Brightline East and West: Chance for the US to Get High-Speed Rail (Finally)
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- Опубликовано: 4 окт 2024
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After the video in which we spoke about the construction of the high-speed rail in California, we decided to make another video with similar keywords: the high-speed rail and the US. That’s why Brightline is our today’s topic.
Brightline is a privately owned inter-city rail service, based in the US, in Florida. However, in perspective, this company has the vision to construct and operate two routes: one that should be an extension to their existing service in Florida, branded as Brightline East, and one brand-new, that should be constructed and operated in Las Vegas and Southern California, branded as Brightline West.
In 2012, owners announced plans to construct and operate high-speed rail service between Miami and Orlando, in the length of 235 miles (378km). The estimated cost of the project was about 4 billion dollars and the project was divided into two phases. The first phase included a route from Miami to West Palm Beach, and the second one included an extension from West Palm Beach to Orlando.
As for the potential of this line itself, the metropolitan area of Miami currently has about 6.2 million inhabitants while the metropolitan area of Orlando currently has 2.3 million. In between, there's a West Palm Beach with a population of about 5.8 million, which means that there is solid potential in the sense of utilization of passenger service.
On the other hand, the initiative to construct a rail line between Las Vegas and Los Angeles along Interstate 15 was launched under the name DesertXpress in 2005. For the purposes to develop, construct, own and operate this rail line, the company named DesertXpress Enterprises was founded as early as 2005.
Furthermore, in June 2012, DesertXpress Enterprises announced a new plan to build a network of high-speed rail lines from Las Vegas to Phoenix and from Las Vegas to Salt Lake City and Denver, Colorado. The project was subsequently rebranded to XpressWest to reflect these expanded ambitions.
Initially, the city of Victorville was selected as the location which will be linked with Las Vegas, bearing in mind that extending the line farther into the Los Angeles basin through the Cajon Pass was considered too expensive. But, the 50-mile (80 km) extension from Victorville to the city of Palmdale was later included in newly emerging developing plans.
However, due to problems with securing the funds and failed idea of a Joint Venture with the Chinese, led to the owner’s decision to sell part of the XpressWest project to Fortress Investment Group in September 2018. The XpressWest project was then rebranded to Brightline West - and now you see the point.
For the whole story, check out our video!
Credits: drive.google.c...
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The requirement for compensation of tolls and such, are ridiculous.
This should not be a requirement
Brightline gets many subsidies, and benefits from municipalities, but it's ridiculous for jurisdictions to seek their own recompensations?
I stopped watching after that, they have worms in thier brain
Roads should compensate brightline for lost ridership
They'll be compensated by roads deteriorating at a slower rate
Averaging 80 miles an hour "are not" high speed bullet trains.
It's a start, considering that's faster than most interstates, and that's *averaging* 80 mph.
@@TheSonic10160 considering people need to drive to the station etc. there will be no time advantage. The whole point should be that it is significantly faster and as a result takes cars of the road. Imo high speed rail should be at least above 200 km/h (125mi/h)
yeah exactly, fastest high speed line(Beijing-Shanghai) in China has average speed of 198mph. Many other lines in China, Japan, France, Spain, Germany, Italy, South Korea not far behind
It’s okay I’d still take it
That's average speed. If you take any car or bus, the average speed is not more than 50.
I have taken the bright line from West Palm to Ft. Lauderdale. I can’t say enough good things. It needs to connect South Florida to Tampa and another spur to Jacksonville. This would connect all of the population centers in Florida.
Well if it extends to Jacksonville, more ambitious plans could arrive, like route extending west to Tallahassee, Mobile, New Orleans, Houston, or north to Atlanta, Charleston, Charlotte, Raleigh
That's nice, but it's not HSR. Take the HSR trains in Europe or Asia and you'll see it's like night and day compared to what Brightline offers. What Brightline considers HSR are regular trains in other parts of the world. However, the project on the West coast could be considered true HSR if it goes 150 MPH or faster.
@@theexmann I’ve only been on Swiss intercity rail lines. The speeds seem comparable.
@@yolo_burrito The great thing in Europe is that intercity rail also readily connects with the HSR lines too. Can be very convenient to get around Europe.
I've taken Bright;ine a few time. And I love it. Yes, the speed is not like the trains in Europe or Asia, But the inside of Brightline trains are much, much nicer that the European counterparts. At least compared to the AVE, TGV and ICE. Which are the system I've used overthere.
10:25 so let me get this straight: Florida is worried their road network won't be able to complete with a privately operated train and this is a bad thing?
does the road network operator is a private own or state own?
Typical Florida BS
Think of the money the state would save having lower maintenance and police presence on these highways. Is Brightline going to get this money if the savings is more than the loss of tolls collected.
I thought tolls were there to help pay for the road. If the Cara no longer utilize the road, there is less ware and tare on the road, and less demand on the highway, so why would the rail line have to reimburse them for lost revenue? The state can't design and operate its own public transportation and they then ask a private company to pay for loss highway tolls. This is so desperate and embarrassing.
Exactly, that is ridiculous 😂. There is already too much traffic on the highway. If the highway was substantially underutilized, I could maybe see this making sense, but it’s not! The gov not subsidizing rail is 1 thing, but actually taxing it?! And, we blew it by rejecting Chinese subsidizing our high speed rail. The trains should be made in China due to the economies of scale
Steam trains in the UK over 70 years ago was averaging 80mph on East Coast Mainline
Awesome content guys... I can't way to see what's Brightline West has to offer
Thanks bro ☺️
hello there
HI SIMPLY
I'm your 100th like!
Just moved to Adelanto perfect timing!
California; We're going to build a super effective high speed rail system which will be the envy of the US and of the world!
Florida; Hold my orange juice.
Hope tampa don't discourage the project. I am just glad the extension to orlando already is under construction. Once that is built it will be hard for tampa to ignore all the benefits.
My main concern is that Tampa Bay as a metro has no serous public transportation. If you get off a train at Tampa, how are you supposed to get anywhere that's not the immediate downtown area, such as the beaches or amusement parks? Something major needs to happen between now and its completion. I hope policy makers in Hillsborough and adjacent counties are considering this too.
@@Jazzmaster1992 Uber/Lyft or rental cars?
@@jjosephm7539 Sorta defeats the purpose of a train (removing traffic from roads) if you're just gonna get in a car. At that point, people going to Tampa, especially from Orlando, would rather just opt to drive. Tampa needs to find a way to get people around the area without needing a car, or else being dumped off at the station will be meaningless.
@@Jazzmaster1992 Tampa does have a bus system like most American cities....
@@ronclark9724 but is it taking people where they want to go and does it have frequent buses? I'm talking about the people who come to Tampa Bay and want to go straight to the coastal areas or even the amusement parks. They're largely hung out to dry by an inadequate and underfunded system.
One important part of the Orlando to Tampa extension is that it would add a stop at Disney World. Orlando airport to Disney World alone is pretty compelling, which is why I would guess it will end up happening. But in any case, FDOT gave them a deadline of the end of July to secure everything, so we will know soon.
You know that the TGV station Marne-la-Vallée-Chessy is right outside Disneyland Paris and has direct connections to both the main French TGV lines, Eurostar and Charles-de-Gaulle Airport, so Disney knows all about good rail connections and important they are.
Yeah. It would cover Disney’s ass too. Less carbon emissions, shorter wait times, and comfort fridge for seniors versus the bus. The problem: Disney would want their own branding on a train. That same train would have to service other cities that don’t care as much about Disney. There may be a problem there.
@@meme-xn6wr I'd Imagine Disney would want a Spur Platform at any WDW station so they could run shuttles back and forth to the Airport
@@iancypes5911 Yeah, just the branding may be weird. But either way, still cool.
Any update?
Just imagine the red-eye train coming back from Vegas on a Sunday night/Monday Morning. An entire carriage would be needed for bathrooms and Waffle House could sponsor the diner car!
“George Floyd” on a train.
@@starventureoh look a racist. How unique. Anyways back to grown up conversation time. Looks like kindergarten got out early today.
Your airlines won't let this happen. All airline unions in your country will be up in arms to ensure that the HSR doesn't go through - especially the smaller regional operators. They'd rather ask for the government or companies to invest in green aviation fuel and promote flights over HSR.
@Life as we know it Trust me, it's not the small ones that will cause issues over it, but the big dogs. Especially that of Southwest I can very easily see causing them massive problems if this in fact gets the funding and go ahead to get underway. Southwest has market dominance over the LAX-LAS route, and if they do not run the train to/from McCarran and LAX, they very likely will riot with lobbying efforts to make it die. However IF they make the direct connections to both, then I can see them and others lightening up a bit or even becoming neutral toward it with some optimism. The reason for this would be the convenience it'd allow business class fliers to get to and from the airports in comfort and slight luxury, which in turn scientifically, is proven to also have them spend far more money on amenities and concessions as well, and it's a direct result of the extra peace of mind and happiness they get from their ride to and from the airports. That of course also tends to lead to far better and happier customers for them, leading to more positive reviews and feedback, which they hope will lead to those passengers coming to be a frequent or even loyal flier on their airline.
See, with airlines, Business class passengers and tickets are their bread winners and thus biggest money makers, and the airline industry is quickly looking to start adding more business class seats to their planes, too, and many of the legacy carriers are looking at completely replacing their first class with business class instead because of it. With Business Class, there is a rapidly increasing amount of economy fliers who take the chance to upgrade to business class at discounts when offered. And obviously, it's a fact that the middle and upper classes who travel a lot for business would LOVE something like this highspeed brightline west line and ride it in increasing numbers IF again, it had direct connections to the airports. So there, is where and how it all comes together to make it extremely lucrative and certainly likely that they'll be beaten the crap out of by the big airlines, especially southwest, if Brightline does not add direct connections on the route to the respective major airports, but highly beneficial to both if they in fact later do opt to add them into it. In fact, knowing Southwest's CEO, I would not be remotely surprised if he'd even chip in on some of the funding on it if they opted to do so. He's the kind of character who would absolutely do that kind of thing. Make a problem out of it if it doesn't happen, but actually invest in and support it if it does.
and WooooorldStarrrrrrr could sponsor the CCTV security cameras.
Great video, very informative.
Only thing that bugs me about Brightline West is the decision to go single track. I'm not a transport engineer so maybe it checks out but I feel like they are really shooting themselves in the foot for the future. Especially if they build the single track between the two highway lanes, would there even be enough room to eventually fit a second rail beside it? Just seems like such a strange idea to put the rails between the two highways lanes and not on either one side.
The fact that the Florida DOT is demanding compensation for lost traffic is laughable and just so typical. If more people switch to rail it means there is less wear and tear on the roads, resulting in less need for toll money for maintenance. I think one of the biggest blockages for rail infrastructure such as these projects are always going to be state DOT's who have by now had several decades to transform into purely car centric bureaucracies which dislike rail.
I hope the Biden administration`s infrastructure bill will include more money for rail, but it sadly seems the majority will once again go to car infrastructure. Maybe you guys could do a video analyzing it when it is announced within the next couple of weeks.
Regarding Brightline West, they decided to construct single track with passing sidings in order to cut the construction cost and enable construction of railroad line on some part along the medium of Interstate 15. In terms of traffic operation, passing sidings will enable train movement in both directions. number of trains will depende on transport demand, Brightline passenger service and adopted rail timetable, but we think that it is good decision to construct single track if we take account how much costs land acquisition in the US.
Regarding Florida DOT requirements, we do not have additional comment. As you said, it is laughable.
Great comment. Do you think the single track decision falls out of Brightline West being a largely commercial venture? I'm wondering if because it's only really seizing on the captive LA-LV market, single track will be enough, whereas if it was conceived as part of infrastructure strategy there's no question you'd build double track.
Most states are clearly incapable of strategic thinking of this nature (although I'm hoping Washington turns out to be an exception) and the federal government clearly needs to lead as it did with the interstate network. And yes, in a nation where the free market is god, the Florida compensation demands are mind-blowing. You're right, they're not departments of transportation, they're departments of roads. Jarrett Walker would say the same.
@@RailwaysExplained Thanks for the reply and explanation.
@@RailwaysExplained Do you think single track HSR is sustainable long term? No-one has a crystal ball but if the service surpasses expectations wouldn't they be quite limited with the service patterns they could offer? Sidings bake in the disadvantage of Amtrak long distance trains - delays waiting for oncoming traffic.
@@tomdarling-fernley3178 We think that decision regarding single track is based on ridership forecast. And when you take into account all costs that go with double track (more land needed, higher construction cost, higher maintenance cost) and if you do not now have in the perspective demand that will utilize that, single track is surely good option. We believe that if a second track is needed on this line, then the HSR should have been built a long time ago 😁
Interesting how railroad needs to comp DOT for lost revenue on road tolls and obtain permission from airport and coal train operators for using rail/connecting to airport. None of the 3 entities have anything positive to say about clean train that will reduce their business
Exactly, people complain that gov regulations in the U.S limit projects like this but in this case, it's the fact that the project has to go back and forth for permission from their own competitors!
If they don't build their own lines and are using already built rails they have to compensate the company that owns the rails. That is part of what has crippled any attempt to build high speed rail on the East coast from Boston to DC or on the west coast between LA and SF. The best routes are already owned and operated by some of the larger cargo rail companies, and they can and will fight very hard in court to avoid losing control of their rails. Amtrack actually has had issues on some of their cross country routes because they use Union Pacific or BNSF rails and will have lower priority than freight trains. This can force a passenger rail line to slow considerably.
I haven't looked too closely into the line that is now Brightline East, but I do know that they required federal grants to afford to purchase some of the land they built on and they had to use freight lines for sections, which limits the speed of the passenger trains as the freight trains again get priority on who gets to use the tracks.
@@brandonbollwark5970 the government is the reason for that, and is the competitor
@@markvargus6519 Railroads should never have been private.
@@unholyrevenger72 public ownership of railways resulted in half the line in the UK being torn up and sold, massive underfunding/out of date rolling stock and contracts going to politician's pals
This is from the Orlando Sentinel:
"FDOT is demanding Brightline complete the following in order to move forward with the Orlando to Tampa route:
*Conduct a study that details toll revenue lost to the state and CFX
*Prepare a compensation plan for lost toll revenue
*Secure an agreement with Sunrail to cross their tracks
*Obtain a letter of support from the Greater Orlando Aviation Authority for the project
*Submit design plans when 30, 60 and 90 percent complete
FDOT’s deadline for Brightline to complete the agreement is mid-summer."
Support from the Greater Orlando Aviation Authority is interesting. In France the TGV ended domestic air travel when people opted for 300kph (187mph) train travel rather than flying. Is there a connection? I get the impression these money interests don't want high speed rail to happen.😒
Orlando's flights are mostly from other states and international, the reason they're working closely with them is because of the high volume of traffic tourism accounts for. Phase 3 is likely going to have a large majority of ridership with most trips being to or from the airport.
I like these developments. They are relatively small and incremental and show there is demand for high-speed rail. They also do not promise the moon and are realistic in their goals. The sheer amount of bureaucracy they have to cut through is just incredible. In Flordia, if the proposed link from Miami to Tampa is completed the state and local municipalities are concerned about losing toll revenue and are not considering spinoff benefits. If they can take say a few million people off the highways every year there is less congestion and goods can move faster potentially reducing shipping costs. That will take the pressure off the Florida highway infrastructure.
They're shitting their pants cause the funds for the tollroad have already been allocated. Municipalities across the US started going broke when federally funded highways started needing maintenance. So they started building tollroads. But they're not worthwhile either. They can't afford the upkeep and the federal dollars have dried up too. They'd rather prolong their financial collapse than introduce the density and transit development that could return land to a financially sustainable level of productivity.
Also, a million cars removed from the highways reduces the total number of traffic accidents and other highway health problems that are all very expensive. (Social costs)
Also, gas is $5 a gallon, they should be desperate to end car dependency now.
And don't forget potential increased revenue from greater connectivity, and obviously, decreased need for road maintenance.
@@jasonreed7522you need transit first
I work from brightline. We have about 20 locations that we are looking at.
Lot's of good information and perspective in this video. If the train goes to a part of town where one can walk or connect on local subway or light rail transit then it is easy to ride instead of drive. Or even if train goes to airport and then one rents a car works too, especially on routes under 4 hours where flying is a lot of hassle versus travel time.
I live in Orlando and will definitely be taking the Brightline any time I go to Miami or Tampa, especially since there will be a Brightline station at Disney Springs right down the road from my house. Miami traffic is the worst!
Orlando to Miami is supposed to take about 3-4 hours by car until you get to Interstate-95 entering Palm Beach County where the Interstate literally turns into a Parking Lot at all hours of the day! The last time I drove to Miami there was a accident in Ft. Lauderdale then it was Rush hour due to the delay. It took me 7 Hours to get to Miami ! I will use BrightLine when it's finally completed.
This is why privatization should return to railroads, Brightline got more done in less time than it took to watch the California High Speed Rail project implode.
The speed at which this got done has nothing to do with the fact a private company built it.
@@unholyrevenger72 I would have to disagree with you. California’s attempt has been a total disaster, with costs now triple what the voters approved.
In Colorado, Boulder voted on an HSR line to Denver back in 2004. They’ve paid almost $250 million in taxes with nothing to show for it. That line was supposed to come into service in 2016, and now the company in charge of it is literally saying there is no way that train will be on line any time before 2050. Meanwhile, the updated cost projection for that has also roughly tripled what was approved by the voters.
HS2 in England is a repeat of the first 2. Government and quasi-private companies screw up everything.
@@unholyrevenger72 no hijacking and mismanagement of the project for political manipulation, a vested interest in the project being completed in a timely manner, and said interest also ensuring the technology is cost effective as well as the route(s) being profitable to deliver to investors and shareholders? I think it played some part.
It actually doesn't, at all. It has to do people being ok or ambivalent to being screwed by a private corporation. Like Land procurement, if a bunch of companies buy a bunch of land at depressed rates, the average person doesn't blink an eye because they don't see the parent company that owns all of those companies. The Government on the other hand is upfront and offers you a fare deal on the land they need to finish a project like this. Then people lawyer up and fight tooth and nail for every square inch of land. Most of the overages incurred are legal fees the state has picked up against litigious citizens. If you want to see how this strategy works and fails in the same case you need only look to Disney World. They did the quiet land grab thing but a fastidious reporter sniffed out the truth and reported it. And the last few properties Disney had to buy were done so at a "government" rate. You call it inefficiency, but really it's just the government being fare to it's citizens, and those citizens being unfair to other tax payers.
@@timwhite2680 The illusion that private corporations get stuff done on the cheap is exactly that, an illusion. Businesses are actually less competent than the government. Think of it like this. Businesses fail at a rate close to 50%. The US government has been in business since 1776, with it's only real challenge being the civil War, when you guessed it wealthy southern businessmen challenged the Federal Government to retain their wealth and political power that slavery gave them.
Correction - West Palm Beach is part of the Miami metro area which has a population of ~6.1m ppl total.
(Not separate populations as implied in the video)
Thanks!
Correction, it is not. It is part of south Florida aka part of the tri-county area. Same with Fort Lauderdale- part of south Florida aka tri-county area.
@@jbar_85 Exactly. Three SEPARATE Counties with THREE distinctive populations
Palm Beach County, Florida Population 2023 1,543,809
Broward County, Florida Population 2023 2,003,268
Miami-Dade County, Florida Population 2023 2,763,366
Oh and the Orlando extension
Orange County, Florida Population 2023 1,515,093
including the Cocoa/ Brevard County
Brevard County, Florida Population 2023 625,584
Car lobbyists are what make high speed train bulding in the U.S. difficult.
Wrong. Capitalism itself makes it impossible.
Remember Japan and Germany are also huge car nations and still managed to get HSR built
@@georgobergfell Germany and Japan are a small fraction the size of the United States. They are much more densely populated. High speed rail makes no sense for the United States.
No. There's no serious call for high speed rail in the United States.
@@Evil0tto
No densely populated areas in USA?
Brightline East has a ton of potential not just because of the sizes of Miami and Orlando's metropolitan areas, but for the tourist draws of each city. People from Miami will take the train to Disney World. People from Orlando will take the train to go on a cruise or to the Beach. International tourists can take the train either direction from the Orlando Airport.
Wow! This is exciting. Of course, the US really needs to learn how to invest in public goods and keep them accessible to the public, but regardless, this is a very important project and I'm glad somebody is taking it on.
The US has one good public good, interstate high way system, but it was seen as a military investment. Maybe if someone can show the senators that an HSR line would be a much better troop transport system than the current interstate highway system.
Florida Brightline runs through towns along the way at street level. If you have been in Delray on a Friday or Saturday night, those crossing barriers don't give the unaware pedestrians or motorists a lot of time to clear the tracks. All other international HSR has dedicated, controlled and separated ROW.
Motorists just ignore the warnings as far as I see
Having ridden on Brightline, it’s the best train service I’ve ever been on!
Countries around the world subsidize trains and railways for a simple fact that this type of infrastructure boosts economy of the entire country indirectly.
Then why do so many nations not have trains and railways?
@@ronclark9724 how many first world countries, or at least world leaders, do not have a railway?
Roads and airlines contribute far more per dollar invested, and people like them better.
@@tonyburzio4107 In the USA, but simply because HST doesn't exist yet. Meanwhile, in Italy, HST is now very competitive to short-haul flights.
@@dbclass4075 Neither does Canada, New Zealand, and Australia.
79 mph is indeed a high speed train. News anchor says Fastest train in Florida cz there is no other train.
They have sun rail and tri rail
Amtrak also runs in Florida.
Technically it isn’t high-speed rail because the UIC sets a standard of at least 250 kph (160 mph). And most railway agencies and operators stick to that
The Federal Railroad Administration has approved several 110 MPH corridors where Amtrak regularly runs diesel trains at such speeds...way too many level crossings (and bad behavior motorists!) in Brightline's territory for 110 MPH running 😳
Glitch in the matrix.
Regional Express train companies in Germany would get sued for breaching the contract with this speed.
I hate how the governments of both California and Florida act like they are doing high speed rail a favor by letting them operate in their states. We have such pathetic politicians! They should be doing everything possible to make it happen.
Thank you for this excellent summary. Being an urban planner who practices along the corridor near West Palm Beach, I've followed the development and implementation of the service. The West Palm Beach to Miami service was just starting to pick up speed (see what I did there?) when it had to halt due to the COVID-19 pandemic. Two things I would like to point out about the information shared here. The entire Miami-Ft. Lauderdale-West Palm Beach MSA is about 6.2 million. West Palm Beach does not have the extra 5 million plus shown in the video. That might be worth an edit. Also it is important to note that this stretch of the route went through an already established urban area with many at grade road crossings. Most of those had to be improved in terms of signaling and safety requirements prior to putting trains on the tracks (the first part of the project included adding an additional track in the existing Florida East Coast ROW so that the new passenger traffic would not interfere with already existing freight traffic). One of the requirements and selling points to communities along the route was that the crossings would be silent. That means that trains would not regularly operate their horns when approaching at grade crossings. This applied to both freight and Brightline trains. There were many - might be worth looking up the number - of train pedestrian fatalities during its operation, including many that were considered attempts at self-harm along the open and unprotected stretch of the railroad. There was some talk of taking away the "no horn" requirement in response. There was also a public relations campaign with TV and social media announcement issued by Brightline about the importance of looking out for trains moving faster than people might expect. The lumbering freight train that you used to be able to see and run across the tracks either by your person on a bike was not the same as a train traveling at 79 miles per hour. I'm looking forward to service returning after we are through with the on-going pandemic condition.
I think he meant the whole corridor between Orlando and Miami although I still doubt that the population is 5.8 million
By the time the USA decided to build or built High Speed Rail, the world will be moving to flying cars, hahaha
So True, what a nightmare all that red tape any new infrastructure projects have to go through and its why they become so extremely expensive along with truly max incompetence in managing these projects efficiently and speedy and with strict cost control 😅😂
And you think this is ecofriendly?
@@Marcus_Oelschlegel to certain circumstances and conditions yes. Both eco friendly and economic friendly.
@@ggurwlcom420 But both not to the US.
@@Marcus_Oelschlegel even to the US. In fact high density area such as new york would benefit greatly from sky mounted monorails and expanded subway systems including bullet trains to the other states.
The question is whether the government would want or even capable to built such long term projects citing the election cycles where opposite party would teardown everything the other party had done when they replace them in the office regardless it's truly beneficial or not.
Very Interesting.
I got back from Japan and their definition of 'high speed' is way more than 80 mph, more like double that speed.
Their *slow* trains are double that speed. The Shinkansen trains run at up to 200 mph, which is more than triple that speed.
@@katrinabryce
80x3=240
240 > 200
@ She can't do math
@ China has some that do over 260, and around 220 in service, so not far off
@@Joesolo13 still, not "more than triple" 😏
Hoping Brightline can eventually fund the Cascadia High Speed Rail project (currently in exploratory planning phases). HSR between Portland-Seattle-Vancouver would be huge for the economy and ease the terrible traffic in Seattle and Portland
It will be nice when the oil addicts don't have a foothold on transport policy.
@@Napsteraspx exactly.
The average traveler just wants speed and comfort and otherwise doesn't really care what method of travel is used. If a train has equivalent travel time to a car it will get used because plenty of people would prefer to not drive on a congested interstate because thats stressful.
The problem is when you go to plan a trip and it takes significantly longer to go by train than car. In the NY/New England area i checked travel times for rail vs car and rail can take litterally 24 hours to get somewhere which is rediculous when a car does the same trip in 7 with stopping.
I would hope this could be fixed by having a policy of all trains arive by minute 50 of the hour and leave on the hour and have a toll like system of get a card for boarding station and pay at your last station with a computer figuring out the cost of the journey.
Also the last mile problem, which for some journeys could be solved with a take your car with you book in advance ticket. (Amtrak has this for DC to Orlando which seems like a crime, it should be for going to/from rural stations not dumping cars into cities from other cities)
Finally, a new video, I've been waiting for it whole week man..
We think it was worth it.
According to the International Union of Railways 2018 definition of high speed rail : requires a minimum travel speed of 200km/hour to 250km/hour depending on certain variables which equates to 125mph - 155mph. Sampling of fastest trains in the world: # 1 Shanghai Maglev(267 mph) # 4 The Italo and Frecciarossa (220 mph) # 7 Deutsche Bahn ICE (205 mph) # 10 Thalys(186 mph)
Brightline is not called high speed.
Brightline is definitely highway optimal speed without the stress of driving.
A train that averages slightly faster than driving could crush highways by simply being moderately luxurious. (In America have a dinning car with realistically a McDonald's and have comfy seats and let people walk around and i would take that over any highway drive)
Rail's number one advantage is efficiency while still being quick. (Boats are the most efficient but super slow) so they can beat cars with speed and moderate comfort and airplanes with superior luxury and by not having the "airport experience" they can be faster for shorter journeys because you don't waste an hour+ at each end of the trip.
High-Speed Rail with only 79 MPH????? That's not high speed at all...
79 mph is the FRA max speed limit with special exceptions for 110 mph in certain areas. Go look up the Naperville train accident to find out why this speed limit exists.
@@starventure The Japanese were running trains at up to 130 mph in the 1960's. Maybe the USA could ask them how to build a train system.
@@MrVenona We would rather have high speed roads though.
@@starventure far from it my friend, you've got multiple lane straight highways that are the envy of the world with ridiculously slow speed limits and yankees that tend to occupy all lanes at such slow speeds instead of staying on the right lane, just ask the germans ;)
@@adamwnt left lane passing is not really the problem, the biggest problem we have is trucks. The number of 18 wheelers is huge and they affect traffic far more than passenger vehicles do.
I live in Cocoa, and I can't be more excited for this. There are festivals and concerts in West Palm Beach and most major flights that leave out of the country connect to MCO airport, it would be so much nicer not to have to worry about having a car to get to these places
There will be no stations between Orlando & West Palm Beach.
Fuck Brightline
Why would they make a high speed railway with only a single track? That doesn't sound efficient at all.
depends on how many trains you want to run. If you start with one train each hour in each direction, you don't need that many locations where trains need to have the ability to pass each other. And as the passenger count starts growing and you want to add more trains, you can also start investing in doubling up sections of your track to enable that higher capacity.
Better to have a single track than no track and service at all. This is done by a private company so they try to limit the construction costs and build as fast and efficient as much as possible (California HSR could take a lesson from them) to make it a realistic business case that can make profits.
@@Hans-gb4mv that just seems weird to me though. I think it's better to build both tracks NOW instead of after. I don't know too many single-track high speed railways. Educate me if I'm mistaken.
@@maa1649 That makes no sense to me, especially since this same company is building (and has built) a less-than-high-speed railway in Florida. Granted, most of the track has been built already, but still. I think brightline west would get more business than east.
@@TheRailwayDrone It's simple. If you are going to run one train an hour in each direction (and in the first years, it really isn't going to be more than that), why would you need the capacity of a double track?
If you look at travel time, you're looking at probably 3 locations where trains need to be able to pass each other. Preferably at speed, but even if one needs to stop, the time lost shouldn't be that big.
But the savings in investment cost will be billions of dollars. And if in the future the capacity needs to increase, you can always start doubling up the track and have the double-track grow with your capacity requirements.
If only we invested in technology and infrastructure instead of telling the world how it should run its affairs, we would have the best of everything. But instead we debate whether to invest in infrastructure or not, and say virtually nothing when sending money abroad to keep wars going.
Another problem is that once projects are approved the end up over budget and late. But I agree we need to fully pull out of Europe, middle East and Africa
America put its money into 20th century infrastructure, airports. Airports link to airports worldwide, train stations don't...
@@ronclark9724 haven't you heard, trains are making a comeback
I have taken the train from Fort Lauderdale to West Palm Beach and I love it. I know once Orlando and Tampa are connected, we'll have people living in one city and working in another with much more ease.
This is not what I would consider to be "high speed".
In England, the Bristol & Exeter Railway was doing 82mph in 1854; and in 1938, the Mallard did 124 mph on the East Coast Mainline. Today, regular commuter trains do between 90-110 mph, and the train between London and Paris does 320km/h(199mph).
Did you actually watch the rest of the video....
Excellent video. Thorough, clear and concise with lots of fact-checking. Good job. FYI, I saw one typo at 11:16 "As you can see, there is no wonder why United States can't aford a high-speed rail line, " should be "As you can see, there is no wonder why United States can't afford a high-speed rail line." Thanks.
I like how people who came and saw the tittle immediately stop when it said that the brightline east top speed is 80 mph, guys that's only the first part of the video if you actually watch the entire thing first you will see that they are indeed planning to build a 'true' hsr lines that could up to 200 mph.
People and their short attention span these days I swear.......
It's 80mph between West Palm Beach and Miami, that stretch is extremely congested and would require significant capital improvements to increase the travel time.
@@taoliu3949 Not to mention it's impossible to have a train go that fast within a metro area.
@@KRYMauL LMFAO
Go look at China, Japan, france, Spain etc
@@Sparkiebc I meant in the US, most of the reasons here make no sense and are just excuses to buy more F150s.
Your videos are not only informative but the footage is outstanding.
Looking forward to the Brightline Orlando extension. Driving to Orlando is such a mess that I'd rather drive to the other coast of the state (2 hrs for me) and take the train in. When Tampa opens it'll be even easier :)
"The eyes of history are on this appointment." - Buttigeig
1964 Japan's first bullet trains were put in service and the the first Beatles album was released.
1998 China started the construction of 36,000km of high speed railways and high speed trains.
2021 US still has NO high speed railway and NO high speed trains.
Good. Why should we spend trillions to fund a system that few people will use?
@@Evil0tto 885,000 is just a few people?
Doesn't the US have Acela Express tho? I know it may not be the fastest but I believe it's still considered "high speed"
@@mattkennedy6115 Yeah, actually. The US has a population of over 340 million. 885K is 0 .2% of the population. Not even remotely enough to justify the vast expenditure such a system will require.
@@Evil0tto Aaaand that's the attitude that's seeing a great lead go to waste lol.
US Highspeed rail in a nutshell:
< 130mph
_DIESEL_
And you can't argue that electrifying US rail lines isn't practical because Russia managed it, the entire Trans Siberian railway is electrified and that's longer than any other railway line let alone any in the US. Seeing as Brightline is sharing freight lines, the freight companies can invest in either electric only or bi-mode locomotives to make use of the OLE too. America already has bi-mode locomotives; the PC32AC-DMs are dual mode because diesel emissions aren't allowed in the tunnels and terminals in New York where they are used. Instead of giving a diesel locomotive a way of using electric power because of a _restriction,_ give it the capability as an _advantage._
They can connect East, west, north, south of US by making high speed railway lines. May, be a City in the Midwest can be made into centeral station. May, be Omaha or Kansas City , connecting New York, Miami, Houston, Chicago, LA etc
HSR commands a premium fare which implies competing with other transportation options such as low cost airlines... Beyond around three hours HSR loses out to the airlines worldwide. America is not a tiny nation one can drive across in a single day. Maybe you can drive across Missouri in a single day, maybe you can drive across Germany in a single day, but you can not drive across America in a single day. There is a reason why the USPS terminated the railroads mail contracts more than 50 years ago which led to the railroad serving the northeast corridor into bankruptcy... Flying is considerably faster, hours instead of days...
Wow this is slow ;) they are building the slowest SBahn I know, but it looks fancy
No kidding, commuter trains run faster than this here (Sweden) as well.
At least its a start, finally.
For real man. Here in Italy the regional trains run at 100 kmph and more, intercity normal trains even at 160/200 kmph. Anyway, for such a car centered society like America's, it's still a great revolution
@@Hastdupech8509 Well, genius.... 80 mph is 128 kmph, and that is the AVERAGE this train will do.. the top end will be 200 mph, or 322 kmph.
@@starmc26 The average is still to low, why do you think 300 kph trains run on distances longer than 200 km? To not waste too much time (in percentage obv) to accelerate and decelerate. If you travel at 320 kph only for 50 km and the other half is employed to get faster and slow down, then you may as well make it run as an average train without wasting fuel and stressing excessively the rails
I have really big faith in brightline west because you know brightline is a fantastic passenger railroad that seems to be run by actual adults
Great summary! I live in Miami and I cannot wait for service to be resume!
I love how instead of encouraging train travel they are worried about lost road toll revenue. Only Americans can do that...
I repeat myself in my comments of videos like this one. Sometime in the 1960s, the US has lost track in a literal sense when it comes to building and operating railroads, diverting the publics focus solely to car and air travel. So far, the US has not a single fully operational highspeed line, even the NEC has only a little over 60 miles of highspeed trackage. We have to agree that anything below 125mph is not highspeed traffic! The CSF for highseed lines in Europe was, the they were from day 1 on an integral part of a complete railroad network, spanning the entire continent. This is not the case in the US - and it won´t be for many more decades to come. Highspeed ines which are not connect will not become much more than a Disney-like tourist attraction, which will not generate sufficient funds for expanding them. The only way forward is government funding - large scale - but doubt that this will happen. The US government prefers to invest into war instead of investing into mattersbeneficial for the people!
Brightline is absolutely the way forward in the US! There's no appetite for government funded HSR, so services like Brightline are the best way forward. What this service is really competing with is airplanes and cars.
Follow the Roaming Railfan, not me, for construction progress of the Florida expansion on RUclips. Currently we are watching the box jacking of the tunnel of the link from the N-S FEC line to the line parallelling SR 528 in Cocoa. He updates every week and the tunnel every few days.
So not only does California fail to make a high-speed rail line, but the only high-speed rail line they may get in their state, may come courtesy of Florida. Yikes that's gotta hurt!
Were getting there, slowly...
It's because of Activist groups, Congress, Unions, and other Private companies. We can't get shit done quickly because of them. People need to stop being a**hats to companies that offer good services.
The fact that a private company is building rail in the US is encouraging. Still think the US building the interstate freeways greatly discouraged this and other types of more efficient travel.
Can you make a video, explaining the proposed Mayan train, which is currently being planned and built within the Yucatán Peninsula in Mexico? It is one of the most significant infrastructure projects in contemporary Mexico and Latin America.
Incredible detail on the rail projects. Thanks for your work
This isn't a Highspeed Railway. In Germany it is a slow Regionaltrain, or a S-Bahn (Citytrain)
Thank you for using your real voice and not some synthesized voice.
This video is great! I just wanted to say, as someone from South Florida the car travel times you guys have are way too fast. Orlando to Miami is normally a 4-5 hour car drive and that's only if you don't hit any traffic. And the fastest I've ever driven West Palm to Miami is 2hours. That was either for work or to see a Miami Heat game.
Two hours? No way lol! I’ve lived in WPB over the years- getting to Miami can be done in about 1.5 hours or less depending on drivers in Miami with the usually accidents.
Orlando to Miami is NOT 4-5 hours. More like 3.5 hours.
Just a small correction, West Palm doesn’t have a separate population of 5.8 million people. West palm is part of the 6 million person metro area of miami
The anti-rail regulations in the US are ridiculous. And the fact that they are planning „high speed“ rails (200 km/h max!) with Diesel Engines and the fact that this even is an „improvement“ for the environment is next to absurd. Don‘t get me wrong, this is of course better than nothing, but from a European perspective, you can only shake your head in disbelief!
TBH those people are the blame. Including those old nimbys protesting in Martin County talkihn conspiracy theories about trains…..
Well done! Thanks for putting this together.
I would imagine that there would be constant track maintenance if they are having to share the line with FEC freight trains to keep the ride as smooth as possible.
Which probably why speeds are limited to 80mph between West Palm Beach and Miami. That stretch is the most congested and carries significantly more rail traffic.
These relatively slow trains on existing tracks aren’t very exciting but they actually get built so maybe they should be more exciting than overpromising and underdelivering mega projects.
Not very high-speed in FL the Metra train in and out of Chicago reaches 75mph and that hasn't been upgraded in over 30 years.
I recommend giving a fellow creator here on RUclips a close look when it comes to the Brightline East line progress, as they are consistently making update videos on the construction of phase two to Orlando from the sites themselves. The channel is The Roaming Railfan. Highly recommend it for reliable progress updates.
Also I would like to make note that the locomotives that are to be used on the West line being Diesel/Electric is likely beneficial considering the fact that typically when temperatures get excessively hot (90F+), the friction produced at high speed along with said heat and direct summer sunlight puts the cantenary wires at high risk of melting or warping, along with the train's pantographs. So being able to swap to diesel is actually a potential work-around for the region's absurdly hot and intensely dry weather conditions in the summer and autumn. Additionally, if the tracks & trusses are not made of strong and high enough grade material, they too can be at very high risk of warping when it is too hot & dry with the train's weight and friction at high speeds.
I suspect another reason behind the choice being made to use Diesel/Electric Locos is likely to get the fuel/petrol giants and lobbies, and their favorite sidekicks in the automotive industry, to ease back just a bit on their attempts to completely eradicate high-speed interstate, ICE, regional and national rail companies and groups, since again, it ensures they will still use fuel some of the time, which makes sure the fuel/petrol giants & lobbies still will make some decent money off of their services too, and not be completely profitless off of them if it was entirely electric. The big Airline companies and lobbies here in the US are also one of the biggest villains in their attitudes and actions towards anything remotely similar to a Brightline concept. And actually with this latter point, that's likely another one of the many reasons they opted to take people direct from and to Orlando's Airport, too - that also guarantees to the airlines there and the airport's ownership group that they will likely help INCREASE the passengers going to and from their airport, and with that, there is almost certainly going to be a decent size increase in the amount of happy Business class & First class passengers for them as a result from it as well, which makes any airline's and airport's CEOs drool these days. Business Class is now the best class of passenger for any level and type of airline for profits, and is projected to only further increase the profits they'll be able to make in the coming years, especially with the likely increase in business class seats on many airline's planes soon.
So again, I sincerely believe they did these things with these reasons in mind on their lists for why they'd make these choices specifically. Hell, I wouldn't doubt Disney and Comcast NBC and Universal) are happy with the choice to have a major stop/station placed at the airport there in Orlando, too. Again, the bigger the corporations, the bigger their money, and the more they control just about everything in this country, especially with lobbying. Not sure they would've cared in the first place, the latter that is, until of course Brightline announced that they'd extend service to the airport there. Now though, it's obvious if they dared retract the station (there's 100% they won't), they would care endlessly now, and fight bitterly to prevent it. But it's only because they were made to care.
All this said, I hope it adds some new perspectives to the mix overall going forward for some people here who happen to come across this video and comment, and, specifically those who actually defy the normal internet & comment sections of websites, and read the whole thing haha. Props to those who do man. You're a rare one!
High speed rail will never happen in this country for at least another 50 years. People are to enamored of their cars here. The government keeps spending its money on roads.
The under 100 mph DIESEL trains are a joke.
I used to live in West Palm when it was built. The train can go much faster than 80 but they were forced to slow down because too many people were getting killed on the tracks. It’s kind of a bad move imo because:
1-It’s a train, it’s still gonna kill people at 80 mph
2-The tracks had plenty of warnings that a train was coming. The deaths were caused either by a lack of public education surrounding track safety or a lack of suicide prevention.
I’m pretty sure peak speed is 110 mph and average is 80mph
hopefully brightline can revive our rail ways cause trains is what made america hopefully brightline decides to expand into illinois
Amtrak has regional trains in Illinois. Amtrak does not have regional trains in Florida. For that matter Amtrak does not have regional trains in Texas either...
Speed, safety, and energy efficiency is the theme for HSR
Definitely stoked about it 👍
Feeling hope for American passenger rail is a very unfamiliar feeling for me. I like it
West Palm Beach is part of the Miami metro area, meaning the combined population of both of them and every city in between is 6 million.
Brightline West needs to get construction going from LV to LA very soon. The traffic congestion along I-15 to either LV or LA is reaching a breaking point. It is getting ridiculous especially during holiday travel season. Traffic just crawls along and Semis and large trucks take up a lot of road space as are too many cars and trucks. HSR would alleviate the problem BUT NOT solve it completely. I-15 needs to breathe.
What would also be great if there was a line running from LA to Phoenix. 6 hour drive could be cut to 2 to 3 hours.
In short, Western cities need to be connected with HSR. The complete "loop of the West" would be: LA to LV to SLC to Denver to Albuquerque to PHNX to LA. $200 to 300 B perhaps in bonds for the entire loop. US is lagging way behind other global nations. We need to get on with it.
Im hoping they make a stop in Downtown Stuart. It be a huge help for me.
That would be a great place for a new station! The Treasure Coast needs a station once we can go to Orlando (and Miami)
@@HannahFoll and it'll be easier since I take Amtrak from up north, transfer to the Brightline to Downtown Stuart. Less gas and the it'll help the city of Stuart grow its economy.
Thanks for a great video! Just as a note, you list the Miami metro area as having a population of 6.2 million people and then list West Palm Beach as having 5.8 million people. The Miami - Fort Lauderdale - Pompano Beach Metropolitan Statistical Area encompasses the three counties of Miami-Dade, Broward (where Fort Lauderdale is located), and Palm Beach (where West Palm Beach is located). Palm Beach County itself has about 1.5 million people.
As a Californian who believes in high speed rail, the US government should just give the contract to build high speed rail to Brightline...
If the CHSRP shows anything, Democrats will award contracts to people who suck. The CHSRP was award to companies owned by Feinstein, Brown, Pelosi and Spier and well 10 years for 60 miles of track costing billions...
The CHSR second in command is on the run from the law during an investigation into theft of funds.
It's not that simple. Telling a private contractor to build doesn't eliminate issues like landowners who refuse to be bought out.
Great video! Of course, as soon as we start getting decent intercity trains in the US, we get smacked with a pandemic.
We had the InterCity 125 HST (125mph in 70s) and InterCity 225 (140mph in the late 80s)
Are you able to check your population figures? The Miami metro population of 6.2 million includes West Palm Beach.
The US census for some reason does not include West Palm Beach as part of the Miami-Metro (I think). They only include Miami-Dade and Broward counties. However, I think you really should, all 3 counties are interlinked very heavily. Miami-Dade: 2,716,940, Broward: 1,952,778, Palm Beach: 1,496,770. Total population: 6,166,488.
@@Xerxesjc28 All 3 Counties are part of the Miami Metro according to the US Census. It's been that way for over 3 decades now.
I think Raider fans will likely destroy the entire Brightline West project within the first season the train is open.
No way those projects can be done by private hands. If Japanese government hasn't taken the first steps they wouldn't have built the Shinkansen. It's to big for greedy hungry private groups.
The public effort in California has been looted, and the second in command of the effort is on the run from the law.
Government gave us Amtrak, private sector is the only way to actually get things done
Excellent reporting! Thank you.
…in order for any excellent passenger rail to be built we must invest in dedicated rail vs relying on freight rail to be ‘understanding’ the need for passenger rail development in the US!!!
The very first high-speed train, Shinkansen 0 series, are not even compatible to the rest of Japan's railway network.
Unless the speed is 300km/h, these trains can not be called bullet trains or HS by world standard, the Brightline East train is medium speed train at best and it still has many road level crossings which slows down the speed even more
That's not even close to high-speed!
"Regular" speed trains in France run at 160km/h 100mph. The TGV high-speed train I take from my home in Paris to visit my father in Reims (Champagne's largest city) runs at 320km/h 200mph and transformed Reims into a suburb of Paris as it only takes 40 minutes city center to city center. It's distant from Paris by 160km / 100mi and the first few and last minutes are acceleration and deceleration in dense populated urban areas (40km out of Paris and 5 out of Reims).
This East high-speed line is in the process of being upgraded to 360km/h 225mph and has completely replaced air travel between Paris and Strasburg (siege of the European Parliament).
Brightline is a good project but you can't call that high-speed, it's higher-than-usual-in-the-US speed but far from high-speed, in Europe or Asia it would be called regular service at best.
We know
Keep moving forward. Thank you for sharing.
Thank you
wont happen America doesn't care about these things, also making it private will make it extremely expensive, amtrak cant go without being subsidized...
Amtrak would be profitable if it focused on region routes at cut off the intercontinental money pits, but they are required to provide services to those small towns
@@greasher926 so small towns need no service? China has no issue getting steady income enough to support its high-speed rail network project, which services almost all of china's small towns east of the mountains surrounding Xinjiang and Tibet, and they are currently building more there, max long-distance in china with this rail is 90 USD, and cheaper the shorter it gets, so much for your logic, try again.
@@greasher926 Also you've failed to also consider the fact that Cargo transport is given priority on US rails, over Passenger, and this is also thanks to your privatization, which has essentially created a spirit that lacks the want to create infrastructure such as this.
utilizing already laid down tracks because its "cheaper"
@@ohhah1255 I know all these things you bring up, obviously it can be done, but it would have to subsidized similar to our federal and state highway networks, but currently that is considered anathema in America’s culture. Everything thing needs to be profitable. All I’m saying is that Amtrak would actually be profitable if it stuck to those shorter distances. However I think that it is good that Amtrak does serve those smaller towns, but unfortunately because Amtrak is underfunded, the profits they make on the regional routes, they use that to subsidize the longer routes, rather investing and improving their successful routes.
@@greasher926 What are smaller towns in your opinion? In my country there are towns, smaller than 1,000 inhabitants, that have a half-an-hour or hourly service by train. Our national railway companies are subsidized, but only to about 40% of operational costs.
Amtrak is said to have the route between Los Angeles and Las Vegas. That will be run on existing track, so there is a good chance they will undercut Brightline. Hopefully that will not happen....
I love the idea of the brightline west however going from Victorville to Palmdale is a terrible idea. It cuts out a huge market area of potential users. As someone who lives in the Inland Empire area of SoCal, the fact I have to go west to go north seems counter productive. The worst part of the drive is Cajon Pass. Once I've loaded my car up and made the trip that far I may as well stay in my car the rest of the way there and not have to rely on taxis, ride sharing, or busses.
The brightline train speed is 79 mph for now and 125 mph for the planned cocoa-orlando segment.
meanwhile Shanghai-Beijing HSR has been in operation for 11 years, with 1268km (788 mi) in length and average speed of 350 km/h (217 mph)...
I didn't think the Virgin deal ever made any sense. All that came out of it was a station in Miami looking like Virgin Megastore (have they rebranded everything meanwhile?) The trains weren't even relabeled (probably a good idea).
Passengers don't care what name is used in marketing, they want safe, reliable, comfortable and fast travel from one place to another. From travel reports I saw it looks like the travel experience is quite fine, it's still not as fast as real high speed though because that would require massive infrastructure investment on the scale that it would need some help from the federal budget.
Why can't the states invest into their state's infrastructure? Uncle Sam is BROKE!
I think Brightline made the deal mainlybfor funding and secondary for branding. Virgin wanted to tie the train into its other assets eg. Airlines and cruises, but pulled out during COVID when money got tight.
The train doesn't have to be "high speed" to be "high speed", it just needs to provide a service that's competitive to flying. Everything else is incremental.
To be fair Virgin group are no stranger to HSR they ran the main north-south route in the UK for over 20 years and had a pretty good reputation, when they lost the franchise there was a public petition to give it back to them which gained over 100K signatures, which in the UK is the trigger level for the issue to be debated by parliament. They did then get the franchise extended but lost it again later.
I've waited so long for this since the last FEC passenger train rolled into history in 1968.
Were you able to ride the new FEC train between Miami and West Palm Beach?
@@taoliu3949 Yes.
@@samtrak1204 How does it live up to its predecessor?
@@taoliu3949 Brightline offers superior service to all passengers whereas FEC trains (and all other trains in the South) were racially segregated until the late 50's. It was only fairly recently that railroads started to hire black engineers and conductors - under pressure - because those were jobs reserved for white males. Brightline uses the latest technology to meet the needs of today's passengers and is fully integrated, but I am very disappointed there is no lounge car - an American train must have.
@@samtrak1204 Wait, so how do they serve food and beverages? Do they even serve food and beverages?
I wonder how much Brightline East will cost between Miami and Orlando. As it stands, it's significantly cheaper to fly into Orlando than it is Miami or Ft. Lauderdale. I have no problem taking the extra time riding the train out of Orlando down to Miami if it's going to end up saving me money.
Part of the problem is that the airline industry is heavily subsidized. They don't even pay any fuel tax in any part of the world, airports, especially smaller ones, are heavily subsidized, and every time a major airline runs into financial trouble they are bailed out by the tax payers.
People in the US prefer to fly for long trips and drive for short trips. There's only a limited range that high speed trains will have an advantage.
Yes but that limited range is still a market that can be filled.
Not with Amtrak, their engineering is catastrophic.
It's thanks to Brightline that the future in passenger rail is finally - bright!
I live in Vero Beach. The proposed Bright Line East line will utilize the existing FEC tracks running through Vero. I am strongly in favor of a station in the Vero-Ft. Pierce area. There already is vacant land next to the track along Old Dixie Highway in St. Lucie County that would make a great location. It already has an over pass in place to take traffic from the station overs to U.S. Route 1. It would be a great asset to both Vero Beach and Ft. Pierce to have a station at this location!
We would like to have one in Melbourne as well.
ICE technology by Germany. Great! We adopted TGV (France) already. The only one left is Shinkansen (Japan).
Koreans developed their own EMU high speed trains, which is different from TGV trains they got from France.
FEC has primarily been a freight railroad. And as such, had real estate assets along its right of way. It upgraded its existing tracks to have twin tracks and upgraded the many many many rail crossings to alllow trains at up to 80mph ( 130kmh)
On Virgin: Branson had never promised to invest and was drawing revenues from the use of his brand. It was hoped that with Virgin cruises, it would draw passengers to the train service, it didn't and in fact, the Brightline brand was still better known and the change to Virgin just confused people, so the branding deal was ended. Since Virgin had no equity in project, it was a no brainer to do. Also, COVID happened, the cruise industruy shiutdown and so did Brightline so it was a very easy decision for FEC to end the branding deal and stop payig royalties for a brand that did not attract any extra passengers and which in fact confused passengers. And the fact that anson never had intenstions to invest in equity shows he didn't really care much.
The original pitch was 80mps for Brightline east. But after many deaths at rail crossings, the authorities declassified the service and it is no longer able to reach 80. Also, which FEC did raise capital, what is not mentioned is that the statem cities, and FRA also contributed hige sums of money for the project so it is not true to state it is entirely privately funded. The stretch between Orlando and Tampa was/is made very coplex because FEC wants the highest possible subsidies to build the line and hence the fight over what route to take depending on whcih city willing to pay more. (the latest is Disneyworld will get the SUn rail service instead of Brightline).
Note that with old fashioned diesel engines, and the gazillion level crossings on the southern portion, this can never be a high speed line even if a few short stretches fuirther north allow it. Note also that FRA does not allow high speed on tracks where there can be freight trains. (and this is where the FEC being a freight railroad comes in).
A single track, diesel powered "high speed" railroad is doomed from start.
ALL HSR projects are economic disasters. ALL
As far as I know there is no Velaro with Diesel engines so at least the bright line west will be electrified
@Va Sr Why? They already KNOW that it isn't economically viable. That's why they have to FORCE citizens who don't use it to pay for it under penalty of imprisonment.
@@protonneutron9046 'That's why they have to FORCE citizens who don't use it to pay for it under penalty of imprisonment.'
The worst fake news ever. Japan has many regional railways serving the same areas as high-speed railways. If Japan 'forces' their citizens to ride high-speed railways, then how come these regional railways still exist, and many people still ride them?
Besides, regions like Hokkaido and Shikoku still have no high-speed railway lines. So tell me, genius, how can the Japanese government 'force' citizens living there to ride high-speed rail if they don't have access to Shinkansen?
You definitely have never been to Japan.
@@protonneutron9046 nope. Not all are an economic disaster. It's serving China, Japan and Germany well for several decades now