
Great video!
Thanks!
Waiting for zen3 threadripper or EPYC 🤪
I thought the same. But what a good filler until those monsters arrive. 👌🏻
Too bad Threadripper doesn't take registered memory, it's normally a lot cheaper.
@@uzefulvideos3440 that's sort of the point though. Want great value? Ryzen. Need workstation performance? Threadripper. Want a ton of memory? Epyc.
@@morosis82 It's only non-registerd ECC memory that's so expensive (and also not available at high clock speeds). If you don't care about ECC memory Threadripper is indeed a great option.
Yes. i want to upgrade my 2950X when the 5960X is released
Ppl in 4 years: bruh, this thing was the better? Omg I have my Ryzen 7 7800x that is twice that!
Love the review. Maybe someday I will get 7742 once the price drops. The problem with OEMs is no matter what how fast AMD Epyc, Ryzen and Threadripper processors are they will never invest too much on making the AMD system hardware and sell to customers. We have to build AMD system ourselves. Intel has large sum of money for r&d by investing with OEMs to make their system. Even when Intel has gold and platinum nearly double or quadruple of their price against Epyc but with lesser performance OEMs will still go for Intel. Maybe someday it will change.
I'm just waiting for a shred of information about Milan. Not leaks.
I know... it is exciting. More on STH when we can.
Not true, many large data centers have access to engineering samples of DVT/PVT CPUs via contract
13:15 so they're... gluing them together?
When does casket lake come out?
Yeah, with Intel TIM I guess
the 3990X is faster in many situations, whenever you're not Memory or PCIe limited.
That's because of the clock speeds
Obviously. Desktop parts are set up to draw about 50% more power and run maybe 20% faster, when under limits.
By many situations you mean not multithreaded operations, right?
@@timerertim In applications that rely on heavily threaded computational power, but that aren't memory limited, the Threadripper performs better. It has a higher all core boost clock and the same amount of cores, but only half the memory bandwidth and 1/16 of the maximum memory capacity.
@@tommihommi1 That's true. Wow I read 3950x... shame to me
could you get your hands onto one of the Thinkstations with the threadripper pro?
I second this. I wanna see a review of the TR-pro Thinkstation too.
I have asked Lenovo and AMD. We do cover the professional workstation market since that has been a Xeon segment. We shall see. Still, I am not sure about doing it with the 4th gen Zen 3 Threadripper coming
I was looking at buying a P620 and the base price was somewhat ludicrous. What I'm really hoping for is enthusiast availability of the platform that's competitive with Epyc pricing.
14k AUD converted from us?
It’s gonna be 20k in Australia.
And did I mention you can buy it ... TODAY ? ;)
Interesting upgrade from the dual socket Opteron I run on a daily basis.
thumbs up for massive systems
Take a shot everytime he says "today" make it a double if he says "buy today"
ok now i know all i want is a "simple" rack of 4x cpus each with 64 cores 256mb chache with 8 channel ram.... liquid cooled..... just rack guys... just a nice rack....
19:52 sorry to tell you but you're totally wrong on that aspect , the server market are hungry for more cores and power for each core , specially with all craziness with virtualization that trend more last ~5-10 years e.g Docker LXC Amazon ECS they're sell like crazy. an EPYC system like this is good investment to them .
Not that there is no market for 64C, but even AMD will tell you the lower core count parts are higher volume.
@@ServeTheHomeVideo I don't own server or sell them , but I watch a lot of hosting webforums spicily LEB latest AMD CPU's like Ryzen 3900x sold out immediately last year , people wanted to build cloud system with fastest cores(not CPU) as they could have , + for security reason some companies spread their applications/systems on multiple nodes , I know 64 beast cores are a lot but for 110K$ server price clearly it had it niche market , for someone like me witnesses the era of first Xeon's and lather on Opteron it's like dream comes true
I agree with both points to a degree. I think the issue here is that the high core count parts are a bit ahead of the "main stream" market. Higher core parts have use cases, and this is where I agree with the other point, those "niche" use cases are where the market trend is headed, it's just at the beginning phase. I run a lot VM's, but have been converting the VM's over to containers for the efficiency gains, I can run much more containers with much less resources, which reduces the need for higher core part servers. If anyone wonders, I have not fully done the calculations on the efficiency gains so I cannot yet give a value.
I definitely agree that the high core parts are like a dream, however at this time I'd rather use another server to scale up rather than consolidate with a beefier higher core density server, too expensive and incremental scaling is too coarse grained to justify. I can see the density equation change down the road, but not now, but that's just my estimation, others may have a different view.
Most epyc rome instances on Azure and aws are still using 32 core CPUs if you buy the bare metal config
@@geekinasuit8333
I don't understand fully everything you guys are talking about. But I'm so proud that between the start of last month and now. I have gone from not knowing anything other than RAM size and i9 > i7... To understanding the comments on a video about HPC parts
Runs out to build a new home lab with this CPU :-)
We have people in the forums doing just that actually :-)
Why does Intel have such an enormous market share, even after Epyc launch? Does Intel have better bios and drivers, better memory support, better customer service? Or do they just own the OEM market? 🤷🏼♂️
Being the incumbent with over 97% market share for years means that the ecosystem uses you as a standard. It is hard to move that. An example of why it matters is with PCIe Gen3 in EPYC 7001 "Naples" generation we saw things like no hot-swap NVMe SSDs for a long time. The industry used Intel Xeon as standard so it did not work out of the box with AMD. These little things add up over time.
@@ServeTheHomeVideo the other thing is likely contracts. Intel likely has many long term contracts out with system integrators and OEMs that are years in the making already. Companies are ordering their servers for next year or 2 years out now, and making purchase decisions based on market share and performance per therm of heat produced.
@Agent Smith A big part of it has to do with Server upgrade cycle. If all your servers are already Intel it has less of a time cost to just upgrade CPUs in your existing servers rather than validating all your hardware with Epyc. Now the thing is that AMD is actually so much higher efficiency that it is worth it for some companies, eg Amazon, to make the switch over. And AMD was actually such a better deal that if you do need all those cores its definitely worthwhile. For smaller scale servers the 7F72 is seeing a lot of use due to the 3.2ghz base and 3.7ghz boost clocks while having 192mb of cache.
You will be driving down the highway and see a cooling tower exactly like a nuclear power station and think. Oh a supercomputer cluster might be attached to this thing. And you might not be wrong.
"Yes mom, I need this for school"
Faster is TR 3995WX, also 128 PCIe 4.0 and 8ch RAM
100% but that is a single socket solution which limits system performance.
@@ServeTheHomeVideo yes, of course. btw. next few months will be very interesting :)
@@ServeTheHomeVideo By that logic, some of the S8S Intel CPUs should be considered fastest, or even some of the newer 4 socket machines.
@@butisitlogical3096 In most workloads the 2P 7H12 was out-performing the quad Platinum 8280 systems by a good margin. The 8380H may do a bit better because of higher UPI bandwidth. Still working on getting a proper Cooper Lake setup and deciding if #1 I want to do it, and #2 if we do Cooper Lake is it a one-off system, or are we going to do multiple systems.
@@ServeTheHomeVideo this is because Windows is poorly optimized on TR 3990X and TR3995WX.
Windows cannot handle too many sockets unlike Linux
Seeing this
One can only imagine what milan is going to be!
*Insert number here* Gamers 1 CPU
Maybe 10, with 4c left for the system itself + other shenanigans.
I wrote this in the last 4 hours as a reply to another video, but I think it fits well here. Compare & contrast ~
The next 3 years are not dire for Intel, they're just not. Intel have a supply problem, They are using all their available 14nm silicon, so they can't meet the orders they have in the home user + gamer_boi space. Why? Because they have a problem with side-channel attacks, and their server space Xeons are threatened, so server_bois have had to apply mitigations, through Windows or far more often, through Linux. That has knocked the performance of the virtual-machine so badly they need about as many extra servers as they already have. If that shop has a thousand Xeons, they've got an extreme mission critical panic to get another thousand Xeons into the building in the next week. So they're all doing the same thing and moving to EPYCs, right? No, as a matter of fact, they're ordering another thousand Xeons, which have has some slight revision to the hardware but they're still on 14nm and they still have side channel vulnerabilities. But to move to EPYC, they'd have to maybe revise some of their software, and this application was written in COBOL in 1973 by our founder, and it's mission critical - it's company central - if this 200 lines of 50 year old code doesn't run the same way, in every possible variation, then four billion dollars worth of Roger's Rat Traps and General PR Company Title is going to vanish without a trace. How do you transition? Well you get onto your IT experts and ask them. So the Intel experts consult other Intel experts who use Intel Intelligence to talk to the Intel developers, who consult the Intel spreadsheet and talk to the Intel accountants, who go back to the Intel rep and tell him to tell his Intel Clients that Intel is still the best, and to certify Intel code to run on some other (poxy) company's chips, would take about 75 years. And so the captains of the IT industry, who are smart enough to run data centres, take that at face value. And so the price of Intel gaming rigs for Gamer_Bois are high, because Intel has a supply problem, because they can't make enough 10-900K gamer chips (which sell for maybe $600) because their entire capacity and 14nm fabs is frantically churning out Xeon chips, which sell for $6,ooo a chip, to fill the back-orders they've already got. And the financial penalty for this catastrophe is that Intel has taken about $60 billion this year in gross revenue instead of AMD, who has take about 6 bil. Intel has taken record profits from record revenue because they've made a huge security and design and engineering blunder, and now it's costing their customers double, so their customers are buying twice as many Xeons. So who exactly took those Polaroids of the Chairman chock-a-block up an Alsatian at the Christmas party? Either that, or how the fk did these people become the boss of all those IT companies? How the F U C K can this be going on? And how can anybody look at this and say Intel are looking at a bleak future for the next 3 ~ 5 years? Are you kidding? Intel are laughing like Vlad Putin! The world is fking stupid! Here ~ I'll show you....
I'd rather say "strongest"
try playing back at 0.9x speed - much more relaxing to watch ;-) He's just excited by the sku
So... can we use one of these in a workstation for 3D rendering?
Of course you can, this cpu would lete the gpu go nuts
Just use the upcoming threadripper 3995wx.
Be nice if the Epyc and TR platforms were the same exact Socket.
Why? The motherboards for the TR Will be more expensive.
EPYC is EPIC!!!!!
Nice!
Do these have the unified L3 cache that Zen 3 brought to the desktop CPUs?
These are EPYC 7002 "Rome" which is Zen 2. EPYC 7003 "Milan" will be Zen 3.
@joyela aeuvunya The Zen 3 cache is shared between all CCX and drastically reduces latency
Looking embarrassingly over at my pathetic 2990wx, and saying, "Why? Why? Why couldn't you be more like your bigger brother, I had such high hopes for you." LMFAO. Mind you, I only paid $850 for the 2990wx.
That's cool and all, but can it run doom?
me watching this on a chrome book with intel celeron: :)
8th gen i7, quadro P3200 thinkpad here
Right Now i have a fx 6300 What would be a good upgrade for 150 or below?
Ryzen 3 3100, 3300X (if you find one), i3 10100 and i5 9400F (the i5 is the least recommended because it's in a dead platform, but it's 6 cores)
You can also look in the used market depending where you live and if you want to deal with dead platforms, but I don't recommend something that is not on AM4 or the newest intel platform
(Tbh AM4 is probably in a dead end with ryzen 5000 now, but it's not a huge deal, zen 2 and zen 3 are really good)
@@inlinesk8r477 what would be a really good gpu that can average 144fps or more for the any of those cpus under 200 in fortnite
@@mystical7784 1650 super is your best bet at medium settings
@@inlinesk8r477 So Gtx 1650 super and Ryzen 3 3100, 3300X And How much Ram would I need to have all of these running smothly
Don't intel and AMD calculate TDP different though ?
They do. That is why we focused more on AMD to AMD comparisons talking about TDP. Still, there are practical limits for what you can cool in a given footprint.
Yea.. If you have 10k credit card limit
It's possible to make this cpu works on a Threadripper motherbaord?
I do not think so at this point. Consumer workstation Threadripper platforms are much smaller.
what fps will it get in CS:go 1080p
Wow, that thing almost pulls as much power as my my x3470 :)
It's faster than the 3990x despite having lower frequency on the same architecture?
This chip does a great job holding turbo frequencies, but the other aspect is memory bandwidth. If the application is memory bandwidth limited, having 8 channel memory is a big benefit. The 3990X is often faster in very small micro benchmarks such as c-ray/ Cinebench or in single threaded workloads. With bigger workloads, the 7H12 has more memory bandwidth and can scale to dual socket which the Threadripper cannot.
2:50 The TDP between Intel Chips and AMD Chips are not comparable. The calculation used is different for both.
Imagine pairing this with the AsRock Rack "deep" iTX Sp3 board in something like a DAN A4... Datacenter in a shoebox anyone?
What is this notion of "a CPU you can buy"
I though the emphasis was on "you can buy", but no, that is practically the opposite xD
That probably needs an asterisk *buget allowing since they are high-end parts. But at the end of 2019 practically the only way to get these required building a supercomputer.
@@ServeTheHomeVideo Still an interesting and good to know if you're anywhere in IT, thank you for keeping us updated!
You are a bit off when it comes to Intel TDP.
250W - 8380HL - ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/205684/intel-xeon-platinum-8380hl-processor-38-5m-cache-2-90-ghz.html [Cooper Lake]
300W - 3110X - No longer in sale / no follow on product
400W - 9282 - ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/194146/intel-xeon-platinum-9282-processor-77m-cache-2-60-ghz.html [Cascade Lake]
We actually just got a Cooper Lake system in. All three of those are not mainstream 2-socket platforms. Cooper is really 4S/8S focused only (basically no reason to use in 2-socket but it can be done.) Xeon Phi is discontinued. We did some content on that. The Cascade-AP is not even socketed. It is only sold on Intel motherboards and has limited system functionality.
Intel has higher TDP parts outside of CPUs as well. Here we were looking at mainstream sockets. Ice Lake Xeons will go much higher than 205W TDP.
NO THE MEMORY is the most shocking spec. 3200 is AMAZING for server grade
just the matter of time amd will introduce kilo-core
Whose home are we serving here? People who want to buy a computer and not pay the rent/mortgage?
Maybe I'm just exhausted and my brain is working anymore today.... but what makes this faster than a Threadripper 3990x?
12:13
3990x: 1TB max, 95.37GB/s. 7H12: 4TB max, 190.7GB/s. Up to the point where your workload bottlenecks the threadripper on memory, the threadripper wins. From there on, it loses.
What asus motherboard do i need? Need to get 10k fps on minecraft
How to power it? How to cool it? Motherboard support? Lol.. 8k for just a cpu lol
My used altima was 9950... it’s almost as much as my bruiser..
I don’t think you could pull off a 2 u that would be able to move the heat. 280watt.. you are going to be loading 1/4 of your 1000watt power supply. This is going to heat everything in the 2u.. electrons hate heat.. I think the smallest platform is 3u. This gives extra heat capacity. On paper.. it might work but we all know there are many factors that can kill lab performance figures.. (dust bunnies love server rooms)
You are right about to many cores. Even 32 is almost way to many.. database applications you can use all. Search engine spiders. Vps rentals..
commenting to promote da video (yt algorithm stuff idfk)
No anti-static precautions :(
Wonder how two of these does mining Monero.
Can you dual socket this?
Yes and you get 128 cores and 256 threads which seems overkill, however you will have to use Windows 10 Pro for Workstation or Enterprise because Windows 10 Home or Pro doesn’t like processors with 128 threads or more
Does it run MS-DOS?
Yes, but I dont think it will address the whole of your 1TB of RAM. 🤯😂
These processors are meant to run Linux, or BSD, DOS based systems aren't design to this kind of operations
TempleOS or bust :')
It will fail to run MS-DOS because it has more cores than the os supporting how many cores can it use
@@tonycheng6478 MS-DOS runs everything on the boot core, so 1.
How many of these do I need if I want to mind-control somebody?
15:57 Holy sht AMD not swap the floor with intel but they wipe them out the universe , I can't understand why AMD sever market still on ~10% market share cap .
I believe those 10% is the installed base, not sales. Considering they where effectively 0% just a couple years ago, and how large the server market is, I say this is a huge feat.
Also, Intel's server sales dropped a whopping 40% year-to-year, according to their last investors call. You can bet AMD is selling Epic chips as fast as they can produce.
@magoid the precnetag are from market demand for new server(quarter/yearly based) , + servers market are huge very huge , but it's moves very slowly when it's comes to adopting new products (they're kinda traditional people) who knows business only, and have tighten relationship with intel , (Intel have effective lobby on OEM and servers market since long time specially overseas ) .
Believe it or not DIY PC market aren't that big up to to 20% only , that's why intel still have very strong quarter revenue (1 quarter is double what AMD make's in whole year ) , AMD even lost big market share on GPU market (which is more DIY than PC) to nVIDIA after VEGA disaster )
Try SVT-av1 processing
How is it different from threadripper 3990x
Good examples are that these can take up to 4TB of memory in 8-channel mode. They also have 128x PCIe lanes. The 7H12 can also be used in dual socket servers.
Epyc motherboard are also epycly expensive
How much faster then AMD Ryzen Threadripper PRO 3995WX ?
Slower
depends on you application?
In germany there is a Retailer called mindfactory.de and its selling it for 7.5k €
Stop! STOP AMD! Intel is already deeeeaaaaaaad!!!
Why does it say copyright 2018 on the cpu?
That is a function of the design cycle. Milan is (c) 2019
too bad we dont see anything in the benchmarks
Before I watch the video.... is this a chip I can buy today? ;)
A year ago, not unless you were building a supercomputer. Today, yes online with a credit card.
When them ZEN3 cores get into EPYC intel will be even more fucked than they already are.
Totally, but we are assuming we are still a quarter-ish from volume EPYC 7003 shipments. Part of why this is getting published now is that we wanted to give a baseline that folks can add an IPC uplift to.
16 channel memory when.
...and I thought my threadripper was fast.
But can it run Crysis?
It can run Crysis in software rendering mode, at least the first level...
@@h2oaddict28 what's software rendering mode?
@@william_SMMAWithout the gpu
@@h2oaddict28 oh. Thanks
My ADHD kicked in half way, zoned out for 5 and now I'm confused 🤣 my fault
At 2.6 base clock its nowhere near the fastest cpu. The most powerful one it is though.
rich gamers: