I live in Chile so I can elaborate in some topics. Doug Tompkins bought a lot of wild areas in southern Chile and started the Douglas Tompkins foundation, creating several Parks and accomplishing his conservation intents. Chilean government and industry doesn't give a crap about nature, so Doug's efforts here were really impactful. After his dead, Doug's foundation donated ALL of this wild areas to Chilean park administration, and now they are part of the Chilean National Park system officially. We are all very grateful of the conservation ideals that Tompkins pursued and thanks to him we can enjoy this beautiful places. Nice video, Levi, keep up the good work!
interesting perspective. i heard some pushback against tompkins on the ground from some locals directly involved in the tourism industry. but hey those were the perspectives of two people with a skin in the game.
@@seanjones2456 lol there has been Corruption in the American election system since JFK...... You don't remember daddy helped him win? So why is everyone acting like people who don't trust the system is a new thing?.... Weren't the democrats the election deniers In 2016 when trump won?......
Im from Patagonia, Chile and I would like to share that I was lucky enough to meet Doug and Yvon in person while I working a couple of kilometres away from Doug’s park “Parque Patagonia”, both of them are amazing characters and funny enough they wear each other’s clothing, Doug on his Snap-t and Yvon with his Denali, lots of locals including me were pretty sad when we found out that “Uncle Doug” has passed away, but his contributions still live on and still protected, locals admire his wish to protect the land 🙌
I work for Patagonia and when Yvonne announced the news of earth being the only shareholder it was an astounding feeling and really brings me joy working for a company who truly cares about their people and their well-being and the environment of course putting their money where their mouth is! Let’s see if other companies will follow!!!
I used to work for the umbrella company that owns The North Face and I can tell you that from my personal point of view, I felt like the "efforts" were simply because consumers wanted it and because competitors were doing so. It never felt genuine and they merely rode on Patagonia's coat tails with sustainability and social issues. There were real efforts by employees to make significant strides, but in the end, umbrella company seemed to care more about sales and what's "cool" aka collabs. Ultimately I left because I too, felt like my work and talents were just going towards pushing people to buy things they do not need.
I do work for VF at the moment and I partially agree, I would say that the impression is that higher up the focus is ultimately on selling more but I also would say that most people working for VF really care about moving more towards sustainability and that recently heading more in that direction is therefore not only cause other do
It's like some food companies offering organic version of their products, not to help the planet and offer healthier choices, but rather to make more money.
Are you suggesting that there are in fact corporations who put anything over profit? I think all make environmental gestures only as their financial situation allows. They have a PR team, and that team finds them “green” opportunities that they can show to their customers, so the customer feels like a good guy using their product. It is psychological manipulation, which have been calling advertisement for a century.
An undervalued part of Patagonia's mission is its support of small businesses doing great things for the environment. A handful of guys saw an opportunity to recycle the massive fishing nets that litter beaches and clog oceans. Bureo started out making skateboard decks and sunglass frames. Patagonia took interest and supported them. Now Bureo is making NetPlus materials for all kinds of uses, including Patagonia Baggies... The company has processed almost 6,000,000 pounds of discarded fishing nets.
Patagonia actually shares where they make their clothes (more sustainably) so other brands can follow! I really admire that they are such a selfless brand ❤
At the end of the day they are just selling cloths. The message behind the company is to just to get you to spend your money. The messaging behind companies just plays with your emotions. Both company’s make the majority of their goods in china and other emerging markets. Don’t let your feelings deceive you.
I love that I can get my clothes repaired by Patagonia. Their jeans are almost the only pants that I wear and I’ve had some of them repaired now three times! I also really value that they were were made sustainably both in terms of the environment and the treatment/compensation of the people who made them. I’m happy then to pay the higher cost because I know that I am getting a high quality product that can be repaired and will last many many years.
Patagonia has been actively involved with conservation and re-wilding efforts throughout South America, especially in Argentina and Chile. They have donated purchased and donated large land masses to national wildlife parks in Latin America. They are helping reintroduce wildlife to parts of South America that have been exterminated out of existence. I applaud their efforts.
I remember when I got into snowboarding in the mid 90s. That’s where I got exposed to really smart outer wear. Back then I got the impression that Patagonia was innovative, original and eye wateringly expensive. Tnf was doing what everyone else had been doing, several years behind. And was affordable. They reminded me of Columbia. I am now a middle age carpenter in coastal New England. After all this time, work wear companies are noticing the loss to mountain wear companies and are finally making their clothes for people who move for a living. I recently learned that Patagonia has been making carpenter styled pants out of hemp. I might just get some when my current stock starts blowing out. Hemp is supposed to be super durable. If they can make them a little stretchy by that time, I’ll pay whatever.
Cool! I have ALWAYS included durability in purchasing since hanging with Valley cliimbers. It was enlightening, and I have some clothes 15-20 years old that remain more acceptable than grubby denim. While stretchy still requires that oil-based elastane or neoprene, the former CAN be woven with hemp, and should be FAR tougher than cotton. Hemp is ancient ship ropes/lines, and does not spring back from stretch, so I'd expect that problem. Duct tape, the common repair onsite for minter wear, seems not so evident in the impress-others-with-wealth present, though indispensable so far.
I have the pants you're referring to and I highly recommend them. There's no stretch, but the hemp is soft and feels pre-broken in (unlike duck cotton pants, like Carhartt) while still maintaining its durability.
I work in forestry and I have the Patagonia hemp pants. They've lasted 3 years so far and still going strong. They're the most durable pants I've ever owned. All other pants barely make it 6 months before holes appear.
I also got some patagonia hemp pants and they were great. I tend to put them through pretty tough wear, and even though the hems frayed, they never got holes in the knees. The pockets did blow out, but I blame that on them being cotton pockets ; )
Little did you know, Patagonia would change the game completely 9 months later! In no way this video or its message has become irrelevant but just giving away the company to a new-founded non-profit and foundation would've been a huge point here. I've been a huge fan of Patagonia as a brand and supported their approach to sustainability for years now but this was just a major step unprecedented not only in fashion!
@@SoldierAssassin98 Yvonne and his family donated their ENTIRE ownership of Patagonia to a nonprofit foundation. Patagonia is now dedicated 100% to the environment, forever. They will never, ever go the route of North Face.
@@cd4984 As far as I know (feel free to correct me), Patagonia has no other owners or investors now, besides the nonprofit. But to be pedantic (and honest) here, ALL entities operating financially, whether “for profit” or “nonprofit”, have to be financially sustainable, and that means “profitable”, in a loose sense of the word. A nonprofit might rely on donations and grants, but it still has a budget, and is bound by that budget. What’s different is the reasoning, not the flow of capital. A for-profit business exists to grow profits and/or valuation for the benefit of the owners. A nonprofit exists to apply its budget for the benefit of others. If the nonprofit can operate a “profitable business”, then it is growing its budget. Patagonia had annual revenues of $209M last year. Let’s say 20% of that was profit (I don’t know for sure, I didn’t dig that far). That’s around $40M that can be applied to either grow the business (new products, new stores, etc), or be spent on charitable causes. And some of it should be applied to growth, which should a: lead to a long-term growth in their charitable budget, and b: should protect them from losing revenue/profit (and thus budget) due to competition or market changes. In a for-profit, the money they can invest in charity now would instead become dividends to shareholders, or be reinvested to grow the value of the company. That’s the only real difference, but it’s a HUGE difference. Dismissing Patagonia’s move to nonprofit status as “no different” is unfair and wrong.
@@davestagner Yvonne and his family donated their ENTIRE ownership of Patagonia to a nonprofit foundation CREATED BY THEM. They didn't do it to send 100% of the money to the environment, they did it so they could skip 100% of the taxes on transferring the company to his children. This same tactic has been used countless times by billionaires for PR and evading taxes. When I heard about Patagonia doing so much for the environment I was genuinely so happy, but alas, the truth is contrary to what they will have you believe.
I’ll always be a Patagonia customer, and in terms of companies I think Patagonia has the clear win of The North Face in terms of sustainability, innovation and even quality of products. It actually drive me crazy how many climbers keep their North Face sponsorships since the companies current state and direction is so far away from whatever environmental and ethical integrity that it started out with from Doug - that’s a very specific gripe within the climbing industry though. In terms of legacies left, Patagonia has always been used as a vehicle to promote, encourage and innovate - fight the good fight from the inside consumerism if you will - even if Yvon has long since stepped away from an active business role within the company, his direction in the early years has inspired millions and that’s a legacy that will probably outlast the company. The North Face as a reflection of Doug seems pretty negligible since he left so long ago and in my mind his conservation efforts are those of a private citizen, which seems pretty bloody impressive. It’s just unfortunate that he did create a company that cares more about turning profit than the planet that it’s marketing itself off of.
This is such a well thought-out and developed comment, thank you for taking the time to share with us! We totally agree with your statement on climbers keeping their TNF sponsorships, there's so many other options for outdoor gear for them to choose from. You're right that it's an industry-level issue though, and we may or may not be releasing future videos talking more about the outdoor clothing market and how it's changed over time, so stay tuned 😉👀
Loved this! My friend pokes fun at me for buying Patagonia because it's more expensive and he refers to it as Patagucci. This video has really helped me! I had no idea about the origins of The North Face. Just goes to show what different paths a brand can take when the founder leaves the company and takes his original vision and passion with him. In the meantime, BRB, just going to buy some $890 Gucci x North Face 'slides' so I can go hiking in what look like some woolly slippers.
Patagucci imo has more to do with the fact that if you're buying Patagonia or North face gear you're spending more money on a name when you could be buying from Columbia or other less expensive, high(er in my personal experience) quality gear companies if you just do your research instead of buying for the brand.
@@jules7926 Patagucci was a term that I think was coined when Patagonia was widely used as Wall Street types as their "uniform"... Especially the vest. And I guess it also refers to the high price tag for outdoor active wear.
TNF has really good marketing, and Patagonia is kind of behind the curtains. Collab with Supreme brought a lot of attention to hypebeasts. With Gucci to trend setters. Patagonia focuses on other things IMO.
Hey, loving the new channel! I've done a lot of research on Thompkins' conservation efforts for undergraduate research projects. Deep Ecology was an organization separate from his direct conservation projects that was intended to promote the ideas of deep Ecology around the world (they used to have a website, I can't find it anymore either). Conservation Land Trust and Conservacion Patagonica were the conservation projects. All three foundations are now the Thompkins foundation. I also think it's very important to note Kristine McDivitt Tompkins' contributions. She helped found Patagonia and was CEO for much of it's rise. She contributed massively both financially and managerially to Doug's conservation efforts. Also, Thompkins foundation has protected more like 14 million acres of land.
In my opinion both actions are important...we need all sort of changes to achieve the best results. Change the brand from inside to help create a new way of looking at sustainable fashion is great and helpful, but we also need actions that have a direct impact on the environment to help to preserve it while our mentality shift!
I find these kind of informative videos really helpful to keep updated with our consumerism’s behavior. As outdoor enthusiasts we often fall on our own trap of buying from brands and assume they care about the environment just because you know “obviously they care about nature if they’re in this kind of business “ right? The thing is that is really important to keep our own values on track when answering questions such as the ones you propose at the end: do I need this? Is it second hand? Etc and of course forget about what social standards “drilled” into our heads about status, luxury and the concept of necessity.
Insightful video, great storytelling and really well-produced too! Your case 'against' The North Face is a bit thin in places though. Offering 100% recycled fabrics and then marketing them in such a way that they are appealing to fashionistas who would otherwise never buy sustainable clothing is a win for everyone, and I think Patagonia would agree. They wouldn't be an activist company if they'd object to others copying their environmentally friendly ideas (a bit like Tesla 'giving away' its patents). So calling that greenwashing is perhaps a bit harsh. Other than that: great work! I would be interested in more digging into what really makes companies 'green', since just about every outdoors company claims to be sustainable.
That's a super fair assessment, thanks for bringing that to our attention. We're working on more videos on the outdoor clothing industry, so stay tuned for those. Thanks for the lovely feedback!
Totally this. Greenwashing would be marketing a product as "sustainable" because it contains recycled content, even if that is only 10%. TNF has a long way to go, but they are also a hell of a lot further down the road than a lot of brands
I live in Ventura California and I started to hear about Patagonia about 5 years ago and I started to like the idea about buying less but quality products to help the planet. since then I'm just not buying clothes as before and I prefer Patagonia. Another point is that Patagonia workers are treated nice from what I heard here in the store located in Ventura :)
I have an interview for a job opportunity at Patagonia later today, I am honestly so excited. Thank you for your information about both brands represented here, I’ve learnt so much.
Great research. I got my 1st Patagonia jacket this past winter. I was looking at many other companies, including North Face. I'm very happy with the jacket. Knowing the background just confirms that it was a good purchase.
Hey man, loved your video and I’m a proud owner of both brands functional items for my mountaineering expeditions. Just thought that you missed one point not he The North Face is how much they’ve pushed the sport of climbing, and all mountain stuff with their athletes especially. I believe it’s really a big part of their DNA and I salute them for that.
As someone born and raised in Patagonia (the actual place) I can tell you that Douglas Tompkins did so much to protect the Patagonian region by buying that amount of land. Because of it, multinationals trying to take our natural resources were blocked. The brand Patagonia, has not really done nothing for us (not that they have to anyways) besides cultural appropriation by using our name.
Dear Pablo...you will be happy to know that the owners of Patagonia have been significant supports of Tompkins Conservation's work and have been major investors in conserving the lands you mentioned.
I agree bro.....you dont wear recycled synthetics in the mountains. You wear wool/Down. Patagonia, TNF & Starbucks preach giving back, sustainability and cultural awareness. Total bullshit! People buy into the feel good phraseology and dream of making the world safer.
Was it turquoise. Are you in Switzerland. I just sold one online before Xmas - as I have several and opted to let go of the turquoise one :) you never know. Stranger things have happened.
Patagonia has been known as Patagucci in Seattle since the 80's. The Patagonia store was the place people who wanted to look like they did outdoor stuff went for clothing, and REI was where the people who actually did outdoor stuff went. I've never owned anything Patagonia. When I was young and broke, I would mostly buy Columbia, but for something critical, like my main rain jacket, I would upgrade to the REI house brand. Now, I stick with the REI house brand.
I’ve always called it patagucci too and definitely chaff at how “cool” it is. But they’ve undeniably used their cool for good. No other company has made wearing patched gear not only practical but cool. I think this is incredible for the planet.
Levi just a tiny correction... Mount Fitz Roy is actually in Argentina, located in Los Glaciares National Park close to the Chilean border. Awesome video anyway. Hope you have a great start to 2022.
I recently just found that buying second hand is my new passion in life. My significant partner laughs at me because she's known this forever. It's hugely satisfying to find the best gear, in great condition for 1/3 or 1/4 or the price.
Patagonia makes extremely high quality fatigues for our military here in the US - so there’s that (I’ll let you individually decide if you like that or not)
My favorite brands ranked 1) Arcteryx 2) Mountain Hardwear 3) Patagonia 4) Black Diamond 5) Columbia (Love Their Fleece Jackets) 6) The North Face 7) Cotopaxi 8) Outdoor Research
Yeah. Dead bird is number one for me too. Patagonia second. Mountain HW has good stuff though the gore tex ski pants I got for. Them has a prematurely.
Both were right, imo. Most company founders don't even consider sustainability these days. If we get every company founder/CEO to consider sustainability on a major scale, we're all better off in the long run, regardless of the path they take
They are all same - Patagonia, vf (northface), anta sports (arcteryx). They are all clothing manufacturers and retailers selling clothes to masses, all over the world. BTW, Doug created a national park in Chile. If Patagonia cares about the environment so much, why are they opening new stores all over the world to sell clothing to people who really do not need them, but aspire to.
I have a couple of items from both brands that I love, but now prefer to see if I can get a good deal on Patagonia stuff, because it seems to last longer. I also love Fjallraven, because they make stuff that lasts and also focus on sustainability. Generally, I just want stuff that I can use for years, cause I don't get bored of my clothes or bags that easily.
Back in the early 70's, I bought my first North Face jacket. It was bombproof. The quality was top-notch. It was expensive, but worth it. Eventually, I needed to replace it and I bought a similar looking North Face jacket at REI in the mid-80's. Almost immediately, I noticed the quality was bad. The zipper constantly got snagged or went off-track. The fabric surface quickly showed signs of delamination . I talked with a friend who was an REI employee and, given the number of customer returns, he agreed that North Face's quality had gotten bad. North Face had lowered its quality and price to stay competitive and appeal to everyone; not just backpackers, climbers, hikers, etc. North Face's quality is just slightly better than similar apparels sold by Old Navy, The GAP, Walmart, Target, etc.
North Face quality has gotten pretty bad. I don't even think of them as an outdoor brand gear anymore tbh. They're a brand for city people who want to look outdoorsy.
When I lived in Canada I used to wear my ski jacket almost every day during winter. And I see no issue with that. I needed a ski jacket years before that to ski (it was cheaper to buy it on sale than ranting) so when I moved there, it was what I had. It works better than normal winter jackets. And I see it as a sustainable approach because the most sustainable thing to wear is what you already have.
I served as one of four Co-chairs of 350Montana for a number of years. We received significant financial support from Patagonia on several occasions. They do indeed support enviornmental efforts.
I know pitting two popular companies against each other is Good For The Algorithm™, but it's not a zero-sum-game here. A larger brand like North Face pivoting to more sustainable materials/packaging/etc is a net good for the planet. It doesn't really matter if Patagonia "did it earlier," and North Face throwing their buying power around in the source material market is going to make it easier other companies to get recycled product.
What is the pivot with partnerships with Supreme and Gucci to name two about then? It's counter productive. You may argue it will bring others into the outdoors, but let's face it, the majority who are TNF die hards over the last few years, especially during COVID wouldn't want their TNF jackets getting too wet alone dirty out walking the trails and wherever else.
Patagonia is my favorite brand period! These products are not only sourced smart but are made extremely well and last! I cannot give this brand enough praise and hope other brands follow suit.
Nice video! New sub here. Here's my ramblings on this subject below: I was a fan of The North Face back in the Doug days right up until the Vanity Fair buyout. I liked the quality of their gear and their over all direction. In that time they seemed to have the technical market covered. After the VF buyout I could notice the quality changing and the prices going up. I think it's been the same ever since. To me The North Face is more a fashion company now catering to the people like you said in the video that think they need outdoor gear when they really don't (whether it's as a status symbol or whatever). Don't get me wrong they do still have some pieces of gear at the very high end that you might take on a serious adventure but overall not so great for what you're paying for. Patagonia. I've always been a fan and honestly they seem to be (and always have been) the lighthouse in the fog. Other companies have gone up and come back down, come onto the scene and faded. Patagonia though has never moved away from care of the environment, innovation, and just doing things right. Yes it's expensive stuff (ie the term Patagucci getting thrown out so much) but unlike a pair of The North Face Gucci collaboration boots you know well it'll last for a long time through many adventures. When it's about time to retire the gear you can send it back to Patagonia for repair or even get something in return if it's beyond fixing. This is where Patagonia is reaching above. There's the Used Wear store, there's the articles and diys on how to fix your own equipment, etc. Do you see anything like this from The North Face? I'll answer that for you I don't. Mountain Hardwear. I've got a "love hate" relationship with these guys. I absolutely loved this company when it started out right up until Colombia Sportswear bought them out. Today they are a shell of their former selves. This was a company you could count on having highly technical gear, made with input from athletes in the field mountaineering 8000m peaks, to serious trail hikers, to everyone in between. The equipment wasn't cheap, but the quality and innovation weren't either. They typically used the best materials and designs for the intended product. People expecting to use their apparel as casual gear or even their equipment casually complained that it didn't work but it wasn't for them. Sizing was for made for athletes or someone that was serious about their outdoor adventures. Not only this you could count on them having the same models of jackets, pants, hats, etc every year but maybe with some color changes or improvements. Nowadays I liken them to a fast fashion type of company. The positives I just spoke of are gone. They make products for that year and then they are gone. When they've revisited a famous product from the past like the Windstopper Tech Fleece Jacket it's been a horrible knock off of the original, quality wise, sizing wise, etc. It's not like there isn't Gore Windstopper fabric anymore as I've bought some to make jackets of my own design, it's that they are too cheap. In all fairness I get what motivated them to sell to Colombia and I bet there's some very talented people at Mountain Hardwear, but they are limited and handicapped by Colombia Sportwear and by extension stockholders where it's a public company. This brings up another good point Patagonia is one of a handful of private companies with no other corporate overlord or stockholders. For Patagonia those are the employees. Does this help their efforts? I think so completely. Westcomb. I didn't know much about these guys until in the last few years but I'm really liking what they do. Production is in Canada 100%. To me they are Mountain Hardwear at the beginning. Unlike Mountain Hardwear they've stayed true to their roots. I have several pieces of their gear and it's about as high notch as you can get. I see other once high end companies in the industry following suit of Mountain Hardwear and The North Face. Arcteryx unfortunately is going the same direction. I wasn't worried when they decided to move production out of Canada. I figured they would be one of the few companies that could turn that negative into a positive. It's worked for a long while but I think it's finally wearing off. Their quality has diminished while prices have skyrocketed. I wouldn't be surprised if they aren't more of a fashion company in a decade like The North Face. There's many more examples of this in the industry which makes me keep turning back to Patagonia.
im wearing a patagonia tshirt at this very moment, which i bought over 10 years ago and have been using frequently. I can vouch for the quality of their products for sure! for some reason ive never bought anything else patagonia, i think ill change that
Holy shit man, Doug owned Esprit and TNF? Bro, I’ve been wearing Esprit literally since 2008 and it’s mindblowing. What’s even crazier is Patagonia and TNF owners are actually friends
One comment I heard regarding The North Face is that it has become more associated with casual city wear, especially with one of their more popular sellers being the puffy Retro Nuptse Jacket (which in my opinion is more for aesthetic than function), and this has seemed to occur alongside a slight drop in product build quality. I personally only ever owned a backpack and a tent from TNF so I can't judge their outdoor clothing quality, but if the comments from these wearers are true then my best guess is that they are just deciding to appeal to a different demographic than before. And like you showed with their strange collaborations, it seems their company's "intent" is just vastly different from Patagonia now. However if their quality is decreasing, their costs (which are as high as Patagonia on comparable items) then seem out of place to me.
I have owned 3 north face coats and all of them have gone the distance, I use them for hiking, mountaineering, mountain biking and general use. I have only had to replace the zip on one of them, they are great coats. I think they now have an array of products which go all the way from consumer to enthusiast.
I'm not sure, but it may all be fabricated in China or SE Asia. Expect cost-cutting everywhere -- TOO many MBAs infest the world, still the most common postgrad degree, and TOTALLY absent ethics, now a miniscule course in only a FEW universities/colleges.
Can confirm, for my city North Face is way too popular. Lots of high school kids have a North Face backpack and lots of adults have North Face jackets that they wear casually.
TNF has different lines. Their consumer line is just shit, and wouldn't last at all as actual outdoor gear. Their actual outdoor gear however, is pretty much as expensive as all other top tier brands and have excellent quality.
I have a synthetic insulated jacket, a down parka and a few micro fleeces etc by North Face. I’ve found it all well made and looks fine after years of wear. My partner has a few fleeces and down jackets and a shell jacket. Again, all well made a long lasting. The zips, stitching, cut, materials are all good. Maybe they have a line of clothing that’s cheaper that I haven’t encountered. The ubiquitousness of the brand has devalued it in the eyes of outdoors types but I’ve found that it’s really on a par with most of the currently sought after brands like Ar’teryx, Rab etc. Those brands are just where North Face were in the 90s. Once they start being worn by everyone, hikers and climbers etc. will move on to some other brands to distance themselves from the general populace.
An important thing not mentioned. North Face was purchased by VF corporation in 2000. This is the company that owns timberland, jansport, dickies, vans, and supreme. They are much more focused at profits than they are conservation and quality products.
Great video, even tho maybe a bit bias ;) !! Patagonia is a common case study used in MBAs during classes about sustainability and ethics. It's not the most "international" of brands (I live in Malaysia and we don't have stores here or even boutiques that sell them)... I purchased my first Patagonia items when I lived in Zurich over winter for 6 months and love the brand and the products and their post purchase service (repairs at the end of the winter season is commonplace!). North Face is definitely more global and can be found in most countries... As much as I might have liked them in the early days, their "street" collaborations and their ridiculous Gucci collaboration has turned me off the brand. I much prefer Patagonia's sustainability message...
Another piece worth noting is that Chouinard Equipment (the actual climbing hardware) was rebranded as Black Diamond in the late 80's. Any climber out there knows Black Diamond gear as being one of the world's leading brands for nuts, cams, harnesses, ropes etc...
As someone who just bought a patagonia raincoat for hiking one of the reasons i chose it over a north face jacket is how clearly north face focuses on fashion over function now, while patagonia still hasnt lost sight of the main purpose of its gear.
Thank you for the informative video.. I am an outdoorsman myself and never really considered Patagonia wear because of price. I do have a couple of Northface coats and was very happy that they replaced a broken zipper for free. I thought that simply reflected a company's commitment to quality; Ihope that also reflects a more sustainable direction for NF. Looking back I fervently admire Yvon's philosophies. I think though rather than run out and start buying Patagonia equipment I can be a better planetary citizen by buying less stuff and that includes unneeded clothes.
For sure, and the idea with Patagonia and what they want you to do is once those clothes are unusable you then buy Patagonia gear which can continue to be repaired
North Face is a fantastic brand, a 5th of the price of Canada Goose or Montclair for a goose down jacket, Patagonia is a great brand too but i don’t think either founder made any mistakes, each is as it should be
Even though I’ve generally supported The North Face, I’ve definitely seen them come out with a lot more collaborations-or just outdoor gear in general- that seems to be focused more on aesthetics than functionality. I like a lot of their staple products (the Denali fleece, thermoball jackets are decent) but I’m not a fan of the random fashion collabs. I’m not opposed to the fashion industry wholesale but I just have more respect for outdoor brands who try to increase their market share by product innovation, not Gucci collabs. Very interesting video! It’s my first one and I will definitely be watching more.
TNF for a while had moved where the market was going: streetwear. However, over the past 10 years, they've sort of went back to basics in terms of their technical clothing collab with lots of athletes, while still marketing to the masses in streetwear and trickle down from their high priced technical clothing for the subaru lovin outdoorsy crowds. I think TNF technical clothing has been remarkable over the past 10 years. Unfortunately, it is ridiculously expensive (e.g. AMK, Flight, Steep, Summit L System), but ridiculously good.
Never seen any real outdoor enthusiast wear any of those... maybe some wearing patagonia, but north face really unseen on hiking trails. It's a lifestyle brand.
Actually, please look into Hap Klopp who actually acquired The North Face in 1968, created the logo and took on Doug‘s vision and values for the North Face. He was then CEO for the next 20 years, created the famous logo and concepts like their unique lifetime warranty concepts for all products sold by the north face. He also led multiple social activism projects and also had a yearly catalog to promote environmental activism. So he clearly took on Dougs‘ values until the company was then sold again. I worked with him and can clearly confirm his passion for making the world a better place. ;))
I’m really into rock climbing and the north face is one of climbing’s biggest sponsors so I have a natural affinity for them. I do wish that they would get back to their roots and stop some of the mainstream collabs (supreme, Gucci, etc…) But I like the fact that they’re a little more affordable than Patagonia and don’t come with the same type of sort of “look at me, I wear Patagonia, and drive a Tesla, and own every piece of apple equipment there is” kind of image. And maybe that’s just around here, but that’s kinda the feeling that I get from Patagonia, kind of an elitist “I care more about the world than you do” feeling, I dunno. I do have some Patagonia gear though so I don’t think you can go wrong with either gear wise. So yep, a little hypocrisy on my part but that’s my rant for the day so…….Great video though dude✌🏽😃✌🏽
Well I have cash down on a Tesla,but NOT for social reasons. If it looked exactly as my 95 pathfiinder, I'd still buy one. In SPITE of Musk being a benighted libertarian. His initiative against the dinosaurian IC Engine makers is spawning FAST change. Entrenched conservatives fatuously and submissively serving $ as bottom-line for-profit investors remains a problem. PaTAGONIA DESIGNS Still make big-waisted tent clothes, which is their only problem. Baggy is cold in wind.
Fjällräven is great, if you don't mind the vintage look. I remember they were nearly impossible to find outside of Europe, and now they seem to be super trendy (or at least the Kanken bags are). I hope their popularity doesn't lead to a decline in quality. Also, I like the effort they put into saving arctic foxes. Another Swedish company that makes good stuff (and more modern, despite being a much older company) is Haglöfs. I think they are about on par with Arc'teryx. I have a couple The North Face parkas. They're alright, not that great. Some of the hard plastic parts - buckles, etc. - and elastic drawstrings broke rather quickly, and the lining of one split. I also have a sleeping bag, it's fine, no issues. I probably won't be buying any more of their products though.
Fjallraven is made in china. Like most companies that were once local, they are now manufactured overseas, this contradicting their environmental pursuits
Great video! I knew Patagonia was more about conservation and activism, but didn't know it was so hardcore. I always thought of North Face as just another fashion brand. Glad I wasn't too far off. Although I'm not really outdoorsey, when I need something for the outdoors, I gravitate to MEC. Good bang for the buck and their stuff tries to be sustainable.
Interesting video. I knew about TNF before Patagonia and have bought TNF outwear. However, I will soon be buying Patagonia because they have a place in my wardrobe. Both are businesses and need to make money; whatever their credentials, like the 'average man in the street' they could both do more than what they advertise they are doing..
Patagonia is a brand I can actually feel good supporting. North Face sells $50 hoodies at Kohl's. Horridly made hoodies. I feel like my Patagonia stuff is going to last me most of my life, but TNF stuff will be in the Goodwill bin in a year or 2.
From a fashion standpoint, North Face's style can fit in with urban streetwear, while Patagonia's style makes one look like a tropical bird - their color pallet is more oceanic. I like both.
Go see the documentary 180 south, the founders speak on their freindship and how they traveled through the panamerican route to the Patagonia back in the day
I was considering a North Face ski jacket but decided against because it is just another huge corporate company. Just bought my forever jacket from Patagonia after they dedicated their company to the environment. Easy math to do.
Dude, this video was so pleasing to watch. Long time Patagonia fan and outdoor enthusiast. This is the first video I’ve seen of yours, instant follow 👏🏼
Some soon to be 20 years ago I bought a Lowe Alpine hardshell jacket with their triple point layering. I wore it up and down mountains, bicyling, citylife, bad weather, good weather, Summer, Winter, I wore it in a desert as well. It is only now, that the middle layer is wearing out and flaking off. Not a scratch, not a sewing is gone, no holes in fabric, no zipper problems apart from a pull that broke off and I just inserted a key ring, which works better with gloves anyway. I never impregnated it, and it's just watertight right up untill now, when the triple point layer is falling apart. Needless to say, I still wear that jacket. I bought a Fjällräven Bergtagen jacket, and while good, there is no way it can compete with my Lowe Alpine jacket. Both are silent to wear, zips are better on Lowe, hood is better, and certainly waterproofing and windproofing is far better in my old Lowe Alpine jacket. Time will tell, if Bergtagen can do the same. Amazing jacket that old Lowe Alone. Built to last. That is environmentally friendly as well ;) I think they are all made of environmentally unfriendly materials as they are produced and sold. So we, the users would want to wear it for as long as possible. Buy less is environmentally friendly. I think each company has a few products in their line, that simply just works, and last for a very very long time. Those I support. I have only just now bought my second pair of steigeisen ever. So my trusty old Grivel still works, albeit not so well anymore. And I bought them second hand many years ago ;) I think I'll sharpen them. Thanks for sharing. Kind regards.
I know Columbia isn’t in the same scale as either, but I’m curious how it is now as a brand, even if not presented as a comparison. I’ve often purchased Columbia for budget reasons after comparing value, & I think they’ve been tops in that measurement.
There ARE some good European companies as well. I have not vetted Mammut, Jack Wolfskin ,Norrona, Jottnar, and others for environmental support. Innovators like Bogner, in focusing on skiing for almost a century, may have been sucked into Gucciness by their planned marketing - EVEN THOUGH some of themost dedicated ski/snowboard people are the broke kids, living inspired life.
You can easily find Patagonia on sale, and they are worth the money. I bought a nano jacket for $100, and it's been through countless backpacking trip, plus daily wear in the winter for 5 years. Not to mention their base layer. They can regularly be found for sale for at least 30% off, and those things last quite a while.
I worked at Patagonia, I have tons of Patagonia Jackets but truthfully , some of them I like, and some I dont..some of the designs I do not like..at all!!
I wore North Face exclusively for many years (since the very early 2000s). However, I have been quite disappointed by the quality of their products in the last few years or so. I feel like they've definitely gone downhill compared to what they once were in regard to the quality and longevity of their jackets. I have now switched over to Patagonia and am extremely happy. I recently bought the Patagonia Torrentshell 3L rain jacket and the Nano Puff winter jacket, and I've been very impressed by their performance and quality. When you live in New England like I do, you need a variety of jackets for all sorts of weather. I've bought some Patagonia T-shirts as well, which are super comfortable and have an amazing fit. I will absolutely be sticking to Patagonia from now on.
You must have read “the responsible company”. If not, I highly recommend the book. After reading it myself I have always felt Doug and TNF have been faking it all these years. It’s too bad because a company their size could be making a greater environmental impact. TNF reminds me of bmw quite a bit; all talk no show regarding electric vehicles.
It wasn't Doug who was faking it...he got out and then used the money he had made to do good things. TNF however went a direction I'm certain he would not have approved of.
They are both right because it just doesn’t matter. The values of both men are laudable, but in the grand scheme of things, their efforts are not matched by the vast majority of businesses and consumers so their impact is small. But, they can hold their heads up in a crowded room, but, for now, it’s just a nice story. I do own both brands and I am pleased with the quality and durability and I hope more companies follow in the footsteps of these two men with vision and integrity. I am still using my North Face tent that I bought in 1976.
I think getting out of the industry if you realize that you are overwhelmed and sacrificing your (mental) health for it is a good thing, but as long as you can it is also incredibly important to initiate change about things that you are passionate about and to give people the alternative opportunity to cast their vote apart from the climate killing brands :)
While it is not directly a Patagonia (Company) documentary, "180 Degreess South: Conquerers of the Useless" is an amazing travel documentary of the Patagonia Region and Doug, Kris and Yvon make an appearance talking about their conservation efforts in Patagonia. Highly recommend everyone watch it.
Patagonia is still owned by Yvon... The North Face is owned by VF, which also owns Vans, Dickies, SmartWool, Supreme, JanSport and quite a few more. You decide which one has the better values when it comes to conservation.
@@cd4984 No need to. Since posting the comment, Yvon, his wife and two children have transferred their ownership of Patagonia, valued at about $3 billion, to a specially designed trust and a nonprofit organization. “Hopefully this will influence a new form of capitalism that doesn’t end up with a few rich people and a bunch of poor people,” Mr. Chouinard, 83, said in an interview. “We are going to give away the maximum amount of money to people who are actively working on saving this planet.”
What about Patagonia making millions of pieces of clothing for the US Military? I don’t think you can disregard that just because it doesn’t fit with the marketing spin for their target demographic.
Another outdoors company along with Patagonia making millions of pieces of clothing for the US military. Fanbois conveniently don’t talk about that though.
I live in Chile so I can elaborate in some topics. Doug Tompkins bought a lot of wild areas in southern Chile and started the Douglas Tompkins foundation, creating several Parks and accomplishing his conservation intents. Chilean government and industry doesn't give a crap about nature, so Doug's efforts here were really impactful. After his dead, Doug's foundation donated ALL of this wild areas to Chilean park administration, and now they are part of the Chilean National Park system officially. We are all very grateful of the conservation ideals that Tompkins pursued and thanks to him we can enjoy this beautiful places. Nice video, Levi, keep up the good work!
Thanks for the insight. It completes the last piece of the puzzle.
interesting perspective. i heard some pushback against tompkins on the ground from some locals directly involved in the tourism industry. but hey those were the perspectives of two people with a skin in the game.
That’s awesome, thank you for sharing
Thanks so much for sharing this info. Definitely completely his side of the story.
I can support this as true having been a Patagonia employee for several years.
I love how you straight out admitted that there would be some bias in the video. That is the kind of honesty we need in reviewers.
came to say the exact same
That's the kind of self-reflection and honesty we need when talking about politics
@@thetshirtblog We need to vote against election deniers.
@@seanjones2456 lol there has been Corruption in the American election system since JFK...... You don't remember daddy helped him win? So why is everyone acting like people who don't trust the system is a new thing?.... Weren't the democrats the election deniers In 2016 when trump won?......
Im from Patagonia, Chile and I would like to share that I was lucky enough to meet Doug and Yvon in person while I working a couple of kilometres away from Doug’s park “Parque Patagonia”, both of them are amazing characters and funny enough they wear each other’s clothing, Doug on his Snap-t and Yvon with his Denali, lots of locals including me were pretty sad when we found out that “Uncle Doug” has passed away, but his contributions still live on and still protected, locals admire his wish to protect the land 🙌
This is so cool
🇨🇱🙏🏻❤️❤️❤️❤️
sweet story
I work for Patagonia and when Yvonne announced the news of earth being the only shareholder it was an astounding feeling and really brings me joy working for a company who truly cares about their people and their well-being and the environment of course putting their money where their mouth is! Let’s see if other companies will follow!!!
They did it for evading taxes: ruclips.net/video/0Cu6EbELZ6I/видео.html
*Yvon
As a biologist I see patagonia's message with much more of a jaundiced eye. They pander to activists, not to the actual sciences.
FFS could you possibly be any more pretentious?
Yvon Patagonia is the only business man i respect
I used to work for the umbrella company that owns The North Face and I can tell you that from my personal point of view, I felt like the "efforts" were simply because consumers wanted it and because competitors were doing so. It never felt genuine and they merely rode on Patagonia's coat tails with sustainability and social issues. There were real efforts by employees to make significant strides, but in the end, umbrella company seemed to care more about sales and what's "cool" aka collabs. Ultimately I left because I too, felt like my work and talents were just going towards pushing people to buy things they do not need.
I do work for VF at the moment and I partially agree, I would say that the impression is that higher up the focus is ultimately on selling more but I also would say that most people working for VF really care about moving more towards sustainability and that recently heading more in that direction is therefore not only cause other do
It's like some food companies offering organic version of their products, not to help the planet and offer healthier choices, but rather to make more money.
it’s sad and disappointing. guess you just have to take your own strides and create something great and genuine!
Are you suggesting that there are in fact corporations who put anything over profit? I think all make environmental gestures only as their financial situation allows. They have a PR team, and that team finds them “green” opportunities that they can show to their customers, so the customer feels like a good guy using their product. It is psychological manipulation, which have been calling advertisement for a century.
i think in a way that's encouraging, in some sense public pressure works
An undervalued part of Patagonia's mission is its support of small businesses doing great things for the environment. A handful of guys saw an opportunity to recycle the massive fishing nets that litter beaches and clog oceans. Bureo started out making skateboard decks and sunglass frames. Patagonia took interest and supported them. Now Bureo is making NetPlus materials for all kinds of uses, including Patagonia Baggies... The company has processed almost 6,000,000 pounds of discarded fishing nets.
Don't mind me just interacting for the algorithm
Yepp really want this amazing channel to grow and persuade the viewers towards sustainable living 🤧
@@rohitsai2533 yeah i love this Channel!
You're the best! ✨
same!!
same
Patagonia actually shares where they make their clothes (more sustainably) so other brands can follow! I really admire that they are such a selfless brand ❤
I have always had the feeling that Patagonia was actually more sustainably conscious than TNF. Now I know for sure :)
Thanks for tuning in 💪🥳
Agreed. I'm a Patagonia Stan. TNF is fine but Patagonia gets my money.
they literally advertise and say they’re sustainable af and use recycled materials ….
@@dlib902 companies greenwash so much I don't always trust what they say.
At the end of the day they are just selling cloths. The message behind the company is to just to get you to spend your money. The messaging behind companies just plays with your emotions. Both company’s make the majority of their goods in china and other emerging markets. Don’t let your feelings deceive you.
I love that I can get my clothes repaired by Patagonia. Their jeans are almost the only pants that I wear and I’ve had some of them repaired now three times! I also really value that they were were made sustainably both in terms of the environment and the treatment/compensation of the people who made them. I’m happy then to pay the higher cost because I know that I am getting a high quality product that can be repaired and will last many many years.
Patagonia has been actively involved with conservation and re-wilding efforts throughout South America, especially in Argentina and Chile. They have donated purchased and donated large land masses to national wildlife parks in Latin America. They are helping reintroduce wildlife to parts of South America that have been exterminated out of existence. I applaud their efforts.
That's TNF, or at least their founders, as well.
North Face is now an urban jacket. I only ever see people wearing them around cities, i never see them worn doing trekking or climbing
I remember when I got into snowboarding in the mid 90s. That’s where I got exposed to really smart outer wear. Back then I got the impression that Patagonia was innovative, original and eye wateringly expensive. Tnf was doing what everyone else had been doing, several years behind. And was affordable. They reminded me of Columbia. I am now a middle age carpenter in coastal New England. After all this time, work wear companies are noticing the loss to mountain wear companies and are finally making their clothes for people who move for a living. I recently learned that Patagonia has been making carpenter styled pants out of hemp. I might just get some when my current stock starts blowing out. Hemp is supposed to be super durable. If they can make them a little stretchy by that time, I’ll pay whatever.
Cool! I have ALWAYS included durability in purchasing since hanging with Valley cliimbers. It was enlightening, and I have some clothes 15-20 years old that remain more acceptable than grubby denim.
While stretchy still requires that oil-based elastane or neoprene, the former CAN be woven with hemp, and should be FAR tougher than cotton. Hemp is ancient ship ropes/lines, and does not spring back from stretch, so I'd expect that problem.
Duct tape, the common repair onsite for minter wear, seems not so evident in the impress-others-with-wealth present, though indispensable so far.
I have the pants you're referring to and I highly recommend them. There's no stretch, but the hemp is soft and feels pre-broken in (unlike duck cotton pants, like Carhartt) while still maintaining its durability.
I work in forestry and I have the Patagonia hemp pants. They've lasted 3 years so far and still going strong. They're the most durable pants I've ever owned. All other pants barely make it 6 months before holes appear.
I also got some patagonia hemp pants and they were great. I tend to put them through pretty tough wear, and even though the hems frayed, they never got holes in the knees. The pockets did blow out, but I blame that on them being cotton pockets ; )
I have some of Patagonia’s workwear and it is solid! Highly recommend!
Little did you know, Patagonia would change the game completely 9 months later! In no way this video or its message has become irrelevant but just giving away the company to a new-founded non-profit and foundation would've been a huge point here. I've been a huge fan of Patagonia as a brand and supported their approach to sustainability for years now but this was just a major step unprecedented not only in fashion!
what happened?
@@SoldierAssassin98 Yvonne and his family donated their ENTIRE ownership of Patagonia to a nonprofit foundation. Patagonia is now dedicated 100% to the environment, forever. They will never, ever go the route of North Face.
@@davestagner oh cool, I'm gonna check it out. Thanks
@@cd4984 As far as I know (feel free to correct me), Patagonia has no other owners or investors now, besides the nonprofit. But to be pedantic (and honest) here, ALL entities operating financially, whether “for profit” or “nonprofit”, have to be financially sustainable, and that means “profitable”, in a loose sense of the word. A nonprofit might rely on donations and grants, but it still has a budget, and is bound by that budget. What’s different is the reasoning, not the flow of capital. A for-profit business exists to grow profits and/or valuation for the benefit of the owners. A nonprofit exists to apply its budget for the benefit of others. If the nonprofit can operate a “profitable business”, then it is growing its budget. Patagonia had annual revenues of $209M last year. Let’s say 20% of that was profit (I don’t know for sure, I didn’t dig that far). That’s around $40M that can be applied to either grow the business (new products, new stores, etc), or be spent on charitable causes. And some of it should be applied to growth, which should a: lead to a long-term growth in their charitable budget, and b: should protect them from losing revenue/profit (and thus budget) due to competition or market changes. In a for-profit, the money they can invest in charity now would instead become dividends to shareholders, or be reinvested to grow the value of the company. That’s the only real difference, but it’s a HUGE difference.
Dismissing Patagonia’s move to nonprofit status as “no different” is unfair and wrong.
@@davestagner Yvonne and his family donated their ENTIRE ownership of Patagonia to a nonprofit foundation CREATED BY THEM. They didn't do it to send 100% of the money to the environment, they did it so they could skip 100% of the taxes on transferring the company to his children. This same tactic has been used countless times by billionaires for PR and evading taxes. When I heard about Patagonia doing so much for the environment I was genuinely so happy, but alas, the truth is contrary to what they will have you believe.
I’ll always be a Patagonia customer, and in terms of companies I think Patagonia has the clear win of The North Face in terms of sustainability, innovation and even quality of products. It actually drive me crazy how many climbers keep their North Face sponsorships since the companies current state and direction is so far away from whatever environmental and ethical integrity that it started out with from Doug - that’s a very specific gripe within the climbing industry though. In terms of legacies left, Patagonia has always been used as a vehicle to promote, encourage and innovate - fight the good fight from the inside consumerism if you will - even if Yvon has long since stepped away from an active business role within the company, his direction in the early years has inspired millions and that’s a legacy that will probably outlast the company. The North Face as a reflection of Doug seems pretty negligible since he left so long ago and in my mind his conservation efforts are those of a private citizen, which seems pretty bloody impressive. It’s just unfortunate that he did create a company that cares more about turning profit than the planet that it’s marketing itself off of.
This is such a well thought-out and developed comment, thank you for taking the time to share with us! We totally agree with your statement on climbers keeping their TNF sponsorships, there's so many other options for outdoor gear for them to choose from. You're right that it's an industry-level issue though, and we may or may not be releasing future videos talking more about the outdoor clothing market and how it's changed over time, so stay tuned 😉👀
it's easy. norht face clothing looks way better. i love their logo and quality.
@@knoxvillehill you missed the entire point, didn't you?
@@WouldntULikeToKnow. not really i get the environmental angle i just dont care since it's minuscule compared to the big polluters
@adrian boot No, he's not wrong. And kids like you are brainwashed.
Loved this! My friend pokes fun at me for buying Patagonia because it's more expensive and he refers to it as Patagucci. This video has really helped me! I had no idea about the origins of The North Face. Just goes to show what different paths a brand can take when the founder leaves the company and takes his original vision and passion with him. In the meantime, BRB, just going to buy some $890 Gucci x North Face 'slides' so I can go hiking in what look like some woolly slippers.
Haha Patagucci? When North Face and Gucci are literally doing a collab for $700 shearling slides.
Patagucci imo has more to do with the fact that if you're buying Patagonia or North face gear you're spending more money on a name when you could be buying from Columbia or other less expensive, high(er in my personal experience) quality gear companies if you just do your research instead of buying for the brand.
dw just remember, patagucci gets the coochie
@@jules7926 Columbia,L. All about Arc'teryx
@@jules7926 Patagucci was a term that I think was coined when Patagonia was widely used as Wall Street types as their "uniform"... Especially the vest. And I guess it also refers to the high price tag for outdoor active wear.
TNF has really good marketing, and Patagonia is kind of behind the curtains. Collab with Supreme brought a lot of attention to hypebeasts. With Gucci to trend setters. Patagonia focuses on other things IMO.
Exactly!! 🤯
they both have really good marketing, it is that patagucci focused on different talking points vs TNF.
@@hanwagu9967 either you misspelled Patagonia or misspelled Gucci
Thanks! Was between buying North Face or Patagonia, buying Patagonia. Great video!
Hey, loving the new channel! I've done a lot of research on Thompkins' conservation efforts for undergraduate research projects. Deep Ecology was an organization separate from his direct conservation projects that was intended to promote the ideas of deep Ecology around the world (they used to have a website, I can't find it anymore either). Conservation Land Trust and Conservacion Patagonica were the conservation projects. All three foundations are now the Thompkins foundation. I also think it's very important to note Kristine McDivitt Tompkins' contributions. She helped found Patagonia and was CEO for much of it's rise. She contributed massively both financially and managerially to Doug's conservation efforts. Also, Thompkins foundation has protected more like 14 million acres of land.
Thanks for this
1:17 Respect for the disclaimer. It's rare to find someone online that admits his biases. I appreciate it immensely.
In my opinion both actions are important...we need all sort of changes to achieve the best results. Change the brand from inside to help create a new way of looking at sustainable fashion is great and helpful, but we also need actions that have a direct impact on the environment to help to preserve it while our mentality shift!
My Patagonia jacket will not die. 5 years on a construction site and its still nice enough to wear to dinner. (After washing)
I find these kind of informative videos really helpful to keep updated with our consumerism’s behavior. As outdoor enthusiasts we often fall on our own trap of buying from brands and assume they care about the environment just because you know “obviously they care about nature if they’re in this kind of business “ right?
The thing is that is really important to keep our own values on track when answering questions such as the ones you propose at the end: do I need this? Is it second hand? Etc and of course forget about what social standards “drilled” into our heads about status, luxury and the concept of necessity.
Or just use preloved clothes. Easy
@@naveedaman1 I actually do. Most of my clothing is second hand or repaired, specially my outdoors gear
Insightful video, great storytelling and really well-produced too! Your case 'against' The North Face is a bit thin in places though. Offering 100% recycled fabrics and then marketing them in such a way that they are appealing to fashionistas who would otherwise never buy sustainable clothing is a win for everyone, and I think Patagonia would agree. They wouldn't be an activist company if they'd object to others copying their environmentally friendly ideas (a bit like Tesla 'giving away' its patents). So calling that greenwashing is perhaps a bit harsh. Other than that: great work! I would be interested in more digging into what really makes companies 'green', since just about every outdoors company claims to be sustainable.
That's a super fair assessment, thanks for bringing that to our attention. We're working on more videos on the outdoor clothing industry, so stay tuned for those. Thanks for the lovely feedback!
Totally this. Greenwashing would be marketing a product as "sustainable" because it contains recycled content, even if that is only 10%. TNF has a long way to go, but they are also a hell of a lot further down the road than a lot of brands
I live in Ventura California and I started to hear about Patagonia about 5 years ago and I started to like the idea about buying less but quality products to help the planet. since then I'm just not buying clothes as before and I prefer Patagonia. Another point is that Patagonia workers are treated nice from what I heard here in the store located in Ventura :)
I have an interview for a job opportunity at Patagonia later today, I am honestly so excited. Thank you for your information about both brands represented here, I’ve learnt so much.
Love your vids. Starting to love Patagonia more and more because of this channel.
That's amazing!!! Thanks so much 😜
I have always been a fan of both companies for different reasons, but what Doug has done really shows true virtue
Great research. I got my 1st Patagonia jacket this past winter. I was looking at many other companies, including North Face. I'm very happy with the jacket. Knowing the background just confirms that it was a good purchase.
I'd love a deep dive on Arc'teryx. I consider them to be the Ferrari of outdoor gear: ungodly expensive but also unsurpassed in performance.
Meh. My tactical poncho says otherwise lol
@@rainypath96 L, Arcteryx is where it's at
100% the gold standard
I just like my Arcteryx gear. It's just good. Not amazing. The warranty is amazing though
@@mumonkey13000 When I have the money, I'd splurge it on Carinthia gear.
Hey man, loved your video and I’m a proud owner of both brands functional items for my mountaineering expeditions. Just thought that you missed one point not he The North Face is how much they’ve pushed the sport of climbing, and all mountain stuff with their athletes especially. I believe it’s really a big part of their DNA and I salute them for that.
As someone born and raised in Patagonia (the actual place) I can tell you that Douglas Tompkins did so much to protect the Patagonian region by buying that amount of land. Because of it, multinationals trying to take our natural resources were blocked. The brand Patagonia, has not really done nothing for us (not that they have to anyways) besides cultural appropriation by using our name.
Dear Pablo...you will be happy to know that the owners of Patagonia have been significant supports of Tompkins Conservation's work and have been major investors in conserving the lands you mentioned.
@@peterbuckley110I was going to type the same sentiment!
I agree bro.....you dont wear recycled synthetics in the mountains. You wear wool/Down. Patagonia, TNF & Starbucks preach giving back, sustainability and cultural awareness. Total bullshit! People buy into the feel good phraseology and dream of making the world safer.
De donde sos Pablo? yo soy de la zona Argentina de Chubut para ser mas especifico
@@elenfermero5156 Coyhaique, Región de Aysén. Pero ahora vivo en Massachusetts. Saludos para allá.
Loved this video!! just received a Patagonia second hand jacket this Christmas!! (best of both worlds) keep up the great work-Jenny
Thanks Jenny, we really appreciate the positive feedback! Happy to hear about your second-hand jacket, that's amazing!!
Was it turquoise. Are you in Switzerland. I just sold one online before Xmas - as I have several and opted to let go of the turquoise one :) you never know. Stranger things have happened.
Patagonia has been known as Patagucci in Seattle since the 80's. The Patagonia store was the place people who wanted to look like they did outdoor stuff went for clothing, and REI was where the people who actually did outdoor stuff went.
I've never owned anything Patagonia. When I was young and broke, I would mostly buy Columbia, but for something critical, like my main rain jacket, I would upgrade to the REI house brand. Now, I stick with the REI house brand.
I’ve always called it patagucci too and definitely chaff at how “cool” it is. But they’ve undeniably used their cool for good. No other company has made wearing patched gear not only practical but cool. I think this is incredible for the planet.
Levi just a tiny correction... Mount Fitz Roy is actually in Argentina, located in Los Glaciares National Park close to the Chilean border. Awesome video anyway. Hope you have a great start to 2022.
Thanks for the clarification! Happy 2022 to you as well!! 💫
I recently just found that buying second hand is my new passion in life. My significant partner laughs at me because she's known this forever. It's hugely satisfying to find the best gear, in great condition for 1/3 or 1/4 or the price.
Unable to remark on jackets, have North Face mummy that was purchased in 1969 still in perfect condition. Was used yearly till 2017.
Patagonia makes extremely high quality fatigues for our military here in the US - so there’s that (I’ll let you individually decide if you like that or not)
My favorite brands ranked
1) Arcteryx
2) Mountain Hardwear
3) Patagonia
4) Black Diamond
5) Columbia (Love Their Fleece Jackets)
6) The North Face
7) Cotopaxi
8) Outdoor Research
Yeah. Dead bird is number one for me too. Patagonia second. Mountain HW has good stuff though the gore tex ski pants I got for. Them has a prematurely.
Both were right, imo. Most company founders don't even consider sustainability these days. If we get every company founder/CEO to consider sustainability on a major scale, we're all better off in the long run, regardless of the path they take
They are all same - Patagonia, vf (northface), anta sports (arcteryx). They are all clothing manufacturers and retailers selling clothes to masses, all over the world. BTW, Doug created a national park in Chile.
If Patagonia cares about the environment so much, why are they opening new stores all over the world to sell clothing to people who really do not need them, but aspire to.
good video! patagonia is a company I would want leading the charge of things like this. SO I am happy they exist and continue to set the standard
I have a couple of items from both brands that I love, but now prefer to see if I can get a good deal on Patagonia stuff, because it seems to last longer. I also love Fjallraven, because they make stuff that lasts and also focus on sustainability. Generally, I just want stuff that I can use for years, cause I don't get bored of my clothes or bags that easily.
Competition is good so long as there is no collusion and no corruption.
Back in the early 70's, I bought my first North Face jacket. It was bombproof. The quality was top-notch. It was expensive, but worth it. Eventually, I needed to replace it and I bought a similar looking North Face jacket at REI in the mid-80's. Almost immediately, I noticed the quality was bad. The zipper constantly got snagged or went off-track. The fabric surface quickly showed signs of delamination . I talked with a friend who was an REI employee and, given the number of customer returns, he agreed that North Face's quality had gotten bad. North Face had lowered its quality and price to stay competitive and appeal to everyone; not just backpackers, climbers, hikers, etc. North Face's quality is just slightly better than similar apparels sold by Old Navy, The GAP, Walmart, Target, etc.
😂😂😂 seeing Walmart and north face in the same sentence
North Face quality has gotten pretty bad. I don't even think of them as an outdoor brand gear anymore tbh. They're a brand for city people who want to look outdoorsy.
When I lived in Canada I used to wear my ski jacket almost every day during winter. And I see no issue with that. I needed a ski jacket years before that to ski (it was cheaper to buy it on sale than ranting) so when I moved there, it was what I had. It works better than normal winter jackets. And I see it as a sustainable approach because the most sustainable thing to wear is what you already have.
Yeah same I don't live in a particularly cold place (northern Argentina) but in winter it can get to 0 degrees and I just my ski jacket.
I served as one of four Co-chairs of 350Montana for a number of years. We received significant financial support from Patagonia on several occasions. They do indeed support enviornmental efforts.
I know pitting two popular companies against each other is Good For The Algorithm™, but it's not a zero-sum-game here. A larger brand like North Face pivoting to more sustainable materials/packaging/etc is a net good for the planet. It doesn't really matter if Patagonia "did it earlier," and North Face throwing their buying power around in the source material market is going to make it easier other companies to get recycled product.
What is the pivot with partnerships with Supreme and Gucci to name two about then? It's counter productive. You may argue it will bring others into the outdoors, but let's face it, the majority who are TNF die hards over the last few years, especially during COVID wouldn't want their TNF jackets getting too wet alone dirty out walking the trails and wherever else.
Patagonia is my favorite brand period! These products are not only sourced smart but are made extremely well and last! I cannot give this brand enough praise and hope other brands follow suit.
Nice video! New sub here. Here's my ramblings on this subject below:
I was a fan of The North Face back in the Doug days right up until the Vanity Fair buyout. I liked the quality of their gear and their over all direction. In that time they seemed to have the technical market covered. After the VF buyout I could notice the quality changing and the prices going up. I think it's been the same ever since. To me The North Face is more a fashion company now catering to the people like you said in the video that think they need outdoor gear when they really don't (whether it's as a status symbol or whatever). Don't get me wrong they do still have some pieces of gear at the very high end that you might take on a serious adventure but overall not so great for what you're paying for.
Patagonia. I've always been a fan and honestly they seem to be (and always have been) the lighthouse in the fog. Other companies have gone up and come back down, come onto the scene and faded. Patagonia though has never moved away from care of the environment, innovation, and just doing things right. Yes it's expensive stuff (ie the term Patagucci getting thrown out so much) but unlike a pair of The North Face Gucci collaboration boots you know well it'll last for a long time through many adventures. When it's about time to retire the gear you can send it back to Patagonia for repair or even get something in return if it's beyond fixing. This is where Patagonia is reaching above. There's the Used Wear store, there's the articles and diys on how to fix your own equipment, etc. Do you see anything like this from The North Face? I'll answer that for you I don't.
Mountain Hardwear. I've got a "love hate" relationship with these guys. I absolutely loved this company when it started out right up until Colombia Sportswear bought them out. Today they are a shell of their former selves. This was a company you could count on having highly technical gear, made with input from athletes in the field mountaineering 8000m peaks, to serious trail hikers, to everyone in between. The equipment wasn't cheap, but the quality and innovation weren't either. They typically used the best materials and designs for the intended product. People expecting to use their apparel as casual gear or even their equipment casually complained that it didn't work but it wasn't for them. Sizing was for made for athletes or someone that was serious about their outdoor adventures. Not only this you could count on them having the same models of jackets, pants, hats, etc every year but maybe with some color changes or improvements. Nowadays I liken them to a fast fashion type of company. The positives I just spoke of are gone. They make products for that year and then they are gone. When they've revisited a famous product from the past like the Windstopper Tech Fleece Jacket it's been a horrible knock off of the original, quality wise, sizing wise, etc. It's not like there isn't Gore Windstopper fabric anymore as I've bought some to make jackets of my own design, it's that they are too cheap. In all fairness I get what motivated them to sell to Colombia and I bet there's some very talented people at Mountain Hardwear, but they are limited and handicapped by Colombia Sportwear and by extension stockholders where it's a public company. This brings up another good point Patagonia is one of a handful of private companies with no other corporate overlord or stockholders. For Patagonia those are the employees. Does this help their efforts? I think so completely.
Westcomb. I didn't know much about these guys until in the last few years but I'm really liking what they do. Production is in Canada 100%. To me they are Mountain Hardwear at the beginning. Unlike Mountain Hardwear they've stayed true to their roots. I have several pieces of their gear and it's about as high notch as you can get.
I see other once high end companies in the industry following suit of Mountain Hardwear and The North Face. Arcteryx unfortunately is going the same direction. I wasn't worried when they decided to move production out of Canada. I figured they would be one of the few companies that could turn that negative into a positive. It's worked for a long while but I think it's finally wearing off. Their quality has diminished while prices have skyrocketed. I wouldn't be surprised if they aren't more of a fashion company in a decade like The North Face. There's many more examples of this in the industry which makes me keep turning back to Patagonia.
im wearing a patagonia tshirt at this very moment, which i bought over 10 years ago and have been using frequently. I can vouch for the quality of their products for sure! for some reason ive never bought anything else patagonia, i think ill change that
Holy shit man, Doug owned Esprit and TNF? Bro, I’ve been wearing Esprit literally since 2008 and it’s mindblowing. What’s even crazier is Patagonia and TNF owners are actually friends
One comment I heard regarding The North Face is that it has become more associated with casual city wear, especially with one of their more popular sellers being the puffy Retro Nuptse Jacket (which in my opinion is more for aesthetic than function), and this has seemed to occur alongside a slight drop in product build quality. I personally only ever owned a backpack and a tent from TNF so I can't judge their outdoor clothing quality, but if the comments from these wearers are true then my best guess is that they are just deciding to appeal to a different demographic than before. And like you showed with their strange collaborations, it seems their company's "intent" is just vastly different from Patagonia now.
However if their quality is decreasing, their costs (which are as high as Patagonia on comparable items) then seem out of place to me.
I have owned 3 north face coats and all of them have gone the distance, I use them for hiking, mountaineering, mountain biking and general use. I have only had to replace the zip on one of them, they are great coats. I think they now have an array of products which go all the way from consumer to enthusiast.
I'm not sure, but it may all be fabricated in China or SE Asia. Expect cost-cutting everywhere -- TOO many MBAs infest the world, still the most common postgrad degree, and TOTALLY absent ethics, now a miniscule course in only a FEW universities/colleges.
Can confirm, for my city North Face is way too popular. Lots of high school kids have a North Face backpack and lots of adults have North Face jackets that they wear casually.
TNF has different lines. Their consumer line is just shit, and wouldn't last at all as actual outdoor gear. Their actual outdoor gear however, is pretty much as expensive as all other top tier brands and have excellent quality.
I have a synthetic insulated jacket, a down parka and a few micro fleeces etc by North Face. I’ve found it all well made and looks fine after years of wear. My partner has a few fleeces and down jackets and a shell jacket. Again, all well made a long lasting. The zips, stitching, cut, materials are all good. Maybe they have a line of clothing that’s cheaper that I haven’t encountered.
The ubiquitousness of the brand has devalued it in the eyes of outdoors types but I’ve found that it’s really on a par with most of the currently sought after brands like Ar’teryx, Rab etc. Those brands are just where North Face were in the 90s. Once they start being worn by everyone, hikers and climbers etc. will move on to some other brands to distance themselves from the general populace.
An important thing not mentioned. North Face was purchased by VF corporation in 2000. This is the company that owns timberland, jansport, dickies, vans, and supreme. They are much more focused at profits than they are conservation and quality products.
Great video, even tho maybe a bit bias ;) !! Patagonia is a common case study used in MBAs during classes about sustainability and ethics. It's not the most "international" of brands (I live in Malaysia and we don't have stores here or even boutiques that sell them)... I purchased my first Patagonia items when I lived in Zurich over winter for 6 months and love the brand and the products and their post purchase service (repairs at the end of the winter season is commonplace!).
North Face is definitely more global and can be found in most countries... As much as I might have liked them in the early days, their "street" collaborations and their ridiculous Gucci collaboration has turned me off the brand. I much prefer Patagonia's sustainability message...
TNF is one of the few brands that cater to short ppl. Means the world to me
Another piece worth noting is that Chouinard Equipment (the actual climbing hardware) was rebranded as Black Diamond in the late 80's. Any climber out there knows Black Diamond gear as being one of the world's leading brands for nuts, cams, harnesses, ropes etc...
As someone who just bought a patagonia raincoat for hiking one of the reasons i chose it over a north face jacket is how clearly north face focuses on fashion over function now, while patagonia still hasnt lost sight of the main purpose of its gear.
Thank you for the informative video.. I am an outdoorsman myself and never really considered Patagonia wear because of price. I do have a couple of Northface coats and was very happy that they replaced a broken zipper for free. I thought that simply reflected a company's commitment to quality; Ihope that also reflects a more sustainable direction for NF. Looking back I fervently admire Yvon's philosophies. I think though rather than run out and start buying Patagonia equipment I can be a better planetary citizen by buying less stuff and that includes unneeded clothes.
For sure, and the idea with Patagonia and what they want you to do is once those clothes are unusable you then buy Patagonia gear which can continue to be repaired
North Face is a fantastic brand, a 5th of the price of Canada Goose or Montclair for a goose down jacket, Patagonia is a great brand too but i don’t think either founder made any mistakes, each is as it should be
Even though I’ve generally supported The North Face, I’ve definitely seen them come out with a lot more collaborations-or just outdoor gear in general- that seems to be focused more on aesthetics than functionality. I like a lot of their staple products (the Denali fleece, thermoball jackets are decent) but I’m not a fan of the random fashion collabs. I’m not opposed to the fashion industry wholesale but I just have more respect for outdoor brands who try to increase their market share by product innovation, not Gucci collabs.
Very interesting video! It’s my first one and I will definitely be watching more.
TNF for a while had moved where the market was going: streetwear. However, over the past 10 years, they've sort of went back to basics in terms of their technical clothing collab with lots of athletes, while still marketing to the masses in streetwear and trickle down from their high priced technical clothing for the subaru lovin outdoorsy crowds. I think TNF technical clothing has been remarkable over the past 10 years. Unfortunately, it is ridiculously expensive (e.g. AMK, Flight, Steep, Summit L System), but ridiculously good.
Never seen any real outdoor enthusiast wear any of those... maybe some wearing patagonia, but north face really unseen on hiking trails. It's a lifestyle brand.
Great information! Will gladly steer my dollars to companies like Patagonia if I need to buy new items.
You and me both! Thanks for tuning in 😜👏
Actually, please look into Hap Klopp who actually acquired The North Face in 1968, created the logo and took on Doug‘s vision and values for the North Face. He was then CEO for the next 20 years, created the famous logo and concepts like their unique lifetime warranty concepts for all products sold by the north face. He also led multiple social activism projects and also had a yearly catalog to promote environmental activism. So he clearly took on Dougs‘ values until the company was then sold again. I worked with him and can clearly confirm his passion for making the world a better place. ;))
I’m really into rock climbing and the north face is one of climbing’s biggest sponsors so I have a natural affinity for them. I do wish that they would get back to their roots and stop some of the mainstream collabs (supreme, Gucci, etc…) But I like the fact that they’re a little more affordable than Patagonia and don’t come with the same type of sort of “look at me, I wear Patagonia, and drive a Tesla, and own every piece of apple equipment there is” kind of image. And maybe that’s just around here, but that’s kinda the feeling that I get from Patagonia, kind of an elitist “I care more about the world than you do” feeling, I dunno. I do have some Patagonia gear though so I don’t think you can go wrong with either gear wise. So yep, a little hypocrisy on my part but that’s my rant for the day so…….Great video though dude✌🏽😃✌🏽
Well I have cash down on a Tesla,but NOT for social reasons. If it looked exactly as my 95 pathfiinder, I'd still buy one. In SPITE of Musk being a benighted libertarian. His initiative against the dinosaurian IC Engine makers is spawning FAST change. Entrenched conservatives fatuously and submissively serving $ as bottom-line for-profit investors remains a problem.
PaTAGONIA DESIGNS Still make big-waisted tent clothes, which is their only problem. Baggy is cold in wind.
I never bought Patagonia, but after this video I want one now. Thanks.
Any time, stay tuned for the next one 😜
Fjällräven is great, if you don't mind the vintage look. I remember they were nearly impossible to find outside of Europe, and now they seem to be super trendy (or at least the Kanken bags are). I hope their popularity doesn't lead to a decline in quality. Also, I like the effort they put into saving arctic foxes.
Another Swedish company that makes good stuff (and more modern, despite being a much older company) is Haglöfs. I think they are about on par with Arc'teryx.
I have a couple The North Face parkas. They're alright, not that great. Some of the hard plastic parts - buckles, etc. - and elastic drawstrings broke rather quickly, and the lining of one split. I also have a sleeping bag, it's fine, no issues. I probably won't be buying any more of their products though.
Fjallraven is made in china. Like most companies that were once local, they are now manufactured overseas, this contradicting their environmental pursuits
Jottnar appears to be good.
I fan of Patagonia, and Fitz Roy, the logo, is in Argentina 🇦🇷. Thank you
Great video!
I knew Patagonia was more about conservation and activism, but didn't know it was so hardcore. I always thought of North Face as just another fashion brand. Glad I wasn't too far off.
Although I'm not really outdoorsey, when I need something for the outdoors, I gravitate to MEC. Good bang for the buck and their stuff tries to be sustainable.
Thank you. Now I finally understand why Patagonia is exorbitantly expensive ( fir me), and why North Face products seem to be cheaper and FEEL cheaper
Interesting video. I knew about TNF before Patagonia and have bought TNF outwear. However, I will soon be buying Patagonia because they have a place in my wardrobe. Both are businesses and need to make money; whatever their credentials, like the 'average man in the street' they could both do more than what they advertise they are doing..
Patagonia is a brand I can actually feel good supporting. North Face sells $50 hoodies at Kohl's. Horridly made hoodies. I feel like my Patagonia stuff is going to last me most of my life, but TNF stuff will be in the Goodwill bin in a year or 2.
From a fashion standpoint, North Face's style can fit in with urban streetwear, while Patagonia's style makes one look like a tropical bird - their color pallet is more oceanic. I like both.
So true! Thanks for sharing 🔥
Go see the documentary 180 south, the founders speak on their freindship and how they traveled through the panamerican route to the Patagonia back in the day
patagonia donated a big box of the webbing and fabric to my high school crafts/sewing class, so ive always viewed them positively
I live on the equator where tropical outdoor temps never go below 24 degrees C.
I don’t know why I am watching this but I am watching this.
Mount Fitz Roy is located in El Chalten argentinean Patagonia, not Chile. Torres del Paine is chilenean
Fitz Roy is the border between both countries but it's more accessible from the Argentinian side.
You should do one on Columbia. It might be as popular as NF and Patagonia, but it’s still a great company.
I was considering a North Face ski jacket but decided against because it is just another huge corporate company. Just bought my forever jacket from Patagonia after they dedicated their company to the environment. Easy math to do.
My family is from Ojai and I live in SF. I did know about this friendship. Buying Patagonia since the 1970’s. They are the best!
Dude, this video was so pleasing to watch. Long time Patagonia fan and outdoor enthusiast. This is the first video I’ve seen of yours, instant follow 👏🏼
i bought a 2nd hand north face jacket and it has been my best purchase of my life ..but I also bought a brand new one very satisfied
WOW! I was always wondering about these two brands. For sure Patagonia is more a sustainable brand but I love TNF design more. Thank you!
Glad you enjoyed, stay tuned for more 😜👏
Some soon to be 20 years ago I bought a Lowe Alpine hardshell jacket with their triple point layering. I wore it up and down mountains, bicyling, citylife, bad weather, good weather, Summer, Winter, I wore it in a desert as well. It is only now, that the middle layer is wearing out and flaking off. Not a scratch, not a sewing is gone, no holes in fabric, no zipper problems apart from a pull that broke off and I just inserted a key ring, which works better with gloves anyway. I never impregnated it, and it's just watertight right up untill now, when the triple point layer is falling apart. Needless to say, I still wear that jacket. I bought a Fjällräven Bergtagen jacket, and while good, there is no way it can compete with my Lowe Alpine jacket. Both are silent to wear, zips are better on Lowe, hood is better, and certainly waterproofing and windproofing is far better in my old Lowe Alpine jacket. Time will tell, if Bergtagen can do the same.
Amazing jacket that old Lowe Alone. Built to last. That is environmentally friendly as well ;) I think they are all made of environmentally unfriendly materials as they are produced and sold. So we, the users would want to wear it for as long as possible. Buy less is environmentally friendly.
I think each company has a few products in their line, that simply just works, and last for a very very long time. Those I support. I have only just now bought my second pair of steigeisen ever. So my trusty old Grivel still works, albeit not so well anymore. And I bought them second hand many years ago ;) I think I'll sharpen them.
Thanks for sharing.
Kind regards.
I know Columbia isn’t in the same scale as either, but I’m curious how it is now as a brand, even if not presented as a comparison. I’ve often purchased Columbia for budget reasons after comparing value, & I think they’ve been tops in that measurement.
We'll keep the brand in mind for future videos, thanks!
Agreed! Patagonia is what I want…. Columbia is what I can afford…
There ARE some good European companies as well. I have not vetted Mammut, Jack Wolfskin ,Norrona, Jottnar, and others for environmental support. Innovators like Bogner, in focusing on skiing for almost a century, may have been sucked into Gucciness by their planned marketing - EVEN THOUGH some of themost dedicated ski/snowboard people are the broke kids, living inspired life.
You can easily find Patagonia on sale, and they are worth the money. I bought a nano jacket for $100, and it's been through countless backpacking trip, plus daily wear in the winter for 5 years.
Not to mention their base layer. They can regularly be found for sale for at least 30% off, and those things last quite a while.
@@wngmv where do you find the best sales? Any second hand resources?
I worked at Patagonia, I have tons of Patagonia Jackets but truthfully , some of them I like, and some I dont..some of the designs I do not like..at all!!
I wore North Face exclusively for many years (since the very early 2000s). However, I have been quite disappointed by the quality of their products in the last few years or so. I feel like they've definitely gone downhill compared to what they once were in regard to the quality and longevity of their jackets. I have now switched over to Patagonia and am extremely happy. I recently bought the Patagonia Torrentshell 3L rain jacket and the Nano Puff winter jacket, and I've been very impressed by their performance and quality. When you live in New England like I do, you need a variety of jackets for all sorts of weather. I've bought some Patagonia T-shirts as well, which are super comfortable and have an amazing fit. I will absolutely be sticking to Patagonia from now on.
Mount Fitz Roy is not in Chile, but in Argentina too. It is part of the frontier between the two countries.
You must have read “the responsible company”. If not, I highly recommend the book. After reading it myself I have always felt Doug and TNF have been faking it all these years. It’s too bad because a company their size could be making a greater environmental impact. TNF reminds me of bmw quite a bit; all talk no show regarding electric vehicles.
We'll make sure to check it out, thanks for taking the time to comment + join us here!!
It wasn't Doug who was faking it...he got out and then used the money he had made to do good things. TNF however went a direction I'm certain he would not have approved of.
@@ScottKent ok I could see that. But do we know what he did with tnf before he sold it?
@@aayotechnology Given the turn around, I would say he only had time to build it up a little. Sounds like he made most of his money off of ESprit.
@@ScottKent so did he do anything environmentally charged with Esprit?
They are both right because it just doesn’t matter. The values of both men are laudable, but in the grand scheme of things, their efforts are not matched by the vast majority of businesses and consumers so their impact is small. But, they can hold their heads up in a crowded room, but, for now, it’s just a nice story. I do own both brands and I am pleased with the quality and durability and I hope more companies follow in the footsteps of these two men with vision and integrity. I am still using my North Face tent that I bought in 1976.
I think getting out of the industry if you realize that you are overwhelmed and sacrificing your (mental) health for it is a good thing, but as long as you can it is also incredibly important to initiate change about things that you are passionate about and to give people the alternative opportunity to cast their vote apart from the climate killing brands :)
While it is not directly a Patagonia (Company) documentary, "180 Degreess South: Conquerers of the Useless" is an amazing travel documentary of the Patagonia Region and Doug, Kris and Yvon make an appearance talking about their conservation efforts in Patagonia. Highly recommend everyone watch it.
Thanks for the tip!
Patagonia is still owned by Yvon... The North Face is owned by VF, which also owns Vans, Dickies, SmartWool, Supreme, JanSport and quite a few more. You decide which one has the better values when it comes to conservation.
@@cd4984 No need to. Since posting the comment, Yvon, his wife and two children have transferred their ownership of Patagonia, valued at about $3 billion, to a specially designed trust and a nonprofit organization. “Hopefully this will influence a new form of capitalism that doesn’t end up with a few rich people and a bunch of poor people,” Mr. Chouinard, 83, said in an interview. “We are going to give away the maximum amount of money to people who are actively working on saving this planet.”
Been binge watching this channel this last few days. Absolutely loving the content!
The most significant difference is that Patagonia’s owner has donated his entire company to fight climate change.
Both keep me warm in the winter. I own a few north face and Patagonia goose down jackets and both are great imo.
What about Patagonia making millions of pieces of clothing for the US Military? I don’t think you can disregard that just because it doesn’t fit with the marketing spin for their target demographic.
That's a good point, we'd love to make a video commenting on that in the future! Thanks for sharing, Matt 👏
The mount Fitz Roy is in Argentina not in Chile
I'd be interested to hear about Arc'teryx as well. :-) Great video.
Haha thanks + stay tuned!! 👀😉
@@FutureProofTV I'm really digging the new channels, by the way! You're doing awesome work! 🙂
Another outdoors company along with Patagonia making millions of pieces of clothing for the US military. Fanbois conveniently don’t talk about that though.
North face is all about hip and trendy nowadays.
Wow, thank you.
I'm buying all my gear from Patagonia from now on.