The Battle of the Atlantic: U-boats and how to sink them
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- Опубликовано: 14 окт 2024
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The Battle of the Atlantic: U-boats and condor combers stalk the convoys supplying Britain, while code-breakers and radio listeners track them down.
Support me on Patreon: / lindybeige
One of my longer rambles, this one.
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Picture credits:
Medal picture:
By Sergeant Tom Robinson RLC - Ministry of Defence www.defenceimag..., select "downloadable images" and enter 45155226 in the search box), OGL, commons.wikime...
Donitz picture:
By Bundesarchiv, Bild 146-1976-127-06A / CC-BY-SA 3.0, CC BY-SA 3.0 de, commons.wikime...
B24 Liberator picture:
By F/O G. Woodbine, Royal Air Force official photographer [Public domain], via Wikimedia Commons
Bombe machine:
By Antoine Taveneaux [CC BY-SA 3.0 (creativecommon...)], from Wikimedia Commons
Interior of bombe machine:
By Magnus Manske (Created by Magnus Manske.) [GFDL (www.gnu.org/cop..., CC-BY-SA-3.0 (creativecommons...) or CC BY-SA
2.5 (creativecommon...)], via Wikimedia Commons
ASDIC:
By ÄDA - DÄP [CC BY-SA 3.0 (creativecommon...)], from Wikimedia Commons
Condor FW 200:
By Anders Beer Wilse (1865-1949) - Galleri Nor Tilvekstnummer: NF.WF 10590* B Internnr: NBR9204:27482, Public Domain, commons.wikime...
Admiral King:
By United States Navy - www.history.nav..., Public Domain, commons.wikime...
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Lindybeige: a channel of archaeology, ancient and medieval warfare, rants, swing dance, travelogues, evolution, and whatever else occurs to me to make.
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I honestly believe he started this channel to talk about wildlife photography but somehow got sidetracked talking about military history and never stopped.
Making this entire channel one huge tangent.
I’d believe it.
It's a beautiful creation this channel
He's eventually going to get back to which aperture setting he likes to use for shooting tree frogs 😂
“So the capabilities of the archer fish are a bit unwise to underestimate…and speaking of archers -“
Let the channel be born.
"The whitestriped comorant spots a meal..." Yeah I can imagine him...
I wish I had known that statistic on the survival rates of merchant seamen 18 years ago. My grandfather was in the Merchant Navy during WWII, back in 2000 or so he sank into a depression so bad that he had to be hospitalised because he lost so much weight due to not caring enough about life to even bother to eat, and part of that depression was caused by the shame he felt that his friends had gone to war to fight and he had "just been in the merchant navy" as if he felt he had been taking the easy route and letting people down. Perhaps if had known that statistic it would have helped him.
I personally always thought that the bravest man upon the battlefield is the man who willingly enters unarmed.
The Merchant Navy were one the most under appreciated yet vital aspect/contributions of the war effort 👍
"The stars of the show aren't the actors, but the stagehands that make the actors' jobs possible." -My high school drama professor
She understood the importance of a solid foundation.
Haha semen
Smartassdroid That may be true, but that's like saying a knife merchant is a threat to a helicopter. Ultimately, they were unarmed in the context because they had no means of fighting back. Maybe they were indeed a valid target, but in context they were functionally unarmed.
My grandfather died in Auschwitz... He fell of a guard tower!
"5 Idiots squabbling in a shed" basically describes a afternoon with me & my friends
Marijuana?
@@ecwashere8735 all in the shed
Friends?
Lindy, Stop shortening your videos. We love hearing you ramble on. I'd love to watch a 2 hour video of Lindy's ramblings about U-Boats.
That makes two of us.
Shush! Don't give Lindy any ideas!
I'm all for it. The pause button conveniently chops it into any length I desire.
Agreed. The longer the better. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
I agree whole heartedly.
A 54 minute video? You're too good to us Lindy
And my phone battery is only at 9% 0_0 What do I do?
Go back home, grab a coffee and watch it. It is worth the sacrifice :)
i took a day off to watch this
Or tea, of course
+Solinimo
Watch at half speed so it doesn't take as much energy
My dad was a merchant seaman, down in the bowels of the boat in the engine room. Like them all, I and we took their unspoken bravery for granted. I recall him catching sight of a burial at sea and tears formed in his eyes. 60 years ago you didn’t tell your son you loved him, but his actions said more than mere words. Beside my seat here my lounge is may parents’ wedding picture, 1943 uniformed and off back to the Atlantic in a few days time. He was lucky he made it and I came along in 47.
Thanks to him his mates and colleagues we are free, thanks to you all
i could honestly listen to Lindy ramble on for hours about pretty much anything.
Next up: Lindys 3x10 hours videos about "Oatmeal and it's use in modern computers"
Now he has an hour long video about siege ladders
"my lord the authenti-boots!"
What about listening to him "prattle on?" Still, I agree.
Even scholars cradles?
"How did they know we were here!?" Shortly before dying. 10/10
"Sir, we have this new, super effective device to detect U-boats!"
"Bloody hell, Rodgers, this will really give Fritz a pain in the arse!"
"Yes sir, that's why we named it ASDIC."
🤣🤣🤣
ASDIC = Allied Submarine Detection Investigation Committee according to the RN ... Anti-Submarine Division -ics according to others ...
Allied Submarine Detection Investigation Committee never existed it was made up by the British admiralty, there are no records of it ever existing
@@benjamintoms5967 It would've been quite unnecessary to detect Allied submarines anyway, they all reported themselves.
@@benjamintoms5967 well they certainly had a committee looking into submarine detection and localisation (where it was was important), and they certainly came up with this device. The historic weakness of the acronym is well documented, but that is how the RN branded the device when they brought it into service. Why? - who knows, not us.
A nearly hour-long video about a subject upon which I am keen to learn more? Goodness, what a lovely day!
this guy cracks me up with the digressions. they're kind of the best part at times hahah
MrMrHiggins he’s such an entertaining speaker because it is so relaxed and informal.
True, that is what I enjoy a lot.
Good stuff...innit?
He reminds me of myself. I however have learned to keep the digressions in my mind, bosses tend to frown on them when it takes you 20 minutes to say "it broke".
How to win a sea battle: Having a detector detector detector detector.
also known as the Yo Dawg machine
Hah, I knew you knew I knew you knew I knew you knew I knew you knew I would do that!
Reminds me of a comic strip where a series of such counters resulted in the Quantum Vector Collector Inspector Detector Deflector Reflector Projector Connector Ejector.
This comment reminded me of a Rhett and Link song...
@Tech10K Obviously, that detector needs to ride on the back of a great sea turtle.
And just keep on doing your digressions, they are just as interesting as the subject itself. There is no need to shorten the videos, we will watch them anyway!
Fun fact: U-864 was torpedoed and sunk with the loss of all hands by the British submarine HMS Venturer in 1945. It is the only time in history a submarine has sunk another submarine on purpose while both were under water.
Yes - A lot of kills by the u boats were done by their deck gun
How the British skipper managed to pull this off is a remarkable story. If you are not familiar with the story, look it up, it is fascinating.
lol, "on purpose".
I guess the Atlantic isn't as large as you would think
Well ships take established route toward ports to avoid running aground, Subs have to take those routes too. More than that Subs are extremely sneaky, you get into that channel to cross the SOSUS net and you've no way to know if someone else is coming the other way, as a British and French Nuclear sub discovered in 2009.
Another fun fact: In 1942 HMS Seraph torpedoed a whale, mistaking it for a U-Boat.
My great-grandfather was a Merchant Seaman, and lost his life. I'm immensely proud of him.
ive read Merchant as Minecraft and screamed in laughter
@@fvo911
Went travelling in the ocean biome, wrecked my boat and didn't bring any wood with me. RIP
huge nerd and so you should be. They did great work.
UnwarrantedEgo
As a war baby, I am immensely proud of him too! Three cheers for your great "great grandad!"
ie a great grand who was just great!
He did amazing work under incredibly difficult conditions. Wish I could have met him and bought him a beer to say thank you. You should be proud mate 😃
Coming from a family of merchant seamen I remember my aunt telling me how her and my father were walking down the street with my grandparents eating a piece of fruit between the two of them. A rare treat that had probably come from some merchant ships cargo. Two women passing by decided to remark loudly, ‘My husband is off fighting for the likes of that!’ followed by some other similar reply from the other woman.
No thought that just because you’re not wearing a uniform at the time doesn’t mean you aren’t doing your bit. As you say being a merchant seaman was often more dangerous than being in a lot of military roles.
Semen hehe
Unfortunately there are women like that in every era, people who live off the glory of their husband's contribution to the war.
My Great Grandfather (Hugh Gardiner) served in the British Army in WW1 and fought at the Somme. When WW2 broke out he signed up to the Royal Merchant Navy and was sunk twice in the Atlantic. He then went on to the Artic Convoys sailing to Russia. He passed away when I was really young, about 3 or 4 I think, but I do have memories of him. When I got older and learned of the life he had lived I felt extremely proud just to have met such a man.
When I was in the 5th grade, my class went on a field trip to the Chicago Museum of Science and Industry. We walked through the U-505 less than thirty years after it was captured. It was incredibly cramped inside, even for a 5th grade class. Since that trip, I've always had an appreciation for the bravery of submariners.
We did that in fifth grade too, but in 1984
You guys are so privileged to have had the honour to walk in a WW2 submarine as a school trip
@@SanderDoesThingsthere's a floating American WWII sub (USS Croaker) in Buffalo's Navy And Military Park. The USS The Sullivans (named after the 5 brothers who died on the USS Juneau on the same day), as well as the Cleveland-class cruiser USS Little Rock are also in immaculate condition considering they're over 80 years old. I've been on a few field trips there, it's awesome. I'm only 26, history isn't lost yet for young people!
The entire U-505 exhibit was refurbished several years ago, and it's an amazing presentation. It's worth the price of admission by itself, and the rest of the museum is great too.
I find that watching your channel is like that feeling you get when you return home after a holiday abroad; you feel somehow comfortable and happy :) Thank you for continuing to make excellent, informative, funny and most importantly - jump cut free videos!
Another amazing Lindybeige video. The one thing I thought ought to have been mentioned was the extraordinary effort and bravery of the Royal Canadian Navy and Merchant Sailors. Canada had U-Boats all the way into the St. Lawrence River. By the end of WWII the Royal Canadian Navy had one of the world's largest surface fleets. I just thought that men who served from Canada were worth a mention. Thank you Lindybeige for making your awesome, educational and entertaining videos. Cheers
Canada was to good to us
Don't forget the lumberjacks. They're ok too.
We British know who our friends are. x
It's common for Canada and it's contributions to be completely forgotten. Still goes on to this very day. He mentioned every commonwealth country BUT Canada in his opening comments. Nothing new or unusual in that.
51:04, "the second happy time made the first happy time look really mildly jovial." LOL. This guy is the best.
I love it when Lloyd digresses so far he forgets where he was :D
It's the age, I fear.
It's not the years. It's the mileage.
Hahaha thats funny
Nah man, it’s the spliffs he secretly smokes.
The reason they lost confidence in Metox is not Enigma, its 10cm wave radar. They were getting attacked at night without Metox warning. Metox didn't detect centimeter wave signals.
I see so the British had detected that the Germans were using a detector detector and so had designed a detector that wouldn’t be detected by the German’s detector detector
Cool
@@NacnudPinky detector detector detector detector detector
the germans must have accused the brits of hacking during the whole war
The Brits were. That was Bletchley Park's purpose.
That scene in the movie "Untergang" (Downfall) where Hitler is ranting, translates to him complaining about the hax.
The predecessor of Russian election interference.
"H1713r let's report W1ns70n_Church111 for hacking!"
- H3rm4nn_G03r1n95 after battle report
The Germans and Soviets never knew that UK had cracked their Enigma code. The Soviets switched to Enigma machines after WW2 which UK was happy to decode using the same Bletchley Park equipment.
I enjoyed that, very informative and what's even more impressive is it was an hour long with no jump-cuts 10/10
We absolutely LOVE these long stories my friend, you're a natural at it! Thank you so much for this, much love from Detroit Michigan!
HELL YEAH LINDY! Avro lancaster! My grandfather was a rear gunner on a lancaster and im quite proud of his roll( and impressive accuracy of fire) during the war and for protecting his crew I’ve been told that the lancaster was really a magnificent aircraft and Im happy to hear you agree
Coastal Command operated the Lancaster after the war.
they flew amazing for a large 4 engine bombers. very light flight controls by all accounts, very responsive
Explosions under water produce much more devastating shockwaves because water is not compressible, differently from air, so the energy of the explosive is dampened over a much larger radius. If a grenade explodes in the sea almost all the fish in a large spheroid of water have their fishbones and bladder cracked by the shockwave and float to the surface. A depth charge will crack a submarine with the energy of its explosion before the gas bubble starts to move to the surface. ;)
The allieds must have killed huge numbers of fish!
Sort of, I guess. ruclips.net/video/UdFNuc5XtII/видео.html
Yeah I vaguely remembered that video and another one regarding the opportunity (or lack thereof) of diving underwater to avoid infantry fire (both bullets and grenade fire). Turns out diving is good for slowing down bullets - relatively - but it's actually worse for grenade survival. ;)
I noticed this post after I submitted essentially the same comment. Physics is real.
Mythbusters testing shooting bullets into water.Basically all modern, supersonic, bullets shatter on impacting the water. They, however, did not measure the shock. ruclips.net/video/v1uaLWAZXfk/видео.html
Do I like the channel? ---- Yes
Do I like the subject? ---- Yes
Do I like long videos on subjects that interest me? ---- Yes
Is this a good video? ---- Yes
Yes, yes, yes, yes......
Then, it must be a good day!
Well done Lindy. Keep getting side-tracked - it opens our minds to questions we might not otherwise have thought about.
I want to hear about the battle of the beige. Lindy's heroes
the battle of lindybeige's bulge
G I G G I T Y ( ͡ ° ͜ ʖ ͡ ° )
"They always had the Italians to blame, which was extremely handy for the British." -Lindybeige 2018
Ah Lindy, that was epic and thank you for the post on a very interesting subject. As a former member of a rather large SIGINT organization allow me to remark on two statements of yours. First, the shortwave radio antenna's on german type VIIC u-boats. The Longwire antennas were located topside and permanently in place, there would have been no need for the crew to deploy the antennas each time the boat needed to communicate. The boat did need to surface to transmit or receive radio communications.
Second; Bletchley Park, indeed a large organization and highly effective. What Turing and his group actually did was not "break the german code" as many believe, but break the daily Key Settings for the german Enigma machine. The eignma produced not a Code, but an involved Substitution Cypher. In many cases Turing and his crew were able to actually predict key settings several days in advance. This was their great achievement, and it was huge. Once you knew the key settings for any given day you then were able to read all the german message traffic for that day on those german radio networks utilizing the key settings you knew.
Lindy, If you haven't already, I would recommend reading "IRON COFFINS" by Herbert A. Werner who was a U-BOAT commander of U-415 & U -953. He mentions that in the early part of the war they (the Germans submariners) were being frustrated by the number of torpedo's they fired on British shipping that didn't actually explode on contact but just bounced of the ships hull. It was due to their use of Magnetic torpedoes that had been developed and stockpiled between the wars but not actually tested. Turns out these particular torpedoes were only effective if it struck the ship head on. To prove his point that the torpedoes were faulty, he took his U-BOAT into an Norwegian Fjord and fired torpedo's directly at the Fjord wall. Just shows how lucky we were , if they had worked properly from the start it could have been a different outcome to the war.
"if they had" but they did not.
@@ohgosh5892…. The US Navy mk14 submarine torpedoes had that wrong and more. To which the people in charge refused to admit and fix
Metox sounds like something you take when diarrhea strikes.
Sounds like a Greek liquor (Metaxa).
it looks like #metoo movement.. which is also the equivalent of diarrhea 🤣🤣
I've got a bottle right here.
diarrhoea usually struck the Boat crew, as seen in the staining on the surface!
@@ildart8738 its a liquor? I only know metaxa gyros, which is gyros in some sauce, baked with cheese on top. So they put liquor in that sauce? or just a coincidental name?
I have a great-grandfather and a grandfather who each sank a U-boat. My Great-grandfather was a merchant seaman in WWI who was at the helm in the middle of the night when he saw a U-boat, turned and rammed it. He got a bit of its handrail in a case as his reward. My Grandfather spotted an Italian U-Boat in the Mediterranean, dropped his depth charges and sank it. He landed to rescue the crew and broke the back of his Catalina. He was reprimanded for this, but was also awarded the first of his DFCs.
Italian spaghetti code>Enigma code
Andrés Caraballo I just imagine Mussolini writing words out of spaghetti
For a full minute I assumed this was a joke about Alphabetti Spaghetti.
@@sparetime2475 even in watery sauce it's tangled... Good luck on decoding!
Oh no... German code came as a giant, endless pretzel with many loops and knots. No pasta, bread.
Do you know why there are no famous Italian paratroopers from WWII?
Because it’s really hard to jump from your basement window
Thank you Lloyd, this knowledge will be priceless in my quest of taking down U-boats. You have my endless gratitude.
The new sonar sounds like birds, it's going through multiple frequencies. The scary part is when you can feel it while you put your hand on the hull. It's more scary when you can feel it in your internal organs without your hand on the hull.
Detecting Metox - that would be a detector detector detector.
What if the detector detector was defective and detected the detector's detector's detector?
But then what if they made a detector detector detector detector
Then a detector detector detector detector detector has to be made
The Germans should have invented a detector-detector-detector detector in return.
Can't help but think of car anti-radars. It's a thing people used to get, which would tell you when a speed camera or cop's radar gun is aimed at you, so they'd slow down to avoid getting into trouble. It was a detector detector. So when the police made those illegal, they had to make a an anti-radar detector to catch people with those. A detector detector detector.
debatable, because a detector detector detector is still a detector detector. it's just that the thing the detector is detecting is, well, detections. a detector detector detector detector (a detector which detects detector detector detectors) therefore would still be a detector detector, and all the detectors thereof would as well. look what you've done, the word detector looks funny and nonsensical now.
let's just call them detectors
What most people don't realise is that there were three great submarine campaigns against merchant shipping during WWII. The ones the Allies undertook worked.
The Royal Navy in the Mediterranean Sea and the United States Navy in the Pacific both swept the seas clear of enemy merchant shipping.
But the only one that gets real glory is the USN campaign, because they faced comparatively feeble ASW opposition. The RN sub campaign in the Med was sheer bloody murder for both sides. The Allied ASW effort may have been the best, but the ruddy Italians didn't do a bad job themselves.
@@KrillLiberator To be fair, the USN campaign does deserve some of the glory, since they weren't just fighting a comparatively poor opposition, but also fighting a war with demonstrably shoddy equipment. By this I don't mean the submarines themselves - the real problem in this respect was the torpedoes the carried. These were horrendously flawed, with inaccurate depth-running gear and extremely unreliable fusing mechanisms.
It didn't matter how good the subs were or how skilled their crews were: Most of the torpedoes fired never had any hope beyond random chance of hitting their targets, and even when a torpedo did hit, the chances of it detonating were not good. The USN had to contend with these inadequate weapons until well into 1943, because those in charge were in almost total denial about the problems, and therefore unwilling to put any effort into solving them.
@@KrillLiberator even so, the glory given to the USN campaign is very little for the simple reason that most don't know it happened. An intentional move that prevented people from going "aren't we doing the same thing the Germans are?"
"prematurely ended the careers of quite a few German submariners"
It certainly is an accurate way of putting it lol
When a company has to make an official statement on a workplace accident
Brilliant. You're like a cross between John Cleese and a (superb) history teacher; who could not enjoy all that? Loved the ending.
A whole hour of lindybeige I'm soo pleased
I honestly love the way you talk about history. I'm a native German speaker and I admire English and it's strange words, that are so wonderful in describing serious things with humour. Like squabbling or gobbledygook (which is my favourite word now). Thank you!
This was a fantastic video, Lloyd! Enjoyed every minute. Huge fan of the long format. And anxiously awaiting the next in the series. Have a great Christmas and New Year's with family and friends!
"Why are so many U-boats lost in the Alantic?"
"Ah, must be the Italians!"
:)
@Aaron: The trouble of being an arrogant racialist is that you are so full of yourself you cannot see your own mistakes. I think the modern image of the war is twisted by WW2 German propaganda. The Germans weren't nearly as "efficient" as it might seem and their most significant victories were diplomatic. Annexing Austria, convincing the allies to abandon Czechoslovakia (and using her substantial weapons stockpiles and many factories to ramp up production), a coup in Norway, allies in southern Europe. They had half of Europe as puppets or allies before they even attacked a much smaller Poland together with the Soviets. Their only military victory against a roughly comparable opponent was against France. Yes, they eventually built impressive tanks (also all sorts of weird "Wunderwaffen" which were sometimes outright ridiculous and in a way characteristic of a totalitarian dictatorship) but it was the allies who were ahead of them in most technologies that really mattered in the end. Also it is easy to build impressive machines if you have an army of slaves at your disposal (not just the people at the concentration camps, many adults in the conquered areas had to work in German factories for free). It is more or less the same way that the Soviets made impressive advancements in the space race - even a backward dictatorship can pick one thing and be very good. The cost might be that half of your country starves but totalitarian regimes don't have to deal with such insignificant details.
Interesting we know that italian sub marines were active in the atlantic and had a similar tonage sunk to submarines lost (they sent very few as the were focused on the med and the african shore, they had 32 boats and sunk 600 000 tons, for the loss of 16 subs before sending their subs back to the med after about a year) , it is interesting to note that they were generally more cautious then german subs (thus sinking less per day on average) but were larger and better armed (which explains why they were more cautious) and so could sink more in a single event and where sunk less easily.
Why did he edit comment? Why doesn't it appear with "edited" tag. RUclips is fuuuucked!
Air power, jeep carriers, a BUTTLOAD of destroyer escorts, Benchley Park breaking the navel code. Sonar, hedgehog, and squid weapon systems.
The mental image of the lights flicking on like the eyes of Sauron gave me chills
"Was developed by the french in 1942, thx guys" :D
Why would they do this
@@somethingelse4878 Because they're untrustworthy? They did us another favour in 1982 selling the secret on how to convert ship launched Exocet missiles to air launch to the Argies. Don't turn you back on them else you'll find a knife in your ribs.
@@FordPrefect23 Well I did see a documentary saying they sold their antiaircraft guns for export right before the Germans invaded
It actually worked out in our favor though, since the Germans had something to blame the Allied successes on. If not, they might have realized that their code had been broken.
@@FordPrefect23 It is significantly more subtle than this www.bbc.com/news/magazine-17256975
Also missiles and planes were sold way before the war the team doing the conversion process was sent there as part of the contract. But it was a fuck up in communication. France when the war started offered all the technical data on the missiles and planes and helped the british army preapering to face them.
As soon as the conflict began, France made available to Britain Super-Etendard and Mirage aircraft - which it had supplied to Argentina - so Harrier pilots could train against them.
i could listen to this type of content and the unique LindyBeige presenting style all day, 55 minutes well spent, thank you.....
Great video, very informative. One pet peeve of mine that you ran into was no mention of the role of the Poles in breaking Enigma. But I love how you gave broad coverage and all the factors of the Battle of the Atlantic. I did not know sonobuoys were in use during World War 2. I was a sonarman in the 80s,and used them extensively.
Bletchley park wasn't just a wooden shed. It was a LOT of wooden sheds!
Quite
Quite
Quite
Lindybeige, our lord and saviour of tangents... never change
An uncle ran away from home and joined the Merchant Navy at age 16. My g-ma and mom had no idea where he was until they got a telegram saying his ship had been torpedoed, but he had been rescued and would be taken to a port in UK.
He continued to crew ships, and was sunk again, this time when his ship broke in two in a storm. He survived that too, by jumping from the sinking half onto the half that stayed afloat long enough to be rescued.
A question about Metox:
The german Wikipedia article says that Metox did send out impulses of its own, thus wasn't completely passive. This is why the germans concluded the allies could detect Metox (the reason for Metox-equiped subs being surprised by Radar-equiped planes was that the allies installed decimeter-wave Radar on their planes, and Metox could only detect meter-wave Radar).
But it doesn't say WHY Metox was giving off impulses of its own.
For me, a Radar detector giving off electromagnetic impulses sounds about as reasonable and intuitive as a microphone sending out sound waves....
Does anyone have more information on the Metox system?
It wasn't intentional. It's a byproduct of how the system was designed.
Metox uses something called a "superheterodyne receiver". The general idea here is that you use a controllable local oscillator to shift a signal from a hard to work with frequency to an easy to work with frequency (and that you can 'tune' the system by changing the frequency the local oscillator works at). Unfortunately it's pretty hard to stop the local oscillator form putting out a detectable signal, which is what the Germans were worried the RAF could pick up.
Thx for the reply.
I should start to digg deeper BEFORE I ask the internet.... I actually found the answer roughly at the same time you posted your reply.
Still, I am surprised that the signal was apparently detectable at a range of over 70 kilometers even with the equipment available (and small and lightweight enough to put it on a plane) at the time...
Hi Have a look at the BBC book The Secret War. Accompanied the excellent series from the 70,s. Metox is discussed along with the story about a captured RAF man who said, incorrectly, they could home in on the Metox "signal". It does say in the book that "all receivers do emit tiny signals from their antenna", thats from memory, my copy of the book is 1500 miles away at the moment!
Iirc RAF pilots were instructed to tell that tale in case they got into German hands.
I had a quick look and found out that they tried to put the ASV and Leigh light on the Swordfish but they had to forgo the torpedo for lighter anti-sub bombs and it still proved too unwieldy(although it could fly and work) so it's only larger planes like the Wellington and liberator that had that type of equipment.
a hypothetical Metox detector might be heavier than a regular radar but I wouldn't expect it to be excessively so.
I have watched your videos for years and, I have to say, this is one of the best videos you have ever done.
10/10
I love your presentation but I feel compelled to make a technical correction. The conning tower is the upper level inside the sub's watertight pressure vessel. It is usually directly above the control room. The exposed platform in the sail (or fin if you are British) that you refer to as the conning tower is actually called the bridge on a sub.
A very interesting skim of an extremely complicated battle. Just a quick for instance. METOX wasn't really liked by U Boat crews because of the aerial which looked like a proper heath Robinson affair and as you describe, had to be disassembled before diving making the boat much more vulnerable! The allies largely defeated this by simply changing the frequency. Then the Germans came up with another system called NAXOS which apparently worked well but the crews still didn't like it! The triangulation system used was, in that wonderfully British way, called Huff Duff. Short for High Frequency Direction Finding and really played on the U Boats big weakness, daily weather and position reports required by high command. This really was the longest battle of the war, maybe even the most crucial, it's always fascinated me. My Dad was on convoy escort duty. He rarely spoke of it, but when I started to research the subject, I got hooked!
Lindybeige
: "Thanks Hilter for being an idiot! " , Back when i was back in University i would have loved to have
Lindybeige
as a professor , He should actually do some work for great courses plus or Audible
Yeah, they'd do better to hire him than to sponsor him. (But keep sponsoring him please! :-) )
My grandfather was part of the Norwegian merchant fleet, which was crucial to the war effort. His story is quite remarkable as well, near the end of the war he got captured by the Germans while on shore leave, interrogated under suspicion of spying for the soviets... After a while they released him, but he then got captured by the soviets under suspicion of spying for the Germans... He wasn't released until the war had ended... He was the strong silent type, never spoke about his deeds to us, but had a passion for history and it's preservation, so he made sure to write down his stories. He co-authored a couple of books, contributed to several more with pictures and stories, and he was extremely interested in unsolved cases of people lost at sea and sunken ships. He conducted investigations on it as a hobby, and gathered huge piles of charts and data around the area the ship had gone down. Sadly he passed away last year, but lived just long enough to see his 96th birthday and too celebrate 79 years married to my grandmother.
The thing with the Hedgehog was that it had a contact fuse. This means the a hit would most times kill the sub, sorry, U-boat. If it missed it didn't explode and keep the sea silent and nice for the sonar-operator to keep on looking for the sub, sorry, U-boat.
That and it fired forwards, the old depth charges were rolled over the stern, which meant at the critical time of an attack run the escort was passing *over* the U-Boat and had lost SONAR contact (WWII Escorts the SONAR faced forward). Hedgehog eliminated that problem, making it much easier for the Escorts SONAR men to keep contact with the target.
I once took a boat handling class from a 95yo merchant captain who got his start as a deckhand during the War. After learning more about the battle of the Atlantic it's amazingly lucky he survived even past 20.
My dad was a US Merchant Marine during WWII. He was in WWII before the US declared war and was on two ships, Liberty Ships, sunk by German U-Boats and saw many of his friends eaten by sharks.
My grandfather was in the Royal artillery regiment jurying the war but after being evacuated from Dunkirk ended up serving most of his time on merchant ships. These ships had no defences so they fitted some obsolete artillery pieces. He admitted they would where no use at all in battle but were really just to make the merchant crews feel a bit safer.
two bob lathe The u-boats had artillery too. Such is war that you can spent it without firing a single shot
two bob - They where Called DEMS Gunners. (Defensively Equipped Merchant Ships). There where 3 Regt‘s of them. After Dunkirk, the RA had a lot of men and no Guns. The Navy was short of men-so the job went to the Army. My grandfather also served in a DEMs Regt, after Dunkirk. He was torpedoed early on in the War. He arrived home to find his newborn child had been killed in a German raid on Liverpool. My mother and aunt had luckily been evacuated to Wales.
U-boats and how to sink them: the Harry Potter prequel we deserved
You getting sidetracked is one of the main reasons I love your channel. I look forward to your sometimes rambling tangents.
Not only the gas bubble rises to the surface, but it also 'pulses' - collapsing and expanding shortly after the explosion, quick pressure change also could damage U-boat shell, you can see the underwater explosions 'pulsing' on slow mo videos on YT, also there is a paper on underwater explosions, that you can find on Google, called 'Underwater Explosion Phenomena and Shock Physics - Chalmers'
I love your digressions, they are just as interesting as the story itself!
The UK also recruited hundreds of Ham radio enthusiasts from all over the country to listen to radio traffic and write down what they heard and send it in to central Stations. The Ham's didn't know what they were listening to but the controllers did and lot's of valuable information was gathered by this method. Might be worthy of a Lindybeige video??
I hope he make less short edited videos. Full 1 hour long video complete with his cute mistakes is better to watch imo
Like listening to grandpa's stories
"cute" does make me sound gay but that's the only word i can think of right now.. shush
delightful mistakes, then?
"No one ever had to do it twice." Like kamikaze?
japan planes fly into ship to kill foes
ally plane fly of ship to save crew
its like reverse kamikaze!
Well, all but one of the pilots survived so that's a rather important distinction
forgottenfamily
True.
there are two kamikaze pilots who surviced there kamikaze flyed so far i know.
One missed his taget and one got shot down moments bevor and even got a second attemt and failed at this ones more.
Kinda furthers your reverse kamikaze argument: two survivors vs 1 lost
I'm so glad I found Lindybeige. What an entertaining and informative channel. My father served in the Merchant Marine as an Ensign. Many Americans who were rejected for the branch services due to sight issues or other maladies did their bit by enlisting in the Merchant Marine. They not only transported war materials, food and other supplies they also served as oil tankers for the Navy. My dad later found his way onto a hospital ship which later led to him becoming an MD on the GI bill. Thank you for enlightening me and your other viewers.
Adding on to the part about U-boats sailing right up to the east coast of North America, my grandmother lived in Eastern Canada during the war and said that one point during the war a man tried to board a train with old tickets (which was suspicious) so the police were called and he turned out to be a German spy dropped off on the coast by a U-boat. The War Museum in the capital of Canada also has a display with the equipment found at a site in Newfoundland decades after the war had ended. It was a little camp with some communications equipment set up by a U-boat crew, and they never went back to collect the equipment. So the U-boats weren't just sinking ships off the coast, they were sometimes dropping off men to go ashore. www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/halifax-harbour-home-to-nazi-submarine-1.1216405 This is also an interesting article I just found about how a German U-boat torpedoed a ship right in the mouth of the Halifax Harbour in Nova Scotia and was then sunk in the Harbour when it surrendered at the end of the war. For somebody living in Europe it probably seems stupid since the war happened right on the streets many of you live on, but it seems to weird that ships were being torpedoed all the way over here, right in a Harbour that I've sailed in so many times.
52:38 Indeed he was, unironically. Ask you this: How on earth is germany getting oil? (Keep in mind that Britain dominated the Middle East and weren't getting much oil to themselves, and the top 3 countries with oil are: USA, Venezuela and the Soviet Union)
@Colin Cleveland Well, Romania may reach demands for the german war machine, but not the german civilian economy, let alone 3/4 of Europe.
Synthetic oil is not only expensive (really expensive), but also limited at the time.
I found from a source stating that Germany was still importing 60% of its pretroleum demands in peacetime.
@Colin Cleveland Germany was doomed at one of the following:
- Since the battle of Stalingrad
- Since Britain blockade
i do not have to watch this vid to give it a thumbs up.. but iam gonna watch it nonetheless
For some reason this reminded me of a documentary on the shipping of World War Two that was narrated by Jeremy Clarkson.
In any case, a number of things were new to me, such as the Leigh Lights. Nice talk.
“Sidetrack” is his middle name... but great job as always, Lindy!
Thank you, LindyBeige for your comments on the Imitation Game. Spot on!
My dad was in the Canadian Navy during this war, serving on Flower Class Corvettes and a sloop at the end of the war. The only sub he ever saw sunk was in 1944 when the ship he was on used the hedgehog spigot mortars to kill a U-Boat. He was among the men detailed to gather evidence of the kill- wreckage and human remains. He suffered from PTSD, my mother recalled the nightmares he used to have.
Hedgehogs employed contact detonation so depth of U boat was not critical.
Interesting.....I guess that also means a smaller charge is needed for each device.
@@allybally0021 a smaller charge, yes, but also a hit was required, a depth charge near a sub could still kill it. Typically a spread of them would be fired, 24 carried in a single housing is typical, and being fired from the ship could be fired a short range (200m).
To their own shore,
Came the world war.
Gleaves and Ingham,
Leading the bury west.
In their own track,
Came the wolfpack.
Gleaves led the convoy,
Into the hornets nest!
I am disappoint that this the only Sabaton reference so far
SABATOOOON!
Poor U-406
reddit.com/r/expectedsabaton
damn, the second he said u-boat i remembered this song
This got uploaded just as I'd finished the last episode of the Chieftain's hatch that I hadn't seen and was starting to worry about what to watch next. What a time to be procrastinating!
You should go to blechly park and make a video on it
I keep hearing belchy
How the hell did they know we
were here?... They must have thought... Shortly before dying.
Loved your video Lindybeige. Currently studying the Battle of the Atlantic for an MA in Military History.
1. If you cover Donitz at the Nuremberg Trials in your next video, be sure to include US Admiral Nimitz's defence of Donitz by pointing out that the US had also practiced unrestricted submarine warfare against the Japanese.
2. The ASDIC stands for the 'Allied Submarine Detection Investigative Committee'; which had created it. (Source: 'Wolfpack', Phillip Kaplan, pages 21, 22)
3. Interesting fact about Metox: the reason why Naval High Command decided to order its U-boats to stop using it was because a captured Allied bomber pilot, under interrogation, lied to the Germans; claiming that their use of Metox gave away their location - and that was the basis under which NHC took that decision.
Currently reading through Donitz's memoirs, and have also read through those of the U-boat captain Herbert Werner (highly recommend both).
I think the development of effective airborne radar was the real game-changer.
If Admiral Donitz went to sea and someone sank his ship, would that be dunkin' Donitz?
That's indeed worth a laugh, coffee and a donut.
Another long video? Oh yes. This is what I need.
A sarcastic nickname for Hitler at the time was _Gröfaz_ which is a contraction of the pompous title "Größter Feldherr aller Zeiten" meaning 'greatest field commander of all times' - you wouldn't want to get caught using this dreogatory contraction, though.
Not a big history guy but I've heard from many sources now that Hitler was seemingly sabotaging his war. Like the fact that we wasn't a fan of the Stg44 and it was developed kinda against his will.
@@martinkirbits4752 He probably was after 1941 since he realized he couldn't win.
@@martinkirbits4752 I don´t think he was actively sabotaging it. He more had really strong opinions that were not always well-informed. Luckily.
The Nazis were also big fans of abbreviations, because they felt so efficient, and used them so much everyone tired of them, so people mockingly abbreviated "Größter Feldherr aller Zeiten" (which is ridiculous on its own) to " Gröfaz". "Gröfaz" also sounds funny in german, because it strongly reminds of "Fatzke", which is a slang term meaning someone who looks dashing, but has no substance, is a con man, and/or thick as a brick. ("fop" or "swell-head" comes close, I believe). So, yes, it was very dangerous. Especially after ´43, when the field commander didn´t look so great anymore, at all....
My grandfather’s ship HMCS Waskesue ran convoys up to Smolensk. They sank a u boat hunting in the North Atlantic. Rescued some of the crew when the surfaced.
In the book "One of our Submarines" (written by a commander of British subs, Edward Young), they sink a few U-boats from using the deck gun. You see, in the Second World War submarines spent most of their time, especially at night, on surface since battery and other technologies were not developed enough to keep submarines under water for extended periods of time.
Pls like so Lindybeige can see.
I think the Germans probably expected the Brits to have Enigma machines, since the machines were being sold commercially before the war.
The Numberphile channel has a pair of really cool videos about how Enigma worked and how it was cracked, if anyone's interested.
GerackSerack it was my understanding that the ones used by the German Military were more advanced than the ones that were sold to the public. I think different branches of the Military even used different kinds of enigma machine than one another.
the enigma machine on its own is useless, its all about knowing which of the 158,962,555,217,826,360,000 different starting positions to use.
also the commercial machines had only rotors compared to the military variant which had a plugboard that increased the number of combinations massively.
It's one of those stories that someone somehow heroically stole an enigma-machine and kept it secret and THAT broke it. Which is phantasy, if I remember correctly there were quite a few enigma-machines in Bletchley Park. The first priority in case of capture was destroying the codebooks, which could simply be dumped into saltwater or burned. One of the first cracks actually was due to weather. The uboats would send weather-reports daily, so if you triangulated the position of the uboat, knew the weather and knew the weather codes (which they did after capturing one weather book), you knew what you were actually looking for in the code and could work your way backwards to the settings. The Kriegsmarine changed the weatherbooks after a while though, which is where Turing and his computer came in.
I doubt that because U-boat charts we made to dissolved in water
timpyrules that really happened. Don't remember exactly the Uboat, but the story goes like this. This u-boat had been damaged and force to emerge. The crew abandoned the ship. The allied one, which damaged the submarine, sent out a party to search it. Meanwhile german survivors were made to believe the u-baot sanked. Of the brave 3men of party only one survived.
I LOVE your scattered descriptions of historical events! You didn't mention that Leigh lights were also used during DAYLIGHT hours to make approaching planes much harder to see against the bright sky, giving the U-boat crews much less time to dive before being bombed.
God, I love it when you digress, and then remember what subject you’re talking about again,,, which is every video! Absolutely hilarious 😂
Depth charge water fountaining was a function of the ignitions' depth setting. Set shallow you get the big impressive water spout. Set deep there was a bit of a swell.
Mr Beige, I know you are an incredibly busy man, but some of us are wistfully yearning for the video you mentioned about the end of the second happy time. Hope you get around to it one of these days
That one use Hurricane concept is so very gangster, to use the expression of our cousins across the pond. Just armed to the teeth, piloted by someone slightly bonkers and a difficult thing to factor in when attacking ships in that time period. I love the innovations war brings.
U-boat detected.
Hurricane is launched
Pumped up kicks starts playing
38:00 Your summation of depth charges isn’t totally wrong. They work on the principle of hydrostatic pressure. Fluids like water do not compress. The concussion of the depth charge presses against the hull of the U-Boat by transferring its concussive force outward in a globular shape. It’s no different than the effect of water hammer in a plumbing system, albeit by different means. Then, the void created by the charge adds the benefit of massive influx of seawater, transferring this shockwave outward in the same fashion as the aforementioned blast thus causing further damage to said U-Boat
The dam busting bombs devised by Barnes Wallis functioned on the same premise of hydrostatic pressure caused by the shockwave of the bomb. It’s also why the bombs had to sink to a minimum depth, otherwise the weakest point the explosion presses against isn’t the dam face, but upward toward fresh air.
There are several videos on RUclips, and even one documentary about the dam busters that display the added benefit of ziplock bags of water behind explosives fixed to sheet metal, essentially an explosive sandwich, causing more damage than the bombs alone with no backing.
the collapsing bubble does massive damage, just not quite how lindy described, ultrasonic cleaning tanks and the flow cavitation that erodes hardened steel and concrete in minutes all work on the shock energy of the collapsing bubbles.
@@mytech6779 Any ultrasonic cleaning tanks I have been given did not live up to expectations.
@@myparceltape1169 get what you pay for.
@@mytech6779 I strongly suspected that too. Then recommended them for disposal as we could not even work out if an ultrasonic signal was being supplied to the bath, in one case, in another I could detect the improvement made by a wet tooth brush.
I seem to remember reading that there was a lot of resistance to a blackout on the Eastern Seaboard from businesses all along the coast from shops to amusement arcades and roller coaster operators. Those who suffered most were the sailors and shipowners of the US merchant marine.
Love your very overt British bias - we don't get the whole picture unless everyone firmly makes the case for themselves, and too many of your countrymen are caught up in self-ridicule to present anything like an honest case for British contributions to the war. Great video!
My father, born in Liverpool, was in the merchant navy all through the war. He sailed on all the convoy routes. My grandmother twice received telegrams reporting him lost at sea but he survived. Not only did merchant seamen not receive any medals or recognition during the war, if their ship was sunk then the ship owners stopped their pay! They were considered not to be working if they had no ship! So much for the treatment of our great British seamen! If you are interested my father wrote a fascinating account of his life in the British merchant navy, rising from deck boy to ships captain, an achievement of which he was very proud.
ottoxid where is this account
The way the UK treated merchantmen was... yeah. Napoleonic press gangs like what started the war of 1812? And to not even attempt to rescue survivors? That is 'the law of the sea' for thousands of years. US escorts, especially coast guard crewed, made every effort to fish survivors. EVERYONE'S survivors... U-boat crews, Japanese pilots- they can either reach for the life ring, or push it away. Their choice. I have no idea of how your dad was paid. That was the sore spot in the US at that time. Merchant men were all union employees. Working at scale plus danger pay etc. So on an undermanned ship, a man would work 2 watches, 16 hours, including meal breaks etc. No satellite TV, VHS videos, so just sleep the other 8. As another descendant of an artilleryman wrote below, as an 'armed guard' they were called on US merchant ships, stood watch as their commander ordered. Sit at your AA turret for 24 hours? too bad. He got $23 a month. The civilian merchantman sleeping below? got 20 hours pay for the 16 he was awake, he made at least as much in that day as the frozen swabby outside made in the month. Yeah, so on a 7 day week, months on end... $1 and coins per hour- as a wiper, deck hand, galley hand, kid? ... one 'lucky' voyage, he made more than the enlisted sailor made in the whole war! That was the bone of contention .... till the late 1990's... so your dad stayed in the merchant navy his whole life? There's something to be proud of !!!!