Benelli B76 Family: Italian Inertial Locking Autopistols
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
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Benelli is not the company we think of today for modern service pistols - and according to the sales record of the B76 family, they weren't in the 1980s either. Designed in the early 1970s and put into production in 1976, the Benelli B76 is very pretty single-stack service pistol, notable for being an inertially locked design. Aside from the Sjogren shotguns of the very early 1900s, Benelli is really the only company to successfully market inertially locked guns - shotguns, specifically. They tried to do the same with the B76 pistols, but the result was basically a commercial flop. The whole family was:
- B76 - 9mm Parabellum, inertially locked, SA/DA trigger
- B76 Sport - same as B76 but with extended 5.5" barrel, adjustable sights, and target grips
- B77 - .32 ACP, simple blowback, SA/DA trigger
- B80 - 7.65mm Parabellum, inertially locked, SA/DA trigger
- B80 Sport - same as B80 but with extended 5.5" barrel, adjustable sights, and target grips
- B82 - 9x18mm Ultra, simple blowback, SA/DA trigger
- MP3S - 9mm Para or .32 S&W Long, 5.5" barrel, extra fine finish, target grips, adjustable sights, and SA-only trigger
The B76 used a single stack 8-round magazine, had a relatively finicky disassembly process, and a not-particularly-ergonomic safety; all features which did not help it compete against the new generation of "wondernine" service pistols hitting the market at about the same time. Less than 10,000 were made by 1990, when the whole series was discontinued. Of those, less than 500 were the very high-end bullseye MP3S model - one of which we are thankful to have on loan from viewer Todd!
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Sufficiently advanced geometry is indistinguishable from magic.
Yeah. Still geometry locked. More like inertia and momentum operated. Trusts on the slide to be lighter than the frame. On the combination of frame and slide get kick on the locking surface from the bolt, the slide will accelerate faster than frame and starts to open. The exact opening speed then determined by the weight (the inertia part). So it is kinda.... Inertia delayed with aid from the recoil spring.
F=m*a, so the speed of sliding moving back depends on F and m. F is how much pressure is on the bolt from the cartridge minus the force taken by the support on the frame, since I don't by the geometry the bolt is directly kicking the slide. Rather the bolt kicks the frame, that kicks the slide. amount of travel time to the critical geometry of bolt being able to open then is pretty much just cumulation of acceleration versus needed travel. Which is dependent on mass of slide since, a=F/m. However F must include a "-k*x" for the additionally resist of recoil spring.
So in the end it is recoil gun, just a weird recoil gun, since the recoil depends on the frame. Where as for long or short recoil, the recoil is independent and the frame is pretty much just the slide rails to keep the recoiling barrel and slide on the right geometry.
Kinda depending on how the geometry goes, I think that frame actually HAS TO recoil, even if minuscule for micrometers. If it is too well supported all the force gets eaten by supports and slide gets no kick at all and ehhhh..... It doesn't cycle. Of course not a problem on hand gun since no shooter can hold the frame secure enough to not have it recoil. However bolted on a good enough to ground and that thing might present weird behavior. though maybe even then the elasticity of the metal frame is enough to allow kick to slide (talking pretty nano and molecular level stuff here).
So mostly the moon magic is "how the heck does this thing cycle at all, since kinda no thing is directly pushing the slide open" and the answer is "you don't hold it well enough to stop it from moving in your hand" which then allows the frame to kick the slide open due to slide being (I presume very) light compared to frame and having light enough recoil spring. Which I think I actually see on the recoil spring. It seems to be double springed. So light first spring to allow for said recoil kick to let the slide just to blow back and then thick buffer spring to keep the light slide from mashing itself to pieces.
geometry is cool
Lovecraft would certainly agree with you, Clarke might smile.
Seems that Ian is wrong on this one. Its just a lever delayed thing. Here you can see that pushing on the breech face through the barrel can unlock the gun. So its most likely the blowback that opens the bolt. And as the bolt lifts up, the lever have to push the slide back. During unlocking slide moves back faster than the bolt, hence lever delayed action.
ruclips.net/video/CdOiQli7e5E/видео.html
Italian space magic
If Ian is geeking out, you know it’s going to be good.
Lol he was gun thrifting, that was his haul of the day.
A loaded chamber indicator that's only visible from the muzzle end? That's useful, but maybe not intended for the shooter.....
Now I want this to be used in some movie where the good guy uses that indicator and the shooters stupidity to his advantage
rediius what do you mean? It’s a perfect designated suicide pistol. And I can confirm from first hand experience. I’m dead.
@@Hybris51129 post apocaliptic movie. The good guy, this pistol, no ammo, only some spent cartridge. Here comes the bad guy, with a baseball bat, intense moment. The good guys point the gun to him, the gun is empty, bu he managed to stick a spent ammo in the chamber, so the little red thinghy sticks out. The camera from the bad guy perspective zooms to that little red tab, you see it, the bad guy too. He then put the bat aside and slowly, hands up, retreat out of the scene. All return to normality, a scavenge day as another.
i think it's actually a darwin indicator
@@clod2692Harry "Now, I know what you're thinking, did I fire 8 shots or only 7, now tell me, are you feeling lucky punk?" Punk "Yes, yes I am, Harry." Harry "What?" Punk "You've run out of ammo!"
Of course Ian finds obscure, rare-ish Italian pistols in pawn shops...
This is top quality FW content!
Italian spaghetti magic with a pinch of retro futuristic vibe and italian style.
Yes! I'm getting some 80s cyberpunk vibes from this gun.
Between the unusual locking system, the strange calibre, and the unusual control choices this feels like a design from the experimental phase in Semi Auto development. Like a lost Paul Mauser project.
I thought the same thing! This has more in common with like a luger than anything from the 80s
I was a salesman for SILE Distributors back in the early 1990s when they were winding down the Benelli pistol sales. At the time we had several hundred B76 pistols in stock all in .30 Luger selling at the dealer price of $ 189. Even at that price we couldn't sell a single gun. We were told that there were 9mm replacement barrels on order but they never came. We also had several of the .32 S&W long versions in stock (I don't remember the model number.) The .32 guns had a dealer price of $289 and even they didn't sell. I finally pleaded with a small gunshop in New Jersey that dealt primarily with Bullseye shooters to take one at that price. A week after receiving the first .32 gun that dealer called and bought the rest we had in stock.
SILE was an importer with all sorts of connections to the Italian gun industry. We imported and sold a huge variety Italian guns but they never did much to market them in the U.S. Their idea of marketing was to have salesmen promoting their products to dealers on the phone. Most sales staff working for distributors are not gun people and SILE was in New York City and I was the only salesman in our office that was also a shooter. Their laid back approach to sales and marketing may have had something to do with the failure of the B76 series of pistols.
I grabbed one in 1990.... still have it. The MP3S is supposed to be a Wadcutter gun (Yes, it will feed flush-seated wadcutters)... regular 100 grain Round Nose .32S&W Long Lead loads are a little hot for the MP3S. The Wadcutters the gun likes tend to be Fiocchi and Norma. If you handload, the now-discontinued Hornady 90 Grain Hollow Base Wadcutter was the best bullet for the gun.
last week: "Here's some german space magic"
Italy: "Hold my beer..."
PsychoLucario you mean “hold my wine...”
*shinebox
The operating system is really well explained, along with expressing regard for the ambitious nature of the design. I was familiar with the design in the while growing up as a shooter in Europe in the 1980s and even at that time the magazine capacity was seen as a limiting factor. Still, its definitely the handgun Inspector Montalbano should carry.
italian firearms are the probably the most elegantly crafted firearms (ones that actually work, that is)
Actually all of them work. It's just like with the cars... f it breaks down, you're probably not doing sth right. They are not idiot proof, unlike the german ones.
They do work. Some designs are incredibly elegant and complicated yet they are designed to be used hard. Check Cosmi shotguns for instance.
@@michelangeloboldri9893 German cars are idiot proof only because no matter how smart or dumb you are some random electronic part will break.
The ones that work... basically everything not made during WW2
@@ShiverMeTimbers93 There are excellent Italian weapons made during the WW2, all those produced by Beretta for sure
That was actually easy to understand.
Advantages are obvious, btw. You can have fixed barrel with locking breach.
@@ThorneyedWT For a gun of that weight and size, the B76 was unusually sturdy too. Benelli was the first company to publicily advertise the gun as being able to shoot safely extremely hot loads. (how many companies still advertise to not use +P ammunitions on their guns?)
Thanks to Ian's demonstration and explanation skills.
Неочікувана зустріч, пане Краб. Приємно бачити знайоме обличчя на каналі з якісним контентом.
@Trebonius Flonius Think of a Newton cradle. The line here is caseback, bolt, lever, slide.
Oh wow, I just picked up a B76 earlier this month and I was thinking how much I wanted to see you do a video on one. It’s such a cool pistol.
Rock on, Mr. McCollum.
One of my favorite things about this gun is I can operate the magazine release without adjusting my grip at all. It’s the only one of my 30-odd semiauto pistols that I can do that with.
Logovanni How much did you get it for?
Dom DeLiso $1000.
What is that plane in your profile pic? I cannot identify it.
@@Ag3nt0fCha0s did my other reply show up? I’m not seeing it
@@Logovanni sorry, no aign of it.
That leather case is so 80's I bet there's some cocaine tracings on It.
I can say 100% for sure there is inside your wallet lol
@@williamkeith8944 That's a hell of a bugout bag....
Looks like something you'd find in the glovebox of a Lamborghini.
Looks more '70s to me, which is like saying European '80s, I suppose.
Yup, looks like a bacammon game/case my mum had when I was little.
The closest thing modern firearm technology is to magic, except kraut space magic....
Don't forget about commie black magic in the an-94
I like the touch of using a "royal ARMOURY" pen to disassemble the gun
Letting a hammer down not gently enough on a single action .357 when I was a kid is how I put a round through my foot. I know I'm lucky to still have one (a foot).
Garrett A I hope it was target ammo. Man that’s brutal.
@@FrumpyPumpkin it wasn't :(. Lead tipped hollow point that fragmented the lead, shoe, and sock into my foot for a three hour session of a surgeon digging it all out wasn't enough. I still have lead in my foot. Im just glad i still have one.
Oof
I didn't blame the gun, as it was just doing what it was supposed to do. I blame the stupid 18 year old handling a firearm without knowing a damn thing about them. I am an avid shooter now, and am probably one of the most cautious, so all in all it worked out to give me quite the respect for these powerful, yet intricately beautiful pieces of technology. And I've never had another negligent discharge.
Holy moly I'm not jealous of this guy www.wowktv.com/amp/news/national/gun-slips-from-waistband-shoots-man-in-genitals/1820873273?__twitter_impression=true
Got my hands on one of these in the 90's. I shot it a lot in competition, it was amazingly accurate and totally reliable.
Excellent explanation for what the mechanism does thanks for making it easy to understand!
I think I just got how it works... after realizing my mistake. We're all used to looking at gun mechanics and thinking "the parts we want to move must be actively pushed to do something". Actually, the reverse is the case here, the entire gun recoils and while the barrel and lock are directly pushed by the recoil forces of the round, the slide stays in place for a moment as there is nothing directly pushing on it - certainly nothing of the same violence as the round going off pushes on the locked barrel assembly. So the piece behind the bolt is not accelerated by recoil as quickly as the barrel assembly is, and therefore collides with the bolt and lifts it - unlocking the gun by staying put through inertia.
What that means obviously is that this gun will not work properly when held too tight, given no or not enough leeway to move under recoil. Which is probably why you don't see many rifles with that design - if the stock is up against something solid, such as shooting from a table, in a vehicle or in a cramped space, or maybe just with the shooter going prone or even just having very good recoil management, such a gun has a good chance to become a manual repeater, because the recoil impulse might be absorbed enough by things other than the gun for the inertia lock to remain locked. I guess that's not as much of a problem with a hunting shotgun, which is rarely if ever shot in any way other than standing up.
I know this comment is 3yrs old but based on another comment I read, the recoil impulse doesnt even have to be that dramatic for the gun to cycle. The comment said that the movement can be as little as the molecules of the metal flexing so extremely small. So by that logic, you could have a sniper rifle or standard assault rifle that could work with this system. I feel like trying to understand it, is a bit complicated and like Ian said, its not much better than any other system so theres no point really besides people like us who find weird stuff like this interesting. However in theory it could lighten up an assault rifle a bit by removing the need for a gas system kinda like g3s where they use the delayed blowback system instead of a gas system. and really all the moving parts of the action would be: bolt, bolt carrier(in this pistol that would be like the slide i think), and the rifle itself so relatively simple in the parts category.
@@scrub_lord no worries about the three year old bit, I guess beyond a certain age, three years ago becomes the new yesterday :). I agree the impulse probably doesn't have to be (and won't be) super severe, but it definitely needs recoil space and inertia, meaning weight, to work. I suppose that's why you don't see if in (semi)automatic rifles, as these recoiling masses will probably result in worse follow-up shots. I suppose you could make it all independent of the gun itself recoilling a lot as I initially thought, but no way to get around some quite heavy parts to provide the inertia..?
@@decnet100 i might but the weight isnt very important because all the energy is from the force of the cartridge going off. If you look at the top comment of this video and look at that really long reply to the comment, someone explains it very in depth and says that the slide would actually need to be very light or at least lighter than the frame. Im only a high school graduate so I have just about zero knowledge of physics but its all very interesting.
@@scrub_lord Hmm, if you're talking about Ari Takalo's comment, I think you might be misunderstanding what he means; I think he's thinking aloud about what would happen if you held the gun frame solidly in place, and I agree with him that "weird things" might happen due to such microscopic reactions to the shock of the cartridge going off, but I don't think it necessarily will operate in a reliable manner. The operating principle runs off a speed difference on components under the recoiling motion (as in, the slide picks up energy from the frame, so it's moving slower than the frame at first, then faster than the frame in a rearwards direction than the frame as the shooter's hand slows it down; while it is slower, this creates the locking forces by pressing the lugnut into the tilting bolt; when it is faster, this acts to unlock by lifting the sliding block); if you remove the mass, the slide will follow the frame more willingly, that velocity difference will decrease, and so will the available unlocking impulse (popping out the tilting bolt, extracting the cartridge and compressing the slide spring far enough to chamber a new one). Also, if you decrease the overall recoiling speeds, then the same thing happens - with a gun like this, the chamber recoil being applied to a solid frame, that definitely means the gun will not cycle if held in a vise or against a wall, and probably also not if applied to a rifle fired from a bipod with a 250lb soldier lying prone behind it - of course, you could come up with some internal recoiling frame assembly, but that opens up the accuracy/repeat performance can of worms; at any rate, something connected to the chamber needs to move by a certain amount for this principle to work. If just microscopic movements of light parts were enough to unlock, then that could result in very short timing; the whole point of the action is to keep the breach locked for a certain amount of time, to lower the pressure from the chamber+fired cartridge before unlocking and extraction. If that time period is too brief, if the gun unlocks within too short a time from just microscopic movements or basically just swings back and forth, then either the slide won't have to power to overcome this friction from the high pressure pushing the cartridge into the chamber wall, or it will be ripping the brass apart. And generally, one would want a certain bit of positive force to open an action - so that minimal wear and tear on your locking mechanism doesn't result in catastrophic malfunctions.
On a sidenote, I believe this could even be acting weird when shot limp-wristed, as in the slide not becoming sufficiently "faster" than the frame in time, before too much of the recoiling energy gets absorbed.
@@decnet100 Ok I think I understand now. like i said i dont know much about physics and inertia and what not but I think I understand the general idea. Ive been drawing up pistol concepts recently just because i have nothing to do and being out of high school has given me a lot of time to learn about all this stuff. but surprisingly I got most of what you are saying so thank you for going into further detail. I have a new question though. Couldnt this system work on a battle rifle like the FAL or G3 because of the larger caliber and higher recoil(since im thinking the bolt carrier would act the same as the slide on the pistol? or maybe even a machine gun that isnt mounted to anything? I guess having that would mean very low accuracy and a lot of muzzle rise because of the recoil being pretty much what cycles the gun. And one more question. Since you seem to understand this more than me, is there a way to simplify this system (eg. make the bolt smaller or have a different type of lever)?
Thanks for doing a video about these interesting pistols. Benelli kept tinkering with the design throughout the production life of the gun, so for a collector with plenty of money, there is a lot to look for. For example, early production guns have a differently shaped, less graceful trigger guard. (The frames of the B-76 series are made out of folded sheet steel, BTW). Also, the magazines of those early guns lack the groove down the spine of the magazine that your has - it is simply flat. The 32 ACPs all have the early type frame. Nobody seems sure why the 32 ACP guns were made at all; they must be one of the biggest 32 ACP service-style pistols ever made.
At some point in the early to mid-1990's, Benelli dumped its remaining inventory of these guns, all in 30 Luger, on the American market. They included a 9mm Luger barrel with each one to help sales. This took a gunsmith to install, so I don't think many people bothered, so you see minty 30 Luger Benellis around more often than you would expect.
At some point, some police agency somewhere in the world bought and used a considerable number of these pistols in 9mm Ultra. There were sold off here in the United States some time after the factory close-out, say the mid to late 1990's. These guns sometimes had plastic grips, and were often fairly well worn.
Benelli also tinkered with the recoil spring design a fair amount, with 2 or 3 different types just for the 9mm/30 Luger models. One version was described as having a stack of "Belleville washers", but I don't recall what those are.
Besides the models you showed (the fixed sight version and the match target version) there was also a version with the adjustable rear sight and a taller front slight mounted on the regular slide. The front sight of that version looks a bit like a shark fin.
I had a match target model in 30 Luger. It was very accurate, although the massive grips were too not comfortable for my hand. Also, it had a problem with the firing chamber - ejection of fired cases would become weaker and weaker until finally it failed to extract altogether, This required the use of a rod and quite a bit of force to clear. A trip to at least one gunsmith failed to fix this.
Although the takedown, which you show very clearly, is like no other gun, I got the hang of it early, and did not think of it as difficult. I think of the Remington Model 51 and the Remington R51, as difficult, for instance, and even the Colt 1903 is more of a nuisance, since there is no way to lock the slide open at the correct point.
I felt the lack of a safe de-cocking mechanism showed a lock of pistol design experience on Benelli's part. As you say, thumb-decocking on a live round is the kind of thing where if enough people do it enough times, you WILL have accidental discharges. Yet many people refuse to recognize this, arguing that THEY have never had an accident. Apparently people like that were in charge at Benelli.
It has to be said that, in the '70s, many decocker-less DA/SA designs appeared. CZ75, the original Beretta 92, Bernardelli P018...
In all those designs, like in the B76, the half-cock position was intended to be the "safe" option for decocking, since you could hold the hammer (or put a finger in front of it), pull the trigger, allow the hammer to move only slightly, and at that point, releasing the trigger, the hammer would have seated safely on half-cock position.
Only later it appeared to be clear that, for a service SA/DA pistol, a decocker was almost mandatory (It's revealing that, while the original CZ75 retained the 1911/style safety, the "clone" Tanfoglio TZ75 of the early '80s already had a Beretta-style slide mounted decocker).
"Found it at a pown shop"
Now I'm curious if it was priced accordingly as an unusual firearm or if you got it at bargain because the pawn shop owner didn't know what it is
me too
The majority of unusual firearms in pawn shops are pretty cheap, actually. The main reason for a firearm to be unusual is that no one really wants to buy it.
Really antique guns or that are prized by collectors are pretty rare among pawn shop "unusual" weapons. Most of those are just generic guns that didn't sell well.
It actually reminds me of the Remington model 51, a lot, with that slide pulling the bolt out of its locking recess. The main difference is that it’s truly inertial : the slide is made to recoil by the firearm itself, whereas in the model 51 the initial push is pure blowback before the inertia of the slide lets it continue its travel. If held firmly in a vise, the B76 would not cycle, whereas the model 51 presumably would.
I worked for Sile Distributors in NYC. Nick DeRobertis, the owner asked me if I would take a look at
the pistol as they were having a consistent feeding problem . It came down to the magazine geometry.
I temporarily glued 8 9mm rounds in a column and placed them on the magazine. It became immediately apparent why a full mag would jam on the feed ramp and a partial mag would feed fine. It was a really well made pistol.
What!?! That's a pen that you used for disassembly.... I was of the impression that was known as "Ian's universal disassembly tool" 😁
@@cameronrichardson1576 Ahhh, I have gained more light upon this subject. 🤔
I miss the "universal disassembly tool". It hasn't appeared in quite a while.
Precision
Engineered
Nubbin for
Careful
Application of
Pressure
I sent you a message requesting this video and then 5 minutes later I found it. I loved my B76, by the way.
Thanks
Frank Freeman
I own the .32 ACP. Its a great gun and fires smooth. I trained my daughter with it.
Thats actually a beautiful pistol.
Also thats the coolest pistol mechanism ive seen so far.
First, yes, they look incredible. I mean look at that MP3S - it still looks like it's from the future 30 years after it was made!
Second, why does everyone always forget about poor old Breda when it comes to inertial guns?
Or about poor old Bernardelli, whose "semiautomatico", prismatic magazine, shotgun had been the first Italian inertia-locked gun.
And Mr. Neophetou's PAW.
Best channel on RUclips right here. Ian blows the other channels away in just pure win.
Don’t think there’s many videos I’ve missed of his. Just win on all his videos.
Well inertia recoil operated action. Locking is traditional. Locks surface on lock surface. Can't physically go through metal. Getting the thing to unlock is physics magic.
However two lock and locking on two different inertia auctioned pieces. Which is kinda key to the inertia operation or at least making it feasible. Also to those saying it is delayed, since actually the point is to be fast. the lever is not there to cause extra work. Actually as one looks it just freely flops down as the slide moves back.
The key is the main pressure and impulse goes to the frame via the frame/receiver via the receiver mounted locking wedge. The bolt opening is locked to the slide, which is recoiling under inertia and thus unlocks the main lock containing the cartridge.
Frame gets kicked by recoil, since the barrel, chamber and bolt are locked to the frame Frame kicks the slide, since the back piece of slide is resting against the locking wedge. Now both frame and slide move backwards. To open the slide must move faster. Otherwise the slide would just ride on the locking wedge and stay closed.
Where in comes the magic aka the rule of inertia and conservation of momentum and momentum's relation to mass aka inertia. Which says p=m*v. Meaning moving speed under inertia is related to mass. Also when two objects are joined p(total)=p1+p2 and reserve aka preservation. Which quickly shows, the whole gun gets a kick. Frame is heavier (must be in this design), which means the slide will move faster thus unlocking. the slide moves back, the flap falls open, the lifter picks up the bolt lift tap. The flap is there mostly to prevent accidental opening of the bolt by blocking it's movement until the slide moves back little. Bolt unlocks and slide and bolt move rear on the slide momentum and the residual pressure in the chamber acting on the now feed bolt.
Frankly I think with little bit of design of the lifter and the roof cut of slide one could eliminate the supposed magic flap entirely, since it isn't really critical part of the system. However not sure it is good idea and I think there is good reason for the lever. The slide roof could be cut so the lifter rests against the slide roof until the slide moves little bit back. then there is deeper cut and in the front the lifter catch surface pulling it up to the new space revealed. However that would need pretty tight tolerances and might cause friction. So instead more smooth operating lever was chosen, since it only contacts the roof, when pushed up by the slide back. Thus until slide moves back, it will stay closed and the roof cut is easier with just single level cut with lift ramp at end. While the lifter with its large surface and catch edge slides completely free thus saving it from wear. Should the lever get worn, one can just replace it. Though it shouldn't since it is only under major contact while closed.
This all in the end is down to tuning the slide to frame mass ratio and the spring, which can't be too stiff to bring the initial speed from inertia to halt before the locks open.
Key advantages would be no need for moving barrel or gas system, so it is simple. Also possibility for extremely fast operation since the frame takes the brunt, so the slide can (and must be) light weight. light slide will open inertially quickly (opposite of heavy slow blow back slide in case of more powerful cartridge)
Bad side: It might be too fast if not tuned correctly. Frame must have certain amount of mass, since it must be heavier than the slide. Second down side is possible reliability on obstruction. Should something press or block against the slide on opening, there isn't active on going force pushing it open. If the inertia is lost, it is lost and the gun just stays closed. Where as say a gas piston or recoiling breach under pressure aka barrel sied gas cylinder will actively force the action open with ongoing force from the pressure.
Tilt lock with inertial actioning.... interesting. Well in theory it would work with any locking as long as the opening isn't too much for the energy contained in the recoiling slide.
Case in point of different inertial action with different lock is the Benelli shotgun inertial action. Funnily it's inertial moving is kinda reverse and even more wonky with a back and worth extra cycle inside the main cycle. We heard you like cycles so we put cycles inside you cycles. Sorry.... Will show myself out.
In it the system is not locked completely forward on wiring. Instead the whole frame and bolt recoil backwards which makes it's slide move forward (relatively speaking, from completely outside reference the slide stays in place because of inertia and other things move backwards around it), this cams a cam pin unlocking a rotating bolt and loading an actioning spring with potential energy. It reaches maximum forward movement and can't mechanically go more forward by resting against the now unlocked bolt. Then the spring kicks both the internal slide and bolt backwards, extracting, ejecting and then the main spring pushes the system closed. The actioning spring keeps the slide back ready to slide again on inertia.
The engineers clearly took the idea of inertia actioning from the shotgun, but streamlined it. No extra backward and forward moving and extra springs. Simple recoil back, unlock the lock of the lock, unlock the main bolt lock, continue to move backwards and pull the bolt back with the inertia and bolt pushing open on residual pressure. Then main spring pushes it all closed and locked again
Edit: also it seems the lever acts as out of battery safety. the lever lifts to it's own locking recess only just as the bolt drops to the main locking surface. Until then it rides on top of the firing pin since the slide roof is cut low enough it can only pass riding low. This pin has the large cylinder plug at the end. This would catch on the low riding lever, which has small cut only to allow passing when fully in it's own locking. Thus the firing pin cant present though the bolt face, until the gun is fully locked. Darn Benelli engineers..... clever bastard.
Ari Takalo Longest post ever award to you my friend! 🥂🏅 I understood most of it. I think...
It looks like it defaults to unlocked, though, and only locks under the initial recoil after firing.
I've copied and pasted this and once I can fully visualize the b76's inertia locking system, I'm gonna try and picture this too. I wish I had the ability to describe mechanisms. I've been working on a gas pistol system where the piston moves a locking block (like that of a beretta 92 or Walter p38) and then continues moving both the slide/bolt thingy and the unlocked locking block rearward.
Edit: my point is, I love hearing innovative ideas for guns.
Man, makes me miss lifesizepotato. Cool gun.
Benelli still makes very nice handguns in .22 and.32. Easy to disassembly and very nice to shoot with. My wife have one in .22.
I remember about 20 years ago when these pistols where being advertised and sold thru Shotgun News . Wish I had bought one .
I actually have one of these pistols! And it is weird.
I actually have 4 of these pistols! And they're wierd.
@@Tr4wnet oh wow your sooo much cooler than he is then.
Cheers.
I actually have none of these pistols. Italians have their own sense of engineering. It works for them.
How does it shoot?
The MP3S is absolutely beautiful
I’d like to see you go through and clean your pawn shop find. Non typical for a forgotten weapons video, but it would be interesting to see what, and how much a collector would do with it.
Never heard of this. I know Benelli from shotguns and motorcycles.
Very good looking and interesting gun!
Can't wait for the shooting.
Beautifully elegant pistols that remind you why the Browning system remains as popular as it does.
Happy I own mine before this video!
That makes me wonder what happened to LifeSizePotato
Yea I forgot about him, he had a great collection
Miss that guy, always wondered what he did for work to afford all those unicorn weapons.
I know he’s watching. Come back! He told me he had a bunch more guns to review.
He probably got sick and tired of all the envious naysayers and trolls.
Maybe he did run out of money... I'm still subscribed to his channel, just in case.
Gorgeous looking pistols!
I had a Benelli B80 in .30 Luger. Very well made pistol. I still regret selling it.......
Just stumbled across this gem. Possibly the neatest pistol I have ever seen. Such a mind boggling design!
Brings back memories. I worked for Sile on Center Market Place, Nick DeRobertis was the owner, and sold quite a few of them.
They were also one of the early importers of the AK. Got one one of those.
Friend had a B76 in the used case. Couldn't sell it, I grabbed it. Love it to dearh
Wow i didn't know Benelli made handguns. Very Cool pistols Ian an thanks for showing them Sir
Hi Ian,
I own 2 Benelli B76 pistols. Bought them in the 90's for $99 each. Other than being a single stacked pistol in the age of the "wondernine", the B76 had other problems. First, it functioned well only with full length ball 9mm and would not reliably feed most hollow points. Secondly, the mags were difficult to load fully, causing sore thumbs by the end of a shooting session. (A nail in the hole of the mag follower could generally solve this.). Lastly, the left grip panel above the mag release was fragile and broke off easily, sometimes only from excessive tightening of the grip screw. Almost every Benelli owner that I have talked to has had most of these experiences. Otherwise, the Benelli was a very accurate, enjoyable gun to shoot. With ammo it liked, it was very reliable. It's main attraction though was it's price, which was cheap even in the 90's
Cool, and good explanation of the mechanism. Pretty sure I understood.
Very interesting design, thank you for explaining the function.
Reminds me (very vaguely) Pedersen pistol design, cool to see things that are different, though unfortunately extinct.
so fascinating on the action part and the trigger guard angle make it even sexier...
My previous shooting club owns the sport model in 9mm Parabellum. Very pleasant to shoot and accurate.
They have a good feel to them. Quality workmanship. The B80 came with an extra barrel in 9mm. So if you didn't like the rare 30 Luger, you could take it to a gunsmith and have the 9mm barrel installed. Unfortunately it was not a drop-in and required some fitting. I don't know if you could switch back once that was done though.
Why bother going back?
I remember seeing pics of the B76 in magazines back in the '80s, but I've never seen one in real life and I had no idea how they operated. Very cool.
I bought one of these in 1982 when I was working as a gunsmith in LA.
Add some lights and those guns could be in some cyberpunk movie.They are seriously some of the coolest guns you have shown here.
Thank you for explaining how it works mechanically. It is the best part of these videos.
WHAT IS UNAPPRECIATED HERE is that this was a pawnshop find! Way to go, Ian!
Today on LifeSizedPotato Ian guest stars and shows his beat to holy Hell Benelli and LifeSizedPotato laughs at his gun because he doesn’t even own a gun with a scratch or that casts less then $5,000. 🤪
I owned one in the 80s and it was a wonderful pointing pistol.
I like the design of that series. Will be looking forward to seeing the accuracy.
Love my M4 Super 90 ....wonder if you ever did a video of that ...my favorite 12ga next to my Kreighoff
0:30 that expression immediately psyche me up for a fantastic engineering mode.
Wow, cool, I forgot I was waiting for these here :) Had the pleasure to shoot one of the sport models some years ago, absolutely lovely IMO, but maybe I'm slightly biased cause I'm a fan of italian guns like Pardini, Tanfoglio & Benelli anyway.
Came for the pistol stayed for Ian’s Supreme pleasure opening the leather case.
“Oh yeah!” -Ian McCollum 2019 colorized.
"It's really a quite nice gun, and it's fantastically weird mechanically."
Sold.
That's some complicated magic there!
Thank you , Ian .
I love the 32 S&W long, your 100% right very accurate caliber.
...hard to imagine importers or dealers operating out of the Five Boroughs of NYC these days...but at one time you had Bannerman, Abercrombie & Fitch. John Jovino, etc all in NYC...but not necessarily at the same period in time...Anthony Imperato & his lat father, Louis operated their company out of Brooklyn...
Same principle as seat belts. But this is about an explosive movement (tightening together) and a small force brought by the lever in a downward direction. Awesome👍👍
So I think I have developed a similar love for these guns. I had a B76 a year ago, but it developed a defect and was thankfully returned. I recently bought a B82, and was surprised to find that it is, as far as I can tell, identical in design. The bolt definitely drops down into the locked position when closed, so unless I am missing something it does not appear to be a direct blowback... might be a point of interest for you...
I have a couple of these B76s... a shooter and a safe queen. They're pretty good! This is the second time I've seen you cover guns I saw at LSP's youtube channel. I don't have time tonight to watch, but I'll watch tomorrow and I'm looking forward to your take.
Just watched, not disappointed. 32WC (SW long) is a great caliber to shoot in centerfire bullseye. It's powerful while not overpowering of the hand in rapid fire.
I agree, it is super cool looking. I’ve been watching your channel a lot because new cool gun designs rarely come around. I’m always trying to imagine up something new and cool. Anyway. Half the appeal of gun, cars, and guitars is the way they look, next is how they feel to use, and last is how well they do the job.
Now that is a cool looking blaster. Added to want list
Those things look so comfortable to use
12:24 *Sjögren Inertia Shotgun,* Produced *1908-1909* by *AB Svenska Vapen- och Ammunitionsfabriken* in Sweden and later by Håndvåbenværkstederne Kjøbenhavn in Denmark
solid pawn shop find! How much did it run yah?
Im not sure, let me call my freind who's an expert on forgotten weapons.
Could've been a steal if they didn't know what they had.
Not much, given how unknown it is.
I'm afraid to find out, because he probably got it for way less than it's worth. I would be very upset to think that I missed getting this Italian Magic Gun for anything less than $1500
Holy crap! That's one of the coolest operating mechanisms I've seen! I want one!
Looks like the sort of gun that would get converted into a Star Wars Blaster.
I had a B76. It was accurate and felt good in the hand. Along with the disassembly / assembly difficulties the magazines were finicky causing FTFs.
Very elegant design both internal and external
My local gander outdoors has two b82 models consecutive serial numbers, and also being the 4th and 5th b82 models made
If I understand this correctly, the user's arm is integral to cycling because at no point does any force act upon the slide independent of the frame.
That is a crazy engineering that went in to making that. Now I kinda want one just for the total oddity of it
I get the concept well enough, but there's something about force vectors I'm not getting:
If the bolt/flapper components are locked during firing, what force is pushing the slide back to unlock the system? Does the firing pin work on the slide engagement block (the bit at the back of the slide), or something else?
When you fire, the slide slowly starts to move back from recoil. The action is only locked from the time of ignition to the time that recoil overcomes the slide's inertia. Until then, it is literally inertia holding the slide in place.
@Lassi Kinnunen i dont think so. The time the bolt is down is the locked time, the flapper just helps
The slide takes longer to start moving backwards than the other components, due to its greater mass.
@Lassi Kinnunen The bolt is locked while it's resting on the locking shoulder in the frame, the flapper just makes sure the bolt stays there while moving around with the gun. As soon as you fire, the slide slowly starts moving backwards and the flapper is disengaged. However, the bolt is still locked until the grove in the slide lifts the bolt up of the locking shoulder.
It's just like @Alistair Shaw said, the bolt is locked while it's resting on the frame.
@@ForgottenWeapons so is the movement of the whole gun from recoil required to unlock the system? If the frame is kept completely stationary (in a sled for accuracy for example) then I can't see any force to be acting on the slide?
Wow Ian great job you really nailed this inertial locked pistol explanation...!!! Great job you broke it down in plain simple terms that made it easy to understand ,and we know its not... thank you good sir
It sounds like this would be more accurately described as inertial locking delay blowback? Because it doesn't look like it's using inertial forces to cycle the gun, just to lock it until chamber pressures have dropped
So in super-simple terms, have I understood these mechanisms correctly?:
- Simple blowback - the bolt pushes against the slide upon firing. The mass of the slide provides the momentary resistance to bolt movement.
- Mechanically delayed (e.g. roller) blowback - as above but the mechanical delay system on the bolt provides the resistance to opening.
- Inertial locked - the slide, after a momentary delay, begins moving due to recoil shock - then grabs, unlocks and drags the bolt open. N.B. OPPOSITE concept to simple blowback.
- Locked breech - This adds a further resistance to the bolt opening by adding a wedge geometry at the breech.
Second question - if this is all correct...then what does the flapper do? Is it simply acting like a spring to keep the bolt pressed down? As I see it, it doesn't actually hammer the slide rearwards. The slide wants to move only because it is loose on the top of the frame, and the whole pistol is flying backwards after firing.
I almost bought one of those pistols a few years back, but my permit was denied because the local police didn’t think that it had enough sporting potential. Keep guarding your 2A, Americans! It sucks to be a gun enthusiast with no rights.
A single stack fixed barrel pistol didn't have sporting potential? Smh
Anything below 210mm in overall length is considered dangerously concealable around here. A real sporting purpose pistol has to be the size of a brick and weigh the same.
@@garchamp9844 Unfortunate, but understandable. Where's "around here"?
+john glass he refers to ''americans'' as if he was from somewhere else, maybe he is european ?
@@eutenhomuitosnomes5485 just reread his comment thanks.
Perfect for use with silencer, just needs slight redesign. Savage style back plug
Huh, interesting about the lack of decocker. Thanks for the vid as always.
Now this is truly a forgotten weapon... As I have clearly forgot all about them.
Nice to know pawn shop finds are also up for examination.
The beat up one looks like Ian got it off the set of one of the Bladerunner movies. I love the grime lol.
YAYYYYY he's finally got my favourite gun!
Love the design of the safety
Super well made great machining
I would argue that this is actually delayed blowback, and not inertia operated. Because the locking cut in the frame is not perpendicular to the breechface, the bolt cams up against that surface immediately and transmits force back into the slide via the lever. The lug on the top of the bolt is only engaged when racking the slide. Overall, it is similar to the Rudd delay mechanism. If it were truly inertially operated, the way we know other Benelli systems to work, the slide would likely have a momentum deficit due to the way handguns tend to recoil.
Theres a video with somebody pushing the bolt with a stick throught the barrel and unlocks it.
@@tiortedrootsky There you go!
"...fantastically weird mechanically...Its the closest thing we have to magic..." Ian, you're priceless 👍
Beautiful looking pistol. Vaguely reminiscent of the Sig 210.........