The biggest mistake turtle rock made while promoting the game ended up being the one mistake they couldn't afford to make. #back4blood #zombies #jimboislost
What throws me off is how brutal the trauma system is. Regaining health is a nightmare and chore. I even started using the knife for gourmet dinners, and it BARELY regressed my trauma.
Novice player I presume? Once u get used to game mechs, u hardly get hit unless a team member really screws u guys over. Or heal via TK if u have deck built for somewhat for copper and upgrade to purple, use TK on prep stashes. Last resort...have a Doc but some ppl don't wanna be a Doc so its a hit or miss.
Yeah the trauma system is way too much. I just want to kill zombies man, why do I have to micromanage a deteriorating health bar for the entire campaign? I don’t know why they didn’t just use a similar system to Left 4 Dead, way better and far more entertaining.
That's how I look at them. As a friend of mine said after looking at some footage I recorded as an accident "looks like you're playing doom", I'm actually up for it tbh
All the main people who carried L2D development stayed with Valve, and the left overs decided to make a game and used their involvement with L2D to spread marketing which worked until people realized the game has none of the labor of love that went into L2D. Great vid bro
no labor of love? oh do tell us how much less work was put in to making b4b. I bet we will get the game designer level of expertise in your response, definitely not of bias reasonings what so ever.. Like bro even I as a l4d fan I just dont see it, hell Id even say it that b4b is better for me personally. The game is up and playable and the only things that a player may not like it is but a mater of taste in gameplay and atmosphere really
Games not bad, its the players running all ammo cards thinking thats a build for No Hope that kills it, triggering alarms every second doesn't make the experience any better obviously..
Thank you so much for this review.. I am a Left 4 Dead fan me and my brother. We have thousands and thousands and thousands of hours into Left 4 Dead. And honestly when this came out it started to become our favorite game not going to lie B4B to our standards is now our favorite game. But we say this every time they should not half came out the gates saying anything and I mean anything about Left 4 Dead. If they would have just came out promoting their own product I think this game would have had more success without the mention of Left 4 Dead. But just wanted to add a few cents in thank you for the review I really did appreciate this.
The hard truth it's not an underrated gem, it's a corporate cash grab. It didn't failed because of poor misplaced marketing campaign, in fact the only reason it actually profited is because it was advertised as a next-gen L4D with cool new features - it made players disappointed, not the publisher. And it made players disappointed because it's barebones at best where it's important and bloated by features that neither fit a core gameplay, nor work together as intended. It's not an audacity to expect a quality game for an AAA price, but quality clearly wasn't a priority here. The fact it wasn't able to stand up in all the ways that matters to a 12 y.o. game it intended to use as a reference is just a cheery on a top - even if it was a buggy mess with low poly graphics, that still could've succeeded if a gameplay loop was solid, but instead it appealed to literally nobody except hardcore grind and meta lovers who prefer their play hours to manifest into some in-game rewards and power-ups rather their in their own skill.
As someone who has played B4B for 2 years now, I can tell you that there is much more depth to the game than you realize. It's a well designed game, but you mustn't compare it to L4D. Beating the toughest challenge in the game, Trial of the Worm (x51 multiplier) requires heavy teamwork, communication, game knowledge and skill that I haven't experienced in most recent games.
@@christopherwinqvist8149 I would argue it is actually well designed, considering they've basically overhauled the game throughout its short life span. It is certainly a more focused game now, but it's focused on a wrong things - gameplay it provides is only attractive for a hardcore online players who enjoy making builds and grind the game with their team until they master it. But for the majority of such players it is not deep enough - they will beat it within months and move on, unless they are a big fans of a zombie games and have finally found where their both passions came together. It could be challenging, but it's not that fun - one can't just jump in and play, learning the gameplay loop within half an hour, and the lackluster visual and sound design doesn't help at all. And the worst part is that gunplay feels really clumsy - not only there is (or at leas was) a good chance you'll be low on a required ammo type at all times, it feels like you're shooting nerf darts at the ketchup sponges. Melee is also useless until you get a proper build and as satisfying as shooting - impact is not there most of the times, animation often acts weirdly and absence of detailed gore is masked by blood splatters on your arms and weapons. I thought it should come without saying that you're supposed to make killing zombies satisfying and fun in a game where you're doing it 98% of time. Overall, the game have missed the casual audience, it missed the hardcore online audience, it tricked L4D fanbase into believing the game is what it's not, hoping everyone will just hop in into something that different, but once the dust has settled, most players were gone - only those who had their personal expectations met are still playing, but it's not much to say the least - B4B now has the same numbers WWZ has, except the latter have lost only third of its audience since steam release, while B4B has only 2% left of its launch players. And I will compare it to L4D2 (since TR had an audacity to do the same) - it has 15(!) times higher peak online than B4B, more players than Overwatch 2, Deep Rock Galactic or Darktide. The game that is 14 years old with no progression whatsoever still has people playing mostly its vanilla co-op. Why do you think is that? Maybe because Valve have focused on what people should enjoy in such game instead of what they wanted them to enjoy?
I like both games. B4b is proof that valve games still have their appeal in this modern time. I think a L4d remaster is something that's needed more rather than a spin-off or sequel.
@@alansauceda8722 oh, B4B proves L4D2 has its appeal today indeed, given it's been almost 10(!) times more people playing the latter in its 15th year of existence. It has only managed to reduce that gap to 3 times when got a 90% discount on a Spring Sale, which also gives an interesting observation that there were twice as more people willing to play L4D2 for 10$ before the sale than those who wants to play B4B for 6$ on sale. It doesn't necessarily means it's a bad game, but clearly tells how badly it missed the mark, believing it's quality and price are fair enough to take on an outdated competition and have its audience, despite barely providing anything of interest for that particular audience.
@@alansauceda8722 yeah, B4B proves L4D2 still has its appeal alright by sustaining almost 10(!) times lesser online player count on Steam. Even discounted down to 6$ today B4B has twice as less players than L4D2 had for its usual price of 10$. Sure, it doesn't necessarily means it's a bad game (even though it's objectively is), but it clearly tells how badly it missed the mark, believing its quality and marketing would be enough to sell for 60$.
One thing that I wished that this game would have, is a "Classic Mode", so that (among others) the "gunplay" is closer to L4D2. Such as that you can't ADS.
I’ll be honest. I had a lot of fun in PVP at launch. I think it helps to have a full team and try wacky stuff. We didn’t really care if we won or lost. Trying creative new ridiculous strategies was cool.
For the dialog when you take holly to the church "Thanks for the hand but you weren't just in the neighbourhood" to get back "We where just in the neighbourhood". The game its self was fun though, still play it with a group of friends to this day. I agree, that was fully more on WB games though I bet, using the names for extra hype.
Personally i only played L4D a little bid, so i had no expectations for this game. Me and a friend just tried the game via Xbox gamepass pc, and so we can only judge the game by how it is today! And we both agreed, our initial experience and opinion, this is probable the smoothest co-op game we tried in a long time in terms of performance, movement, weapons/gunplay, it seems solid so far, and the gameplay is pretty fun! We both just ran more or less default settings. We have not dived deeper into it yet, so can't say for an overall opinion of the game yet.
This game is fun af. I almost didn't buy it then I was like. I do need a zombie game for PS5. The best things about this game are, that you can customize, matchmaking/crossplay (can join in game), when host leaves you can stay, gameplay fun, PVP, lobby waiting area, characters beautiful, no lag feels great, & fast pace ( depending on your build ). THE FLAWS: Creating decks (People are usually lazy & dumb, so they won't understand that CREATING A DECK IS KINDA MANDATORY & Only are good for anything with a HEAL option on Kill/ For that I wouldn't mind it TOOKEN OUT THE GAME), Having to wait for people to load in the game, Cutscene leave me CLUELESS 😂 (still til this day don't know what the story is about), Dry... The game just seems dead 😂 IDK why, & last I feel it NEEDS MORE CHARACTERS & let us use the same characters, because everybody keep fighting for Jill Valentine (Karlee). I feel like This game is worth $45 or lower, just cus story kinda trash. People bashed it like it was trash... Its not. Yea a modded Left 4 Dead is better & easier.
If you change crosshair settings in the options menu from crosshair to dot your shotguns are WAY more accurate from the hip, literally no spread and if you ADS you can snipe from ridiculous distances with no damage lost over distance. Its insane. Your welcome 😅
I disagree to that, i think that mkt is really strong and made the game a huge success in sales. Imo its just that there are really A LOT of really cool options in gaming today and we always want something fresh. The game is really good. But its repetitive, exactly like L4D or World War Z. The deck system actually helps a lot with that.
Lots of players want fun immediatly, like arcade mode, they don't wanna waste time optimize their B4B decks. Collecting cards is not very clear. Combination of cards is even worst. Have to search deck templates on internet.With L4D fun is immediately at the start of each runs. Understanding team characters rules require more time experience and tries. Some players deck are too weak and run fails. According to me, B4B requires more RPG character creation settings and blablas. Too complicated for most arcade gamers. If you have game skill + tweaking characters decks patience + search/loot + team play, it's a great game.
for pvp it was theres still game breaking bugs that werent fixed and regio locked runined it meaning people in less populated areas like australia new zealand europe couldnt play the mode and it had barely any new content devs said they consider pvp updates each update but never came no new riddens after dlc1 no new maps at all added you had to vpn to usa to find games
4:25 I wouldn't advise a lore breakdown. It's pretty intuitively generic, and the clip (at 3:33) you've chosen nails it pretty well lol. I would've done it a year later, or during River of Blood DLC days.
The line you're referring to is a story point in the game. It changes by character and reveal parts of the story depending on your team. The randomize dialogue is really good in this game. :) This game isn't Left4dead so you might be on to something, but it's super solid game on by it's own right. Also the game is quite difficult, and the learning curve is high. Swarm mode is pretty fun, but story mode is way more fun.
(This game had really good potential, which is why I liked it in the first place and still play it to this day on Steam) Xbox Gamepass literally saved this game, which further bolstered their unfair DLC-developing practices considering the basegame has like $20-$30 worth of content, which led to that eventual pitfall, plus its community didn't realise nor preached the right message to buy this game at sale prices either.
WRONG! In left for dead the player never felt they were getting stronger, they felt they were getting better. Better through skill of the game and not because of microtransactions or a skill tree. Left for dead was won thru skill and cooperation thru teammates. This generation lacks all of that because feelings and wanting to show out for social media
I still need to play it. But it's funny how even though I haven't played it and only heard reviews. Yeah, this one thing is what I heard that they needed to Not do. I need to get a group of friends and record the hell out of it. Then I'll have fun.
@@Jackfromshack on the other hand, expectations, hype, are built up to gather excitement for a new product launch. it becomes the other party's problem when they can't meet it. your statement does not paint the whole picture, especially for B4B.
@@Jackfromshack I didn't say it was not. I'm having a blast currently playing it. so much so that I haven't played my other favorite zombo games like State of Decay 2 for the better part of the week. we're talking about expectations, not whether or not B4B is L4D succcessor lol.
Please developers dont use Unreal Engine for Legend gamess.... The ragdoll and how the zombies dying is really bad... and that hitmarker makes also bad..
If you really want to look into how ridiculous the marketing phrase of "By the Creators of L4D" only a handful of people from TRS from the full team that made the initial version of L4D before Valve took over the reigns and took in TRS. I really doubt they had any of the people that came up with the concepts, designs, and writing that made L4D such a memorable piece to begin with.
Ya i believe it was like 7 people who worked on back 4 blood from the left for dead team. Which just makes it worse because it just shows that they only said that to get more eyes on the game and don't actually have an idea on what made left for dead good.
Actually Valve employees come and leave between creating project. Core of work was always TRS. B4B confirmed it, because there a lot of smart changes solving huge problems of both L4Ds, that only L4D creators could do, wich all bland clones like Vermintide can not
@@Jackfromshackno, the game is pretty bad on its own, and only not being exposed to a really quality games whatsoever could make you believe otherwise. It's a generic co-op shooter plagued with trendy features that doesn't blend together, lazy unfocused game design and poor technical condition. It looks and plays like a Korean f2p indie game, yet it was sold as an AAA title.
@@Jackfromshack oh, I did alright. I had a chance to play beta first (which convinced me against buying that... product), then I had it on Gamepass (perss F for people who paid for that game). Not only that, I'm pretty sure my expertise is quite okay, since my total gaming experience exceededs 30 years, and I know what the game would be even when I just see it, sometimes screenshots alone could be enough. And for the last decade my answer for "You can't know the game would be bad" my answer is "just watch" - I have enough insight and broad exposure to see the red flags from miles away and yet to get something wrong. That also, by the way, allowed me to find "taking heads" which I can consider trustworthy, since they tend to analyse things the same way I do to confirm or dispel my concerns about things I'm not willing to touch on my own. But I digress. Of course, I dropped the game before any major patches did, but from what I see it was far than enough to turn the tables. It's not a terrible game, but it's not a good one either - it's painfully mediocre are best. The very fact that developers has neglected a basic features like votekick(!) in a multiplayer game is a telltale sign of developers being clueless of what they're doing. People tend to say B4B is an improvement upon L4D2 just by a sheer number of features, and it indeed tries to mimic it and has tons of features, except in the end has very little in common with L4D2, most things that made L4D2 great were stripped down as unnecessary, replaced with bells and whistles that cater to gamers who believe that more features and progression makes game better, while in fact those elements not only barely work together (not to mention doesn't fit a chosen core gameplay), but also cripples the player base since it all boils down to everyone maxing out their deck and guns and using meta at any given time, and it's not uncommon for team to spend more time choosing their loadout than for actual run. The game tried to be complex and deep, but ended up being overcomplicated and unfocused instead. It certainly has an apeal for a hardcore grind fans, but most of the players are not so, because people expected to simply have fun killing zombies in a most visceral ways in a team of other players, while the game fails to provide it - ammunition is often scarce (well, technically there's tons of it, but it's rarely of a required type), melee and/or run'n'gun is not an option until a late game since there is a stamina in place for some reason, melee weapons are not effective, shooting is not satisfying, despite having a proper ADS, because ridden are terribly animated, gore is primitive, impact is almost nonexistent - it feels more like shooting nerf darts into a ketchup sponges, especially considering nothing in the environment reacts to your shots at all (yeah, that's almost word-to-word what all the "taking heads" keep saying, but that's because it's one of the first thing I've noticed and it really hurts the experience, developing a subconscious fatigue). And team play is ruined thanks to a copper system, meta builds and worst campaig pacing - players just spread out for looting at the very first chance, trying to outrun their mates in a process, and most of the time game won't punish such behaviour, in fact making to the end of the map alone is not that difficult either. Max difficulty kinda fixes it, but other issues come out - special ridden would spawn in an overwhelming rate and numbers without any kind of balance, so any semblance of tactics goes out the window, turning gameplay in a tedious bloodbath, making your loadout and dumb luck more relevant than your skill. Of course, skill is involved too, but, as I said, to make such gameplay enjoyable *requires* you too have a full team of such hardcore players who got that far into the game despite all of its shortcomings. I wish I could stay that could've been fixed by the updates, but I can't see how it could be - the game is broken at its core, so even a balance overhaul developers dropped at some point weren't enough, because the game should be redone from the ground up just to match the level of L4D (given that was their benchmark), not to mention you would expect a game released a decade later to be an improvement in every single department without saying. It even fails to look good - visuals were outdated even by the 2019 standards, the whole game feels like it was made by amateurs that can't make a basic UE4 features work properly, to the point the games performed worse than almost every title on that engine - ironically, I had Days Gone on my PC at the same time and it looked much better with more FPS for me to have. Who needs an optimisation in a multiplayer title, right? I've rarely seen the game that was so disappointing in almost every aspect you touch. And I'm not even touching upon PVP and the story/characters now. To summarise, there are basically two main issues with a game: 1) It is a poor quality game to begin with, both in game design and technical condition (sold for an AAA price) - it's not a total failure (especially in financial terms, thanks to marketing was able to push tons of pre-orders and GamePass deal), but it is a generic co-op shooter with worst features modern industry has to offer (that obviously meant to become live service as well). It looks and plays like a Korean f2p indie title, and there are f2p titles out there that are more fun and value than this. 2) Intentionally or not (maybe the latter, considering the marketing strategy), game is not made for L4D audience - core gameplay loop and base mechanics are broken or sidelined in favour of trendy gimmicks, you can't just join random people and have fun the way you did back then, because you have a progression and loadout to consider. It's a whole another game that neither can stan up to its inspiration source to get into its niche, nor can compete with a mainstream co-op shooters in its own rights. You can't make a porn that resembles a beloved action movie and expect all the original fans to get on board, no matter how hard you improve the coitus part. And even though there definitely would be an audience for that too, you won't be able to hold them either because they'll move on once the novelty withers since that's what that kind of audience usually does, especially if the coitus part is also uninspiring and hectic. But the fun part is that I actually didn't need to make my point on anything of that, since player numbers speak for themselves. Ask yourself why people are playing vanilla campaigns in L4D2 for more than a decade now, keeping returning over and over, despite there is literally no reward for a play hours invested? How come L4D2 still has 34k active players daily while B4B has 4k ever since it lost 93% of players within three months(!) after the release? Why WWZ performs even slightly better than B4B today and it's audience has actually increased from 3k to 4k since the release? If you believe fans are the issue, why then Project Wingman was not only a financial success, but also was embraced by Ace Combat community, unlike B4B? The hard truth it's not an underrated gem, it's a corporate cash grab. It didn't failed because of poor marketing choice, in fact the only reason it actually profited is because it was advertised as a next-gen L4D with cool new features - it made players disappointed, not the publisher. Another lesson for not trusting the hype, not being a fanboy and not making pre-orders.
Play L4D 1 and 2 with dev commentary on, that team are people who want to make a good replayable game for their fans. B4B isn't made by people, it's made by corporate sellouts to milk their fans.
Wtf is this shit? Are u even played B4B or just watched hate reviewers? B4B has better repairability than both L4D ever had, because of scary word "cards". I do not even need arguments. You just do not know what you talking about bro. Play it at least
I completely disagree. B4B has absolutely the entire basis of l4D2, plus a strategic layer of building a playstyles and huge replayability due to cards, which the casual audience hates. Only TRA and Valve know who did what for L4D. Not some guy from RUclips with million subscribers who read end credits and decided to devalue someone else's work with his biased hatred of the company (he made video on Evolve). When you play B4B, everything becomes clear. Is this a bad game? Not a bit. Acceptance by the public, which for the most part did not launch the game, cannot be considered a disadvantage of the game. And the support of L4D veterans went unnoticed. Think for yourself
You're delusional, B4B has little in common with L4D2. Thing is that the game is not complex or deep, it's overcomplicated and unfocused instead, not to mention its overall mediocre quality. It's true that L4D fans, myself included, were cheering to this game... until it hit the beta. Thing is it wasn't for people who enjoyed shooting zombies with a team (since that kind of fun is simply not there due to lackluster visuals, animations and impact, that made it feel like shooting nerf darts into ketchup sponges), it's for those who loves to grind through a bloated progression to make a meta builds just for sake of it. What kind of public acceptance are you taking about when B4B lost 93% of its players within first three months after the release? It's less than 4k players daily in peak now, while L4D2 is currently enjoyed by 34k players, who've been coming back to it for more than a decade now, despite there are literally no rewards for play hours invested. Truth is B4B is not a terrible game, but it's not a good game either - it's overhyped, overpriced, and mediocre at best in every department. Except the profit - thanks to it's marketing that granted tons of pre-orders and GamePass deal it was able to cash in pretty well, until people figured out they were fed with a game that looks and plays like a Korean indy f2p shooter (and performs even worse somehow). Of course, TR hoped to turn it into live-service, even made a numerous improvements and a balance overhaul, but you can't fix something that was never meant to work - you can't make a porn out of beloved action movie and expect all the original fans to get on board, no matter how hard you improve the fuсking part. Surely there would be an audience for that, but even they will get bored quickly and move on as they usually do.
I agree. That's not the biggest reason but it's definitely one of the main reasons... If it was sold at 1/3 or 1/2 the price the game for sure would be less criticized or if the game were lower than player's expectations they will also be less disappointed. For just $60, you can have many more gaming options with more diverse content, larger contexts or more attractive gameplay
WRONG it is gameplay left 4 dead doesn't have iron sights for weapons but guess what does it have - EVERYTHING ELSE ack 4 blood is lacking "tons of things to unlock" - something left 4 dead never did cosmetics... wow you took painfully mediocre game and claim it's great but hey it's definetly no the case!
This is what i always say i think the game is great obveusly it has a few issues but as a game its really solid the problem is it was marketed as the next left 4 dead and its not the game is similar in sprit but the game wasn't the same. Marketing and expectation killed this game before it was even released
It is L4D3 in terms of gameplay. Same basis but more on top of that. But it was too hard for people who used to take same old shit every year but with next number in the name. Bad for them
i dont get how people think it was marketed as l4d3. like what do people mean when they say l4d3? did they expect the same game just with a different name and different characters? maybe its because i played the beta but ive never heard my friends (7 of us in total) ever say "oh i thoughts this was l4d3". like when i see "directed by guy ritchie" or "produced by jerry burckheimer" i dont expect it to be a sequel or something
They literally sold the game by putting it out there that its a successor to L4D2 while also saying its a bigger and better cersion of L4D2. If anything, it shows that they only used the name for marketing while scamming L4D2 fans using empty promises. Wheres the devs now if this game was successful? Theyre literally making another zombie game but definitely not a B4B sequel
And they tied B4B with realism, when we all know having custom skins and card decks isnt realistic in an "actual zombie apocalypse". They literally shitted on how old L4D2 gameplay is while trying to prove B4B is better. Well guess who got 20k Daily plays on steam against 2k plays on steam? 😂
@@troua2001 literally their live launch of the trailer to B4B and some streams with one of the main Devs. They kept reiterating that B4B was supposed to be a better L4D2 and that the old storyline wouldn't hold water in modern story driven campaign games. Mostly the shit talk was from that stream with devs but I forgot what streams, it's been long since it's from when B4B is still getting fame
I’m playing B4B now with a buddy, and while I’ve definitely played better games, this game is clearly better than the first L4D. Never played L4D2 so I don’t know how or even if they improved anything.
Is it just me, or is this just yet another person looking for anything to bitch about? I’m more than happy with this game. The issues stated means absolutely nothing to me. Maybe I’m just that really weird person that enjoys enjoying things. Because apparently THATS the weird thing these days in a hate fad culture.
@@facehurt7606 …Not really… are you in high school or something? You see how I acknowledge I’m a minority in liking it because we’re in a hate fad culture, and he proved my point? Like legit just straight up backed up what I was saying. Did you get dropped on your head as a baby mate?
You’re way off , FANS OF L4D know who Turtle rock studios are and they already knew who and what this game was . They were just confirming it . The problem was and is . That we have been always waiting for the New / sequel to L4D and this is not what they gave us ! That’s the problem. They made the game they wanted to make as opposed to giving the people what they wanted and THATS WHY IT FAILED!!!
![Chino Pacas - Modo Capone (with Drake & Fuerza Regida) [Video Oficial]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/zjv8TQ0gBkg/mqdefault.jpg)
![Dead Space [Remake] vs Original | Direct Comparison](/img/1.gif)
What throws me off is how brutal the trauma system is. Regaining health is a nightmare and chore. I even started using the knife for gourmet dinners, and it BARELY regressed my trauma.
Novice player I presume? Once u get used to game mechs, u hardly get hit unless a team member really screws u guys over. Or heal via TK if u have deck built for somewhat for copper and upgrade to purple, use TK on prep stashes. Last resort...have a Doc but some ppl don't wanna be a Doc so its a hit or miss.
Yeah the trauma system is way too much. I just want to kill zombies man, why do I have to micromanage a deteriorating health bar for the entire campaign? I don’t know why they didn’t just use a similar system to Left 4 Dead, way better and far more entertaining.
There are some Doc and Mom builds that keep your team healthy.
@@zeviandev065 yeah, I’ve been working with those and it makes the game significantly more bearable. Still, that means I’m stuck as a medic :/
The look of these zombies, they don't look like zombies but some other demon/tree monsters.
That's how I look at them. As a friend of mine said after looking at some footage I recorded as an accident "looks like you're playing doom", I'm actually up for it tbh
For me it's an actual good game but for me the mistake they made is no mod support
The problem was also that the price at launch was too high
Good point. I didn't even think about that because i got it through game pass
All because they wanted to release the game on Halloween
All the main people who carried L2D development stayed with Valve, and the left overs decided to make a game and used their involvement with L2D to spread marketing which worked until people realized the game has none of the labor of love that went into L2D. Great vid bro
What the fuck is l2d?
I only know l4d and l4d2
@@Glitchmouse2L2D is legitimately the acronym for Left 2 Die, not that it actually makes any more sense lmao
Left 2 die is a roblox guy, think the guy above just had a seizure or something.
Go out and buy a copy if you haven’t
no labor of love? oh do tell us how much less work was put in to making b4b. I bet we will get the game designer level of expertise in your response, definitely not of bias reasonings what so ever.. Like bro even I as a l4d fan I just dont see it, hell Id even say it that b4b is better for me personally. The game is up and playable and the only things that a player may not like it is but a mater of taste in gameplay and atmosphere really
Games not bad, its the players running all ammo cards thinking thats a build for No Hope that kills it, triggering alarms every second doesn't make the experience any better obviously..
Thank you so much for this review.. I am a Left 4 Dead fan me and my brother. We have thousands and thousands and thousands of hours into Left 4 Dead.
And honestly when this came out it started to become our favorite game not going to lie B4B to our standards is now our favorite game.
But we say this every time they should not half came out the gates saying anything and I mean anything about Left 4 Dead. If they would have just came out promoting their own product I think this game would have had more success without the mention of Left 4 Dead.
But just wanted to add a few cents in thank you for the review I really did appreciate this.
The hard truth it's not an underrated gem, it's a corporate cash grab.
It didn't failed because of poor misplaced marketing campaign, in fact the only reason it actually profited is because it was advertised as a next-gen L4D with cool new features - it made players disappointed, not the publisher.
And it made players disappointed because it's barebones at best where it's important and bloated by features that neither fit a core gameplay, nor work together as intended. It's not an audacity to expect a quality game for an AAA price, but quality clearly wasn't a priority here.
The fact it wasn't able to stand up in all the ways that matters to a 12 y.o. game it intended to use as a reference is just a cheery on a top - even if it was a buggy mess with low poly graphics, that still could've succeeded if a gameplay loop was solid, but instead it appealed to literally nobody except hardcore grind and meta lovers who prefer their play hours to manifest into some in-game rewards and power-ups rather their in their own skill.
As someone who has played B4B for 2 years now, I can tell you that there is much more depth to the game than you realize. It's a well designed game, but you mustn't compare it to L4D. Beating the toughest challenge in the game, Trial of the Worm (x51 multiplier) requires heavy teamwork, communication, game knowledge and skill that I haven't experienced in most recent games.
@@christopherwinqvist8149 I would argue it is actually well designed, considering they've basically overhauled the game throughout its short life span. It is certainly a more focused game now, but it's focused on a wrong things - gameplay it provides is only attractive for a hardcore online players who enjoy making builds and grind the game with their team until they master it. But for the majority of such players it is not deep enough - they will beat it within months and move on, unless they are a big fans of a zombie games and have finally found where their both passions came together.
It could be challenging, but it's not that fun - one can't just jump in and play, learning the gameplay loop within half an hour, and the lackluster visual and sound design doesn't help at all. And the worst part is that gunplay feels really clumsy - not only there is (or at leas was) a good chance you'll be low on a required ammo type at all times, it feels like you're shooting nerf darts at the ketchup sponges. Melee is also useless until you get a proper build and as satisfying as shooting - impact is not there most of the times, animation often acts weirdly and absence of detailed gore is masked by blood splatters on your arms and weapons. I thought it should come without saying that you're supposed to make killing zombies satisfying and fun in a game where you're doing it 98% of time.
Overall, the game have missed the casual audience, it missed the hardcore online audience, it tricked L4D fanbase into believing the game is what it's not, hoping everyone will just hop in into something that different, but once the dust has settled, most players were gone - only those who had their personal expectations met are still playing, but it's not much to say the least - B4B now has the same numbers WWZ has, except the latter have lost only third of its audience since steam release, while B4B has only 2% left of its launch players.
And I will compare it to L4D2 (since TR had an audacity to do the same) - it has 15(!) times higher peak online than B4B, more players than Overwatch 2, Deep Rock Galactic or Darktide. The game that is 14 years old with no progression whatsoever still has people playing mostly its vanilla co-op. Why do you think is that? Maybe because Valve have focused on what people should enjoy in such game instead of what they wanted them to enjoy?
I like both games. B4b is proof that valve games still have their appeal in this modern time. I think a L4d remaster is something that's needed more rather than a spin-off or sequel.
@@alansauceda8722 oh, B4B proves L4D2 has its appeal today indeed, given it's been almost 10(!) times more people playing the latter in its 15th year of existence.
It has only managed to reduce that gap to 3 times when got a 90% discount on a Spring Sale, which also gives an interesting observation that there were twice as more people willing to play L4D2 for 10$ before the sale than those who wants to play B4B for 6$ on sale.
It doesn't necessarily means it's a bad game, but clearly tells how badly it missed the mark, believing it's quality and price are fair enough to take on an outdated competition and have its audience, despite barely providing anything of interest for that particular audience.
@@alansauceda8722 yeah, B4B proves L4D2 still has its appeal alright by sustaining almost 10(!) times lesser online player count on Steam. Even discounted down to 6$ today B4B has twice as less players than L4D2 had for its usual price of 10$.
Sure, it doesn't necessarily means it's a bad game (even though it's objectively is), but it clearly tells how badly it missed the mark, believing its quality and marketing would be enough to sell for 60$.
One thing that I wished that this game would have, is a "Classic Mode", so that (among others) the "gunplay" is closer to L4D2. Such as that you can't ADS.
You easily achieve this by taking three ADS cards for 100% accuracy
Just build for it dude
Cringe
I’ll be honest. I had a lot of fun in PVP at launch. I think it helps to have a full team and try wacky stuff. We didn’t really care if we won or lost. Trying creative new ridiculous strategies was cool.
For the dialog when you take holly to the church "Thanks for the hand but you weren't just in the neighbourhood" to get back "We where just in the neighbourhood". The game its self was fun though, still play it with a group of friends to this day. I agree, that was fully more on WB games though I bet, using the names for extra hype.
Personally i only played L4D a little bid, so i had no expectations for this game. Me and a friend just tried the game via Xbox gamepass pc, and so we can only judge the game by how it is today!
And we both agreed, our initial experience and opinion, this is probable the smoothest co-op game we tried in a long time in terms of performance, movement, weapons/gunplay, it seems solid so far, and the gameplay is pretty fun! We both just ran more or less default settings. We have not dived deeper into it yet, so can't say for an overall opinion of the game yet.
This game is fun af. I almost didn't buy it then I was like. I do need a zombie game for PS5. The best things about this game are, that you can customize, matchmaking/crossplay (can join in game), when host leaves you can stay, gameplay fun, PVP, lobby waiting area, characters beautiful, no lag feels great, & fast pace ( depending on your build ).
THE FLAWS: Creating decks (People are usually lazy & dumb, so they won't understand that CREATING A DECK IS KINDA MANDATORY & Only are good for anything with a HEAL option on Kill/ For that I wouldn't mind it TOOKEN OUT THE GAME), Having to wait for people to load in the game, Cutscene leave me CLUELESS 😂 (still til this day don't know what the story is about), Dry... The game just seems dead 😂 IDK why, & last I feel it NEEDS MORE CHARACTERS & let us use the same characters, because everybody keep fighting for Jill Valentine (Karlee). I feel like This game is worth $45 or lower, just cus story kinda trash. People bashed it like it was trash... Its not. Yea a modded Left 4 Dead is better & easier.
This game needs to support mod tools itd be a hell of a game for sure if it did
If you change crosshair settings in the options menu from crosshair to dot your shotguns are WAY more accurate from the hip, literally no spread and if you ADS you can snipe from ridiculous distances with no damage lost over distance. Its insane. Your welcome 😅
Another mistake it didn't succeed is the gametime, it is VERY time consuming.
I disagree to that, i think that mkt is really strong and made the game a huge success in sales. Imo its just that there are really A LOT of really cool options in gaming today and we always want something fresh. The game is really good. But its repetitive, exactly like L4D or World War Z. The deck system actually helps a lot with that.
Lots of players want fun immediatly, like arcade mode, they don't wanna waste time optimize their B4B decks.
Collecting cards is not very clear. Combination of cards is even worst. Have to search deck templates on internet.With L4D fun is immediately at the start of each runs.
Understanding team characters rules require more time experience and tries. Some players deck are too weak and run fails.
According to me, B4B requires more RPG character creation settings and blablas. Too complicated for most arcade gamers.
If you have game skill + tweaking characters decks patience + search/loot + team play, it's a great game.
I feel like it would be more interesting if it was somewhere farther up the east coast or a foreign country
He doesn’t trust you because the game opens on your team returning from an unauthorized mission
for pvp it was theres still game breaking bugs that werent fixed and regio locked runined it meaning people in less populated areas like australia new zealand europe couldnt play the mode and it had barely any new content devs said they consider pvp updates each update but never came no new riddens after dlc1 no new maps at all added you had to vpn to usa to find games
4:25 I wouldn't advise a lore breakdown. It's pretty intuitively generic, and the clip (at 3:33) you've chosen nails it pretty well lol. I would've done it a year later, or during River of Blood DLC days.
Mistake is doc having her personality (and all the characters have bad personalities)
YOOO BIG MAN IS POPPING OFF
The line you're referring to is a story point in the game. It changes by character and reveal parts of the story depending on your team. The randomize dialogue is really good in this game. :) This game isn't Left4dead so you might be on to something, but it's super solid game on by it's own right. Also the game is quite difficult, and the learning curve is high. Swarm mode is pretty fun, but story mode is way more fun.
as a L4D vet, imo i didn't get it because I thought the characters were lame, looked buggy af too.
Marketing was not the reason.
it's like someone decided to copy left 4 dead only much much shittier and low effort
I liked this game. Would be there for the sequel. Needs a versus mode though
They talked it up to be l4d3 in spirit, if not in name. It is not L4D3.
i played it and then quite it i wanted it to be amazing
(This game had really good potential, which is why I liked it in the first place and still play it to this day on Steam) Xbox Gamepass literally saved this game, which further bolstered their unfair DLC-developing practices considering the basegame has like $20-$30 worth of content, which led to that eventual pitfall, plus its community didn't realise nor preached the right message to buy this game at sale prices either.
The mistake they made was the AI
WRONG! In left for dead the player never felt they were getting stronger, they felt they were getting better. Better through skill of the game and not because of microtransactions or a skill tree. Left for dead was won thru skill and cooperation thru teammates. This generation lacks all of that because feelings and wanting to show out for social media
I still need to play it. But it's funny how even though I haven't played it and only heard reviews. Yeah, this one thing is what I heard that they needed to Not do. I need to get a group of friends and record the hell out of it. Then I'll have fun.
The best way to play it
@@Jimboislost That's what you gotta do with every terrible but good with friends game. The "2023" motto.
expectation is a hell of a thing
Your expectations are your problems
@@Jackfromshack on the other hand, expectations, hype, are built up to gather excitement for a new product launch. it becomes the other party's problem when they can't meet it.
your statement does not paint the whole picture, especially for B4B.
@@vallenvega B4B is a first tru successor of L4D, regardless of what Internet sheeps yell. Haters hate. Gamers play
@@Jackfromshack I didn't say it was not. I'm having a blast currently playing it. so much so that I haven't played my other favorite zombo games like State of Decay 2 for the better part of the week.
we're talking about expectations, not whether or not B4B is L4D succcessor lol.
Playing with bots is excruciating. Would like to just play with my friend without bots
i have a question did the devs left the game ?will there be any update in the future or any expand?
The devs did indeed leave the game and are no longer updating the it. They said they're moving on to other projects.
Please developers dont use Unreal Engine for Legend gamess.... The ragdoll and how the zombies dying is really bad... and that hitmarker makes also bad..
Unreal engine games also hurts low end pc gamers.
If you really want to look into how ridiculous the marketing phrase of "By the Creators of L4D" only a handful of people from TRS from the full team that made the initial version of L4D before Valve took over the reigns and took in TRS. I really doubt they had any of the people that came up with the concepts, designs, and writing that made L4D such a memorable piece to begin with.
Ya i believe it was like 7 people who worked on back 4 blood from the left for dead team. Which just makes it worse because it just shows that they only said that to get more eyes on the game and don't actually have an idea on what made left for dead good.
Actually Valve employees come and leave between creating project. Core of work was always TRS. B4B confirmed it, because there a lot of smart changes solving huge problems of both L4Ds, that only L4D creators could do, wich all bland clones like Vermintide can not
Should be able to trade burn cards with other players
I feel like it isnt the fault of L4D but the nostalgia and over flooded market of zombie games that ruined its chances
It is a fault of toxic fans of L4D who can not learn new things stucking in the time capsule rejecting everything that is not comfortable for them
@@Jackfromshackno, the game is pretty bad on its own, and only not being exposed to a really quality games whatsoever could make you believe otherwise. It's a generic co-op shooter plagued with trendy features that doesn't blend together, lazy unfocused game design and poor technical condition. It looks and plays like a Korean f2p indie game, yet it was sold as an AAA title.
@@evilbabai7083 did you even played B4B or just mindless repeating words from talking heads?
@@Jackfromshack oh, I did alright. I had a chance to play beta first (which convinced me against buying that... product), then I had it on Gamepass (perss F for people who paid for that game). Not only that, I'm pretty sure my expertise is quite okay, since my total gaming experience exceededs 30 years, and I know what the game would be even when I just see it, sometimes screenshots alone could be enough. And for the last decade my answer for "You can't know the game would be bad" my answer is "just watch" - I have enough insight and broad exposure to see the red flags from miles away and yet to get something wrong. That also, by the way, allowed me to find "taking heads" which I can consider trustworthy, since they tend to analyse things the same way I do to confirm or dispel my concerns about things I'm not willing to touch on my own. But I digress.
Of course, I dropped the game before any major patches did, but from what I see it was far than enough to turn the tables. It's not a terrible game, but it's not a good one either - it's painfully mediocre are best. The very fact that developers has neglected a basic features like votekick(!) in a multiplayer game is a telltale sign of developers being clueless of what they're doing. People tend to say B4B is an improvement upon L4D2 just by a sheer number of features, and it indeed tries to mimic it and has tons of features, except in the end has very little in common with L4D2, most things that made L4D2 great were stripped down as unnecessary, replaced with bells and whistles that cater to gamers who believe that more features and progression makes game better, while in fact those elements not only barely work together (not to mention doesn't fit a chosen core gameplay), but also cripples the player base since it all boils down to everyone maxing out their deck and guns and using meta at any given time, and it's not uncommon for team to spend more time choosing their loadout than for actual run. The game tried to be complex and deep, but ended up being overcomplicated and unfocused instead.
It certainly has an apeal for a hardcore grind fans, but most of the players are not so, because people expected to simply have fun killing zombies in a most visceral ways in a team of other players, while the game fails to provide it - ammunition is often scarce (well, technically there's tons of it, but it's rarely of a required type), melee and/or run'n'gun is not an option until a late game since there is a stamina in place for some reason, melee weapons are not effective, shooting is not satisfying, despite having a proper ADS, because ridden are terribly animated, gore is primitive, impact is almost nonexistent - it feels more like shooting nerf darts into a ketchup sponges, especially considering nothing in the environment reacts to your shots at all (yeah, that's almost word-to-word what all the "taking heads" keep saying, but that's because it's one of the first thing I've noticed and it really hurts the experience, developing a subconscious fatigue). And team play is ruined thanks to a copper system, meta builds and worst campaig pacing - players just spread out for looting at the very first chance, trying to outrun their mates in a process, and most of the time game won't punish such behaviour, in fact making to the end of the map alone is not that difficult either. Max difficulty kinda fixes it, but other issues come out - special ridden would spawn in an overwhelming rate and numbers without any kind of balance, so any semblance of tactics goes out the window, turning gameplay in a tedious bloodbath, making your loadout and dumb luck more relevant than your skill. Of course, skill is involved too, but, as I said, to make such gameplay enjoyable *requires* you too have a full team of such hardcore players who got that far into the game despite all of its shortcomings. I wish I could stay that could've been fixed by the updates, but I can't see how it could be - the game is broken at its core, so even a balance overhaul developers dropped at some point weren't enough, because the game should be redone from the ground up just to match the level of L4D (given that was their benchmark), not to mention you would expect a game released a decade later to be an improvement in every single department without saying. It even fails to look good - visuals were outdated even by the 2019 standards, the whole game feels like it was made by amateurs that can't make a basic UE4 features work properly, to the point the games performed worse than almost every title on that engine - ironically, I had Days Gone on my PC at the same time and it looked much better with more FPS for me to have. Who needs an optimisation in a multiplayer title, right? I've rarely seen the game that was so disappointing in almost every aspect you touch. And I'm not even touching upon PVP and the story/characters now.
To summarise, there are basically two main issues with a game:
1) It is a poor quality game to begin with, both in game design and technical condition (sold for an AAA price) - it's not a total failure (especially in financial terms, thanks to marketing was able to push tons of pre-orders and GamePass deal), but it is a generic co-op shooter with worst features modern industry has to offer (that obviously meant to become live service as well). It looks and plays like a Korean f2p indie title, and there are f2p titles out there that are more fun and value than this.
2) Intentionally or not (maybe the latter, considering the marketing strategy), game is not made for L4D audience - core gameplay loop and base mechanics are broken or sidelined in favour of trendy gimmicks, you can't just join random people and have fun the way you did back then, because you have a progression and loadout to consider. It's a whole another game that neither can stan up to its inspiration source to get into its niche, nor can compete with a mainstream co-op shooters in its own rights.
You can't make a porn that resembles a beloved action movie and expect all the original fans to get on board, no matter how hard you improve the coitus part. And even though there definitely would be an audience for that too, you won't be able to hold them either because they'll move on once the novelty withers since that's what that kind of audience usually does, especially if the coitus part is also uninspiring and hectic.
But the fun part is that I actually didn't need to make my point on anything of that, since player numbers speak for themselves. Ask yourself why people are playing vanilla campaigns in L4D2 for more than a decade now, keeping returning over and over, despite there is literally no reward for a play hours invested? How come L4D2 still has 34k active players daily while B4B has 4k ever since it lost 93% of players within three months(!) after the release? Why WWZ performs even slightly better than B4B today and it's audience has actually increased from 3k to 4k since the release? If you believe fans are the issue, why then Project Wingman was not only a financial success, but also was embraced by Ace Combat community, unlike B4B?
The hard truth it's not an underrated gem, it's a corporate cash grab. It didn't failed because of poor marketing choice, in fact the only reason it actually profited is because it was advertised as a next-gen L4D with cool new features - it made players disappointed, not the publisher. Another lesson for not trusting the hype, not being a fanboy and not making pre-orders.
Play L4D 1 and 2 with dev commentary on, that team are people who want to make a good replayable game for their fans. B4B isn't made by people, it's made by corporate sellouts to milk their fans.
Wtf is this shit? Are u even played B4B or just watched hate reviewers? B4B has better repairability than both L4D ever had, because of scary word "cards". I do not even need arguments. You just do not know what you talking about bro. Play it at least
it uses the same engine as 'World War Z' right? it feels the same
UE4 or 5 both of them
@@Jackfromshack WWZ uses it's own "Swarm engine", B4B uses UE4
@@evilbabai7083 "unreal swarm" is a part of Unreal Engine's toolkit
I completely disagree. B4B has absolutely the entire basis of l4D2, plus a strategic layer of building a playstyles and huge replayability due to cards, which the casual audience hates.
Only TRA and Valve know who did what for L4D. Not some guy from RUclips with million subscribers who read end credits and decided to devalue someone else's work with his biased hatred of the company (he made video on Evolve). When you play B4B, everything becomes clear.
Is this a bad game? Not a bit. Acceptance by the public, which for the most part did not launch the game, cannot be considered a disadvantage of the game. And the support of L4D veterans went unnoticed. Think for yourself
You're delusional, B4B has little in common with L4D2. Thing is that the game is not complex or deep, it's overcomplicated and unfocused instead, not to mention its overall mediocre quality.
It's true that L4D fans, myself included, were cheering to this game... until it hit the beta. Thing is it wasn't for people who enjoyed shooting zombies with a team (since that kind of fun is simply not there due to lackluster visuals, animations and impact, that made it feel like shooting nerf darts into ketchup sponges), it's for those who loves to grind through a bloated progression to make a meta builds just for sake of it.
What kind of public acceptance are you taking about when B4B lost 93% of its players within first three months after the release? It's less than 4k players daily in peak now, while L4D2 is currently enjoyed by 34k players, who've been coming back to it for more than a decade now, despite there are literally no rewards for play hours invested.
Truth is B4B is not a terrible game, but it's not a good game either - it's overhyped, overpriced, and mediocre at best in every department. Except the profit - thanks to it's marketing that granted tons of pre-orders and GamePass deal it was able to cash in pretty well, until people figured out they were fed with a game that looks and plays like a Korean indy f2p shooter (and performs even worse somehow). Of course, TR hoped to turn it into live-service, even made a numerous improvements and a balance overhaul, but you can't fix something that was never meant to work - you can't make a porn out of beloved action movie and expect all the original fans to get on board, no matter how hard you improve the fuсking part. Surely there would be an audience for that, but even they will get bored quickly and move on as they usually do.
@@evilbabai7083 если бы л4д была так хороша как ты фантазируешь, ты бы играл в неё, а не бегал по роликам б4б испрожняясь
@@evilbabai7083I've been playing it for two weeks now and I like it
I think it's just the price
I agree. That's not the biggest reason but it's definitely one of the main reasons... If it was sold at 1/3 or 1/2 the price the game for sure would be less criticized or if the game were lower than player's expectations they will also be less disappointed. For just $60, you can have many more gaming options with more diverse content, larger contexts or more attractive gameplay
WRONG
it is gameplay
left 4 dead doesn't have iron sights for weapons but guess what does it have - EVERYTHING ELSE ack 4 blood is lacking
"tons of things to unlock" - something left 4 dead never did
cosmetics... wow
you took painfully mediocre game and claim it's great but hey it's definetly no the case!
This is what i always say i think the game is great obveusly it has a few issues but as a game its really solid the problem is it was marketed as the next left 4 dead and its not the game is similar in sprit but the game wasn't the same. Marketing and expectation killed this game before it was even released
It is L4D3 in terms of gameplay. Same basis but more on top of that. But it was too hard for people who used to take same old shit every year but with next number in the name. Bad for them
i dont get how people think it was marketed as l4d3. like what do people mean when they say l4d3? did they expect the same game just with a different name and different characters?
maybe its because i played the beta but ive never heard my friends (7 of us in total) ever say "oh i thoughts this was l4d3". like when i see "directed by guy ritchie" or "produced by jerry burckheimer" i dont expect it to be a sequel or something
They literally sold the game by putting it out there that its a successor to L4D2 while also saying its a bigger and better cersion of L4D2. If anything, it shows that they only used the name for marketing while scamming L4D2 fans using empty promises. Wheres the devs now if this game was successful? Theyre literally making another zombie game but definitely not a B4B sequel
And they tied B4B with realism, when we all know having custom skins and card decks isnt realistic in an "actual zombie apocalypse". They literally shitted on how old L4D2 gameplay is while trying to prove B4B is better. Well guess who got 20k Daily plays on steam against 2k plays on steam? 😂
@@justaguy_yt1240 They literally sold the game by putting it out there that its a successor to L4D2 - send me the link for this
@@troua2001 literally their live launch of the trailer to B4B and some streams with one of the main Devs. They kept reiterating that B4B was supposed to be a better L4D2 and that the old storyline wouldn't hold water in modern story driven campaign games. Mostly the shit talk was from that stream with devs but I forgot what streams, it's been long since it's from when B4B is still getting fame
@@justaguy_yt1240 then just send the link. not everybody has seen the same things u did.
l4d elitists just need to get gud
L4d was fun but i traded that crap so fast to a friend for jet set radio future
If the fix the bot that u play with it's gonna be alot beter then left 4 dead and there is nothing ealse then that i have a problem with in this game
I’m playing B4B now with a buddy, and while I’ve definitely played better games, this game is clearly better than the first L4D. Never played L4D2 so I don’t know how or even if they improved anything.
Is it just me, or is this just yet another person looking for anything to bitch about?
I’m more than happy with this game. The issues stated means absolutely nothing to me.
Maybe I’m just that really weird person that enjoys enjoying things. Because apparently THATS the weird thing these days in a hate fad culture.
nah game sux lul😂
@@facehurt7606 Thanks for validating the last paragraph 😂
@@scottmeager5919 u got owned
@@facehurt7606 …Not really… are you in high school or something?
You see how I acknowledge I’m a minority in liking it because we’re in a hate fad culture, and he proved my point? Like legit just straight up backed up what I was saying.
Did you get dropped on your head as a baby mate?
nawh bro it was just lacking in content
You’re way off , FANS OF L4D know who Turtle rock studios are and they already knew who and what this game was . They were just confirming it . The problem was and is . That we have been always waiting for the New / sequel to L4D and this is not what they gave us ! That’s the problem. They made the game they wanted to make as opposed to giving the people what they wanted and THATS WHY IT FAILED!!!
Have they fixed all the bugs in this game from Day 1?
Yeah