Honestly, I can see the Hero of Time being really protective over his kids- not wanting them to be called to battle or heroism as young as he was, probably not wanting them to suffer the life of a hero at all, forgoing teaching them the way of the sword. I like to think he married and raised his kids probably to teenhood or young adulthood, then some sort of disaster struck and he went to battle as he always has- only not making it home this time. And I can see him regretting choosing not to prepare his descendants for the incoming battles he knew they'd eventually face being the blood of the hero. But that's just my head canon. Great compilation by the way and solid theories!
I agree, The Hero of Time wouldn’t want his kids to go through what he did as the life of a hero when it was deemed unnecessary in a time of peace. My head canon deviates from yours a bit, instead of him dying in battle, I think in the end the “the cruel flow of time” got him in the end, dying of old age, and he would come back as the hero’s shade out of a sense of duty to help his descendant finish the job he couldn’t in his time.
The worst part of being a huge zelda nerd is finding an awesome huge theory compilation video from one of your fav zeldatubers and then find out you’ve already watched and deepdived every theory in it. I spend way too much time on these channels….
Rewatching these theories takes me back to when I was going through a tough time and first started watching them 4 years ago because it kept my mind off of what was going on. And it made love the zelda series more🥹❤️
The Abandoned Timeline should absolutely be more famous. It works pretty much perfectly and should be accepted as "canon" unless there are any glaring flaws. After all, Hyrule Historia and the Encyclopedia have plenty of places where it's interpretation (not saying to fully discredit them). The games take first priority, and you solved the timeline issue years ago using just the games! It's incredible
The Abandoned Timeline has a flaw, namely, it doesn't contain Link's initial defeat of Ganondorf before the tower collapses. That's the event that transforms Ganondorf into Ganon. Without that event, Ganondorf would still be GanonDORF like he is in the Child Timeline. But he definitely is GANON in the Fallen Timeline, so that timeline must somehow contain that event. This is the real crux of the issue. Link has to defeat Ganondorf, but then fail to defeat Ganon. Since we can safely assume the guy chosen by the Triforce of Courage wouldn't run away from the fight, the most reasonable solution is that Ganon defeated Link, and thus the Fallen Timeline is a 'what-if' timeline as is described in the official material. If I had to come up with a theory to explain the Fallen Timeline without it being a 'what-if' timeline, I would say that it is like a "Groundhog Day" style of time travel. This would mean Link fought Ganon and lost; this event actually occurred diegetically in the Zelda world, not just as a gameplay element for the player in the real world; but then Link mysteriously woke up 24 hours earlier and decided he'd better find those last few Heart Pieces after all. That's basically what happens to this exact Link in Majora's Mask, after all.
No it doesn't work cause the sages need to be awakened if they aren't then there is no one to do the imprisoning war and they can't just awaken themselves cause they specifically needed adult link to help them
The biggest issue is that the original timeline wasn't ever the childtimeline, it was the adult timeline. The abandonment that takes place lasts for seven years and then adult link arrives. For the theory to be correct the abandoned timeline would need to split off not just from the child timeline, but also from the adult timeline, and from what we see it just doesn't.
There was another Theorist who proposed that the Dowfall Timeline was the Original Timeline. Originally, Zelda did not have any prophetic dreams warning her of the storm from the west or heralding the light of hope from the fairy forrest. Link also didn't have his nightmares about meeting Ganondorf. There was nobody to oppose Ganondorf and he was able to cheat and intrigue his way through Hyrule to find the Ocarina and the secrets of how to open the Temple of Time. But touching the Triforce, caused it to split up. The Imprisonment War broke out, during which Link, now in posession of the Triforce of Courage, was able to awaken the Sages but ultimately failed, and Ganondorf was driven back into the Sacret Realm and sealed. At the very end of the Downfall Timeline, Link and Zelda make a wish on the Completed Triforce to protect Hyrule from Evil. This wish sent the prohetic dreams to Past Zelda and the Link who would become the Hero of Time.
you know, after Twilight Princess, you would think that Link would be like "hey, so.... apparently this is a thing that happens a decent bit, perhaps I should make certain my kids, my kid's kids, ect grow up learning swordsmanship" and in the next game in the time line it becomes a bad case of Gannon vs Hawkeye Miawk, where Gannon isnt using a sword, but using the "run and gun" style of sorcery until backed into a corner, and goes into this godzilla looking form he always ends up in lol
26:11 "Kasuto" is meant to be "Cast". It's another legendary mistranslation in Zelda 2. It's where you learn to cast "Spell" and "Thunder", the most important spells in the game. Hope that helps!
I've always played the games and enjoyed the story they told, but I never really paid too much attention to the deep lore they presented. Your videos have deepend my love for the franchise and the fascinating mysteries contained within.
Happy birthday! I actually remember hearing a theory on The Hero's Shade based on the graveyard puzzle in Hyrule Castle. Very notably, there's a tombstone stating that the "cursed swordsman" rests beneath "a sacred tree." Where do we first meet The Hero's Shade? That's right, in the forest just before that sacred tree full of parasites. That first meeting is also the only time we don't have to summon him ourselves. It could very likely be that the Hero of Time's final resting place is beneath that sacred tree. In conjunction with your other theory on Ordonians being Kokiri, it seems as though Link went back to them at some point. Could even be likely he's the one who showed them it was safe to leave the forest. Perhaps he met his end in battle, was taken back home to Ordon, and was buried beneath their new Forest Temple as the hero he is. Raised a Kokiri and buried as a Kokiri
With the Mido theory, I really like it, but I always thought the kokiri children turned into the Faron woods monkey group in twilight princess. But I also never noticed the name Fado being connected.
Woah! love that you didn't include discontinued or disproven theories, makes it easier 😊 thanks for this! love your videos and love when they're super long too :D
Im pretty sure i watched all of your theorie videos, but the reminder of your logic behind the fallen timeline finally makes sense to me agiain. Also because this in my book fixes the issue with the bottom of the well paradox
Your theory of Zant's neck crack makes total sense, Bandit!!! Yeah like the master sword can't tell the Triforce what to do. Nice and creepy part of the video!!! 👏👏👏👏😁😁😀😀👍👍
Actually, Bandit. When I got the Hyrule historia and first read it. I thought the same thing, Link failed to stop Ganondorf from getting the Triforce. And I didn't find out the real canon thing for awhile, So yours is a million times better then Nintendo's story. Fantastic part of the video!!!! 👍👍👍👍😀😀😀👏👏
Your theory from Kokiri to Ordianin makes sense. The special magic of the Deku tree making them not age, and without him, they turn into normal people, not even hylians. Also, nice Bible reference, too. Super fantastic part of the video!!!! 👍👍👍👍😀😀😁😁👏👏👏👏
A question I have now after rewatching the two master sword theory is, how is the Triforce of Courage able to exist in both timelines? We know the Hero of Time took the Triforce with him since the Hero of Twilight inherited it. But the Triforce of Courage also exists in the adult timeline where the spirit of the hero and the original Master Sword were erased from existence when Zelda sent the Hero to the Child timeline. These things keep me up at night
Neither the Tri-Force nor the Spirit of the Hero were erased for the Child Timeline. Some of you seem to forget Zelda is not Science Fiction, but Fantasy. Time travel rules aren't as rigid when you have divine beings and relics involved.
Happy Birthday, Bandit! Insight for the first theory, if we look at the opening for Windwaker, it shows the Master Sword in the Hero of Time’s hand as he rides off with the Triforce of Courage behind him in the panel that tells of the Hero’s departure. I think that this further proves the theory you have told to us here because if the Master Sword had been the same one used in both Ocarina of Time and Wind Waker, it should have also been left behind with the piece of the Triforce. It also additionally proves your understanding of the events between games, because if this “Mural” opening was created by the residence of Hyrule/Great Sea (hard to date something like that) it would also prove that people had understood that the sword was taken away from the Land as well. I don’t know if this was something you picked up on, but I thought about leaving it here in case it wasn’t. Here’s to another year of Theory crafting!
Something to note in the theory for Mido's Fate. The Echoes of Wisdom falls in the downfall timeline and does have a Deku Tree. This doesn't invalidate the theory however, just the wording you provided. I know at the time the game wasn't out yet but something to add to the theory as we see the Deku tree and no Kokiri. This does mean that the Hero of Time must have at least ensured the Deku Sprout's growth before his defeat.
Yes!!! I'm all for reuploads as a longer video, combining multiple shorter videos! Thank you for not including anything newer, related to TOTK..... I have to sadly admit that I have yet to finish that game (I have been doing a 100% for all side things since release & have been afraid to complete it & end up being disappointed lol).
I remember seeing a Zelda iceberg from 2020, where the person was talking about alot of things related to the franchise but i remember one of the last entries in the Iceberg. It was a fan theory entry called "The gap between dimensions" theory. The theory talks about how Phantom Ganon from OoT is actually a being that can travel through time and space, and the Phantom Ganon from Wind Waker is actually the same from Ocarina. But thats not all, apparently the theory also says that the writting in Phantom G's blade in WW has mentions of Termina, which suggest that after Link defeated Phantom G in OOT he traveled to some time in Termina and asked the blacksmiths in Snowhead to forge the blade that he then uses to try and defeat Toon Link in Wind Waker. Theres proly provlems with this theory and points that go against it, and its ofc a fan theory so its meant to not be taken literally and canon. But it has stuck out to me for nearly 4 years now.
First time hearing the two Master Sword theory and, I believe it. If some games feature the sword mostly the same and appear largely in the same place across them, then appears in a different place, looking different, entirely different in every way, then it seems to me like the one from Wind Waker is not the same Master Sword from the other games.
I've never heard the abandoned timeline theory, and I must say I like it. It wraps up OOT as being the time split with a nice little bow without the infinite fallen timelines where Link fails. It means that Zelda dooms two timelines... the adult line where she severs the Hero's Line by sending Link away and dooming the world to a flood, and the abandoned timeline where Link doesn't return to at the end of OOT. All because she made a foolish, panicked choice as a kid and threw the ocarina into the river for Link. Not like the child timeline is much better... Twilight Princess reveals that Ganondorf slayed the Sage of Water during his execution... which would be around the time that Princess Ruto became the sage of water. Any timeline without her is a timeline not worth having.
The only problem with your Abandoned Timeline theory is that realistically, that timeline wasnt abandoned, its the timeline that becomes the Adult Timeline and does, at least until the 7 year seal is elapsed, contains a version of Link, just sealed within the sacred realm until he has grown. The Fallen Timeline is one of many very frustrating issue with Time Travel in the LoZ series as a whole, because the mechanics of Time Travel within the series don't follow the same rules every time, even within their same game. In most cases of Time Travel within the LoZ, changes to the past immediately effect the future, plant a Magic Bean, you get a magical hover plant thing. use the song of time to move a block in the past, moves the block in the future. Both those examples are in OoT, so Time Travel has a cause and effect mechanic, at least in regards to Link's manipulation of time. The exceptions to this rule are the notorious Song of Storms Paradox, the Gauntlets mentioned in your theory, and Zelda's manipulation of time. But beyond those instances, Time Travel within OoT follows the same rules every time. the Time Travel in Skyward Sword follows similar rules, changes to the past effect the world of the future....except when they don't. When Zelda and Link use the Tri-Force to drop Skyloft on the Imprisoned, they effectively kill the present version of Demise, but then Girahim kidnaps Zelda back into the past and uses her to reawaken Demise in that time period. Link then proceeds to kill Demise there and then, resulting in Demise's death in the past, long before Skyloft can be dropped on him to kill him in Link and Zelda's present. This creates its own, very frustrating paradox, and should by all right result in its own Timeline Split. Time Travel also functions differently and very frustratingly in Oracle of Ages, where most changes to the past change the present immediately, with the sole exception of the Dark Tower's construction. Personal frustrations with LoZ Time Travel mechanics aside, and back to the Fallen Timeline. I personally have my own theory. So, the Fallen Timeline states that Link specifically fails fighting Ganondorf, meaning Link has to get to Ganondorf in the first place, which would imply that his entire quest happened as we play it. Yet despite that, two characters that should be dead by the time Ganondorf and Link fight appear later in the Fallen Timeline; Koume and Kotake both appear in a linked Oracle game. So in order for the Fallen Timeline to exist properly, Ganondorf not only needs to defeat Link and gain the full Tri-Force, but Koume and Kotake both need to survive, meaning that Link cant have defeated them in the Spirit Temple. Your theory would account for them still being alive, but again technically speaking that abandoned point in time still has a Link sealed in the Sacred Realm and eventually becomes the Adult Timeline. So, my own theory is that the Fallen Timeline is the Prime Timeline, the original history. Think Dragon Ball Z, the future that Trunks comes from is technically speaking the original true timeline, and the time he travels to becomes an altered alternate history because of his meddling. I propose that something similar occurs here. When Link pulls the Master Sword in the Temple of Time for the first time he is sealed away for 7 years because he is "not old enough' to be considered worthy to wield the Master Sword. This is the only time we have seen the Master Sword operate in this way. No other Link has ever been sealed away by the Master Sword like this to make them worthy, not even Wind Waker Link who was clearly younger than adult OoT Link. But there is someone, someone associated with time within the Sacred Realm at the time Link pulls the sword, Rauru, the Sage of Time. I propose that in the original course of events that when Link pulled the Master Sword he was not sealed away, but remained a child and confronted Ganondorf when he came to invade the Sacred Realm to claim the Tri-Force, and this is when he falls, this is his defeat. He was too young, too inexperienced to challenge a grown man and accomplished sorcerer. And so he lost, right when he got the Master Sword. This leaves Zelda alone to gather the Sages and confront Ganondorf, but she fails too, at least initially, as Ganondorf his able to take from her the Tri-Force of Wisdom, having already acquired the other two after his defeat of Link. The Imprisoning War then erupts with Hyrule combating the dark forces of the Demon King Ganon, fully empowered by the Tri-Force. Eventually he is defeated and sealed within the Sacred Realm. But the Sages and Zelda lament the war, the grievous losses, and Zelda with the Ocarina of Time and Rauru's guidance, decides to send a message back, back to a younger Rauru, who, when Link comes to claim the Master Sword, will be the one to actually seal Link away until he is better able to challenge Ganondorf.
Regarding the Downfall Timeline: Going by an old theory of VortexxyGaming-God rest her soul-the Downfall Timeline was THE original timeline. But a Zelda further down that timeline, possibly the one from original LoZ or AoL, used the TriForce to change the past which led to the child and adult timelines.
The two master swords theory just makes me feel even more bad for toon link, bros not the chosen one, just some random boy, and to top it off, he doesn’t even get his own proper master sword lol. Bro the equivalent of putting your toddler in a basket and pretending it’s a roller coaster when it comes to being “the Hero”. Still straight up kills ganondorf in one of the cleanest deaths in the franchise, so there’s that going for him.
In Twilight Princess, Rusl is Link´s uncle which means Rusl IS a direct descendant of the Hero of Time, so he´s also a descendant of Malon and he´s a pretty skilled fighter. He defended Ordon Village from a whole monster invasion! What an absolute goat and a badass! Also this also means Colin is a descendant of the Hero of Time and Malon.
I doubt the Downfall Timeline happens at any point where you could've died. I believe it's what happens if Link was killed SPECIFICALLY when Ganon knocks the MasterSword from his hand after transforming at the end, but instead of you recovering the sword and defeating him, Link's defeated without the sword in his possession, and as the sword is the key to time in the game, it not being in his possession upon his death broke the timeline, causing a split at that very moment.
If the imprisoning war is part of the fallen hero timeline which was an extremely important topic in tears of the kingdom than wouldn't the timeline for breath of the wild and tears of the kingdom be the fallen timeline.
Imagine living for like 100 years as a child due to immortality to suddenly hit puperty with all its fun side effects. But i do have one issue with this theory. IF the kokiri started aging after the deku tree died, why where they still children when link returned 7 years in the future timeline? Shouldnt they have aged at least a bit by that point, 7 years later as well?
Regarding the Hero's Shade: if the hero if time was sent back in time to before the king of hyrule was killed, appearing in the master sword chamber at a point before you get there in game, doesn't that mean there are two Links at that point? The Hero of Time at the end of his adventure and the Kokiri raised Link who no longer has an adventure to go on. So Twilight Link isn't the descendant of the Hero of Time, but the Kokiri raised Link who never had to be a hero in the first place, right?
Rewatching a compilation of great theories-what more could you ask for? That said, not all of them hold up entirely. Take the Abandoned Timeline, for instance: while I absolutely love it, the split between the Adult and Child timelines isn’t actually caused by time travel itself. As Zelda explains in Ocarina of Time, it’s the closing of the Door of Time that triggers the split. Still, I have to admit-it makes way more sense than the official explanation! That said, I personally believe the Hero is Defeated timeline could stem from the time travel in Twilight Princess, potentially leading to a point before Ocarina of Time. This idea wouldn’t contradict canon, as the Door of Time is also closed in Twilight Princess, which would lead into the creation of a timeline split much like the one between the Adult and Child eras.
My thoughts on each thoery 2 master swords theory - Ganondorf seems much more in control over his dark powers in the windwaker vs other games, usually going into a beastial form at least 1 point in other games. Explaining why a lesser blade then the true master sword could kill ganondorf. He wasn't using the demons power, but his own magics. The sages must sacrificed their powers in order to create the blade explaining why only 2 sages remained to maintain the power in the blade. Mido's fate - I believe Mido decided to create ordon village after oot in the child timeline. In the downfall timeline, Id like there to be a manga detailing Mido's rise to war hero. Neck crack - pretty much agree, I think they had a point of showing that the triforce could be willingly given but not forcefully taken. Abandoned Timeline - Well thought out, Im tempted to take this as my own head canon. Who killed the hero of Time - Im gunna have to consult a medieval armor expert on this one, but sounds very plausible. Ordon Village - I think you're spot on, but why not both? Some kokiri may have stayed within the deku tree and sourounding trees and others fled. Both monkeys and ordonians could both be descendants.
Abandoned/downfall The timeline that was a result of Link going back-and-forth via use of the master sword; and Link never returning back to that timeline The child and adult timelines are a direct result of Zelda and her use of the Ocarina The use of the Ocarina and sending Link back creates the additional 3rd alternate (child) timeline, separate from the Masters Swords original "child" timeline
When looking at all the designs of the master sword: TP, SS, BOTW/ TOTK actually look the same; OOT looks slightly different form the mentioned games above (could be a design factor from the years), WW master sword kinda looks like OOT master sword even tho it looks slightly different from it, not gonna talk about the fell timeline. This is me talking as a designer myself, as a theorist I don’t know what to say at all lol.
Would the two Master Swords theory not confirm that BotW and TotK take place in the child timeline? Or, I suppose a better recreation might’ve just been made in the first enormous time since whatever game came before.
The Deku didn't sprout in the adult timeline because of Ganondorf messing with the forest and forest temple. In the child timeline Link wouldnt have saved the forest temple but it also wouldnt have been afflicted. So the need isn't exactly necessary either. So one can assume that the new tree would have just sprouted on its own. A lot of people always say the bit about how in the child timeline Link never did such and such event. Nothing was stopping him from going to take care of those things as he got older. The only thing that would have stopped him would be if he actually died during the events of Majora's Mask. Like the "Link is dead" theory states. I know you don't follow that belief. But I haven't ruled it out entirely. People say that the Hero's Shade is too old to be Ocarina of Time Link if he died as a child. But that's not true. The Hero's Shade is the SPIRIT of the Hero of Time. In the child timeline, Link's spirit/soul would be older than his body appeared. Because the spirit isn't tied to his physical form. Just like the mind and memories aren't tied to his physical body/brain. We KNOW this because if it were then any time he went back in time during the game then he wouldnt have knowledge of anything that occurred in the future. Because those memories hadn't been formed yet. So in a way, he was aging internally but not externally. This means his soul would be older than his body looked. Which means he COULD have died in the forest pursuing the Skull Kid. But I'm not here to talk about this theory. This is about the Deku Tree. The only thing that probably didn't happen in the child timeline is stuff like getting the silver gauntlets. Because there would have been no need to do so in that timeline. So certain artifacts may not have moved. But any specific event of something heroic needing to have happened could have still happened so long as you don't believe that Link died during the direct sequel of the game. In fact if he didn't die during that game then he may have died trying to do one of those tasks since he no longer had the Master Sword to do so. Meaning maybe he died in the forest temple trying to clear it out as an adult without the Master Sword and got killed. That would actually satisfy the criteria for him being killed AND the new Deku Tree not sprouting.
The fallen timeline is only hard to understand if you don't accept the multiverse theory, which is a factual part of the Zelda series. Yes, that means that every potentiality creates it's own split. But guess what? there aren't games for every single one. Their story isn't told. That's why they're not as readily acknowledged. Like, what if Link hadn't been brought to the Kokiri forest? What if He had never gotten past Mido? Or if Saria had been killed before becoming a sage? They're just unexplored stories. Doesn't mean they don't happen.
hi bandit, I saw a post the other day and it was of the hero of time and twilight with modna and navi, and it got me thinking. you know how the interlopers were a group banished to the twilight realm, what if they were the kokiri and fairies, or just the fairies, and they rebeled after the great deku tree died and ganandwarf was fleeing back to gerudo? I know that the timing is kinda off but it would be another answer to the missing kokiri and fairies I mean its a slim chance just something I thought of lol
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
It's my birthday guys go easy on my pronunciations over the years-
Also... thank you, so much, for all the years. Here's to many more!
Happy birthday
Happy birthday
@@casparfangHappy Birthday! 🎉
Happy birthday Bandit
Happy birthday dude!!
Honestly, I can see the Hero of Time being really protective over his kids- not wanting them to be called to battle or heroism as young as he was, probably not wanting them to suffer the life of a hero at all, forgoing teaching them the way of the sword. I like to think he married and raised his kids probably to teenhood or young adulthood, then some sort of disaster struck and he went to battle as he always has- only not making it home this time. And I can see him regretting choosing not to prepare his descendants for the incoming battles he knew they'd eventually face being the blood of the hero. But that's just my head canon. Great compilation by the way and solid theories!
I agree, The Hero of Time wouldn’t want his kids to go through what he did as the life of a hero when it was deemed unnecessary in a time of peace. My head canon deviates from yours a bit, instead of him dying in battle, I think in the end the “the cruel flow of time” got him in the end, dying of old age, and he would come back as the hero’s shade out of a sense of duty to help his descendant finish the job he couldn’t in his time.
1 hour of bliss
Ngl, I thought this comment said 1 hours of balls when I first read it
A bot...
Not ads too , literal bliss
Agreed!! 👍👍
Wtf robin Williams dies
Ganondorf sitting there thinking "I'd rather not die" kills me every time I see it
Oh I'm saving this one. It will be *perfect* for my next long drive.
The worst part of being a huge zelda nerd is finding an awesome huge theory compilation video from one of your fav zeldatubers and then find out you’ve already watched and deepdived every theory in it. I spend way too much time on these channels….
Rewatching these theories takes me back to when I was going through a tough time and first started watching them 4 years ago because it kept my mind off of what was going on. And it made love the zelda series more🥹❤️
Same here...I wish we still had as much theories as before.
The Abandoned Timeline should absolutely be more famous. It works pretty much perfectly and should be accepted as "canon" unless there are any glaring flaws. After all, Hyrule Historia and the Encyclopedia have plenty of places where it's interpretation (not saying to fully discredit them). The games take first priority, and you solved the timeline issue years ago using just the games! It's incredible
The Abandoned Timeline has a flaw, namely, it doesn't contain Link's initial defeat of Ganondorf before the tower collapses. That's the event that transforms Ganondorf into Ganon. Without that event, Ganondorf would still be GanonDORF like he is in the Child Timeline. But he definitely is GANON in the Fallen Timeline, so that timeline must somehow contain that event.
This is the real crux of the issue. Link has to defeat Ganondorf, but then fail to defeat Ganon. Since we can safely assume the guy chosen by the Triforce of Courage wouldn't run away from the fight, the most reasonable solution is that Ganon defeated Link, and thus the Fallen Timeline is a 'what-if' timeline as is described in the official material.
If I had to come up with a theory to explain the Fallen Timeline without it being a 'what-if' timeline, I would say that it is like a "Groundhog Day" style of time travel. This would mean Link fought Ganon and lost; this event actually occurred diegetically in the Zelda world, not just as a gameplay element for the player in the real world; but then Link mysteriously woke up 24 hours earlier and decided he'd better find those last few Heart Pieces after all. That's basically what happens to this exact Link in Majora's Mask, after all.
No it doesn't work cause the sages need to be awakened if they aren't then there is no one to do the imprisoning war and they can't just awaken themselves cause they specifically needed adult link to help them
The biggest issue is that the original timeline wasn't ever the childtimeline, it was the adult timeline. The abandonment that takes place lasts for seven years and then adult link arrives. For the theory to be correct the abandoned timeline would need to split off not just from the child timeline, but also from the adult timeline, and from what we see it just doesn't.
There was another Theorist who proposed that the Dowfall Timeline was the Original Timeline.
Originally, Zelda did not have any prophetic dreams warning her of the storm from the west or heralding the light of hope from the fairy forrest. Link also didn't have his nightmares about meeting Ganondorf.
There was nobody to oppose Ganondorf and he was able to cheat and intrigue his way through Hyrule to find the Ocarina and the secrets of how to open the Temple of Time. But touching the Triforce, caused it to split up.
The Imprisonment War broke out, during which Link, now in posession of the Triforce of Courage, was able to awaken the Sages but ultimately failed, and Ganondorf was driven back into the Sacret Realm and sealed.
At the very end of the Downfall Timeline, Link and Zelda make a wish on the Completed Triforce to protect Hyrule from Evil. This wish sent the prohetic dreams to Past Zelda and the Link who would become the Hero of Time.
Yeah great idea of video!!! Thank you!!!
And HAPPY BIRTHDAY JORDAN 🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
Bandit: Theres no lore to Totk
Also bandit: 1 hour of lore/theories.
On other Zelda games yeah. Point still stands. Totk lore sucks complete ass
@@tylmf I would say it doesn't, the Totk lore just doesn't fit into Zelda lore that good but the lore on its own is pretty good
Reposting videos that were made before TOTK and have nothing to do with TOTK...
@@tylmf there's lore, he just doesn't want to go over it.
“The neck is a pretty sensitive area for most people” implies that it’s not for Bandit 😂 26:34
Happy Birthday Bandit!! I'm glad that you did a theory recap since I haven't seen them all and it's nice to have them all in one bundle.
Ah, the two Master Sword theory, the theory that really made me a fan of this channel.
Happy birthday man !!!! Much love to you and your content ❤❤❤ keep doing it !!!!
needed this today youtube been dry lately. happy birthday!
Absolutely amazing video. The care and work effort clearly shows in this video and grabs the hearts of true Zelda fans.
Happy Birthday!! I’m totally going to listen to this before sleeping, it’s both interesting and relaxing : )
I like to think that the temple of time dungeon is happening at the same time as OOT, that's why the Master Sword isn't there
it just feels cooler ig
One hour of theories and one hour since post?! Coincidence? I think not.
you know, after Twilight Princess, you would think that Link would be like "hey, so.... apparently this is a thing that happens a decent bit, perhaps I should make certain my kids, my kid's kids, ect grow up learning swordsmanship" and in the next game in the time line it becomes a bad case of Gannon vs Hawkeye Miawk, where Gannon isnt using a sword, but using the "run and gun" style of sorcery until backed into a corner, and goes into this godzilla looking form he always ends up in lol
26:11 "Kasuto" is meant to be "Cast". It's another legendary mistranslation in Zelda 2. It's where you learn to cast "Spell" and "Thunder", the most important spells in the game. Hope that helps!
30 seconds in I already appreciate that you indicated that the disproved theories have been curated, and that this is only volume one.
Opened up the app, said out loud “hmm what theory shall I listen to?”, Bandits video was at the top…perfect!
I've always played the games and enjoyed the story they told, but I never really paid too much attention to the deep lore they presented. Your videos have deepend my love for the franchise and the fascinating mysteries contained within.
Happy birthday! I actually remember hearing a theory on The Hero's Shade based on the graveyard puzzle in Hyrule Castle. Very notably, there's a tombstone stating that the "cursed swordsman" rests beneath "a sacred tree." Where do we first meet The Hero's Shade? That's right, in the forest just before that sacred tree full of parasites. That first meeting is also the only time we don't have to summon him ourselves. It could very likely be that the Hero of Time's final resting place is beneath that sacred tree. In conjunction with your other theory on Ordonians being Kokiri, it seems as though Link went back to them at some point. Could even be likely he's the one who showed them it was safe to leave the forest. Perhaps he met his end in battle, was taken back home to Ordon, and was buried beneath their new Forest Temple as the hero he is. Raised a Kokiri and buried as a Kokiri
I saw the double sword theory in my recommended eariler this week, it's not completely forgotten.
With the Mido theory, I really like it, but I always thought the kokiri children turned into the Faron woods monkey group in twilight princess. But I also never noticed the name Fado being connected.
55:06 The Great Deku tree is Elohim and both of the forbidden trees of Eden at the same time.
Woah! love that you didn't include discontinued or disproven theories, makes it easier 😊 thanks for this! love your videos and love when they're super long too :D
I have a hard time right now, but your Zelda theories keep me hanging on! Thank you!❤
Twilight princess is so creepy and disturbing
Thanks for the christmas present. Listening to this while i revisit the game and grind some shrines for my vacation off work
It’s been a while guys but yk what that means time to binge all the bandit vids before Christmas🔥
Thanks daddy
Finally another Zelda video!! I forgot about your channel bro
Thanks real BANDIT 👀👀👀👀
Im pretty sure i watched all of your theorie videos, but the reminder of your logic behind the fallen timeline finally makes sense to me agiain. Also because this in my book fixes the issue with the bottom of the well paradox
Happy birthday Bandit, hope it was a good one 🤘
Happy Birthday!!
About to go to bed, gonna listen to this
No one can intro like Bandit can intro. Wish ya well my guy!
Happy Birthday
Your version of the fallen timeline definitely makes more sense than the official version. It explains why there are 3 timelines, no more and no less.
happy belated birthday. Thanks for your great content. ❤🎉🎉🎉
Dude, I dunno why, but Mido's last lines really screwed with me. Can't believe this little turd got me tearing up...
I never wanted to hear of this bandit hack again 😤 but these theories were all great!
Been listening to your theories since before your RUclips channel but enjoyed it everytime!
Your theory of Zant's neck crack makes total sense, Bandit!!! Yeah like the master sword can't tell the Triforce what to do. Nice and creepy part of the video!!! 👏👏👏👏😁😁😀😀👍👍
Actually, Bandit. When I got the Hyrule historia and first read it. I thought the same thing, Link failed to stop Ganondorf from getting the Triforce. And I didn't find out the real canon thing for awhile, So yours is a million times better then Nintendo's story. Fantastic part of the video!!!! 👍👍👍👍😀😀😀👏👏
Your theory from Kokiri to Ordianin makes sense. The special magic of the Deku tree making them not age, and without him, they turn into normal people, not even hylians. Also, nice Bible reference, too. Super fantastic part of the video!!!! 👍👍👍👍😀😀😁😁👏👏👏👏
A question I have now after rewatching the two master sword theory is, how is the Triforce of Courage able to exist in both timelines? We know the Hero of Time took the Triforce with him since the Hero of Twilight inherited it. But the Triforce of Courage also exists in the adult timeline where the spirit of the hero and the original Master Sword were erased from existence when Zelda sent the Hero to the Child timeline. These things keep me up at night
Neither the Tri-Force nor the Spirit of the Hero were erased for the Child Timeline. Some of you seem to forget Zelda is not Science Fiction, but Fantasy. Time travel rules aren't as rigid when you have divine beings and relics involved.
This, this is amazing.
Happy Birthday, Bandit!
Insight for the first theory, if we look at the opening for Windwaker, it shows the Master Sword in the Hero of Time’s hand as he rides off with the Triforce of Courage behind him in the panel that tells of the Hero’s departure. I think that this further proves the theory you have told to us here because if the Master Sword had been the same one used in both Ocarina of Time and Wind Waker, it should have also been left behind with the piece of the Triforce. It also additionally proves your understanding of the events between games, because if this “Mural” opening was created by the residence of Hyrule/Great Sea (hard to date something like that) it would also prove that people had understood that the sword was taken away from the Land as well. I don’t know if this was something you picked up on, but I thought about leaving it here in case it wasn’t. Here’s to another year of Theory crafting!
It's definitely possible.
Imo, since the Master Sword is timeless, it makes sense if it is also the same Master Sword.
Something to note in the theory for Mido's Fate. The Echoes of Wisdom falls in the downfall timeline and does have a Deku Tree. This doesn't invalidate the theory however, just the wording you provided. I know at the time the game wasn't out yet but something to add to the theory as we see the Deku tree and no Kokiri. This does mean that the Hero of Time must have at least ensured the Deku Sprout's growth before his defeat.
instantly clicked when i saw this in my recommendations. I will be sleeping good tonight
Yes!!! I'm all for reuploads as a longer video, combining multiple shorter videos!
Thank you for not including anything newer, related to TOTK..... I have to sadly admit that I have yet to finish that game (I have been doing a 100% for all side things since release & have been afraid to complete it & end up being disappointed lol).
truly enjoyed this!
Happy birthday man! However I belive dark link was the water temples test as it was built to test heroes.
Love this video, please make more compilations!
I remember seeing a Zelda iceberg from 2020, where the person was talking about alot of things related to the franchise but i remember one of the last entries in the Iceberg. It was a fan theory entry called "The gap between dimensions" theory. The theory talks about how Phantom Ganon from OoT is actually a being that can travel through time and space, and the Phantom Ganon from Wind Waker is actually the same from Ocarina.
But thats not all, apparently the theory also says that the writting in Phantom G's blade in WW has mentions of Termina, which suggest that after Link defeated Phantom G in OOT he traveled to some time in Termina and asked the blacksmiths in Snowhead to forge the blade that he then uses to try and defeat Toon Link in Wind Waker.
Theres proly provlems with this theory and points that go against it, and its ofc a fan theory so its meant to not be taken literally and canon. But it has stuck out to me for nearly 4 years now.
I didn’t know I needed this
First time hearing the two Master Sword theory and, I believe it. If some games feature the sword mostly the same and appear largely in the same place across them, then appears in a different place, looking different, entirely different in every way, then it seems to me like the one from Wind Waker is not the same Master Sword from the other games.
I've never heard the abandoned timeline theory, and I must say I like it. It wraps up OOT as being the time split with a nice little bow without the infinite fallen timelines where Link fails. It means that Zelda dooms two timelines... the adult line where she severs the Hero's Line by sending Link away and dooming the world to a flood, and the abandoned timeline where Link doesn't return to at the end of OOT. All because she made a foolish, panicked choice as a kid and threw the ocarina into the river for Link. Not like the child timeline is much better... Twilight Princess reveals that Ganondorf slayed the Sage of Water during his execution... which would be around the time that Princess Ruto became the sage of water. Any timeline without her is a timeline not worth having.
The only problem with your Abandoned Timeline theory is that realistically, that timeline wasnt abandoned, its the timeline that becomes the Adult Timeline and does, at least until the 7 year seal is elapsed, contains a version of Link, just sealed within the sacred realm until he has grown. The Fallen Timeline is one of many very frustrating issue with Time Travel in the LoZ series as a whole, because the mechanics of Time Travel within the series don't follow the same rules every time, even within their same game. In most cases of Time Travel within the LoZ, changes to the past immediately effect the future, plant a Magic Bean, you get a magical hover plant thing. use the song of time to move a block in the past, moves the block in the future. Both those examples are in OoT, so Time Travel has a cause and effect mechanic, at least in regards to Link's manipulation of time. The exceptions to this rule are the notorious Song of Storms Paradox, the Gauntlets mentioned in your theory, and Zelda's manipulation of time. But beyond those instances, Time Travel within OoT follows the same rules every time. the Time Travel in Skyward Sword follows similar rules, changes to the past effect the world of the future....except when they don't. When Zelda and Link use the Tri-Force to drop Skyloft on the Imprisoned, they effectively kill the present version of Demise, but then Girahim kidnaps Zelda back into the past and uses her to reawaken Demise in that time period. Link then proceeds to kill Demise there and then, resulting in Demise's death in the past, long before Skyloft can be dropped on him to kill him in Link and Zelda's present. This creates its own, very frustrating paradox, and should by all right result in its own Timeline Split. Time Travel also functions differently and very frustratingly in Oracle of Ages, where most changes to the past change the present immediately, with the sole exception of the Dark Tower's construction.
Personal frustrations with LoZ Time Travel mechanics aside, and back to the Fallen Timeline. I personally have my own theory. So, the Fallen Timeline states that Link specifically fails fighting Ganondorf, meaning Link has to get to Ganondorf in the first place, which would imply that his entire quest happened as we play it. Yet despite that, two characters that should be dead by the time Ganondorf and Link fight appear later in the Fallen Timeline; Koume and Kotake both appear in a linked Oracle game. So in order for the Fallen Timeline to exist properly, Ganondorf not only needs to defeat Link and gain the full Tri-Force, but Koume and Kotake both need to survive, meaning that Link cant have defeated them in the Spirit Temple. Your theory would account for them still being alive, but again technically speaking that abandoned point in time still has a Link sealed in the Sacred Realm and eventually becomes the Adult Timeline.
So, my own theory is that the Fallen Timeline is the Prime Timeline, the original history. Think Dragon Ball Z, the future that Trunks comes from is technically speaking the original true timeline, and the time he travels to becomes an altered alternate history because of his meddling. I propose that something similar occurs here. When Link pulls the Master Sword in the Temple of Time for the first time he is sealed away for 7 years because he is "not old enough' to be considered worthy to wield the Master Sword. This is the only time we have seen the Master Sword operate in this way. No other Link has ever been sealed away by the Master Sword like this to make them worthy, not even Wind Waker Link who was clearly younger than adult OoT Link. But there is someone, someone associated with time within the Sacred Realm at the time Link pulls the sword, Rauru, the Sage of Time. I propose that in the original course of events that when Link pulled the Master Sword he was not sealed away, but remained a child and confronted Ganondorf when he came to invade the Sacred Realm to claim the Tri-Force, and this is when he falls, this is his defeat. He was too young, too inexperienced to challenge a grown man and accomplished sorcerer. And so he lost, right when he got the Master Sword. This leaves Zelda alone to gather the Sages and confront Ganondorf, but she fails too, at least initially, as Ganondorf his able to take from her the Tri-Force of Wisdom, having already acquired the other two after his defeat of Link. The Imprisoning War then erupts with Hyrule combating the dark forces of the Demon King Ganon, fully empowered by the Tri-Force. Eventually he is defeated and sealed within the Sacred Realm. But the Sages and Zelda lament the war, the grievous losses, and Zelda with the Ocarina of Time and Rauru's guidance, decides to send a message back, back to a younger Rauru, who, when Link comes to claim the Master Sword, will be the one to actually seal Link away until he is better able to challenge Ganondorf.
I clicked because I love but am not currently going to bed so will save for later
My favorite type of video!
Regarding the Downfall Timeline:
Going by an old theory of VortexxyGaming-God rest her soul-the Downfall Timeline was THE original timeline. But a Zelda further down that timeline, possibly the one from original LoZ or AoL, used the TriForce to change the past which led to the child and adult timelines.
Just what I needed
Oh I can’t wait to come back to this after I work
been needing somethin like this
44:33
"Which according to his own words is because he, quote: could not-"
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The two master swords theory just makes me feel even more bad for toon link, bros not the chosen one, just some random boy, and to top it off, he doesn’t even get his own proper master sword lol. Bro the equivalent of putting your toddler in a basket and pretending it’s a roller coaster when it comes to being “the Hero”. Still straight up kills ganondorf in one of the cleanest deaths in the franchise, so there’s that going for him.
In Twilight Princess, Rusl is Link´s uncle which means Rusl IS a direct descendant of the Hero of Time, so he´s also a descendant of Malon and he´s a pretty skilled fighter. He defended Ordon Village from a whole monster invasion! What an absolute goat and a badass! Also this also means Colin is a descendant of the Hero of Time and Malon.
Is it ever explicitly stated their relation? I just played the entire game and don’t recall ever seeing it mentioned that they were blood related
@@mrnoodlr0284 Yes, he´s Link´s Uncle
@ source?
The hero really was defeated. In the Spirit Temple. He had to go back in time.
I doubt the Downfall Timeline happens at any point where you could've died. I believe it's what happens if Link was killed SPECIFICALLY when Ganon knocks the MasterSword from his hand after transforming at the end, but instead of you recovering the sword and defeating him, Link's defeated without the sword in his possession, and as the sword is the key to time in the game, it not being in his possession upon his death broke the timeline, causing a split at that very moment.
If the imprisoning war is part of the fallen hero timeline which was an extremely important topic in tears of the kingdom than wouldn't the timeline for breath of the wild and tears of the kingdom be the fallen timeline.
Imagine living for like 100 years as a child due to immortality to suddenly hit puperty with all its fun side effects. But i do have one issue with this theory. IF the kokiri started aging after the deku tree died, why where they still children when link returned 7 years in the future timeline? Shouldnt they have aged at least a bit by that point, 7 years later as well?
I miss the days when my feed was nothing but Zelda theories
Regarding the Hero's Shade: if the hero if time was sent back in time to before the king of hyrule was killed, appearing in the master sword chamber at a point before you get there in game, doesn't that mean there are two Links at that point? The Hero of Time at the end of his adventure and the Kokiri raised Link who no longer has an adventure to go on. So Twilight Link isn't the descendant of the Hero of Time, but the Kokiri raised Link who never had to be a hero in the first place, right?
1 hour of zelda is a good hour
Rewatching a compilation of great theories-what more could you ask for?
That said, not all of them hold up entirely. Take the Abandoned Timeline, for instance: while I absolutely love it, the split between the Adult and Child timelines isn’t actually caused by time travel itself. As Zelda explains in Ocarina of Time, it’s the closing of the Door of Time that triggers the split. Still, I have to admit-it makes way more sense than the official explanation!
That said, I personally believe the Hero is Defeated timeline could stem from the time travel in Twilight Princess, potentially leading to a point before Ocarina of Time. This idea wouldn’t contradict canon, as the Door of Time is also closed in Twilight Princess, which would lead into the creation of a timeline split much like the one between the Adult and Child eras.
37:42 LMFAO Deecoo stick 😂😂
I thought I wouldn't watch the whole hour. But I did
My thoughts on each thoery
2 master swords theory - Ganondorf seems much more in control over his dark powers in the windwaker vs other games, usually going into a beastial form at least 1 point in other games. Explaining why a lesser blade then the true master sword could kill ganondorf. He wasn't using the demons power, but his own magics. The sages must sacrificed their powers in order to create the blade explaining why only 2 sages remained to maintain the power in the blade.
Mido's fate - I believe Mido decided to create ordon village after oot in the child timeline. In the downfall timeline, Id like there to be a manga detailing Mido's rise to war hero.
Neck crack - pretty much agree, I think they had a point of showing that the triforce could be willingly given but not forcefully taken.
Abandoned Timeline - Well thought out, Im tempted to take this as my own head canon.
Who killed the hero of Time - Im gunna have to consult a medieval armor expert on this one, but sounds very plausible.
Ordon Village - I think you're spot on, but why not both? Some kokiri may have stayed within the deku tree and sourounding trees and others fled. Both monkeys and ordonians could both be descendants.
The Zelda timeline is a blessing and a curse.
MNB: "Twilight Princess came out over 10 years ago."
Me: "It came out almost 20 years ag--ohhh my GOD. 👵🏽😫"
"...even though the game came out over ten years ago."
> Look at the date
> Date is almost 20 years ago
💀
Happy birthday!
seen all of em before and am watching it again
I had a thought recently you might could do a theory on "Who is the sage that Ganondorf spoke with after obtaining the stone" 🤔
Abandoned/downfall
The timeline that was a result of Link going back-and-forth via use of the master sword; and Link never returning back to that timeline
The child and adult timelines are a direct result of Zelda and her use of the Ocarina
The use of the Ocarina and sending Link back creates the additional 3rd alternate (child) timeline, separate from the Masters Swords original "child" timeline
I found the video that I’m gonna fall asleep to😮
Curiously, despite Echo of Wisdom having the Deku tree, there's no kokiri, so it doesn't seem to mess up the Mido theory.
When looking at all the designs of the master sword: TP, SS, BOTW/ TOTK actually look the same; OOT looks slightly different form the mentioned games above (could be a design factor from the years), WW master sword kinda looks like OOT master sword even tho it looks slightly different from it, not gonna talk about the fell timeline. This is me talking as a designer myself, as a theorist I don’t know what to say at all lol.
Would the two Master Swords theory not confirm that BotW and TotK take place in the child timeline?
Or, I suppose a better recreation might’ve just been made in the first enormous time since whatever game came before.
I always interpreted the downfall timeline as Link is killed in general, not necessarily by Ganondorf
Dope thumbnail
#16 mouse in baked beans. 🐁🥫
The Deku didn't sprout in the adult timeline because of Ganondorf messing with the forest and forest temple. In the child timeline Link wouldnt have saved the forest temple but it also wouldnt have been afflicted. So the need isn't exactly necessary either. So one can assume that the new tree would have just sprouted on its own.
A lot of people always say the bit about how in the child timeline Link never did such and such event. Nothing was stopping him from going to take care of those things as he got older. The only thing that would have stopped him would be if he actually died during the events of Majora's Mask. Like the "Link is dead" theory states. I know you don't follow that belief. But I haven't ruled it out entirely.
People say that the Hero's Shade is too old to be Ocarina of Time Link if he died as a child. But that's not true. The Hero's Shade is the SPIRIT of the Hero of Time. In the child timeline, Link's spirit/soul would be older than his body appeared. Because the spirit isn't tied to his physical form. Just like the mind and memories aren't tied to his physical body/brain. We KNOW this because if it were then any time he went back in time during the game then he wouldnt have knowledge of anything that occurred in the future. Because those memories hadn't been formed yet. So in a way, he was aging internally but not externally. This means his soul would be older than his body looked. Which means he COULD have died in the forest pursuing the Skull Kid. But I'm not here to talk about this theory. This is about the Deku Tree. The only thing that probably didn't happen in the child timeline is stuff like getting the silver gauntlets. Because there would have been no need to do so in that timeline. So certain artifacts may not have moved. But any specific event of something heroic needing to have happened could have still happened so long as you don't believe that Link died during the direct sequel of the game. In fact if he didn't die during that game then he may have died trying to do one of those tasks since he no longer had the Master Sword to do so. Meaning maybe he died in the forest temple trying to clear it out as an adult without the Master Sword and got killed. That would actually satisfy the criteria for him being killed AND the new Deku Tree not sprouting.
I minute…the earliest I’ve ever been 😂
The fallen timeline is only hard to understand if you don't accept the multiverse theory, which is a factual part of the Zelda series. Yes, that means that every potentiality creates it's own split. But guess what? there aren't games for every single one. Their story isn't told. That's why they're not as readily acknowledged. Like, what if Link hadn't been brought to the Kokiri forest? What if He had never gotten past Mido? Or if Saria had been killed before becoming a sage? They're just unexplored stories. Doesn't mean they don't happen.
hi bandit, I saw a post the other day and it was of the hero of time and twilight with modna and navi, and it got me thinking. you know how the interlopers were a group banished to the twilight realm, what if they were the kokiri and fairies, or just the fairies, and they rebeled after the great deku tree died and ganandwarf was fleeing back to gerudo? I know that the timing is kinda off but it would be another answer to the missing kokiri and fairies I mean its a slim chance just something I thought of lol