[angel] [angel] fun fact: if kris hp drops to 0 in the berdly fight,he'll say smt like this in the next turn: "noelle kris is down,come here-" Noelle:"i can still hear their voice"
@@regularaccount9167The fandom has known the player is separate from kris for years, matpat is incredibly late to the party. It really isn’t like, needed to watch his video because of this since theres already been so many videos and discussions about the topic.
@@duckman9327it’s kind of crazy people still deny it lol. the player was diegetic in undertale, and deltarune has set it up and implied it so much, i don’t really understand why people don’t think the player is a force in the story.
I think my favorite part about the weird route is how.. creepypasta-esc it feels. Playing chapter 2 when it released and then the next night seeing rumors of the “genocide route” of chapter 2 was an insane experience, especially after having the assumption for so long that this games whole thing was that your choices don’t matter. The route was initially documented with a google doc, and I really thought a super creative fan just put this story together in a day until I saw people starting to take pictures
@@laytonspuzzle It's a blogpost (deltarune/icepalace_glaceir) Noelle did about Dragonblazers and the Ice Palace where she found a weird door that supposedly shouldn't exist. She eventually found it by going up, so the door is positioned like the door to Spamton's shop (a character she has a subconscious history with as well) but it also evokes the hidden gray door leading to the mystery man. d_a_m_n_y_o_u_t_e_n_n_a can lead you to a portion of the site that looks like it resembles an ice palace with a door. And clicking on that door leads you to the blogpost again.
Thank you for using my guide! I may have to make some changes if anything goes wrong, it’s been reviewed by peers on a Deltarune discord server, but this will be the first time I actually see it used in a Let’s Play. UPDATE - Sounds like I missed an important detail: fighting the enemies in the trash zone seems to be the official trigger for the Weird Route to start, so going left first is actually mandatory, not just recommended. Lancer falls asleep immediately after you freeze the last enemy in the trash zone. The guide has been updated accordingly.
@@Magma-Idiot-2001 The guide says that it’s optional. In fact, the guide mentions a lot of optional things that are entirely possible to do outside of the weird route, but sorta fit the tone. But everything that’s optional is labeled as such.
Fun fact about the conversation you have with Noelle after you leave Rudy's hospital room and you get that cutscene, there's three way's it can go depending on what you do. The first happens when you just play through the snowgrave route and reach the hospital cutscene with Noelle, and once you say to either see Noelle or her father, she'll realize the voice responding sounds just like the one in her dream and then Susie shows up and interrupts and ends the cutscene. The second was the one you go to see where you have the watch equipped and Noelle notices it. And the third being that during that cutscene, you can actually move right, the first time Noelle hears Kris step towards her startling her, the second scaring Noelle, and the third causing her to run, prematurely ending the cutscene (you can do this at any part of the cutscene)
Toby is such a good writer. I've never seen a story where you, the reader, manipulate your vessel to groom a child into murder. it's sickening. amazing writing.
Berdly character development changes drastically the moment he sees something wrong with Noelle, he doesn’t act smug anymore and he uses a stronger version of his normal attack. A single pixel he has during his battle sprite changes so he’s not smiling anymore too, this route makes berdly one of my favorite deltarune characters
To borrow comments from other Deltarune videos: Everyone always recoils in horror to what the player does to the characters in the Snowgrave route, but have we truly considered the cost of the Pacifist route? According to everything we have learned about Kris from talking to the other town folks, Kris is a loner at best, and a bit of a creep at worst. Kris's own mother reacts with shock to learn that Kris is hanging out with a friend. TWICE. Multiple school members state that Kris has used his mother as a study partner in the past because no one wants to pair up with Kris, and that Kris is a lackluster student despite being intelligent. Multiple people say that Kris is a creepy quite kid that seems to always take mean-spirited pranks and practical jokes a bit too far. Half of the town members reaction to Kris is some variant of "stay out of trouble", which clearly says what they think of Kris. Noelle, the person who is closest to Kris other than Asriel, who grew up alongside Kris, and says "they know me better than everyone, AND YET" Noelle still struggles to view Kris as a "friend". Now imagine if you are Kris, and someTHING comes and takes control of your body. And within just two days, that outside force has made more friends than you have in your entire life, they have mended the bridges YOU burned, and everyone is saying that you are so much nicer, more pleasant, better in everyway WHEN YOU ARE NO LONGER YOURSELF. Are we truly helping Kris by being nice to everyone? Or just rubbing salt in Kris' wounds?
Kris also seems friends with Catti and Monster Teen tho, not only Noelle, Monster Teen was 100% willing to become Kris' partner but because they thought Kris wouldn't come, he went with Snowy, so he was even waiting for Kris, and about Catti, they studied occult together, and that doesn't really seem like a school subject I don't think it's a "Nobody wants to hang out with Kris" but "Kris doesn't start conversations and nobody knows what's up with them, other than people who bother to become their friend", so kinda of a "social Introvert" situation where sure Kris enjoys having people around and having friends, but they're introverted
Not so fun fact: When Noelle has the Thornring in the Berdly fight, her health always drops to 55. If you translate 55 into Roman numerals, it comes out to LV. What’s LV stand for? Why, LOVE, of course!
@@slim3rs172 it was definitely intended. It was probably just easier to implement it 1/3rd-ing her health rather than just making it set to 55. Or maybe Toby just coded it like that to throw dataminers off. That's something he would do. Not to mention, there's literally no normal way to have Noelles health be higher than 166, so using something that'd normally be illegal in-game as proof honestly kinda weakens the point.
Little fun fact. The nusic that plays in Queen's castle is known as Pandora Palace. However, when doing the snowgrave route, it is replaced by "Deal Gone Wrong". This is the music that also plays before the NEO fight, as you have probably noticed. I think it adds that little extra [[Power]] to the route and area.
I love seeing the dialog when Noelle steps on the button and you interact with her, and when she notes that Kris is looking at her in a strange way. In my opinion, it might be a look of apology? Maybe desperation? Kris can't reassure her through words, so they try to do so through looking at her, but they've got such a creepy-kid aura that it doesn't come off that way.
Noelle’s corruption is a lot like Chara’s. They both start to echo the sentiments of “I’m getting stronger” and becoming “powerful”. The player forcing Chara to witness or Noelle to do it make them change. Noelle seems more willing to do it since she thinks it’s all like a “video game”. Once she kills Berdly, it’s no longer a “game”. Chara knows it’s murder tho, but they’re a dead kid too so they don’t have any control until they accept it.
If I may, I'd recommend the 'SNOWGRAVE' animation by Atristicamente, even if just for personal watching instead of a reaction video, it captures the feeling excellently. Great job on beating the route! That NEO fight is rough.
Here's a list of "interesting" details in the Weird Route. WARNING: WAY TOO LONG, WILL COVER YOUR SCREEN 3:07 Usually, you can teach Noelle how to battle by ACTing with the help of this Virovirokun. But in this route, Noelle never learns how to fight without attacking, and just assumes it's how the Dark World works. This is reinforced later at 21:10 and 37:36, you make this whole route happen by making it seem like freezing is obviously the only way.
16:25 Usually, you can see Susie and Ralsei eating cotton candy they just bought from an Addison in this room. You even get some cute Noelle dialogue. ...Guess the cotton candy stand is closed? 24:28 Okay, so this room is full of details. First, usually you stand on the switch and Noelle walks across. Now it's the other way around. Second, there's secret dialogue for talking to her while she's standing on the switch. You actually found some of this ("Why are they... staring into my eyes like that?") But there's even more, for... talking to her from behind ("I... I can't see what they're doing, but...) (Aren't they staring at me...?"), and on each side ("What are they looking at?) and (Why don't they step on the switch?"). Really specific. Third, if you watch Noelle really closely at 24:53, you can see she's ABOUT TO STEP OFF the switch. Maybe that's even why she offered to stand on the switch. She was more than thinking about it. 26:24 After getting the FreezeRing, the music actually changes slightly, rather than just slowing, enemies flee from you, and Noelle's battle sprites change entirely. You noticed the snow globe around her at the end of fights rather than her sighing in relief, but she also: - Summons a wall of ice to defend rather than turning and hiding - Only flinches briefly when hit rather than looking scared - Looks uncomfortably down in her idle animation rather than calmly forward - And my personal (least) favorite, is... sort of... dragged into battles, rather than jumping up in fear. 29:50 Snowgrave IS actually an AOE spell...Guess you got your wish. Unsettlingly, this implies we might use it normally later in the game just as a method of clearing out enemies. 31:28 Kris actually will eat the moss normally, upgrading their title to "Moss Finder." You can even bring Susie and Ralsei here later, and "Eat the moss... together." giving some of the goofiest dialogue in the entire game, and giving Susie the incredible "Moss Enjoyer" title. ...So it's too bad Kris isn't in the mood for moss right now. 33:25 A common theme is having multiple answers, where one is incredibly simple and empty, and the other is longer and more like something somebody would actually say. Could be Kris trying to say one thing, but us rejecting it and picking the opposite. Or maybe not, who knows at this point. 38:44 Most enemies just run directly away from you instead of toward, but the Poppups actually hide rather than run. Their eyes dart around before popping back into the ground when you get close, instead of popping up and chasing you when you approach. 44:06 Alright, the Berdly fight. Unsettling to see Berdly actually focused rather than fumbling for an excuse to attack. The music is perfect for the tone. But there's a big secret you missed. You noticed that Berdly is actually directing his attacks at Kris and avoiding Noelle, but it goes even further. If you hadn't healed Kris at 45:24, Berdly would actually pass his attack and talk to Noelle, giving the terrifying dialogue: N-Noelle, look! Kris is down! Now's your chance to come back over here! N... Noelle? (I can... still... hear... their voice...) Really drilling in: it's not Kris, it's you. You can end this fight in four ways: by casting SnowGrave, Fighting, using IceShock, or acting. The fight even has custom acts with plenty of flavor text. If you choose to end the fight peacefully, the route is aborted at the last minute, BUT, you keep all the equipment AND the SnowGrave spell. This way, you can show Ralsei and Susie the Ice, Freeze, and Thorn rings later, (Ralsei responds to the ThornRing with "..." and Susie responds with "A torture device?") and you can read SnowGrave's description on the stats page: SnowGrave Fatal Deals the fatal damage to all of the enemies. If you use SnowGrave on a Darkner (as of now, you have to cheat to do this), they will disintegrate into red mist. One more detail about this fight: This may sound like a stretch, and it could be a coincidence, but Noelle's HP is at 166 when you get the ThornRing, and the ThornRing makes her drop to a third of her HP, which can only ever be 55 at that point in the game. 55 in roman numerals is LV. 54:57 No chocolate/tea/coffee for Susie this time. 56:26 Sorry Ralsei, but what do you by "supposed to?" Do you have a script or something? This whole sequence of Kris refusing to respond so you don't get a dialogue option, and Ralsei desperately asking Susie what happened so the story isn't further thrown off track is great. 59:34 You caught this one (; 1:01:51 Susie going back to comfort Noelle really makes you wonder what kind of state she's in. 1:08:43 Here's a thought: This isn't concrete, of course, but the meaning of [Hyperlink Blocked] could potentially be LV. It usually fits in other places better than other candidates, and works especially well here. Not only is "[Making] LV" exactly the kind of stupid joke Spamton would make, but it fits absolutely perfect here. Now that you and Noelle have been causing havoc and gaining stats, you don't need his equipment anymore. In fact, all of Spamton's dialogue in this fight is incredibly interesting, especially after translating out the gibberish. 1:14:54 KRIS called for help... but nobody came. KRIS called for help... KRIS called for help... KRIS called for help... 1:16:21 YOU whispered Noelle's name. You, not Kris. 1:16:47 That wasn't SnowGrave. She didn't cast SnowGrave there. That was IceShock, which did 300-400 before. It did 2000+ here, more than SnowGrave did against Berdly, and this was against Spamton with his defenses up so high you only did 10 damage. What happened? 1:26:06 There's a very interesting thing you missed: If you talk to Malius (the guy who fixed the key for Jevil) and look at the list of items you can combine together, one of them is the Twisted Sword. Crafting it requires the a "PureCrystal" and the Thorn Ring. This is an incredibly interesting detail that will probably have some impact on later chapters. The ThornRing requires you to do the Weird Route, and the PureCrystal's description is "The shadow purified by the cat" meaning that the PureCrystal is almost certainly what Seam is planning to "stitch together for you" if you get every Shadow Crystal, aka beating every secret boss. But what is the Twisted Sword? We actually have some information on it. Through save file editing, you check the stats of the sword. It's an item only equippable to Kris, and it has incredibly high attack. It also gives the effect "Trance" with a downwards pointing arrow. This implies that by defeating every secret boss and doing the Weird Route, you can decrease your control over Kris? Very unsettling, and sounds like a setup for a Kris boss fight to me. That said, Trance with a downwards arrow could also imply that it's giving a "Trance" debuff, maybe giving completely control over Kris? Either way, this item is right there in front of us, you can see this recipe in any route, and it's probably going to be very significant later on. 1:31:51 An extremely unsettling track is meant to play here. Unfortunate your audio cut out and closing the game didn't help. I'd suggest listening to it, it's simple but great. If you actually read all this, thank you! I know way too much about this game and can't help but share it. I agree with basically all your closing thoughts and couldn't bring myself to do a LV 20 run of Undertale either. Love your videos, keep it up!
I read it all, it's all very insightful thank you!! The Twisted Sword has me hooked - and the trance state, I didn't realize it's significance until reading through the comments. You answered a lot of questions I had, and also ones I didn't think to ask! Kinda sad I missed the whole moss party - my fault for not being able to dodge cars, ha!
Snowgrave is a very interesting route. Throughout Deltarune we are told that our choices don't matter which is proven due to the lack of a genocide route, and then we get the Snowgrave route which completely changes chapter 2. Immediately we think "Oh I guess our choices do matter" however when you reach the end of the chapter, the ending is exactly the same. Both the normal route and the snowgrave route leave Noelle more confident and deepens her relationship with Kris and Susie. So despite it seeming very different, both endings leave the characters in the same (or at least very similar) place. Just an interesting thing about the game!
Very specific but interesting, berdly is the "blue bead" on the doctors toy that "gravely march on their set path". But by killing him the blue bead is torn off. So you get rid of characters as whatevers left continues on their set path.
1:18:47 I always thought the "that's great" means: "So that really was a dream bc susie doesn't have a tail irl" 1:31:46 This "Hospital Scene" has 3 versión -Normal Version -Having the Silver watch equiped -Pressing Right buttom all the time
Oh! I totally misread the tail interaction. Your interpretation makes so much sense. Especially since Noelle is doing her very best to try and find some way to make what happened not real... 3 VERSIONS? *and* one of them is done by pressing on the controls while in a cut scene, reminds me of the end of chapter 1 when the heart in the cage can be controlled!
Fun Fact: it's highly suggestive that Noelle hears the Choice in the menu window that you do as the player, no mater which choice you do in the hospital Susie will cut that conversation of just after the choice is made, meaning that even if Kris can't tell Noelle what we chooses she might have still heard it, on top of that the game records all of these choices meaning that it might be important for a later chapter. about Susie and Noelle, a lot of people believes that with Noelles "Boldness" being 12 that she kissed Susie, and Susie comes out happy about it but but some like me are not convinced because we believe Susie would act different about Noelle waking up and in the hospital, Susie is Dense and don't understand Rudy is trying to help her date Noelle but if they did kiss this would all be more straight forward, they probably start of just as friends since Susie don't seem to be the romantic type and she's just ecstatic about having friends. some other believes Susie was told something weird about Kris and thus she'll "tell Kris Later" and don't want to involve Ralsei. a thought i had was that maybe Boldness is not synonymous with Bravery, Guts seem to have a closer correlation with Bravery, maybe Boldness is a "progression bar" for the next Guts
I've seen that some Spamton NEO's dialogue from this route is really interesting. Including some foreshadowing. What I got from it is that Spamton implies is that if Kris/player wants "freedom" by going down that path, they will, but the outcome will be a regretful one, where Kris will be "crying in a broken home...".
So, a couple facts that you might not have realized. First, when Noelle is stepping on the switch to let you through, if you look closely, you can see her feet shuffle, showing she's thinking of stepping off the switch. Also, in the Berdly fight (assuming you have the Thorn Ring equipped), Noelle's HP will always go down to 55, which in Roman Numerals is LV.
Some very, very interesting Weird route Spamton dialogue "You think making [Frozen Chicken] with your [Side Chick] is gonna let you drink up that [Sweet, Sweet] [Freedom] Sauce. Well you're [$!$!] right but don't blame me when you're crying in a [Broken Home] wishing you let your old pal Spamton [Kill You]."
i really love watching your playthrough, and how willing you are to really go above and beyond to explore this game!!!! ive been getting into deltarune alongside you and its just really amazing to see someone express the same level of interest!!! thank you for this series!!!
This was a fantastic playthrough. It's really enjoyable to see an in depth playthrough where the difference between you and Kris is understood from the start.
Thank you! Playing this game on youtube has been great, there's been a lot of great discussion in the comments and my understanding wouldn't be as good as it is without everyone's input!
Hey Fizzi! iJust wanted to Point out that in 1:20:7 The Blue broken off bead represents berdly, The beads represent the Characters. Most likely, if you kill more characters, more beads will dissapear. Great Videi by the way!
You should watch a video about the Spamton Sweepstakes if you want some extra Deltarune Lore (This could be two videos - one for the material that was on the sweepstake website, and one for the finale of the sweepstakes aka the spamton value network)
I've been excited for this. The Weird Route is so interesting and i can't wait to see where it goes in future chapters. One very interesting part of this route is that it implies that Kris has some other motivation for making the Fountain. In the normal route, you could make the argument that Kris only made the Fountain to have more fun adventures with Susie, but that doesn't make sense in the Weird Route. After watching Berdly die and Noelle get manipulated into killing him, why would they open a fountain with their mother present? So it implies that Kris has a motive for making a fountain that is important enough to risk the possibility of another Weird Route. They could be the Knight, it could be another thing entirely, but whatever it is it has to be important to them.
I’m a believer in the theory that Dess is lost in a Dark World somewhere, and Kris is desperately trying to find her. Gives another explanation for why they want actual adults (Toriel and the police) to see a Dark World - if they know it’s real….
One detail I think you'll find very interesting: If you take a look at what Malius can alchemize in the Castle Town, there's a notable item listed there. The TwistedSword. Why is this relevant to this route? Well, the crafting ingredients require two things that should immediately be confusing. Sorry if you already knew about this, just something I thought you might appreciate considering you're curious about things like Kris's save file.
It's good that Deltarune has multiple save files, as opposed to Undertale's singular. So if you want to experiment without consequences in your usual save, you can! ...Probably!
"Probably" haunts me in my dreams at night. I've thought about deleting the "weird" save file before chapter 3 releases... but that wouldn't be very Annoying Dog of me!
Great video! I only just found your channel about a week ago, but I binge-watched your entire playthroughs of Undertale and Deltarune, and I had a fun time!! I even just finished the Deltarune one last night, and I was intrigued to see that you posted this, and I was really interested to hear what you had to say about it :3 I agreed with everything you said at the end, too. Now, if I may, allow me to share some thoughts I had during the video ^^ sorry if it's a long read lol - What you said about a future "no save run" in the full game sounded cool. It could change something, but also it might not, knowing Toby Fox. In undertale, not saving only gave you one extra line at the end during the sans call lol. At this point I just don't think it's possible, because it creates a file for you after you finish each chapter (When you start chapter 2, you can choose to either create a new file or choose your chapter 1 save, titled something like " Your Room - Chapter 1 END"). - Somehow, I never noticed how to music just cuts out around 6:30 right after defeating those popups. The cold wind blowing is pretty ominous though and fits the tone of the Snowgrave route - Interestingly, choosing "I will ride with you" at the ferris wheel poster is not mandatory for the route. I always thought it was, but I learned recently you can completely ignore it and it wouldn't change anything :) - 32:56 You don't level up like in undertale, BUT kris' and noelle's HP go up everytime your "power" increases. - Not-so-fun fact about the Thorn Ring: it reduces the TP cost for ice spells because without it, Snowgrave would cost about 200 TP. Also I assume the "trance" stat is why Noelle didn't recognize Berdly at first - Did you notice how Noelle's HP stopped going down after it hit 55? 55 in roman numerals is LV (: - Also during the Berdly battle, the music kinda sounds like a heartbeat. At least, I think that's what it's meant to represent - I saw someone say it already, but the distinction between "Kris called for help" and "YOU whispered Noelle's name" is concerning. Kris calls out for their friends, and nobody shows up, but when it's time to call for Noelle, you, the player, whisper for her, and she comes running. - 1:24:52 I actually haven't seen this interaction before, but it's so cute!! ☺ I wanna ride the Susie train too, haha - In Rudy's hospital room, Noelle usually notices Susie first. But this time, she only saw Kris, and didn't seem to notice Susie was even there until she said something. Interesting.. - I don't think a lot of people know this but, after you leave the hospital room, you can move while Noelle is talking, and she'll get scared, cutting off whatever she was saying, and ask how long you've been standing behind her. Anyways, it's really strange to me how the ending of the chapter is the exact same no matter your actions. The game really meant it when it said your choices don't matter. Ultimately, Kris still opens the fountain, even after everything you just put them, and Noelle, through. I'm just wondering how Susie and Ralsei are gonna react in the future if/when they find out what "Kris" has done.
I did not notice their HP going up! that in combination with the 55 = LV detail, the sound design i.e the whooshing and silence, the heartbeat (I think it's that too!) really help sets the tone for the route and it's just... such great design. I didn't know about the small dialogue change in Undertale if you played without saving until just recently, and it's reinforced my obsession in no save Deltarune, ha! Thanks for joining us!
This is a well-discussed topic in the fandom and there's a lot of comments on this video so someone might have already brought this up, but one aspect of the Weird Route that both fascinates and horrifies me the most is the weird romantic undertones it has. Probably the most obvious aspect of this is when you get the FreezeRing; in order for the route to happen, you HAVE to say that Kris and Noelle aren't "just" friends, but "something else." Something which confuses Noelle and clearly makes her uncomfortable. While the Ferris Wheel dialogue isn't necessary for the route, it's still connected to it. Noelle thinking about wanting to ride with Susie, her actual love interest, and us forcing Kris to say "I will ride with you" and then "Noelle will ride with me", pressuring her into it... it's like we're forcibly replacing Susie with Kris. And then of course, in order to progress the route you have to give Noelle the ThornRing. You literally have to force Kris to give Noelle a ring, a ring that literally hurts her to wear. I feel like the forced relationship symbolism there is obvious. And of course, this isn't just a forced relationship, but an abusive one. (That much should be obvious.) But the worst part is that it isn't just Noelle who is suffering here, but Kris as well. It seems highly unlikely Kris would ever do something like this, especially considering the emphasis put on how odd this behavior is from them and that our voice is "unlike Kris's." Kris seems to be visibly upset when joining back up with Susie and Ralsei, judging from Susie's comment. Nobody wins here. There's also the fact that the whole route seems to be made deliberately to feel like you're breaking the game, doing something you're not supposed to. When it was first discovered a lot of people genuinely didn't think it was real. The connections to breaking a game, going out-of-bounds, finding secrets/glitches etc. that this route has become a LOT more interesting once you've gone through the Spamton Sweepstakes and learned a bit more about Noelle. I also think that people don't place enough importance on Noelle's monologue at the hospital. She is one of the few people who has noticed something is off about Kris since we started controlling them, and she actually vows to try and figure out what's going on with them. It sort of warms and breaks my heart that even after everything "Kris" did to Noelle, she just knows them so well that she knows they would never do something like this and wants to try and help them. I think that in future chapters that's going to become more important; Noelle might be the one to actually discover our existence, at least on a Weird Route. (Also this is unrelated but if you want a great catalogue of Deltarune's metanarrative, I highly suggest watching Part 1 and 2 of mollystars' Device Theory! They're very long, but they're a fantastic summary and analysis of everything fourth-wall-breaking about Deltarune, including stuff like Gaster, the Weird Route, and the many odd things found in the game's files.)
I also wanna add that with Kris, the game seems to be looking to explore (at least in a small way) the idea of choosing romance options for the protagonist. Along with everything with Noelle, there's also the fact that we seem to be able to play into romantic-seeming options with Ralsei. There's evidence to suggest that Kris doesn't have the highest opinion of Ralsei, but even outside of that there's also the obvious fact that Ralsei looks like their brother. It's pretty likely that Kris does NOT feel that way about Ralsei, and yet we're able to do things like hug him and say "I feel the same" during the Acid Tunnel of Love ride. It all seems to go back to the fact that we are not Kris, and we should not be able to force them into these kinds of relationships. This kind of stuff just fascinates me, and I'm interested to see where Toby goes with it in future chapters.
Things to watch in order: Deltarune Status Updates, then Spamton Sweepstakes, then the Valentines letters Bonus: Undertale Alarm Clock Dialogue Potentially good videos: Spookydood's "I solved Gaster's Mysterious Valentines Card" and "Solving Deltarune's Big Twist", Nighthawk's Kris analysis and "What did Kris say", Dorked's "Learning To Love Berdly" and "The Truth About Papyrus"
3:46 I mean, maybe you're not instantly killing them. Maybe you're just leaving them to slowly freeze to death. 18:11 They probably are dying. The way the Weird Route is written, it seems like an error in the game that should never have been possible. It's like you're abusing an exploit by freezing enemies in place so they can't run and you can actually kill them. 33:56 Or perhaps Kris is just losing their will to resist. Especially considering what Susie says at 49:30. 41:34 "Wearer takes damage from pain" is probably the most plain, item-description-like way to say "This equipment you're giving her is a torture device." 46:31 Is Noelle hiding that she knows the spell from you so you don't make her use it, or does she really not know? 1:34:53 I'm honestly not sure who I feel more sorry for.
Game theory just made a theory about deltarune. I think now would be the perfect time to look at it with everything fresh in your mind, i would love to hear your thoughts on.
You missed the dialogue uf kris is down in berdly fight as you revived kris, at least It's better than going back to the start. And there's another dialogue in castle town if you attacked everyone in queen mansion instead of sparing, sparing doesn't abort the route, but It's edgier to attack so it's an obvious choice
1:10:13 and 1:10:35 Really think about what he says. Doing weird route (freezing chicken) will give you freedom. Maybe, even if it looks so bad right now, maybe it is the only way to get to be free
Looking at it now, Perhaps Spamton neo talks about kris instead? Like, we are going to be so bad, so kris gonna tell about us, and then we gonna get separated. Or something like that?
45:47 Fact: Noelle's HP stays at 55 means something interesting... If you convert 55 to Roman numerals, you get "LV" Warning. Possible Undertale Spoilers ahead This is an acronym. It stands for *level of violence* in Undertale
@@LiMe251 I said that there was a spoiler in this comment. And yeah, she knows about that because she also watched the genocide route using a video of Asmolboy's RUclips account.
The worst part of this route to me is the weird romantic connotations with Noelle. And it's worse because said connotations are more so between the player and Noelle rather than Kris and Noelle. The Ferris Wheel is primarily Noelle's way of fantasizing about, and, in the normal route, getting closer to Susie. It's no coincidence that in this route exclusively, you can pressure her into agreeing to go with you, even though she's clearly uncomfortable. The route requires you to tell the Addison that "We're something else," even though Noelle clearly wants Kris to answer that they're friends. Not to mention the fact that you give her a ring. And several times in the route you end up violating her personal space. You can actually press right during the hospital scene and Noelle ends up screaming at you to stop and not get any closer. Kris's sprite placement reveals you had her and Kris nearly nose to nose against the wall. It's horrifying to me and I love it.
Also the way that Kris turns to the screen and stares at you feels so intentional in this route. Yes it happens during regular gameplay and sometimes is kinda funny but especially after the Berdly fight, it just...feels like they're judging you and it works so well.
There was something really off putting about the romantic scenes and I couldn't really place why... but your reasoning makes a lot of sense. Thanks for this perspective!
Finding your deltarune playthrough has been great, I really enjoyed it. I know you made a video reacting to the explaining Gaster video so I have another deltarune video recommendation. Even if you dont want to do a video reacting to it I think Daryl Talks Games' video "psych of play Noelle’s Actions In Deltarune Explained" would be a really good watch! It's super interesting, delves deep into this route, and personally one of my favorite deltarune analysis videos out there. I'm gonna go watch your undertale playthrough now, thank you for making these!
Here's a "fun" fact: The amount of HP that Noelle is reduced to in the fight with Berdly, 55, is "LV" in Roman numerals. LV, as in Undertale's Level of Violence....
Why is there no audio during the hospital cutscene with Noelle? Did it get copyright claimed or something? The song that plays there isn't even on the official soundtrack so it shouldn't have...
No copyright issues or the such, just... me being silly! At 1:36:19 I mentioned that I had some audio issues during that cut scene that resulted in me having to record that small chunk without audio and also the somewhat abrupt end to the route. I *don't* expect you to catch every little thing I say, so sorry if the time stamp seems a little cheeky, I just wanted to give you a reference point in case you wanted to hear the explanation!
You were asking for some videos ideas. Well, for some non reaction content. - There's undertale hard mode, you can only only active it if you name yourself frisk in tye start menu. There's the spamton sweepstakes, one toby fox site with mysteries of the deltarune characters. Inverted fate comic and some fangames like ts underswap, deltatraveler, starrune, undertale green ams some others. - For some reactions you could watch to "who's the true villan of undertale" and the follow up video after the geno reaction, it talk about Chara(the fallen human) character.(chara character, get it?) - You could watch "Undertale the musical" by man of the internet(both paci and geno route), and maybe their deltarune lyrics ones(It's incomplete), lemonlight studios geno route lyrics, or maybe undertale the narrator musical, following the theory that chara is the narrator of undertale, It's basically confirmed to say the truth.(It's incomplete) - There's this youtuber called JQR that does undertale/deltarune concepts/animation, spamton and Susie weird routes, spamton ex battle and more. - There are some theories like the tea theory, universal mother theory, why kris isn't the knight(and the follow up), dorked analisy videos(berdly for example) and other theorys in general, like about Gaster, the knight, the titans, the eggs(that you missed in your gameplay), everyman, the secret bosses, about kris and the soul, dess and more. - You don't even need to make an reaction video of everthing, but you could at least see it alone when you have time.
Slightly edited this comment(my heart) because of grammatical errors. But while I'm at it amd you just gave me an heart, are you thinking of chosing any of them?
Hi! These are all really good suggestions, thank you! Undertale hard mode hasn't been suggested yet, but it's a good idea! I TS!Underswap and deltatraveler are on the list for sure!
If I could say other 2 suggestions, each undertale console has exclusive content, in one of them, mad dummy has an entire diferent boss fight as "mad mew mew" because the ghost possesed an Alphys doll(there's one console where Sans talk about "the antler girl and her sister", so Noelle and dess) - There's also undertale alarm clock, toby said he would do it, but just did the winter one, in it you see monsters after the pacifist run(i think), you should check out to see flowey being an tsundere, Toriel bodyslaming Undyne, Sans doing fortnite dance and more
And second would be undertale alarm clock, toby in kickstarter said one type of alarm clock with the undertale characters, but he only endup making the winter one. In it is are characters talking about an party in the surface.
Oh yeah, amd there are the undertale newsletters, toby send ne about once 3 months. In it there are developer updates, how deltarune chapter 3+ is doing, new sprites and ideas, and even some story stuff(like grillbys gallery, an thing talking about grillbys and his clients, sans, papyrus, the dogs) - There's underevent, an big fan event with thousand of views showing undertale/deltarune fangames and comics. - And while I'm saying suggestions, I would also recoment Tc underfell amd ps outertale(I would recomment to wait for the last update. - I know you can't just make everthing into an video, but I hope you can see everthing of the game later
i feel like the weird route is supposed to be on some level a subversion of people who just want to get close to their favourite (particularly female) character.
Don't be sorry! It *is* very Flowey-esque. Flowey is a very intricate fella, one facet of his character is his representation/ reflection/ exploration of the average RPG player's actions and mindset. I mean, most of us already know this, I just like saying things.
![[REACTION] IT'S TIME!! | Misty Sparkles: Who Dr. Gaster Is and Why That Matters to Deltarune](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/VzOdfRBw2q4/mqdefault.jpg)
![[REACTION] IT'S TIME!! | Misty Sparkles: Who Dr. Gaster Is and Why That Matters to Deltarune](/img/tr.png)
![[REACTION] | You feel like you're going to have a BAD TIME... | Watching @ASmolBoy's GENOCIDE RUN](/img/1.gif)
[angel] [angel] fun fact:
if kris hp drops to 0 in the berdly fight,he'll say smt like this in the next turn:
"noelle kris is down,come here-"
Noelle:"i can still hear their voice"
Should watch matpats newest theory
@@regularaccount9167The fandom has known the player is separate from kris for years, matpat is incredibly late to the party. It really isn’t like, needed to watch his video because of this since theres already been so many videos and discussions about the topic.
@@duckman9327it’s kind of crazy people still deny it lol. the player was diegetic in undertale, and deltarune has set it up and implied it so much, i don’t really understand why people don’t think the player is a force in the story.
I think my favorite part about the weird route is how.. creepypasta-esc it feels. Playing chapter 2 when it released and then the next night seeing rumors of the “genocide route” of chapter 2 was an insane experience, especially after having the assumption for so long that this games whole thing was that your choices don’t matter. The route was initially documented with a google doc, and I really thought a super creative fan just put this story together in a day until I saw people starting to take pictures
Welcome to snowgrave route! We have:
-mental abuse
-gamer murder
-Spamton A LOT of Spamton
"Why is that nostalgic? What happened in Noelle's past?"
Well. The Spamton Sweepstakes secret pages could disclose.
Which page you mean?
@@laytonspuzzle It's a blogpost (deltarune/icepalace_glaceir) Noelle did about Dragonblazers and the Ice Palace where she found a weird door that supposedly shouldn't exist. She eventually found it by going up, so the door is positioned like the door to Spamton's shop (a character she has a subconscious history with as well) but it also evokes the hidden gray door leading to the mystery man.
d_a_m_n_y_o_u_t_e_n_n_a can lead you to a portion of the site that looks like it resembles an ice palace with a door. And clicking on that door leads you to the blogpost again.
@@laytonspuzzle All the stuff relating to Noelle.
bro you can't start talking like this and then not actually elaborating further
@@Capeey go to the sweepstakes lmao theres your elaboration
Thank you for using my guide! I may have to make some changes if anything goes wrong, it’s been reviewed by peers on a Deltarune discord server, but this will be the first time I actually see it used in a Let’s Play.
UPDATE - Sounds like I missed an important detail: fighting the enemies in the trash zone seems to be the official trigger for the Weird Route to start, so going left first is actually mandatory, not just recommended. Lancer falls asleep immediately after you freeze the last enemy in the trash zone. The guide has been updated accordingly.
Feel free to leave another comment with a link to the guide on this video, if you're comfortable with it, I'll pin it! Thanks again!
That sounds good! I’ll make another comment for that.
You don't have to actually to force Noelle to walk through the first maus puzzle. It's the only one you can complete normally.
@@Magma-Idiot-2001 The guide says that it’s optional. In fact, the guide mentions a lot of optional things that are entirely possible to do outside of the weird route, but sorta fit the tone. But everything that’s optional is labeled as such.
@@embrefrosste6044 Oh, alright (I've never looked at a guide on snowgrave before). It is cool seeing that you can skip the first puzzle.
Fun fact about the conversation you have with Noelle after you leave Rudy's hospital room and you get that cutscene, there's three way's it can go depending on what you do. The first happens when you just play through the snowgrave route and reach the hospital cutscene with Noelle, and once you say to either see Noelle or her father, she'll realize the voice responding sounds just like the one in her dream and then Susie shows up and interrupts and ends the cutscene. The second was the one you go to see where you have the watch equipped and Noelle notices it. And the third being that during that cutscene, you can actually move right, the first time Noelle hears Kris step towards her startling her, the second scaring Noelle, and the third causing her to run, prematurely ending the cutscene (you can do this at any part of the cutscene)
You forgot that if you DO approach Noelle, your location after the cutscene implies you backed her into a corner.
@@LiMe251 That is SO well-written! I'm surprised I never knew about this third version! :0
Toby is such a good writer. I've never seen a story where you, the reader, manipulate your vessel to groom a child into murder. it's sickening. amazing writing.
Berdly character development changes drastically the moment he sees something wrong with Noelle, he doesn’t act smug anymore and he uses a stronger version of his normal attack. A single pixel he has during his battle sprite changes so he’s not smiling anymore too, this route makes berdly one of my favorite deltarune characters
To borrow comments from other Deltarune videos: Everyone always recoils in horror to what the player does to the characters in the Snowgrave route, but have we truly considered the cost of the Pacifist route? According to everything we have learned about Kris from talking to the other town folks, Kris is a loner at best, and a bit of a creep at worst.
Kris's own mother reacts with shock to learn that Kris is hanging out with a friend. TWICE. Multiple school members state that Kris has used his mother as a study partner in the past because no one wants to pair up with Kris, and that Kris is a lackluster student despite being intelligent. Multiple people say that Kris is a creepy quite kid that seems to always take mean-spirited pranks and practical jokes a bit too far. Half of the town members reaction to Kris is some variant of "stay out of trouble", which clearly says what they think of Kris.
Noelle, the person who is closest to Kris other than Asriel, who grew up alongside Kris, and says "they know me better than everyone, AND YET" Noelle still struggles to view Kris as a "friend".
Now imagine if you are Kris, and someTHING comes and takes control of your body. And within just two days, that outside force has made more friends than you have in your entire life, they have mended the bridges YOU burned, and everyone is saying that you are so much nicer, more pleasant, better in everyway WHEN YOU ARE NO LONGER YOURSELF. Are we truly helping Kris by being nice to everyone? Or just rubbing salt in Kris' wounds?
I don’t want to downplay your comment, but this is just the plot of the newest captain underpants
@@sumthngcool4221Elaborate
Kris also seems friends with Catti and Monster Teen tho, not only Noelle, Monster Teen was 100% willing to become Kris' partner but because they thought Kris wouldn't come, he went with Snowy, so he was even waiting for Kris, and about Catti, they studied occult together, and that doesn't really seem like a school subject
I don't think it's a "Nobody wants to hang out with Kris" but "Kris doesn't start conversations and nobody knows what's up with them, other than people who bother to become their friend", so kinda of a "social Introvert" situation where sure Kris enjoys having people around and having friends, but they're introverted
@@sumthngcool4221 they're still making those?
@@Sergeikins Yeah.
Not so fun fact: When Noelle has the Thornring in the Berdly fight, her health always drops to 55. If you translate 55 into Roman numerals, it comes out to LV. What’s LV stand for? Why, LOVE, of course!
dont think it was intended as setting her total health to anything higher will cause it to drop down to 1/3 of itself, not 55
@@slim3rs172 it was definitely intended. It was probably just easier to implement it 1/3rd-ing her health rather than just making it set to 55. Or maybe Toby just coded it like that to throw dataminers off. That's something he would do. Not to mention, there's literally no normal way to have Noelles health be higher than 166, so using something that'd normally be illegal in-game as proof honestly kinda weakens the point.
@@idontknowwhattoput5851 you sound like an insane person rambling 😭😭
@@slim3rs172 its 5 sentences. Is 5 sentences too much for you?
Little fun fact. The nusic that plays in Queen's castle is known as Pandora Palace. However, when doing the snowgrave route, it is replaced by "Deal Gone Wrong". This is the music that also plays before the NEO fight, as you have probably noticed. I think it adds that little extra [[Power]] to the route and area.
“ ‘I don’t like this, ’ I told myself. I’m just doing this because I HAVE to know what happens.” - Flowey, Undertale
This is one of the many reasons why I love Undertale so much.
I love seeing the dialog when Noelle steps on the button and you interact with her, and when she notes that Kris is looking at her in a strange way. In my opinion, it might be a look of apology? Maybe desperation? Kris can't reassure her through words, so they try to do so through looking at her, but they've got such a creepy-kid aura that it doesn't come off that way.
It's different depending on what direction you look at her from.
btw the difference between:
"kris called for help"
and
"YOU whispered noelle's name"
i don't see what you're talking about, when is that taking place exactly ?
Thank you for pointing this out! I need to go back and look, I've been attempting to read Kris' body language better but I missed this one.
@@shanqo7325
1:15:59
1:16:19
there is literally no difference in the sprites, i have no idea where you got it from
@@theprinceofawesomenessoh shoot now that looked closely it was the sword,sorry guys
Noelle’s corruption is a lot like Chara’s. They both start to echo the sentiments of “I’m getting stronger” and becoming “powerful”.
The player forcing Chara to witness or Noelle to do it make them change.
Noelle seems more willing to do it since she thinks it’s all like a “video game”. Once she kills Berdly, it’s no longer a “game”. Chara knows it’s murder tho, but they’re a dead kid too so they don’t have any control until they accept it.
If I may, I'd recommend the 'SNOWGRAVE' animation by Atristicamente, even if just for personal watching instead of a reaction video, it captures the feeling excellently.
Great job on beating the route! That NEO fight is rough.
Thank you! I'll take a look, I love fan animations! NEO was so rough, Kris being the only one around to soak up damage really makes a huge difference.
@@hellofizzi kris is a [little sponge!!1!] after all
Here's a list of "interesting" details in the Weird Route.
WARNING: WAY TOO LONG, WILL COVER YOUR SCREEN
3:07 Usually, you can teach Noelle how to battle by ACTing with the help of this Virovirokun. But in this route, Noelle never learns how to fight without attacking, and just assumes it's how the Dark World works. This is reinforced later at 21:10 and 37:36, you make this whole route happen by making it seem like freezing is obviously the only way.
16:25 Usually, you can see Susie and Ralsei eating cotton candy they just bought from an Addison in this room. You even get some cute Noelle dialogue.
...Guess the cotton candy stand is closed?
24:28 Okay, so this room is full of details. First, usually you stand on the switch and Noelle walks across. Now it's the other way around.
Second, there's secret dialogue for talking to her while she's standing on the switch. You actually found some of this ("Why are they... staring into my eyes like that?") But there's even more, for... talking to her from behind ("I... I can't see what they're doing, but...) (Aren't they staring at me...?"), and on each side ("What are they looking at?) and (Why don't they step on the switch?"). Really specific.
Third, if you watch Noelle really closely at 24:53, you can see she's ABOUT TO STEP OFF the switch. Maybe that's even why she offered to stand on the switch. She was more than thinking about it.
26:24 After getting the FreezeRing, the music actually changes slightly, rather than just slowing, enemies flee from you, and Noelle's battle sprites change entirely. You noticed the snow globe around her at the end of fights rather than her sighing in relief, but she also:
- Summons a wall of ice to defend rather than turning and hiding
- Only flinches briefly when hit rather than looking scared
- Looks uncomfortably down in her idle animation rather than calmly forward
- And my personal (least) favorite, is... sort of... dragged into battles, rather than jumping up in fear.
29:50 Snowgrave IS actually an AOE spell...Guess you got your wish. Unsettlingly, this implies we might use it normally later in the game just as a method of clearing out enemies.
31:28 Kris actually will eat the moss normally, upgrading their title to "Moss Finder." You can even bring Susie and Ralsei here later, and "Eat the moss... together." giving some of the goofiest dialogue in the entire game, and giving Susie the incredible "Moss Enjoyer" title.
...So it's too bad Kris isn't in the mood for moss right now.
33:25 A common theme is having multiple answers, where one is incredibly simple and empty, and the other is longer and more like something somebody would actually say. Could be Kris trying to say one thing, but us rejecting it and picking the opposite. Or maybe not, who knows at this point.
38:44 Most enemies just run directly away from you instead of toward, but the Poppups actually hide rather than run. Their eyes dart around before popping back into the ground when you get close, instead of popping up and chasing you when you approach.
44:06 Alright, the Berdly fight. Unsettling to see Berdly actually focused rather than fumbling for an excuse to attack. The music is perfect for the tone. But there's a big secret you missed. You noticed that Berdly is actually directing his attacks at Kris and avoiding Noelle, but it goes even further. If you hadn't healed Kris at 45:24, Berdly would actually pass his attack and talk to Noelle, giving the terrifying dialogue:
N-Noelle, look!
Kris is down!
Now's your chance to
come back over here!
N... Noelle?
(I can...
still...
hear...
their voice...)
Really drilling in: it's not Kris, it's you.
You can end this fight in four ways: by casting SnowGrave, Fighting, using IceShock, or acting. The fight even has custom acts with plenty of flavor text. If you choose to end the fight peacefully, the route is aborted at the last minute, BUT, you keep all the equipment AND the SnowGrave spell. This way, you can show Ralsei and Susie the Ice, Freeze, and Thorn rings later, (Ralsei responds to the ThornRing with "..." and Susie responds with "A torture device?") and you can read SnowGrave's description on the stats page:
SnowGrave
Fatal
Deals the fatal damage to
all of the enemies.
If you use SnowGrave on a Darkner (as of now, you have to cheat to do this), they will disintegrate into red mist.
One more detail about this fight: This may sound like a stretch, and it could be a coincidence, but Noelle's HP is at 166 when you get the ThornRing, and the ThornRing makes her drop to a third of her HP, which can only ever be 55 at that point in the game. 55 in roman numerals is LV.
54:57 No chocolate/tea/coffee for Susie this time.
56:26 Sorry Ralsei, but what do you by "supposed to?" Do you have a script or something? This whole sequence of Kris refusing to respond so you don't get a dialogue option, and Ralsei desperately asking Susie what happened so the story isn't further thrown off track is great.
59:34 You caught this one (;
1:01:51 Susie going back to comfort Noelle really makes you wonder what kind of state she's in.
1:08:43 Here's a thought: This isn't concrete, of course, but the meaning of [Hyperlink Blocked] could potentially be LV. It usually fits in other places better than other candidates, and works especially well here. Not only is "[Making] LV" exactly the kind of stupid joke Spamton would make, but it fits absolutely perfect here. Now that you and Noelle have been causing havoc and gaining stats, you don't need his equipment anymore. In fact, all of Spamton's dialogue in this fight is incredibly interesting, especially after translating out the gibberish.
1:14:54 KRIS called for help... but nobody came.
KRIS called for help... KRIS called for help... KRIS called for help...
1:16:21 YOU whispered Noelle's name. You, not Kris.
1:16:47 That wasn't SnowGrave. She didn't cast SnowGrave there. That was IceShock, which did 300-400 before. It did 2000+ here, more than SnowGrave did against Berdly, and this was against Spamton with his defenses up so high you only did 10 damage.
What happened?
1:26:06 There's a very interesting thing you missed: If you talk to Malius (the guy who fixed the key for Jevil) and look at the list of items you can combine together, one of them is the Twisted Sword. Crafting it requires the a "PureCrystal" and the Thorn Ring. This is an incredibly interesting detail that will probably have some impact on later chapters. The ThornRing requires you to do the Weird Route, and the PureCrystal's description is "The shadow purified by the cat" meaning that the PureCrystal is almost certainly what Seam is planning to "stitch together for you" if you get every Shadow Crystal, aka beating every secret boss.
But what is the Twisted Sword? We actually have some information on it. Through save file editing, you check the stats of the sword. It's an item only equippable to Kris, and it has incredibly high attack. It also gives the effect "Trance" with a downwards pointing arrow. This implies that by defeating every secret boss and doing the Weird Route, you can decrease your control over Kris? Very unsettling, and sounds like a setup for a Kris boss fight to me. That said, Trance with a downwards arrow could also imply that it's giving a "Trance" debuff, maybe giving completely control over Kris? Either way, this item is right there in front of us, you can see this recipe in any route, and it's probably going to be very significant later on.
1:31:51 An extremely unsettling track is meant to play here. Unfortunate your audio cut out and closing the game didn't help. I'd suggest listening to it, it's simple but great.
If you actually read all this, thank you! I know way too much about this game and can't help but share it. I agree with basically all your closing thoughts and couldn't bring myself to do a LV 20 run of Undertale either. Love your videos, keep it up!
This is such a great comment. Nice.
I read it all, it's all very insightful thank you!! The Twisted Sword has me hooked - and the trance state, I didn't realize it's significance until reading through the comments. You answered a lot of questions I had, and also ones I didn't think to ask! Kinda sad I missed the whole moss party - my fault for not being able to dodge cars, ha!
Snowgrave is a very interesting route. Throughout Deltarune we are told that our choices don't matter which is proven due to the lack of a genocide route, and then we get the Snowgrave route which completely changes chapter 2. Immediately we think "Oh I guess our choices do matter" however when you reach the end of the chapter, the ending is exactly the same. Both the normal route and the snowgrave route leave Noelle more confident and deepens her relationship with Kris and Susie. So despite it seeming very different, both endings leave the characters in the same (or at least very similar) place. Just an interesting thing about the game!
what about berdly tho
@@NodzergHorde1997 Well... it seems that Berdly's fears were cruelly not unfounded. Everything in the world works perfectly without Him.
Very specific but interesting, berdly is the "blue bead" on the doctors toy that "gravely march on their set path". But by killing him the blue bead is torn off.
So you get rid of characters as whatevers left continues on their set path.
1:18:47
I always thought the "that's great" means:
"So that really was a dream bc susie doesn't have a tail irl"
1:31:46
This "Hospital Scene" has 3 versión
-Normal Version
-Having the Silver watch equiped
-Pressing Right buttom all the time
Oh! I totally misread the tail interaction. Your interpretation makes so much sense. Especially since Noelle is doing her very best to try and find some way to make what happened not real...
3 VERSIONS? *and* one of them is done by pressing on the controls while in a cut scene, reminds me of the end of chapter 1 when the heart in the cage can be controlled!
Fun Fact: it's highly suggestive that Noelle hears the Choice in the menu window that you do as the player, no mater which choice you do in the hospital Susie will cut that conversation of just after the choice is made, meaning that even if Kris can't tell Noelle what we chooses she might have still heard it, on top of that the game records all of these choices meaning that it might be important for a later chapter.
about Susie and Noelle, a lot of people believes that with Noelles "Boldness" being 12 that she kissed Susie, and Susie comes out happy about it but but some like me are not convinced because we believe Susie would act different about Noelle waking up and in the hospital, Susie is Dense and don't understand Rudy is trying to help her date Noelle but if they did kiss this would all be more straight forward, they probably start of just as friends since Susie don't seem to be the romantic type and she's just ecstatic about having friends. some other believes Susie was told something weird about Kris and thus she'll "tell Kris Later" and don't want to involve Ralsei.
a thought i had was that maybe Boldness is not synonymous with Bravery, Guts seem to have a closer correlation with Bravery, maybe Boldness is a "progression bar" for the next Guts
Its a shame you couldnt hear the music during the hospital scene. its almost like something wanted to protect you from it
I'm gonna go listen to it anyway (the bad ending)
I've seen that some Spamton NEO's dialogue from this route is really interesting. Including some foreshadowing.
What I got from it is that Spamton implies is that if Kris/player wants "freedom" by going down that path, they will, but the outcome will be a regretful one, where Kris will be "crying in a broken home...".
So, a couple facts that you might not have realized. First, when Noelle is stepping on the switch to let you through, if you look closely, you can see her feet shuffle, showing she's thinking of stepping off the switch. Also, in the Berdly fight (assuming you have the Thorn Ring equipped), Noelle's HP will always go down to 55, which in Roman Numerals is LV.
intentionally stopping the HP drain at 55, and it being LV is absolutely bonkers. I love it. Thank you!
Some very, very interesting Weird route Spamton dialogue
"You think making [Frozen Chicken] with your [Side Chick] is gonna let you drink up that [Sweet, Sweet] [Freedom] Sauce. Well you're [$!$!] right but don't blame me when you're crying in a [Broken Home] wishing you let your old pal Spamton [Kill You]."
i really love watching your playthrough, and how willing you are to really go above and beyond to explore this game!!!! ive been getting into deltarune alongside you and its just really amazing to see someone express the same level of interest!!! thank you for this series!!!
This was a fantastic playthrough. It's really enjoyable to see an in depth playthrough where the difference between you and Kris is understood from the start.
Thank you! Playing this game on youtube has been great, there's been a lot of great discussion in the comments and my understanding wouldn't be as good as it is without everyone's input!
@@hellofizzi Hey, don't sell yourself short!
40:49 "...And Banish the ANGEL'S HEAVEN" an excerpt from the prophecy.
Hey Fizzi! iJust wanted to Point out that in 1:20:7 The Blue broken off bead represents berdly, The beads represent the Characters. Most likely, if you kill more characters, more beads will dissapear. Great Videi by the way!
You should watch a video about the Spamton Sweepstakes if you want some extra Deltarune Lore (This could be two videos - one for the material that was on the sweepstake website, and one for the finale of the sweepstakes aka the spamton value network)
I've been excited for this. The Weird Route is so interesting and i can't wait to see where it goes in future chapters.
One very interesting part of this route is that it implies that Kris has some other motivation for making the Fountain. In the normal route, you could make the argument that Kris only made the Fountain to have more fun adventures with Susie, but that doesn't make sense in the Weird Route.
After watching Berdly die and Noelle get manipulated into killing him, why would they open a fountain with their mother present?
So it implies that Kris has a motive for making a fountain that is important enough to risk the possibility of another Weird Route. They could be the Knight, it could be another thing entirely, but whatever it is it has to be important to them.
I’m a believer in the theory that Dess is lost in a Dark World somewhere, and Kris is desperately trying to find her. Gives another explanation for why they want actual adults (Toriel and the police) to see a Dark World - if they know it’s real….
@@whiskeredwolf4861 I really like that theory too
Oh my god. How did I never notice that the "getting stronger" noise is the deltarune noise???
Oh boy! I've been watching some of your deltarune/undertale let's plays recently and I never expected this! I'm scared and excited to watch!
One detail I think you'll find very interesting: If you take a look at what Malius can alchemize in the Castle Town, there's a notable item listed there. The TwistedSword. Why is this relevant to this route? Well, the crafting ingredients require two things that should immediately be confusing. Sorry if you already knew about this, just something I thought you might appreciate considering you're curious about things like Kris's save file.
You legitimately sound like how I envision Noelle sounding when she’s frustrated, good stuff!
King will also refuse to speak to you if you miss a single recruit.
It's good that Deltarune has multiple save files, as opposed to Undertale's singular.
So if you want to experiment without consequences in your usual save, you can!
...Probably!
"Probably" haunts me in my dreams at night. I've thought about deleting the "weird" save file before chapter 3 releases... but that wouldn't be very Annoying Dog of me!
Great video! I only just found your channel about a week ago, but I binge-watched your entire playthroughs of Undertale and Deltarune, and I had a fun time!! I even just finished the Deltarune one last night, and I was intrigued to see that you posted this, and I was really interested to hear what you had to say about it :3 I agreed with everything you said at the end, too. Now, if I may, allow me to share some thoughts I had during the video ^^ sorry if it's a long read lol
- What you said about a future "no save run" in the full game sounded cool. It could change something, but also it might not, knowing Toby Fox. In undertale, not saving only gave you one extra line at the end during the sans call lol. At this point I just don't think it's possible, because it creates a file for you after you finish each chapter (When you start chapter 2, you can choose to either create a new file or choose your chapter 1 save, titled something like " Your Room - Chapter 1 END").
- Somehow, I never noticed how to music just cuts out around 6:30 right after defeating those popups. The cold wind blowing is pretty ominous though and fits the tone of the Snowgrave route
- Interestingly, choosing "I will ride with you" at the ferris wheel poster is not mandatory for the route. I always thought it was, but I learned recently you can completely ignore it and it wouldn't change anything :)
- 32:56 You don't level up like in undertale, BUT kris' and noelle's HP go up everytime your "power" increases.
- Not-so-fun fact about the Thorn Ring: it reduces the TP cost for ice spells because without it, Snowgrave would cost about 200 TP. Also I assume the "trance" stat is why Noelle didn't recognize Berdly at first
- Did you notice how Noelle's HP stopped going down after it hit 55? 55 in roman numerals is LV (:
- Also during the Berdly battle, the music kinda sounds like a heartbeat. At least, I think that's what it's meant to represent
- I saw someone say it already, but the distinction between "Kris called for help" and "YOU whispered Noelle's name" is concerning. Kris calls out for their friends, and nobody shows up, but when it's time to call for Noelle, you, the player, whisper for her, and she comes running.
- 1:24:52 I actually haven't seen this interaction before, but it's so cute!! ☺ I wanna ride the Susie train too, haha
- In Rudy's hospital room, Noelle usually notices Susie first. But this time, she only saw Kris, and didn't seem to notice Susie was even there until she said something. Interesting..
- I don't think a lot of people know this but, after you leave the hospital room, you can move while Noelle is talking, and she'll get scared, cutting off whatever she was saying, and ask how long you've been standing behind her.
Anyways, it's really strange to me how the ending of the chapter is the exact same no matter your actions. The game really meant it when it said your choices don't matter. Ultimately, Kris still opens the fountain, even after everything you just put them, and Noelle, through. I'm just wondering how Susie and Ralsei are gonna react in the future if/when they find out what "Kris" has done.
I did not notice their HP going up! that in combination with the 55 = LV detail, the sound design i.e the whooshing and silence, the heartbeat (I think it's that too!) really help sets the tone for the route and it's just... such great design.
I didn't know about the small dialogue change in Undertale if you played without saving until just recently, and it's reinforced my obsession in no save Deltarune, ha!
Thanks for joining us!
If you use Snowgrave on normal enemies, they turn red and disintegrate.
This is a well-discussed topic in the fandom and there's a lot of comments on this video so someone might have already brought this up, but one aspect of the Weird Route that both fascinates and horrifies me the most is the weird romantic undertones it has.
Probably the most obvious aspect of this is when you get the FreezeRing; in order for the route to happen, you HAVE to say that Kris and Noelle aren't "just" friends, but "something else." Something which confuses Noelle and clearly makes her uncomfortable.
While the Ferris Wheel dialogue isn't necessary for the route, it's still connected to it. Noelle thinking about wanting to ride with Susie, her actual love interest, and us forcing Kris to say "I will ride with you" and then "Noelle will ride with me", pressuring her into it... it's like we're forcibly replacing Susie with Kris.
And then of course, in order to progress the route you have to give Noelle the ThornRing. You literally have to force Kris to give Noelle a ring, a ring that literally hurts her to wear. I feel like the forced relationship symbolism there is obvious.
And of course, this isn't just a forced relationship, but an abusive one. (That much should be obvious.) But the worst part is that it isn't just Noelle who is suffering here, but Kris as well. It seems highly unlikely Kris would ever do something like this, especially considering the emphasis put on how odd this behavior is from them and that our voice is "unlike Kris's." Kris seems to be visibly upset when joining back up with Susie and Ralsei, judging from Susie's comment. Nobody wins here.
There's also the fact that the whole route seems to be made deliberately to feel like you're breaking the game, doing something you're not supposed to. When it was first discovered a lot of people genuinely didn't think it was real. The connections to breaking a game, going out-of-bounds, finding secrets/glitches etc. that this route has become a LOT more interesting once you've gone through the Spamton Sweepstakes and learned a bit more about Noelle.
I also think that people don't place enough importance on Noelle's monologue at the hospital. She is one of the few people who has noticed something is off about Kris since we started controlling them, and she actually vows to try and figure out what's going on with them. It sort of warms and breaks my heart that even after everything "Kris" did to Noelle, she just knows them so well that she knows they would never do something like this and wants to try and help them. I think that in future chapters that's going to become more important; Noelle might be the one to actually discover our existence, at least on a Weird Route.
(Also this is unrelated but if you want a great catalogue of Deltarune's metanarrative, I highly suggest watching Part 1 and 2 of mollystars' Device Theory! They're very long, but they're a fantastic summary and analysis of everything fourth-wall-breaking about Deltarune, including stuff like Gaster, the Weird Route, and the many odd things found in the game's files.)
I also wanna add that with Kris, the game seems to be looking to explore (at least in a small way) the idea of choosing romance options for the protagonist. Along with everything with Noelle, there's also the fact that we seem to be able to play into romantic-seeming options with Ralsei. There's evidence to suggest that Kris doesn't have the highest opinion of Ralsei, but even outside of that there's also the obvious fact that Ralsei looks like their brother. It's pretty likely that Kris does NOT feel that way about Ralsei, and yet we're able to do things like hug him and say "I feel the same" during the Acid Tunnel of Love ride. It all seems to go back to the fact that we are not Kris, and we should not be able to force them into these kinds of relationships. This kind of stuff just fascinates me, and I'm interested to see where Toby goes with it in future chapters.
despite how dark all of this is, i must say that i love your title for the spamton neo section is wonderful lol
This made me go back and check the chapter title - I must have been pretty frustrated with that battle, haha.
Things to watch in order: Deltarune Status Updates, then Spamton Sweepstakes, then the Valentines letters
Bonus: Undertale Alarm Clock Dialogue
Potentially good videos: Spookydood's "I solved Gaster's Mysterious Valentines Card" and "Solving Deltarune's Big Twist", Nighthawk's Kris analysis and "What did Kris say", Dorked's "Learning To Love Berdly" and "The Truth About Papyrus"
Best commentary on Deltarune actually, love it
1:14:56
Remember that line, it will be important if you decide to do/watch Genocide in Undertale
3:46 I mean, maybe you're not instantly killing them. Maybe you're just leaving them to slowly freeze to death.
18:11 They probably are dying. The way the Weird Route is written, it seems like an error in the game that should never have been possible. It's like you're abusing an exploit by freezing enemies in place so they can't run and you can actually kill them.
33:56 Or perhaps Kris is just losing their will to resist. Especially considering what Susie says at 49:30.
41:34 "Wearer takes damage from pain" is probably the most plain, item-description-like way to say "This equipment you're giving her is a torture device."
46:31 Is Noelle hiding that she knows the spell from you so you don't make her use it, or does she really not know?
1:34:53 I'm honestly not sure who I feel more sorry for.
I’m so happy to get to see you play this route. I loved your normal play through.
Personally I love the interpretation that Hyperlink Blocked is Choice.
You've been making choices, haven't you?
And this time, they might just matter.
Game theory just made a theory about deltarune. I think now would be the perfect time to look at it with everything fresh in your mind, i would love to hear your thoughts on.
"We haven't seen Spamton," and then he appears outta frickin' nowhere
At 32:55 , Noelle's Boldness has gone up again. It's positive now.
You missed the dialogue uf kris is down in berdly fight as you revived kris, at least It's better than going back to the start.
And there's another dialogue in castle town if you attacked everyone in queen mansion instead of sparing, sparing doesn't abort the route, but It's edgier to attack so it's an obvious choice
1:10:13 and 1:10:35
Really think about what he says. Doing weird route (freezing chicken) will give you freedom. Maybe, even if it looks so bad right now, maybe it is the only way to get to be free
Looking at it now, Perhaps Spamton neo talks about kris instead? Like, we are going to be so bad, so kris gonna tell about us, and then we gonna get separated. Or something like that?
45:47
Fact: Noelle's HP stays at 55 means something interesting...
If you convert 55 to Roman numerals, you get "LV"
Warning. Possible Undertale Spoilers ahead
This is an acronym.
It stands for *level of violence* in Undertale
You only learn what LV is in Neutral and Pacifist, which is what this person played, so no spoilers.
@@LiMe251 I said that there was a spoiler in this comment.
And yeah, she knows about that because she also watched the genocide route using a video of Asmolboy's RUclips account.
@@PAAF2005 Genocide is the only route where you AREN'T informed of what LV is.
@@LiMe251 I Indeed use this information to say that because she played Undertale. She knows about that
@@PAAF2005 ???????
I guess this video confirms that sparing enemies doesn't end the snowgrave route.
The worst part of this route to me is the weird romantic connotations with Noelle. And it's worse because said connotations are more so between the player and Noelle rather than Kris and Noelle.
The Ferris Wheel is primarily Noelle's way of fantasizing about, and, in the normal route, getting closer to Susie. It's no coincidence that in this route exclusively, you can pressure her into agreeing to go with you, even though she's clearly uncomfortable. The route requires you to tell the Addison that "We're something else," even though Noelle clearly wants Kris to answer that they're friends. Not to mention the fact that you give her a ring. And several times in the route you end up violating her personal space. You can actually press right during the hospital scene and Noelle ends up screaming at you to stop and not get any closer. Kris's sprite placement reveals you had her and Kris nearly nose to nose against the wall. It's horrifying to me and I love it.
Also the way that Kris turns to the screen and stares at you feels so intentional in this route. Yes it happens during regular gameplay and sometimes is kinda funny but especially after the Berdly fight, it just...feels like they're judging you and it works so well.
There was something really off putting about the romantic scenes and I couldn't really place why... but your reasoning makes a lot of sense. Thanks for this perspective!
Yaaaay, I sooooo love your letsplays!!!!!
HOOOOORAAAAAAYYYYYYY🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉A new video AND it's snowgrave
Finding your deltarune playthrough has been great, I really enjoyed it. I know you made a video reacting to the explaining Gaster video so I have another deltarune video recommendation. Even if you dont want to do a video reacting to it I think Daryl Talks Games' video "psych of play Noelle’s Actions In Deltarune Explained" would be a really good watch! It's super interesting, delves deep into this route, and personally one of my favorite deltarune analysis videos out there. I'm gonna go watch your undertale playthrough now, thank you for making these!
Here's a "fun" fact: The amount of HP that Noelle is reduced to in the fight with Berdly, 55, is "LV" in Roman numerals. LV, as in Undertale's Level of Violence....
You Should Check Out Kooki Autumn's Universal Mother Theory
(Scratching his baIIs and sniffing his finger three times)
Wtf
3:28 me when I play pizza tower and fight the 3rd boss
Spamton: putting rings on it since 1997
Why is there no audio during the hospital cutscene with Noelle? Did it get copyright claimed or something? The song that plays there isn't even on the official soundtrack so it shouldn't have...
No copyright issues or the such, just... me being silly! At 1:36:19 I mentioned that I had some audio issues during that cut scene that resulted in me having to record that small chunk without audio and also the somewhat abrupt end to the route.
I *don't* expect you to catch every little thing I say, so sorry if the time stamp seems a little cheeky, I just wanted to give you a reference point in case you wanted to hear the explanation!
You were asking for some videos ideas.
Well, for some non reaction content.
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There's undertale hard mode, you can only only active it if you name yourself frisk in tye start menu.
There's the spamton sweepstakes, one toby fox site with mysteries of the deltarune characters.
Inverted fate comic and some fangames like ts underswap, deltatraveler, starrune, undertale green ams some others.
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For some reactions you could watch to "who's the true villan of undertale" and the follow up video after the geno reaction, it talk about Chara(the fallen human) character.(chara character, get it?)
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You could watch "Undertale the musical" by man of the internet(both paci and geno route), and maybe their deltarune lyrics ones(It's incomplete), lemonlight studios geno route lyrics, or maybe undertale the narrator musical, following the theory that chara is the narrator of undertale, It's basically confirmed to say the truth.(It's incomplete)
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There's this youtuber called JQR that does undertale/deltarune concepts/animation, spamton and Susie weird routes, spamton ex battle and more.
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There are some theories like the tea theory, universal mother theory, why kris isn't the knight(and the follow up), dorked analisy videos(berdly for example) and other theorys in general, like about Gaster, the knight, the titans, the eggs(that you missed in your gameplay), everyman, the secret bosses, about kris and the soul, dess and more.
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You don't even need to make an reaction video of everthing, but you could at least see it alone when you have time.
Slightly edited this comment(my heart) because of grammatical errors.
But while I'm at it amd you just gave me an heart, are you thinking of chosing any of them?
Hi! These are all really good suggestions, thank you! Undertale hard mode hasn't been suggested yet, but it's a good idea! I TS!Underswap and deltatraveler are on the list for sure!
If I could say other 2 suggestions, each undertale console has exclusive content, in one of them, mad dummy has an entire diferent boss fight as "mad mew mew" because the ghost possesed an Alphys doll(there's one console where Sans talk about "the antler girl and her sister", so Noelle and dess)
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There's also undertale alarm clock, toby said he would do it, but just did the winter one, in it you see monsters after the pacifist run(i think), you should check out to see flowey being an tsundere, Toriel bodyslaming Undyne, Sans doing fortnite dance and more
And second would be undertale alarm clock, toby in kickstarter said one type of alarm clock with the undertale characters, but he only endup making the winter one.
In it is are characters talking about an party in the surface.
Oh yeah, amd there are the undertale newsletters, toby send ne about once 3 months.
In it there are developer updates, how deltarune chapter 3+ is doing, new sprites and ideas, and even some story stuff(like grillbys gallery, an thing talking about grillbys and his clients, sans, papyrus, the dogs)
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There's underevent, an big fan event with thousand of views showing undertale/deltarune fangames and comics.
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And while I'm saying suggestions, I would also recoment Tc underfell amd ps outertale(I would recomment to wait for the last update.
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I know you can't just make everthing into an video, but I hope you can see everthing of the game later
1:12:10 You literally destroyed his face, did you think he would be happy? Lmao
Matpat have recently made a really good Deltarune theory. Sadly, one of his last theories. Though, he mentioned some things you did not notice.
i feel like the weird route is supposed to be on some level a subversion of people who just want to get close to their favourite (particularly female) character.
I don’t want to do the snowgrave if I’m being honest
Proceed.
The Ring of Thorns makes Noelle's hp drop to 55. The Roman numeral for 55 is LV.
16:00 the way you say that you dont like this but continue on to feel things is very flowey-esque to me- sorry i just had to point that out
Don't be sorry! It *is* very Flowey-esque.
Flowey is a very intricate fella, one facet of his character is his representation/ reflection/ exploration of the average RPG player's actions and mindset. I mean, most of us already know this, I just like saying things.
Oh boy.
❤
grgreat
Wait.. you don't want to do a genocide route on undertale, but willing to do a weird route on deltarune?🤨
Yes! but doing it made me feel so awful it reinforced the fact that doing geno route on my own wasn't what I wanted.
Bruh do the genocide route of Undertale next please, you did snowgrave but not genocide???
I'll be uploading a reaction to a no commentary genocide route next!