CinePi - The Open Source Cinema Camera
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- Опубликовано: 5 окт 2024
- In this video I discuss the CinePi, and open source open hardware cinema camera built with a raspberry pi.
CinePi build project
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Super 8 sensor size is too small for cinema in most cases. Wouldn’t go any smaller than 16mm sensor size. Really wish there was a higher end version. It would make more sense to have an upgradable camera when you just spent $5-10k on it.
He said there are other sensors 1:05 … He keeps mentioning 4k so im a little confused about this and why they made the housing suitable for viewfinder vs small or with lens priority. Lil leery about sizable lenses on that housing. 11:00 that rig and lens looks wonky af, everyone using obscure lenses from the 1960s on these things?
Up gradeable hardware has been tried and doesn’t work. Default hardware specs aare well balanced, better cameras usually ship with ALL of a better sensor, more CPU, better bandwidth, etc, when new models ship. And the new sensor tech will probably need a new heat sink design, etc. At the end you’re left with nothing worthwhile and the amount of skilled labour involved in the upgrade is nasty. Anyway, your camera body shouldn’t be a big part of your system costs - less than lights and lenses. So selling it and upgrading to a new body shouldn’t hurt that much, at least if you are one of the pros cinema cameras are meant for and are getting the tax breaks. Otherwise buy an old Canon and put magic lantern on it.
@@TheGreatAmphibian What about Red? They’re still in business and do sensor upgrades. A more open and technical user friendly version at a lower price point I think would be appreciated by many.
@@martinlutherkingjr.5582 Actually RED are the poster child for NOT doing sensor upgrades. They said they were going to, but they have been largely or entirely discontinued for the reasons I gave. I think the last upgrade announced was 2019 and the only info on their sensor upgrade page is a list of abandoned ones…
@@TrggrWarninghe's mistaken about it being 4k, it's HD. From what I can find it's the best camera module for the PI. Others might can be adapted for the Pi, but I don't know what would be involved in that.
If someone was to make like a micro four thirds sensor module for the Pi, I would expect it to run 3x - 4x as much as the one mentioned (150-200 instead of 50). Whole project then approaches the cost of a camera from Panasonic.
Seems like a neat project though. The fact that it uses lenses does give it an edge over a comparably priced Android phone.
this would be huge for things like my old college's video dept which is currently at the whim of huge camera companies deciding when they feel like giving schools access to affordable gear
one thing not mentioned is what lenses are being used, which makes a huge difference and lenses are a big money sink (with cinema grade lenses being upwards of $5k-$10k new)
i'm def gonna have to do more research on this
i wish we could have this kind of effort for celluloid film, which literally your only options are kodak film or old kodak film
Lens choice would depend on the lens mount, with a project like this i would be shocked if the lens mount wasn't modular since cine cameras already have interchangeable lens mounts
Lenses are pricy for a reason. You couldnt easily open source some high quality glass as a lot of the construction is company secrets. But this project being open source means that you probably dont need to worry about the mount type
@@Probable.Orangeyou wouldn't download a Leica 🥴
@@Probable.Orangethe designs are out there and might as well be open. The precision to make them well.... yeah there's a reason we're not making em at home lol
@@jacobheinrich4919im not familiar with cinema lens mounts but i dont see any reason why it would be particularly precise or difficult to make one at a machine shop. Precision is cheap nowadays anyway, someone who knows what they're doing can make something way more precise than a camera mount if they have the right tools in their garage.
Would buy one, love open source stuff like this
I hope we get the same treatment as more open source music DAWS and software that are just as good as FL studio, Logic or Ableton
Yeaahh, i mean theres LMMS but I just couldnt get the hang of it
@@clemente_01 Ardour is pretty nice.
@@clemente_01lmms feels mid
hey dude, funny to run into you here
@@TruthDoesNotExist whats up
Sadly, here in Europe, the Raspberry Pi is always sold out and unobtanium. Might be easier to find an actual cinema camera in used condition and repairing it myself.
You can set the shutter set to exactly XXX microseconds, the gain (iso) to whatever, etc.
Can use your own white balance or EV/auto exposure algorithms.
Pretty cool.
Eh, why? It's a terrible camera for far too much money. Get a decent 2nd hand camera for less that can run Magic Lantern = profit. No 3d printed garbage, better sensor, optics, controls etc.
if you end up building one you should make a video on the process. I'm super intrigued
I can wait for new gooning material filmed using foss
Yikes, lmao
OnlyFoss
????
I already record goonin with frens under nods. The CinePi would be a fine addition
Nah.
This is incredible.
I've been waiting for proper quality DIY cameras for years. We need more variation in the market, both for photo and for cinema.
Hopefully we'l get real cinema sized sensors in the future!
Thank you so much for not being a soulless time sucking level 99 Grifter bro. Your the only creator who I enjoy seeing in my timeline 💯
Facts, seeing people shill for corporate brands without shouting out smaller projects or brands constantly wears on you.
Lenses is where you need to spend the money. Cameras are more or less disposable these days, which the CinePi solves. I will keep an eye on this project for sure.
Yeah but you can make any mount you want with this I guess :D
@@DarkTrapStudiothat would be great, i got a bunch of Pentax lenses lying around
You have zero FOV for whatever glass you mount to it seeing as the sensor is the size of a CCTV camera.
@@Foche_T._Schitt Yes heavy crop but you get the character of each lens, and if it open source that means we could get any sensor on it right ?
The character of the lens is muted when the crop is that heavy from a 1/2.3" sensor @@DarkTrapStudio
The DNG files are going to be huge but I might take a look at this as I love these kinds of projects. Someone did something similar with the Canon EOS M but with that being a 10 year old camera as a base this looks like it would be a better project to sink my time into. Biggest issues would be the relatively small sensor and lens mount but for what it is this is pretty amazing. I'll be very interested to see if this gets updated for the rpi 5 (comes out in a few weeks).
Edit: After some looking into it looks like people have used MFT lenses with 3d printed mounts which probably means you can use whatever you can print a mount for (within reason) so long as you get the distance right. And it's a super 8 sized sensor which isn't all that small. Now if only I had a 3d printer...
Just ask some1 to help u out if u really needed it id print parts for u
Yeah but 2tb SSD cost 80$, people pay 150 dollars for like 240gb Cf express ? That pretty easy DNG workflow here, flawless editing, best image quality, RAW capability..... Its the best.
Fortunately a lotta people operate a business of 3d printing, some libraries have 3d printers you can commission and maybe there's a con or something you can hit up. 3d printing is becoming fairly mainstream because being able to just make a plastic (or various materials) bit for whatever you need is rather nifty.
@@DarkTrapStudio I have a crop mood modded EOS M and the DNG footage takes up a lot of space quick. 1 minute of 10 bit footage takes up a GB of space, and there is a bit of a learning curve editing the files. That said DNG has some advantages which is why people use modded EOS M cameras and the Sigma FP for example, and it's likely someone who is doing this kind of DIY project probably wouldn't mind the extra steps in workflow.
@@alockworkorange7296 I've been doing some research and yeah, there are a lot of options between relatively inexpensive 3d printers and services that will do the printing for you.
The new RPi5 and the expected upgrades of camera hardware, combined with this project ... game changer
You couldn't have posted this at a better time for me holy shit.
I'm a compsci student looking to get into filmmaking, and searching for EXACTLY this!
Thank you for this video!
This would be amazing for high schools and colleges to have access to professional grade cameras at less than a quarter of the cost. Especially in low income areas.
this is totally up my alley, open source tech and film stuff, really cool. Now someone shoot a film like "The Creator" with the Sony FX3, but with the CinePI, just kidding but maybe one day it'll get there, the gap between prosumer cinema cams and the professional stuff is getting shorter.
For the camera sensor specifications, there is a link that is called "Datasheet" in the seller page, it is a link to a PDF
That is very very groovy.
... And, like you suggested, it will only get better.
this is F*ing amazing! Thanks for letting us know ❤
Ok this is really neat project, might actually built it myself as a secondary camera
The best part to me is that you can stock up on parts and if anything breaks you can fix it yourself~
Thanks for sharing this! I use Blackmagic 6Ks at work and I've shot a film on RED and used Canon cinema cameras, among many others.
I wonder how this will compete/interact with the Apertus Axiom which has dedicated open hardware for the project. Definitely gonna make one of these though; it's affordable and available. The more open source for creatives the better.
neither the Sony sensor or the SoC on the Raspi are open (+ the Raspi is still kinda' overpriced)...if you actually want to dick around making vids, a used, magic lantern capable camera is probably a better investment
btw thanks for mentioning the Apertus Axiom, didn't know about it.
@@AKAtheA Ye, was just talking about as cameras and how much difference there is in performance. Open vs closed hardware. Knew about Magic Lantern, but didn't think the compatible cameras could be pretty affordable used. Thanks for the suggestion.
Ooooooooo, very nice, cool, and ultimately, based.
Dang didn't realize you already got over half a million subs. Congrats Kenny. Keep it up. Cheers
Loving the shave style, this also seems like a sick project
This is awesome! There’s so many uses for this type of camera. I’m going to definitely try building one
Thanks for bringing this to our attention. This looks very cool, and something I can do!
Dude i hope u end up making one yourself and uploading it here , really cool project
Awesome. I am hoping that Tech will move more in this direction, and I think it will. Something I am especially worried about is the increasing popularity of electric cars, which, so far, are basically like giant iPhones running on proprietary software. Imagine the kinds of back doors this software has. Governments, tech companies, and potentially hackers can most likely do whatever with your car, which is a scary thought, since your life literally depends on the car.
Imagine a future with open-source electric vehicles. If that day ever comes, I'll finally feel safe about owning one, but until then, no thanks.
I like these projects because they push the major camera manufacturers to adopt new features and push creativity in the filmmaking world. The form factor is really interesting.
I wish it was more ergonomic becuase it looks like it would be awkward to hold.
they could make it solderless by using pogo pins just like the newer mod chips used to circumvent lockdowns on modern game consoles.
i would be ok with soldering as long as it is not tiny sub millimeter sized pads like you will find on some of today's circuit boards.
This is wonderful. Pi 5 just came out too
Would buy this instantly if they can get bigger sensor sizes (at least micro 4/3)
One thing I imagine it would have over any commercially sold camera would just be updates. Fixes and features could be rolled out, unlike pretty much everything else which is static for its whole life out of the box.
amazing! Thanks for sharing! Think of the applications! Drone photography and indie film is going to be incredible in no time soon.
Sounds like free content building this for a youtube video. It's Free Real Estate.
This seems like a fun project for people to learn how cameras work, but i think it's a stretch to call it a cinema camera. The sensor being a cheap raspberry pi 8mm makes this more approachable, but more akin to a CCTV camera in terms of quality. The C lens mount is also a really weird choice, as it's almost only used on CCTV cameras today.
What you really pay for when buying a "cinema" camera (whatever that means nowadays) is a ton of design, testing, build quality and calibration.
Bro im such a tech noob but lol the way you do your videos has taught me sososososo much over the past few months (maybe a year already) since I started watching your content!
This is insane! Thank you for sharing this.
I will probably build it when I have some money to spare.
Wow, I may have to try to cobble one of these things together. Great video as always. Thanks Outlaw.
There is an interesting 80’s quality to that footage. Neat stuff. I love this
It would be interesting to see you build it if you're up for it. Also how based would you be to film yourself on a FOSS cinematic camera.
I would recommend the 64MP raspberry pi compatible sensor module that uses the same "gigantic" sensor as the flagship Samsung smartphones. That camera module delivers insanely good performance and ultra high res.
love ya content man, never stop being based.
You should definitely build one
Please buy one and show us the entire process, that seems amazing
You don't buy it, you build it.
This is a great project. I hope bigger sensors will be available at decent prices in the future. A real cinema camera needs at least an APS-C sensor.
Not at all, cinema had small sensors for years, and now lens and low light capability are extremely good I don't understand your take.
@@DarkTrapStudio Op isn't wrong, the cinema camera community wants larger sensors and higher resolutions. A 1080 super 8 sensor wouldn't cut it for most professionals when even the 'budget' cinema cameras (blackmagic) come with MFT at 4k now a days. Some research makes it seem like the resolution limit is because of the Pi but it looks like the rpi 5 won't solve that because it still comes with USB 3 and PCIe 2.0 x1, but maybe in the future. Still an interesting project for DIY or the budget oriented though.
@@nadtz The cinema community ? you mean the youtube community or are you in the cinema industry ?
I must admit I am just a hobby photographer, but I know that for good depth of field you need a large sensor and big/expensive lenses. Cinema is different of course, but you have to capture at least 24 fps and the larger the sensor, the more light you can capture.
@@nadtz No what you say doesn't make sense, Arri 4K camera are extremely recent and most cinema camera where shooting film on 1080p Arri camera, and so in cinema DNG.
If you don't do CG movies or Still print you don't need more than 4K, you won't even post in more 4K, maybe if you do wildlife but you don't need to crop with a small sensors cause lens have huge reach.
USB 3 limits are more on the codecs side than resolution, DNG 4K is huge, H264 8K is riddiculous next to DNG 4K.
This product is the future of consumer user products I think.
Just go buy a used Micro 4/3rds camera. You'll come out way ahead.
please build one of these for the channel... id love to see more things about open source video production. I'm currently in the process of abandoning adobe for davinci resolve and something like this would be great to free me from canon
Nice. I have everything here. Waited for something like this.Thanks for bringing this to my attention!
I have used it and i will relese some footage . I have a build full working is amazing
Cinema-Grade Camera → 1/2.3" sensor. Sorry mate but that is not a cinema grade camera. Especially with the horrible lens selection that would naturally come with such a small sensor. Micro-four-thirds already has limited lens selection, this is a step beyond even that. 12 bit DNG doesn't make a lick of difference on such a small sensor. I agree it's a cool project, but that's about it. It has no more potential than that. There's a reason pro grade cameras cost thousands, and it's not for quadruple profit margins I can tell you that much. Cameras are designed from the ground up to deliver the best image quality possible at a given cost. This is nothing more than camera software and a really good webcam.
lol, so wrong.
@@djjoeray I encourage you to cite your sources sir.
1:06 "you can also put other sensors in this"
actually, the guy who made this said himself on reddit that he's already trying to make it work with the same sensor the BMPCC 4K uses.
That's what a lot of people with this more immediate view of things usually fail to get.
First of all, you can absolutely get good quality images with the setup as is - way better than what you could possibly get by any other means within this price range.
But something like this existing - especially with it being open source - allows people to iterate and improve upon the design it's been made in ways that proprietary hardware just doesn't allow.
I mean, it hasn't been a month yet since the dude published his open source camera, give him a break lol
It already is a valuable thing for film schools in empoverished areas, for example. Let's wait some time and see what developments may come - bigger and better sensors, etc
This is absolutely amazing, I'm not a tech guy but I'll try to assemble this someday (it's just I doubt that this parts available in Russia)
Aliexpress is not from the Alliance ;)
@@DarkTrapStudio yeah, but it's usually take more than a month for delivery and high chances of damages during transportation ;c
@@quite1enough :(
At least from a technical perspective I know a lot of pro cameras use FPGAs to do some compute, would cool to see brought to mainstream. Maybe GPU programming? Mainly just because more people are familiar the development ecosystems for GPUs are a little more open than FPGAs
This is very interesting, and I applaud the effort, though video professionals would most likely laugh at you for coming to a shoot with this thing.
It'll be interesting to see how this develops over the next decade though.
If it gets the job done opinions do not matter.
The absolute cope of repeating "it looks pretty good!". Literally the gnu/car meme.
Finally open source camera to make cinema movies open source easier
Unimaginably based
I can see one application for these that theyll be unbeatable at: Cinematic FPV Drone shots.
Many productions miss out on this insane tool because flying a quad with a 20k camera setup on top is something for big advertising and hollywood with fancy insurances.
This is very cool I’d definitely want to learn how to make this.
The IMX477 is what comes with the RaspberryPi HQ camera and it’s quite good but definitely not cinema quality.
I actually use it for my drone have a couple videos of it here on my channel.
The footage on his channel are Arri like, why this is not "cinema quality" ?
We had Cinelerra for a while. Now we got the CinePi. Imagine somesay the industry standard tools will become fully open source.
Ordering all the parts. Will need to get it on my tech channel.
Holy crap, I've been drooling over professional cinema cameras like Blackmagic URSA/pocket cinema but can't even acquire one due to price, now I know what to do after getting a 3D printer.
not the only the output makes a camera pro - its the interfaces(SDI, XLR, other), the ease of use, reliability, audio\video codecs(LOG, RAW, 10bit, HDR)
Its 12 bit RAW DNG, Its a pi you can make any port you want.
@@DarkTrapStudio its not that convenient
@@Neuer_Alias_erstellenIts DIY camera ....
I wonder if there is a PrinterPi that would be amazing.
this rules so much. I love open source soft- & hardware
Thanks for doing this video and bringing this to our attention. A full frame sensor or larger such as medium or large format sensor, and HDMI output would be nice.
Gamechanger for sure. It's like building your own PC, but with a Camera. I got a feeling this is going to become the norm as time goes on.
Actually awesome! Finally have a use for mine.
The project is amazing, but after using this setup for a time, I went back to my BMPCC original.
The rolling shutter is awful on the IMX477, and the RPI 4 was too unstable for long recording sessions.
RPI 5 our now, may be better?
Yes! build one.
The vimeo video was shaky but otherwise, the video quality is sweet.
This is really cool, there is another project doing this to canon cameras called magic lantern. And there is a guy IMCE that built an enclosure for the EOSM granted he's just selling them. They're not open source unfortunately
This makes me so happy to see
Very interesting project. I would love to see you try and put this together and do a little photography yourself.
This is such a cool project
thanks for the video kenny :)
traditional film runs at 24 FPS which would help with data. TV and home video use higher framerates which, through association with the convention, people tend to see as looking "cheaper." Most movies are still shot in 24p.
This is the kinda thing that will really profit off of the Pi 5
10:20 yes, but the shake makes me seasick. Stabilization is an issue, but I can see this project taking off, couple it with a vintage lens like a Helios 44m and you could get some crazy interesting footage.
This looks like a Pi based product has caught up to the Bolex D16 from a decade earlier. It would be interesting to see a full list of sensors with CSI2 connections that can work with this project, especially some of the Global Shutter units that go under used for action cinematographry.
I want to build one now!
bro it might be good to try making this as a project on the channel and seeing the diff with what u currently have.
Rather interesting project... considering it uses the sensor similar in size to one inside GoPro Hero4 Black, with the features and video capabilities according.
That's pretty cool I'm going to have to look into that...
Any reason the come and find it shirt isn't available in long sleeve?
Cant wait for the day they allow a full frame sensor to the Pi, its a long ways away since it would destroy other camera companies ability to compete but maybe some day! If the MIPI protocol was opensourced then other people could use different boards than the official Pi which would be epic.
Wow!!! Thanks for the news
The removal of hardware video encoding on raspberry pi 5 has made a lot of projects like this worse, which sucks
This is an impressive project, but I only see it for photographers of which I am not. If I ever consider getting a professional camera though, The CinePi or a similar project will be the first thing I check out!
It doesn't really look like it's made for photographers. Cine cameras are really only built to do video well
@@jacobnussbaum2309Video are still frames, some of cinema/documentary prints on billboard are video stills.
Bigger sensor and options to mount professional lenses could make this something worthwhile for video shooting
i know im gonna get flak for asking this but what makes this better than say a modern mid to high end phone camera? access to lenses?
there should be like, an Open Source Hardware shop online, where people can make a (down)payment on a completed & tested as functioning build from some opensource design listed there.
makers all over the world can make parts & organise the assembly & testing until sent to the customer.
might require blockchain-technology🤔
Something to watch but not for hard use in its current iteration. The sensor needs to at least be Super16. You need to get at least 10 gbps write speeds for raw. Something a pi 5 and some other hardware can fix, outside of the sensor. If I get into this project I may take a crack at redesigning the body to accommodate a hood and a spot for a handgrip.
With that sensor size you might as well just use a newer iPhone that can already exceed the recording specs. Black magic just release a camera app for iPhone as well which is super nice given how greedy filmic pro got.
Epic
The main limiting factor is the sensor.
Micro43 is the minimum sensor size required in my opinion(like lumix gh5)
why ?
super 16mm like the original pocket camera could be fine imo
I glad to say i have real footage of thia camera on my channel. Thanks to all that suport this technology
This is pretty exciting as this is something I’ve been looking for for awhile tbh. Though I’d probably ditch the inbuilt screen and try to find a way to hook up an HDMI port and go that route. Pretty cool though.
This would be the best dashcam in existance. Sure it's a bit larger but seems like with a compact case it would still easily fit
I've been following it for a bit and actually thinking of building one for fun/webcam (I own cinema cameras since I'm a cinematographer) and thinking of even doing a comparison video between just how close the CinePi can get to real industry cameras.
what would make sense is to modify the firmware of existing dslrs to make them records formats and do things that are not available but obviously supported by the hardware... like in the old times of magic lantern with the 5D cameras.