Water droplet moving across a wettability gradient

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  • Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
  • Water droplet moving across a wettability gradient prepared by controlling the adsorption-kinetics of alkanethiols on a gold-coated surface.
    For more information about research of the group of Surface Science and Technology at ETH Zürich: surface.mat.et...

Комментарии • 778

  • @eth_materials
    @eth_materials  2 года назад +418

    We are very happy that you all like our water droplet video! Check out our channel for more videos about materials science!

    • @paveldrotar4493
      @paveldrotar4493 2 года назад +2

      Any chance this could be repeated and this time, captured in HD?

    • @mihcael
      @mihcael 2 года назад

      hello, would love more from the surface-chemical gradient group

    • @cicik57
      @cicik57 2 года назад

      can you make perpetuum mobile on this effect?

    • @networkedperson
      @networkedperson 2 года назад

      for your next video I recommend the song titled "The Terrorist" by Dj Vadim

    • @ralexttm4368
      @ralexttm4368 2 года назад +1

      any way we could use this to make power?

  • @draa0gon
    @draa0gon 2 года назад +4416

    Huge respect for crediting water for his role as droplet.

    • @happysongs4kyrone
      @happysongs4kyrone 2 года назад +249

      it was really an outstanding performance by water.

    • @stumbling
      @stumbling 2 года назад +276

      A fine actor who is really making waves.

    • @draa0gon
      @draa0gon 2 года назад +78

      @@stumbling Your pun makes me [sic].

    • @Zuion_Art
      @Zuion_Art 2 года назад +20

      @@stumbling i hate that pun so bad

    • @iwbmo
      @iwbmo 2 года назад +15

      Liked the video for crediting water

  • @AKIPOPOPOPOOON
    @AKIPOPOPOPOOON 2 года назад +9

    can't wait to do this in my nanotech class!

    • @Skibbityboo0580
      @Skibbityboo0580 2 года назад +2

      @Hey Girl I Like Your Kitchen Romania Buttfuck Magoo

  • @Idlehampster
    @Idlehampster 2 года назад

    Love the GameBoy music.

  • @pullupbruh5810
    @pullupbruh5810 2 года назад

    But is the water wet?

  • @flip2724
    @flip2724 2 года назад

    why is it doing this?

  • @jakubdraws395
    @jakubdraws395 2 года назад +1

    Why was this in my recommended?! I need answers…

  • @jerlome4467
    @jerlome4467 2 года назад +848

    Little known fact, water's part was unscripted and what we're seeing is alkanethiols on gold's genuine reaction, the director ended up liking the shot so much they kept it in.

  • @perfectstranger1152
    @perfectstranger1152 2 года назад +2864

    Soon we will all be together through the algorithm.

  • @puerlatinophilus3037
    @puerlatinophilus3037 2 года назад +426

    "Droplet: Water" Thanks. I'll cast him in my next movie. Awesome performance! Not even a stunt double used.

  • @Zahlenteufel1
    @Zahlenteufel1 2 года назад +1790

    [Conservation of Energy] is actually absolutely fine, even though the center of mass actually does move upwards. This effect is caused by the adhesion force. A not entirely accurate yet very visual intuition is that the larger force of attraction from the higher-up material just pulls the droplet upwards. However, the further up the slope the drop is, the more energy would be required to remove it from the surface. So in effect, the drop still loses potential energy.
    @UCzO06X9B7kXEmUa7xkqZueA explained but not in a top-level comment so here it is again for visibility.

    • @86JEYPI
      @86JEYPI 2 года назад +41

      I guess a simpler explanation could be in terms of hydrophilic hydrophobic gradients... Since molercular attractions are way stronger than gravitational potential energy

    • @Metal_Master_YT
      @Metal_Master_YT 2 года назад +53

      so basically, it has gravitational potential energy, as well as adhesion potential energy.
      *whenever two objects are attracted, there's a potential energy gradient,* and since the water is attracted to the second potion of the wettability strip, it essentially has "adhesion potential energy", and it can be traded for "gravitational potential energy".

    • @wes8190
      @wes8190 2 года назад +34

      Wetting is like sticking magnets together. Force is necessary to remove liquid from a surface just like separating magnets.

    • @XMooseManX
      @XMooseManX 2 года назад +3

      Ok but couldn't you make a turn at the end so it would drop off and create perpetual motion?

    • @Mia-ln1zs
      @Mia-ln1zs 2 года назад +29

      @@XMooseManX It wouldn't fall. The attractive forces are greater than the pull of gravity as demonstrated in the video.

  • @NineAtoms1
    @NineAtoms1 2 года назад +152

    Amazing performance. Just amazing. Bravo to all involved, but, mostly, to the little water droplet that could.

  • @jackodonnell3463
    @jackodonnell3463 2 года назад +96

    Made this in my research lab back in 2013. Most of the time was spent getting those damn metal surfaces molecularly clean before applying the hydrophobic monolayers. We used diamond polish.

  • @abraruralam3534
    @abraruralam3534 2 года назад +43

    So basically like a magnet above pulling a metal upwards, but its not free energy because now you gotta find some energy to pull the metal off the magnet itself.

    • @JaSkateJa
      @JaSkateJa 2 года назад +2

      No m8, its not about magnets here. As the title calls... its about the surface adhesion gradient.

    • @Genny207
      @Genny207 2 года назад +19

      ​@@JaSkateJa If you want to get technical, I think adhesion is more or less an atomic scale of magnetism, but this isn't the point of the comment:
      Once it's at the top, you still have to pull the water off of the high adhesion material at the top of the gradient. Much like when a magnet does work to pull itself into another magnet, you need some form of energy to separate them again, which is a totally fair comparison.

    • @JaSkateJa
      @JaSkateJa 2 года назад

      ​@@Genny207 There is no gradient on capillary plant walls?! You don´t need a gradient on plants to be able to transport water.

    • @server642
      @server642 2 года назад +1

      @@JaSkateJa The plane they drop the water onto, in this video, has a material on it which creates an adhesion gradient. That’s the gradient they’re talking about above.

    • @JaSkateJa
      @JaSkateJa 2 года назад

      @@server642 No, its not the material changing... its a surface edging changing over distance. Material stays the same ;)... as i said

  • @phild8095
    @phild8095 2 года назад +20

    Retired chemical engineer here. I am glad someone thought to do this and did it so well. My compliments to everyone involved.

  • @2nd-place
    @2nd-place 2 года назад +2

    I’ve just witnessed water flowing uphill. What a time to be alive!
    Can we use this to flood the Russians?

  • @fakestory1753
    @fakestory1753 2 года назад +55

    I like how people saying perpetual motion because they don't understand anything while title literally explain everything.

    • @eleSDSU
      @eleSDSU 2 года назад +3

      Yes, sorcery.
      In any case there is no such thing as "free energy".

    • @scottcantdance804
      @scottcantdance804 2 года назад +6

      I'm going to go out on a limb and guess most people don't know what "wettability" means.
      I inferred it from "wettability gradient", but if someone would have asked me before then, I wouldn't have believed that was a real word.

    • @86JEYPI
      @86JEYPI 2 года назад

      I couldn't agree more, like 4u

    • @dimitralex1892
      @dimitralex1892 2 года назад +1

      if i am not mistaken, the title says nothing because this experiment would not work with water.... and using a word like "wettability" is not explaining :'D pretty sure most people dont know the word

  • @fluffycritter
    @fluffycritter 2 года назад +22

    I'd be tempted to just keep adding more and more drops of water to see how much it ends up holding and what sorts of interesting effects there are at critical points of surface tension vs. gravity.

  • @VinOnline
    @VinOnline 2 года назад +19

    The water deserves an academy award for it's performance moving upwards.

  • @tristenarctician6910
    @tristenarctician6910 2 года назад +32

    this is the first time i've heard the word "Wettability"

    • @hyfy-tr2jy
      @hyfy-tr2jy 2 года назад +9

      In fact there is a class of chemicals called "water wetters" or in other terms "surfactants" which break down surface tension and make water exhibit its "wetting" properties in a more profound way. Example, there are chemicals added to water in fire fighting tanks to allow the water to form smaller droplets making them more effective at putting out flames

    • @karolakkolo123
      @karolakkolo123 2 года назад

      @@hyfy-tr2jy so you're telling me water can be dry?

    • @karolakkolo123
      @karolakkolo123 2 года назад

      Also, wettability sounds like a term from a physiological study

    • @BariumCobaltNitrog3n
      @BariumCobaltNitrog3n 2 года назад

      Sounds like a woman's potential for mating.

    • @msruag
      @msruag 2 года назад

      @@BariumCobaltNitrog3n coepulaetion

  • @djcfrompt
    @djcfrompt 2 года назад +29

    Is there a manuscript detailing the process used to prepare this surface? Interested to know how specifically you can control the adsorption of alkanethiolates at Au with such spatial resolution. Seems counter-intuitive as we normally strive for a homogeneous SAM across the substrate. Though I suppose gradual emersion of the substrate over the assembly time would give a gradient eventually reaching monolayer coverage.

    • @mrgreenskypiano
      @mrgreenskypiano 2 года назад +4

      future phd right here boys

    • @waightforrest1737
      @waightforrest1737 2 года назад +4

      The answer is banana sir.

    • @RealMasterChief117
      @RealMasterChief117 2 года назад +4

      Technobabble

    • @adrianpip2000
      @adrianpip2000 2 года назад +8

      Was also curious about that, so I did a really quick diggin' into the literature and found this quite wonderful paper. Indeed gradual immersion is one way to do it, but other possibilities include e.g. diffusion of thiols through a polysaccharide matrix, and using an STM to do selective desorption of SAM thiols (you can make all kinds of patterns). See DOI:10.1021/la7033164, especially figure 2 (and reference no. 45 for the STM article, which is super cool).
      EDIT: actually found another great article about this, but this time one of the authors is the same person that made the surface for this video (S. Morgenthaler)! DOI:10.1039/B715466F

    • @djcfrompt
      @djcfrompt 2 года назад +1

      @@mrgreenskypiano Soon, I hope!

  • @casaxtreme2952
    @casaxtreme2952 2 года назад +95

    Does the center of gravity of the droplet actually move upwards?
    How does this behave in terms of conservation of energy?

    • @anarchy_kitty
      @anarchy_kitty 2 года назад +8

      Są inne siły niż grawitacja, myślę, że jest wykorzystywana zasada podobna do pozyskiwania wody z korzeni.

    • @captainunicode
      @captainunicode 2 года назад +117

      CoE is actually absolutely fine, even though the center of mass actually does move upwards. This effect is caused by the adhesion force. A not entirely accurate yet very visual intuition is that the larger force of attraction from the higher-up material just pulls the droplet upwards. However, the further up the slope the drop is, the more energy would be required to remove it from the surface. So in effect, the drop still loses potential energy.

    • @casaxtreme2952
      @casaxtreme2952 2 года назад +3

      @@captainunicode Thank you for the explanation, makes sense!

    • @fredriks5090
      @fredriks5090 2 года назад +4

      @@captainunicode So it's a bit like Velcro,- where initial contact causes more and more "pulleys" to bring it closer to the origin of pull.

    • @TheNameOfJesus
      @TheNameOfJesus 2 года назад +4

      I'm not a physicist, but in both cases you can see the shape of the drop along its point of contact changing. That's where the energy must be lost, in its surface tension. Even on the horizontal direction (not just when moving upwards) it has to change shape, because it takes energy to move the drop horizontally. What this video omitted is what happens if the surface slants downwards. In that case, and only that case, there's no reason for the drop's shape to change along its edge, because it doesn't take energy to move downhill. I wish they had included that clip.

  • @jellymop
    @jellymop 2 года назад +73

    Roll the credits!!!
    Thanks everyone for your hard work! Couldn’t have made this huge motion picture without all of you!!

  • @kingsud9161
    @kingsud9161 2 года назад +2

    bro J.S. Bach/Glenn Gould nailed the music, absolute masterpiece

  • @spiderduckpig
    @spiderduckpig 2 года назад +2

    Water was scammed at the Oscars for not receiving Best Actor for his role as Droplet

  • @jamesmatthew1903
    @jamesmatthew1903 2 года назад +5

    Not long ago people would have called this witchcraft.

    • @kirayoshikage4057
      @kirayoshikage4057 2 года назад +3

      Except they still do and some idiot is about to start talking about conservation of energy and perpetual motion machines again.

  • @Genny207
    @Genny207 2 года назад +15

    Beautiful music. I have to say, I'm a _huge_ fan of this piece.

    • @zek1405
      @zek1405 2 года назад

      it sounds great! whats it called?

    • @glennkrafczyk
      @glennkrafczyk 2 года назад +4

      @@zek1405 JS Bach Goldberg Variations Nr. 3 :)

    • @Terieni-q7c
      @Terieni-q7c 2 года назад

      @@glennkrafczyk I was about to ask this. Thanks!

    • @roflattheworld
      @roflattheworld 2 года назад +2

      99% sure is the 1981 Glenn Gould recording, but would have to check

    • @nloc1929
      @nloc1929 2 года назад +4

      @@roflattheworld Sounds like the 1955 audio quality and speed, but I'm not 100% sure

  • @MuradBeybalaev
    @MuradBeybalaev 2 года назад +5

    Cool.
    Also nice of you to credit water at the end.

  • @SuperNicejohn
    @SuperNicejohn 2 года назад +4

    0:39 me when someone thinks I'm too lazy to move up the wettability gradient on my own

  • @TehPwnerer
    @TehPwnerer 2 года назад +13

    Gotta love surface tension

  • @acf2802
    @acf2802 2 года назад +1

    One week ago this obscure video from 2016 had 18,206 views and today it has 214,718

  • @applejuices
    @applejuices 2 года назад +1

    98.111 views. I'll reload to see if the views changed
    2 minutes later and we're still at 98.111 views. I'll take a whizz and see at how many views it has after that.
    After I emptied my bladder I reloaded and took a look at the views again. We're at 98.249 now. My my, this is getting exciting! Will be back soon!
    After practicing la campanella on piano for a bit, I came back to see the views are at a staggering 98.912! Amazing!

  • @jossypoo
    @jossypoo 2 года назад +6

    Using surface tension to climb

  • @colefoster9280
    @colefoster9280 2 года назад +4

    Best part is the credit for the music...

  • @Lychen_Lyre
    @Lychen_Lyre 2 года назад +22

    love how the materials used were in the credits

    • @GvinahGui
      @GvinahGui 2 года назад +3

      Indeed, he even listed Sarah Morgenthaler

    • @123TeeMee
      @123TeeMee 2 года назад

      All in comic sans

    • @YourLocalCafe
      @YourLocalCafe 2 года назад +2

      As an aspiring engineer i must tell you that we have to mention each chemical that we use in an experiment even if it is as basic as water. You know there are many transparant chemicals so they have to mention it.

  • @bluebaconjake405
    @bluebaconjake405 2 года назад +1

    *water droplet climbing a ramp*
    300K people: _interesting_

  • @cameo2277
    @cameo2277 2 года назад +1

    ohh i’m actually here before the video blows up for once 😂

  • @Dziaji
    @Dziaji 2 года назад +1

    They did it. Free energy! About 0.00000000001 joules worth!

  • @BearRealOfficial
    @BearRealOfficial 2 года назад +2

    wettability gradient como estas bear real

  • @rockybushes
    @rockybushes 2 года назад +1

    i cant believe i just watched a drop of water moving across a wettability gradient

  • @1.4142
    @1.4142 2 года назад +1

    A bold move to not cast a famous celebrity as droplet, opting for the better fit water.

  • @Mr.BobsDog
    @Mr.BobsDog 2 года назад +1

    This is my church
    This is where I heal my hurts

  • @CiMcM135
    @CiMcM135 2 года назад +1

    Water did great and all but I can't help see him as the baddie after his role in Titanic

  • @jordigutierrez4161
    @jordigutierrez4161 2 года назад +4

    In all my years never has the RUclips algorithm given me such a gem

  • @Snaykez
    @Snaykez 2 года назад +1

    reminds me of peter griffin falling down the stairs

  • @jimmyestrella1059
    @jimmyestrella1059 2 года назад +1

    And the Oscar for Best Actor goes to...Water!

  • @dnuma5852
    @dnuma5852 2 года назад +1

    gotta love the glenn gould goldberg variations

  • @roxanneconner7185
    @roxanneconner7185 2 года назад +1

    I'm so glad we have science so I can watch this at 3 am

  • @crewrangergaming9582
    @crewrangergaming9582 2 года назад +1

    thanks for crediting our friend Water

  • @Dragonmastur24
    @Dragonmastur24 2 года назад +2

    ah yes, 2016: the days of old 56K mp2 compression!!
    ***breathes in the nostalgia***

  • @frostchain2362
    @frostchain2362 2 года назад +2

    I assume the slow start of the droplet on the hill is because of a difference between the wettability gradient and the gravitational potential energy gradient?

  • @amafangames
    @amafangames 2 года назад +1

    This will have 3 million views by 2025

  • @UTKETCHUP
    @UTKETCHUP 2 года назад +5

    Gotta say, algorithm does its magic sometimes

  • @kluwer1
    @kluwer1 2 года назад +2

    I could make a meme out of this

  • @johnchessant3012
    @johnchessant3012 2 года назад +1

    Nice choice of music (Bach "Goldberg Variations")

    • @dnuma5852
      @dnuma5852 2 года назад +1

      recorded by glenn gould as well, very nice

  • @dunichtich100
    @dunichtich100 2 года назад +1

    So water can flow uphil 🤯

  • @cardijey6918
    @cardijey6918 2 года назад +2

    Interesting scientific video with proper methods.
    COMIC SANS IN THE CREDITS

  • @Mr.BobsDog
    @Mr.BobsDog 2 года назад +1

    You’re a wizard Harry

  • @grynsight
    @grynsight 2 года назад +7

    does the water get colder after it moved on a gradient?

    • @HotelPapa100
      @HotelPapa100 2 года назад +1

      Nah, it falls into an adhesion well.

    • @grynsight
      @grynsight 2 года назад +1

      @@HotelPapa100 shouldnt it get colder tho? It does fall into adhesion well due to a fact it is liquid al has a surface tension, it does come from the fact its particles are kinetically bashing around.
      I can imagine that this energy to move a droplet actually comes from its potential energy in a form of temperature.

    • @HotelPapa100
      @HotelPapa100 2 года назад +2

      @@grynsight The molecules on its surface kinda change state, by orienting themselves with regards to the surface of the substrate. It's almost as if the surface turns into a solid film. I'd regard the energy that is freed as similar to the latent energy that is freed when a liquid solidifies.
      These state-changes are isothermic; the stochastic velocity of the molecules remains at the same distribution.

  • @dehanbadenhorst1398
    @dehanbadenhorst1398 2 года назад +1

    Ah, Glenn Gould. My favourite interpreter of Bach!

  • @SocialDownclimber
    @SocialDownclimber 2 года назад +5

    Love seeing the advancing contact angle drop as it goes up the gradient : )

  • @thomasstewart9752
    @thomasstewart9752 2 года назад +3

    This is also how solder flows on a heat gradient!

  • @Arlon2003
    @Arlon2003 2 года назад +1

    Cool. Ich bau in der wüste ein Waaserkraftwerk un lass das Wasser cyrkulieren.

  • @edouardrenaud5517
    @edouardrenaud5517 2 года назад +1

    bro credited bach

  • @saurabhchandra6267
    @saurabhchandra6267 2 года назад +2

    Surface tension. It depends on the liquid and material in contact. Mercury tends to repel glass whereas water tends to stick to glass.

    • @SoftBreadSoft
      @SoftBreadSoft 11 месяцев назад

      cohesive-adhesive forces
      surface tension is the effect of cohesion.

  • @neeltheother2342
    @neeltheother2342 2 года назад

    Major props for playing the Goldberg Variations in the background.

  • @RealChairNotFake
    @RealChairNotFake 2 года назад +1

    hi mr algorithm

  • @dillondank5662
    @dillondank5662 2 года назад +1

    Why do I have the feeling this video's views and comments are about to blow up EXPONENTIALLY

  • @yeetdosis39
    @yeetdosis39 2 года назад

    Once the algorithm brings us back here in 5 years may everything actually be peaceful and NOT FUCKING 450 HISTORICAL EVENTS HAPPENING AT ONCE

  • @goattheoak
    @goattheoak 2 года назад

    Let’s see how many people the algorithm ropes in
    Current views: 65,809

  • @wotshish
    @wotshish 2 года назад +1

    witchcraft

  • @GeneralBays
    @GeneralBays 2 года назад

    You got a like on the first example.
    You would've gotten a second like from the second example, if it was possible!

  • @kalidwapur
    @kalidwapur 2 года назад

    I'll start putting music over my recordings too. Neurons spiking to the doom Soundtrack. That'll make conferences more fun

  • @AlexTrusk91
    @AlexTrusk91 2 года назад

    Now build a staircase ( jk, obviously wouldn't work. Or would it....? :D )

  • @kivilcimsiz
    @kivilcimsiz 2 года назад

    2016 is too late for this. Should've been from 2009 or something.

  • @rooh5825
    @rooh5825 2 года назад

    In the United States, a university would waste a 2 million dollar public grant from the government making something like this.

  • @chulocat2581
    @chulocat2581 2 года назад

    The unknown perfume oddly file because snowflake syntactically grab past a responsible pants. ready, needy ocelot

  • @antoniopacelli
    @antoniopacelli 2 года назад

    Good things , the Asiatic deserts are by now a thing of the past!
    Gobi desert we are coming at you from the Depths of the Oceans !
    Did you noticed that experiment who proves that Salt water passing through ultra Hydrophobic surfaces generated Electricity?!?!?!
    Isn't that awesome ?!?!
    Going to Gobi and with Class...
    Good choice for the Goldenberg Variation.
    Just one thing :
    All this ideas come from a past so ancient the People who thought those first are by now already dead..
    And they were all already feasible ideas...
    Shame on everyone.

  • @orangeapples
    @orangeapples 2 года назад

    Wait, we’re allowed to post witchcraft you RUclips?

  • @manKan379
    @manKan379 2 года назад

    why are there so many comments that are just personifying inanimate objects???

  • @Einheit101
    @Einheit101 2 года назад

    "Someday the water simply decided to flow upwards. Turned out - George just kept filming all the time"

  • @ScoochieR
    @ScoochieR 2 года назад

    How about actually documenting this? Filming something and putting music over the top is poxy.

  • @trc8197
    @trc8197 2 года назад

    Five years youtube has been hiding water can go uphill? This whole time I thought water was lazy but I'm just gullible.

  • @matthewitt2276
    @matthewitt2276 2 года назад

    Ah, yes. The old "wettability" trope. How quaint.

  • @abdullahalhashmi5739
    @abdullahalhashmi5739 2 года назад

    Tbh, I expected a more solid performance after reading all the comments praising Mr. Water.

  • @will9828
    @will9828 2 года назад

    I don't exactly unterstand what this is, but I want one of those magic square thingy, i'm sold!

  • @RijuChatterjee
    @RijuChatterjee 2 года назад

    Dude I literally just found out about this phenomenon today at a conference talk. Google is scary.

  • @jadjoaquinquesada-khoury6176
    @jadjoaquinquesada-khoury6176 2 года назад

    Anyone know that specific Bach/Gould piece?

  • @huraqan3761
    @huraqan3761 2 года назад

    Nice principle but the comic sans font in the credits is really off-putting x'D

  • @BranGrizz
    @BranGrizz 2 года назад

    wonder if it's center of mass is actually moving uphill

  • @rsid5644
    @rsid5644 2 года назад

    Some vague and random Portal 2 vibes with that water sliding up that ramp >:)

  • @joshbowman7114
    @joshbowman7114 2 года назад

    Interesting but that music was trash. Sounded like it was being played by a kids music toy through a tin can.

  • @ahobimo732
    @ahobimo732 2 года назад

    TFW the algorithm straightup flexes on you.

  • @AdamantineAxe
    @AdamantineAxe 2 года назад

    Narrator: After years of struggle, Dihydrogen Monoxide got his big break after assuming a stage name

  • @intratis
    @intratis 2 года назад

    Water is very powerful, if you can prove however the surface you're filming on is perfectly level to begin with that is, assuming we know nothing about the centreweighted average of a cmos sensor . . . :D

  • @deei5130
    @deei5130 2 года назад

    Could you like, yk, make an infinite loop of moving water like that? Water would go up, fall, flow back and go up again?

  • @viatranquilla
    @viatranquilla 2 года назад

    That's almost like how they bought New York from the Indians, but then it was shiny watch bobbles and trinkets..

  • @fafablablabla
    @fafablablabla 2 года назад

    Bruh, yesterday I had a lecture about wettability and just now I got this recommended wth

  • @rolls_8798
    @rolls_8798 2 года назад

    got sent home from school because of floods, and here I am watching a 5 year old video with stock music and unbelievable black magic fuckery

  • @froginthemachine
    @froginthemachine 2 года назад

    this seems like something I would've come across in 2008 but it was posted so recently lol