Dzongsar Khyentse Rinpoche about Homosexuality and Buddhism (traduit en français)
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- Опубликовано: 30 сен 2024
- First time one of the highest renowned teacher of Tibetan Buddhism is talking about homosexuality in buddhism. (Deutsch: tinyurl.com/nho...) en français... appuyer sur PLUS:
DZONGSAR KHYENTSE RINPOCHE A PROPOS DE L'HOMOSEXUALITE DANS LE BOUDDHISME
traduit généreusement par "Minou Pochette Ou Presque" à partir de la vidéo:
C'est une question intéressante: l'orientation sexuelle, les gays, les lesbiennes, ainsi que notre façon de l'appréhender dans le monde bouddhiste. Je voudrai prendre quelques minutes pour en parler.
Dans le bouddhisme, d'après Shantideva, la Sagesse est la chose la plus importante. Tout le reste est secondaire. Le plus important est de voir la Vérité. Si la morale, la discipline et même la méditation (aussi précieux que cela puisse être) ne vous font pas voir la Vérité, vous faites seulement "pourrir vos fesses" (traduction littérale), vous ne faites que rester assis. C'est inutile! Effectivement, peut être que cela vous permettra de vous relaxer, de vous calmer quelques peu mais quel est l’intérêt ? Si vous ne voyez pas la Vérité, cela ne sert à rien. Rien n'est plus important que de voir la vérité. Je voudrai que vous compreniez bien cela car toutes ces méthodes (méditation, etc...) sont toujours teintées (mélangées, influencées) par la culture. La Vérité, selon le Bouddhisme, comme par exemple les 4 Sceaux, n'est jamais, et ne doit pas être entachées par la culture. Vous comprenez cela?
Obtenir cette Vérité? Oui, bien entendu, car elle se doit d'être transmise aux être humains. Quand vous la transmettez aux êtres humains, ceux-ci ne peuvent l'appréhender qu'à travers leur culture. Par conséquent, ce que je voudrai dire vis-à-vis de l'orientation sexuelle, c'est qu'elle n'a rien à voir avec le fait de comprendre ou non la Vérité. Vous pouvez être gay, ou bien lesbienne, ou encore hétérosexuel, personne ne peut affirmer qui atteindra l'Eveil en premier. Prooooobablement les lesbiennes (rires). On ne peut pas savoir car ces deux choses n'ont rien à voir. Je sais que certains pourraient soutenir que, d'un point de vue traditionnel, ces pratiques pourraient être considérées comme de "l'inconduite sexuelle". Il faut être prudent avec ce genre de rapprochement.
Je me souviens qu'un jour quelqu'un m'a demandé pourquoi les femmes ne pouvaient pas entrer dans le Gönkhang, le temple des Protecteurs. La réponse était simple: c'est faux! Il faut arrêter cela! Il n'est pas écrit dans le Kangyur, ni dans le Tengyur, ni dans les textes Tantriques que les femmes ne peuvent pas entrer dans le Gönkhang. Je suis sérieux! Ces idées sont créées par les culturalistes (traduction littérale). Cela arrive souvent. Si vous faites partie d'un groupe de bouddhistes misogynes, peut être devriez vous juste garder le silence et faire avec. La Vérité, c'est cela ; et je pense qu'il est important de le dire car certaines personnes ont une orientation sexuelle différente. Je souhaite en particulier dire aux parents qui s'ils remarquent cette légère différence chez leur enfant, ils leur faut se montrer compréhensifs, ne pas considérer cela comme une maladie. C'est ce message que je souhaite faire passer.
Vous savez, certaines personnes aiment le fromage de chèvre, d'autres le fromage suisse, d'autres encore aiment les deux! (rires) C'est aussi simple que ça! Et pourquoi pas ?
Mais je souhaite aussi dire à ceux qui ont ces orientations qu'ils doivent se montrer patient.
Par exemple, nous les Bhoutanais sommes persuadés d'être un grand peuple de cette Terre. Nous sommes très conservateurs. Et nous ne comprenons pas pourquoi tout le monde ne nous aime pas. C'est comme si je disais : "Je te sers le meilleur plat du monde, pourquoi ne l'aimes tu pas?". Nous avons cette mentalité.
Seulement les temps changent, et nous devons nous montrer tolérants. Non, en fait vous ne devez pas tolérer cela, vous devez le RESPECTER! La tolérance n'est pas une bonne chose. Si vous tolérez, cela sous-entend que vous pensez que c'est mal, mais que vous le tolérez. Mais il faut aller au-delà de ça, vous devez respecter ces gens.
Je voulais juste vous dire cela.
"we never know which one will get enlightened first... Probably lesbians."
It made me laugh so hard 😭
Bro true religion never put human in suffer ! True religion let people with peace and clam and real god not against human
This guy is very wise. Because Buddhism doesn't say anything other than no sexual misconduct, the cultures that it spread to interpret that precept as a rule against homosexulity. I'm not part of the LGBTQ+ community, but as a Buddhist it would be great for it to become a norm in all cultures that share the Buddha's teachings to be more accepting towards them.
AN honest buddhist will tell you it homsexuality is delusion based on desire and attachment, which is the root of all suffering. It says so in the four noble truths. Plus homosexuals can't have families.
Sexual misconduct and sexual orientation are absolutely different things. That's the point.
DKR is one of the best. I hope that every LGBTQ person who has ever had a problem with any religion will get a chance to hear a teacher this genuine say things like this.
I think there is no problem in USA! All people there are sexual confused, so it doesn't matter!!!! The next step is a gender conform LamaGenderBuddhismTransQueer Philosophy!!!
👍🏾🙏
marketin BT to to niezła maszynka - nakierowana na wyciągnie kasy od każdego środowiska - oni sa zarówno tradycjonalistami , wręcz konserwatystami i patriotami tybetańskim walczącymi o wyzwolenie Tybetu , Komunistami pełnymi troski o wszystkie klasy społeczne ,jak i liberałami walczącymi o wszystkie 100 płcie. przy czym pamiętajmy, ze w tybecie do najazdu Maoistowskich Chin istniał feudalizm i niewolnictwo ,a w Bhutanie z którego pochodzi ten pan rinpocze niewolnictwo zniesiono w roku 1979
I am converting right now. omg I never thought there is a religion out there that accepts lgbt+ community.
+Vivian Mekonnen I am glad that you are finding a community that is good for you. However, there are other religious communities who also accept lgbt people very openly: www.episcopalchurch.org/page/lgbt-church
+Vivian Mekonnen I think you should lol. If you ever convert and start practicing Buddhism even on a basic level, you'll find that one of the things you need to do is to get rid of your desire to have a religion that "accepts the lgbt+ community", the very thing that brought you to Buddhism in the first place.
akoofromtp I have no desire to be surrounded by bunch of people against light+ community. They are ignorant. And Buddhism goes against ignorance. That is why I want to convert.
+akoofromtp Why should she? It's a legitimate desire, what in Buddhist terms could be described as a wholesome aspiration to goodness and social harmony.
+Vivian Mekonnen
You maybe surprised to find that you don't have to convert. You can have both.
Well, for monks any kind of sexuality, heterossexual or homossexual, is a kind of attachment, which their purpose is to avoid. As for lay practitioners, the type of sexual orientation doesn't make a lot of difference, as long as it doesn't hurt anybody.
Beatriz Karwai correct. As monastic people, of course not only homosexual but any sexual activity is against the vinaya/ vow. But that is only for monastic people / nuns and monks and not to lay practitioners.
Unless one is doing Karmamudra.
@@Metabrotropic well, secret practices are a separate topic
Beatriz,
Asexual is also a form of attachment in reverse. We tend to forget this side.
Thanks, so refreshing
homosexuals exist ...its the truth... we should be compassionate towards them accept the reality as it is dont try to change it...
live and let live..
The object of compassion is a suffering being. Therefore I don't see what compassion has to do with a 'straight' person's attitude towards a homosexual. As DKR said - respect is what's needed. :)
ruclips.net/video/uSBx9GMET8c/видео.html
Respect was the key word I think
My favorite part is when he suggests that lesbians will probably get enlightened first and I find myself in full agreement.
@enigma Anyone can get enlightenment as long as they are compassionate without desire which is the root cause of suffering.....there is no disparity between genders in achieving Buddhahood,
Females are naturally more compassionate and lesbian has not to blind with attachment for their kids so they can see the truth more faster way. It does make sense!
I disagree. I was super harassed by a LESBIAN way older than me. Zero compassion over there!
@@cristinaSZ84 ,
He was just pulling your legs with his off the cuff humor.
Why are you in full agreement?
"...your sexual orientation has got nothing to do with understanding or not understanding the truth." 2:25
FINALLY!! One of the top Rinpoche's discussing this stuff! :-)
+Astraea Shaw it is not about sticking dick into anuses or whatever. It is about respecting other's choice and not imposing own belief on others.
Hahahaha this is the best responce ever!
+Astrea Shaw
Ask him why he's discussing it. Why you so bothered about what others consensually choose to do with their genitals in private behind closed doors? How is it your business? What difference does it make? How is it degrading? To whom? Why are you so concerned? You seem a bit defensive & preoccupied - does this touch on some raw nerves? Your insecurities are being conspicuously exposed just as much as your ignorance, anger & hatred. Please do whatever you wish to do with your genitals - provided it's consensual, legal and causes nobody any harm. Wish you a wonderful weekend.
+Charlie Morley WHOOPS! - you misused the apostrophe :-)
Hey don't "grammar shame" me! He he :-) x
"And some people like both!
And why not?"
DKR smiles knowingly, because he appreciates all kinds of "cheese".
And has the balls to speak His Mind , too
I agree with DKR "why must I pick one, can't I enjoy both?" 😊
Yes, as soon as the topic came up, I had an epiphany. It was something I didnt fully realise until this moment, but I think you may be correct. 🙏😊
I don't know what you mean, rimpoche is a monk, thus leading a life of celibacy.
Thank you Rinpotché, your teaching is like a hot bath when it is very cold outside.
+Nathalie Quet
Beautiful response.
j'aime bien quand il dit : tolérer ce n'est pas la bonne attitude ..c'est respecter qui est la bonne attitude
One of the interpretation of the Heart of Perfect Wisdom Sutra is simple : never stop to going beyond. Beyond what ? Beyond all dualistic vision. The truth nature of the reality is beyond all the distinction, discrimination, created by the human spirit. All dualistic vision is source of suffering. So when you see people as etherosexual or homosexual, you creat a distinction, a dualism, a suffering for you and the others. You want to stop suffering ? Ceased to creat dualism.
The Buddha says : in the sky there is no distinction between east and west, people creat distinctions in there mind and beleive they are truth.
when sex, whatever form it takes becomes more important than truth seeking ,that is a big impediment to spiritual growth. You could say the same for money, power, food, possessions etc, one cannot love two masters at the same time, all these things are desires , which lead to more desires and they will not let go until you are dead, which will lead to another birth and more suffering.
If you seriously are on the spiritual path, make truth the one desire,all the rest are just mind traps.
To see the truth is most important. Everything else is secondary. - lovely words guru
We need more spirtual leaders like Dzongstar.
Ok
As Rinpoche states all the time; Buddhism is not a dogmatic religion. LGBTQ people are ABSOLUTELY NOT prejudiced against in the Mahayana. Advanced Vajrayana practices represent a conundrum for gay people of course; but there is no 'exclusion' in the religion.
Being tolerant with the intolerant , is also something we have tolerate . Tee hee
. Bigotry is everywhere . We have to approach the bigots not with our own predudice ,but with understanding and love
Thank you for this,, now lets hope the major 3 religions follow this beautiful mans words.
Love his way to speak, very wisely and funny also - but the last one comes from culture 😊and that is what I love more 🙃
When ppl dun understand this video, perhaps they dun understand what the truth or absolute truth talking in buddhism.
anyway, questioning or arguing is good.
I celebrate his knowledge.
There is real knowledge as well.
I follow u profoundly.... it's amazing...!!!!
Love this!! So good to hear! :-)
DKR's answer is spot on and clear. So much cultural baggage and misconceptions about sexual orientation in Buddhism as well as other major religions.
This is a very enlightened master indeed! I'd like to see some master of Bön tradition saying the same as I'm more into Bön but so far I haven't seen any article or video by any of them about my minority, LGBTIQs. Thank you for uploading this here and tuday chay, rimpoche for your support!!!!
honorable Rinpoche , the Dalai lama previously indirectly implied its a minor sin. the desire itself is not a sin however actively engaging in homosexual acts or gay marriage is sin. as for genders there are only 3 female and male and intersex. however we should compassionate and tolerant towards everyone
Lovely words! Grateful!
When someone derives identity from their sexuality, it's not the truth
Oui , a partir du moment ou l'on oblige pas à vivre de cette façon en niant l'hétérosexualité.
"...la tolérance n'est pas une bonne chose,si vous tolérez,cela sous entend que vous pensez que c'est mal,mais que vous le tolérez.Mais il faut aller au delà de ça,vous devez respecter ces (les) gens."
I bet the user called Crunch would like this
Thanks for your wisdom
Eternal Gratitude and Appreciation. Namaste
I don't know if the audience was feeling him... very serious looking faces... still my people love them all.
I think DKR lost them. They gave him a blank stare. Realizing their reactions, he cut the sermon short.
If DJKR says humans came from mars, they would agree with him whole heartedly. Dont misunderstand their silence, it is their traditional ettiquette not to howl like pack of wolfs during a sermon.
Amazing Teaching -100% TRUE ! _()_((()))_(((()))_(((())))_(((()))_(((())__
Beautifully said! chaktsl.
This is such a bad explanation that is equal to saying: it's okay to have fetters on your way to wisdom.
I love blue cheese...
You are so brave coming out like this
🙏 wisdom 🙏❤
There is what we call double samsara. You can be a murder or thief, lier and this who’ll obscure your path to wisdom. There are things that we grasp or fixate to and no wisdom will arise. Obscure a society will make harder for realization like America not just one thing but many things forced on us to do to except no right or wrong. I will choose the later....
~Chaksalo Rinpoche~ 🙏🙏🙏
🙏🙏
❤
He's right, people are confused by culturalr bias
Thank you, Rinpoche, I hope this would be translated in spanish, it would help many people
I rinpoche
you don't answer the following question;
if i'm in a couple is it better to go in a homosexual couple ?
do you encourage homosexuality more than hétéro ? or is that not the Point ?
The old text of Buddhism, morality is number one. Second loving the same sex non sexually is ok yet act into sexual act in homosexual is prohibited
I read an Article that homosexuality is in bhtan very comon.
He is good. Very good indeed.
Em português
🙏🙏🙏
🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
Great
Rinpoche the audience is Bhutanese so why are you speaking in English?
+456
For the benefit of those who aren't Bhutanese - he's being filmed - for a global audience.
Because Bhutanese people speak different dialects and don’t always know the other person’s dialect
There was an interview with the Dalai Lama and he said if you are not spiritual then homosexuality is a personal issue and he says it's okay. But if you are spiritual you must respect your culture. And another respected Tibetan Buddhist said homosexuality is not a big sin but it still is one. And if you're homosexual you will likely have a lesser reincarnation. I guess I'm grateful that they tolerate homosexuality but it doesn't seem like they accept it into Buddhism. What if I'm gay and I WANT to be spiritual. Just a bit confusing I guess.
The other buddhist was Khenpo Sodargye.
Don't listen to this bullshit. With so called spiritual development you get rid of cultural conditioning. And in buddhism there is no such thing as sin.
@@chinyuenwong5342 Well in vajrayana tantric buddhism (the most comprehensive, deepest and fastest way in my and many others opinion) a practicioner don't force themselves to celibate nor get rid of sexual desire, instead work with these energies and transform them into realization. Being a monk isn't for everyone and practise in yogi way can be the same or even more fruitful.
Life is suffering or full with disatisfaction. The first noble truth said so. Why? Because of attachment. The second noble truth said so.
Therefore, be it gay, lesbian or straight, it will be painfull, it will be suffering, it will be full with disatisfaction when attachment arise.
Gay, straight and lesbian can free themself if they wish to do so. All sexual orientation need to be accepted. No need to put judgement on straight, lesbian and gay.
@@larrya1025 beg to differs here. The old Pali text of Buddhism said these act of Homosexuality, beastiality, pedophilia etc actually being prohibited. Non attachment of things even the desire of lust. True while at the same we can love all sentinels yet it never make their acts is right. There is boundary in these even in the old text. The reason this monk said vague language becase he is Tibetan. And he knows if the collective West turn against his nation because he telling exactly what is written and meant in the Biddhist text of Theravada and Mahayana even Pure Land school, boy he will be put into blamed by his dalai.lama.
🙏🏽🙏🏽🙏🏽
Où est la traduction en français ?
Bonjour Martine,
sous la video est le text en français: il faut just cliquer sur PLUS
🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
⛅
;)
Don't read the subtitles, some words are wrong, and therefore it's hardly understandable. Thanx, Rinpoche, for this discussion.
To understand the truth is liberating,
to follow natures law is natural,
Same sex is not natural.
rotten your butt :) love this dharma!
homoseksualizm to podążanie za poszukiwaniem przyjemności czyli forma hedonizmu wiec raczej nie po drodze mu z dharma Buddy. Przy okazji pan "rinpocze" może powie cos o pedofili i homoseksualizmie w tybetańskich klasztorach ?
Straight people are pedo
Rimpoche, there are energies in those places which are harmful to women, and especially, if they are pregnant, the energies are very harmful to the extremely delicate and sensitive fetus. We all know how sensitive we are to male energies during menstruation, wanting to stay away from men and not even see them, but we don't talk about it. And we all know that sometimes we just instinctively feel some people are evil and dangerous. So we don't go to hang out there on purpose. And when it comes to those temples in India, those special babas, and those protector rooms in Tibetan temples, same thing. Not good for women's energy field. It's like sunburn: you can have a little sun and feel healthy, but too much directly on your skin burns you. So we carry shade with us. Or sharks: we know how they are, they can't help it, it 's their nature to eat us, but we avoid their presence and energy. It would be really stupid to say, " Oh, I'm a liberated woman. I can go anywhere I want, wear anything I want, do anything I want and I want to be with sharks. Naked. " Ok. Cause and effect is inevitable! Too bad. We warned you!
Rinpoche is gay is what he is trying to say..no big deal ! He is Human before monk. wHt if BUDDHA RETURNED AS FEMALE GAY OR BI..WOULD U ACCEPT ???
No thats not true...no one cares...he has an open heart and thats all that matters
@enigma Being gay is not misconduct.
@@dublinphotoart having sex is
Of course he would.
No, we would not.
With due respect Rinpoche ...I have fully admired your Wisdom and the Teachings of Buddha and Boddisatvas ..I was watching your Talks at some University ...
I know you have studied and have known much about the Buddhism ...I just if you could get better with the English Language ......bcoz I noticed in other videos you get stucks often thinking about the Question ..which Audience raised ......
Anyways ..Thank you
Better than my Bhutanese😉
His English is far better than yours buddy.
Dzongsar Khyentse Rinpoche speaks about "truth". And then he say homosexuality is not "a disease". So, is that statement the absolute and universal truth (which we did not know some decades ago)? Or is it just a conditional truth of the decadent western culture of our age? I see this way: when he say homosexuality is not a disease that is not the truth of all approved universally, only his own opinion which he shares with the like-minded people.
DKR speaks approvingly about the different kinf of sexual orientations, but he mention only straights, gays and lesbians. Why he dont mention the animal lovers for example or the adult men who like to do sex with minor girls? They are sexual orientations, too. He pronounces we must not tolerate, but respect homosexuals. This sounds strange. Why we would respect any person cause of his sexual orientation, no matter if she/he is straight or gay.
(If we live in a city and there is heavy metal concert in the park near our place and a lot of noise in the late night - we can tolerate that. Outdoor conserts are a part of modern city life. But why we would give special respect to the ones who like this kind of music and happenings?)
When we speak about homosexuality it is not a question of tolerating or respect gays. It is nowadays also a case of gay marriage. Is gay marriage organic way of life for real and truly or, just weird copy of straight marriage? Gays says they have right to get married. Many others says children has right to have a father and mother. So, which direction Khyentse Rinpoche heads his compassion and respect in this contradictory situation?
+bongomorya Since Buddhism is all about exploring truth, you might like to ask him if you met. You do have some legitimate concerns though.
Grow up man. 'The decadent West'? Please use arguments instead of generalising groups of people and cultures...
Also Buddhism is not against gay, lesbian, queer or any kind of sexual orientation. Buddhism does have a problem with attachment. Maybe you should let go of your attachment to certain views.