Transcribed this for a class. Thought I should leave it here for reference. I made some editorial changes. “When I hear what we call music, it seems to be that someone is talking, and talking about his feelings, or talking about his ideas of relationships. But when I hear traffic, the sound of traffic, hear on 6th avenue for instance, I don’t have the feeling that anyone is talking. I have the feeling that sound is acting, and I love the activity of sound. What it does is it gets louder and quieter, and it gets higher and lower, and it gets longer and shorter. It does all of those things. I am completely satisfied with that. I don’t need sound to talk to me.” “We don’t see much difference between time and space. We don’t know where one begins and the other stops. So most of the arts we think of being in time, and most of the arts we think of being in space. Marcel Duchamp, for instance, began thinking of music not as a time-art but as a space-art, and he made a piece called sculpture-musical, which means different sounds coming from different places, producing a sculpture with is sonorous and which remains.” “People expect listening to be more than listening, and so sometimes they speak of inner-listening or the meaning of sound. When I talk about music, it finally comes to mind that I’m talking about sound that doesn’t mean anything, that is not inner, but just outer. These people, who understand that finally say: you mean it’s just sound? Thinking that for something to just be a sound is useless, whereas I love sounds just where they are, and I have no need for them to be anything more than what they are. I don’t want them to be psychologically. I don’t want a sound to pretend it’s a bucket, or that it’s a president, or that it’s in love with another sound. I just want it to be sound. And I’m no so stupid either. There’s a German philosopher, whose well-known, Immanuel Kant, and he said there’s two things that don’t have to mean anything. One is music, and the other is laughter. Don’t have to mean anything, that is, in order to give us very deep pleasure.” “The sound experience, which I prefer to all others, is the experience of silence. This silence, almost everywhere in the world now, is traffic. If you listen to Beethoven or Mozart, you see that they’re always the same. But if you listen to traffic, you see that it’s always different.”
From my understanding of Kant, you can still appreciate vocal/lyrical music, music that has a meaning even if that meaning is talking, Beethoven, or Mozart. Whereas, Cage would seemingly prefer silence or mostly traffic over these things. In Kant's Aesthetic Theory, he pointed out "disinterested pleasure" in determining if something is beautiful rather than its utility that makes something beautiful. Cage preferred sound without an additional meaning like if music sounds like people talking. Whereas, I think Kant was open to limited meanings in music with his suggestion of “disinterested pleasure.” To my mind, I think you can appreciate Beethoven's or Mozart's music for how it sounds too rather than hear it as sounds talking to one another. Admittedly, Cage in this quote is difficult to follow in detail because it seems like oddly, he is drawing a meaning of something from something else and/or comparing different categories. Silence is mostly traffic? It sounds metaphorical. Ummm...Okay? I am unclear, but Beethoven and Mozart and Silence (whatever this means in this context) are not close enough in comparison, so Cage does not give a fair representation of the items he is comparing with.
mic9check We can never hear nothing, we will always at least hear our own heartbeats. Even quiet sounds like our blood flowing through our veins is still sound.
Cage's approach is nice because something is fundamentally childlike about it. A child waking up in the morning loves to hear clatter coming from the kitchen; it's the music of home and has comforting familiarity. There's rhythm all over the place; feet on stairs, trains on tracks. Great authors have sounds and sense perceptions in their work all the time, including James Joyce. There's music in many sounds, including words. I like languages because each language has its own music.
Two years ago my mother died. When I'm at my father's house preparing food in the kitchen or cleaning the house, he sleeps in the chair and says that these sounds make him feel that everything is ok.
@@jackyagerline8922 not scientifically though , because , xhere black is a pure absence of light and colour, 4'33" 's silence is made to proof that even the lowest and quietest sounds still exist, matter, and are interesting to pay attention
I love listening to him talk. It's like he views the world as an entirely different realm than anyone else and he has an incredible ability to link things like philosophy and music together. Fascinating.
i'd say he's just on the autistic spectrum. every autist has this totally unique world view that humans could learn a lot from if they only learned to listen instead of judging.
I feel like John Cage would really appreciate electronic music today because it's all about the sounds. I remember in something I read by him once he said he appreciated electronic instruments that tried to make new sounds rather than ones that tried to replicate already existing instruments.
A little late, but I don't see as just an appreciation to music but you could easily say this man is the grandfather of this subgenera. In fact, the way sounds are played, in synced and out of synced, provide an ASMR like sound, which gives the person focus on each individual voice.
most of electronic music people listen to nowadays is not at all all about sounds. there are grooves, harmonies, melodies in it. it's full of narrative
Cage just seems so content with things just as they are, yet he helped change the world of art and music. His love for sounds and his kindness give me hope that someday, I will meet someone like him. One of the greatest musicians/philosophers of this century.
I think Kant means, so to speak, “signify” or “represent”. Music is essentially a non-representational art form, in contradistinction to traditional painting or literature.
Everything that can be heard and is pleasing to someone can be considered music. John Cage works off of this idea for his music. He takes the noises of the everyday world, and even the moments of silence, and uses them to create musical masterpieces. Genius.
His candid outlook on ambient sound is probably one of the most foundational forms of artistic appreciation; appreciation for the art found (or heard) in everyday life, outside of any composite structure. To have exercised this outlook as part of the body of his musical works just goes to show how inspired he was by the world around him.
The point is that there is beauty in the sounds of the environment and he wants the audience to recognize this. It is a very serious point, but there is really nothing more to it than that.
When I feel stressed, lonely, and empty inside, I feel like listening to nothing but silence.153 people may disagree with me but I consider silence as the song made by nature; and I dig it.
I like your outlook on life and silence. I agree. Love from Noisy california. When I can get out into nature, away from the city, and just sit in quiet.. that is heaven.
Even in silence there are still things you can hear and you never truly stop hearing sounds. It then changes to the high pitch white noise caused by the working nervous system and the low rumble hum of the blood running through your body. This becomes especially evident when you are in a sound-dead or sound absorbed room.
Probably one of the most beautiful ways to describe Silence, truely subtle yet meaningful. Will miss john cage and his friend merce cunningham, and thier laughter !
This reminds me of my friend with perfect pitch. He studied so much music that classical music got boring as he could predict what would happen next. He only really appreciates indie/noise bands. I'm sure if you take his sense of music/sound to a further extreme, you get a John Cage.
I am the furthest thing from profesionally trained or educated, but very obsessed with music, finding new groups, and this is something I experience I alot. I can hear a song being preimiered on the radio for the first time, and after about 15 seconds I can predict the chords that are coming, the beat, even the lyrics. So many musicians just steal and copy now. Not enough creating organically.
@@ZeranZeran I don't know this person, I'll have to take a look. I'm personally interested in music in video games, jazz and some music by lesser-known artists (I'm mostly into video game music to be honest)
I watch this video every time I get frustrated writing, practicing, or performing music. Listening to Cage talk about his love for sound and laugh about it makes me feel better immediately.
I never knew him, but I love this man! If ever there was a truly enlightened master, it's John Cage. And yet he made no grand claims about himself whatsoever. He just shared what he loved. And I understand that to know him was to love him.
@@djentcommunion2422 A person who doesn’t know love doesn’t have a working concept of it. A person who feels discouraged knows what discouragement feels like and likely encouragement too. I think it’s more like telling a depressed patient that to feel better they must help others find purpose when they’ve yet to do that for themselves yet Then again, that doesn’t sound like the _worst_ idea
I'll make a presumptive statement & say that men who truly, deeply love their wives think that they are most attractive without make-up. I believe this is how Cage felt about sound.
I love cats they never miss when they jump they can spend much time in silence and when they love you they can feel your moods and comfort you when you’re depressed.
Once, I was falling asleep in a campground as the last big rig slowly faded away down the highway.. I thought I was listening to the most beautiful fade-out of an epic piece..
the part when kitty came in was the best, that simple meow made me so happy and flushing with so many memories from my childhood and at present. It is priceless, thanks JC you're a genius!
In whole honesty; I was thinking about my "interactive sound environment' project for my degree and I was thinking about all the sounds of traffic that I hear whilst waiting for public transport. The difference weather makes, hearing the transition from no traffic to bird song and back to traffic, etc. I instantly thought of Cage's Silence and this video gives me so many quotes to use in my research, that I am very grateful to jdavidm for posting this beauty, well done sir!!
I was in a concert a few weeks ago, and the orchestra played a work by Cage. It was one chord, played trough one hour, every 4 seconds. You know, it was the most intense music I heard, because I felt asleep, I was bored, I started to think in some things, good things, in conclusion, his music COMMUNICATED me something. Was emotional, a really complete music!
with so many definitions of music, its hard to decide on one. but the one i go by and encourage is "music is something we enjoy listening to, everything else is noise." So it still is ultimately up to the opinion of the listener.
What I love about John Cage is that there is nothing revolutionary about what he is saying here. Through his study of music and art over the years, he eventually found himself at the core of ancient Zen/Taoist philosophy.
John Cage was a brilliant man. I agree with his take on sound just for what it is and not trying to play a part (i.e. to be something other than just what it is.). Some have said John Cage was putting down music but I disagree. Cage was talking about sounds in their purest forms of which music is a subset.
This explains everything! I've been following Cage, even through his tonal/formal notation phase, and I've gotta say.....this gives good insight into the 4'33 concept. I love it! Duchamp is the shit as well :D
When I hear what we call music, it seems to me that someone is talking But when I hear traffic, I dont have the feeling that anyone is talking I don't need someone to talk to me - John Cage This is why I hate music This is why I teach music
I never said they were the same thing and I agree with you completely. However it frustrates me that someone just says that 4'33'' does not make sense. Music is more than just hearing a musical instrument having different key signatures, time signatures, note values and rests, and all other stuff related to it. Sometimes I wonder how the human being came up with the concept of music. There are lots of historical evidence about it true. But I always wonder what the first thought about creating music was. Was it just hearing sound? Was it someone using different materials to formulate a particular sound? At the end of the day, the concept of music started somewhere and I believe sound had a main part. After all music and sound go hand-in-hand.
***** So, in your definition of music harmony is the factory that makes something music, correct? If that is your definition then you're discounting a lot of Eastern music such as the Japanese Biwa. In much Biwa music they use monophony which is music with melody, but no harmony.
David Sherris Harmony can arguably mean two notes (frequencies if you will) in comparison to each other but not necessarily played at the same time. The note (frequency) that was previously played still leaves an imprint on the mind before you hear the next note, which lets you judge if that next note is "pleasant" or what have you. Of course that is also called melody, but when you think of the principles that drive melodies like in Biwa they are really interrelated to harmony. I think that's what Bill CZY would say. Under this (admittedly expanded) definition of harmony even repeating a single note is music because it utilizes the same frequency ratios to get a specific note that is "in harmony" with itself (yes! I strung together a logical sentence with my flimsy definition). Basically, he's trying to say why 4'33 is not music...but I'm sure you could make a lot of plausible explanations why not as well as counter-arguments why yes.
He was sober and did not drink alcohol, or smoke anything. He did chant and meditate however. He took the prescription drugs people who had MD after their names prescribed for him. 4' 33" is music as Zen. Try as we may, we cannot make a silence. Music and laughter bring us joy.
As a physicist, I have long thought of Cage as the musical equivalent of Einstein for his expansion of the conceptual foundations of music theory, so it is nice to hear him make the space-time connections here. Many can't see past 4:33 (the most controversial composition ever?), but his work is a breath of fresh air to anyone who wants to hear music that doesn't insist on being something else. Much of it is quite beautiful, often in ways no other composer has imagined.
SILENCE IS THE MOST POWERFUL ELEMENT OF MUSIC WITHOUT THE DARK, THERE WOULD BE NO LIGHT Yin and Yang is universal, and everywhere. Beautiful video, and beautiful sentiment.
This is such an amazing video. John Cage has been and is an inspiration for my work as a musician. There is so much humor in his books too! I can only recommend his masterpiece "Silence".
I both agree and disagree with him. I love sound for sound's sake, but I also want to listen to art that has intentions - sound which has been arranged and shaped, synthesized or found sounds, played instruments, patterns, expectation, suprise, boredom, creativity. A playground for the soul. Ambient sound is just one tool in a whole infinity of creative possibilities. I love the sound of traffic, waterfalls, I love the soundtrack in the game Limbo, which mostly consists of filtered ambient noises, drones, and natural foley FX, and when I want to compose, I like to wallow in silence for a few hours - go for a walk and listen to the sounds of nature, of people talking in the background. Then I come home and compose and all hell breaks loose. I cannot live on a diet of 100% ambient sound.
Well.. Seven years passed, and still I think that what he and you say can exist together. Music doesn't have to mean anything - but it may. It's like life - even nihilistic people seek some sense and structure in everyday life. It's the way of existing P S sorry for any mistakes. English is foreign language for me
Music, laughter and silence (interesting). Silence has become so difficult to find that it's practically extinct. And, traffic has replaced it as the background soundtrack of our lives subsequent to industrial and high tech living...
thats what i said when my teacher said what happens on repeated listens of a work, and i said you get something new out of it each time!! but what also happens is that you repeat the same experience, it is a good experience so we listen to the music again and again in order to repeat it!
I never in my life enjoyed the actual sound of traffic, only in films and TV... the idea that traffic can be beautiful, akin to silence or white noise... I feel something there, thank you for nearly convincing me, John Cage. I have some listening to do!
Please, when you post something of this sort, write at least the source you took it from if you're not in the mood to write the whole information about it (year, location, context of the interview, etc). I don't know about copyright on youtube, but as you're quoting someone's work, you should make reference to them at least in description. sorry
I agree. There are obviously certain aspects of each culture's music that need to be learned, but joy and sorrow and other emotional states seem quite easy to 'read', whether it's in the music of Mozart, drummers from Burundi or Australian didgeridoo music. It's probably the same for most arts, such as painting, sculpture and theatre; a smile is a smile, a frown is a frown, etc.
To be frank, this is much more entertaining and informative than listening to 4’33’’. I like listening to the background sounds of this video more than 4’33’’, but now because of the video I appreciate where he is coming from.
In other words: a virtuoso can make really good music, but it takes a genius to realize that the best music was always there, in the universe, regardless of us.
Whereas I love sounds, just as they are, and I have no need for them to be anything more than what they are..." Yes! Wonderful - very gentle man. Great innovator, great man of ideas and music "Or to be in love with another sound" ! Music and laughter don't have to 'mean' anything - the cat knows.
Ficar em silêncio quando poderiam estar sendo executadas notas maravilhosas, é música? Isso é arte? Esse cara merece esse respeito todo por ficar em silêncio? Podem viajar a vontade, filosofar, isso nunca entrará no meu conceito de intelectualidade, e muito menos de música, mesmo sabendo que silêncio também é música, mas usada de forma dosada, dentro da execução sonora, não simplesmente não tocar nada.
@Dolphidood I think that one defines one thing in terms of what is not that thing. In this video Cage actually distinguishes "what we call music" from "sounds acting". In the context of the discussion on this vid, Cage is distinguishing his compositions from those that are more "musical". But in other contexts he is defending what he composes as music. When he is doing the former he is narrowing the discussion and drawing distinctions. In the latter, he is expanding and blurring distinctions
I have to say I quite like that piece! I do have an unusual taste in music, probably why I enjoy Ives, as some people might argue... but getting back to the task at hand... I too enjoy music as a way to escape from the grip of life. And I do agree, I only listen to cage to challenge myself and to think radically. I also agree with your definition of music. I just enjoy the conversation of a fellow music appreciator. I mostly listen to Barber, or listen to the Ave Maria by Franz Biebl. Wonderful!
At around 2:30 when Cage describes his lack of need for sounds to have meaning is when he really exposes the fraud that his music is. Music, as all arts, is communicative. Cage simply admits that his "music" is not music. If you look at the history of music, and the biological roots for it in the emotive system - it becomes evident that music is a language of emotional communication. By not distinguishing between "sounds" and "music", Cage is attempting to destroy the concept of music altogether, since it is a redundancy.
I did a little re-edit with "dreams" laid down as the final dimension in this amazing interview. Thank you for directing this interview. I saw his radio play "Alphabet" in Berkeley back in 2001. It was a special moment in my life. RUclips: John Cage (Time and Space) Interview on Silence and Music.
+hymlen v Tinnitus is terrible. Forgive me if you've heard this story, but Cage went into an anechoic chamber at Harvard in 1951. He described two sounds that he heard while in the chamber, one of which was high-pitched, and the researcher told him that was his nervous system. (The other sound was his blood circulating.)
Not directly related to John Cage, but I read an article recently about an anechoic chamber deep underground used to test acoustic qualities of things. Pretty much as you described -- with or without tinnitus. The only sounds you hear are the high-pitched whine of your nervous system against your inner ear, and the sound of your own heartbeat. Most people can only stand it for a little while before getting agitated.
@Stektanudlar Great question. Duchamp's acoustical sculpture idea is sculpture made of sound as opposed sound pretending to be a sculpture or representing a sculpture. The sounds, in Duchamp's idea, are actually behaving in space in such a way that it is shaping itslef in space. Sounds do exist in space, so utilizing this fact about them is to work with something that is natural to their physical reality, as opposed to anything merely psychological. This is consonant with Cage's other views.
+Anonymous It bothered me at first too. I think, though, that his point isn't that those two composers were lacking in vision or that they wrote the same music. I think he's mostly just trying to communicate that they were writing from within the same framework--a framework that he found to be suffocating. Traditional harmony can be strikingly beautiful, but it is also deceptive. Listening (or at least the kind that John Cage seeks out) requires only sound... not dominant-tonic resolutions.
"I love sounds. Just as they are. And I have no need for them to be anything more than what they are." Warmed my heart.
right? i just left pretty much the exact same comment :)
You might want to see a cardiologist about this.
@@jeffryphillipsburns bravo
No, silence is mostly traffic!
Especially with the perfectly timed car horn
Transcribed this for a class. Thought I should leave it here for reference. I made some editorial changes.
“When I hear what we call music, it seems to be that someone is talking, and talking about his feelings, or talking about his ideas of relationships. But when I hear traffic, the sound of traffic, hear on 6th avenue for instance, I don’t have the feeling that anyone is talking. I have the feeling that sound is acting, and I love the activity of sound. What it does is it gets louder and quieter, and it gets higher and lower, and it gets longer and shorter. It does all of those things. I am completely satisfied with that. I don’t need sound to talk to me.”
“We don’t see much difference between time and space. We don’t know where one begins and the other stops. So most of the arts we think of being in time, and most of the arts we think of being in space. Marcel Duchamp, for instance, began thinking of music not as a time-art but as a space-art, and he made a piece called sculpture-musical, which means different sounds coming from different places, producing a sculpture with is sonorous and which remains.”
“People expect listening to be more than listening, and so sometimes they speak of inner-listening or the meaning of sound. When I talk about music, it finally comes to mind that I’m talking about sound that doesn’t mean anything, that is not inner, but just outer. These people, who understand that finally say: you mean it’s just sound? Thinking that for something to just be a sound is useless, whereas I love sounds just where they are, and I have no need for them to be anything more than what they are. I don’t want them to be psychologically. I don’t want a sound to pretend it’s a bucket, or that it’s a president, or that it’s in love with another sound. I just want it to be sound. And I’m no so stupid either. There’s a German philosopher, whose well-known, Immanuel Kant, and he said there’s two things that don’t have to mean anything. One is music, and the other is laughter. Don’t have to mean anything, that is, in order to give us very deep pleasure.”
“The sound experience, which I prefer to all others, is the experience of silence. This silence, almost everywhere in the world now, is traffic. If you listen to Beethoven or Mozart, you see that they’re always the same. But if you listen to traffic, you see that it’s always different.”
Спасибо!
Many thanks--most useful.
Thanks !!!
From my understanding of Kant, you can still appreciate vocal/lyrical music, music that has a meaning even if that meaning is talking, Beethoven, or Mozart. Whereas, Cage would seemingly prefer silence or mostly traffic over these things. In Kant's Aesthetic Theory, he pointed out "disinterested pleasure" in determining if something is beautiful rather than its utility that makes something beautiful. Cage preferred sound without an additional meaning like if music sounds like people talking. Whereas, I think Kant was open to limited meanings in music with his suggestion of “disinterested pleasure.” To my mind, I think you can appreciate Beethoven's or Mozart's music for how it sounds too rather than hear it as sounds talking to one another. Admittedly, Cage in this quote is difficult to follow in detail because it seems like oddly, he is drawing a meaning of something from something else and/or comparing different categories. Silence is mostly traffic? It sounds metaphorical. Ummm...Okay? I am unclear, but Beethoven and Mozart and Silence (whatever this means in this context) are not close enough in comparison, so Cage does not give a fair representation of the items he is comparing with.
Every time there is a gap of silence on the radio or television, John Cage gets paid a royalty 4 dollars and 33 cents.
But remember that there's no such thing as silence.
Lucas Buvinic I don't know if you've been to more isolated areas or have been in a soundproofed room.
Opus 32 You clearly haven't either, because if you have then you would truly understand how silence does not exist. It's exactly what inspired 4'33.
puny74 Complete auditory silence exist, stay on topic.
mic9check We can never hear nothing, we will always at least hear our own heartbeats. Even quiet sounds like our blood flowing through our veins is still sound.
"I love sounds...just as they are"
HONNNNK
perfect
lmao! Moments like that make me question if god is real, I swear.
2:37
I think he heard it too and made the pause intentionally 😂
I doubt that was fortuitous, a matter of happenstance.
In that moment, The Universe quietly cleared its throat.
Cage's approach is nice because something is fundamentally childlike about it. A child waking up in the morning loves to hear clatter coming from the kitchen; it's the music of home and has comforting familiarity. There's rhythm all over the place; feet on stairs, trains on tracks. Great authors have sounds and sense perceptions in their work all the time, including James Joyce. There's music in many sounds, including words. I like languages because each language has its own music.
Two years ago my mother died. When I'm at my father's house preparing food in the kitchen or cleaning the house, he sleeps in the chair and says that these sounds make him feel that everything is ok.
But a child must someday grow up.
@@MrRuplenas must they?
Black is an absence of colour but yet we still define it as a colour, so surely the absence of sound could also be considered a sound no?
Good point, I'd not thought of it that way before.
That's exactly the point he was trying to make with 4'33", no matter what, there is always something to hear. :)
@@jackyagerline8922 not scientifically though , because , xhere black is a pure absence of light and colour, 4'33" 's silence is made to proof that even the lowest and quietest sounds still exist, matter, and are interesting to pay attention
Silence matters
@@jackyagerline8922 and what you hear speaks to you
I love listening to him talk. It's like he views the world as an entirely different realm than anyone else and he has an incredible ability to link things like philosophy and music together. Fascinating.
i'd say he's just on the autistic spectrum. every autist has this totally unique world view that humans could learn a lot from if they only learned to listen instead of judging.
@@f.d.3289 Some autists drive cahs, some drink in bahs-writers especially.
I hit pause but the music keeps playing is this a bug?
Paul Thoresen Since John Cage I accepted that my amplifiers hum and I sometimes just find myself listening to that for quite some time.
(brow raise, followed by appreciative nod and quiet clap)
You win my long-belated like, sir!
Paul Thoresen STOP ✋
this was nice
I long to have Cage's view of the world. He seems so happy and appreciative of everything.
I feel like John Cage would really appreciate electronic music today because it's all about the sounds. I remember in something I read by him once he said he appreciated electronic instruments that tried to make new sounds rather than ones that tried to replicate already existing instruments.
There was plenty of excellent electronic music in Cage's day too. He made some of it.
A little late, but I don't see as just an appreciation to music but you could easily say this man is the grandfather of this subgenera. In fact, the way sounds are played, in synced and out of synced, provide an ASMR like sound, which gives the person focus on each individual voice.
most of electronic music people listen to nowadays is not at all all about sounds. there are grooves, harmonies, melodies in it. it's full of narrative
Amen man. He would love Ambient music like Brian Eno, I think.
@@aysegulozguler7712 he is probably more speaking of artists like Autechre and such. I mean let's keep it in the experimental realm.
this is why people sit and listen to rain.
yeah...
rain .... not traffic !!
rain actually sounds good though
@@Grizzs I've realised that something doesn't have to sound "good" to appreciate it though.
Took me years to realise it though.
I can understand listening to rain, but this idiot...
" "
- John Cage
That's poetic (Unironically)
Unexpress the expressible
I really love the way he laughts 1:01
He's just like a little child, that's what i really like from him.
ironically, 1:01 looks like lol ❤
Cage just seems so content with things just as they are, yet he helped change the world of art and music. His love for sounds and his kindness give me hope that someday, I will meet someone like him. One of the greatest musicians/philosophers of this century.
He's so happy I love it
The music is a language that we don't understand, and the fact of not understanding it is what makes it so attractive.
How can you not understand music?
Hey Julian, you're wrong
@@advaitamaunitva5363
Understanding a message and understanding the language it’s articulated in are two very different things
He seemed sad, when he realized that music is all the same. Look like he found a kind of peace in ambient sounds and I'm glad he could laugh here.
"There are two things that don’t have to mean anything; one is music, the other is laughter" Agree
I think Kant means, so to speak, “signify” or “represent”. Music is essentially a non-representational art form, in contradistinction to traditional painting or literature.
Everything that can be heard and is pleasing to someone can be considered music. John Cage works off of this idea for his music. He takes the noises of the everyday world, and even the moments of silence, and uses them to create musical masterpieces. Genius.
such a kind and genuine and open man who was so appreciative of life. He is such a joy to listen to!
His candid outlook on ambient sound is probably one of the most foundational forms of artistic appreciation; appreciation for the art found (or heard) in everyday life, outside of any composite structure. To have exercised this outlook as part of the body of his musical works just goes to show how inspired he was by the world around him.
The point is that there is beauty in the sounds of the environment and he wants the audience to recognize this. It is a very serious point, but there is really nothing more to it than that.
When I feel stressed, lonely, and empty inside, I feel like listening to nothing but silence.153 people may disagree with me but I consider silence as the song made by nature; and I dig it.
+Edz View Was that number decided by chance operations? 153 is oddly specific.
@@weirdosheep9296 Oddly specific sometimes being uses for humour, though inner reference is possible
I like your outlook on life and silence. I agree.
Love from Noisy california. When I can get out into nature, away from the city, and just sit in quiet.. that is heaven.
@@weirdosheep9296 probably the number of likes or dislikes the video had at the time, but just guessing
Even in silence there are still things you can hear and you never truly stop hearing sounds. It then changes to the high pitch white noise caused by the working nervous system and the low rumble hum of the blood running through your body. This becomes especially evident when you are in a sound-dead or sound absorbed room.
Probably one of the most beautiful ways to describe Silence, truely subtle yet meaningful. Will miss john cage and his friend merce cunningham, and thier laughter !
This reminds me of my friend with perfect pitch. He studied so much music that classical music got boring as he could predict what would happen next. He only really appreciates indie/noise bands. I'm sure if you take his sense of music/sound to a further extreme, you get a John Cage.
I am the furthest thing from profesionally trained or educated, but very obsessed with music, finding new groups, and this is something I experience I alot. I can hear a song being preimiered on the radio for the first time, and after about 15 seconds I can predict the chords that are coming, the beat, even the lyrics. So many musicians just steal and copy now. Not enough creating organically.
@@ZeranZeran the pop music we hear on the radio is crap, music is much more valuable when you're really interested in it :)
@@Sedyon Amen. You're right! I'm so thankful for all the cool indie music scenes I've found. I'm loving George Clanton right now!
@@ZeranZeran I don't know this person, I'll have to take a look. I'm personally interested in music in video games, jazz and some music by lesser-known artists (I'm mostly into video game music to be honest)
I watch this video every time I get frustrated writing, practicing, or performing music. Listening to Cage talk about his love for sound and laugh about it makes me feel better immediately.
why the hell did they zoom in so close on his face??
Im laughing so much at your comment
outside, faces zoom by.
I never knew him, but I love this man! If ever there was a truly enlightened master, it's John Cage. And yet he made no grand claims about himself whatsoever. He just shared what he loved. And I understand that to know him was to love him.
İ loved how he proves what he just said by lauhing for no reason, it made me laugh too :)
***** sure it's psychological, but what i think is meant, is that you shouldn't think too much about it.
He has a beautiful soul and he speaks truth.
mozart was ok bro, but you need to check out traffic
"To me, it looked like a leprechaun to me" lmao
Have you listened his newest album called car crash? It's amazing
Fingamer™ I know! Mozart’s doin pretty well for 300
@KryptoChronicutelite ༼ つ ͡° ͜ʖ ͡° ༽つ "IT COULD BE A CRACKHEAD"
Steve Winwood's band? Yeah, they were pretty good...
2:40 = perfection
Yup!
John Cage The student told the teacher Suzuki:
"I am very discouraged, what can I do?"
The master replied:
"encourage others"
wow
which is not possible to i think like a person who doesn't know love can't love someone
@@djentcommunion2422
A person who doesn’t know love doesn’t have a working concept of it. A person who feels discouraged knows what discouragement feels like and likely encouragement too. I think it’s more like telling a depressed patient that to feel better they must help others find purpose when they’ve yet to do that for themselves yet
Then again, that doesn’t sound like the _worst_ idea
Good interview, great guy, he was very Zen.
I'll make a presumptive statement & say that men who truly, deeply love their wives think that they are most attractive without make-up. I believe this is how Cage felt about sound.
Excellent comparison!
+, (NC, USA) wow this is very clever !
VulgarHNW what makes a woman beautiful?
Music is not tarted-up sound, a painted lady. It’s not sound at all. It’s a play of patterns realized in sound.
The source is the French documentary "Écoute (Listen)" (1992).
Thank you so much for pointing that out, I've been trying to find the full bit for ages.
Talented and innovative artist and an interesting man.
This guy's philosophy on sound and music is intense. I don't know if I could handle it. He's way too impressive. A complete genius. Also, a BAMF.
I love cats they never miss when they jump they can spend much time in silence and when they love you they can feel your moods and comfort you when you’re depressed.
I need to play it many times to extract all of its wisdom.
true
I just said the exact same thing!
Once, I was falling asleep in a campground as the last big rig slowly faded away down the highway.. I thought I was listening to the most beautiful fade-out of an epic piece..
the part when kitty came in was the best, that simple meow made me so happy and flushing with so many memories from my childhood and at present. It is priceless, thanks JC you're a genius!
I never knew what Cage was like. Hearing this makes me appreciate it all more!
"Its hard to believe a year later he made his debut in Mortal Kombat.. "
LOL
In whole honesty; I was thinking about my "interactive sound environment' project for my degree and I was thinking about all the sounds of traffic that I hear whilst waiting for public transport. The difference weather makes, hearing the transition from no traffic to bird song and back to traffic, etc. I instantly thought of Cage's Silence and this video gives me so many quotes to use in my research, that I am very grateful to jdavidm for posting this beauty, well done sir!!
I was in a concert a few weeks ago, and the orchestra played a work by Cage. It was one chord, played trough one hour, every 4 seconds. You know, it was the most intense music I heard, because I felt asleep, I was bored, I started to think in some things, good things, in conclusion, his music COMMUNICATED me something. Was emotional, a really complete music!
damn, sounds intense, I woul'dnt have paid much though.
I love the background 'sound' in this. It emphasizes his mission. Perfect.
This man is so beyond genius, It pisses me off I didn't think of making a song with no notes.
Same bru
Traduzir em Português!!!.
with so many definitions of music, its hard to decide on one. but the one i go by and encourage is "music is something we enjoy listening to, everything else is noise."
So it still is ultimately up to the opinion of the listener.
I have always loved this video.
i return to it repeatedly
An artist respects the silence; it serves as the foundation of creativity.
What I love about John Cage is that there is nothing revolutionary about what he is saying here. Through his study of music and art over the years, he eventually found himself at the core of ancient Zen/Taoist philosophy.
hehehe, that's where every seeker of knowledge and beauty eventually ends up. tao is the way.
This man changed my whole perspective on how I listen to the world. If you can't relate to his idea's then why even comment on them?
John Cage was a brilliant man. I agree with his take on sound just for what it is and not trying to play a part (i.e. to be something other than just what it is.). Some have said John Cage was putting down music but I disagree. Cage was talking about sounds in their purest forms of which music is a subset.
thank you so much for uploading this - it's simply a great eye- (or ear-)opener.
The video should haave lasted until 4:33
With no sound, of course.
Art is something that can be interpreted in multiple ways and has creative drive behind it. Art can be anything, and, in a way, art is in everything.
This explains everything! I've been following Cage, even through his tonal/formal notation phase, and I've gotta say.....this gives good insight into the 4'33 concept. I love it! Duchamp is the shit as well :D
One of the most important composers of recent times without a shadow of a doubt...
.
When I hear what we call music, it seems to me that someone is talking
But when I hear traffic, I dont have the feeling that anyone is talking
I don't need someone to talk to me
- John Cage
This is why I hate music
This is why I teach music
2:37 "Whereas I love sounds... just as they are." *heart melts*
Yes yes just wonderful!!!!!!
I like his way of thinking, and also that everytime he pauses a Horn goes off in the background sounds.
141 people don't understand the meaning of music and sound! This fascinates me in so many ways!
I never said they were the same thing and I agree with you completely. However it frustrates me that someone just says that 4'33'' does not make sense. Music is more than just hearing a musical instrument having different key signatures, time signatures, note values and rests, and all other stuff related to it. Sometimes I wonder how the human being came up with the concept of music. There are lots of historical evidence about it true. But I always wonder what the first thought about creating music was. Was it just hearing sound? Was it someone using different materials to formulate a particular sound? At the end of the day, the concept of music started somewhere and I believe sound had a main part. After all music and sound go hand-in-hand.
***** So, in your definition of music harmony is the factory that makes something music, correct? If that is your definition then you're discounting a lot of Eastern music such as the Japanese Biwa. In much Biwa music they use monophony which is music with melody, but no harmony.
Elise Xuereb So, does music need harmony to be music?
David Sherris Harmony can arguably mean two notes (frequencies if you will) in comparison to each other but not necessarily played at the same time. The note (frequency) that was previously played still leaves an imprint on the mind before you hear the next note, which lets you judge if that next note is "pleasant" or what have you. Of course that is also called melody, but when you think of the principles that drive melodies like in Biwa they are really interrelated to harmony. I think that's what Bill CZY would say. Under this (admittedly expanded) definition of harmony even repeating a single note is music because it utilizes the same frequency ratios to get a specific note that is "in harmony" with itself (yes! I strung together a logical sentence with my flimsy definition). Basically, he's trying to say why 4'33 is not music...but I'm sure you could make a lot of plausible explanations why not as well as counter-arguments why yes.
141 don't 141 the meaning of 141,this 141 in so many ways
"I love sounds, just as they are" - Perfect saying Mr. Cage!
This man was a genius
He was sober and did not drink alcohol, or smoke anything. He did chant and meditate however. He took the prescription drugs people who had MD after their names prescribed for him. 4' 33" is music as Zen. Try as we may, we cannot make a silence. Music and laughter bring us joy.
As a physicist, I have long thought of Cage as the musical equivalent of Einstein for his expansion of the conceptual foundations of music theory, so it is nice to hear him make the space-time connections here. Many can't see past 4:33 (the most controversial composition ever?), but his work is a breath of fresh air to anyone who wants to hear music that doesn't insist on being something else. Much of it is quite beautiful, often in ways no other composer has imagined.
SILENCE IS THE MOST POWERFUL ELEMENT OF MUSIC
WITHOUT THE DARK, THERE WOULD BE NO LIGHT
Yin and Yang is universal, and everywhere. Beautiful video, and beautiful sentiment.
I think he's a genius! The way he composes I just love!!!
This is such an amazing video. John Cage has been and is an inspiration for my work as a musician. There is so much humor in his books too! I can only recommend his masterpiece "Silence".
I both agree and disagree with him. I love sound for sound's sake, but I also want to listen to art that has intentions - sound which has been arranged and shaped, synthesized or found sounds, played instruments, patterns, expectation, suprise, boredom, creativity. A playground for the soul. Ambient sound is just one tool in a whole infinity of creative possibilities. I love the sound of traffic, waterfalls, I love the soundtrack in the game Limbo, which mostly consists of filtered ambient noises, drones, and natural foley FX, and when I want to compose, I like to wallow in silence for a few hours - go for a walk and listen to the sounds of nature, of people talking in the background. Then I come home and compose and all hell breaks loose. I cannot live on a diet of 100% ambient sound.
Being a composer just the way u are, do what you like, and respect others ideology
Well.. Seven years passed, and still
I think that what he and you say can exist together. Music doesn't have to mean anything - but it may.
It's like life - even nihilistic people seek some sense and structure in everyday life. It's the way of existing
P S sorry for any mistakes. English is foreign language for me
He changed how we see and think and his ideas have stood the test of time.
Music, laughter and silence (interesting). Silence has become so difficult to find that it's practically extinct. And, traffic has replaced it as the background soundtrack of our lives subsequent to industrial and high tech living...
thats what i said when my teacher said what happens on repeated listens of a work, and i said you get something new out of it each time!!
but what also happens is that you repeat the same experience, it is a good experience so we listen to the music again and again in order to repeat it!
Get a load a this guy
Yes,ATMA..thanks to write here Cage's words.
Thank you very much,nice soul.
"There are two things that don't have to mean anything: 1. Music and 2. Laughter." Beautiful quote.
well here we have a person with a closed mind that has been able to develop that to a very high caliber. salutations to you my friend.
Uma das maiores cabeças do século, pude ouvi-lo em S Paulo, na Bienal de Artes!
Queria poder ter tido essa oportunidade
It is so amazing to have this information first hand - from the man himself!
Skip to 4:33 for the best part
i see what you did there :D
I never in my life enjoyed the actual sound of traffic, only in films and TV... the idea that traffic can be beautiful, akin to silence or white noise... I feel something there, thank you for nearly convincing me, John Cage. I have some listening to do!
Please, when you post something of this sort, write at least the source you took it from if you're not in the mood to write the whole information about it (year, location, context of the interview, etc). I don't know about copyright on youtube, but as you're quoting someone's work, you should make reference to them at least in description.
sorry
I agree. There are obviously certain aspects of each culture's music that need to be learned, but joy and sorrow and other emotional states seem quite easy to 'read', whether it's in the music of Mozart, drummers from Burundi or Australian didgeridoo music. It's probably the same for most arts, such as painting, sculpture and theatre; a smile is a smile, a frown is a frown, etc.
every word that came out of his mouth was poetry
To be frank, this is much more entertaining and informative than listening to 4’33’’. I like listening to the background sounds of this video more than 4’33’’, but now because of the video I appreciate where he is coming from.
In other words: a virtuoso can make really good music, but it takes a genius to realize that the best music was always there, in the universe, regardless of us.
does anyone have info on where this interview was. who conducted it. just the kind of thing you would need for citations
Joseph Pratt I believe it's a clip from a documentary called Écoute (1992) directed by Miroslav Sebestik. That's all I could find.
Whereas I love sounds, just as they are, and I have no need for them to be anything more than what they are..." Yes!
Wonderful - very gentle man. Great innovator, great man of ideas and music
"Or to be in love with another sound" !
Music and laughter don't have to 'mean' anything - the cat knows.
Ficar em silêncio quando poderiam estar sendo executadas notas maravilhosas, é música? Isso é arte? Esse cara merece esse respeito todo por ficar em silêncio? Podem viajar a vontade, filosofar, isso nunca entrará no meu conceito de intelectualidade, e muito menos de música, mesmo sabendo que silêncio também é música, mas usada de forma dosada, dentro da execução sonora, não simplesmente não tocar nada.
Vai muito além disso
Beautifully said.
Ah... você é só um burro, cara
The importance of sounds being sounds as in Buddhism hearing things just as they are is deep understanding.Thats all.
@Dolphidood I think that one defines one thing in terms of what is not that thing. In this video Cage actually distinguishes "what we call music" from "sounds acting". In the context of the discussion on this vid, Cage is distinguishing his compositions from those that are more "musical". But in other contexts he is defending what he composes as music. When he is doing the former he is narrowing the discussion and drawing distinctions. In the latter, he is expanding and blurring distinctions
why is 3:01 so funny to me😂😂 everytime i get to this part i laugh like a donkey on crack
There's a common thing between us, I guess since I too laugh.
I have to say I quite like that piece! I do have an unusual taste in music, probably why I enjoy Ives, as some people might argue... but getting back to the task at hand... I too enjoy music as a way to escape from the grip of life. And I do agree, I only listen to cage to challenge myself and to think radically. I also agree with your definition of music. I just enjoy the conversation of a fellow music appreciator. I mostly listen to Barber, or listen to the Ave Maria by Franz Biebl. Wonderful!
At around 2:30 when Cage describes his lack of need for sounds to have meaning is when he really exposes the fraud that his music is.
Music, as all arts, is communicative. Cage simply admits that his "music" is not music. If you look at the history of music, and the biological roots for it in the emotive system - it becomes evident that music is a language of emotional communication. By not distinguishing between "sounds" and "music", Cage is attempting to destroy the concept of music altogether, since it is a redundancy.
Andrew Zey you have a point, but I think that is exactly what he is trying to do. but nicely described!
I did a little re-edit with "dreams" laid down as the final dimension in this amazing interview. Thank you for directing this interview.
I saw his radio play "Alphabet" in Berkeley back in 2001. It was a special moment in my life. RUclips: John Cage (Time and Space) Interview on Silence and Music.
this guy would hate to have tinnitus
+hymlen v Tinnitus is terrible. Forgive me if you've heard this story, but Cage went into an anechoic chamber at Harvard in 1951. He described two sounds that he heard while in the chamber, one of which was high-pitched, and the researcher told him that was his nervous system. (The other sound was his blood circulating.)
hymlen v tinnitus is also just a sound. You don't have to like it but you can learn to live with it (I have tinnitus btw)
That would bug the hell out of me to hear my own circulation. I would go crazy standing in one of those rooms
Not directly related to John Cage, but I read an article recently about an anechoic chamber deep underground used to test acoustic qualities of things. Pretty much as you described -- with or without tinnitus. The only sounds you hear are the high-pitched whine of your nervous system against your inner ear, and the sound of your own heartbeat. Most people can only stand it for a little while before getting agitated.
@Stektanudlar Great question. Duchamp's acoustical sculpture idea is sculpture made of sound as opposed sound pretending to be a sculpture or representing a sculpture. The sounds, in Duchamp's idea, are actually behaving in space in such a way that it is shaping itslef in space. Sounds do exist in space, so utilizing this fact about them is to work with something that is natural to their physical reality, as opposed to anything merely psychological. This is consonant with Cage's other views.
Mr. Cage made a lot of sense until he opined that Mozart and Beethoven's music all sounded the same. I strongly disagree.
+Anonymous It bothered me at first too. I think, though, that his point isn't that those two composers were lacking in vision or that they wrote the same music. I think he's mostly just trying to communicate that they were writing from within the same framework--a framework that he found to be suffocating. Traditional harmony can be strikingly beautiful, but it is also deceptive. Listening (or at least the kind that John Cage seeks out) requires only sound... not dominant-tonic resolutions.
This is my favourite video on the internet.
one is music and the other is...? love affair?
laughter.
thanks :)
This man is brilliant. His mind is so different from the rest.