I love that you're addressing the evolution of the game. I've heard pretty much all of these, but as I've gotten better and faced better opponents, they just don't hold up quite so well. Thank you for the permission to grow!
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I was fortunate enough to, in the 1980s as a college tennis player & PE major, help my racket sports professor put together a pickleball instruction manual. (He used our tennis team and racquetball team for photos) He was actually friends of the families that invented the game. So, that said.....Not anywhere in the manual was the word "dink" used, (it's called a half-volley),(or "kitchen" for that matter ) and the game was meant to be fast and fun, with "vigorous volleys at the net".... But if you wanted to "rally" then it was "let's count how many times we can hit it back and forth before a mistake"...that was not the same as a game...So as terminology and other aspects of the game have evolved, I am glad that your video explains how "tips" have evolved and that the game is very much situational...(And that tips are not the same as instruction :) ) ...Thank you for presenting the evolution of each "tip"....I think player's don't always know or are taught the "Whys" of the game...So anyone who says hard shots are not allowed has never looked at the official rules and instructions for the game.The game is evolving into a mix of power and finesse ...which is actually how it was meant to be played, ask any of the siblings or parents of the originators of the game....
Dinking is the way to play but not by choice, but rather because the dinks are so good that the opponent is forced to dink back. Your dink should be positioned so well and low that if the opponent tries to speed it up, it will fly out of the court or hit the net. But once a bad dink is hit, it is essential to capitalize on that by speeding it up and crushing the opponent. But no, you should not get upset that someone hits a well hit drive, because it's most likely your fault that you didn't hit a good enough dink and instead allowed them to crush it.
I agree. Those who say that dinking is bad or that speed is the wrong way to play are missing a crucial element: strategy. If one is mindlessly banging the ball, a little finesse and some strategy will easily counter this play style. It's hard to hit balls hard when your opponent is dropping every third shot low in the kitchen with some top spin, or when your opponent is consistently dinking in an unpredictable way. EDIT: That said, if one can't counter a faster player, its going to be tough for them to play with finesse and they probably should do some fast hands drills to improve.
Excellent info. I must watch every PB video online and your videos are consistently outstanding. Most importantly they make sense for the evolving game. Thank you.
So glad to see/hear this. I love to dink and I love to use my wicked backhand. Being able to control the pace of the ball makes for fun pickleball. Just banging is boring. Dinking until you see an opening to attack takes skill. Doing it together is what makes pickleball challenging and FUN!!
What's cool about this video is it's great for BOTH strategy beginners and advanced strategy ie as you learn to rush to the non volley zone after a serve return but then emphasizes the importance of the deep shot on that return and then maybe adding both deep and harder (maybe even spin) shot on your return while also advancing forward.
Yes, there is certainly a lot of truth and wisdom in the basic strategies but you definitely need to build out your understanding of when to use them and when to do something differently. There's no "one way" to do something all the time. As they say...it depends.
@@primetimepickleball yes a lot depends in Pickleball on the level you are playing and who you are playing along with your strengths as a player But with a consistent deep and hard serve return I would love to know a scenario where both partners being at the net is less effective than not for the other teams third shot. Whether they are banging the return or trying for the drop shot it just seems it's better to both be there ready because it's too much of your advantage not to be.
Thank you ! Yes many many people told me all these same steps. Now I’m going to apply your thoughts along with my common sense. See how it goes Good for you to share !
16:30 We just spent several days with friends who are better than we are and used every one of these platitudes. We knew it was more complex and your video validated that for us. Thanks a ton!
Excellent advice for the improving player. Think, vary your shots & strategy to suit your ability & your opponents strengths & weaknesses. Thank you Nicole.
Outstanding video! The game is evolving and your points are spot on in addressing that what used to be the norm, may not work too well for you anymore. Thanks!
So glad you liked the Video Randy! Yes, this was exactly my thought process in putting together this video. The game is evolving. Is there truth to the basic strategies? Yes, but you have to go beyond if you want to keep up.
Thanks Nicole for another excellent (and timely!) video. As a senior player, I laugh at myself that once I figured most fundamental pickleball shots/strategies down, the game changed, but it’s all about adapting and growing vs getting stuck. That’s what keeps it exciting and challenging! Bravo!
Wow! This video is EXACTLY what I needed. I recently ended up playing in a tournament where I got stuck in too a high a bracket and the 9 popular tips addressed here which used to work just fine at a lower level suddenly set me up for constant disasters and I had no idea what I was doing wrong! The worst was me trying to do drop shots from too far back and then rushing in to the net. That didn't work!!! At all!!! Ever!!! Thank you so much for enlightening me on how to play (or at least how NOT to play) when playing with strong players.
This is excellent advice. I think it is good to emphasize that all these strategies are quite useful to a certain point in your development. For instance, forehand takes the middle is good advice, especially when you are playing with different partners, until you get to about the 3.75 level when you need to add some nuance to your game. So for the hundreds of thousands of rec players at the 2.5 to 3.5 level it is important to realize that much of the “accepted way of doing things” is still good advice. You just have to know when you are ready to move up and employ the more advanced strategies that Nicole has so effectively discussed.
So much to say!! All good! You are right on with all of this information. I teach beginners and do keep it simple for them. Also coach Novice and Intermediate players. So hard to break their bad habits. Most just want to win rec games as that's how they judge each other. I teach RVE R realize what shot is coming to you V visualize your return. Pace, speed, and placement of your shot E excellence of execution. And you must practice as much as you play games to execute your shots successfully!!!
Hi Nicole, This video is long overdue. I have been doing the correct strategies while people give me draconian advice to always come up after the serve no matter what and never stand or play in transition zone. They can get so bossy and annoyed if i don’t do this. I do way better when I earn getting in. Another myth is Micky Mouse party at the net. I just lob it behind them to end the Micky Mouse party. 😂 My tennis background help definitely to understand these strategies you are presenting. Thank you.
Hi Nalyne! Glad you found this useful. Yes, the "party is at the net" is a fading concept. Yes, get to the NVZ to get good court positioning and build to attack. Don't be there, just to be there. Some players want to have a dinkfest and that's all. Nothing wrong with that but all 4 players on the court need to want that too. If that's not your game/interest then find other players that want to play more competitively. Glad you found pickleball and are having fun with it!
@PrimeTime Pickleball Some good ideas in this video. I agree that technology is evolving in game allowing players to generate more spin enabling big swings that stay in the court. That said, I don't necessarily think that's a great thing. Tennis in my opinion changed for the worse when technology allowed power only to be the way to win. I recall when serve and volley was dominant, alot of that enabled by speed of the ball. As equipment changed and game got faster, serve and volley is all but gone at highest levels. You mentioned the dink party, don't forget the banging party. Not everyone wants points that are finished quickly with every ball hit being as hard as possible. I like the fact as a guy in my mid sixties I can still compete with guys half my age. This being due to the nature of the ball, current regulations, court size, etc. I can use shot variety including speeding ball up, slowing it down, drinking, driving, lobbing, smashing, etc to try and keep my opponents off balance. Ultimately at my skill and age, I love the fact I can work my opponents into a situation favorable to my team and finish the point with a well executed ball, not necessarily hard or fast. This is why Pickelball has been so embraced by people of all ages. If it turns I future to only the strongest, fastest will win the sport will have moved away from its roots.
I’m relatively new to pickleball so I truly appreciate your clearing up some of the advice I am getting from those who have played longer. Many of these “givens” I have encountered so having your explanations has cleared my way to take their advice in a more informed way.
Awesome! Yeah, there's no hard and fast rules as far as strategy goes despite what many would like you to think. There are rules of thumb but those don't always apply which is why they're only rules of thumb.
As a longtime tennis player and instructor, I've been dipping my toe in the water of Pickleball. Therefore, I am viewing a variety of RUclips channels passing on advice and insights. One thing that continually annoys me is when these "experts" tell me that Pickleball is not mini-tennis. True, Pickleball is certainly not tennis. It requires much less good footwork, preparation, and overall fitness (at an amateur level). However, I have seen professionals (playing singles) that move and build points much like a tennis player. Of course they do, because tennis is at the core of Pickleball. I'm grateful that, in your video, you did not disrespect tennis as it probably supplies the majority of today's pickleball players who are, as I am, testing the waters (or pickle juice). I would also suggest that several professional tennis players revolutionized the game of tennis by not following a cookie-cutter approach from those who loved to tell them they were doing it wrong. Let's remember Bjorn Borg in the 70's and Rafael Nadal today. I, myself, will continue to use good tennis footwork, turn my shoulders when time permits for maximum core rotation, and use both a semi-western (or eastern) grip for groundstrokes along with a Continental grip at the net for volleys and dinks (or half-volleys). And when I get told that it is not mini-tennis, I'll suggest you stand at the net and make your best attempt to intercept my strong passing shot. My suggestion: pickleball players can learn much from watching professional tennis matches especially as it relates to positioning, footwork, and point construction. First, there was tennis, then pickleball. That order can never change. With that said, thanks for your solid video and insight.
Thanks so much for your thoughtful and thorough comment. There is certainly a lot that can be carried over from tennis hence why the great majority of the top players are former high level tennis players. It is its own game though and pickleball specific strategies are seeing some separation.
You nailed it with this video Nicole. The game is changing and is just getting faster. Especially with the introduction of carbon face paddles that add ridiculous amounts of spin and power.
Good stuff! I'm happy to have learned to make clean contact first. After that I added speed and spin. Just as my game evolved ... so did the game for everyone else.
Thank you, Nicole. This was a very informative video. I knew most of it, but still enjoyed watching it a lot! I'd love more videos on strategy for 3.75-4.5 players... I love your videos!
I watch a lot of pickleball videos and this one is probably the best I’ve ever seen. Lots of the players I play with are old school. One guy told me the other day I need to always hit 3rd shot drops and always rush to the no volley zone. Not so grasshopper. The sets of tips in this video I believe will really improve your game.
Agreed, too much old school info still flying around out there. I hope those players see the light sooner rather than later or they'll get left behind. Thanks for the kinds words and glad you found value in the video.
Agree that few videos go all in on accepting the evolution of the sport. I’m 2 months in, but I’m not sold on dinking game. Is the goal of pickleball to win points? Right? Or is it to count how many points you can win from the dinking game? It’s reasonably easy to hit attacks without going to dinking game.
@@vanrxrunner740 Well them problem you're gonna face in higher level is that the opponents are gonna force you into dinking cause if you dink properly, the ball is unattackable in most cases. If you don't have mastery over control and soft game then you are more often that not gonna put the ball nice a high for them to smash.
Works against a wall, ball machine or with a partner and work with a very slow shot focusing on keeping a stable wrist and think about only that. Drill that way for as long as it takes.
This makes so much sense. It’s the natural progression of a sport that is evolving. What we have to remember is the timing of this progression in conjunction with your skill level. While playing up is a fantastic way to improve your game, if you are playing up using these techniques and your game is not there, these tips won’t work. Quick hands and a quick mind. Great thoughts and I see where they are immensely helpful & insightful
Great video! We call it "the money's in the middle." lol My money shot is down the line (from tennis) or backhand short angle shot. Having so much fun seeing my game improve (slowly) but am excited to try the wall drills!!
Thank you! I am a beginner at pickleball who comes from a tennis background. I'm receiving a lot of flack about my aggressiveness. I haven't mastered the topspin dinking to get a low bounce, so if i see an opportunity on a high bounce coming my way, I'll hit it right "down the line" or "cross court" instead of a soft dink. If it earns the point, I don't see what the problem is. Advice on this?
It’s not a problem. You do you. Players only get upset because it’s working against them and they’d rather it didn’t. Keep in mind that as you progress in levels you will need to develop a soft game because just hitting hard on everything won’t work at higher levels of play.
I believe the lob should be covered as a strategy. You must develop a very good lob as a poor one is often just giving away a rally. However, the lob should not be considered strictly a way to win a rally. A lob is most effective as a set-up shot. Quite often the opponent will have to retreat to return the lob and will respond with a poor shot that you can put away or at least lead to you getting into an advantageous position.
Great explanations...I like the one where a guy tells someone how they have to hold the paddle grip...sure, some Grips are better than others but is it effective for that player's game...we can all hold and swing a hammer but is one right and the other wrong if they both get the same results??...I like when players "ask" you if you want any tips as opposed to just giving their unsolicited advice....as the game advances, alot of old school ideas are going to be tossed aside...two handed backhanders were unheard of in tennis now everyone does them, same goes with pickleball, the game is still developing...thanks for dispelling many common "accepted" do and don'ts of the game
Thank you SO much for addressing each of these points. This is truly helpful information. Players who get bogged down in dogmatic thinking are setting themselves up for failure.
great advice...I think you said about assessing the situation...my strategy is always to win the points with easiest shot for me...meaning my first option...assessment and flexibility in changing the strategy is important. Number one reason for doing something in the game is to win the points and not to loose the points. If we are loosing with doing something we should change it...Also different partners will have different preferences on what strategy to implement. I feel best when playing with partner that hits high percentage (middle) and hard as a first choice...
Nice! Yes, there are general strategies that work and then we can personalize from there based on our preferences/weaknesses and our partners while also factoring in what our opponents like and don't like.
Thank you for this video. It definitely helps expand my approach to the game, both strategically, as well as in terms of which shots and techniques to develop.
Great advice. PB is like chess: Frequently the opportunity to score is created by strategic shot placements several shots earlier. There is no "always" except to get the ball over the net and in the court! If you don't at least do THOSE two things, everything else is useless. I play with folks who don't like the "fast game." If I want to be accepted for play with them, I opt to work on my "soft game" and the accuracy of shot placement. I even will intentionally place a ball such that the opponent can make a return. EVERYONE wants to get a chance to hit the ball! That may seem dumb but if you can place a ball for easy return, you can also place it where it is difficult! The skill is: Mental agility to recognize the desired destination spot and intentionally placing it there consistently. Likewise, if you have a partner who refuses to get to the NVZ because they don't like the stress, go ahead and stay parallel with him/her where they are comfortable (to avoid creating a big gap) and work on dealing with that less-than-optimal position. There is something to be learned no matter where you find yourself on the court. The point that YOU know that you are not in the best position but are choosing to make the best of it. One final thing: I think those players with "fastest hands" actually have developed a keen sense of where the incoming shot is likely to go and being ready for it. There is some degree of guessing going on; sometime they guess right and sometimes not. Getting better also comes from getting smarter. Getting smarter comes from experience and from watching the pros play and noting how they prepare for the shot that is going to come back.
Love it! This is one of the most insightful comments someone has every dropped on this channel. Than you! I agree with you 💯. Sorry for the delayed response. I fell behind.
Nice. Finally, a video that does not try to tell you there is primarily one best way of making various shots. Yes, we athletic, beginner to intermediate players are capable of making common sense decisions rather than being treated like children (in other videos).
The speed of the game is here to stay. That has made it extremely important to develop a good block/reset when your opponent has the high ground. So many players just keep hitting back with pace when they are at net level or below, keeping their opponents in the advantageous position, then say "nice shot" when their opponent finally puts a volley away. They fail to realize that really it was their own BAD SHOT that led to the point being won by the opponent. A good reset will quickly turn the tables and put yourself in the advantage as they are now the ones hitting up.
LOL, I hate that too. Novice partner: "Nice shot" (to opponent after a pop up) Me: "Nice shot?. No, that was a cream puff, easy put-away because you GAVE it to them"
What about the serving team coming to the line always together or split after the 3rd shot return. the person hitting the 3rd shot (if second shoot is deep) has to stay back but if I as the non server on the team know that the return is not coming to me, I rush to the NVZ so we have at least one up at the net, but I hear both sometimes saying , no stay back with your partner and flow to the line together. this seems to give up some offensive capability right away. What do you think? I just subscribed and liked.
Well done! I come from a advanced level ping pong background and hitting hard with spin is the norm. Pickleball is a perfect crossover, but I was feeling badly for hitting hard and changed to a group that hit harder. But I can still see that hitting hard isn't looked at kindly :(
Personally, I prefer it when my opponents play at their best in order to improve my own game. That said, if you're playing against less capable opponents, you might consider practicing other skills that you have yet to master to avoid frustration.
Great accurate evaluation of the rapid evolvements of pickleball in general. Paddle improvement alone will change the game as racquet improvement in both tennis and racquetball did. Think back on tennis played with wooden racquets and compare that to how it is played with modern racquets.
Down the middle does solve the riddle though… the main lesson from that one isn’t to jam the middle no matter what, it mostly applies to people trying to paint the lines when they have a number of shots down the middle that are higher percentage. When people unnecessarily go for those edges they often miss trying to do too much, or if they are higher level they just get ernie’d. And again while no strategy should be employed all the time, down the middle works an awful lot.
I agree that it works as part of a bigger overall strategy. Many players take it as stand alone advice which is why I sought to unpack it in this video. Thanks for the comment.
As an advanced beginner and I can say with 100% certainty there's a LOT of really bad advice out there! More "advanced" players love to tell us newer players how to play and most of the time it's total crap advice. This is why I LOVE your videos; you debunk the myths all the time. Keep 'em coming, Nicole!
Thanks Kath! Yup, I strive to shed light on reality. Most mean well but sadly the mark gets missed and I seek to being a more complete perspective. Glad it comes across.
Agree; what is it about pickleball that makes folks think they need to be constantly "teaching"? And, as you say, most of it is parroting nonsense. Tennis was never like that.
Problem is most players (near me) do Round Robin in rec play. You don’t always know what skills, strengths and weaknesses your partner has, much less your opponents. You find out in real time, during the game, and then hope for the best. I think in rec play some basic guidelines are helpful.
Thanks for the clear, concise information, presented in an understandable and adaptable way, for me at least. The issue I have is trying to find a place to practice these concepts and a partner to hit balls at me, because without the physical part of drilling these into my subconscious, the lessons become lost.
One shot that is never talked about or is considered off limits is a lob from the baseline. I don't know why this. When you and your partner are stuck at the baseline in a defensive position with your opponents established at the kitchen line I will occasionally lob the ball with topspin high over their heads, where they are forced to scramble back while we then rush to the line. We will typically win this point as they are then forced to try a baseline drop or drive off balance after they reach the lob.
Good vid. I also noticed advanced players are banging at the net. They can even drive their backhand with major top spin below the net. Against these players, I am always getting smashed when I do a third shot drop that is not perfect. So I guess I need to change my strategy as the game evolves. . Would like to see a video on the mechanics of the backhand top spin drive at the net...if you have one, please provide link.. Thank you.
Ex tennis player played in australia for 3 weeks. Heard all of this as i blasted drives threw everybody and become the best player in club in 3 weeks.. Simply everything the old school pickleball players say is just repeated ideas but dont work and nobody thinks for themselves.. I figured out all of this myself but im guessing its a tennis background thing. Cool video and i hope it helps other newbies escape the dummy pickleball 'know it alls'
I'm still struggling with the results of 3rd shot drives (or any 3rd shot) when the service return is very deep (and probably cross court) to me. The context of the problem is that I'm pushed back possibly several feet behind the baseline and the returner has plenty of time to mosey on up to the kitchen line. Some further context is necessary: I'm 64 and though I'm not slow for my age I'm not as fast as I was when I was 25; and I'm usually playing ladders, rotations or open play and therefore I don't have partners I can count on or even predict for that matter. The problem is this. I hit a good 3rd shot drive: low and hard with decent placement (i.e. not directly to either opponent but they can still usually get to it). But both opponents are at the kitchen line and it's not terribly hard for them to take all the pace off the ball and make a super short soft shot in the kitchen on my side of the court. Since I'm well behind the baseline when I hit the ball, I simply am not fast enough to run all the way from where I hit the 3rd shot to the opponents super short return. So I lose the point. Not every time, but too often. In theory, my partner should get up to the kitchen while I'm dropping back to take the 3rd shot, and then cover the opponents short shot for me, but theory and reality just don't mesh in this case. I have other 3rd shots, but for the 3rd shot drive for well behind the baseline what am I doing wrong? How do I prevent the super short return?
Hi Bret! It doesn’t seem to me like you’re doing anything wrong. The low drive which you say you hit well is a great response. And yes, you and your partner can make a plan that they will look to cover a super short response. If they can’t be relied upon to do that then there’s not much you can do about it. You’ve done your part. That’s just the way the cookie crumbles in open play and with partners you can’t rely on. Are you able to take some pace of your drive and still keep it low (off speed drive). So you can give yourself a better chance of getting to those shots yourself? Outside of that…work on strengthening your drop.
@@primetimepickleball Yes, I'm able to hit off speed drives, usually about 40% of max speed (for me), usually with lots of topspin, and these days that's my go to shot for deep service returns. And because the ball is moving slower and has a lot of topspin, it tends to be much lower when it gets to the opponents which makes their return a bit harder, and, as you point out, gives me (and my partner) more time to get closer to the kitchen. The other thing I've been trying lately with some success is to step forward and do a 3rd shot half-volley. This saves me several feet in my long trek to the kitchen and often the service returner hasn't yet made it to the kitchen before my shot reaches them, limiting their options and giving me more time. And for those of us who aren't young and fast, time is the most precious commodity in the world on (and off) the pickleball court.
This is super solid info. I never understood the “just get the serve in”. It was just bizarre for me not to be offensively serving. Unless I’m totally off my game. I am going to smoke those serves center, middle, and outside corner and with different spins. Sets up great forehand drives. Even at 4.5/5.0 level. The right side logic also irritates me. If anything, I think it takes more discipline to be a good right side player and really jive with your left side partner who’s role is to be a bit more aggressive. But I’m traditionally a left side player but since I played with my dad on the right, I’ve learned to turn off and turn on my super aggressive game to play either side.
@@primetimepickleball have you done a video on hitting a sliding ball? Even though I play 4.5, a ball that skips on me gives me a nasty miss hit. It’s the ones that skip out of nowhere. I can expect it when it’s sliced. It’s the ones that look like easy sets up. Like I take my time, set my feet and swing smooth but last second it slides making me hit it almost behind me versus out front. Doesn’t happen often but it annoys me when it does.
Speed kills. Yes the evolution of Pickleball, especially with all the money coming into the game, attracts young, better athletes putting on a show. As the play morphs over time, the game of Pickleball will revert back to a touch game as players get better at defending against the attack. Speed will always be a part of the game and for now, the Bangers will rule the game's direction, but speed will eventually give way to touch, especially in recreational play. Pros are paid for entertainment which for now is speeding up the game. All this is good news!
I can't say I'm sold on "speed giving way to touch". I'm in the camp of...you need to be a complete player and use the right shot for the right situation. The game will continue to speed up but touch will still be needed, in my view.
This video should be sent to all coaches who are stuck in dinking la la land. Fast hands, fast paddles, fast balls, fast court surfaces, younger/quicker players with great hands, all point to what you said in explaining evolution of this game. You succinctly identified progression from beginner and up, and how the game has evolved to be played as opportunistic as possible
Advanced players use lobs in 2 ways: #1 Offensively when they have their opponents leaning forward at the NVZ line to push them off the line and into the back court and gain control of the point and #2 when they’re back in the court on big defense and throw up lobs as high and as deep as possible and seek to get back to neutral in the point and ideally work their way all the way back up to the NVZ line.
I have a comment on "no man's land". I would say it does exist, and it is the place right in front of the baseline. Too many players, even ones with experience, hit a serve and step right in front of that base line. Or at some point during a point stand right there. Whenever I see that I just pound a shot at thier feet. Easy point. But I do agree that the transition zone in between both lines is underutilized strategically. I especially find that so many players are used to that third shot drop, that I can sit back and wait for a cheese ball to attack as I wish.
The rule the pros are using who covers the middle is if your opponent is hitting diagonal from you. Forehand or backhand it doesn’t mater you see a pop up diagonal you already have your paddle ready towards them and down for the pickup.
If you can cut off the ball before it gets cross court from the player who is sending it that way that is straight ahead of you then yes...take it and be offensive with it.
3:56 I hope nobody is paying attention to what the blonde girl in the back right box is doing when you're showing a proper return and rush to the kitchen. She is staying far back in the court while her partner goes up by himself, even though he hit a fine deep return.
thanks, I'll have to take a look at that. Yes, if your partner hits a return that gives you time to come up...DO IT! Get up as soon as your reasonable can.
@@primetimepickleball Haha sometimes I just can't help myself and I end up reminding my opponents that they should do their best to come up to the kitchen. It throws me off when I'm about to hit a 3rd shot and 1/2 of the other team is loitering in the back of the court for no reason, leaving their opponent solo at the kitchen. Of course if I really wanted to win at all costs, I'd keep it to myself because it gives me a huge advantage, but it just feels so wrong.
@@AMurderOfLobs I play, I suck, but I play. Why not call the left side of the court the living room and the right side the bedroom and the paddle the spoon and the ball the doughnut and the net the colander?
This is an excellent video. Ive watched many instruction videos, and they contain "always" advice, or "never" advice. Bruce Lee said to be like water. Adapt. Vary your game. Be like Bruce Lee!
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I love that you're addressing the evolution of the game. I've heard pretty much all of these, but as I've gotten better and faced better opponents, they just don't hold up quite so well. Thank you for the permission to grow!
Yes, they hold you back after a certain point. Gotta keep growing!
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I was fortunate enough to, in the 1980s as a college tennis player & PE major, help my racket sports professor put together a pickleball instruction manual. (He used our tennis team and racquetball team for photos) He was actually friends of the families that invented the game. So, that said.....Not anywhere in the manual was the word "dink" used, (it's called a half-volley),(or "kitchen" for that matter ) and the game was meant to be fast and fun, with "vigorous volleys at the net".... But if you wanted to "rally" then it was "let's count how many times we can hit it back and forth before a mistake"...that was not the same as a game...So as terminology and other aspects of the game have evolved, I am glad that your video explains how "tips" have evolved and that the game is very much situational...(And that tips are not the same as instruction :) )
...Thank you for presenting the evolution of each "tip"....I think player's don't always know or are taught the "Whys" of the game...So anyone who says hard shots are not allowed has never looked at the official rules and instructions for the game.The game is evolving into a mix of power and finesse ...which is actually how it was meant to be played, ask any of the siblings or parents of the originators of the game....
Yes, I always try to give the why in addition to the how. I think it's so important.
Thanks for the comment.
Dinking is the way to play but not by choice, but rather because the dinks are so good that the opponent is forced to dink back. Your dink should be positioned so well and low that if the opponent tries to speed it up, it will fly out of the court or hit the net. But once a bad dink is hit, it is essential to capitalize on that by speeding it up and crushing the opponent. But no, you should not get upset that someone hits a well hit drive, because it's most likely your fault that you didn't hit a good enough dink and instead allowed them to crush it.
So well said Fernando!
Big deal
I agree. Those who say that dinking is bad or that speed is the wrong way to play are missing a crucial element: strategy. If one is mindlessly banging the ball, a little finesse and some strategy will easily counter this play style. It's hard to hit balls hard when your opponent is dropping every third shot low in the kitchen with some top spin, or when your opponent is consistently dinking in an unpredictable way. EDIT: That said, if one can't counter a faster player, its going to be tough for them to play with finesse and they probably should do some fast hands drills to improve.
I dink until it is no longer necessary.
@@mddale beautifully put
Excellent info. I must watch every PB video online and your videos are consistently outstanding. Most importantly they make sense for the evolving game. Thank you.
Thank you so much! I really work hard to make the videos impactful.
So glad to see/hear this. I love to dink and I love to use my wicked backhand. Being able to control the pace of the ball makes for fun pickleball. Just banging is boring. Dinking until you see an opening to attack takes skill. Doing it together is what makes pickleball challenging and FUN!!
You got it Ann!
Totally agree. Be patient, dink, wait for an opportunity then go in for the kill.
What's cool about this video is it's great for BOTH strategy beginners and advanced strategy ie as you learn to rush to the non volley zone after a serve return but then emphasizes the importance of the deep shot on that return and then maybe adding both deep and harder (maybe even spin) shot on your return while also advancing forward.
Yes, there is certainly a lot of truth and wisdom in the basic strategies but you definitely need to build out your understanding of when to use them and when to do something differently. There's no "one way" to do something all the time. As they say...it depends.
@@primetimepickleball yes a lot depends in Pickleball on the level you are playing and who you are playing along with your strengths as a player But with a consistent deep and hard serve return I would love to know a scenario where both partners being at the net is less effective than not for the other teams third shot. Whether they are banging the return or trying for the drop shot it just seems it's better to both be there ready because it's too much of your advantage not to be.
Thank you ! Yes many many people told me all these same steps. Now I’m going to apply your thoughts along with my common sense. See how it goes
Good for you to share !
Awesome! Pickleball is an evolution.
16:30 We just spent several days with friends who are better than we are and used every one of these platitudes. We knew it was more complex and your video validated that for us. Thanks a ton!
My pleasure Marshall!
Excellent advice for the improving player.
Think, vary your shots & strategy to suit your ability & your opponents strengths & weaknesses.
Thank you Nicole.
You got it! You're welcome 😊
Outstanding video! The game is evolving and your points are spot on in addressing that what used to be the norm, may not work too well for you anymore. Thanks!
So glad you liked the Video Randy! Yes, this was exactly my thought process in putting together this video. The game is evolving. Is there truth to the basic strategies? Yes, but you have to go beyond if you want to keep up.
@@primetimepickleball Sent it out to my local blog email list and look forward to discussing these points with folks. Keep up the good work.
Thanks Nicole for another excellent (and timely!) video. As a senior player, I laugh at myself that once I figured most fundamental pickleball shots/strategies down, the game changed, but it’s all about adapting and growing vs getting stuck. That’s what keeps it exciting and challenging! Bravo!
you're welcome! glad you like it! yep you got it, it's all about growing and adapting
Wow! This video is EXACTLY what I needed. I recently ended up playing in a tournament where I got stuck in too a high a bracket and the 9 popular tips addressed here which used to work just fine at a lower level suddenly set me up for constant disasters and I had no idea what I was doing wrong! The worst was me trying to do drop shots from too far back and then rushing in to the net. That didn't work!!! At all!!! Ever!!!
Thank you so much for enlightening me on how to play (or at least how NOT to play) when playing with strong players.
Awesome! So glad you learned a lot from it!
This is excellent advice. I think it is good to emphasize that all these strategies are quite useful to a certain point in your development. For instance, forehand takes the middle is good advice, especially when you are playing with different partners, until you get to about the 3.75 level when you need to add some nuance to your game. So for the hundreds of thousands of rec players at the 2.5 to 3.5 level it is important to realize that much of the “accepted way of doing things” is still good advice. You just have to know when you are ready to move up and employ the more advanced strategies that Nicole has so effectively discussed.
💯 Yes, things are always changing as the variables change.
So much to say!! All good! You are right on with all of this information. I teach beginners and do keep it simple for them. Also coach Novice and Intermediate players. So hard to break their bad habits. Most just want to win rec games as that's how they judge each other. I teach RVE
R realize what shot is coming to you
V visualize your return. Pace, speed, and placement of your shot
E excellence of execution. And you must practice as much as you play games to execute your shots successfully!!!
Loving RVE! Nice tool.
Hi Nicole, This video is long overdue. I have been doing the correct strategies while people give me draconian advice to always come up after the serve no matter what and never stand or play in transition zone. They can get so bossy and annoyed if i don’t do this. I do way better when I earn getting in. Another myth is Micky Mouse party at the net. I just lob it behind them to end the Micky Mouse party. 😂
My tennis background help definitely to understand these strategies you are presenting. Thank you.
Hi Nalyne! Glad you found this useful. Yes, the "party is at the net" is a fading concept. Yes, get to the NVZ to get good court positioning and build to attack. Don't be there, just to be there. Some players want to have a dinkfest and that's all. Nothing wrong with that but all 4 players on the court need to want that too. If that's not your game/interest then find other players that want to play more competitively. Glad you found pickleball and are having fun with it!
@PrimeTime Pickleball Some good ideas in this video. I agree that technology is evolving in game allowing players to generate more spin enabling big swings that stay in the court. That said, I don't necessarily think that's a great thing. Tennis in my opinion changed for the worse when technology allowed power only to be the way to win. I recall when serve and volley was dominant, alot of that enabled by speed of the ball. As equipment changed and game got faster, serve and volley is all but gone at highest levels.
You mentioned the dink party, don't forget the banging party. Not everyone wants points that are finished quickly with every ball hit being as hard as possible. I like the fact as a guy in my mid sixties I can still compete with guys half my age. This being due to the nature of the ball, current regulations, court size, etc. I can use shot variety including speeding ball up, slowing it down, drinking, driving, lobbing, smashing, etc to try and keep my opponents off balance. Ultimately at my skill and age, I love the fact I can work my opponents into a situation favorable to my team and finish the point with a well executed ball, not necessarily hard or fast. This is why Pickelball has been so embraced by people of all ages. If it turns I future to only the strongest, fastest will win the sport will have moved away from its roots.
Lob it when a dinking party is going on extremely occasionally maybe. It’s probably a very bad idea if you do it often against two strong players.
Good stuff Nicole. In my five years of playing, my game has evolved to include all of the items you mentioned. Thanks
I’m relatively new to pickleball so I truly appreciate your clearing up some of the advice I am getting from those who have played longer. Many of these “givens” I have encountered so having your explanations has cleared my way to take their advice in a more informed way.
Awesome! Yeah, there's no hard and fast rules as far as strategy goes despite what many would like you to think. There are rules of thumb but those don't always apply which is why they're only rules of thumb.
Absolutely spot on! Great job! If you want to up your game, watch this video...and then watch it again.
Thanks Patrick! Much appreciated!
As a longtime tennis player and instructor, I've been dipping my toe in the water of Pickleball. Therefore, I am viewing a variety of RUclips channels passing on advice and insights. One thing that continually annoys me is when these "experts" tell me that Pickleball is not mini-tennis. True, Pickleball is certainly not tennis. It requires much less good footwork, preparation, and overall fitness (at an amateur level). However, I have seen professionals (playing singles) that move and build points much like a tennis player. Of course they do, because tennis is at the core of Pickleball. I'm grateful that, in your video, you did not disrespect tennis as it probably supplies the majority of today's pickleball players who are, as I am, testing the waters (or pickle juice). I would also suggest that several professional tennis players revolutionized the game of tennis by not following a cookie-cutter approach from those who loved to tell them they were doing it wrong. Let's remember Bjorn Borg in the 70's and Rafael Nadal today. I, myself, will continue to use good tennis footwork, turn my shoulders when time permits for maximum core rotation, and use both a semi-western (or eastern) grip for groundstrokes along with a Continental grip at the net for volleys and dinks (or half-volleys). And when I get told that it is not mini-tennis, I'll suggest you stand at the net and make your best attempt to intercept my strong passing shot. My suggestion: pickleball players can learn much from watching professional tennis matches especially as it relates to positioning, footwork, and point construction. First, there was tennis, then pickleball. That order can never change. With that said, thanks for your solid video and insight.
Thanks so much for your thoughtful and thorough comment. There is certainly a lot that can be carried over from tennis hence why the great majority of the top players are former high level tennis players. It is its own game though and pickleball specific strategies are seeing some separation.
Love this video! Thanks for articulating these thoughts, Nicole!
You are so welcome!
I’ve been taking lessons and playing others for a year, but had truly not heard these before… Thankfully🙂. Cheers.
Happy to help!
You nailed it with this video Nicole. The game is changing and is just getting faster. Especially with the introduction of carbon face paddles that add ridiculous amounts of spin and power.
Thanks Patrick! Yup, it's clear where the direction is headed.
Good stuff!
I'm happy to have learned to make clean contact first. After that I added speed and spin. Just as my game evolved ... so did the game for everyone else.
Nice work! Clean contact is crucial. Really smart progression you did there. That's how it should go. Step by step.
Thank you, Nicole. This was a very informative video. I knew most of it, but still enjoyed watching it a lot! I'd love more videos on strategy for 3.75-4.5 players... I love your videos!
Yay! Thank you!
at 2:01 yall are playing with a tennis net, is that ok? Isnt the tennis net way too high
tennis nets often double as pickleball nets. you just lower the net two inches.
I watch a lot of pickleball videos and this one is probably the best I’ve ever seen. Lots of the players I play with are old school. One guy told me the other day I need to always hit 3rd shot drops and always rush to the no volley zone. Not so grasshopper. The sets of tips in this video I believe will really improve your game.
Agreed, too much old school info still flying around out there. I hope those players see the light sooner rather than later or they'll get left behind. Thanks for the kinds words and glad you found value in the video.
Agree that few videos go all in on accepting the evolution of the sport. I’m 2 months in, but I’m not sold on dinking game. Is the goal of pickleball to win points? Right? Or is it to count how many points you can win from the dinking game? It’s reasonably easy to hit attacks without going to dinking game.
@@vanrxrunner740 Well them problem you're gonna face in higher level is that the opponents are gonna force you into dinking cause if you dink properly, the ball is unattackable in most cases. If you don't have mastery over control and soft game then you are more often that not gonna put the ball nice a high for them to smash.
@@vanrxrunner740 You need both to advance
I twist my wrist downward on my backhand when at the NVZ. Its reflex..how can I correct it?
Works against a wall, ball machine or with a partner and work with a very slow shot focusing on keeping a stable wrist and think about only that. Drill that way for as long as it takes.
This makes so much sense. It’s the natural progression of a sport that is evolving. What we have to remember is the timing of this progression in conjunction with your skill level. While playing up is a fantastic way to improve your game, if you are playing up using these techniques and your game is not there, these tips won’t work. Quick hands and a quick mind. Great thoughts and I see where they are immensely helpful & insightful
You're on point with this Kim! You have to be ready skill wise to take advantage of these strategies.
Great video! We call it "the money's in the middle." lol My money shot is down the line (from tennis) or backhand short angle shot. Having so much fun seeing my game improve (slowly) but am excited to try the wall drills!!
Awesome!!
Thank you! I am a beginner at pickleball who comes from a tennis background. I'm receiving a lot of flack about my aggressiveness. I haven't mastered the topspin dinking to get a low bounce, so if i see an opportunity on a high bounce coming my way, I'll hit it right "down the line" or "cross court" instead of a soft dink. If it earns the point, I don't see what the problem is. Advice on this?
It’s not a problem. You do you. Players only get upset because it’s working against them and they’d rather it didn’t. Keep in mind that as you progress in levels you will need to develop a soft game because just hitting hard on everything won’t work at higher levels of play.
Great advice! I'm certainly in the spot where much of the "old mantra" is holding me back. Thank you.
Glad it was helpful!
Agree 100% with all of these and I’m seeing every one of them more and more as I advance from novice to intermediate. Great video! Keep them coming!
Totally! Thanks for the comment Augster. I’m glad you enjoyed the video.
Excellent! I realize the "lob" is chancy....but it can also be an effective shot if you've developed it to a point of accuracy.
Agreed! If you’ve got it…use it! Worth developing if you don’t quite have it locked in yet.
I believe the lob should be covered as a strategy. You must develop a very good lob as a poor one is often just giving away a rally. However, the lob should not be considered strictly a way to win a rally. A lob is most effective as a set-up shot. Quite often the opponent will have to retreat to return the lob and will respond with a poor shot that you can put away or at least lead to you getting into an advantageous position.
Great explanations...I like the one where a guy tells someone how they have to hold the paddle grip...sure, some Grips are better than others but is it effective for that player's game...we can all hold and swing a hammer but is one right and the other wrong if they both get the same results??...I like when players "ask" you if you want any tips as opposed to just giving their unsolicited advice....as the game advances, alot of old school ideas are going to be tossed aside...two handed backhanders were unheard of in tennis now everyone does them, same goes with pickleball, the game is still developing...thanks for dispelling many common "accepted" do and don'ts of the game
Thanks for the thoughtful comment. Great points! Yes, there are certainly variations to everything and multiple ways to do it can be effective.
Thank you SO much for addressing each of these points. This is truly helpful information. Players who get bogged down in dogmatic thinking are setting themselves up for failure.
You’re very welcome! Glad this info helps you. Yes, pickleball has evolved.
great advice...I think you said about assessing the situation...my strategy is always to win the points with easiest shot for me...meaning my first option...assessment and flexibility in changing the strategy is important. Number one reason for doing something in the game is to win the points and not to loose the points. If we are loosing with doing something we should change it...Also different partners will have different preferences on what strategy to implement. I feel best when playing with partner that hits high percentage (middle) and hard as a first choice...
Nice! Yes, there are general strategies that work and then we can personalize from there based on our preferences/weaknesses and our partners while also factoring in what our opponents like and don't like.
Great video. There is ALOT out there. Yours is to the point, well thought out and explained. Thank you!
Thanks so much Steve! I really strive to me clear and explain everything well. I'm glad it comes across.
As a newbie who gets unsolicited advice (most great), I really appreciate the nuance here. #7 was my favourite.
Thanks!
Excellent thoughts in this video. I agree with your comments about moving players forward on their Pickleball journey to the next level.
Awesome! Thanks so much for the comment Geoffrey!
Great video! Really cleared up some things. Very clear and concise. Thank you!
Thanks Julie!
Thank you for this video. It definitely helps expand my approach to the game, both strategically, as well as in terms of which shots and techniques to develop.
So glad it was helpful!
This is your best video yet Considering the evolution of the game is brilliant
Thanks Marc!
Great video! Issues are so well framed and easy to understand.
Hi Mir! Thanks so much for dropping this comment :)
Great advice. PB is like chess: Frequently the opportunity to score is created by strategic shot placements several shots earlier. There is no "always" except to get the ball over the net and in the court! If you don't at least do THOSE two things, everything else is useless. I play with folks who don't like the "fast game." If I want to be accepted for play with them, I opt to work on my "soft game" and the accuracy of shot placement. I even will intentionally place a ball such that the opponent can make a return. EVERYONE wants to get a chance to hit the ball! That may seem dumb but if you can place a ball for easy return, you can also place it where it is difficult! The skill is: Mental agility to recognize the desired destination spot and intentionally placing it there consistently. Likewise, if you have a partner who refuses to get to the NVZ because they don't like the stress, go ahead and stay parallel with him/her where they are comfortable (to avoid creating a big gap) and work on dealing with that less-than-optimal position. There is something to be learned no matter where you find yourself on the court. The point that YOU know that you are not in the best position but are choosing to make the best of it. One final thing: I think those players with "fastest hands" actually have developed a keen sense of where the incoming shot is likely to go and being ready for it. There is some degree of guessing going on; sometime they guess right and sometimes not. Getting better also comes from getting smarter. Getting smarter comes from experience and from watching the pros play and noting how they prepare for the shot that is going to come back.
Love it! This is one of the most insightful comments someone has every dropped on this channel. Than you! I agree with you 💯. Sorry for the delayed response. I fell behind.
This was the most clear succinct explanation of good strategies I’ve heard. Thank you!
Glad it was helpful!
Nice. Finally, a video that does not try to tell you there is primarily one best way of making various shots. Yes, we athletic, beginner to intermediate players are capable of making common sense decisions rather than being treated like children (in other videos).
Absolutely Van! Glad you enjoyed the vid.
The speed of the game is here to stay. That has made it extremely important to develop a good block/reset when your opponent has the high ground. So many players just keep hitting back with pace when they are at net level or below, keeping their opponents in the advantageous position, then say "nice shot" when their opponent finally puts a volley away. They fail to realize that really it was their own BAD SHOT that led to the point being won by the opponent. A good reset will quickly turn the tables and put yourself in the advantage as they are now the ones hitting up.
Totally agree Bryce! Very well said. Many aren't aware they're feeding right into what their opponents want.
LOL, I hate that too.
Novice partner: "Nice shot" (to opponent after a pop up)
Me: "Nice shot?. No, that was a cream puff, easy put-away because you GAVE it to them"
Very well done. At the 60’s plus group which is where I play these strategies surface constantly
Great reset here. Ty
Thanks David! Yes, traditional strategies are a good start but it doesn't end there.
Best set of recommendations ever! Thank you Nicole! :D
Thank you! Glad you enjoyed it and I appreciate the positive feedback.
Very helpful to hear the obvious, that the best techniques/strategies must be nuanced with the situation.
😊
Outstanding video loved it. Confirmed all my thoughts. It's an evolving game!
Thank you! I'm glad you liked the video. The game is truly ever evolving.
Great tips! Makes me want to run out & play! Thank you😊
Awesome! 😁
What about the serving team coming to the line always together or split after the 3rd shot return. the person hitting the 3rd shot (if second shoot is deep) has to stay back but if I as the non server on the team know that the return is not coming to me, I rush to the NVZ so we have at least one up at the net, but I hear both sometimes saying , no stay back with your partner and flow to the line together. this seems to give up some offensive capability right away. What do you think? I just subscribed and liked.
If you have one up and one back then it creates a huge diagonal gap between you two. I'd recommend you advancing as a team.
Well done! I come from a advanced level ping pong background and hitting hard with spin is the norm. Pickleball is a perfect crossover, but I was feeling badly for hitting hard and changed to a group that hit harder. But I can still see that hitting hard isn't looked at kindly :(
Personally, I prefer it when my opponents play at their best in order to improve my own game. That said, if you're playing against less capable opponents, you might consider practicing other skills that you have yet to master to avoid frustration.
The game is getting harder. Don't feel bad about it. You just have to play with a group that can handle it.
Yup! Love it.
Thanks!
Thanks you so much!
What an awesome video! Excellent instruction, explanation, and examples in the video.
Thanks so much! Glad you enjoyed it.
Great accurate evaluation of the rapid evolvements of pickleball in general. Paddle improvement alone will change the game as racquet improvement in both tennis and racquetball did. Think back on tennis played with wooden racquets and compare that to how it is played with modern racquets.
Agreed! Thanks for the comment.
Down the middle does solve the riddle though… the main lesson from that one isn’t to jam the middle no matter what, it mostly applies to people trying to paint the lines when they have a number of shots down the middle that are higher percentage. When people unnecessarily go for those edges they often miss trying to do too much, or if they are higher level they just get ernie’d. And again while no strategy should be employed all the time, down the middle works an awful lot.
I agree that it works as part of a bigger overall strategy. Many players take it as stand alone advice which is why I sought to unpack it in this video. Thanks for the comment.
So many valid observations and appropriate recommendations for improving your game. Thanks
Thanks Tommy!
As an advanced beginner and I can say with 100% certainty there's a LOT of really bad advice out there! More "advanced" players love to tell us newer players how to play and most of the time it's total crap advice. This is why I LOVE your videos; you debunk the myths all the time. Keep 'em coming, Nicole!
Thanks Kath! Yup, I strive to shed light on reality. Most mean well but sadly the mark gets missed and I seek to being a more complete perspective. Glad it comes across.
Agree; what is it about pickleball that makes folks think they need to be constantly "teaching"? And, as you say, most of it is parroting nonsense. Tennis was never like that.
I've been told to hold the line at the no kitchen and to have a little wiggle room (approx. 8 inches off the line)
Yes, some wiggle room is good.
Fantastic video, very helpful, especially for the newbie
Thanks Jim! Glad you think so.
Problem is most players (near me) do Round Robin in rec play. You don’t always know what skills, strengths and weaknesses your partner has, much less your opponents. You find out in real time, during the game, and then hope for the best. I think in rec play some basic guidelines are helpful.
yeah, open play and switching up partners does present this challenge.
Great info I teach new players and do work the start conventional system but growing from this plan builds there game THANKS FOR THE GREAT TIPS!
Awesome Bob! Yes, start with conventional and the build. Keep up the good work. 👍
Thanks for the clear, concise information, presented in an understandable and adaptable way, for me at least. The issue I have is trying to find a place to practice these concepts and a partner to hit balls at me, because without the physical part of drilling these into my subconscious, the lessons become lost.
Keep looking! There's someone out there.
One shot that is never talked about or is considered off limits is a lob from the baseline. I don't know why this. When you and your partner are stuck at the baseline in a defensive position with your opponents established at the kitchen line I will occasionally lob the ball with topspin high over their heads, where they are forced to scramble back while we then rush to the line. We will typically win this point as they are then forced to try a baseline drop or drive off balance after they reach the lob.
Yes, this is a great strategy but mainly if you're on big defense or your opponents have bad or so-so overheads.
I’m stuck, taller players with better reach are up at the kitchen and I don’t know where to hit my shot if I am in the transition zone. Please help.
Drive it low at them or drop it short enough so it’s still out of reach for them. It’s possible even if they’re tall. You have to train it.
Using that idiotic term, kitchen.
Good vid. I also noticed advanced players are banging at the net. They can even drive their backhand with major top spin below the net. Against these players, I am always getting smashed when I do a third shot drop that is not perfect. So I guess I need to change my strategy as the game evolves. . Would like to see a video on the mechanics of the backhand top spin drive at the net...if you have one, please provide link.. Thank you.
Yes, we have TWO:
ruclips.net/video/WzjRrQGLZmU/видео.html
ruclips.net/video/i4UPFzl6QuU/видео.html
Ex tennis player played in australia for 3 weeks. Heard all of this as i blasted drives threw everybody and become the best player in club in 3 weeks.. Simply everything the old school pickleball players say is just repeated ideas but dont work and nobody thinks for themselves.. I figured out all of this myself but im guessing its a tennis background thing. Cool video and i hope it helps other newbies escape the dummy pickleball 'know it alls'
Glad you enjoyed the video. Thanks for your comments!
I'm still struggling with the results of 3rd shot drives (or any 3rd shot) when the service return is very deep (and probably cross court) to me. The context of the problem is that I'm pushed back possibly several feet behind the baseline and the returner has plenty of time to mosey on up to the kitchen line. Some further context is necessary: I'm 64 and though I'm not slow for my age I'm not as fast as I was when I was 25; and I'm usually playing ladders, rotations or open play and therefore I don't have partners I can count on or even predict for that matter.
The problem is this. I hit a good 3rd shot drive: low and hard with decent placement (i.e. not directly to either opponent but they can still usually get to it). But both opponents are at the kitchen line and it's not terribly hard for them to take all the pace off the ball and make a super short soft shot in the kitchen on my side of the court. Since I'm well behind the baseline when I hit the ball, I simply am not fast enough to run all the way from where I hit the 3rd shot to the opponents super short return. So I lose the point. Not every time, but too often.
In theory, my partner should get up to the kitchen while I'm dropping back to take the 3rd shot, and then cover the opponents short shot for me, but theory and reality just don't mesh in this case.
I have other 3rd shots, but for the 3rd shot drive for well behind the baseline what am I doing wrong? How do I prevent the super short return?
Hi Bret! It doesn’t seem to me like you’re doing anything wrong. The low drive which you say you hit well is a great response. And yes, you and your partner can make a plan that they will look to cover a super short response. If they can’t be relied upon to do that then there’s not much you can do about it. You’ve done your part. That’s just the way the cookie crumbles in open play and with partners you can’t rely on. Are you able to take some pace of your drive and still keep it low (off speed drive). So you can give yourself a better chance of getting to those shots yourself? Outside of that…work on strengthening your drop.
@@primetimepickleball Yes, I'm able to hit off speed drives, usually about 40% of max speed (for me), usually with lots of topspin, and these days that's my go to shot for deep service returns. And because the ball is moving slower and has a lot of topspin, it tends to be much lower when it gets to the opponents which makes their return a bit harder, and, as you point out, gives me (and my partner) more time to get closer to the kitchen.
The other thing I've been trying lately with some success is to step forward and do a 3rd shot half-volley. This saves me several feet in my long trek to the kitchen and often the service returner hasn't yet made it to the kitchen before my shot reaches them, limiting their options and giving me more time. And for those of us who aren't young and fast, time is the most precious commodity in the world on (and off) the pickleball court.
Using that idiotic term, kitchen.
This is super solid info. I never understood the “just get the serve in”. It was just bizarre for me not to be offensively serving. Unless I’m totally off my game. I am going to smoke those serves center, middle, and outside corner and with different spins. Sets up great forehand drives. Even at 4.5/5.0 level. The right side logic also irritates me. If anything, I think it takes more discipline to be a good right side player and really jive with your left side partner who’s role is to be a bit more aggressive. But I’m traditionally a left side player but since I played with my dad on the right, I’ve learned to turn off and turn on my super aggressive game to play either side.
Love these great insights! Yeah, the more versatile you can be in this game, the better you are and therefore...you're a bigger threat to opponents.
@@primetimepickleball have you done a video on hitting a sliding ball? Even though I play 4.5, a ball that skips on me gives me a nasty miss hit. It’s the ones that skip out of nowhere. I can expect it when it’s sliced. It’s the ones that look like easy sets up. Like I take my time, set my feet and swing smooth but last second it slides making me hit it almost behind me versus out front. Doesn’t happen often but it annoys me when it does.
Do you make adjustments if your partner is left-handed?
Yes, as the variables change so much your strategy.
OK!! No more woosy third shot drops. Time to drive more shots. Good video -thanks Nicole!!!
Thanks Charlie! You'll hit a bad one from time to time. Everyone does. Just don't rush in behind it.
Great video & advice. Thank you!
You are so welcome!
Sound advice, Very good tips.
Glad you think so!
Great video, excellent tips!
Thanks, I'm glad you found it helpful!
Speed kills. Yes the evolution of Pickleball, especially with all the money coming into the game, attracts young, better athletes putting on a show. As the play morphs over time, the game of Pickleball will revert back to a touch game as players get better at defending against the attack. Speed will always be a part of the game and for now, the Bangers will rule the game's direction, but speed will eventually give way to touch, especially in recreational play. Pros are paid for entertainment which for now is speeding up the game. All this is good news!
I can't say I'm sold on "speed giving way to touch". I'm in the camp of...you need to be a complete player and use the right shot for the right situation. The game will continue to speed up but touch will still be needed, in my view.
Some great tips here! A lot of the old guard tips just don't make sense anymore as the game has evolved over time.
Totally agree Zach!
So good!!!! Thank you!
Thank you! I'm glad you enjoyed it.
This video should be sent to all coaches who are stuck in dinking la la land. Fast hands, fast paddles, fast balls, fast court surfaces, younger/quicker players with great hands, all point to what you said in explaining evolution of this game. You succinctly identified progression from beginner and up, and how the game has evolved to be played as opportunistic as possible
Thanks so much Kenan! Glad to hear that I captured it. That's what I was going for :)
Good talk, thanks for the tips!
Any time!
Thank you for the helpful videos.
You'r so welcome Lily!
This is an outstanding video. Thanks
Thanks Sue! Glad you enjoyed it.
Many players claim that lobs are low level shots that shouldn’t be used by advanced players. What’s your take on lobs and when to use them?
Advanced players use lobs in 2 ways: #1 Offensively when they have their opponents leaning forward at the NVZ line to push them off the line and into the back court and gain control of the point and #2 when they’re back in the court on big defense and throw up lobs as high and as deep as possible and seek to get back to neutral in the point and ideally work their way all the way back up to the NVZ line.
Very sound advice and makes you think more about the game, at a higher level.
Yes, keep adding to your game :)
Excellent excellent excellent!!! Thank you heaps!!
You’re so welcome Francis! 😊
I have a comment on "no man's land". I would say it does exist, and it is the place right in front of the baseline. Too many players, even ones with experience, hit a serve and step right in front of that base line. Or at some point during a point stand right there. Whenever I see that I just pound a shot at thier feet. Easy point. But I do agree that the transition zone in between both lines is underutilized strategically. I especially find that so many players are used to that third shot drop, that I can sit back and wait for a cheese ball to attack as I wish.
Yep, I love it when servers stand on the baseline after they serve. I just hit my medium pace, slice return deep at their feet. Point over.
Very good point James. The "drift" inside the baseline post serve is a no no and far too common, sadly.
Excellent. So much of pickleball happens above the neck.
For sure!
GREAT video- great advice
Glad it was helpful!
So true. Funny how I will get someone tell me one of those tropes, to help me play better - all while I am kicking their butts 😂
It’s interesting time on their feedback for sure. Lol
I agree with your statement about dinking. It’s sucks and speed is here to stay
Best to embrace it as it's a foregone conclusion at this point.
Thanks for the dope content ❤
Thanks Samuel! Glad you like it!
great comments. way too many coaches using these rules as a way to teach. I agree pace of play will be the future
Absolutely
The rule the pros are using who covers the middle is if your opponent is hitting diagonal from you. Forehand or backhand it doesn’t mater you see a pop up diagonal you already have your paddle ready towards them and down for the pickup.
If you can cut off the ball before it gets cross court from the player who is sending it that way that is straight ahead of you then yes...take it and be offensive with it.
Excellent content! 👏
Thank you 🙌
3:56 I hope nobody is paying attention to what the blonde girl in the back right box is doing when you're showing a proper return and rush to the kitchen. She is staying far back in the court while her partner goes up by himself, even though he hit a fine deep return.
thanks, I'll have to take a look at that. Yes, if your partner hits a return that gives you time to come up...DO IT! Get up as soon as your reasonable can.
@@primetimepickleball Haha sometimes I just can't help myself and I end up reminding my opponents that they should do their best to come up to the kitchen. It throws me off when I'm about to hit a 3rd shot and 1/2 of the other team is loitering in the back of the court for no reason, leaving their opponent solo at the kitchen. Of course if I really wanted to win at all costs, I'd keep it to myself because it gives me a huge advantage, but it just feels so wrong.
Using that idiotic term, kitchen.
@@Capecodham Why are you watching and commenting on this video if you don't play pickleball?
@@AMurderOfLobs I play, I suck, but I play. Why not call the left side of the court the living room and the right side the bedroom and the paddle the spoon and the ball the doughnut and the net the colander?
This is an excellent video. Ive watched many instruction videos, and they contain "always" advice, or "never" advice. Bruce Lee said to be like water. Adapt. Vary your game. Be like Bruce Lee!
Yes! You want to have more than one way to handle any situation. The best course of action always “depends” on the parameters in play.
Thanks. Great tips on how to up your game
Happy to help!
Good advice, thanks.
Glad it was helpful!
Awesome video!!
Glad you enjoyed it