Help Solve The Mystery Of The Strange Hole - I'm Confused And Need Your Expertise!
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- Опубликовано: 18 апр 2024
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Back at an old job to figure out this mystery hole.
#fieldtile
#watererosion
#trench
#sinkhole
#excavatorworking 
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This is how you keep a good reputation in business. This is where many guys fail on decisions to do the right thing. This problem wasn’t your fault but you took the high road. You cannot measure how much this will pay you back down the road. Like paying it forward. Huge pat on the back Mike!
You do right by your customers, and they will sing your praises if they end up in a conversation with someone who needs the services you offer.
Transversely you do them dirty, they will spare no detail lambasting your/company name in those same conversations.
If you know of any business that doesn’t fix problems man they deserve to be out of business 😅 I know what you are saying but it’s hard to believe someone who wouldn’t fix a unknown failure that just so happened where you did work. End of the day it’s your fault somethings happened and it’s only right to fix it even if it’s not because of you because kinda hard to be like that’s not because of me when the hole is over top of the trench you ran 😂 definitely sucks for Mike but it’s apart of the business unfortunately and the only good out of it is Mike gets content and he will recoup what little he lost with the little revenue the video will make over time.
DP it"s nice to see a owner of a company that gets down and dirty in a hole and thats why your Chanel is my #1 go to
Had a boss on the job site digging a trench for mechanical water main and Patsy was taken too long hooking up the connection period a torrential downpour came and water was filling up Rather quickly. The boss jump down into the trench to hook it up. He had another appointment for a bid and changed into a clean suit on the side of the road!
Correct. To lead, lead by example.
As an old dinosaur an over 50 years of experience in clay sand and muck.. I have seen pockets of sandy soil that is so water soaked that the weight of the top cover will actually push an stretch the tile down in the watery pocket of mush sand… Now as to the tile rising? Plastic tile (( unlike clay )) is in my experience nothing more than an air balloon under ground and just the right soil conditions? It will float up. Now with a backhoe or excavator you don’t have so much as a void like we do with a tile machine . If it did not compress on the sides a top? Bingo she will float up till hits a hard layer of compaction. But 90% of the time?? Give an inch or two the plowed in tile stays put! But I have seen in totally 150 % soaked soil ? We have actually had the tile float as it was plowed. We go back to our long plastic tile filled with air with water surrounding it we get the balloon effect… much is absolutely common to see this plowing with a high water table…. Now my best guess is with the ups and downs downs?? A clay loam soil could seal the drain slots off A water will go to least resistance and once she cut a path along the tile?? It is easier for water to flow beside the tile than weep inside the tile… now this is my best advice/ suggestion on what happened .. for an example 734 foot of 8” knifed in thro extremely saturated sugar sand .. 5 months later? Where tile was plowed at 12 foot deep when dug back up?? Was spots only 36 inches below the ground surface!!! Trust me it was nothing you all did wrong it just the nature of the beast ( tile ) I’m 680 years old now and have seen happen what you all are experiencing…. (( edit )) lol drop the ZERO 😂😂😂 but are days?? This old timer feels like I’m 650 🤣🤣🤣
No job is without its surprises. The difference between a good contractor and a bad one, is addressing the issue and making it right or just ignoring it. Nice to see, once again that you are the reputable contractor who stands behind his work. More critical in a small community. Thanks for sharing.
A void wouldn't move the pipe, it would only create a depression. What went wrong was that soil is ancient wash and what you went through was a sand bar.. That sand was fine enough to drain away through the pipe causing the problems you have. By digging it up and mixing soils you may be lucky . The real solution would have been to run a sock on the pipe in that stuff.
This video is why you are in demand and why I watch you. I've dealt with contractors having to fix problems and for the most part, all they do is put bandaids on. The one landscaping contractor that fixed our problem is permanent 'with us. Too many 'pros' would've dug up the hole and tamped dirt back down. They wouldn't have found the problem to fix it. You did. You & Aaron (and Matt) are a joy to watch. Thank you for sharing this.
Looks like Mother Nature threw you another curve ball Mike. The power of water never ceases to amaze me. Nice save Mike & Aaron.
Here is my guess.Back when nature was doing its thing making the valley. A sand dune was blown or sloughed off over a cut bank in the river creating a void. The evidence was somewhat shown in the cross section of your ditch. You guys are so lucky to find it. It is great to see you stand behind your work. Thanks for all the entertainment you bring on your videos
And that right there is why you always chose a quality contractor. Because they stand by the work and their customers. Excellent example of going the extra mile. Congratulations. My thoughts are that the plough may have skipped upward for some reason like a rock or something and the travel continued possibly changed grade enough at that one position then returning to normal depth.
Aaron, it's very dangerous being down in a ditch with sand walls. That sand can slough off and become your gravesite faster than you can say oogley boogly and Matt could not get you out fast enough. My cousin was a pipelayer and two young boys working for him were down in the ditch and that was the end of them in less than three minutes. They make braces that fit down in those ditches and next time you have rain put one together in the shop!
OSHA has guidelines for trench support plates … lifesaving via prevention of troubles
You know I feel the same way. I’ve been in holes a lot less sketchy than this and seen whole sides come in. It’s not a matter of being good at digging or whatever, it’s just soil conditions. The OSHA guidelines are set up because they have proof that people can die when they aren’t followed.
Not saying y'all don't grease things them pins sounds like they get some wear on them ur awesome guys love watching yall
I can hear the OHSA guys going crazy that you are in that ditch without shoring. and it is well above your waist. HAVE A GREAT DAY.
The reason you are a successful contractor is that when the problem showed up you fixed it right. Good on ya!
That is a weird situation for sure. The soil profile was interesting and probably the issue. Great work. Stay safe
Glad the walls of the hole didn’t collapse on you when both of you were in the hole. Very interesting episode.
Look at the soil they are working with. That clay is pretty tough. It’s not going to collapse very easy. Tough stuff.
@@paulprigge1209said all the guys who have been buried in trench collapses.
@@Hawkermkii always the good looking ground that kills you...
I wouldn't go down there with trench sheets
I've seen many trenches collapse and nowhere near that deep, been fortunate that nobody was in the hole or the trench box was installed. That's a very dangerous hole!
You two are a BLAST watching their's always callbacks from time to time whatever we do
The first thing I thought was a cave or old mine of some sort.
That doesn't explain the hump in the tile though.
Weird.
It had to be a void, groundwater encroachment floating the empty tile.
At least you didn't get a journey to the center of the earth!
Cheers
Terry
The shot in the trench with you back filling was great, but some people who have a claustrophobic problems probably won't like it. They can just skip that part or close their eyes. Keep up the good work !!!!
Water follows the path of least resistance, fill dirt over the trench in that area made for inconsistent compaction. I appreciate you guys.
He forgot to mention he had 4 excavators on the job, the 210, 304, MBS 0.1 and DP 0.1. Good to see you standing behind your work.
I didn’t realize the tile went so deep. Good viewpoint of the depth now.
It doesn't. It only goes about 4 or 5 feet deep. If you watch the video of them doing this install they used a dozer to cut a slot in before plowing because they knew they needed it deeper than what the plow could do. If you look at the grass you can see where the slot was that they cut in.
@@mikel9567 thanks
Here in north western Ont. Canada. My property an everyone around me.. it all red clay not a rock.. when I dug my water lines down 6' as out frost line . From Well to barns, house an live stock tanks I had a year later 2 huge sink hole over 50' round. One barn 1' line even pinch off.
Rented the same 225 cat to dig it up. Found the lines an went 12' deeper an hit really clean white sand. So clean you can't even use it for mortor sand. It was washed out an a huge cavity. With under ground stream. . Seem once you disturb this rock hard clay it starts a chain reaction. Same thing happened to people down the road.. I had to dig clay out of big front hill to pack that void in an reset new line
I even sunk the 225 cat in the front valley that drops 120' down from were house is. I was trying to get to were I had to dig 2 6' holes 1 for a 45' Hydro pole an 1 for the guy wire anchor. It was black mud in the bottom. The tracks were sinking a good foot in the mud. As I tracked across to were I had to dig an just before I got there the whole machine dropped 4 feet down..
There a foot of black mud an just over 2' of hard red clay. Below that the same clean white beach like sand. Took to other big excavators to get my retal out. It was swimming in that beach sand.
In order to dig the 2 holes I had to get mates an weld up 2 heavy steel plates with 4 3" pipes in each corner dug throw the clay layer an hammered both steel box like a trench gard into the sand an dig the sand out from the center. Hammer the box down more dig more hammer with bucket more dig. Until I got both down 6' for the pole an pole guy cable ancer. With out the steel as you dug the sand out it under mind the clay running down into my hole like sugar.. put the ancer an rod in one hole an set the 45' pole in the other an packed it tight with clay. Both steel are still in the ground to this day. Since then I rammed the field down into the sand area after stopping off 2 to 3' of clay about 50' sqare load my 5 ton dump truck for back filling the root cellar basement.. I can't take any more out until I strip more clay. As it under mind like 6' under the ledge of clay.
When digging an tranch in this clay if you don't back fill an compact good every 12" . If I just back fill an pack with bucket the next spring you can see were I dug. It sinks over a foot. I put more clay. Next spring it down a foot again. Some old ones I am still adding to. As you dig the clay come out in big chunks. Or stuck in the bucket
Those of us who watched the tile being put in know it was deep. But this video put it in perspective just how deep it was! And once again, soil, water, and mother nature can do some crazy things! That tile being about four feet above where it was originally placed is insane! Let's hope the backfilling creates a tighter pack around the pipe and the soil is mixed up better for the whole process to work properly. The DP crew strives to do a good job, but if there is a problem they will take care of it properly. If only every contractor had that kind of work ethic and honesty.
Good morning sunshine! Wow that is crazy! Then again water does what it wants when it wants! Good business men stand behind their work & come back & fixes any problems. Good job! Much love from Henderson Ga USA
Mike, If what you say is true about breaking the tile plow at this job, then the tile plow would stopped laying flat as you moved it across the ground. That means from where the pipe began to rise, the pipe would have been laid at an angle, creating an arch and a void/gap under the pipe. Overtime, the earth continue to fill in under the tile pipe, causing it to rise up as water passed through it and eventually, creating the sink hole! And if it was at an angle, that would have also created a gap for the water to run outside the pipe as well. Hopefully it is now fixed!
I don’t think he meant the tile plow broke enough on that job to bend and let the tile be put in at an upward angle, he meant it might have started just cracking there. The plow didn’t bend and break until the next job where he started plowing through rocks the size of a skid steer and it happened about 10’ into the rocks which if it were completely broke it wouldn’t have even started into them. If you ask me he’s just using the excuse that it started cracking on this job to cover the fact he shouldn’t have been plowing through those rocks in the first place, he should have used the excavator to dig across that road. But he was alone and in a hurry. 😂
Since you've been doing this work for a few minutes I wouldn't doubt your thought is correct. Water does have an amazing way of lifting stuff up.
Even caskets used to float if too much rain at once, hence vaults these days.
I see your all most as good on the back fill as me, but give you 40 more years, and you will just keep on trying now.
I been doing it for 65 years now and I still working each day at 72 years old now.
God bless y'all crazy boys now.
That man in that hole made me nervous the whole time. With that material and voids everywhere man that was tough to watch
I think you are 💯 correct on your thoughts about a void. I was an underground plumber for years and I have seen that happen. I just wanted to say it was so nice seeing that you shelved your ditch I can't tell you how many I've been in ditches that have collapsed because the operator didn't do that and it's terrifying when it falls on your head and you have no where to go. Awesome job sir.👍👍
When I was a kid back in the late 70’s my parents bought a camper off a guy in the next town over who was an underground plumber. About 2 months later that’s exactly what happened to him. He was in a trench working on the town water lines when it collapsed. It took them about an hour to dig him out and of course he was already dead by then.
Dp we’ve run into that situation before. The only thing we thought was that when we backfilled didn’t get it tight enough around the pipe we redid it and compacted it and it solved the problem
Machine leveling from flat to going downhill, the plow tiling height needs adjusting until it reaches new elevation. Tipping point scenario. Dozer front lowers, back raisers.
Could be
Great job standing behind your work. That's what makes a great contractor, not a hit and run money grabber. Just wondering what Aaron was doing while you did all the work. Hopefully you deducted it out of his payroll 😂😂😂. Can't wait for the next one.
You ought to swap machines with LD18 for a week, and then the 210 would come back spotless!😅
Nice to see in this day and time someone who guarantees their work even when it’s technically not their fault. Nice work getting the most scoop ability out of the little Cat excavator.
Yeah, I always thought that if it is not the owners fault it was my responsibility to fix the problem. Amazing when a problem reveals itself how everyone else possibly involved runs for cover, leaving you - the contractor- as the last man standing. Only had one example where a supplier offered any assistance.
You found an old home brew tunnel that got messed up with the tile plow. Thanks for the video
Mike,
I helped a guy out some years back, excavating out a pond. He exposed a 4-inch diameter ADS (corrugated flex drain line), perforated, no sock membrane on it. He advised that he had installed it some years prior (in a similar situation that you have on this project), to get water away, from a forage crop field.
It was now going to be abandoned to facilitate the pond, so we cut it open to see how much sediment was in it. To my surprise, there was fine layer of sediment that had accumulated in the bottom of the pipe, and in essence made the bottom a smooth surface (like double wall ADS), and clear water was flowing thru beautifully.
I was surprised, I thought it would be full of sediment.
Please let us all know the progress of this warranty repair, or if some ground water specialist made a comment on your request for help.
Thank you sir.
The question is, if the tile floated 4 foot in the trench, where did the extra length come from? Pipe would have had to have gotten another 8 foot or more longer to account for that extra length.
I know you have a bunch of limestone out your way. Maybe water degraded the limestone and left the void space. Something similar is happening in King of Prussia, PA right now on a major highway.
Don't think the pipe can "float" up through soil. More likely the soil subsided under the pipe in the area of the "sink hole" and carried the pipe down with it.
One thing I would wonder about is whether the downward movement has caused the dislocation of the pipe upstream.
Like the video Mike and Aaron cause you take care ove your costumer .
Well done 👍👏👏👏Australia🦘🐨🦘🐨🦘🐨🦘🤗
My guess is that the soil didn't drop into the trench allowing the pipe to float as the moist dirt flowed in beneath it causing the hump. In your fabrication shop projects, how about a couple small wings that could scratch some sealing soil from the sides a foot or so above the bottom? Enjoyed the video.
I figured out what the problem is. What you boys got there is what you call a floater. Sometimes, when you least expect it, when you're laying pipe, one of them floats to the top. I'm not sure how it happens, but sometimes even big pipes float!😁
You made the statement that the plow was in extremely deep, with little experience, I would think that as the plow went through and allowing the soil to come back together, the soil only closed back on the top 2’ or so creating a void down to the pipe, ( especially in that hard pack soil area) that void never was allowed to close and heal shut because the top acted like a bridge/ block, letting the water to not only flood the cavity and open it up, but lift the pipe in the process, I think that would explain some of the 3’ lift you were seeing in pipe. Just a thought sir or guess if you will. Thanks for the update.
Your roughed in is better than some with their final product! Wow. Impressive.
Thank you for another great video. Cheers
Nice Vid!
The dirt around the tile at the correct elevation looked compacted really well so it doesn’t seem that the problem was a result of the tile plow. Also the step increase in elevation would rule out the tile plow unless you had intentionally stopped, raised the plow all the way up, started traveling again for several feet and then lowered it again. It appears your explanation is the best one.
The tile wizards at work!
Mike, I think your problem just might be underground erosion below the trench caused by water running through the layers of rock in the hillside. There is probably a good chance that when you cut through that hard spot, it disrupted that flow and perhaps rerouted it. If I remember correctly that was extremely hard ground. When you back filled you took the time to mix the different materials to ensure a solid seal around the pipe.
It is also possible that the water froze and jacked the recently disturbed soil allowing the opening it needed to flush the hole open with that softer material.
I would have the owner keep an eye out for weird runoff.
The odd thing is no water anywhere in the trench.
Nice work fellas!!!! Comebacks are not fun but you guys are a definite class act!
Great video
Another great video keep them coming please
Dirt Perfect, Subscribed because your videos are so much fun!
1,780 👍's up DP thank you for sharing 🤗
Top job DP and Aaron
Great video Mr Dirt Perfect and MBTS
Nice work ❤
Great job running the mini excavator Mr Dirt Perfect
There aint no way I would be in that hole while digging. Crazy.
Hello Mike, I wonder how long the current homeowner has been on that property and if they know when that outhouse was relocated to where it is now? I'm thinking if the tile you installed went through an origional sewy hole and at about where the soil changed from clay to sand? Please don't fall out of your chair laughing but It could be the sink hole had something to do with an old outhouse. LOL, you asked for possible reasons. The steps were awesome.
Mike , I was expecting to hear you call Scooby Do and the Mystery Machine to solve this mystery .
I think your right Mike the plow created a void, that with the soil and it being that deep might not have settled in. Other then that 🤷♂️. Can’t believe how much it floated 😳. Nice work guys 👍
You guys are the best good job
Thanks
Awesome video! I enjoy watching you, DP, and Aaron! Thank you for sharing! 👌 😊
Good repair. Well done and spring is coming!
I see you stair stepped that ditch some but it made me nervous to have Aarron down in that deep of a hole with an unknown stability problem with the dirt.
Good morning, in Minnesota we have that clay to sandy loamy mixed soil quite a bit. Usually we have water pockets and those cause problems with settling and bank blowouts. The only thing you can do is dig it up and backfill.
Great job guys on going back and standing behind your work even though it was a mystery about how it all happened. The work you do with those machines is top notch but the commentary between you and MBTS is PRICELESS!!! Keep up the good work.
We’ve had to start using the corrugated abs pipe for culverts on our creek crossings instead of steel pipe, sure have to have the right material and proper compaction to keep them from floating out,you guys are great to watch, keep it up.
Another job well done, I absoluty love the banter between you two reminds me a lot of me and my best friend when we worked together! ✌😊
You guys is to fun. Love you 🤣
good video
Mike & Aarpn, I remember the video when you guys originally cut this tile parh. I remember this area was slicker than snot and you had to use the excavator to pull the tile trencher through the slick mud and the excavator strap slipped off several times and I think the tile machine was not deep when you had to have it pulled by the excavator. If it had been as deep, it simply would not pull through. It was during that pulling scenario when things got sketchy. That's just my thoughts on the pipe depth change.
Great job putting the tile in Mr Dirt Perfect and MBTS
Mike and Aaron I love how you stand behind your work! Thanks for sharing! Kevin
DP , be careful in that deep ditch lost a good friend in a cave in. He didn’t think it needed to stepped back either.
Definitely strange. Good work fixing it though!
Thank you for sharing, I learn a lot , always a pleasure watch your project with the dream team 👍👍👍👍
Nice follow up and fix guys. Interesting soil make up.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts, ideas and videos. That certainly was a strange one, glad to see you got it fixed with very little drama. Wishing you, Arron, and your families the best.
Great job running the big excavator Mr Dirt Perfect
Your trench from the tile plow did not close on top of the pipe before the trench filled with water. The pipe floated up in the trench. The water then followed the pipe to the outlet and left a void which collapsed.
Mike, perhaps a small future rainy-day project would be to make a blade attachment to cover the teeth of the 210 bucket when needed (Utilizing some of MBTSs saved metal 😄) that you could attach with heavy-duty U-bolts going around the outside teeth of the bucket and fashioned in a way that you could store it in the machine, or on the boom (with bolts welded to the boom where the U-bolt holes are.) 🤔???? Hence, it's always handy and available. You know how we love your "little" projects!!! 💯💪👊
I love watching you two work and mess with each other. It lightens up the day even through the frustration of having to correct a problem. Thanks for you content. You are the channel where I look first for new content. jimb
Awesome job. Again appreciate the narration. Just posted a new video where I'm trying to do more narration myself on a excavation for new footings. Great work guys
Good morning 🌅 great video guys hopefully that solves your problems there 💯✌🏻💚🌱💨
DP I’m just speculating,but maybe there’s a hidden water source somewhere in that area and it undermined your tile. If it happens again you may need to rap filter cloth around the tile and cover it with stone. Great job!
What appears that you have found one disadvantage of the plow versus the excavator when installing field tile, you cannot see the change in the soil, very rare instance
You TWO are a BLAST watching their's always callbacks whatever we do !!!
That’s what standing behind you work is called most people tell the homeowner good luck I’ve been in the drywall business for 40 years I don’t usually get called back but I do when it happens good job boys keep up the awesome work
Sure hope you got it this time great to see you went back that kind of stuff sure tells everyone just what you are all about well done 👍👋🇨🇦
Such a good thing y’all had the 210 on site already! Great job problem solving this one boys!
Was it cold the day of install? If that was the end of the roll, the Tile had some residual curl in it that stood it up in the trench. Water found it's way in and took the dirt from the Sink Hole to under the Tile arched up. Then it continued beside the Tile out. That's why I like dig and bury. Tile plows can also stretch the Tile skinny or pull it in two and continue to look fine. Sandy Loam, Plows will work pretty good with the tile laid out in the Sun to be flexible.
Trenching is slow but it does make the dirt fine enough for backfilling with a blade. I know digging with a Hoe or Excavator is more costly. Never saw an issue like this after, occasionally pinched shut from too much dirt all at once in backfill.
Guys like to put a Tile Plow behind their big 4x4 tractor and tow it with a Dozer. Seen some fouled that way as well.
hello Mike & Aaron & it's is Randy and i like yours video is cool & Thanks Mike & Aaron & Friends Randy
Finding the problem and the up on the pipe, took an extra effort, having done, pipework and excavating myself it’s good to see somebody doing the job right
That is Weird.
Mr. MBTS bringing you your pepsi before he leaves... the bond that you two have brings a smile to the face!!!
and better yet, the can was already opened and ready to go - that's perfect customer service, better than what you get at many restaurants.
Puzzles are fun!
Excellent shoring in place…