I bought a B17 in 1982. It was very hard, I melted proofhide to rub into the underside, and polished the top with shoe polish & dubbin. After about 2 years use it was comfortable. I took care of it, polishing with shoepolish / dubbin. But regretted that it was black, and did not have the brass rivets. It did stretch a little, so I bought a spanner to stretch it and it was fine again. (lasted to ~2007 = 25 years) Now I have a honey swift, not done anything to it yet, probably needs a polish soon. I suggest you give it a good polish with dubbin & leave it for a few weeks, then polish it again with shoe polish. ( I think proofhide is a waste of time / money). Even if you don't use it a nicely polished B17 can be sold easily.
I'm honestly not sure what to do with it now. I've been using a Selle SMP TRK on my touring bike for the last 9 months and it's been comfortable. I've just ordered the gel version which I'll put on my tourer and move the older one onto another bike. I feel reluctant to use the B17 again as it nearly ruined my tour of Northern Thailand last year. I also don't want to sell it. Plus, it would be hard to do as it looks like crap anyway. I'll probably just keep it on display as an ornament! Anyway, pleased yours worked out for you. That's always good to hear. Have a great Xmas and New Year. JP
Nice review Jay. Got the same saddle, came with my Nomad. It took a while to get used to it, very hard to begin with but softened up nicely. I haven’t experienced any fading like you, strange. Nor do I have an issue with the saddle rubbing my thighs. I found that cycling in padded shorts didn’t work for me in this saddle, I wear loose fitting jocks and pants and try keep undies dry as best I can and my backside is happy :) so, from almost dumping it, to loving it :) safe riding!
That's interesting. I'm particularly interested that you say you got better results not wearing padded shorts. I might try that on my city run-around bike and see how it goes. I haven't dumped it but it is now sitting on a shelf and has been replaced on my touring bike with a Selle SMP TRK which I find much more comfortable. Appreciate the feedback and as I'm sure you'll agree saddles are such a personal thing! Have a great Easter weekend and I hope you get the chance to get out on the bike. JP
"breaking in" is a trick that companies are shoving down our throat to keep the product and not return in. I believe a product should serve it's purpose since day one especially when in comes to comfort. Do not fail for this as I did with brooks saddles. Did hundreds of miles on mine, and I struggle to believe if either my anatomy adapted to the pressure points or the saddle broken in. I'm more inclined to believe that it's the anatomy. Opinions may vary, but this was my experience and I resonate with mostly this man said
I have a b17 with 17,000 miles and a b17 special with 25,000, a flyer with 1200 and i couldn't imagine not using one. Break in was 200 - 500 miles with proofide on the underside. Keeping the tension and knowing how to gauge it is important. I also love the discoloration on the brown ones, tells a story.
I gave up on it a while ago and have been using a Selle TRK. However, I was wondering if maybe a cutaway B17 would be a better option for me and maybe take off a little tension and let it sag a touch. Any thoughts?
I also have a flyer, it has only 2000 miles. It needed no breaking in period as the springs absorb most of the pressure without feeling too bouncy. They are the correct springiness for me 80kg. Over long distance touring I will still use a b17 as I'm moving around more and find them more than adequate without cycling shorts over 80-100 mile days. I have the flyer on an ebike which I pedal very lightly so more weight on the saddle, travel faster so hit potholes harder, and don't need to save weight. I was worried about it creaking but I just oiled the silver shoulder plate where it seats on the nosepiece as it is metal on metal and meant to move when adjusted , but that creaked on my b17 as well, so the springs haven't added any noise yet.also wonder if the flyer makes the overall bike faster as less energy is being lost through road vibration when the riders weight is absorbed away from the tyres?
Could not agree more, used a B17 on my Thailand tour and the sides rubbed on the inner thigh. Used it on my return for 30-80km trips and was ok....but the inner thigh rub is a real pain....I agree and bought a selle SMP TRK as used by Mark Beaumont and love it...great video and happy riding mate.
It sounds like we've had a very similar experience with the B17. Since I changed to the Selle SMP TRK things for me are also much better. How long have you had you TRK?
@@Biking360 hey mate. I’ve used the TRK on my cannondale and giant bikes, I have a video on my channel Of my 300km in a day-using that saddle....I love it, just bought a salsa gravel bike and fitted one to it, the B17 I fitted on the fat bike (video as well :)). And loved it for shorter rides, I just found it always rubbed the inner thigh...happy riding mate🙏🏼👊🏼
Like any saddle it needs to support your sit bones and that involves playing around with the tilt angle. It won't be suitable for some bicycles that have you stretched out too far and I found that there wasn't a break=in period if you adjust it correctly and it fits your sit bones, then it's comfortable straight out of the box. You also need to play around with the tension screw so that it isn't to tight and also doesn't sag too much. Get all of these things right and its very comfortable. If the sides cause chaffing, then tie them together to stop them splaying out. When it is working it is almost magical comfort, but when it isn't working it is very uncomfortable, so its worth playing around with to try different settings to better fit your sit bones..
I can see where you are coming from. I am riding my B17 for 7000 km now and breaking in is still not finished. Yet there is no other saddle that fits me better.
A saddle I have considered. I have opted to use the one that came with the bike. Haven't had any issues with it but I also try to limit the distances I ride each day (35-50 miles). Very thorough review.
Hey Alex. It worked brilliantly for me when I was about your age and weight! This time around it's been a let down as you saw from the video. My best advice is if you have a saddle that's comfortable hang on to it! What did you use on your last tour and how was it?
@@Biking360 my saddle is okay for a few hours then it's quite uncomfortable. So I'm thinking of getting a new seat. But at the same time it could be the hours I'm putting in on it at one time. My saddle is a wtb volt sport which comes stock on my bike.
Different saddles for each rider. Ive only had my B17 a very short time, less than 200km. Fortunately I found mine to be comfortable right out of the box. To each three own of course.
I'm no touring cyclist. What tends to limit the length of my ride is seat comfort. Recently bought a bike with a B17. Right out of the gate it been the most comfortable riding saddle I've ever had. I know some of that is also likely due to the geometry of the bike, but I can't get over my ass not going flat after 10 miles or so.
That's great to hear. I honestly think when the B17 works well it works brilliantly. If you find a saddle that's comfortable make sure you hang on to it :)
I have been using a Selle SMP TRK for about two and a half years now and it is excellent. No pain. They have a wide version if you have large size bones. Highly recommend it.
Very good review. I bought the B17 after two VERY uncomfortable saddles. Right from the start it was very comfortable and fit well. Interesting how so many people approve or dislike it. But that is the beauty of sharing our experience 👍
I'm really pleased the B17 is working for you. I'm sure you'll agree there's nothing worse than riding around with a sore backside! What kind of bike and riding do you use our B17 for?
I am 67 so went with petal assist and it has made bike riding fun again! 50+ miles and the B17 worked for me but I would be hesitate to recommend it for my friends price wise.
There is four different settings so you pick. Hills are a breeze if you choose to do so. I have blown up hills that I never would have been able to in my younger years. I know a lot of purists would never go near pedal assist but to each their own. I had quit riding for 10 years because I had lost the desire. But as I have said...it is fun again!
@@R0dan I'm a big fan of pedal assist though I don't use it at the moment. I think the purist attitude is ridiculous. We're all two-wheeled brothers and should stick together. Stay safe. JP
I am breaking in a B66. Never rode Brooks. I noticed the adjustment nut under zero tension. I took the play out plus a quarter turn. My hopes are high, feels pretty good!
I love mine. It's done many a comfy mile. I never had an issue with a break in period. Rode it from the get go without knicks. Loosen the adjuster bolt a little when they're new. I have not had any discomfort, rubbing or chaffing at all. But saddles are as personal as underwear 👍 Cheers mate.
@@Biking360 I have it on my Kona Sutra. I bought it in 2016. At least 6000 plus km. But as I said, saddles are personal. I've found with the B17 people either love them, or hate them. We're all different. 👍
Great review, that colour fade is called character and patina. Enjoyed this and another of yours i'm watching. Subscribed. Regards, a 60 y/o Brit from Udon, life long motorcyclist who just got back.into cycling last year. Great stuff, cheers.
Honest review, thanks. I tried a C17 and gave up on it after 500km, supposed to be comfortable from the start. Ha!! I decided to try a Brooks Swift as I have narrow sit bones so B17 is a bit wide for me, and as you mentioned here, I didn't like the deep sides. Only done 50k so far, uncomfortable, so a lot more breaking in to do and hoping I don't end up with the same conclusions as you. Cheers
It's definitely worth persevering with, at least for a while, because when the B17 works it seems to do so brilliantly. Though on the flip side it may be nothing but trouble! Good luck and let me know how you get on. Ride safe. JP
I have two B17s. One is the short, women's version and the other is the standard (came stock with a bike). The women's saddle has not worked out well for me. The standard is perfect. Also, it is breaking in better. So I have a love/hate relationship with the B17. Thanks for this honest review.
Saddles are such a personal thing. I'm pleased you have something that's working for you though a little surprised the standard feel better than the ladies version. What ever works though eh? Jay
What about the B17 standard vs the B17s do you like/not like? What makes one work over the other for you? I have had a hard time finding women's reviews and perspectives on Brooks saddles but I am interested in buying one. Hesitating between B17, B17s, and the cut-out versions of both of those. I'd love to hear your thoughts! (By the way, I'm from Ontario too, and I recently discovered your channel/instagram. Keep up the great work!)
@@gc1375 Hello fellow Ontarian! Thanks for your comment and for the finding my channel. To answer your question - I think it comes down to the length of the rails. B17s is a shorter saddle with shorter rails, which leaves less room for it to be adjusted on the seat post. I find that I am always "hanging over" the back of the saddle, as ideally I'd like to be able to move it back about a cm, but I am unable to do so because of the shorter rails. In comparison, the standard B17 offers a lot more range in terms of adjustability (longer rails) and because of this I find it a lot more comfortable. So the comfort may not have anything to do with the saddle itself (the top of the saddle), but rather with the ability to adjust it for the best fit. I hope this makes sense, if it doesn't, please let me know. If you haven't found their channel yet, Rad Bike Adventure are a channel of two women who love their Brooks saddles. They have a variety of them. Here's one of their videos ruclips.net/video/2PazFwYTfJM/видео.html.
@@WheelsonaBike Yes, I love Rad Bike Adventure and have watched their Brooks videos many times! They're awesome! What you are saying totally makes sense, thank you. I am trying to research as much as I can because I simply don't believe that the one model marketed as "the women's version" is necessarily the right one. I actually stumbled on this article and found some great info on saddle fitting! So refreshing and validating to get female perspectives. lovelybike.blogspot.com/2011/04/on-female-anatomy-and-bicycle-saddles.html?m=1 Check it out if you are interested, and thanks for the reply! :)
@@gc1375 Excellent article! Very thoughtful and specific to women. I was surprised with the findings of the research. I would assume most people ride pain free, especially athletes who have access to the best of the best. Thank you for sharing!
I've got a B17 special and had the same experience with the agony of breaking in was hell on my sit bones...it was like sitting on a plastic bmx saddle from the 80s I didn't give up riding it, but did get frustrated and put a load of leather conditioner on the underside to soften as well as loosen tension bolt and it helped a lot, but after hundreds of miles on it, the first 15 miles riding I start to feel pressure discomfort on my sit bones. I just tolerate it as it was a lot of money and don't want to give up on it.
Yeah, that definitely sounds exactly the same as my experience! I ended up buying a Selle SMP TRK (Large). I've had it for over a year now and it's been comfortable right out of the box. It was cheap too!! I'm not sure where you're based but if you change saddles there's a very good second-hand market, with high prices, for Brooks saddles. So you could end up getting a lot of your money back if you decided to sell it. Take care. Jay
I'm pleased it helped. Since this review, I bought a Selle SMP TRK and I've been much happier with it. It's not perfect but it's much better. I hope you find something suitable. What are you using now?
Agree wholeheartedly with you, the wonderful chap Stephen Green still heads up the public face of the company in England has been very kind and swapped out a recent B-17 purchase by just simply replacing it, when things went wrong with it, but what was upsetting was a much loved titanium B-17 special that had the titanium nose cone shear apart - a saddle that had done over 55,000 km cycling and you can’t actually buy them anymore. Less than 10 years old, the biggest issue is that they want £60 to repair it, and many of the saddles you mention can be bought for a fraction of that on on sale at the usual Internet outlets. I worry about Brooks, it’s as if they will just become the saddles that get placed on bikes hung on walls in cycling cafés in France and England where some nostalgia is needed. Such a shame, I haven’t tried the Italian selle saddles you mention, but may consider them if my research into cheaper replaceable and day-one stable saddles doesn’t work out. For your information, I have seen three Brooks Saddles fail catastrophically in the last year and a half within 10 cycling friends who only four of them use them. Pretty poor quality output in that regard?
It's a shame quite frankly as I still have a soft spot for Brooks. Sorry to hear about your experiences but I think this is all too common now. I don't think I'd ever put a Brooks on my bike again. However, the Selle SMP TRK I have on my bike also has its issues. Fortunately, comfort isn't one of them though after 12,000 k it's now falling apart! JP
Well worn Brooks saddle looks better than a Factory new. Compare it to a Marcial art belt, a brand new saddle is like a white belt, a totally worn one is like a Black belt. You must ride it a lot to get yours as worn as you can. It means you are a hard core ciclist 😉
I’ve had several Brooks leather saddles and in my own experience the B17 is comfortable from day one. There seems to be a lot of fuss these days about breaking them in with copious amounts of (costly) Proofide. However, the first Brooks saddle I bought in my 20s was the narrow version of the B17 … I bought it from a small independent bike shop that was closing down at a bargain price as it came loose as it were without any packaging. Nor did it come with either Proofide or a Tensioning Spanner (neither of which had I ever heard of at the time and knew nothing about). I used the saddle on 2 or 3 bikes in succession and it lasted me 25 years before the frame actually broke. In all that time though, I never tensioned it or treated it with any Proofide at all. It was a Brown one, and the only stuff I ever put on it - from time to time - was brown shoe polish! I’ve perhaps gone a bit off track there, but would suggest that blokes with big inner thighs maybe, should look at the narrower versions in the Brooks range, but for most people, my feeling is that the tried and tested shape of the B17 will prove very comfortable. My advice though to anyone about to buy one is not to worry too much about all the Proofide and Spanner malarkey.
I completely agree about not needing to use Proofide or mess around with the spanner. I had one for ten years and it was brilliant without having to do anything with it. I so wish that I had kept it. Over 40 years ago now though!
I will be riding a Brooks saddle for the first time this season. I will be riding the C15 though instead of the B17. From what I understand much less break in time and much more durable. Thanks for the video. Cheers
@@Biking360 Currently using the saddle that came with my bike, it works OK but I have a nutter biking friend who likes to push me too hard and then I can't walk for weeks, so I thought the Brooks might help?
@@iandavies4514 Lol. Maybe you need to find a new friend! Sorry to hear you're having trouble with your existing saddle. What kind of mileage and riding are you doing.
@@Biking360 Mainly to 7-11 and Back and my housekeeper goes around the corner to a local shop for small groceries on my bike as well, so maybe 0.9km a year. I realise this is not what you would call heavy-duty touring but I think a better saddle would improve my comfort on the long ride. I'll bear what you said on finding a new friend in mind and start looking. Thanks again for an informative review.
I think this was a great honest review Jay. I tried a Selle Anatomica X saddle on a 1,000 mile (1609 km) tour of Texas and it was horrible by the time I finished. I have two other bikes with Charge Spoon saddles that are 100% more comfortable and cost $100 dollars less. Leather has a cool factor and is traditional and looks great on vintage style bikes but my butt will argue about long distance comfort. No one ever mentions a riders sit bone distance when talking about Brooks or Selle Anatomica but for me it's just to wide. Atb, Tony
@@Biking360 One bike has had the Charge Spoon for about a year and a half. The other about a year. Each saddle has about 1600 km riding time and are holding up wonderful. In fact, they still look new.
@@BluecollarBackcountry That's very valuable feedback. If the Selle SMP TRK doesn't work out I think the Charge Spoon is my next port of call. Any other suggestions?
@@Biking360 I don't really have other recommendations. I have a cheaper Selle Italia and a few others but once I started using the Charge Spoon I quit trying other saddles. At 145mm wide and the shape, they fit me perfectly. Good luck. Finding the right saddle can be a frustrating experience can't it? Atb, Tony
@@BluecollarBackcountry It's been a nightmare. However, I've just come off a 70km ride and the Selle SMP TRK has been more comfortable than the B17 on any of the 6,000kms I used it for. I'm cautiously optimistic but we will see. Appreciate the help and advice. Jay
Geez I'm glad somebody else had all these concerns. I bought a b17 6 months ago and i have all the same complaints. In a word compared to all my other saddles it is shocking.
Yeah, it seems like a lot of people are super positive about it. I've been using a Selle SMP TRKfor the last 2,000km and all my problems have disappeared. I definitely recommend it. What are you using now? Still teh B17??
@@Biking360 I have a salle Tioga gel seat that I've done 7 years on on the road bike and a serfas RX gel on my touring bike. I've put the brooks on my old mtb but I will be even taking that off soon and put the original mtb seat back on. Hey you can't say I havnt tried my best.
@@Biking360 I'm here in Melbourne Australia. And those seats are 220 bucks over here. I only paid 450 for the mtb near new 2nd hand. Seat cost near half price of a whole bike. I'm afraid that whole 135 year old design should be dead and buried to be honest. I get that it's a tradition and all but technology has produced beautiful gel seats.
Choice of saddle is a very personal thing. Every saddle will have people that love it and people that hate it. So many things affect the choice, rider weight, riding style, bike type, terrain and use etc. You just have to try different ones and find the right one for you. As for the B17 saddle I have watched a lot of reviews and most of them have been positive, especially about comfort. I have tried many different saddles and none of them have been great. I have ordered a B17 and will just have to see if it suits me.
Impressive that you rode it so long without finding it comfortable. Thanks for the honest review. I would say most Brooks fans wouldn't really mind the discoloration. It's part of the natural leather aesthetic. That said, the discoloration at the edges like that makes me wonder if that bit got wet while you rode it. Not ideal, of course. I'm not sure what else would cause such uneven discoloration.
I love the look of the saddle and really wanted it to work which is why I stuck with it for so long. Never used in the rain btw! Maybe the discolouration was because it was used in excessive heat and the sweat caused the problem but who knows?? Take care and thanks for taking the time to comment. JP
i have the carved b-17.. have put maybe 400 miles on it so far.. it hurt at first and is breaking in slowwwly but is really getting noticeably and steadily more comfortable. getting the right fore/aft and tilt settings was important but at this point i think it will be very good for a 100 mile ride by the time i hit 1000 miles.. we'll see..
That's great news. If the Brooks works it seems to work really well. Good luck with it but it sounds like you will be fine. What bike do you use it with ?
@@Biking360 i ride a mountain bike (montague) with road slick tires so i'm somewhat upright as the b-17 is made for. for my mostly shorter 5-10 mile rides i'm trying to speed up the super slow break in process by getting my underwear wet before riding :)
@@peabody3000 I've never heard of getting your underwear wet as helping to break in a B17. You learn something new every day! It's definitely dedication.
Get a tin of Properts saddle soap and soap it once per week without fail . Also about a capful of neatsfoot oil applied underneath and about twice per year ----- this will facilitate its conforming to your particular anatomy asap. Once it fits you like a glove you'll never sit on anything else .
That’s a shame you still have to find the right saddle for you. I like that you’re willing to take the heat on this. It’s a beloved piece of kit by so many people. It works great for me, and I plan on getting a second for my other bike.
Hey Rick. You're right it was hard having to give the B17 some negative comments. Ironically I love it too along with just about everyone else! I now have a Selle SMP TRK and it has worked brilliantly straight out of the box 2,000km in and sweet as. What bike do you have it on and what do you plan to put it on?
@@Biking360 right now it is on my surly ECR that I converted to road with drop bars and smaller tires. I’m using that until I can get replacement wheels for my Kona rove NRB. The surly conversion to street was intended to be a temporary thing while I wait on replacement wheel under warranty. But I like the surly so much, I’m going to keep them both outfitted for street with Brooks saddles. I have pictures on my Instagram account: instagram.com/rickurbphoto I’m glad you finally got your saddle situation straightened out though!
Not sure about different price ranges as I've not much experience with city bikes outside of owning a Trek 7.3. However, this is a bike I'd definitely recommend in the mid price category.
Sounds to me you had the same experience as I had with the B17. It was too wide for me, it's probably too wide for you. I switched to a Brooks Professional and it has been superb. I ride Brooks Swift saddles now. UTube bike fitting and saddles, shape makes a big difference. It's not the saddle that's bad it's your choice that's bad, as mine was.
It could be! I would love to try a different Brooks saddle and different sizes but the prices prevent me from trying too many out unfortunately. I do like the Brooks brand though so maybe I will give one of their saddles another try sometime in the future. Take care, ride safe, and Seasons greetings. JP
I am totally with you on your conclusions. Yt with the lack of nice leather bicycle saddles that look classic and good, in a modern shape,...there is some, but they are ugly. So Brooks and Selle Italia,...it is for the looks. And yeah is important too. Yet I am switching back as well, since I lack the sight on a saddle leather honey MTB/ATB Race format, the one I did see was an ugly ostrich leather one. There is none in EU, that is modern and looks like leather honey. The most that do, are fake leather. So.... we all want it, no people make them. So ... I maybe will or have to myself. Good luck, thanks for your honest review.
Thank you for the kind words. For your further information since this review I have been using a Selle TRK which is very comfortable. Take care and ride safe. JP
I have a b17 and I think it is awesome. It is heavy but that is no longer a concern of mine. I can ride all day in comfort. I was comfortable the day I put it on my bike. I guess everybody’s butt is different but this works for me.
I completely agree that everyone's backside is different and a bike saddle is a very personal choice. I also believe if the B17 works it works brilliantly like nothing else and looks incredible in the process. It's good to hear it's comfortable for you. What bike do you use it with?
I have this saddle I have nearly 1000kms on it now. Originally it was super hard and gave me a saddle sore. I read something online where you put a damp cloth and stuff it in the rails where you sit and go for a 10 minute ride. It has been a lot better since. I did try and get something else just to see if there was anything better out there but so far tried numerous others and the comfort was no where near the brooks so I have just put the brooks back on :) Brooks need a massive amount of set back due to their small rail lengths. I bought a rather expensive seatpost ‘nitto s84’ that helped a lot as I was sitting in the sweet spot rather than on the rivets at the back. That’s my two penneth anyway :)
I appreciate the feedback. I never knew that a Brooks saddle needed a big amount of setback so that's very interesting to me. It's great that you're now getting on with the saddle. it can be so difficult to find one that works well and is comfortable. What kind of riding and bike do you use it with?
@@Biking360 I have my bike on a Marin Muirwoods which is rigid hybrid come mountain bike. My seatpost has 37mm of setback and my seat is still nearly slammed all the way back on the rails. At the moment I use it for commuting and riding with my kids approx 100km a week but would like to test it on some longer rides. Also interested to try a brooks c17 too.
You're not going to believe this but I've just bought a used Surly ECR from the UK with a Brooks C17. My son is keeping it for me till I complete this trip before he shops it over. I'll let you know how I get on with it.
Sadly, Brooks B17 seem to be very fond of stripping their tensioning bolts which are virtually impossible to repair. My old saddle lasted 20 years but the next two saddles stripped their bolts. They are making these bolts from alloy these days which corrodes preventing the tensioning nut from turning. If you persist the bolt will fail.
Nice review and thanks for presenting it in such a clear and informative way. It's interesting that you experience so much rubbing from the flaps on the side of the saddle, I don't experience that at all so it's interesting to hear different perspectives. I personally like the Brooks B17 quite a lot, when I ride it I always wonder if there is something better out there but when I switch to a different saddle I really notice the difference and end up with a really sore back side even when wearing cycling shorts. I recently bought a Brooks Swallow which is narrower and doesn't have those flaps, I haven't put it on my bike yet because it's been so wet lately but maybe it would be worth looking at some of the other Brooks saddles?
Like yourself, I love Brooks saddles, and the B17, even though you wouldn't think so! When I had one 40 years ago it worked brilliantly. I think most of the issue is I'm now simply too fat and heavy!! Shortly after I released this video I got a Selle Pro TRK and it's been excellent. However, I'm not done with Brooks yet! I bought a Surly ECR last week and it has a Brooks Cambium saddle. I bought it in the UK and my son is shipping it to me here in Thailand. Once I get it I'm going to give it a go and who knows?? Stay safe JP
I think you should have gone with the B17 narrow or even with the pro special for better comfort based on your bike type vs the B17 Standard where it’s meant for more upright ride position. Just my 2 cents. I have a B17 Special on my folding bike and I love it and it’s super comfy.
Thanks for the input. I have relatively wide sit bones which is why I didn't go for the B17 narrow. I'm honestly surprised that things went badly with the B17 this time around given my previous excellent experiences with it. What kind of riding do you do on your folding bike?
@@Biking360 I normally do both short and long rides on my folding. I also have a RB and a hybrid but I’m enjoying my Dahon MU xls folding due to its flexibility and for the amount of cargo I can have on it (front and back rack).
@@Biking360 it’s been reliable so far. I love its internal hub gearing (8-speed Shimano Nexus) because you don’t need to pedal or in motion to switch or jump between gears. So helpful when taking off or starting from an uphill. Less maintenance as well because there no cassette and exposed RD to worry about. Pretty much just lube the chain.
@@mannyd.2185 I've heard great things about various internal hub gear systems. I'm still considering one for the future but I'm a little worried about how to fix it if it goes wrong when touring.
I never used it in the rain as it was the dry season here when I got it. I used Proofide a few times so it was well taken care of. The one I had back in the 70s I used in the rain never did anything to it and it was brilliant. I was 20 kgs lighter then though!!
Hi Biking 360 - Finally got around to viewing your saddle review here since I have the same saddle. As I mentioned previously to you mine is also still hard after 1000s of km. Now, I haven't treated the saddle with a leather softener at all and I'm wondering if you ever tried that? I think I remember that Brooks recommended some periodic application of saddle softener. Perhaps that would help us out ??? Thanks and a great review!
I've used Proofide on it but that's had no effect. I'm now using a Selle SMP TRK and it's way, way more comfortable than the B17 ever was. I've only done about 500kms on the Selle to date but it's looking very positive. As we all know saddles are such a personal thing but for me, the b17 just hasn't worked this time around which is disappointing. Are you still using your B17?
@@Biking360 thanks. I’d forgotten the Brooks Proofide name. No effect huh? Hmmm. Yes I have not tried switching saddles but may try that one you like. I may also try some horse saddle conditioner on it to see if that softens it up. I now wear riding pants with padding and that helps but up until a year ago I didn’t and i would get pretty sore from that hard saddle nose in particular. SMP also makes a saddle with a nose that drops away steeply so only your butt is supporting your weight. A friend uses that and likes it. Forget which model that is.
@@hervedelnorte7928 I think the Selle with the steep dropping nose is the SMP PRO. That's the one Mark Beaumont used twice to cycle around the world! If you're still struggling with the B17 I'd definitely consider a swap. For me, changing my saddle has made a huge difference to my comfort and enjoyment of the rides. If you don't try the SMP TRK I've also heard very good things about the Charge Spoon.
@@Biking360 thanks for the info. I will be in one bike store tomorrow but not sure what saddle choices he has. P.S. are you using bike shoes and clip in pedals or just standard peddles?
Nice vid brother, it's a shame it didnt work for you, one would think after 6000k itd be nice and supple. I'll let ya know how it goes for me.... take care, peace
@@Biking360 lol, no, that's thinking to far in advance... probably the one you're using now or also heard good things about the Specialized Power saddles, but so far I'm happy with the brooks, it's starting to mold to my ass fairly well
I bought a B17 it was comfortable out of the box but unfortunately I had to exchange it as the leather had a cut (not a scratch). The new one I received which I have ridden 900 kms on is killing my bum and back. I've swapped it out with my gel saddle and thinking about selling the brooks. Very disappointed as I love the looks of it
@@Biking360 I have a San marco Bio active it is a fat and wide saddle but I use my bike for communting to and from work 18kms each way. I only got the brook because it looked nice but I didnt think it would hurt me this much. it properly will break me before i break it in.
The Brooks are great for some people and awful for some too. The quality varies quite a bit, which makes sense considering the leather is a natural product with a lot of variation, but in my opinion it is one of the major downsides of a Brooks. Some people modify the saddles and lace down the side flaps to prevent them flaring out as you describe, hitting their thighs. This will make the saddle stiffer as well though. Perhaps the saddle is just too wide for you and your riding position? Brooks makes narrower saddles, but the descriptions they give them are rather unhelpful. Some people swear by the Brooks Team Professional, it is a bit narrower and has more pedalling freedom. The 'Pro' generally has thicker, tougher leather though, so it takes a lot longer to break in, and may feel especially harsh at first. This saddle is intended for hunched over riding, but maybe it works well with narrower sitbones. There's also the B17 Narrow, which is a very narrow version of the B17 for maximum pedalling clearance, even narrower than the Team Professional. This is only good when you have really narrow sitbones or are riding in an extreme, low aero position. Specifically aimed at racing they also make the classic very narrow 'Swallow', but from what I've read this saddle is not very durable and tends to sag rather quickly.
I appreciate the very detailed analysis and I'm in full agreement. Unfortunately, I have wide sit bones that rule out any of Brooks narrower saddles so I've changed the B17 for a Selle SMP TRK. It's not perfect but it's appreciably more comfortable than the B17. I'm still looking for something even more comfortable and I'm very open to suggestions if you have any ideas? I'd be interested to know what you are using and how you get on with it. Ride safe. JP
No. It wasn't that. I used proofide as instructed. I honestly think the quality of finish is wanting. In comparison, I had a black B17 over 40 years ago, and totally abused it, but it was fine. Thanks for watching and ride safe. JP
@@Biking360 im very skinny person after - +5 months, it starts breaking in, and quite comfortable in my butt, i feel my brooks like hammock now, once i ever wearing my brooks on medium rainy days... Sorry my english not very good cheers
I‘m no expert, but I really think you have chosen the wrong saddle for your type of bike. The B17 is definitely a touring bike saddle . As soon as you lean more forward with your upper body, it‘s not comfortable anymore (you mentioned the problem parts) and it‘s clear that you need a lot of time to break it in as you have much less weight on the saddle with your riding style. I think it‘s not the saddle. Saddle and bike don‘t match.
Hey Vicky. I appreciate your comment and feedback. I agree completely with what you say about this being the wrong saddle if you are using it in a more aggressive position for fasting riding. I have two road bikes, one vintage, and one modern, and use very different saddles, with long narrow noses, for this specific purpose. The B17 was used exclusively on my Surly LHT touring bike and nothing else. When I was a teenager I used the B17 for touring for over ten years, and a lot of miles, and had zero problems. I honestly think my recent discomfort was because I'm simply too heavy! I'm now using a Selle TRK with no issues. Saddles are such a personal thing I'm sure you'll agree? What kind of bike, and saddle do you use?
@@Biking360 it‘s definitely a touring bike, but right now I‘m thinking of switching to a cross or gravel bike due to a narrow pedal width stance (or Q factor). We will see!
I used mink oil and it broke in pretty quick (maybe 200 miles) - not sure I was supposed to do that but I'm not waiting several thousand miles to get comfortable even if shortens saddle life.
@@Biking360 Couple of years and no problems. Well apart from the saddle stinks for the first few rides so dont wear your best shorts. I dont wear padded shorts with it anymore and that seems to work better for comfort bizarrely. Switched to the normal brooks recommended paste now its broken in
Mine broke after a year of minimal use and Brooks did not honor their warranty. I will never give them another penny. The build quality isn't what it used to be.
Most of what you said is quite contrary to my experience in EVERY way. Your assessments didn't tie in with any of mine. Not the best design of saddle? Over 1/2 a million might disagree over the last few decades. Including me! Comfort - 10/10 (1000mls+ and didn't know the saddle was there) Durability - 10/10 stains don't count Break in - 9/10 - cp other users Chafing - 10/10 i.e. nil Leg movement - 9+/10 - no problems whatsoever Looks - 10/10 on any bike - Classic looks, classic performance OPINIONS DIFFER
Thanks for the input. I wish my experience had been more positive. I had such great memories of the B17 as a youngster that I bought and built a touring bike around the one in the review. It got me back into touring so I'm really grateful for that. I rode on the B17 for 6,000 km so you can't say I didn't give it a fair go. It was uncomfortable for virtually all of it! As you rightly say, opinions differ, and most reviews are on your side of the fence and disagree with my assessment.
I wanted to love it and I built a touring bike around it and began touring again because of this saddle. I owe it a lot but it is never going on of my bikes again!
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Thanks for the honest review.
You're welcome.
This has been very informative, thank you!
You're welcome :)
I bought a B17 in 1982. It was very hard, I melted proofhide to rub into the underside, and polished the top with shoe polish & dubbin.
After about 2 years use it was comfortable.
I took care of it, polishing with shoepolish / dubbin. But regretted that it was black, and did not have the brass rivets. It did stretch a little, so I bought a spanner to stretch it and it was fine again. (lasted to ~2007 = 25 years)
Now I have a honey swift, not done anything to it yet, probably needs a polish soon.
I suggest you give it a good polish with dubbin & leave it for a few weeks, then polish it again with shoe polish. ( I think proofhide is a waste of time / money). Even if you don't use it a nicely polished B17 can be sold easily.
I'm honestly not sure what to do with it now. I've been using a Selle SMP TRK on my touring bike for the last 9 months and it's been comfortable. I've just ordered the gel version which I'll put on my tourer and move the older one onto another bike. I feel reluctant to use the B17 again as it nearly ruined my tour of Northern Thailand last year. I also don't want to sell it. Plus, it would be hard to do as it looks like crap anyway. I'll probably just keep it on display as an ornament! Anyway, pleased yours worked out for you. That's always good to hear. Have a great Xmas and New Year. JP
Nice review Jay. Got the same saddle, came with my Nomad. It took a while to get used to it, very hard to begin with but softened up nicely. I haven’t experienced any fading like you, strange. Nor do I have an issue with the saddle rubbing my thighs. I found that cycling in padded shorts didn’t work for me in this saddle, I wear loose fitting jocks and pants and try keep undies dry as best I can and my backside is happy :) so, from almost dumping it, to loving it :) safe riding!
That's interesting. I'm particularly interested that you say you got better results not wearing padded shorts. I might try that on my city run-around bike and see how it goes. I haven't dumped it but it is now sitting on a shelf and has been replaced on my touring bike with a Selle SMP TRK which I find much more comfortable. Appreciate the feedback and as I'm sure you'll agree saddles are such a personal thing! Have a great Easter weekend and I hope you get the chance to get out on the bike. JP
"breaking in" is a trick that companies are shoving down our throat to keep the product and not return in. I believe a product should serve it's purpose since day one especially when in comes to comfort. Do not fail for this as I did with brooks saddles. Did hundreds of miles on mine, and I struggle to believe if either my anatomy adapted to the pressure points or the saddle broken in. I'm more inclined to believe that it's the anatomy. Opinions may vary, but this was my experience and I resonate with mostly this man said
I have a b17 with 17,000 miles and a b17 special with 25,000, a flyer with 1200 and i couldn't imagine not using one. Break in was 200 - 500 miles with proofide on the underside. Keeping the tension and knowing how to gauge it is important. I also love the discoloration on the brown ones, tells a story.
I gave up on it a while ago and have been using a Selle TRK. However, I was wondering if maybe a cutaway B17 would be a better option for me and maybe take off a little tension and let it sag a touch. Any thoughts?
And the flyer is more confortable or not? For long traveling on a BTT.
Thank you.
I also have a flyer, it has only 2000 miles. It needed no breaking in period as the springs absorb most of the pressure without feeling too bouncy. They are the correct springiness for me 80kg. Over long distance touring I will still use a b17 as I'm moving around more and find them more than adequate without cycling shorts over 80-100 mile days. I have the flyer on an ebike which I pedal very lightly so more weight on the saddle, travel faster so hit potholes harder, and don't need to save weight. I was worried about it creaking but I just oiled the silver shoulder plate where it seats on the nosepiece as it is metal on metal and meant to move when adjusted , but that creaked on my b17 as well, so the springs haven't added any noise yet.also wonder if the flyer makes the overall bike faster as less energy is being lost through road vibration when the riders weight is absorbed away from the tyres?
Could not agree more, used a B17 on my Thailand tour and the sides rubbed on the inner thigh. Used it on my return for 30-80km trips and was ok....but the inner thigh rub is a real pain....I agree and bought a selle SMP TRK as used by Mark Beaumont and love it...great video and happy riding mate.
It sounds like we've had a very similar experience with the B17. Since I changed to the Selle SMP TRK things for me are also much better. How long have you had you TRK?
@@Biking360 hey mate. I’ve used the TRK on my cannondale and giant bikes, I have a video on my channel
Of my 300km in a day-using that saddle....I love it, just bought a salsa gravel bike and fitted one to it, the B17 I fitted on the fat bike (video as well :)). And loved it for shorter rides, I just found it always rubbed the inner thigh...happy riding mate🙏🏼👊🏼
Like any saddle it needs to support your sit bones and that involves playing around with the tilt angle. It won't be suitable for some bicycles that have you stretched out too far and I found that there wasn't a break=in period if you adjust it correctly and it fits your sit bones, then it's comfortable straight out of the box. You also need to play around with the tension screw so that it isn't to tight and also doesn't sag too much. Get all of these things right and its very comfortable. If the sides cause chaffing, then tie them together to stop them splaying out. When it is working it is almost magical comfort, but when it isn't working it is very uncomfortable, so its worth playing around with to try different settings to better fit your sit bones..
I can see where you are coming from. I am riding my B17 for 7000 km now and breaking in is still not finished. Yet there is no other saddle that fits me better.
I gave up at 6,000km! Maybe too early but who knows!! Good luck with breaking it in and I'd be interested to know how it goes.
A saddle I have considered. I have opted to use the one that came with the bike. Haven't had any issues with it but I also try to limit the distances I ride each day (35-50 miles). Very thorough review.
What's the saddle that came with your bike?
@@Biking360 I believe their standard saddle. It's th Oval 344. Last time I looked still used on current Fuji Touring bike.
@@whatsupwithrichard I've not heard of the Oval 344 but if it works it works. Love those Fujis btw. I bet you've made some great memories with it!
I've always saw this saddle and thought to myself.. that looks nice but uncomfortable 🤣 great review!
Hey Alex. It worked brilliantly for me when I was about your age and weight! This time around it's been a let down as you saw from the video. My best advice is if you have a saddle that's comfortable hang on to it! What did you use on your last tour and how was it?
@@Biking360 my saddle is okay for a few hours then it's quite uncomfortable. So I'm thinking of getting a new seat. But at the same time it could be the hours I'm putting in on it at one time. My saddle is a wtb volt sport which comes stock on my bike.
@@nomadicalex6218 I not familiar with the WTB Volt. How about seeing if you're LBS does loan saddles to try and sort out something more comfortable?
Different saddles for each rider. Ive only had my B17 a very short time, less than 200km. Fortunately I found mine to be comfortable right out of the box. To each three own of course.
That's great news and it sounds like you'll be fine. Good luck with it and take care 👍
I thought that it didn't look all that comfortable. But then I like softer saddles anyway. Great review.
I think I do too now! What do you use for touring?
I'm no touring cyclist. What tends to limit the length of my ride is seat comfort. Recently bought a bike with a B17. Right out of the gate it been the most comfortable riding saddle I've ever had. I know some of that is also likely due to the geometry of the bike, but I can't get over my ass not going flat after 10 miles or so.
That's great to hear. I honestly think when the B17 works well it works brilliantly. If you find a saddle that's comfortable make sure you hang on to it :)
I previously used to ride 50Kms with some pain , but past few months I have had to cut down to 20KMS . On the hunt for a solution .
I have been using a Selle SMP TRK for about two and a half years now and it is excellent. No pain. They have a wide version if you have large size bones. Highly recommend it.
Very good review. I bought the B17 after two VERY uncomfortable saddles. Right from the start it was very comfortable and fit well.
Interesting how so many people approve or dislike it. But that is the beauty of sharing our experience 👍
I'm really pleased the B17 is working for you. I'm sure you'll agree there's nothing worse than riding around with a sore backside! What kind of bike and riding do you use our B17 for?
I am 67 so went with petal assist and it has made bike riding fun again! 50+ miles and the B17 worked for me but I would be hesitate to recommend it for my friends price wise.
@@R0dan Fair play to you. Riding 50 + miles can take you to some great places in a day. What's pedal-assist like up the hills?
There is four different settings so you pick. Hills are a breeze if you choose to do so. I have blown up hills that I never would have been able to in my younger years. I know a lot of purists would never go near pedal assist but to each their own. I had quit riding for 10 years because I had lost the desire. But as I have said...it is fun again!
@@R0dan I'm a big fan of pedal assist though I don't use it at the moment. I think the purist attitude is ridiculous. We're all two-wheeled brothers and should stick together. Stay safe. JP
I am breaking in a B66. Never rode Brooks. I noticed the adjustment nut under zero tension. I took the play out plus a quarter turn. My hopes are high, feels pretty good!
That sounds great. Good luck with it. Brooks makes excellent saddles which when they work well work brilliantly. Happy and safe riding.
I love mine. It's done many a comfy mile. I never had an issue with a break in period. Rode it from the get go without knicks. Loosen the adjuster bolt a little when they're new.
I have not had any discomfort, rubbing or chaffing at all. But saddles are as personal as underwear 👍
Cheers mate.
What bike have you got it on now and what kind of mileage have you done on it?
@@Biking360 I have it on my Kona Sutra. I bought it in 2016. At least 6000 plus km. But as I said, saddles are personal. I've found with the B17 people either love them, or hate them. We're all different. 👍
@@OldBumOnABike You're so right about saddles being a highly personal affair. How do you find the Kona sutra on longer rides?
@@Biking360 absolutely love it. It is the best bike I've owned.
Great review, that colour fade is called character and patina.
Enjoyed this and another of yours i'm watching.
Subscribed.
Regards, a 60 y/o Brit from Udon, life long motorcyclist who just got back.into cycling last year.
Great stuff, cheers.
Hey Michael. Great to hear you're back into cycling again. Appreciate the comment and subscription. Ride safe. JP
Honest review, thanks. I tried a C17 and gave up on it after 500km, supposed to be comfortable from the start. Ha!! I decided to try a Brooks Swift as I have narrow sit bones so B17 is a bit wide for me, and as you mentioned here, I didn't like the deep sides. Only done 50k so far, uncomfortable, so a lot more breaking in to do and hoping I don't end up with the same conclusions as you. Cheers
It's definitely worth persevering with, at least for a while, because when the B17 works it seems to do so brilliantly. Though on the flip side it may be nothing but trouble! Good luck and let me know how you get on. Ride safe. JP
I have two B17s. One is the short, women's version and the other is the standard (came stock with a bike). The women's saddle has not worked out well for me. The standard is perfect. Also, it is breaking in better. So I have a love/hate relationship with the B17. Thanks for this honest review.
Saddles are such a personal thing. I'm pleased you have something that's working for you though a little surprised the standard feel better than the ladies version. What ever works though eh? Jay
What about the B17 standard vs the B17s do you like/not like? What makes one work over the other for you? I have had a hard time finding women's reviews and perspectives on Brooks saddles but I am interested in buying one. Hesitating between B17, B17s, and the cut-out versions of both of those. I'd love to hear your thoughts!
(By the way, I'm from Ontario too, and I recently discovered your channel/instagram. Keep up the great work!)
@@gc1375 Hello fellow Ontarian! Thanks for your comment and for the finding my channel. To answer your question - I think it comes down to the length of the rails. B17s is a shorter saddle with shorter rails, which leaves less room for it to be adjusted on the seat post. I find that I am always "hanging over" the back of the saddle, as ideally I'd like to be able to move it back about a cm, but I am unable to do so because of the shorter rails.
In comparison, the standard B17 offers a lot more range in terms of adjustability (longer rails) and because of this I find it a lot more comfortable. So the comfort may not have anything to do with the saddle itself (the top of the saddle), but rather with the ability to adjust it for the best fit. I hope this makes sense, if it doesn't, please let me know.
If you haven't found their channel yet, Rad Bike Adventure are a channel of two women who love their Brooks saddles. They have a variety of them. Here's one of their videos ruclips.net/video/2PazFwYTfJM/видео.html.
@@WheelsonaBike Yes, I love Rad Bike Adventure and have watched their Brooks videos many times! They're awesome!
What you are saying totally makes sense, thank you. I am trying to research as much as I can because I simply don't believe that the one model marketed as "the women's version" is necessarily the right one. I actually stumbled on this article and found some great info on saddle fitting! So refreshing and validating to get female perspectives. lovelybike.blogspot.com/2011/04/on-female-anatomy-and-bicycle-saddles.html?m=1
Check it out if you are interested, and thanks for the reply! :)
@@gc1375 Excellent article! Very thoughtful and specific to women. I was surprised with the findings of the research. I would assume most people ride pain free, especially athletes who have access to the best of the best. Thank you for sharing!
I've got a B17 special and had the same experience with the agony of breaking in was hell on my sit bones...it was like sitting on a plastic bmx saddle from the 80s
I didn't give up riding it, but did get frustrated and put a load of leather conditioner on the underside to soften as well as loosen tension bolt and it helped a lot, but after hundreds of miles on it, the first 15 miles riding I start to feel pressure discomfort on my sit bones.
I just tolerate it as it was a lot of money and don't want to give up on it.
Yeah, that definitely sounds exactly the same as my experience! I ended up buying a Selle SMP TRK (Large). I've had it for over a year now and it's been comfortable right out of the box. It was cheap too!! I'm not sure where you're based but if you change saddles there's a very good second-hand market, with high prices, for Brooks saddles. So you could end up getting a lot of your money back if you decided to sell it. Take care. Jay
Excellent honest review, thank you for posting this has helped me decide about not getting one.
I'm pleased it helped. Since this review, I bought a Selle SMP TRK and I've been much happier with it. It's not perfect but it's much better. I hope you find something suitable. What are you using now?
Agree wholeheartedly with you, the wonderful chap Stephen Green still heads up the public face of the company in England has been very kind and swapped out a recent B-17 purchase by just simply replacing it, when things went wrong with it, but what was upsetting was a much loved titanium B-17 special that had the titanium nose cone shear apart - a saddle that had done over 55,000 km cycling and you can’t actually buy them anymore.
Less than 10 years old, the biggest issue is that they want £60 to repair it, and many of the saddles you mention can be bought for a fraction of that on on sale at the usual Internet outlets. I worry about Brooks, it’s as if they will just become the saddles that get placed on bikes hung on walls in cycling cafés in France and England where some nostalgia is needed. Such a shame, I haven’t tried the Italian selle saddles you mention, but may consider them if my research into cheaper replaceable and day-one stable saddles doesn’t work out.
For your information, I have seen three Brooks Saddles fail catastrophically in the last year and a half within 10 cycling friends who only four of them use them.
Pretty poor quality output in that regard?
It's a shame quite frankly as I still have a soft spot for Brooks. Sorry to hear about your experiences but I think this is all too common now. I don't think I'd ever put a Brooks on my bike again. However, the Selle SMP TRK I have on my bike also has its issues. Fortunately, comfort isn't one of them though after 12,000 k it's now falling apart! JP
@@Biking360 enjoyed your review of the Ortlieb panniers as well! Good work top-notch 👍
@@AndrewBeardsmore-AndyOsira Thanks very much that's greatly appreciated. The panniers are still going strong and totally awesome btw :)
I tried Brooks and I am so happy to be back on Fizcik
I hear you. I'm now using Fizik Arione on my road bikes and Selle SMP TRK on my other bikes with no problems. Ride safe. JP
Well worn Brooks saddle looks better than a Factory new.
Compare it to a Marcial art belt, a brand new saddle is like a white belt, a totally worn one is like a Black belt.
You must ride it a lot to get yours as worn as you can. It means you are a hard core ciclist 😉
I’ve had several Brooks leather saddles and in my own experience the B17 is comfortable from day one. There seems to be a lot of fuss these days about breaking them in with copious amounts of (costly) Proofide. However, the first Brooks saddle I bought in my 20s was the narrow version of the B17 … I bought it from a small independent bike shop that was closing down at a bargain price as it came loose as it were without any packaging. Nor did it come with either Proofide or a Tensioning Spanner (neither of which had I ever heard of at the time and knew nothing about). I used the saddle on 2 or 3 bikes in succession and it lasted me 25 years before the frame actually broke. In all that time though, I never tensioned it or treated it with any Proofide at all. It was a Brown one, and the only stuff I ever put on it - from time to time - was brown shoe polish! I’ve perhaps gone a bit off track there, but would suggest that blokes with big inner thighs maybe, should look at the narrower versions in the Brooks range, but for most people, my feeling is that the tried and tested shape of the B17 will prove very comfortable. My advice though to anyone about to buy one is not to worry too much about all the Proofide and Spanner malarkey.
I completely agree about not needing to use Proofide or mess around with the spanner. I had one for ten years and it was brilliant without having to do anything with it. I so wish that I had kept it. Over 40 years ago now though!
I will be riding a Brooks saddle for the first time this season. I will be riding the C15 though instead of the B17. From what I understand much less break in time and much more durable. Thanks for the video. Cheers
Hey there. My understanding is exactly the same. I'll keep an eye out for a review from you to see how it goes. Good luck!
Very interesting perspective, thanks for the review, very informative.
I'm pleased it's helped. What are you using at the moment? Are you thinking of changing? JP
@@Biking360 Currently using the saddle that came with my bike, it works OK but I have a nutter biking friend who likes to push me too hard and then I can't walk for weeks, so I thought the Brooks might help?
@@iandavies4514 Lol. Maybe you need to find a new friend! Sorry to hear you're having trouble with your existing saddle. What kind of mileage and riding are you doing.
@@Biking360 Mainly to 7-11 and Back and my housekeeper goes around the corner to a local shop for small groceries on my bike as well, so maybe 0.9km a year. I realise this is not what you would call heavy-duty touring but I think a better saddle would improve my comfort on the long ride. I'll bear what you said on finding a new friend in mind and start looking. Thanks again for an informative review.
@@iandavies4514 Lol. I think you should be ok with saddle you have as long as you steer clear of your maniac friend :)
The best adn honest opinion!
Thanks 🙏
I think this was a great honest review Jay. I tried a Selle Anatomica X saddle on a 1,000 mile (1609 km) tour of Texas and it was horrible by the time I finished. I have two other bikes with Charge Spoon saddles that are 100% more comfortable and cost $100 dollars less. Leather has a cool factor and is traditional and looks great on vintage style bikes but my butt will argue about long distance comfort. No one ever mentions a riders sit bone distance when talking about Brooks or Selle Anatomica but for me it's just to wide. Atb, Tony
I hear good things about Charge Spoon which is why I included them as an alternative. how long have you had the Charge Spoons for?
@@Biking360 One bike has had the Charge Spoon for about a year and a half. The other about a year. Each saddle has about 1600 km riding time and are holding up wonderful. In fact, they still look new.
@@BluecollarBackcountry That's very valuable feedback. If the Selle SMP TRK doesn't work out I think the Charge Spoon is my next port of call. Any other suggestions?
@@Biking360 I don't really have other recommendations. I have a cheaper Selle Italia and a few others but once I started using the Charge Spoon I quit trying other saddles. At 145mm wide and the shape, they fit me perfectly. Good luck. Finding the right saddle can be a frustrating experience can't it? Atb, Tony
@@BluecollarBackcountry It's been a nightmare. However, I've just come off a 70km ride and the Selle SMP TRK has been more comfortable than the B17 on any of the 6,000kms I used it for. I'm cautiously optimistic but we will see. Appreciate the help and advice. Jay
Geez I'm glad somebody else had all these concerns. I bought a b17 6 months ago and i have all the same complaints. In a word compared to all my other saddles it is shocking.
Yeah, it seems like a lot of people are super positive about it. I've been using a Selle SMP TRKfor the last 2,000km and all my problems have disappeared. I definitely recommend it. What are you using now? Still teh B17??
@@Biking360 I have a salle Tioga gel seat that I've done 7 years on on the road bike and a serfas RX gel on my touring bike. I've put the brooks on my old mtb but I will be even taking that off soon and put the original mtb seat back on. Hey you can't say I havnt tried my best.
@@Mark-f7o Lol! That's exactly what I thought when I took off my B17. Disappointing but never again! You doing much touring atm?
@@Biking360 I'm here in Melbourne Australia. And those seats are 220 bucks over here. I only paid 450 for the mtb near new 2nd hand. Seat cost near half price of a whole bike. I'm afraid that whole 135 year old design should be dead and buried to be honest. I get that it's a tradition and all but technology has produced beautiful gel seats.
@@Mark-f7o I'm with you. Technology has moved on. A great part of the world you're in there. I was in Melbourne back in 98 and loved it :)
Choice of saddle is a very personal thing. Every saddle will have people that love it and people that hate it. So many things affect the choice, rider weight, riding style, bike type, terrain and use etc. You just have to try different ones and find the right one for you.
As for the B17 saddle I have watched a lot of reviews and most of them have been positive, especially about comfort. I have tried many different saddles and none of them have been great. I have ordered a B17 and will just have to see if it suits me.
I hope it goes well. I agree with your analysis that most people like it and find it comfortable so hopefully, you will be fine. Good luck :)
Hey did you get it? How is it?
Impressive that you rode it so long without finding it comfortable. Thanks for the honest review. I would say most Brooks fans wouldn't really mind the discoloration. It's part of the natural leather aesthetic. That said, the discoloration at the edges like that makes me wonder if that bit got wet while you rode it. Not ideal, of course. I'm not sure what else would cause such uneven discoloration.
I love the look of the saddle and really wanted it to work which is why I stuck with it for so long. Never used in the rain btw! Maybe the discolouration was because it was used in excessive heat and the sweat caused the problem but who knows?? Take care and thanks for taking the time to comment. JP
Leather does wear in. Definitely don’t get them wet and dry off and use leather care kit helps prevent it and wearing them in more evenly.
i have the carved b-17.. have put maybe 400 miles on it so far.. it hurt at first and is breaking in slowwwly but is really getting noticeably and steadily more comfortable. getting the right fore/aft and tilt settings was important but at this point i think it will be very good for a 100 mile ride by the time i hit 1000 miles.. we'll see..
That's great news. If the Brooks works it seems to work really well. Good luck with it but it sounds like you will be fine. What bike do you use it with ?
@@Biking360 i ride a mountain bike (montague) with road slick tires so i'm somewhat upright as the b-17 is made for. for my mostly shorter 5-10 mile rides i'm trying to speed up the super slow break in process by getting my underwear wet before riding :)
@@peabody3000 I've never heard of getting your underwear wet as helping to break in a B17. You learn something new every day! It's definitely dedication.
I'm currently trying to break in a Brooks saddle and find it pretty uncomfortable too at the moment. Hoping to see changes
I wish you the best of luck. How many miles/kilometers have you had it and how far do you typically ride?
Get a tin of Properts saddle soap and soap it once per week without fail . Also about a capful of neatsfoot oil applied underneath and about twice per year ----- this will facilitate its conforming to your particular anatomy asap. Once it fits you like a glove you'll never sit on anything else .
That’s a shame you still have to find the right saddle for you. I like that you’re willing to take the heat on this. It’s a beloved piece of kit by so many people. It works great for me, and I plan on getting a second for my other bike.
Hey Rick. You're right it was hard having to give the B17 some negative comments. Ironically I love it too along with just about everyone else! I now have a Selle SMP TRK and it has worked brilliantly straight out of the box 2,000km in and sweet as. What bike do you have it on and what do you plan to put it on?
@@Biking360 right now it is on my surly ECR that I converted to road with drop bars and smaller tires. I’m using that until I can get replacement wheels for my Kona rove NRB. The surly conversion to street was intended to be a temporary thing while I wait on replacement wheel under warranty. But I like the surly so much, I’m going to keep them both outfitted for street with Brooks saddles. I have pictures on my Instagram account: instagram.com/rickurbphoto
I’m glad you finally got your saddle situation straightened out though!
Hello i am boughting a brand new city bike for commuting. What do you suggest in different price gabs?
Not sure about different price ranges as I've not much experience with city bikes outside of owning a Trek 7.3. However, this is a bike I'd definitely recommend in the mid price category.
Sounds to me you had the same experience as I had with the B17. It was too wide for me, it's probably too wide for you. I switched to a Brooks Professional and it has been superb. I ride Brooks Swift saddles now. UTube bike fitting and saddles, shape makes a big difference. It's not the saddle that's bad it's your choice that's bad, as mine was.
It could be! I would love to try a different Brooks saddle and different sizes but the prices prevent me from trying too many out unfortunately. I do like the Brooks brand though so maybe I will give one of their saddles another try sometime in the future. Take care, ride safe, and Seasons greetings. JP
Keep Spa cycles in mind I've got a couple of them and they're great. Maybe a Spa cycles Wharfe Deluxe on offer now for £62.00.@@Biking360
I am totally with you on your conclusions. Yt with the lack of nice leather bicycle saddles that look classic and good, in a modern shape,...there is some, but they are ugly. So Brooks and Selle Italia,...it is for the looks. And yeah is important too. Yet I am switching back as well, since I lack the sight on a saddle leather honey MTB/ATB Race format, the one I did see was an ugly ostrich leather one. There is none in EU, that is modern and looks like leather honey. The most that do, are fake leather. So.... we all want it, no people make them. So ... I maybe will or have to myself. Good luck, thanks for your honest review.
Thank you for the kind words. For your further information since this review I have been using a Selle TRK which is very comfortable. Take care and ride safe. JP
I have a b17 and I think it is awesome. It is heavy but that is no longer a concern of mine. I can ride all day in comfort. I was comfortable the day I put it on my bike.
I guess everybody’s butt is different but this works for me.
I completely agree that everyone's backside is different and a bike saddle is a very personal choice. I also believe if the B17 works it works brilliantly like nothing else and looks incredible in the process. It's good to hear it's comfortable for you. What bike do you use it with?
Don't exaggerate, it's very expensive. After all, it's just a piece of leather on a bent wire. Half the price, it's the Brooks name.
Interesting review!
In what way?
I have this saddle I have nearly 1000kms on it now. Originally it was super hard and gave me a saddle sore. I read something online where you put a damp cloth and stuff it in the rails where you sit and go for a 10 minute ride. It has been a lot better since. I did try and get something else just to see if there was anything better out there but so far tried numerous others and the comfort was no where near the brooks so I have just put the brooks back on :)
Brooks need a massive amount of set back due to their small rail lengths. I bought a rather expensive seatpost ‘nitto s84’ that helped a lot as I was sitting in the sweet spot rather than on the rivets at the back.
That’s my two penneth anyway :)
I appreciate the feedback. I never knew that a Brooks saddle needed a big amount of setback so that's very interesting to me. It's great that you're now getting on with the saddle. it can be so difficult to find one that works well and is comfortable. What kind of riding and bike do you use it with?
@@Biking360 I have my bike on a Marin Muirwoods which is rigid hybrid come mountain bike. My seatpost has 37mm of setback and my seat is still nearly slammed all the way back on the rails. At the moment I use it for commuting and riding with my kids approx 100km a week but would like to test it on some longer rides. Also interested to try a brooks c17 too.
You're not going to believe this but I've just bought a used Surly ECR from the UK with a Brooks C17. My son is keeping it for me till I complete this trip before he shops it over. I'll let you know how I get on with it.
@@Biking360 yes please do look forward to hear your thoughts!
Sadly, Brooks B17 seem to be very fond of stripping their tensioning bolts which are virtually impossible to repair.
My old saddle lasted 20 years but the next two saddles stripped their bolts. They are making these bolts from alloy these days which corrodes preventing the tensioning nut from turning. If you persist the bolt will fail.
Thanks for the feedback. I had no idea about the issue with the tension bolts!
Nice review and thanks for presenting it in such a clear and informative way. It's interesting that you experience so much rubbing from the flaps on the side of the saddle, I don't experience that at all so it's interesting to hear different perspectives. I personally like the Brooks B17 quite a lot, when I ride it I always wonder if there is something better out there but when I switch to a different saddle I really notice the difference and end up with a really sore back side even when wearing cycling shorts. I recently bought a Brooks Swallow which is narrower and doesn't have those flaps, I haven't put it on my bike yet because it's been so wet lately but maybe it would be worth looking at some of the other Brooks saddles?
Like yourself, I love Brooks saddles, and the B17, even though you wouldn't think so! When I had one 40 years ago it worked brilliantly. I think most of the issue is I'm now simply too fat and heavy!! Shortly after I released this video I got a Selle Pro TRK and it's been excellent. However, I'm not done with Brooks yet! I bought a Surly ECR last week and it has a Brooks Cambium saddle. I bought it in the UK and my son is shipping it to me here in Thailand. Once I get it I'm going to give it a go and who knows?? Stay safe JP
Cut the flaps off with a Stanley knife and sanpaper the cut edges smooth , no more rubbing AND perfect comfort .
I think you should have gone with the B17 narrow or even with the pro special for better comfort based on your bike type vs the B17 Standard where it’s meant for more upright ride position. Just my 2 cents. I have a B17 Special on my folding bike and I love it and it’s super comfy.
Thanks for the input. I have relatively wide sit bones which is why I didn't go for the B17 narrow. I'm honestly surprised that things went badly with the B17 this time around given my previous excellent experiences with it. What kind of riding do you do on your folding bike?
@@Biking360 I normally do both short and long rides on my folding. I also have a RB and a hybrid but I’m enjoying my Dahon MU xls folding due to its flexibility and for the amount of cargo I can have on it (front and back rack).
@@mannyd.2185 I've just had to look up the Dahon MU xls. I'm surprised how light it is. It looks pretty solid. Is it reliable?
@@Biking360 it’s been reliable so far. I love its internal hub gearing (8-speed Shimano Nexus) because you don’t need to pedal or in motion to switch or jump between gears. So helpful when taking off or starting from an uphill. Less maintenance as well because there no cassette and exposed RD to worry about. Pretty much just lube the chain.
@@mannyd.2185 I've heard great things about various internal hub gear systems. I'm still considering one for the future but I'm a little worried about how to fix it if it goes wrong when touring.
Take care on wherever you do biking my friend. Safety comes first.
I dont know how to bike
Thank you for you. I try to be safe. I hope you are safe in your country. Jay
2:14, are you taking care of it?, leaving it on the rain during the night and day? Isn't it important just to mention the way you take care of it?
I never used it in the rain as it was the dry season here when I got it. I used Proofide a few times so it was well taken care of. The one I had back in the 70s I used in the rain never did anything to it and it was brilliant. I was 20 kgs lighter then though!!
@@Biking360 i see thanks!
Hi Biking 360 - Finally got around to viewing your saddle review here since I have the same saddle. As I mentioned previously to you mine is also still hard after 1000s of km. Now, I haven't treated the saddle with a leather softener at all and I'm wondering if you ever tried that? I think I remember that Brooks recommended some periodic application of saddle softener. Perhaps that would help us out ??? Thanks and a great review!
I've used Proofide on it but that's had no effect. I'm now using a Selle SMP TRK and it's way, way more comfortable than the B17 ever was. I've only done about 500kms on the Selle to date but it's looking very positive. As we all know saddles are such a personal thing but for me, the b17 just hasn't worked this time around which is disappointing. Are you still using your B17?
@@Biking360 thanks. I’d forgotten the Brooks Proofide name. No effect huh? Hmmm. Yes I have not tried switching saddles but may try that one you like. I may also try some horse saddle conditioner on it to see if that softens it up. I now wear riding pants with padding and that helps but up until a year ago I didn’t and i would get pretty sore from that hard saddle nose in particular. SMP also makes a saddle with a nose that drops away steeply so only your butt is supporting your weight. A friend uses that and likes it. Forget which model that is.
@@hervedelnorte7928 I think the Selle with the steep dropping nose is the SMP PRO. That's the one Mark Beaumont used twice to cycle around the world! If you're still struggling with the B17 I'd definitely consider a swap. For me, changing my saddle has made a huge difference to my comfort and enjoyment of the rides. If you don't try the SMP TRK I've also heard very good things about the Charge Spoon.
@@Biking360 thanks for the info. I will be in one bike store tomorrow but not sure what saddle choices he has. P.S. are you using bike shoes and clip in pedals or just standard peddles?
Try the racing model check your Q hope this helps.
Thanks, I will take a look. I was also thinking of maybe trying the carved or carved short as an alternative. Any thoughts?
Nice vid brother, it's a shame it didnt work for you, one would think after 6000k itd be nice and supple. I'll let ya know how it goes for me.... take care, peace
Definitely let me know. Have you got a backup in mind if it doesn't work out?
@@Biking360 lol, no, that's thinking to far in advance... probably the one you're using now or also heard good things about the Specialized Power saddles, but so far I'm happy with the brooks, it's starting to mold to my ass fairly well
@@Biking360 I also think when it gets warmer it'll soften up a bit, hopefully, think the cold weather is keeping it hard too
@@Biking360 btw, what do you use to edit your vids? Gopro app? Or something else? Just curious...
@@cyclingharrisburgpa I hope it works out
its like Marmite you either love it or hate it
That is so true 👍
have you tried or compared noseless bike seats at all?
I have never tried one. What are your thoughts?
@@Biking360 About to try one, they seem to be anatomically more sound than most other alternatives not blocking bloodflow and damaging our pelvic area
I don't know anyone who has used one so would be very interested to hear how you get on . Especially on longer all day rides. Good Luck 👍
I bought a B17 it was comfortable out of the box but unfortunately I had to exchange it as the leather had a cut (not a scratch). The new one I received which I have ridden 900 kms on is killing my bum and back. I've swapped it out with my gel saddle and thinking about selling the brooks.
Very disappointed as I love the looks of it
I hear you. I've been using the Selle Pro TRK for the last 2,000 miles and it's so much more comfortable. What gel saddle you using now?
@@Biking360 I have a San marco Bio active it is a fat and wide saddle but I use my bike for communting to and from work 18kms each way. I only got the brook because it looked nice but I didnt think it would hurt me this much. it properly will break me before i break it in.
Lots of people tell me the B-17 is comfortable, I looked at their padded riding wear and think...hmmm.
This time around the B17 was disappointing. The Selle SMP TRK I'm now using is way more comfortable. What about yourself? What do you use? JP
@@Biking360 hi! Are you using gel version of smp trk or standard?
@@grzegorzp2314 I'm using the gel version. I've got about 500kms on the clock now and it feels great. What about yourself? What are you using?
The Brooks are great for some people and awful for some too. The quality varies quite a bit, which makes sense considering the leather is a natural product with a lot of variation, but in my opinion it is one of the major downsides of a Brooks.
Some people modify the saddles and lace down the side flaps to prevent them flaring out as you describe, hitting their thighs. This will make the saddle stiffer as well though. Perhaps the saddle is just too wide for you and your riding position? Brooks makes narrower saddles, but the descriptions they give them are rather unhelpful.
Some people swear by the Brooks Team Professional, it is a bit narrower and has more pedalling freedom. The 'Pro' generally has thicker, tougher leather though, so it takes a lot longer to break in, and may feel especially harsh at first. This saddle is intended for hunched over riding, but maybe it works well with narrower sitbones.
There's also the B17 Narrow, which is a very narrow version of the B17 for maximum pedalling clearance, even narrower than the Team Professional. This is only good when you have really narrow sitbones or are riding in an extreme, low aero position.
Specifically aimed at racing they also make the classic very narrow 'Swallow', but from what I've read this saddle is not very durable and tends to sag rather quickly.
I appreciate the very detailed analysis and I'm in full agreement. Unfortunately, I have wide sit bones that rule out any of Brooks narrower saddles so I've changed the B17 for a Selle SMP TRK. It's not perfect but it's appreciably more comfortable than the B17. I'm still looking for something even more comfortable and I'm very open to suggestions if you have any ideas? I'd be interested to know what you are using and how you get on with it. Ride safe. JP
Got the brooks swift and it has been around for 7 years. I feel it far more comfortable compared to my b17 narrow.
Thank you for the review….. could the color fad be from not put enough proofride or even to much?
Again ty for the info!
No. It wasn't that. I used proofide as instructed. I honestly think the quality of finish is wanting. In comparison, I had a black B17 over 40 years ago, and totally abused it, but it was fine. Thanks for watching and ride safe. JP
Brooks saddles are the best!
Very hard to argue with. I wish it had worked for me this time though! Do you use a B17?
Do you ever wearing brooks saddle in rainy day without covering it?
Hey there. It's never been out in the rain. What do you think about your Brooks B17? Is it comfortable?
@@Biking360 im very skinny person after - +5 months, it starts breaking in, and quite comfortable in my butt, i feel my brooks like hammock now, once i ever wearing my brooks on medium rainy days...
Sorry my english not very good cheers
@@Dnhwzy I'm very pleased it is comfortable. Do you ride a lot of miles/kilometres?
@@Biking360 yeah maybe im riding about 1000km++ right now and im overall enjoy it
@@Dnhwzy I'm super pleased it's working for you.
👍👍
Thanks. Do you use this for your Brompton, or have you got it on any other of your bikes? JP
I‘m no expert, but I really think you have chosen the wrong saddle for your type of bike. The B17 is definitely a touring bike saddle . As soon as you lean more forward with your upper body, it‘s not comfortable anymore (you mentioned the problem parts) and it‘s clear that you need a lot of time to break it in as you have much less weight on the saddle with your riding style.
I think it‘s not the saddle. Saddle and bike don‘t match.
Hey Vicky. I appreciate your comment and feedback. I agree completely with what you say about this being the wrong saddle if you are using it in a more aggressive position for fasting riding. I have two road bikes, one vintage, and one modern, and use very different saddles, with long narrow noses, for this specific purpose. The B17 was used exclusively on my Surly LHT touring bike and nothing else. When I was a teenager I used the B17 for touring for over ten years, and a lot of miles, and had zero problems. I honestly think my recent discomfort was because I'm simply too heavy! I'm now using a Selle TRK with no issues. Saddles are such a personal thing I'm sure you'll agree? What kind of bike, and saddle do you use?
@@Biking360 oh, I absolut agree. Sometimes it‘s a lifetime challenge to find the right one. I have a B17 as well and quite happy with it
@@vicky0841 That's brilliant. I'm so pleased it works for you. What bike do you ride and is it mainly for touring.
@@Biking360 it‘s definitely a touring bike, but right now I‘m thinking of switching to a cross or gravel bike due to a narrow pedal width stance (or Q factor).
We will see!
C17 carved hands down
I have a C17 but I've never tried the C17. Hopefully, I'll find one I can borrow and use one day!
I used mink oil and it broke in pretty quick (maybe 200 miles) - not sure I was supposed to do that but I'm not waiting several thousand miles to get comfortable even if shortens saddle life.
I've never heard of using mink oil but nice one. Whatever works. How long have you had it now and any kinds of problems?
@@Biking360 Couple of years and no problems. Well apart from the saddle stinks for the first few rides so dont wear your best shorts. I dont wear padded shorts with it anymore and that seems to work better for comfort bizarrely. Switched to the normal brooks recommended paste now its broken in
@@brindlebot Good to hear it's comfortable. If the B17 works it seems to work brilliantly.
discoloration of leather. this happens when leather gets moisture on it, whether sweat or body oil.
Mine broke after a year of minimal use and Brooks did not honor their warranty. I will never give them another penny. The build quality isn't what it used to be.
That sucks and I don't blame you. What are you using now and how's it working out?
Most of what you said is quite contrary to my experience in EVERY way. Your assessments didn't tie in with any of mine.
Not the best design of saddle?
Over 1/2 a million might disagree over the last few decades. Including me!
Comfort - 10/10 (1000mls+ and didn't know the saddle was there)
Durability - 10/10 stains don't count
Break in - 9/10 - cp other users
Chafing - 10/10 i.e. nil
Leg movement - 9+/10 - no problems whatsoever
Looks - 10/10 on any bike - Classic looks, classic performance
OPINIONS DIFFER
Thanks for the input. I wish my experience had been more positive. I had such great memories of the B17 as a youngster that I bought and built a touring bike around the one in the review. It got me back into touring so I'm really grateful for that. I rode on the B17 for 6,000 km so you can't say I didn't give it a fair go. It was uncomfortable for virtually all of it! As you rightly say, opinions differ, and most reviews are on your side of the fence and disagree with my assessment.
Buzzkill
I wanted to love it and I built a touring bike around it and began touring again because of this saddle. I owe it a lot but it is never going on of my bikes again!
Thighs - add laces.
Good tip :)
Disagree..all good
I'm pleased it works for you and I honestly wish I could disagree with myself on this one!
THANK YOU!!! Honesty and accuracy. Clunky old ass design with those horrible wings. Hated mine.
I think there are better and more modern designs for sure. What are you using instead?