The Reddit Noobs were Right About Forward Castles! | 1v4 AoE2
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- Опубликовано: 11 сен 2024
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#Ageofempires2, #AoE2, #Hera
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Shall I limit castles to 1 per enemy from now on? Or shud I just get good and stop complaining? 11
Get good nerd
considering you think youre the best player in the world, id say stop crying and do some great things u were made for
Yea bro just get better don't be a whiner 11
get good nerd
Maybe one offensive castle OR 2 defensive castles. This way they can go unique units if they want to
"My defense needs to be studied for generations. Oh my god I'm popping off.... I'm feeling myself, that was amazing! Alright, good, and I was humble about it too." - Hera
clicking away from the archers so fast that we don't even hear the shot is insane 16:25
Yeah, that was impressive 😮. Microing with a few archers, moving a larger army forward, making farms, AND scouting a gold in the enemy base with an archer. All at the same time
Maybe you don't care because it is just 1/100 of the enemies
35:11 "walking around my base, with those fat a** elephants!"
lol, he was frustrated
DEFENSE! "I'm good at everything.. except humility. Cause I'm GREAT AT IT!" I love humility jokes :)
Well, my only downside is I'm too modest. 😂
>gets blessed with Goth
>goes scouts into knights into longsword into halbs
he's very confused but he's getting there
2:35 "and its been a while and they coming for revenge and that elephant just moon walked dont pretend we didnt see it" such a funny momment the way you said it omg
Thank you Grey. Those 10 skirms at 45 minutes were awesome.
1111 They were playing their own game of farming civ. I love it!
Book of Five Rings, via Internet Archive:
"There are many enemies'" applies when you are fighting one against many. Draw both sword and companion sword and assume a wide-stretched left and right attitude. *The spirit is to chase the enemies around from side to side, even though they come from all four directions. Observe their attacking order, and go to meet first those who attack first.* Sweep your eyes around broadly, carefully examining the attacking order, and cut left and right alternately with your swords. *Waiting is bad.* Always quickly reassume your attitudes to both sides, cut the enemies down as they advance, crushing them in the direction from which they attack. Whatever you do, you must drive the enemy together, as if tying a line of fishes, and when they are seen to be piled up, cut them down strongly without giving them room to move.
Applied to AoE2, and commenting on this game: 7 cavalry archers (700 res) are more useful in 1v4 than 10 crossbowmen (700 res). The fight you took against skirms at 15:22? With cavalry archers, you can just run away. In the above quote, the method is to discourage people from attacking, by making them think they are about to be attacked, so they prioritize defending over attacking. Your scouting makes it obvious just how little your opponents in this game needed to fear being attacked, when they were castle-dropping you; they didn't even fear their forward villagers would die.
You said you weren't sure how to counter Bengali elephant archers, which may be because in a 1v1 expert game, you probably wouldn't see them. Just an example of how 1v4 is different from 1v1. Later on, you weren't able to take advantage of your monks to convert some elephants while they were fighting camels, which would have been a big help: camel dies to 18 arrows (7*18=126), while a converted Elephant Archer dies to 58+ arrows (4*58=232).
Key point: moves which are good enough to win 1v1 are not good enough 1v4. Killing 15 units with 10 units: good in 1v1, bad in 1v4. You need to keep those 10 units alive to keep on killing more units. If you are, say, 1v7, then you could have 10 archers with Fletching continually shooting at units that are on No-Attack stance, and you still lose. Those 10 archers could kill 1 unit every 4 seconds, which is ~60 resources lost per 4 sec, or 15 resources per sec, which is the production of 30~40 villagers. But 7 opponents will have a lot more than 30~40 villagers; you are cancelling out 40 villagers while another 150 villagers are booming. In a real game (not against AI), those 10 archers aren't even killing units all the time: they are running between bases.
Also you might find it interesting to read the Chinese classic, The Thirty-Six Strategies. Maybe you could start a series where you try to apply some of the strategies to your games. Some FFA community games might be good for some of them. "Fool the Emperor to Cross the Sea", "Besiege Wei to Rescue Zhao", "Clamor in the East, Attack in the West" . . .
LINK www.chinastrategies.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/The-Thirty-Six-Strategies.pdf
This sounds cool and would be neat to see Hera implement this.
I agree that Hera should go out on the offensive.
Micro in this game was out of this world 😵💫
You're a good presenter for a general audience. Keep it up bro.
We get to the point that you need an extra inital boost to keep up against 4 players. Maybe you could start with 3 or 4 extra vills, or just 50 of kind resource per each player... because boost population is good when you reach that late game which is clearly extremely hard to get ther
Been following and watching you for years, your content and presentation has gotten so much better over time. You used to be one of a bunch of AOE2 content creators I used to watch regularly and now you're the number 1. Keep it up!
16:16 WHAT THE FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU is going on 16:48 😭😭
“Things are starting to pile up now”
*monk noises*
Don't limit castles.
You should give yourself some other advantage(s) instead:
-100+ population/player
-Maybe you start with additional resources
-Enable the ability for laming and early Feudal rushing
You should convince one of your brothers to do a stream with you that would be so sick! maybe a 2v4??
The meta to beat you 1x4 flanks go at you in feudal to keep you at home, pockets go quickish castle, castle age units or UU, and forward castle.
Ridiculous hera too good that even 1v4 didn't give you a sure win but a close fight with 3 guy doing fast castle 1 guy just a decoy
A good luck for keeping him closed in are scicilians. Great food eco, uu builds special tower-barracks. All you’ve to do is get a solid 18 farms, 6-8 on gold, 8-10 on stone. Once you’ve taken a couple hills and have 4-5 donjons, go castle. Should have 20-30 sarjeants by this point with upgrades. A couple vils forward while going castle to get some palisades up then siege ws. Force him to build towers or into a different unit line all while harassing his outer eco and refusing his walls. Deny gold as much as possible so he can’t use market. All the while your team is doing there thing, FC or FI
So on the one hand I don't think this is indicative on anything.
On the other hand mother trucking forward castles, yellow understood the assignment.
Get good 😅
My defense should be studied for generations 12:40 😂😂😂
I prefer limiting forward castles instead of castles as a whole because limiting the total number of castles takes away the option for the enemy to go unique units. At least that’s how I feel. Besides if they are heavy on stone then their eco is also affected in a way and as long as it’s not forward you’re not losing your base simply to castle fire.
After the new update has anyone noticed that persians have become very strong. I play with the following settings- fast game speed, infinite resources, arabia, 500 population, all visible map and conquest. No matter how many halberdiers or scorpions you make they overwhelm you all the time. Be it easy standard hard or extreme. And yes, starting age is post imperial age. If anyone has won with these conditions please tell me how you did it. You can choose any civ except persians. Even 30 aztec monks are taking longer time converting 10 of them now.
That is true, happened with me as well
There is no way to beat a horde of persian war elephants. They kill everyone in their path
Have you tried spanish monks? They are faster.
@@ameetadas6540 does not work believe me
Try burmese monks.
04:20 I feel you. I've been playing DotA for more than 10 years and there are times i can't do even the most basic things correctly. I feel it's more of a "gaming fatigue" more than anything because whenever I take a week or two off from playing any video games, I'm back to my best self.
Sometimes you can play the meta perfectly too, but even an upstart who has gotten just some things right can put pressure on you in-game with a unique targeted strategy that can have one questioning whether they are doing everything they can correctly.
Many such cases.
You're not alone, Hera. We all die to forward castles 😉
12:46 "HYPE ME UP IN THE CHAT"
Hype train below, as requested from mr hera himself
HYPE
@@skdword HYPE
I am really impressed that you keep trying until it is inevitable you will lose before calling gg, as a pro you can definitely call gg earlier and not take the game as serious as you can be, I love to watch players trying their best in every game
Again interesting to watch because I once played Schwingzila and YetiMonk, too.
(I met them on the ranked ladder as they are both my ELO.)
Awesome vil save early on, and Red glued to his troops instead of his own vils.
16:10 demonic Micro
love the 4vs4 with mixed elo
Man this micro skills are a gift from the gods.
yellow caused some huge problems with those elephant archers
Popularization of the game and demonstration of gameplay by top players led to an increase in the qualifications of the community as a whole. Just a few years ago, players with an ILO of 1500 played worse than those who today have an ILO of around 1000.
This makes it increasingly difficult for Hera to cope with this. It seems like ILO is the same, but the players are more stronger
Overall level has definitely rose, but theres no way a 1000 today being better than a 1500 ten years ago, let alone few years ago.
Unless you are referring to 1500s on HD, which hv a starting elo of 1600.
@@hongeykong I agree the lower elos of today all watch Hera/Viper/Daut/Survivalist/Spirit and all tune into the cheese strats as well...they learn them by heart and rinse repeat ... I regularly see 1k and below players with little to no TC Idle time through Dark Age. Tell me that's a thing 2-3 years ago?
@@kdaniels9750 1) Theres no way a sub-1k player have close to zero idle (constantly), even 1k5 players TODAY slip up quite often.
2) Im not saying there wasnt improvement from beginners over the years, but them being better than old 1k5s is a far fetched stretch, unless you are talking about 1k5s those who played on MSN zone (shut down almost 20 years ago) or on HD (1k6 starting elo meaning 1k5 is below average at the time) .
A 1k5 from any point of the DE era would still easily beat a 1k today with a score of at least 7:3.
You should start another channel showcasing other games. Definitely check out Terminator Defiance. It’s a tough and unforgiving top-down rogue-like RTS. Very fun. Veterancy, weapon/equipment slots for units and vehicles. Linear campaign with choices, go here, don’t go there, etc. sort of decisions. Min/max is recommended.
"My defense will be studied for generations" -> Hera the great , Julius Hera, Hera Bonaparte.
GOOD GAME
i think huge mistake on enemy side of these is not kiting the archer units with scouts. they just run in and lose tons of hp, while the skirms dont have time to catch up. use the advantage of numbers, micro side to side to let the skirms+scouts aggregate, then get upgrades and go in
I firmly believe that you win with any civ that abuses elephants in these 1v4s
Why didn’t you pressure yellow when he first came with the elephant archers? Your units were useless against his to defend you could have gotten some good damage
I get what you're saying about the green screen it's all about authenticity. Green screens by definition are not authentic.
Are there any rules in place in these too prevent very early pressure from the 4 or no? Would seem that would be very op otherwise
IMO there's not really a good solution to the forward castle problem without messing with the spirit of the game.
Assuming you don't want to simply find less skilled players for the 1v4, the ideal solution is to change from 1v4 to 1v3.
Doing 1v4 with this and that house rule stacked on top is going to slowly drift away from the kind of game we're familiar with. For example, some comments suggested to give yourself some early advantage, but then that would make build orders and stuff all every different. We have to remember the point of the series is to show how the familiar game of AoE we all know can be played to the maximum skill level, and demonstrate how far skill can take you.
If people start figuring out a meta for 1v4 that basically solves the game, that means you've hit the limit, and 4 opponents is beyond what you can manage with your skills alone. Changing the rules of the game is not as elegant as simply dialing back the number of opponents to find the actual limit of your skill.
chaindropping forward castles is unbeatable, the new rule is good
OMG youre a legend... such defense... what a god... you're right, we should all bow to your greatness for generations to come. Statues and buildings with you're feminine name all over it. What an inspiration. The man, the legend at pushing buttons. Tell me god, can you change a tap washer too because that would put you in the same status as Zeus. All hail hera.
4:23 It could be bceause of recent ladder losses at the hands of Vivi and maybe Sebastian.
It looks like at least Vivi may have figured out that if they punish your early Feudal Age greed/boom by catching you off guard with a surprise attack and take out some villagers, they might stand a better shot in late game.
Its pretty funny the LEL’s are developing a meta against you lol
Hahaha fr
6:30 I genuinely appreciate your choice.
Hera watching you play is a beauty. What a beauty.
16:20 And I feel like Hera can do anything.
16:40 Absolutely elated, what ecstatic gameplay. "I will out micro you green". Phenomenal.
18:30 And he gives genuine compliements and props, Hera is mighty.
The moment Hera can feel that a change in military unit is necessary, that a transition to unlock a counter, is a type of intuition I could only see by him.
Unrelated, but id love to watch a speedrun series.
Fun game but in a 1v4 there should at MOST be 1 forward castle allowed per player. I think that makes the games a lot more winnable for Hera...we been stacking the odds against him lately lmao
miss the old curtains.
1 fwd castle per player is still potential 4 castles on the face in 1v4 :)
I have watched almost all your videos in these 2 years, and I see that people is getting waaaaaaay better than 2 years ago. Call me pessimistic but I don't think it is possible for you to win against 4 players even as good as you HERA. People are getting better, and I don't think forward castle is the real issue there. In this game we can clearly see that grey is mostly out of the game, only 10 or so skirms at the end of the game don't count towards any contribution. So basicallly you can't beat 3 players with no boost (50 pop isn't a boost before you reach 200 pop anyway). I suggest that you are still going to challenge 4 decent player, and get that 50 pop per player as usual, but the twist is YOU PICK ONE CIV BONUS FROM ANOTHER CIV PICKED BY YOUR OPPONENT. You picking the bonus is OP because you can basically pick half price for archery line from Korean, then pic archer civs like England, but your opponent picking 1 bonus for you added to your civ is completely fair. By the way, I wanna join these events too!
The only problem is that we all know AOE2 has a lot of useless bonuses, you need to figure out a way to eliminate those options, otherwise, this bonus won't matter anyway.
so much Hera copium at the end. 11
gg, folks
hey hera ive been watching you for a long time. question di you ply any fps games. I'm horrible at AOE but not bad at shooters . you're mouse movements would make you great.
4 custom civs vs your least fav civ
3:40 shawarma riders 11
speaking of green screens, if you really want to isolate your figure as if you had a green screen you can do that with software easy
1v4 insane 😂
34:52
What was that, please? 1111111
git gut hera. Got clapped by yellow 11
10 forward castles is way too backbreaking for sure. I vote for the rule of 1 forward castle OR as many of them as you want at home. Playing spanish or portuguese with only 1 castle would be kinda meh.
I need me some österreich shawarma
U got to deny the castle
Should have stomped red harder
1 vs 1 Hera vs Yellow player
Why wall the bottom of your base instead of just walling to the end of the map?
Schwingzilla must be german
Shawarma riders lmao
I can think of about 40,000 reasons why you're not feeling yourself lately
Maybe stop forward castles before the minute 30?
Grey was slinging Yellow, no?
I work in set design and fabrication . I’ll make you a backdrop :)
hera you can try aoe 2 cosplay!
its no doubt that you are one of the best AOE player right now. still to solo vs 4 and 2/3 of them has like 300 games is just too much. maybe go with arena or regicide? its mathematicly impossible to win in arabia imo, to much angle to attack.
do you have Shawarma in Arkhentina?
+1 for green screen
hey hera, quick question, have you played Stellaris? its similar to AoE2 but totally different 11
Hera please dont make a stupid 1 castle rule, just play against less opponents. 4 is just too much anyway.
Not enough market abuse smh.
why not just use the handicap 🙃
No bimaristan smh
HYPES IN THE CHAT
Archers beat crossbows
Who's #1?
Do 1 v 1 with noobs and see what you can do
Yeah imagine Mike Tyson go to middle school to beat up group teenageers and film it for youtube. This hera guy is pathetic
1v4 is too much, just do 1v3, and it will be interesting.
Stop putting restrictions and conditions only for you to save face by not losing. Perhaps only play three opponents at a time.
First