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“Start as close to end as possible,” reminds me of another bit of advice I once heard, “Is this the most interesting period of your character’s life? If not, why are you showing us it?” Point being to keep extraneous information out of the story.
@ I’m 90% certain I got that from a class I took, but it could have been Yahtzee… I have watched his videos obsessively since I first discovered him, so I don’t remember exactly. Still, I’ll credit him. It’s good advice.
Hey man, just want to share a compliment. As a person that wants to become a writer, I learned a lot from your video's and also gave me lots of inspiration. You would make a great teacher with your easy going and understanding way of explaining concepts.
Wow, thank you. That's exactly the kind of vibe I'm going for with this channel. Writing is hard, and it's hard to get into, if I can be a welcoming voice among all that, I'm doing my job!
Thanks K man. I really think that small tiny piece of advice, “even in a conversation each person has some agenda they want to happen out of it”, and trying to focus more on the character being like we are in real life, which is never ever passive or neutral, is so so helpful. Thanks bruv
I like the "give your readers as much information as possible" quote... I think what he means is give them all the information they need so they can envision an ending.... or guess.... but then because of the one thing you gave them in the beginning of the book that seemed to be inconsequential is now of the biggest consequence and changes the entire ending and they are blown away cause what info was given early is now coming around to blow them away.
I also wanted to mention I've been wanting to start writing for a long time but it's hard to figure out where to start and you've been helping me with your videos... here's to see if I can figure out something to write about as the last time I wrote something was in grade school 15+ years ago
That's a good take on that tip, I think you're right. Give them as much information as possible. Thanks very much! Glad to hear the videos are helping. Hope you have fun with the writing :)
my dude. i am so glad I found this video. needed all of this info. After decades of writing (both for fun and professionally) I am finally attempting the novel.
Yeah that's the only one I'm not sure on either. I'd love to have the confidence to write like that, but I think I ultimately have to keep some intrigue and tension there. Even if it's just for me while I'm writing it!
8:02 Poor old Edgar Derby's fate is one of the first things we learn in Slaughterhouse 5. It's the "climax" of the story, and yet Vonnegut deliberately "spoils" it for the reader as soon as he possibly can. That's because the thematic suspense is what's important in any great novel, not the plot suspense. Theme is the "point" of the story, and the plot is just a vessel. If you define suspense as anything that keeps the reader intrigued and asking questions, the main question you ask throughout Slaughterhouse 5 isn't "what happens next?" It's "why is Vonnegut going out of his way to spoil this and basically everything about this plot?" And then the answer blows you away at the end when the thematic suspense is released: Only after you see the suffering and privation Billy Pilgrim had to endure; only after reading about Billy's PTSD, and the hollow life he leads after the war; only after you understand the illusion of time and the inevitability of war; only after meeting child soldiers, sadistic Americans, kind Soviets, a glory-hungry officer drowning in his own phlegm, a military historian who has never seen war, and a Nazi Uncle Sam; only after seeing tens of thousands of people murdered in the firebombing of a city that was not producing any kind of military value for Germany, and see the survivors strafed by American fighter planes; after 20 years of Vonnegut trying to write his book and make sense of all that he personally witnessed; after meeting Mary OHare, and seeing Vonnegut marvel at Dresden days before it's leveled; and after seeing Billy dig corpses out of the catacombs of Dresden - the reader finally understands that war is completely pointless and inevitable; like this one, single, pointless, fact: "Somewhere in there the poor old high school teacher, Edgar Derby, was caught with a teapot he had taken from the catacombs. He was arrested for plundering. He was tried and shot. So it goes." Derby's death isn't what builds suspense. It's the build up to understanding "so it goes" which creates suspense. Thematic suspense! Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
Great video, with great tips. I've heard them all but somehow had forgotten they were from Vonnegut, but they are great reminders. And we all need reminders like these, no matter how long we've been at it. I also have never read Vonnegut. I know, I know. I'm a terrible person. I've had Slaughterhouse Five for years. Maybe it's time I finally pick it up.
I really recommend reading Slaughterhhouse Five. It's a great book. I read it when I was about 15 and no book I've read as an adult has impressed me so much. It's one of those books that stand out from the crowd , and leave a lasting impression.
@@JasonFuhrman I hope you will enjoy it as much as I did . And I think for once the blurb on the back cover is not just publishers hype. "It is a book we need to read and re-read, funny , compassionate and wise ".
Write about something you care about is very good advice - but I wonder how would it be possible to not do that. I mean if you don't care about it how can you write it. Thank you for this video - it is good to listen to other writers tips. Even if only as motivation to continue with the story I am currently working on.
Absolutely, I’m with you on that. The way I take it, I think he meant ‘don’t just write a cool story, say something about the world’. Thanks for watching and hope your story is going well ☺️
Something bad happening to your character doesn't have to be overtly catastrophic every time. It can be a moment of embarrassment. Like when Marilyn Monroe stepped onto the windy subway grate on a sidewalk in New York City. Her dress flew up, and she held it down. It ended up being some of the most iconic photos of all time. But it also upset her husband, Joe DiMaggio, one of the greatest baseball players of all time. That was reality with a lot of drama. It was pleasant in one way because the photo is so beautiful. But catastrophic in another because of the stress it put on her marriage, and ultimately their divorce.
Absolutely. It can be anything that hits a weakness or a vulnerability in your character. It could be something entirely normal that most people wouldn't be phased by, but your character might be.
👉 Join my Writing Club - www.patreon.com/kierenwestwoodwriting
👉 Hire me to work on your story - www.kierenwestwood.com/editing
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“Start as close to end as possible,” reminds me of another bit of advice I once heard, “Is this the most interesting period of your character’s life? If not, why are you showing us it?” Point being to keep extraneous information out of the story.
Absolutely. I definitely think that’s the spirit of it. That’s a good way to look at it. Thanks for watching!
This is gold!
Wasn’t that Yahtzee Crosshaw?
@ I’m 90% certain I got that from a class I took, but it could have been Yahtzee… I have watched his videos obsessively since I first discovered him, so I don’t remember exactly. Still, I’ll credit him. It’s good advice.
Hey man, just want to share a compliment. As a person that wants to become a writer, I learned a lot from your video's and also gave me lots of inspiration. You would make a great teacher with your easy going and understanding way of explaining concepts.
Wow, thank you. That's exactly the kind of vibe I'm going for with this channel. Writing is hard, and it's hard to get into, if I can be a welcoming voice among all that, I'm doing my job!
Thanks K man. I really think that small tiny piece of advice, “even in a conversation each person has some agenda they want to happen out of it”, and trying to focus more on the character being like we are in real life, which is never ever passive or neutral, is so so helpful. Thanks bruv
Thanks for watching as always! Got a new video coming soon that goes into a bit more depth on that very point too :D
@@KierenWestwoodWriting I’ll be watching and appreciating it for sure dude. Thank you!!
I always love when you do these kinds of videos, the start as close to the end as possible is golden!
Thanks Joey, I do enjoy these videos too :) Sometimes I struggle for a while to find an author who has enough quotes though.
I like the "give your readers as much information as possible" quote... I think what he means is give them all the information they need so they can envision an ending.... or guess.... but then because of the one thing you gave them in the beginning of the book that seemed to be inconsequential is now of the biggest consequence and changes the entire ending and they are blown away cause what info was given early is now coming around to blow them away.
I also wanted to mention I've been wanting to start writing for a long time but it's hard to figure out where to start and you've been helping me with your videos... here's to see if I can figure out something to write about as the last time I wrote something was in grade school 15+ years ago
That's a good take on that tip, I think you're right. Give them as much information as possible.
Thanks very much! Glad to hear the videos are helping. Hope you have fun with the writing :)
my dude. i am so glad I found this video. needed all of this info. After decades of writing (both for fun and professionally) I am finally attempting the novel.
Go for it! Have fun with it too, don't forget that!
Thank you for your generous summary advice, so clearly and eruditely expressed!
Succinct, helpful, and loved your elaborations on each quote
Great advice. Not sure about giving readers as much info as possible in the beginning 😅 but I think a good balance of intrigue is key
Yeah that's the only one I'm not sure on either. I'd love to have the confidence to write like that, but I think I ultimately have to keep some intrigue and tension there. Even if it's just for me while I'm writing it!
Great video. I’m here from film courage - you’re my new favourite channel!
Thanks so much and welcome! ☺️
On a more serious note, I've taken a screen shot of that final quote as I really love it!
Absolutely! It's a great reminder of why we're trying to do what we do I think :)
Excellent advice explained really nicely!
Thanks so much! Welcome to the channel :)
More awesome stuff. I’m encouraged now because a lot of these tips I’m following naturally. Thanks as always.
Thanks Alan! Absolutely, you’re putting it into practice ☺️
8:02 Poor old Edgar Derby's fate is one of the first things we learn in Slaughterhouse 5. It's the "climax" of the story, and yet Vonnegut deliberately "spoils" it for the reader as soon as he possibly can. That's because the thematic suspense is what's important in any great novel, not the plot suspense. Theme is the "point" of the story, and the plot is just a vessel. If you define suspense as anything that keeps the reader intrigued and asking questions, the main question you ask throughout Slaughterhouse 5 isn't "what happens next?" It's "why is Vonnegut going out of his way to spoil this and basically everything about this plot?"
And then the answer blows you away at the end when the thematic suspense is released: Only after you see the suffering and privation Billy Pilgrim had to endure; only after reading about Billy's PTSD, and the hollow life he leads after the war; only after you understand the illusion of time and the inevitability of war; only after meeting child soldiers, sadistic Americans, kind Soviets, a glory-hungry officer drowning in his own phlegm, a military historian who has never seen war, and a Nazi Uncle Sam; only after seeing tens of thousands of people murdered in the firebombing of a city that was not producing any kind of military value for Germany, and see the survivors strafed by American fighter planes; after 20 years of Vonnegut trying to write his book and make sense of all that he personally witnessed; after meeting Mary OHare, and seeing Vonnegut marvel at Dresden days before it's leveled; and after seeing Billy dig corpses out of the catacombs of Dresden - the reader finally understands that war is completely pointless and inevitable; like this one, single, pointless, fact:
"Somewhere in there the poor old high school teacher, Edgar Derby, was caught with a teapot he had taken from the catacombs. He was arrested for plundering. He was tried and shot. So it goes."
Derby's death isn't what builds suspense. It's the build up to understanding "so it goes" which creates suspense. Thematic suspense!
Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
Great video, with great tips. I've heard them all but somehow had forgotten they were from Vonnegut, but they are great reminders. And we all need reminders like these, no matter how long we've been at it.
I also have never read Vonnegut. I know, I know. I'm a terrible person. I've had Slaughterhouse Five for years. Maybe it's time I finally pick it up.
Thanks Jason! Ah, it's the way of books. There are too many that are absolutely essential reads, yet we'd never have time to read even half of them.
I really recommend reading Slaughterhhouse Five. It's a great book. I read it when I was about 15 and no book I've read as an adult has impressed me so much. It's one of those books that stand out from the crowd , and leave a lasting impression.
@@howardcoles3537 thanks for the push. I'll give it a read soon.
@@JasonFuhrman I hope you will enjoy it as much as I did . And I think for once the blurb on the back cover is not just publishers hype. "It is a book we need to read and re-read, funny , compassionate and wise ".
Great video, I have not read Slaughterhouse 5 but I do really love Cat’s Cradle and the Player Piano.
Thanks for watching!
a one of my fav movies is Slaughterhouse 5
Gracias por el 4to y 7mo consejo. Saludos desde Argentina!
Gracias por ver! hola desde gran bretaña! :D
Write about something you care about is very good advice - but I wonder how would it be possible to not do that. I mean if you don't care about it how can you write it.
Thank you for this video - it is good to listen to other writers tips. Even if only as motivation to continue with the story I am currently working on.
Absolutely, I’m with you on that. The way I take it, I think he meant ‘don’t just write a cool story, say something about the world’.
Thanks for watching and hope your story is going well ☺️
The Tarzan comparison mega works man.
I'm glad, I wasn't sure whether to even leave it in!
@@KierenWestwoodWriting most def man most def
Great comments
Something bad happening to your character doesn't have to be overtly catastrophic every time. It can be a moment of embarrassment. Like when Marilyn Monroe stepped onto the windy subway grate on a sidewalk in New York City. Her dress flew up, and she held it down. It ended up being some of the most iconic photos of all time. But it also upset her husband, Joe DiMaggio, one of the greatest baseball players of all time. That was reality with a lot of drama. It was pleasant in one way because the photo is so beautiful. But catastrophic in another because of the stress it put on her marriage, and ultimately their divorce.
Absolutely. It can be anything that hits a weakness or a vulnerability in your character. It could be something entirely normal that most people wouldn't be phased by, but your character might be.
wasnt it just a photo shoot? you make it sound like paparazzi snapped it, I'm not sure that is the case
Great stuff. Happy Birthday, Wanda June
Thanks for watching!
Tarzan would feel honoured! 😂
I wrote an entire, perfectly good video script then ignored it and talked about Tarzan :D
@@KierenWestwoodWriting Haha! Tarzan was calling... 😆
These sound like editing stage tips. The first draft is just telling yourself the story.