Attempting a CONSTRUCT ONLY campaign...
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- Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
- Today we're going to try and make a Tomb Kings Construct army work in Total War: Warhammer 3... It is very *sigh*... fun....
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The fact that Khalida no longer starts with snakes in her army despite it beeing her main theme is still baffling to me.
yeah they just randomly neutered the tomb kings starting armies for some reason. Took the snakes away from khalida and all the single entities from everyone else.
I never understand why thorek declares war on khalida so often. He always does it while on neutral relations.
Because she normally has a very weak army, and because of the Tomb Kings' army cap her power rank is really low. A lot of the reasons about "anti player bias" is due to the fact that the player usually doesn't build armies until he runs out of income, but prefers to have income to upgrade his settlements, at the cost of being weaker to the AI, and therefore being declared war more often.
The other reason, of course, is because he's a prick.
Anti player bias kills any form of actually playing lesser lords in game from my experience.
I legit cannot play out the Dragon Lord in most cases very long because he, like Khalida, is surrounded by enemies that hate them.
@@TheDarkkilla12 Imrik has one of the worst starts in the game, it's surreal, I'm shocked Merkovich was able to complete a dragon-only challenge run using him.
@@Supercohboy he is. On WH2 it was HELLA WORSE with rats next door. He’s still a bad start, but compared to the number of runs on WH2 to then to 3 feels a lot easier, but only by what he has to put up with no rats unless you get REALLY unlucky.
If creative assembly doesnt revive the tomb kings, At least games Workshop gives them a revival with "warhammer the old World"
What are you on about? GW can't be trusted to do amything right, they literally just sold out of TK old world in minutes!
GW is dog 💩!
You know things are dire when Games Workshop is the "good guy" in a situation...
Or SFO :)
They put skaven as a “legacy race” (they won’t be getting any updates) for the warhammer of the old world. Screw games workshop.
@@BrenttFease they aren't though soooo... 🤷
Considering how the Tomb King neighbour is always a reliable ally when playing Sisters of Twilight it is nice to see them help out unlike the Dwarf being a jerk.
Actually if you think about it screaming skull catapults are constructs as well because they are completely made of bone and magic.
Old world unfortunately didn’t add too many new units for tomb kings.
We got the arch necrotect lord, tomb guard chariots, necroserpents with no riders, and an elite ushabti unit, which can only have the melee weapon.
Pretty neat stuff for the morturary cult and the nekeharan royal host, but yeah, just some kit bash swaps or paint options.
At least we got the necro dragon!
TKs aren't supposed to play tall Zerk.
They are a definition of wide faction because they need more buildings to get better armies.
There were two changes to tomb kings. One in Whii update that slowed their growth, but another in 3 that greatly reduced their building costs and increased recruitment speed. Really don't think they need a rework, just some LLs.
Don't forget some new units, i Don't really know what other units aren't there. Maybe some elite armored infantry? Cavalry, definitely constructs, and without a doubt a new generic lord and hero!
@@OrkBoss theyre missing the khemric titan, a big scarab beetle construct thats incredinly badass
Try playing Grombie. You get Malekith, Khatep and Valkia all coming at you with super-aggro. That's what you get for being the only order guy around in miles.
Chaos dwarfes with only war machines, both tanks and artillery, could be interesting, tho the start would be pretty difficult
The low army amount makes domination insanely hard to do especially if the enemy has like 20 armies and u got 5, but i think if they add some more types and buff what's there to at least a good stat not this pis poor stats they be good once again
Tomb Kings constructs only should start with going for scorpians and get a building in every settlement of scorpians. You can get 2 early with khatep. First one with lvl 3 city and second one when you get your free hero necrotect then use the rite to get a settlement to lvl 3 and build your second scorpian. Then of course continue ushabti for the bows, but the regular ushabti are just as good as skellies for holding the line. Yell me what you think.
Back in the day, the tomb kings were so strong and fun to play ...
ngl the title made me go "wow that sounds like hell" and it seems like it was, in fact, hell
Wait did you make thid video because we recently got our first look at warhammer the old world😁
Why don't you try this challenge in a lower difficulty again?
Love the idea of it
BRO PLEASE MAKE A TUTORIAL ON HOW TO GET THE PAINT BRUSSH I WANT IT SO BAD
Oo oo oo. Next do a lizardman with just dinos rex trike kinda stuff
Removing that hierotitan from DJ was a really bad move, made his champaign bearable, but fun! Im sure people played with him like mr just to enjoy the animations of it, as lets be clear no body recruit them late game
Yeah Tomb Kings need their spam.
i hope nagash dlc changes things
That's a big if, there's a good chance that never comes.
@@henrybatten3315 I mean you're right as much as I hate to say it but there are some great mods
they still haven't unnerfed their units. I hate that pvp got their leadership numbers nuked.
Yeah they need a big glow up and new units
Tomb kings lifes matter
Maybe try sfo mod? I think I will on the old world and see how it goes.
Lol just dies as Khalida
A thumbnail with ushatbi and a big ‘’weak text’’ yeah alright dude
I do love the tomb kings but god damn I agree, they are not that great.
I salute you for going though this much pain for us. Tomb Kings and in general older races needs a bit of update.
The real cure for Tomb Kings is a new mechanic
I think all undead factions like both vampires and the tomb kings need a mechanic that is based around two vital resource
Bones and Souls
These two resources will shape their campaign into a really fun campaign
Just like how the Skaven campaign heavily depends on food
In this mechanic, Bones would be harvested from the sites of the great battles just like raise dead mechanic of the vampires
The souls will be harvested from the enemy units after each victory as an post-battle option
With bones, you could recruit skeletons and with souls, you could recruit ethereal units like Carin Wreghts and Hex Wreights and Mortis Engines for vampires or create constructs for the tomb kings
So in this way, all of the undead roster of all undead factions would be free of gold upkeep but instead rely on bones and souls
And you could avoid having those meaningless unit caps for the constructs for the tomb kings
We waiting for Nagash.
Tomb Kings really do suck nowadays, but constructs still wreck so much face. Perhaps someday the Tomb Kings will get a rework, Ptra willing.
complaining about how bad the tomb kings are when you're trying to make a doomstack challenge work, when they way they are designed disincentives that with the unit caps, seems shortsighted. they are fine. this was just a bad idea.
Tomb King's Lore of Magic and Clan Eshin's Lore of Magic fighting over which one is the shittiest.
Not even close. Nehekara is one of the better lores.
I'm sorry to have changed the 'likes' on this video from 69 to 70, but there ain't no way I'm not gonna give some love to a Zerk vid!
The TOmb Kings!! They suck.. 🤣🤣🤣👍
"they came out (years) ago and they haven't changed since"
Isn't that... lore accurate? 🤔
I read a bit about Tomb Kings lore, and they were pretty static as a culture, especially after the TK achieved longer, but not immortal, lives
Analysis: True!
lol
Tabletop accurate too
That's what happens when the main source of income is pay to win, and ppl buy it..literally
@@thecursed01 Tomb kings are absolute the strongest faction in campaign. #1 Do not do these ridiculous game rules on yourself such as- construct only army. This is not limit by the game but the player. Fail. #2 Create constructs and most importantly buy moratory cult items like 1: blade that gives your lords and units hunger(so all heroes and lords could have that). Have armor of eternity created or any other armor. Next- add Oroboros- that gives you regeneration. Have constructs and artilery always. See gods roaming the map and taking on everything with ease. Also- just skip skeletons- they are trash and prioritize settlement upgrade so you can get to constructs faster.
Its not just the tomb kings, fighting malakith in naggarond feels like an endless ordeal with any faction
I'd say if you rush him down at the beginning with dwarfs its easy life. But it has to be done quickly
@amorlanjenkins1531 last time i fought against him in the ME campaign, he was spamming 3 armies every 2 turns and had morathi, rakath and himself leading those armies. At turn 100 with their full abilities it became very boring after a while
at turn 100 you should be able to roll his ass over with doomstacks or multiple shitstacks with any faction i think just focus only on attacking malekith and only defend at other fronts until you beat him
Not if you are torox
That fker took 60 turns to get chesed down my Beastmen hordes. 60 f k turns of running in circles retaking beaststones
I think with tomb kings you have to prioritize getting that second army even if it means fielding 2 smaller armies due to the unit caps put on the tomb kings
There's no "smaller armies" with Tomb Kings.
They can fill the rest of the army with skeletons, Zerk shot himself in the foot by ONLY recruiting constructs.
@@acheron16 The challenge was "Attempting a CONSTRUCT ONLY campaign...", so would kinda defeat the whole purpose
@@richardsolheim374 true but the point of the kings is they need every unit to play properly until they're large enough to go into themed armies.
I knew the moment i saw construct only this wasn't gonna go well.
Although to be fair, i actually like unit caps. I feel like every faction should have capped units.
@@skeith1543I disagree somewhat, I would prefer a medieval 2 style system where you can only build certain kinds of buildings in certain towns and instead of recruiting armies Willy Nilly youve got a cool down.
or as i do just fuck ton of basic units because shure they shit but i rather have max stacks always in a blob.
I think this is doable with Khatep, but you just have to sit in your starting province for a long time until you can fill out a second army of constructs. Also abuse the techs for recruiting all the heroes first, they are really strong.
I don’t think lore of Nehek is bad at all, maybe I’m just a TK fanboy but the spells are cheap and stack up that restless dead passive (aoe heal on casts). Really strong in tight formations, especially with the realm of souls healing added
It is one of the stronger lores.
That's the issue though, you have to be in tight formation. Considering how deadly vortex magic is in 3 compared to 2 you clump too much and you can lose half your army to one good vortex
@@sasothedog That's the trick. If you use a spell to only destroy six skelyboi units, Tomb Kings are winning the value battle.
It's strong, but it's buff/debuff focused (the vortex was ass, last I tried) which makes it difficult to calculate the gold value impact it has on a battle
But Pha's Protection to spam passive + the big ol Dessication debuff are massive assets
I think the big issue here is that as far as I remember constructs don't benefit from that healing correct? I think the healing only works for undead units but I could be wrong.
Could see the Tomb Kings get a DLC in the relativly near future. Trying to cache in on the TK hype from old world.
the tomb kings are a hard army to play, however they are not 'weak'. more so then any other army you really need combined arms to hold with them. they are not a faction that plays well with themed armies early in the campaign you just don't have the resources to do it.
The Necrotects are absolutely vital to pumping up construct numbers too.
That said, Khalida's start is really terrible lol. I think Settra's got the best start of the kings.
I remember so many multiplayer campaigns where i had to go bail out my buddy cause he got overwhelmed so quickly.
Turns out the Out Post system made up for a lot of issues by giving the kings more variety early on.
The meta for tomb kings is to just spam tomb guard buildings everywhere. +3 capacity for each settlement to tomb guard means that you can get a full 18 or 19 stack of them with 6 or 7 settlements owned. They also get a ton of buffs from technology and some nearby settlement bonuses while being easily replaceable in 1 turn globally by around turn 35-40. Scorpions being nerfed in game 3 means that the sphynx are the only constructs worth caring about now lol.
@@cHaMp630 who gives two fucks about 'the meta'? We're here to have fun.
@@skeith1543 Typical reddit andy thinking.
@@cHaMp630 Typical WAAC player.
This
The constructs really aren't built to tank (ironically, given how they're made of goddamn stone) but to deal damage. They're the hammer to your skeletons'/tomb guards' anvil
Zerkovich is sounding exceptionally Khornate in this one.
Although not a winning style it is fun to see how long it last. However I do think doing some manual might be better then auto
really don't understand why they decided to remove the titan from khatep and the scorpion from arkham...
My biggest thing about Tomb Kings: I just wish their archers weren't capped.
Like...The basic archers. I am not asking for cavalry, chariots, beasts, constructs, anything. I just find it hard to believe that the most basic archer is so hard to have that I need a dedicated building to it. That alone likely would let me enjoy them to their fullest. Don't really need much other than that and you can easily handle a lot of early game stuff.
Always like your videos but for your last point, I think I’d rather have a faction like Tomb King that asks the player to pair necrotects with ushabti to make them strong rather than the Beastmen leaving you almost unable to lose no matter the difficulty setting. I hope we’ll get a TK rework but I don’t want it to be like with the Beastmen where the faction doesn’t need any form of strategy to be successful with.
Tomb kings were always weak trash armies that compensated by being completely free of upkeep. Though to be fair, they have been buffed since WH2.
Realm of souls now loop once. Making it twice as strong in theory. (Not in practice!)
Most troops have better morale now.
The Bone Giant is no longer terrible.
Some troop generating buildings can be built earlier now.
I think also that the lore of Nehekara is not quite as bad as it was. Mainly because so many other schools have gotten nerfed along the way and I think the skull storm is stronger.
Some of their units could use a buff sure (Ushabti & all their cavalry are trash), but mechanically I love how TK plays and I dont think they really need an overhaul. WoC confederation system would work perfectly for Settra at least and building pyramids should increase army capacity in Nehekharan tomb cities. Keeping players expansion limited to research or mortuary cult removes incentive to use canopic jars for anything other than army capacity (beastmen have similar problem with dread, where its more optimal to have tons of lords with ungol crap stack than increase elite unit capacity with their cost increasing so much). Otherwise, although TKs are not the strongest, they're still one of the most fun races to play in WH3 imo...
Not sure if I agree on the TKs. Their ability to crapstack is what makes them so good. If you remove the crapstack from the TK strategy that's like when you forbid the knife-ears to shoot pointy sticks.
you should do videos where you show the units on those OVN factions man, Araby one is sick
the ushaptis being a level 2 building is a buff(was level 3-4), making the bows buildable from minor settlements. dunno how long ago that was though
@2:00 don't rush that settlement and instead build a full 20 stack for free? Within 50 turns on VH/L you should be unbeatable.
Nice to see another video where one of these goofy campaign ideas just doesn't work as oppossed to the usual steamrolling. Its amazing seeing how different Ushapti are on vanilla vs SFO, where they are absolutely no pushovers
Technically by lore there's not much of a difference between the tomb kings soldiers and the constructs
The constructs are either statues animated by bound souls (the same way the soldiers are skeletons animated by bound souls) or they're just giant, elaborate sarcophagi
You’re usual preferred difficulty is VH/H good sir 😡
Awesome commentary, i can tell how much goddamn fun you had with this!
Hope this vid pays for a stressball and maybe a nice pillow ^^
Play Tomb Kings Extended mod. It's all the update and overhaul on Tomb Kings you need.
I wonder how this would do in SFO I guess I’ll give it a go.
Update: It is doable with an asterisk. My settings are very hard, very hard, max ai stat buff. If you use grand hierophant khatep you get the four choices for a buff and debuff upon starting. One of which increases unit cap for all units which is essential early game. Now the reason it’s doable with an asterisk. I didn’t restrict myself purely to necrotects. It didn’t seem possible, and it’s seemingly arbitrary that necrotects are all right just because they’re related to constructs. So i heavily relied on heroes early on with hard cap of three heroes per army. It is VERY difficult early on. I had to trade one of my provinces to the sisters of twilight to stop the nearby skaven clan from taking my territory while struggling to take rothkar spire.
It’s turn 105 four full armies, strength rank 4, 10 provinces, still allies with the sisters, expanding northward because chaos op.
Bonus ducks for doing it on the old world map
Tomb kings dont feel weak for me at all regardless of how far back they came out. I dominate with them quite well on higher difficulties.
Only constructs with tomb kings doesnt work out because they are very infantry centric. A solid line of about ten infantry units is important for every tomb king army. Tomb king infantry multiply the power of everything else because they also fill up the realm of souls meter which would heal all constructs.
That simple fact is a major key to unlock the power of tomb kings on the battlefield.
Just bought TWW 1 and 2 during Skull fest on money i got from selling all of my cases from CS and TF2. Haven't played Total War games before btw. Had some money left so i took Tomb Kings DLC. Khalida is my favorite faction atm - love undead vs undead action. This video made me not want to buy TWW 3.
It's okay Zerk, I get it, cheating by having skeletons to defend is okay in my book, I tried construct only too, ended up making the decision to keep Khalida's starting army as is just to defend until I had at least a few extra constructs available, because surviving just didn't seem possible without them
I'd recommend Agemouk's Tomb Kings Extended mod to give them a much needed update.
The truth has spoken!
Playing Tomb King's contruct - only army feels like playing Beastmen's giant buddy - only lol
Khatep has a really brutal starting location in general, ngl.
FoR tHe AlGoRiThM
You know that TK are underpowered when Zerk even accepts help of elves. :) I think partially why this challenge is hard is because it goes against TK faction design.
Tomb Kangz are still my favourite faction even though their start is woefully slow, once you get up to the 3 armies point you can just snowball the living (in a wholesome way, that sounded kinda dirty)
the sheer amount of cheating in this game is baffling...
some capaign starts get nerfed to the point that a whole faction is nearly unplayable...
but behind that "balance" charade, the game's AI will, to its own detriment, target the player specifically from the other side of the map, leave its territory undefended, going into a huge amount of economic deficit, to attack the player as soon as he starts the game. and to make it so it's not just the AI commiting suicide on the player's army, the AI teleports next to the player with a doomstack way too big for any kind of turn 3 economy to sustain, ignore every notion of "replenishment" and "recruitment cost" and besiege the player on turn 3 and every turn thereafter with said doomstack.
this game costs 200 bucks for the full experience, and it's fucked up beyond all recognition.
While they're less annoying to build up, the Vamp Coast is even worse-off as far as campaign mechanics and unit variety goes. It's not a contest though, CA really needs to bring all the races up to parity with WH3's standards and then supplement roster gaps with DLC/FLC.
idk if we're going to get that though, especially if CA plans to add any other factions to the game. There's only so many work hours in a year for them to make content with, after all., and we can only expect to get 1-3 more years of content/support for the game. Fingers crossed that the vampiric factions all get a refresh or even a rework, depending on the faction.
Funny watching you to torture yourself like that, kudos! I am maining TK since they came out and yeah I would really liked some new content for them, even in a form of just a small dlc.
They're quite weak at the start yeah (especially Khalida, that position is really meh, Khatep did not win much either), even in the middle game it's tough if you are not playing Arkhan (cause 2 armies from the start are nuts, plus the wraiths are a godsend, since most of their units are slow, except chariots, which kinda sucks), however they are the definition of "playing the long game" nature, once you have enough armiers, you are unbeatable.
Lost few armies? No biggie, gimme a few turns and I have them back like nothing's happened without affecting my economy at all, even with the same leveled lords and heroes
Seriously, FUCK anti-player bias. Worst mechanic in the game. If you want to stop people from finishing a campaign there is no better way than to have every faction in a thousand kilometer radius declare war on you for no fucking reason. I have started dozens of campaigns over the three games, won 3 and abandoned the rest because I got frustrated that everyone was attacking me.
I really wish they would give the Tomb Kings back their constructs. The thing that made Settra's campaign so fun was the warsphinx he started with, which made you want to get more as well. Now his campaign is very mid until you get them.
Yep, TK are a pain. Imagine hard capping armies in a game what expects you to constantly and rapidly expand. You are always limited in number of provinces you can control and your armies are limited in power by very strict unit caps. The faction what can do shit only after developing but just can't develop fast. What 0 upkeep matter when your forces are constantly outnumbered and outpowered?
That's my biggest complaint about these types of games. It doesn't feel like the computer is bound by the same rules as the player. Every round they some how have a new full stack.
Exiles of Nehek is super strong as far as factions go. You just start stacking those jars with his superior hero count and you can get a second army up by turn 12 and a third by turn 15. And then you just roll around like a thug
Pretty much tells you how badly made the game is with how the AI works, full stacks showing up with one province that have no upkeep and an economy with it's murder boner on the player only, I am surrounded by enemies I hate, lets declare war on the player and send my whole army after them... still play the odd legendary, but it's been a while..
To be fair your not really supposed to do only constructs as the melee ushabti still want an infantry unit stop them from being surrounded. Then add in unit cap army and you're trying to use only units that rely on unit caps. Plus on Very Hard campaign you can't just derp around doing nothing for the first 10 turns.
I wonder how much easier this would be if you use one of the Tomb Kings overhaul mods, like Agemouks or TK: Expanded
Honestly it is about the same, the mod doesn't add alot of variety early, mostly focused on tier 5 units, with a lot locked behind special buildings
I LOVE Khalida, but I despise playing her in Total War Warhammer 3 because of all the bullshit you have to put up with.
I strongly disagree. Their chariot access is unrivalled. And with changes to chariots making them really good, they form a great core unit.
If you would win by dungeons and dragons standards or most other role playing game metrics the undead are technically constructs all of them
Anti player bias is the bane of simple fun, i get it, they had to do something to challenge the player or whatever but that is such a dumb and nonsensical way to do it.
ehm... i play the tomb kings since they came out (my favorite faction) and they are still one of the most powerful factions in the hand of the player. I really didnt need any overhaul
How is Malakith a problem for you? In my play throughs, he almost always gets wiped out by Grombrindaal and Valkia lol
thutep of the third dynasty is still a powerful lord for the ushabti despite his entire branch doing nothing for them.
He also allows more recruitment of constructs.
Aaaaah, classic WH3 stuff...
Anti-player bias
Recruiting full stacks in a single turn
Suddenly teleporting right on top of you with no warning
Having "conveniently just enough" movement to constantly kite your own armies
A modern CA classic, the four horsement of "poor game design" xD
Saying the Tomb Kings are mediocre in campaign or battle is just....wrong.
Ushapti shouldnt have siege attacker. They have slicing weapons and despiite their size, dont seem very strong
That's basically drone warfare campaign😅
When ppl support pay to win, then don't be surprised factions who didn't get a new pay to win dlc for long are underpowered now
the amount of tomb king mods i have make them a serious threat, my favorite new big boy unit is the khemric titan, it is what it says it is. but base game oh yeah they need some serious help
Would Casket of Souls passed as a artillary construct? Favorite unit.
this is a dumb concept of a video, i dont know why you thought it would even be possible or fun without mods, the whole thing of the TKs and undead factions in general is to spam mass amounts of ass quality chaff and then get a few good monsters...
Tomb Kings in Warhammer 2 are still good right?
Here soemthing CA can do. Rever Nakai vassal to the Warhammer 2 version.
You know this is making me want to play as Khalida just to see whether I can win
huh for me malakith always kinda stays hold up in his capital as mostly valkia runs all over nagaroth
my dude, not putting points into scorpions. They're the best unit in the roster until tier 5.
Tomb scorpion spam is epic their animations are so effective