Why You Root for Gone Girl's Amy Dunne
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 21 сен 2024
- Get a full month of MUBI FOR FREE: mubi.com/thetake (With the support of Creative Europe - MEDIA Programme of the European Union) | Gone Girl’s Amy Dunne (Rosamund Pike) has been called a lot of things, both in her world and in ours. Ever since director David Fincher brought Gillian Flynn’s bestselling novel to the screen in 2014, we’ve remained torn over whether Amy is an antihero or a villain-a feminist icon or an irredeemable monster. The divided reaction to Amy Dunne speaks to our own feelings about female rage, a notably quiet kind of anger that we normally expect women to suppress. As Gone Girl shows us through the story of a woman whose bottled-up disappointment in her husband (Ben Affleck) gradually curdles into murderous resentment, this kind of repressed anger isn’t just common-it’s accepted. Here’s our Take on Amy Dunne as an exaggerated embodiment of female rage, what our reaction to her says about our own gendered expectations, and why Amy’s revenge doesn’t have to be empowering to feel cathartic.
Support The Take:
Shop our Merch: bit.ly/122020TT support our channel and look great doing it with Take t-shirts, hoodies, mugs, and more!
If you like this video, subscribe to our channel and support us by:
Joining our Patreon: / thetake vote on the topic we cover next, gain early access to videos and much more!
Follow The Take:
Facebook: / thisisthetake
Instagram: / thisisthetake
Snap: / 8721082935
Twitter: / thisisthetake
Website: the-take.com/
We are The Take (formerly ScreenPrism).
Get a full month of MUBI FOR FREE: mubi.com/thetake (With the support of Creative Europe - MEDIA Programme of the European Union)
Do a take on acrimony please
@Aristotle was Not a fan of Plato Good point!
Rosamund Pike should have won the Oscar for this role... Her "cool girl" monologue lives rent free in my mind
Agreed. She was robbed!
Who won that year?
@@maggiemcfly5267 Julianne Moore won for "Still Alice." 💖
@@maggiemcfly5267 Julianne Moore, for "Still Alice". She won in the Al Pacino "Scent of a Woman" fashion, being nominated multiple times, but having an okay enough performance to get their first win. At Rosamund Pike's expense, who performed the hell out of a role that was as far from Oscar bait as possible.
Oh i watch that monologue at least once a month, it's epic honestly. And the comment section underneath the video clip is gold
"There’s something disturbing about recalling a warm memory and feeling utterly cold."
This sums up Amy in a nutshell! She's mastered the act of the devoted, victimised wife to a tee, but she's not only playing Nick and the police like pawns, but the audience as well! 😮
The Vile Eye RUclips Channel has a better take on this movie than this channel does.
@@1bridge11 Lol no it doesn't. It says Desi only wanted to love Amy. What a croc.
@@bouncyshak And this vid justifies the actions of a psycho like Amy Dunne. That's the croc.
@@1bridge11 both have.
I love the character of Amy Dunn. To me, she's a villain in a story with no heroes. It's so rare to see a truly evil villain in a female character.
You summed up my thoughts perfectly. I never rooted for her as the title suggests, but I am fascinated by her. She's terrifying and I love that. Finally a villain that isn't patronizing to women. She's brutal, cold, and calculating. Amazing.
As a villain, Amy is one of the best in movie history. Gillian Flynn is an incredible writer.
"A villain in a story with no heroes." Read the book and watched the movie years ago, but never knew how to put it into words. They're all assholes. Brilliant.
Omg the “no heroes” thing is so true. The characters she screws over don’t necessarily deserve to be murdered or framed for murder, but they’re not innocent decent guys either. Everyone’s a scumbag
YES!
Amy: “I watched Adam Sandler movies.”
That, alone, is enough to drive anyone over the edge into insanity.
💀😂
I actually enjoy some of Adam Sandler's movies, especially his rom-coms with Drew Barrymore. I think they're cute. Silly and dumb, but cute. But i realize he's not everyone's taste and i can understand why.
STFU. Adam Sandler is a good person and actor.
fr I never understood his hype
@@ceterisparibus8966 chill kid
My favorite thing (by which I mean most frustrating and interesting thing) about Gone GIrl was the way the parents saw themselves as perfect, when they treated Amy as just as much of an artificial trophy as Nick did. Of course she would up with someone like that, because the dynamic was familiar to her. I'll always remember the way her father shamed Nick for bringing her--his beautiful daughter--to Nick's "ugly" home town. He felt so righteous, but his treatment of her wasn't any more personal or supportive, and he and his wife will surely never see that.
Not that the book needed that, but I would have been satisfied to see her parents get some deeper comeupance.
Finally someone said it about the parents who put the trophy level perfectionism in her.. thumbs up
@@ericdinesh63 I couldn't agree more! It's no wonder she felt like a trophy for everyone and that drove her bonkers.
I totally agree! Amy didn't really have much of a chance since she was taught that she was a commodity at a disgustingly young age. Her parents set up the pattern for her psyche, and they did deserve some sort of consequence. Maybe Amy won't let them see her baby...that would be a fitting punishment.
@@TheTam0613 No, she'll use the baby as leverage to force them into being the perfect parent/grandparents she wants.
@@TheTam0613 Trouble is, I don't see her ever interfering with her own image enough to distance herself from them on any real level. Pretense is all that Amy knows, it's all that Amy has. Her parents made a monster, and I don't think there's much chance of them ever seeing their own mistake. It helps I guess to remember that this book isn't about making me feel good or satisfied.
My favourite scene in the movie is when Amy spits in a girl's cup while she's not looking. It's such an immature move from an otherwise calculated character that it makes her villainy borderline cartoonish and I love it.
I like it, and that section with the couple, cause it shows that Amy is losing control over her situation, and she is scrambling to take it back, which is why she meets with Desi, as she decides to change her plans. She kinda realises she's not safe on her own and that it could go wrong for her which she doesn't want at all
?? I only read the book and man so many parts of the movie sound so wild. This wasn't in the book.
@@citrus_sweet yes it was! When she is in the cabin and Greta says something about Amy (they are watching Ellen Abbot), then Greta goes to the bathroom and Amy starts spitting in her food and drinks on the fridge.
@@MargaridaFerreira-mi3lw Oh oops lol my mistake 😅
Rosamund Pike was Jane in Pride and Prejudice, this woman's range is astonishing
omg, I've never noticed it!
That was the first role I saw her in and I loved her portrayal of Jane so much. The complete opposite of Amy lmao
I had only ever seen her in Doom, which isn't a movie that did much to flatter anyone in it. lol
When I saw Gone Girl, I was blown away. She made me truly, deeply hate her character, and for me that's a sign of a great actor.
Definitely, although I also think Jane and Amy Dunne come from the same place of delicate, white femininity. Jane is the kind of woman Amy Dunne is pretending to be: effortlessly beautiful, effortlessly kind, the perfect well-mannered wife. Rosamund Pike knew how to play that femininity and then twist it into menace
Yup. 💜
What made the story so interesting was that with her intelligence, Amy could've easily killed Nick and covered it up if she wanted to. However, her choice to instead punish Nick through public perception gives the whole movie another layer of depth that brings in gender dynamics to explore.
She could have killed Nick and Andie, and made it look like a double suicide.
@@sharonjensen3016I think she didn't care that much about Andie, Andie was an accessory. Amy was married to Nick and she knows that.
@@heloisaalmeida1243 eh, her reaction when she sees Andie on camera speaks volumes. She cared, she just wasn't Amy's target.
I think if it had been a husband getting revenge on a cheating wife by making it look like she was guilty of murder, people would just view him as evil without trying to justify his actions in any way. The only reason Amy is seen as "complex" rather than just evil is because of her gender.
@@greywolf7577but she’s not just evil. That’s a static way of viewing her character. There are factors that play into why she’s the way she is. Her parents created an ideal version of their daughter that caused psychological damage to their daughter because it was a version of perfection she could never be. They were too busy praising their fictional daughter, instead of nurturing their actual daughter. Everyone has always just wanted parts of her even Nick. Not saying she isn’t completely psychotic but it didn’t occur in a vacuum.
Amy Dunne is the female Joker, Rick Sanchez, Tyler Durden, Michael Corleone, Walter White. She’s morally complex, multifaceted, unpredictable and captivating, and you can’t help but empathise with/admire her while recoiling at the things she does, but more than that she has unique views and experiences that her male counterparts don’t have. Amy is relatable to women on a visceral level. She shares our insecurities, our fears, our frustrations, our pain and heartbreak, our rage. She’s authentically, emphatically female, and her femininity and sexuality shapes her story and character arc in a way that you can’t achieve with males. And good or bad, they’re all integral to the plot and feel completely organic.
In short, Amy Dunne is not a villain who happens to be female. She’s a FEMALE VILLAIN. All the qualities we love in a bad guy, but with a few things tailored and added so they fit a woman. She’s believable to the audience because of her gender, not in spite of it.
Awesome. Perfectly stated to point. cheers
Yessssaaaa! PREACH. Very well said.
I love the way you put it
can't agree with that, I dislike Amy and can't relate to her at all. Very unpleasant movie
100% agreed
I read the book Gone Girl and in the book it’s made clear the Amazing Amy book series is her parents’ thinly veiled way of shaming her for not living up to their expectations. I always wonder why she never lashes out at them
probably cuz of something to do with not wanting to ruin her image or something
@@monabohamad2242 you’re probably right
And because she could never satisfy them she fakes being the 'cool girl' to satisfy a man. Their marriage was doomed from the start.
Aren’t they already kinda old. I mean their probably one step away from the grave anyway so I don’t think she can get any satisfaction from torturing them. Plus I don’t think she cares about them anymore. Their probably just background noise to her.
That's a good question. She clearly resents them. Given the way she treats others who mistreat her, it really is a wonder that she never attacked her parents in the same way.
Whether you love or hate Amy, you can't deny she is a genius.
more a genius psychopath
She think she is, the movie is in her point of view. She got "one uped" by a trailer girl.
@@marcelo2169 because she likes to think she is the best in the world, but she still got robbed
@@valemedina4473 She was arrogant which is why she was robbed but, for the most part, she has the skills to back up her arrogance. She is exceptionally intelligent and accomplished, the fact that she is well aware of it and perfectly confident only makes her more compelling.
@@Chris-rg6nm I think you’re underestimating the sheer amount of cunning and savvy it takes to fake your own death in this day and age. And even if she isn’t as skilled as I think, she is certainly dedicated. And she is clearly academically intelligent and accomplished as well as having an obvious talent with language shown in her vocabulary and ability to convincingly write a series of fictitious events. So, no, I’m afraid you’re mistaken.
"The idea that a woman's character can't or shouldn’t be evil is sexist in itself."
I love this comment
cuz their motives are shallow and simple minded born from jealousy
@@stanleyshady9465, go touch some grass
@@stanleyshady9465 so..villains???
@@stanleyshady9465 uh wtf are you even referring to?
I know that we’re talking about the movie here, but it’s also worth noting that in the book when we are in Nick’s perspective he frequently calls women that he had ANY disagreements with or that inconvenience him in any way a ‘bitch’. Yet in the Goodread’s comments on the book Nick is seen as the ‘normal, average guy’. Him casually using the word bitch shows us how little he actually cares about women.
I know men who do that too. It always rubs me the wrong way
While i do agree that Nick was a horrible person, I'm not sure if he deserved death and prison for it . Nick did bad things like cheating and not working on their marriage yes, but Amy wanted to Kill Nick, which I feel is another level of a crime, and I'm not sure if it is the punishment he deserved for cheating on someone. Imagine if the genders were reversed and Nick wanted to kill Amy for cheating on him. I feel that the society would view that differently. However that is just my opinion and I totally understand if you disagree with it. :)
That doesn’t mean he doesn’t care about women .
I don't know if putting it as the normal average guy Is him being misoginist or just aknowleging how common it Is that attitude.
@@theresaegan3129 can’t tell you how often I hear this attitude in daily life. I also note that I don’t hear people whine about guys disagreeing with them. Hopefully it gets better as time passes
I think the most interesting part of Gone Girl, is the fact that most women on the planet, has at some point had dark energy that they’ve been forced to push down. Relating to never being allowed to be “angry” cause it’s not feminine or likable. Like there’s no woman in the world who won’t find some part, even the smallest part somewhat relatable in “Gone Girl”.
I am woman and I don't find any part relatable in "gone girl". I depise people like Amy who put on a fake facade and resent you when you don't want to play along with their lie. The most dark energy I ever had to push down, was the urge to slap in the face girls like her in high school.
@@mievaselli7910 this response is so indicative that you're still playing cool and acceptable to the public at large and also that you did not understand what gone girl was about, like, at all. amy isn't a high school mean girl lol. you sound like a pick me.
@@wyattnicks2283 Gone Girl was about a psychopath unable of love or genuine human conexion who can't even tell the difference between a pretend good relationship and a real one. She crafts a fake persona because that's the only way she knows how to interact whit others. Still playing this game takes a lot of emotional labor and she grow weary of it.
She thinks her husband owes her to play his role as well as she plays hers in the perfect couple theater piece she has written in her head. When he fails to do so she gets mad and blames him for her decision to put so much effort in her fake persona in the first place.
What you took away from my comment is that I am faking a cool girl persona? Do you believe that every woman goes through a phase of being fake and that I am pretending not to relate with a psycho because I haven't grown out of it?
I am autistic and "Playing cool and acceptable" is not something I am able or willing to do. For most of my childhood I was just obtuse undestand what role I was meant to play, society's messaging when right over my head. When I was able to get a grasp on it, I decided it wan't woth the effort. So I can't relate to people who choose to play a role that make them miserable. I have however met such people who dislked me because I didnt play the role they had in mind for me.
But sure tell, yourself I'm a "pick me girl" because my life expercience is different from yours.
@@mievaselli7910 thank you this was awesome
No, there totally is. That woman is a total psycho. So twisted and wrong.
She was the first female character that I felt paralelled the toxic masculine characters like Tyler Durden, but for women and I've loved that
So don’t be upset when men enjoy toxic masculinity. If you don’t like toxicity, you don’t like it AT ALL.
No wonder they are directed by the same person
@@fadethechannel There is a difference between enjoying it for the spectacle & trying to emulate it. I enjoy watching a toxic woman because it's not really something that's explored very often. I don't want to be her but I like watching it.
When you start taking on those traits because it's something that's shown to be "normal" though, then it gets problematic pretty quickly.
@@tazhienunurbusinezz1703 I am a fan of the complex female character and I was so intrigued by the way Amy was portrayed and the gone girl scene was the cherry on the top. I completely agree with you that toxic woman is not portrayed enough especially someone so morally grey and actually gets to win at the end. People want to like her even tho we know what she is doing is wrong because like you said it's not about emulating Amy's action but watching this amazing piece of art slowly unfolding and its a wonderful spectacle.
so when guys idolize tyler durden that is presumably problematic for you, but if women do it to Amy then it's good. got it.
“Amy’s rage doesn’t have to be empowering to feel cathartic.” That is such a great distinction. Like no, I don’t think Amy’s is any kind of anti-hero and Nick definitely didn’t deserve to be framed for murder, but f*ck I was kinda of rooting for her to get away with it sometimes.
So if a woman cheated on a man and he did horrible things to her, would you be rooting for him?
@@greywolf7577 Honestly though, everyone would be rooting for him. There’s probably already dozens of male Amy Dunes out there real or fictional.
@@greywolf7577 Also, what about you? Would you root for him?
@@greywolf7577 Yes, I would root for him too. The revenge on a superficial person makes Amy's revenge great and relatable, not her gender.
@@namkia205 Maybe you would, but I think most people would be horrified at the idea of a man trying to get his wife executed even if she did cheat. It's just that people, especially many women, tend to take more negative views of men who do bad things and be less forgiving than they are toward women who do bad things. The correct moral view is that cheating does not make it okay to try to execute that person. Yet too many people, especially other women, are willing to at least fantasize about the idea of killing a man who cheated. I worry that too many of them would actually cheer on a woman who did something like Amy did in the movie.
I don’t care, Gone girl had the best “cool girl” monologue.
I love that scene so much, brings me chills.
The Cool Girl monologue is a classic. They'll be studying that one in film classes forever.
I strongly concur! Amy breaks down the entire concept that women have to change themselves to be whatever appeals to their significant other, while also shaming men into not doing the same. However, it's far more complex than it appears.
@@trinaq I like the monologue too but yeah, I kind of feel like a lot of it is her own fault. Nobody asked her to be the cool girl. She pretended to be someone she wasn't in order to stay with a guy she didn't really seem to like because she found it easier than being her true self. That doesn't really fall on Nick. And it's not medieval times where she has to put up an act either.
I just *disagree.*
Nobody forces people to falsify their identity.
I don't. Plenty of people don't.
If she married a man whom she knew could only love a falsified version of herself then the bad marriage was inevitable and she is absolutely complicit in that.
And a murderer.
But I'm glad the film did something for you that hopefully can be channeled in a positive way.
Amy is definitely a psychopath. The reason we sometimes root for her is that we have often seen a Nick behaviour in our husbands, boyfriends,fathers, uncles, brothers and other male relatives. The movie makes us remember that suppressed anger. And seeing Nick get his due makes us feel satisfied.
It is probably one of the most cynical movies we will ever see on marriage.
Who's the "us"?
@@monabohamad2242 the people who liked the comment. Including moi
Amy is a great villain, but I never found myself rooting for her, quite the contrary - I wanted her arrested. Her scheme imo wasn't clever enough for her to totally get away with.
@@kimvanfelton3413 she framed a man for rape, another for murder and then brutally killed another. The fact that women see her as a hero speaks of toxic feminism
@@adamcraig1468 I don't think most women see her as a hero(ine), but a lot can sympathize with her rage. Just like some men look up to Tyler Durden, which is also very toxic.
I think people sometimes don't realize that you can admire a character without overlooking their flaws and justifying their (horrifying terrible evil) mistakes. The movie is feminist in the way that portrays a woman not as an object of a man but as their own protagonist with her machiavellian mind and as a complex human being with different levels of emotions. BUT Amy is not a feminist icon, she's a villain in a movie without heroes (like someone in the comments said I love that comment bcs is the perfect explanation).
I like her as a character and she got me to reevaluate a lot of things about myself (which I'd great cinema), why I tried so hard to please some people when that wasn't giving me any satisfaction.
But they do love it when it’s a male character, like the joker. Just saying.
Well yeah women can be evil and twisted too, it’s not just men.
@@deliac2187 yes and that's a huge red flag for me unless the person explain what they admire about him
I think it really depends on the setting and the victims. That's why we root for Tony Montana, but not for Ted Bundy. And that's why we root for The Bride, but not for Amy. The more realistic the setting and the character the more we realize how outside of society's norm his deeds are.
@@toro5280 I agree compleatly. The imediacy you get to Nick and the other people who’s lives she is affecting also play a huge roll.
Great video, but I wish you hadn't glossed over the character of Desi (Neil Patrick Harris) and how he treated Amy. Amy didn't "throw him away when he was no longer useful." She decides to kill Desi after he starts treating her like an object and fantasy again. Even though he believes she has just escaped a horrific, abusive marriage, he immediately tells her to dye her hair, dress in sexy clothing, and get back in shape, so she can be the beautiful, flawless version of Amy that he's been obsessing over for years. He expects her to sleep with him and run away with him after only a day of recuperation. In the same way that Nick demanded her to be "Cool Girl," Desi demands her to be "Sophisticated Sexpot." Desi also disparages Nick for his abuse, but doesn't recognize that he himself abused Amy by stalking her and threatening to commit suicide if she left him.
In the end, Amy sacrifices the abusive relationship where she holds no power (Desi) to return to the abusive relationship where she knows she holds all the power (Nick). Nick's victimhood at the end of the movie is clear to everyone, but most people overlook that Amy is still a victim. She chose the least miserable option she had left -- which also happened to be the one where she gives Nick everything he wanted (the housewife and family in his hometown). It says everything about the role women are forced to play in society.
Thank you so much for this great insight! I was never able to quite wrap my head around why Amy killed Desi but you put it into words perfectly.
Yeah, cause she was planning on unaliving herself as part of her plan, but when desi found her and expected her to be his doll again, she changed her mind and decided to go back
That’s a really good point and also adds to why we feel empathy towards Amy, because we subconsciously recognize threatening actions in her victims, first time I saw the movie I couldn’t quite put it into words but something was very off about Desi and I didn’t feel sorry for him when Amy killed him, I realize it’s because of how he tried to get her to fit into his fantasy and relished on the power imbalance that was created.
What exactly is so terrible about her that she needs so many masks to cover it up? Why can't she just be herself? I'll tell you the answer. It's because deep-down, she knows that she's just a materialistic animal, motivated by base desires. You can even tell. "I need to be punished, and by punished, I mean had." How much more of a masochistic pig can you get? "I torture innocent men for fun, just because I don't like them." Yes. Poisonous little weed pretending to be an innocent little flower. It's no wonder she covers up.
That’s great insight but I mean, the best option would be to get a divorce (which Nick wanted) - they’re both victims but they will continue being victims if they stay with each other, and Amy doesn’t even allow them to not be together
This is exactly why I recently ended a 12 year relationship. I felt like I was turning into someone I'm not, and I felt horrified and disgusted because of it. I really needed this video, thank you very much. I was able to cry what I couldn't before.
It's hard to leave a 12 year relationship. But you saw yourself becoming someone you didn't want to be, or you weren't that person, and you left. I think that's pretty great. You chose your relationship with your own self over your romantic relationship. More people would be much happier if they could do this and prioritize their own inner truth.
You have a new path ahead. I pray that you have the strength to start walking. Eventually you'll start to notice again the flowers on your way. Enjoy your "self-path". It's scaring and extremely rewarding. I ended a three-year marriage (9 years together) almost two years ago. I'm in love with myself like I've never been before. ❤️
I left a 23 year relationship. I was 13 he was 16 I stayed for 23 years. I lost myself my friends and everything because I faked the happiness. But after my daughter was getting older I couldn't let her think that was an ok or normal relationship. It would have allowed her to think women are property and don't have a choice. So I understand and give you credit for leaving, it's hard, unbelievably hard.
@@JennaBomb You are incredibly brave!!
@@TheTam0613 Thank you! We have 2 kids together. Our son wanted nothing to do with him because he was older. It was the hardest thing I've ever done because I was literally afraid every day...I commented before I was checking my brake lines n tires n everything before I'd drive always looking in the rear view n hoping it wasn't him. Met someone great and he wouldn't stop stalking us so it obviously drove that man away. I can't blame him because my ex was going by his house daily and would send threats through fb messenger n texts just any way he could. It was horrible and the worst part besides my kids, I completely lost myself, I didn't know me anymore. Going out to places always checking if he was there, going to bars or restaurants etc and actually having to find out who I was again was weird. I had fun for the first time in 23 years and I started to realize that who I was before him would never be the type to back down or be afraid of anyone. I spent the holidays and birthdays alone. I wasn't allowed to go out so my friends slowly started to disappear, all except 1. She and I grew up together and she had gone through everything I did and much more unfortunately. Having her as my rock, my reminder that yes I wasn't property helped me figure out that I could breathe again. I could make decisions for myself and having fun didn't make me a bad mom or person. I'm sorry for the long response. You just don't realize how bad it was until you leave, and learn, that life isn't supposed to be living the way someone else expects you to. It brought me so much closer to my kids and friends and for that, I'm forever grateful!
It’s quite annoying when a writer makes something and people say you’ve mischaracterized women or men, or this shows that women can be xyz, which is negative. If you want to see something where there is no conflict and men and women are painted in a perfect light watch the Brady Bunch
facts, people are allowed to show bad traits in characters because that’s just how people are. every person has flaws, and whether you like it or not, there are bad women in this world. portraying them isn’t “anti feminist”, it’s realistic
Lol yes!!!!
Or hallmark movies
I write and it’s way more interesting to have toxic characters. They do things they go through stuff. If the character is happy there is no conflict.
@@SarifaXionic I'm saying!!!! AGREED. I think with woman characters and minority characters especially, whenever they are painted in a bad light people say "well you painting a character this way shows..." or "you saying this about a character shows..." and its frustrating because it says that these types of characters have to be perfect for them to be deserving of empathy or love or etc from an audience. It also shows that people think one character a minority character or a woman character or whatever is a representation of all people in the same category, if (in this case) a woman acts crazy that must mean all woman are crazy, so its a representation of women as a whole. In the case of when people say the author shouldn't have characterized the main character that way because it shows women are nuts, I think no, that's lazy thinking, the author painting the main character that way shows that the main character may be nuts.
There's still a lot of places where people think it's acceptable for a man to kill his wife if he finds out she's cheating on him. Think about that
Indeed.. musogyny has yet to be wiped out.
And he probably cheated on her first and/or has probably been an Abusive POS anyways
@@Nicole-ti3we that’s not true.
@Will Diesel To be fair, the "I" and "U" keys are really close together on the keyboard.
Couldnt have said it better myself.
No one is talking about this enough: HER PARENTS created a psychopath, when creating an alternate version of THEIR REAL DAUGHTER, that would accomplished everything that she would never do, because of this thing called being human. From the perspective of a movie fan, I appreciate providing a female character, a female villain, with such a complexity and depth.
As a human being: such a couple of assholes should NEVER have kids. The damage they do for a new born is sometimes irreversible. It's like a cautionary tale for those people who think their kids are their property and they can mess up with them like little projects.
Most underrated comment
Psychopaths are born that way sociopaths are made
"They f*&k you up, your mum and dad/They may not mean to, but they do" (Philip Larkin's "This Be The Verse").
No, someone can be predisposed genetically to psychopathy, it can still take a trigger.
They are narcissists, that’s for sure. It’s sickening what they do to their children.
Ben Affleck is perfect for this role, because he cheated on his wife with a producer, and then he blame her for being an harpy, and most of Hollywood agree with him at the time, calling her controlling and bitchy, but then when it was discover that Affleck used the private jet of his friend to travel to his mistress to Las Vegas, and they discover her identity, all the facade of a wounded husband fall off, in other words, Affleck is not acting in this role, he is being himself.
I've always hated him hahaha
also shows how un-self aware he is that he could play a character in a movie that showcases how shitty people act and then do the same thing 😂 but I guess people like that don’t cafe
I hate him lol
maybe you should express yourself more respectful
That's what I call perfect casting 🤣🤣
"finding catharsis without empowering it" is exactly how I feel about Midsommar's ending as well when Dani smiles as her emotionally absent, gaslighting boyfriend is sacrificed by the cult. Please do a video essay on that movie too!
I believe they already did, some time ago
Oh got spoiled
@Christopher Reynolds uh seems to me like BOTH YOU AND
the second last commenter here
are full of BS
Yeah! Not something I condone or could do, but damn if it doesn't feel just.
@Christopher Reynolds you know Midsommar is a fictional movie and no one was actually murdered, right?
Amy is by far my favourite female villain, she's brilliant.
Also worth noticing is the fact that the male version of the psycho-mastermind like Anthony Hopkins's Hannibal Lecter, and Heath Ledger and Joaquin Phoenix's Jokers always win big at the Oscars, yet their female counterparts like Glenn Close in Fatal Attraction, Rosamund Pike in Gone Girl, and Carey Mulligan in Promising Young Woman are always left in just the nominations even when the roles are equally challenging.
Why we cheer on something we would otherwise condone
With all due respect of the winners against both of them, Pike and Carey should've won for each of their awards. It's incredible that they both went from playing the Bennet sister in Pride and Prejudice to a psycho-mastermind characters and pulled off brilliantly. A day and night role
She isn't Tyler Durden. Tyler represents chaos, when she represents control. Of all cinematic villains she 's most similar to is Hannibal Lecter.
The way that Fincher pulled a yin yang with the ultramasculine-ultrafeminine chaos-control concept for his villianous main characters is kinda cool
You don't think Tyler represents control with how he indoctrinated an entire workforce? Project Mayhem?
@@downsjmmyjones101 he didn't indocrinate noone,
"You wanna make a omlet,you gotta break some eggs".
@@fellowgoyimwhite7630 You don't think Project Mayhem involved indoctrination? Do you remember the first rule of Project Mayhem?
@@downsjmmyjones101 what do you mean Exactly "Indocrination" ? Because the 1st and the 2nd rules were created to be broken.
Reverse Psychology.
She is absolutely terrifying and I love her for that, absolutely relatable. Both the book and the movie version.
I agree, you can't help but feel awful for Amy, in spite of her twisted nature, since her parents blatantly preferred their fictional book daughter to their real one, and she never felt like anyone, even her own husband, knew who she really was.💔
@@trinaq feel like its one of the reason why she is so interesting and relatable to a woman especially because they can relate to fractions of her story. Of course, the planning, killing and the manipulation is overly dramatised but at a simplistic level, she is a victim of a patriarchal society.
@Mark Hays If you switch her to a guy wouldn't be seen as more normal since we have seen alot of media representation of man like that ?
And maybe she is so intriguing because we rarely see woman be so evil and calculating.
How is a spiteful, envious, self-obsessed, hateful, manipulative, pathological liar, conceited, delusional, narcissistic sociopath "relatable"? No part of me relates to Amy and I don't at any point "feel awful for her". She is descpicable.
Nick 100% abused Amy emotionally and financially, neglected her. Completely drained her. You can empathize with Amy because she was wronged in the first place. She got back at her abuser and won. That’s why it’s so twisted and you still love her
I love Amy’s character because she shows us that we’re all wearing masks with certain restrictions. She’s selfish enough to do what most people only fantasize about. I think we only caught a glimpse of the real Amy.
That's the point... There is no "real" Amy, she's only a bunch of masks she created to fit in and when it all went to shit she used the same strategy to get her revenge.. more lying.
@@sarroumarbeu6810 I like the theme of masks with both Amy and nick, cause they both admit to being characterisations of what other people would like, to seem relatable to them
Yes, I often fantasize about framing my wife of my murder, framing an ex-girlfriend of rape, and murdering/accusing of rape one of my other ex-girlfriends.
The same way men root for Joker, and many other villians...but cry if women root for Amy Dunn
Please seek help.
@@oc7759 no u
Tbh we shouldn't try to emulate either Amy or Joker, but they are delightful to watch on screen
False equivalence, there. Those two are nothing alike. The Joker was innocent and sweet and turned evil. Amy was a liar from the beginning. People need to be more aware of the distinctions between things. You don't get to compare Amy to the Joker. That's insulting nonsense.
nobody roots for the joker btw, but people respect his situation. you seriously root for amy?
omg you articulated why I love her: her revenge is against a culturally-endorsed man child
@Christopher Reynolds no it's an exaggerated fantasy of punishment/opposal of the manchild.
@@samyuktha. nobody likes a man child, but she framed a man for murder, another for rape and another she violently killed. This is the most toxic depiction of a woman for long time
@@adamcraig1468 no one is saying a manchild warrants for that punishment. it's just a very exaggerated scenario where a manchild does get a punishment. no one is saying this should be implemented or that Amy is right. but we can understand and see a part of us in WHERE that anger (to do all those things) came from.
@@adamcraig1468 Spot on!
@@samyuktha. Very well stated!
She’s so iconic. She’s both a feminist and misogynist. A privileged Karen but is fun to watch. Great video!
I guess I can see why you might call her a feminist, I just don't think it pans out. She accurately sees the societal narratives and imbalances that might lead someone to feminism, but she only uses them for her own immediate interest--She doesn't actually advocate for equality. I know this might meld with the average anti-feminists conception of feminism, but I don't think that conception has ever been accurate or useful.
edit: For the record, I'm not claiming that she's *anti-feminist*, just that she's not actually feminist. There's this whole space in between.
I do wonder how she would be viewed by her audience if she was portrayed by non white actress.
Should be interesting to see how people's underlying prejudice impact the narrative of whole story.
while i do respect where you're coming from, i'm not sure if Amy Dunne is someone to take inspiration from. Personally I feel like considering Amy dunne to be a voice for strong women is like fanboys considering joker to be a voice for men, it's just stupid. Amy dunne is without a doubt an extremely interesting character, and I'm glad we have such complex female villains, but i don't think amy dunne is someone to be inspired by, in the same way how the joker isn't a charcter that men should be inspired by, just because society was cruel to him.
Arun Munagala I don’t think Amy is inspiring or aspirational, but more of a fun and fascinating character to watch. I hope no one is looking to her for life tips lol
yuki, who loves Emilia. Yeah this is an interesting question. I think a lot of the plausibility of Amy getting away with what she did was the presumption of innocence and victim hood placed on White women (the video calls this out) and Amy takes advantage of that. A non white woman wouldn’t get the same assumptions
one of the most interesting points about gone girl is that Amy didn't stalker Andy (Nick's mistress). Her revenge was after Nick
And I love that. Nick is the one that used and betrayed her.
@@damieo8139Jack Kammer would disagree !
IFF she had divorced Nick, would she have gotten everything that he took from her back? All her money from her trust fund, all the energy she put into this relationship, all the emotional attachment, her life in the city, years of her time spent in this relationship?
Amy dunne WAS psycho and doing what she did was fucked up, but the basic truth behind her rage is totally valid. To be used up and then thrown away as though you were nothing but an object meant to serve some selfish moron is a kind of pain that is hard to find relief from.
She is a psychopath. She was intent on using him. When it turned out he was alsu using her she got pissed and tried to kill him. So relatable...... FFS.
Yeah I mean it shouldn't be difficult to grasp. She was loving, intelligent, beyond supportive, a model spouse in every way, yet she basically got discarded in the middle of her marriage by a 'partner' who never bothered to not only work on whatever went wrong (supposedly) from his POV but to even talk to her about it, like... *ever*. But obv he's immediately excused, almost as if he couldn't possibly be aware of the damage he's doing to her, while she is ThE dEviL.
I think Amy is a villain - but I love me a good revenge plot; they are so satisfying. I think the perfect part of her revenge wasn't even framing him. the perfect part was how she trapped him in his "perfect" life with her. It's kind of like the Monkey's paw.
At one point or another all straight women go through this pain. And that's comforting at least. To know we're not alone.
@@annaeverette8960 How do we know she was loving? Isn't the point that we have her version of events which isn't reliable? She might have been wronged but to a large degree she was the author of her own misfortune and the action she took to avenge herself was ridiculously out of proportion to what was done to her.
Because Rosamund Pike is inextricably linked with Gone Girl, many don’t know that she has some serious range. Absolutely brilliant in A Private War.
I think Gone Girl shows her range! There's the 1st, idealized version of Amy we see, through the lens of her diary. Then, there's the reveal of scary/revenge Amy. Then she plays the part of 'Nancy', gaining weight and a southern accent. Then, there's Desi's dream girl version of Amy she plays, in order to stage her comeback. Girl played like 4 roles in one.
And invents nuclear bomb
@@umchinagirard1800 haha! Radioactive was my pick for most underrated film of this year.
@@laurend9829 all great points! It’s worth noting that Charlize Theron and Natalie Portman were among the MANY who sought after the role. Still, I doubt any could have played it better than Rosamund Pike.
And also in Pride and Prejudice (2005)
I would really love it if women in media could simply be human more often. It's either "girly girl", "crazy girl", "cool girl", "the tomboy", "gold digger", "smart girl", "mean girl", "business women", "picke me girl", "strong girl", "house wife", or any box the writers decided to take a female character from. I think that's what we so love about seeing Beth Harmon from The Queen's Gambit on screen. She was just a complex human being. She was strong, yet vulnerable, cared for people but was lonely, never let other people (especially men) stop her from her goals and ambitions, yet wore feminine fashion. She doesn't fit a stereotype. Yes she's a drug addicted genius, but she is also much more than that.
It's honestly really sad that characters are women first, human second in most cases.
yeah even more sad when there's women characters people say it's "forced diversity" or has an "agenda" like half of the world's population is women there's a side of humanity that should be explored in a more complex way
A lot of men don’t really see men as human beings either, so it just bleeds through our media
There are reductive tropes for men as well, many with videos from this pair, like 'nice guy', 'himbo', 'bad boy, 'simp' etc. etc.
A lot of male writers write two dimensional female characters and there is a shortage of complex female characters in films but less so in TV and there's no shortage at all in literature.
That lack of complexity in film mirrors the lack of conplexity in life. When you get right down to it, how many people are really unique and special individuals that are so unique and special and unlike anything the universe has ever seen? Most people are lemmings that copy eachother. It would be nice if people were actually as multifaceted and complex as they are in films and novels but the deeper you look inside their souls, the more you realize, nothing is there. It's disgusting how little depth most of them actually have. I would prefer a stereotypical hero to what your average little modern lying whelp has become. When people talk about "humanity" and "complexity", it's almost always a codeword for pathological selfishness and parasitic emotional neuroticism. This is what most people mean when they say: they don't see enough "humanity" in film. It means they don't see their selfish little pea-brained, pathetic, troglodyte-selves, in any of the heroes that they see, in films. And that's a wonderful thing. I don't want film-characters to be more "human" if they're just going to be what humans are now. What humans are now are a pack of indecisive rats with parasitic personality disorders. They destroy, and decay, all they touch. They're ugly to every god's eye. They have no values, and only care about money. And all of them think they have the depth of a universe, or an ocean. They're nothing. And they raise the iron rod to the weak, and then swing. I'm glad you don't see these little wretches often in great legends, and film. They don't deserve much, and never will.
@@_Sakidora_
True. But not only are these tropes often perpetuated by MEN themselves - But also, unlike women, these image constraints DO NOT hurt men the same way that vile, sexist tropes hurt women in the wider society
I read the book twice and I came to the conclusion that while I don't agree with her actions, her way of viewing the world is pretty damn accurate and that's what I truly love about her, the whole monologue on how many idealize women is incredibly powerful and real.
10:20 reminds me of the song obsessed
I've always found it funny how a "bad version" of any person belonging to a marginalised group, will always be under more scrutiny than those who are not.
A bad woman is anti-feminist, even if she is well written, but that is never said about a bad man.
The Joker's character isn't seen as anti-men, he's just an insane product of society.
Amy can't be seen as JUST an insane product of society, no, she's also a bad representation of women, perpetuating negative stereotypes, anti-feminist etc.
It's a double standard which I have suppressed rage for.
How is the Joker's character not a bad representation of men? How does the Joker not "perpetuate negative stereotypes," if Amy Dunne does? It sounds like you just started from the presupposition that there's a double standard and then reverse-engineered some justification for it. The Joker is a literal manchild. He lives with his mom and he's like 40 years old. He's pathetic in every way that feminists love to mock. At the end, he unleashes his impotent rage against the world like some kind of repressed school shooter. And lo and behold, when the movie was successful and men reveled in vicariously living through the character, feminist media predictably published psychoanalytical hit pieces against an entire generation, calling the whole thing a "male power fantasy." Not merely critiquing it for perpetuating negative stereotypes, but actually reviewing the film as if it was nonfiction - a kind of microcosm for real masculinity in the real world. Both of these are fabulous movies, but that doesn't stop people from using their influence for their own rhetorical purposes.
@@ToxicallyMasculinelol I think she's trying to say that people don't start denying the actions of bad men when a character like joker suddenly appears. But when any evil female character appears, people, especially feminists start losing their shit. That's what I got from her comment.
@@masterdevoe2519 Also that the moment a bad character is a woman it's because of some kind of agenda and not just because women are human beings too.
@@ToxicallyMasculinelolagreed.
@@lexa2310reminds me of Claudia Pacheco An analysis of female psychopathology
Too many people are forgetting Amy is a psychopath with or without Nick. That's what makes her great. He didn't drive her to it, he was just the biggest push.
Yes, and Nick is who he is without Amy as well.
Yes, some seem to forget that Nick is not her first victim
ALELUIA! Kinda losing my mind here with the comments sympathizing with Amy
@@JoseFerreira-jq2cd I kind of sympathize with her but also with Nick. He could've gotten the death penalty and now is stuck with her.
In the book, he takes some of the responsibility for "unleashing" her. He says if she had married 1,000 other guys she never would have gone this far. I think it's one of the reasons he stays with her.
It's not politically correct but I liked Amy because she let herself rage out on a man who hurt her. Men always say they aren't allowed to cry, but women aren't allowed to be angry which is why the worst tropes for women involve women being pissed off ( angry black woman, karen, man hating feminists, mean girl,crazy ex girlfriend etc) No woman wants to be labeled bitter and angry even if it's justifiable but women are socialized to put others needs before our own and when men treat us like crap we're expected to take it on the chin or nurture the shitty behavior out of them.
Amy refused to just take it or drag Nicks dumb ass to couples therapy lol Women are tired of taking responsibility for the way men treat us, no matter what background or race you are.
All I have to say is yes, Yes, YES!!!
I think you pointed out a really interesting duality. I remember in another video by the Take, they even mentioned how women are expected to be sad and men angry. It’s interesting to see it’s somewhat normalized to see an angry man or sad woman, but when a man shows sadness, he’s seen as weak, and when a woman shows anger, she’s seen as crazy.
Gender norms just end up hurting everyone. No one comes out of them better.
Say it louder for the people in the back
I was "a lady" when my marriage has reached its end. And I regret it deeply. Despite the endless conversations we had for almost two years, my ex never seemed to understand how it all ended like that because I was never angry. So, in my opinion, rage is not only a feeling suppressed by most of women, but perhaps the only "language" that men understand. Otherwise, we women become the naggy boring wife. Until it's all over and men just can't say how and why it's over. 🤷🏻
Yes very true 👏👏👏
she would have been a PERFECT SPY.
This comment 💋💅
Her being a bond girl was her major hollywood break and she was a double agent there lmao!
totally!!
She literally got tricked and robbed less then 2 days after making her escape plan.
@@masterDarts4188 because she's never seen the actual world out there. She was always in her rich protected bubble or never interacted with much of other people.
You become a spy through training and damn, she's one hell of a manipulator.
I think the real tragedy about Amy Dunne is that she would rather settle with a humble guy than use all her privileges/merits for a partner that is on equal foot stance, despite all her wits, intelligence and beauty.
I think, in a way, she did it because she really needed to feel superior in her relationship. She couldn't bear the thought to be outsmarted or outperformed by her partner since she was already outperformed all the time by her alter ego "Amazing Amy". No, she wanted the sweet, humble, boyish man whose transformation into a successful, reasonable adult she later could take credit for. Like she pointed out in the "cool girl"- monologue, she was willing to play her role as long as he was willing to play his. Then, to her dismay, she found out that he 1. didn't even understand she put up an act for him and 2. didn't even see the necessity to step up his game for her and instead just dropped the act entirely and didn't feel like he still has to be invested once they were married.
In the book, it was made clear that BOTH Amy and Nick were terrible, despicable people who throughly deserved each other. In the movie, Nick is made slightly more sympathetic, and you can understand why he continues to be married to a sociopath in order to protect his unborn child.
While i do agree that Nick was a horrible person, I'm not sure if he deserved death and prison for it . Nick did bad things like cheating and not working on their marriage yes, but Amy wanted to Kill Nick, which I feel is another level of a crime, and I'm not sure if it is the punishment he deserved for cheating on someone. Imagine if the genders were reversed and Nick wanted to kill Amy for cheating on him. I feel that the society would view that differently. However that is just my opinion and I totally understand if you disagree with it. :)
@@arunmunagala8333 You are a very agreeable person. I really like that you end you're comments with basically "we all can get along even with differing opinions". I rarely see that on any social media platforms. Thanks for being kind!
@@arunmunagala8333 no I don't think that he deserves death either but you have to admit, Amy's an evil genius and incredibly smart. It was fun watching her carry out her plan with such perfection
Yup. In the book they deserve each other because they *choose* each other. Just as she chooses to stay with him, knowing he's faking, he chooses to stay because he'd rather be fake but rich, famous, and respected, than be free of her but be a disregarded, poor, low-level shlub.
@@TheTam0613 Thanks a lot for saying that! I think conversations would be much more productive if we were just polite and I totally felt that talking with you today. Hope you have a great day! :)
It’s true though, he wanted her to be the trophy the perfect wife but never even wanted to know the real her. That’s not to say that she was a victim because she didn’t try to solve the problem and jumped straight to revenge.
Precisely, it's made clear that Amy spent so long trying to preserve the image of Nick's "Cool Girl", that they never really got to know each other as people, as she kept her "True" self hidden all the while. 😓
I think it also applies to how her parents wanted this perfect vision of her "perfect Amy" so she also had to be something else for her parents. She was essentially a trophy for them. So maybe at the beginning she was opening up to Nick but then she realised he is exactly like parents.
That's not true. Nick never had a chance to "get to know the real Amy" because she was faking from the moment she met him and didn't start to show her true self until after they were married, and her "true self" is an absolutely horrifying person, in so far as Amy has any "true self" as her sense of personhood is totally fractured. Nor did she ever wish to "get to know the real Nick", but only treat him as a raw lump of dough to mold into the perfect husband for herself and can't deal with him when she finds out that he's not, in fact, that. Amy doesn't want to love Nick, but just control him, and when she is with Desi and begins comparing him, she admits that Nick never tried to control her, and it wasn't really that he didn't accept the real her, he just didn't LIKE the real her- but he never attempted to change her. Nor does Nick have any notion whatsoever that changing Amy is possible, whereas even at the end Amy still believes she can change Nick. training him like seal throwing little rewards his way for correct behavior and using fear to force him to be the perfect husband.
I find it interesting at the end of the movie that they stay together - I think despite himself nick is drawn to the true Amy. Even his sister says 'you want to stay with her'
@@NirvanaIsMyDrugg I find it interesting how little people actually care about Nick and only see him as a device in Amy's story. Nick stays with Amy because he was abandoned by his dad and his greatest fear is failing his child. Nick stays with Amy because he's terrified of what she'll do to his son, and Amy makes it clear that she understands this about him. He's being held hostage for the rest of his life, and it's all part of her plan.
And that is why Amy Dunne is one of the most brutal villains of all time. She said she's not going to get an abortion, which means she's going to give birth to a Nick's baby and then put a metaphorical gun to their head for the next 18 years to make him do what she wants.
Both Nick and Amy were in the wrong. Nick cheated on Amy and did the bare minimum in their marriage. Instead of solving their marital problems healthily, Amy went to the extremes. This is why they are perfect for each other. A lot of people didn't like the ending of the book and the movie but I thought it ended how it should have. These two horrible, narcissistic people got what they deserved in the end --- each other.
While i do agree that Nick was a horrible person, I'm not sure if he deserved death and prison for it . Nick did bad things like cheating and not working on their marriage yes, but Amy wanted to Kill Nick, which I feel is another level of a crime, and I'm not sure if it is the punishment he deserved for cheating on someone. Imagine if the genders were reversed and Nick wanted to kill Amy for cheating on him. I feel that the society would view that differently. However that is just my opinion and I totally understand if you disagree with it. :)
I don't think he was as bad as her, he was not brilliant, but not an evil person. Also, I will fight anyone who says Amy is a bitch, she's the best antiheroine ever and besides, we know already what kind of people don't like her.
🎯💯
Brilliantly put.
Nick is a cheat and a bad husband. Amy is a psychopathic murderer who preyed on Nick's angst over his father's abandonment by trapping him in a relationship and holding his future child hostage. Amy is the female equivalent of those men who slap their wives around and say they should know better to talk back to them except cranked to 13 on a scale of 10.
" he took & took from me til I no longer existed. That's murder. Let the punishment fit the crime" that quote within the " cool girl " dialogue is brilliant! smart how she wielded societies conceptions of a woman as a weapon.
yet he never took anything. She lied and lied and she never existed. From the begining she was never true to him. And then she complains about him cheating... When she was never true to him.
Imagine feminists justifying this. Reminds me Chinweizu anatomy of female power
She was no better than him. In fact, she was way worse.
Amy is definitely one of the most exciting characters in film in the past 20 years. I will never get tired rewatching this film! Rosamund Pike deserved an Oscar for this role🏆
I just realized Gone Girl is sorta a modern adaptation of the Greek tragedy Medea. A hero who has a woman at his side supported him no matter what, but the Jason/Nick disposed Medea/Amy for another woman which led the latter to commit great revenge on him. There were even Greek and Medieval writers who thought Medea is more in the right than Jason.
I'm betting people would be less sympathetic to a man who got horrific revenge on a cheating wife.
The great irony of this film is that when I found out that Nick didn't kill his wife, I somehow despised him more. The way he took her for granted. The way he treats not only his wife but all those around him. He actually goes from being the guy who was wrongly accused of a crime to being a nasty person in his own right. Don't get me wrong. Amy is far, far, far worse. No question. Nick is many things, a murderer isn't one of them. That said, this film does a good job of making Amy at least empathetic.
Amy like many other anti-heroes (Joe Goldberg and Walter White) deserves some kind of comeuppance for her actions. However, like the best cautionary tales, the bad guy actually wins.
ty ♥️
I like your comment. I would say she "won" living in a lie, sure it is what she wanted but we all know they will be miserable, just as Nick's sister predicts, and the worst, involving a inocent child in a messed up home.
What a fuckin Maniac. The lot of yous.
I dissagree. He isn’t the best person obviously but he isnt filth. He’s just a normal flawed human. She is a compleat psyco. I always felt that he must have started to see under her mask at somepoint and that it drove him away. I mean We know she has a track reccord with her framing her frind for being a stalker and all. She wanst just some woman pushed too far, she was always a psyco.
@@MissCaraMint She is over the top cruel. She goes to lengths that no one would go to in real life (I hope). She also faces no consequences for her villainy.
The best cautionary tales has the villain winning because of a broken society. Wolf of Wall Street's ending is another good example of this trope.
This video is awesome! Especially the part where she’s begging him, and she’s telling him that he’s turning her into a person she doesn’t want to be! She doesn’t want to nag she doesn’t want to yell she doesn’t want to bug him to do things properly… It just makes you feel like you’re their mother or something! I believe all this crap starts in the home when you’re young… Parents treat their daughters differently than they treat their sons. This is why women are “more mature“ than men! It’s all how they are raised. Amy’s monologue was everything! A lot of us women felt exactly what she was talking about. The fact that you could do everything for a guy, give him your body your soul and do everything for him and then his ass goes and cheats on you with some floozy!!
What bullshit. How about you be responsible for your own behavior instead of blaming others for "making" you turn into something.
It's especially ironic when your argument is that women are raised differently to be more mature yet you're blaming others for your own issues like a kid.
@@visassess8607 oh look a narcissist who deflects onto women how theyre remiss in their own roles because a woman dare say they don't want to be villified for nagging get are turned into playing substitute mother for men who can't fulfill their own roles, responsibilities and duty in the marriage
Yeah Nick definitely isn't a role model and shouldn't be excused for his behaviour. But framing him for your murder? Not quite justifiable. Cheating is a horrible, disgusting act. But it ain't a crime.
Not the replies intentionally missing the point 😂
@@adibakalimi9108 ahaha your loser women who can't get over being cheated on are using like bots, I see.
Rosamund should’ve won some sort of award. Amy was scary but I rooted for her at the same time!!
OOF! it's like the edgy joker fanboys but female.
@Laura Kay if you see nothing wrong with rooting for a psychopath I don’t know what to tell you.
how are you rooting for her? please just tell me how
I won't say I was rooting for her but I do empathise quite a bit...she is what I could never become but I have faced similar situations that end up pushing her towards that extreme.
I broke my feet today because I kicked my computer because someone commented that my videos are bad! I hate unjustified criticism. Please wish me a speedy recovery, dear anj
I agree, however this situation sort of reminds me of how angry people were when some guys said that they understood where the joker was coming from in the movie. I often feel like those who understand and sympathize with Amy's get very pissed when some people say they understand where the joker is coming from, which I think is a bit biased. However i do understand if you disagree.
Hope you have a great day! :)
@@arunmunagala8333 I don't think people who criticize the joker, would actually support Amy tho. As far as the movies are concerned, it's much harder to feel sympathy towards Amy than the joker too.
@@arunmunagala8333 I do not sympathise with Amy or The Joker, I empathise with both of them.. as in I understand where they are coming from even tho I don't see their actions as justified !
"pushing her towards the extreme" - she is a well-read wife beater, the abuser in an abusive relationship, and judging by how she'd framed and ruined an ex boyfriend and almost ruined (and ultimately murdered ) another I can say she was like this long before se ever met Nick. But the character is written so well that Amy manipulated YOU into feel sorry for her and hate Nick. Just like they always do "she provoked me", "she was asking for it", "I warned her, but she would not listen", "she did it to herself" etc.
She went too far, but, dare I say it, I kinda sorta understand her.
I agree, however this situation sort of reminds me of how angry people were when some guys said that they understood where the joker was coming from in the movie. I often feel like those who understand and sympathize with Amy's get very pissed when some people say they understand where the joker is coming from, which I think is a bit biased. However i do understand if you disagree.
Hope you have a great day! :)
I totally agree Cassie!
Same🤷🏻♀️
@@arunmunagala8333 I think there is a double standard there but you also have to factor in that there aren’t female serial killers/mass shooters going around claiming to be inspired by such movies. I feel like this movie is a good outlet for many women’s suppressed/disturbing revenge fantasies but when it come’s to men, it seems to be more triggering in the sense that they’re far more likely to actually play out the revenge fantasy that they’re watching. Does that make sense? Lol
She accused an inocent man of being a rapist and ruined his life(her ex even before meeting her husband), and she KILLED a man for her selfish reasons( the rich guy). Her husband only cheated on her. Hes a cheater and thats not ok, but shes a fucking pshycopatic evil sociopat
I watched Gone Girl with my current boyfriend years ago and by the the end of the film he was silent the whole ride home until we arrived at my house and he said “if I’ve ever been lazy, please correct me right away.”
It's sad that he thought that being lazy would justify you doing something horrible to him. I guarantee that if there was a movie about a man framing a lazy woman for murder, the first thought of women wouldn't be "I better not be lazy anymore". That's victim blaming.
@@greywolf7577how on earth was THAT your takeaway from the comment? 😂😂😂
Nick is all men that say "not all men".
Exactly! An annoying dudebro whos had everything handed to him
That makes no sense.
So the guy she dated in college was bad too? Cause she's had a a pattern since college.
haha
Thats so true.
Amy is definite proof that you can perfectly embody the traits of your man's dream girl, and being the loving partner, but he'll STILL cheat on you anyway. 😔💔
Obviously she didn't perfectly embody much of anything since it was all an act. She pretended to be what she deemed he wanted. it was never her, so the lack of genuineness could be a factor
Lol what? She wasn’t perfect though. We see by his talk with her ex’s she became a different person when they married and was overbearing.
She stopped being a cool girl for him when she couldn't put up with him being a failure. He needed someone else who could validate/overlook his lack of ambition, that's why he cheated. If it was me, I would just get a divorce, let him trash someone else's life...
@@tatioliveira8598 Yeah that would be the sane approach, but a divorce would not fit into what she demanded to be.
A failed marriage would just make her a part of all those other relationships that she hated.
She both resented the role that society expected of her and does everything with no moral limits to be the perfect version of it.
No she's proof to be who you are and not to build a relationship on just the idea ideal versions of each other.
the real victim in this story is the child
and amy's inner child herself
Omg yes!
@@aibileenadller3107 Yes, the Amy before she became this sick psychopath craving warmth she can't feel anymore.
She's a villain, but the writer is a hero--for creating a character that plays on our cultural stereotypes like a master. The book has a character that can really see the box people put her into and she works it. I hate the way so many characters pretend we aren't all dealing with these pressures.
Edit: I do wonder why she let him put her money into a bar. I do wonder why she's so strong in the film, but she chose away from herself in her move and money choices.
Edit2: I really didn't get the people who loved the Gone with the Wind woman, Scarlet. But I watched a really great film about how she's one of the first female character who drives a plot. Whatever we want to say about Amy Dunn, she runs the plot. The viewers are running to keep up the whole time.
Honestly thought of Scarlet as well. Never liked her, but yeah, she is a strong female lead.
@@ericellsworth985211:20 what is a man child? Reminds me of what Patrice o Neil says about female manipulation
Gillian Flynn is a fantastic writer. Love her or hate her, Amy is a fascinating character and I’m so happy she exists.
@@smartass0124 Don't get married. Better yet don't date women at all, problem solved.
@@smartass0124 Your comments are extremely tiring. We're talking about a fictional book and movie. A fictional character.
And honestly, men commit violence against women, even down to murder, quite frequently.
Please stop making ridiculous, and totally off topic remarks. We get it, you hate women and think men are the true victims in life. I'm sorry if you encountered some gendered trauma. But this is just a book & movie.
@@smartass0124then stop giving women reasons/a reason to
"hate men"
People will enjoy the dark morality of characters like Patrick bateman, Tyler Durden, Hannibal lector, and Walter White but think Amy Dunne is the most evil person in history, irredeemable from understanding :0 but I think her actions are fascinating
I think the way her actions are treated by the story is the most interesting. Durden dies as does Walter. Amy lives and also goes back to her old marriage. What does that say? Be crazy, get away with it?
Hannibal is in prison. Walter is dead. Amy gets to be a mother & free. The hate is that she faces no consequences for her actions. Accountability escapes women once again
@@realjcoop182 that's within the movie's setting. I'm talking about real life people reacting to the characters themselves. Amy Dunne is a bad person just like the rest of the characters I listed but I'm saying that real people idolize the other characters and only see her character as completely evil.
It's because men often place their warped hatred of women above everything
@@realjcoop182 But she got consequences, she never will be loved by a husband, since her own husband hates her. She will never get the attention and validation she craves so much.
I actually remember watching the video where the woman says "his only crime; not lavishing her with attention" and being like... girl no
Not far off. He cheated. That's about it. Lots of people cheat. The correct response is to either forgive them or leave them. It doesn't begin to justify what she did.
@@_Sakidora_ Right, but the point is, being emotionally neglectful and being an outright cheater are two entirely different ball games. Nothing could ever begin to justify what Amy does, but a cheating Nick has more reason to “deserve” it than just an emotionally un-invested Nick.
@@kiera6326 I wonder if you would still say that if the sexes were reversed.
@@_Sakidora_ Uh… yeah? That’s why I didn’t specify a cheating “husband” or cheating “wife.”
@@kiera6326 You were speaking of a cheating husband in this instance, hence my query whether you would speak in the same way if it was a husband who was punishing his cheating wife by being a psycho.
Oh, she's definitely a psychopath, no doubt about that. Why do I root for her? She's absolutely brilliant. Intelligent, determined, quick-witted. I root for her because she absolutely slayed Nick, always two steps ahead, baiting him like a little child throughout the movie. She deserved to win.
Imagine causing a death, betraying your husband in order to get him executed as a murderer, and also planning to kill yourself in the end to finish it all brilliantly, a win.
And what a winner she was, first encounter with a woman who's a predator, she was powerless and exposed and tried to crawl back to her husband to salvage whatever honour she had. Because she was penniless and severely discouraged at that point.
@@subutaynoyan5372 Crawling back to her husband? He called her. Penniless? She owns everything they have, he's the penniless one. As for mistakes she made, she got out of them better than she was before. At the end she got exactly what she wanted, a "cool" man to play house with her.
@@ДанилоЦвјетковић Though he could still work and all, he was in a desperate outcry, I kinda forgot that, true. He was apoligising through tellie. One of the reasons she came back was that
But the true one was because her master plan had failed quite astonishingly.
But then again, Nick kinda managed to reach out to her.
Nick's problem is that he is acutely aware of his marrige failing, but is not inclined to do anything about it. He just complains, bitches aboıut everything, because why bother?
Has a young girlfriend(Though got to admit, that girlfriend is E. Ratajkowski) but still manages to assume it's all because of his wife
But, would Amy let him go? She basically tricked him, pretended to be an easygoing person, thinking she's creating her own perfect marrige, than accused Nick for being financiall reckless, dispassionate and disinterested.
Nick just returned to his own town when his mother got sick, and they had financial problems, she could've left, could've admit Nick's not what she wants but that would be losing. Instead she makes this crazy, murderous, suicidal plan just to make a point.
@@ДанилоЦвјетковић i agree with this 100%
@@subutaynoyan5372 her master plan failed, but she still won in the end because of her cunning (it was evil, but this is fiction anyway) so idk. She won. He didn't.
"He became someone I did not agree to marry." That happens so often! Men are great partners as boyfriends, you fall in love, then you get married and they become lazy cheating assholes. I've heard many women say they wouldn't have married their husband if they knew what they would become.
She also started the relationship off as a lie she says it herself.
She tried to change him and was dissappointed that it didn’t stick. I really don’t feel sorry for here here. She created her own mess, and now she’s blaiming someone ells for not putting on the same kind of mask and playing pretend like she does. She is toxic.
@@MissCaraMint more like
a murderous,deluded,lying,
delusional:(seemingly sexist/mysoginistic/mysanthropic perhaps?): psychopath/sociopath
I'm not talking about the movie here, just quoting her line and applying it to the reality of many marriages. Marriages that start off as genuine, at least from the woman's part.
@@stefanycarrasco6245 actually,is the inverse,woman that are like that.
i’d love to see a “BAD GIRL TROPE explained” - like maeve from sex education, effy from skins etc...
Effy might be the best execution of “seems cool but deep down has a lot of problems” I’ve ever seen. Not sure what that trope is called but I love Effy as a character.
i’d say probably the bad girl trope. most characters in the bad girl trope have a lot of problems if you stop to think about it, but i could be wrong
You will never get that because Bad girls hardly exist in cinema. For a hundred bad boys there’s only ONE bad girl. That’s why I believe it’s a misogynistic trope because men don’t have the fantasy of having to change a woman but they do have the fantasy of woman not wanting to change them. I don’t know if you get what I mean.
@@zendayasfruityfrenchfry1784 I can’t really speak to the sexism of any particular trope but if you’ll allow another perspective; I always saw the “bad boy” as a quintessential female romantic fantasy. In that way, I feel like the manic pixie dream girl would be more equivalent to the bad boy trope than the bad girl trope because that’s a more popular male fantasy. They are both romantic ideals in cinema, healthy or not
@@Ergoperidot the bad girl trope is kind of another female fantasy. In real life, girls at a young age are already conditioned to be this and that. There’s already expectations set (cant stay out late, close your legs when sitting; speak softly, always be the bigger person; etc). To be the “bad girl” is to be free on your expressions and not giving a fuck about what others say and not being suppressed by expectations. Literally everything opposite of what girls are conditioned to be.
Men’s responses to Amy Dunne are amazing. John Wick gets to go on a murder spree for a puppy, but women who sympathize with Amy Dunne are apparently latent psychopaths.
Yes 🤣🤣🤣
John wick kills murderers and assassins. Amy kills an innocent and all her Nick problems was self made by her faking her whole personality.
Absolutely correct.
THANK YOU FOR THIS
I don't think the people in the comments were saying that to those who sympathized with her, but those who rooted for her and found her relatable. A lot of villains can be sympathized with, but it's a bit alarming if you respect or find their dangerous characteristics to be relatable.
the way she did not get an oscar for this makes me so sad
Are you reading my mind, or something? :D I'm reading Rage Becomes Her and this video is exactly about that - the society making women suppress their anger, frustration and disappointment and putting on a bright smile - one of the reasons why more women than men are anxious and depressed
Are they? As far as I knew men where a lot more represented in suicdes and the like. It's pretty shit in both ways, tho. Gender is just hurting people.
@@MangaMarjan Yes, they are. Men have more "successful" suicide attempts, but women are more often anxious and depressed. What can I tell you, patriarchy sucks for everyone. I don't have any links but the data about depression is pretty easy to find. I need to be up to date because I teach English as a second language to psychology students
@Will Diesel why are you so triggered lol. I’ve seen you in a bunch of replies😂 get over it
@Will Diesel which only proves her point that patriarchy sucks for EVERYone, including MEN. Patriarchy places an expectation upon men to be strong, adventurous and aggressive => thus men are more likely to be stereotypes in roles that require strength and aggressiveness/hostility, such as deviants and criminals => these unfair tropes affect the likelihood of convicted men to have longer and more severe punishments/sentences for crimes than women who committed an equally problematic crime, if not worse. Meanwhile, women usually tend to go scot free from toxic/criminal behaviors because they are often viewed by the patriarchal lens as soft, prim, delicate, damsels in distress creatures who are often "defenseless" and "in need of men's protection" thus they "could do no harm." But ofc, we all know this is all bullshit, hence the criticism against patriarchy.
@Will Diesel
And that is the main misconception that most people have with patriarchy, bud. Patriarchy is not synonymous with men "being in charge." Attributing problematic shit to patriarchy does not mean that that same shit is being blamed on actual living males like us or the men we look up to. Patriarchy is not a group of people, it is merely a system of norms and social regulations that place attitudes, values, traits, and characteristics related to "masculinity" unto a higher pedestal than those related with "femininity." Meaning, masculinity is valued more than femininity. Which is why when women cut their hair short, wear masculine jeans, and become masculine, they are not as vilified as men who dress feminine or paint their nails. Patriarchy therefore tend to benefit mostly men who espouse masculinity (I said mostly, since there are feminine men). And despite that benefit, it can still be a double-edged sword that can also harm those same men (i.e. male serial killers getting more scrutinized and harsher punishments than female serial killers), because gender roles, even though it is becoming fluid, has still vestiges deeply ingrained to our society.
I suggest you study Sociology and Anthropology first to learn about the basic concept of "social facts" or the word "pattern" before painting everything you don't agree with as "bullshit."
She is basically like the tv show YOU but everyone loves YOU but hates this movie? A man can do this but a woman scare people.
I think it’s the character complexity what people appreciate. Not all movies or tv shows gives you justice at the end.
I've been saying this! Even down to how people view Beck and Nick, who are essentially the same character.
No, I detest them both equally. Most people don't like creepy people, period. It's not about their gender.
I've never watched YOU. I saw a trailer for it where I presume the main character narrator was talking about how perfect the girl was and how he'd be the perfect guy for her and I just thought I couldn't stand to have that as the main character and narrator. That show honestly from everything I know is completely insufferable.
>$369.3 million
>Fincher's highest-grossing film.
>87% on rotten tomatoes.
Yeah people "hate" this movie
@@anu. I think it is though, women were fangirling all over Joe on Twitter & other social media when it premiered, yet I’ve only heard men say they were afraid of Amy
you expressed exactly why i rooted for her - women having to put on a mask, suppress anger, frustration etc and just smile and take it when men disrespect them and destroy them from the inside, that emotional and psychological abuse hurts women too
her actions are an extreme of taking back control in a patriarchal society
of course that in real life she should dump him and find a man who she is more compatible with
but a revenge fantasy is satisfying to watch
And no man ever puts on a mask and has to suppress anger or frustration in his life? No woman has ever emotionally or psychologically abused a man?
She doesn't live in a patriarchal society. She is a well off middle class woman with a fairly easy life and the wrongs done to her in no way justified anything she did. She's no feminist heroine. She uses feminism as a form of self pity and to justify her psychopathy.
@@_Sakidora_ totally agree
i changed my opinion since i wrote my comment
i no longer root for cluster b disordered female characters that play victims and seek revenge to justify their personality disorder
"Tell me you have daddy issues without telling me you have daddy issues"
@@oc7759 “tell me you are a troll without telling me you are a troll”
@Laura Kay you don't even know if I am a feminist or not, you just assume I am a mysogynist for no reason.
Rooting for a female murderer and justifying her actions makes me assume that they have a personal issue with men... in most cases that is a result of daddy issues
Amy validates your pain and anger, the violence Nick uses is the everyday kind of violence most women suffer, the "normal stuff" and she's like "no, this deserves punishment"... It does, not to be framed for murder but that violence should be punished not applauded by our society.
it depends. If the violence is used towards the normal wife then it is wrong. It is never wrong though when it is used on someone like Amy. Bad people do not get to complain when bad things happen to them. Amy was being fake with Nick since day 1... so any insult any raised voice or cheating towards her is not only deserved but also far less damaging than what she has done to him. The problem with women empathising with Amy is that they put themselves in her shoes. But normal people are not able to wear Amy's shoes. She is a monster, not a normal person. And being a monster she does not deserve love or respect or happiness. In Amy's case she doesn't even deserve to be alive.
It is the same thing as saying that it is wrong to storm the capitol on january 6... But if the president elect was Adolf Hitler then the capitol must be stormed and Hitler executed... no matter what anybody says, it has to be done. The same way that "abuse" towards a woman and abuse towards Amy are not the same thing. Everyone should be treated exactly as they deserve to be treated based on their actions and on who their actions fall.
I wonder how this ties into race domination ?
You should do a video about the Disney live action movies, on why they have/are so hated by both critic's and audiences. Why the outcome just doesn't have the same magic and entertainment as the original movies, and also why the so called 'more feminist' portrayals of the female protagonist's in these movies are actually EVEN MORE sexist than the original movies, by being more passive or more pandering in the advertisement's for these movies.
I have only seen the Beauty and the Beast remake in theatres and refuse to watch any of the others. Every single person I know who has seen them HATES them and yet they STILL GO TO SEE THE NEXT REMAKE AND IT IS SO INFURIATING. It makes me want to scream at them, “STOP GIVING DISNEY YOUR MONEY FOR LOW QUALITY CONTENT YOU KNEW WOULD BE BAD!” I would love a dissection of why people continue to pay for something we all know will be messily thrown together and a let down.
Lindsey Ellis has actually done some videos on this, they are really long but thorough with what is wrong and off about them
@@taleytaleytaley It's called the Disney Cult. Disney cultivated a culture of utter devotion to their works. This allows them to make larger profits through passive consumption despite the quality of content they put out. It's one the major problems of nostalgia because they refuse to see the company for what it is now.
I grew up watching only the Disney afternoon cartoons, the Sunday movie, the Mickey Christmas Carol, and a few of the 80's live action feature movies. My first viewing of The Lion King in 1994 was when I was 18. While I wanted to see the "reimagining", after I found who does what in the end. I have no urge to see it.
I was ranting to my boyfriend about this yesterday as we where watching beauty and the beast (animated) in the remake they took bells bravery and strength and replaced it with a home made washing machine how is that feminist
The way people still makes videos and talk about Amy Elliott Dunne, such an amazing and timeless performance, I'm sorry to Julianne Moore but Rosamud deserved that oscar
Amy should date Joe Golberg. He would be the good guy for her and she will act like a tipical good girl for him and none of them would be bad for eachother.
Love isn't a saint. I'm sure the next season we'll be seeing her do some crazy shit. I can't wait
@@incharak1927 she already did.
@@sgcastle8389 Very good point!!
That would be an interesting relationship. I'm trying to picture how their psyches would react to each other...can anyone foresee what their biggest issue would be? I'm asking honestly, since there's are many people with the great ability to "break down" how people interact psychologically. I'm not trained in that area. Plus I love seeing how intelligent people are in the comments. Now I'll be pondering this most of the day 🤓
@@TheTam0613 well i'm gonna try. Joe likes good girl. If we compare his relationship with Beck and his relationship with Love and if doesn't need help he won't interfere or be invasif. He will still follow her tho .Like with Love he spent more time to trying to cover tracks than trying to be a possessive fuck.
Amy is more like good girl who will stay that way unless he treat her bad. Which he won't; unless she do something bad like cheating, which she won't unless she is hypocrite.
Non of them will be negleted by the other.
TW: rape mentions
The reason so many women resonate with Amy dunne is the same reason so many men resent her: she embodies the female rage women are supposed to suppress when they are abused/disrespected/let down by the men in their lives, be it a boyfriend, a husband or even the men in their families. Amy gave up so much for nick: she agreed to move with nick out of NYC (even if she didnt want to), she gave him her trustfund that he spent on stupid shit while they were on a tight situation, and then he proceedes to cheat on her with a much younger student. She even said it herself, she was willing to be his Cool Girl and even that wasn't enough. Although I dont agree with all her actions (especially the false rape) and she did benefict from the missing white women syndrome, ultimately she did what she did because she wanted to expose how much of a piece of shit nick dunne truly was. Yes, she could have just divorced, but would that give her back the years and the emotional energy she invested in this relationship when nick was the cause of why it stagnated? I totally understand the rage she felt at being ignored and disrespected by him (especially with the cheating) and wanting to lash out. That's what makes her such a good female villain: we know what she did was wrong, but we can't help it but root for her. And rosamund pike did a brilliant job giving life to Amy dunne!
NOTE: just do add that even though it wasn't how she planned, Amy still got what she wanted: nick will forever nationally be known as the jerk who was cheating on his tortured pregnant wife. And from now on, is now nick who will do the pretending.
If a male character killed a woman and framed his own wife because she cheated on him and a bunch of male movie fans talked about how they were rooting for him, I'm betting they'd be bashed as misogynists. It's sad that people react so differently when the genders are flipped.
@@greywolf7577 I would adore him as well. I hate cheaters no matter the gender. I will always be on the side of the person who got cheated on and I think so are a lot of other people.
@MestizoMarquez He cheated before she became a killer. I felt nothing for Nick. He deserved everything. I only despise what she did to people besides him.
@@namkia205 Skylar White? Literally any woman in an abusive relationship who cheated?
Dude, you gotta be complex lmao.
@@nonno112415:00 missing white woman syndrome
Why Amy's revenge doesn't have to be empowering to feel cathartic LOLZ
LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK!!!
Exactly, what is this obsession with women being good role models? Our “flaws” as a gender have never been the root of misogyny so why is a vengeful female character as the protagonist so worrying for the feminist fight? Even those trying to use these types of things against feminists are often just trying to rationalise a misogyny that’s already there
So that makes it right?
@@sharon-bp9pk so in a nutshell
women are often/frequently underestimated is perhaps basically what you're saying?
Remember guys it’s not what you can do for misogyny it’s what misogyny can do for you.
Me: *sees title*
*immediately clicks*
Same here,T J, same here.
Likewise, I adore "Gone Girl", and I'm excited to see their take on the crafty, duplicitous Amy Elliott Dunne! 😍
Same here.
we deserve more complex multi-faceted female characters after we have rooted for & maybe even empathized w their male counterparts. you're so right abt female rage too!! they always expect us to deal with it gracefully, silently & in the dark :/
The irony of this video is coming to the comments and finding (presumably) men shunning women who express appreciation for Amy's character. Not condoning her behaviour/crimes, not saying she's anything but a psychopath, simply expressing their own catharisis while watching this movie. The funny thing is that it only serves to prove how much we as women are expected to deal with female rage silently; we're told we shouldn't even relate in any way to a female villain, whereas male villains (such as the joker) are acceptable! Silliness.
I find the comparison between Gone Girl and Fight Club particularly interesting, considering Fight Club is about toxic masculinity and I've always viewed Gone Girl as a commentary on toxic femininity.
I have not seen it for many years but I don't remember the men as toxic? Because they fight among themselves for thrills? They don't beat up random people do they?
I'm wondering if their fates frame their behavior differently. For instance, Tyler dies but is ultimately successful in his endeavor. Amy fails to frame her husband but gets to live free(sort of).
This kind of muddies the water as to how their behavior is judged.
The reason why I root for Amy is because she embodies a revenge fantasy we all have when going through a break-up, to hurt the person who hurt you back after you put in so much work and love into something only to have it go up in smoke anyways. Gone Girl is a go-to breakup movie for me, because it's cathartic to watch a revenge fantasy film while going through a bad breakup where the unfaithful and uncaring partner gets their bad karma. 😂
Then why don't you ever see extreme revenge fantasies like this being made where the man is the one getting revenge on a cheating wife?
People who cheat on their partners are seldom really punished. She went all the way and I love it. She was a victim and she made him the victim.
So the man she killed didn't cheat on her, he waited till she left her husband & she killed him. Guess he deserved it. The guy she accused of rape deserved it too. Smh. Y'all crazy and I'm going to buy a car and stay the hell away from dating.
you think framing someone for murder is an appropriate response to infidelity?
@@JakeKoenig women are children and they don't even try to hide it
yes
I heard about one woman who sold her husband's belongings on Craigslist when she found out he was cheating on her. Advertising slogan: "Everything Must Go!"
"It depecits a men's right activis's worst nightemare come to vicious, bleeding life" 😂😂😂😂
Yes, because men's rights is evil whereas feminism is holy scripture.
@@_Sakidora_ 🤣🤣
@@_Sakidora_ It’s because it’s a pretentious movement with far, far more emphasis on tearing down women and feminism than actually addressing issues men face- something that feminism does.
@@kiera6326 I see little difference between the two movements. Both have legitimate concerns and both have activists who are ideologically possessed and make a mockery of the causes they fight for. You can frequently take a feminist text and change the pronouns and turn it into an MRA screed and vice versa.
@@kiera6326 People who say this normally only hear about men's rights activists from writings by Feminists. If you actually go to the men's rights subreddit on reddit and actually read the posts, pretty much all of them are focused on gender equality. Feminist sites rarely talk about men's gender issues and are often dismissive of them. It's good to have a place where men can talk about gender issues and how to make things more equal.
amy dunne is the most compelling female character i have ever seen on screen. she is hypnotic and so cathartic to watch
The number of men who ask women shop workers what they should get for their wives as gifts if super sad. Just some real world context.
Not sure why it's "super sad".
It is what it is.
Because men and women tend not to have the same interest, husbands and wives don't either.
It's not a bad thing, it just is.
Keep it moving. It ain't THAT heavy.
@@stephencarter7266 yeah, but if you are interested in your partner, you usually know what they like and can think of something special for them on your own
@@soanalaichnam344 If I happen to like _Italian engraved shotguns_ and shotguns aren't something that my wife is into, I'd rather her ask someone who appreciates engraved shotguns, (for advice on what I might like as a BD present) than get a _robe and slippers to match hers_ (because she's my soulmate) .
But my whole point is that it's not really sad that a spouse asks for advice.
@@stephencarter7266 Then advice should be specific. You surely dont want your wife to just go around seeking advice saying, "Umm... my husband likes something Italian...with a gun. Pls show that shirt with the gun prints."
Men just hop in to shops and says "Gift for my wife, something nice."
@@bread2951 Yes exactly like that :)
I'm interested in art for example and it won't be okay, if my boyfriend would hop into an art shop and ask: "I need something art related."
It would be totally fine on the other hand, if he would say something like: "My girlfriend is interested in art anatomy at the moment, can you recommend a good book on the topic." That would be really specific, but advice would still be necessary. It would be aceptable. But most husbands are more like version one unfortunately.
I always felt I was meant to walk away from the film despising every single character. There were indeed moments where I was rooting for Amy. I remember how utterly entranced I was during the "Cool Girl" monologue and I found myself agreeing with much of what she said.
I think I actually understood her character more when I watched the movie a second time (when I was going through a shitty break up, cheated on, etc etc). And the cool girl monologue stuck to me ever since then.
I'm curious how you would have reacted if the movie had been about a husband who framed his wife for murder.
@@greywolf7577stop spamming this on every comment
Why? What's wrong with discussing how people judge people differently based on gender? @@TheKlutz31013
@@greywolf7577ask Mel Feit about that
Rosamund Pike should have won an Oscar for the cool girl monologue alone. That was so awesome!
Amy as a character can only be a white woman, the way how she has weaponised victimhood and precived innocence is not something that women of colour can easily do. Like the video said the missing white woman syndrome boom. She's a well written villain I like.
🤭
Omg another black woman with her victim mentality....
I so agree. But Amy also exists apart from white or white passing women like me who weren’t born in to high society and money. Her race benefits her in this situation as mine would, but her class she was born into and has always existed in is what truly sets her up for a successful victimhood. Just as you said she could only be a white woman, I think her character could only come from money as well. America might love pregnant women, but we also love rich people.
@@alinan4320 girl hush she just speaking her part
@@alinan4320 girl hush cuz she’s absolutely correct! Do you remember the black and Hispanic women who went missing under similar circumstances to Lacey Peterson or do you just know the latter?
@@cwalker6911 Absolutely. If Amy was black the police would have put in 10x less effort. Actually, if both of them were black, the police would've just arrested Nick an hour within the movie and call it a day.
i love how this is a METAPHOR that no one understood. it still shocks me at how many college graduates exist in america and yet people _still_ seem to take everything at face value rather than actually think about things and try to understand maybe what something might MEAN.
I just love Rosamund's performance as Amy garnering the simmering anger beneath the surface depicted by her tone of voice, always repressed and low but firm
The voice is what makes her so perfect for the role. Reese Witherspoon was supposed to be Amy and that would've been an absolute miscast eventhough i love Reese and have a full respect on her talent, but she's absolutely not right for Amy
I enjoy Gone Girl and i really like all the thought that went into her plan, however Gillian Flynn was really smart to include the woman that Amy meets when she is in the hotel. That woman was one that actually lived the life that Amy was trying to portray as hers. A character that didn't care about Amy and even mocked her news reports and Amy responded by spitting in her Sprite. It really makes it clear that Amy's plan is fun to think about but is disproportionate. Also, Amy expects Nick to fulfill his gender role, which he is able to do initially until the recession hits.
Agreed! Is that woman in the movie?
@@JC-yy8iv yes she is. She's the one that robs Amy and punches her in the face because she could tell Amy had never been hit before.
@@spiderdog07 cool I still haven’t seen the movie, I usually don’t watch adaptations of books I really enjoyed in a special way, but I’ve heard enough good things about this one. At this point I just keep forgetting lol
Im glad you brought attention to this. It's amazing how so much of this video is spent trying to glorify this girl and completely side steps the fact that she was immediately market and robbed. In the real world she would have been eaten alive and she knows it.
@@masterDarts4188 I think that's partly why she decided to change her plan, meet with Desi and takes the unalive post-it note off her calender, cause she had to stay away longer then a few days originally, but she didnt feel like she could actually do it alone. It was far easier for her to manipulate someone else from her past into helping her, then turning them into a scapegoat
I feel about Amy Dunne in Gone Girl the same way I feel about Arthur Fleck in the Joker. They had their reasons for their actions, and their reasons make sense - they’ve both had difficult upbringings and the people in their own lives only make it all worse, so as a result they do terrible things. And when they get their revenge, it’s deeply cathartic. I don’t hate or dislike either character, I feel like they’re something between good and bad.
Well said
And both fantastick movies and performences.
Flek got arrested. Amy got.....exactly. No consequences. Lol. She's a evil wench & the fact she's seen as anything else is scary social commentary
@@realjcoop182 We live in a society where women suffer no consequences.
I loved Amy and this film! There are so many lazy husbands who expect to be mothered by their wives and women trying to gently talk them into adulthood when their sadness, frustration, and exhaustion is killing them. All the while, the women have to play the role of happy wife, devoted mother and any small effort he puts in is widely praised but any small mistakes she makes, stain her as failure. I can image wanting to destroy your husband sometimes, but discretely so you can keep up the appearances.
@Will Diesel based on the sheer number of people who identified with this movie, looks like I’m not alone. And no ❤️
@Will Diesel lol as much as I appreciate your insults and concern for my mental health, even if I was a murderer, what’s your goal here?
@Will Diesel Nvmd I just realized you posted all over this video, trying to start shit and telling people to go to therapy but you’re the one who needs help. I’m done with your pathetic self 😂😂
There are so many manipulative and sociopathic wives out there who expect men to take care of them and pay for them like they're a child, all the while men are expected to play the role of the devoted husband and remain silent even if they're suffering. Even with that being said, I still couldn't imagine wanting to murder a woman for that, because you know, morals.
@@Crypticmind242 who said murder? Haha no. You should watch the movie. She doesn’t murder her husband. Silly goose 🙂
I’ve always said, the portrayal of a relationship from totally glorious in the beginning... to slip in to desperate despair is the truest depiction I’ve ever seen in a movie.
The fact that false rape allegation in a crime fantasy has made people afraid that it will be normalized irl just goes to show how feeble the argument of false rape allegations actually is, based on "what ifs" instead of the shared experiences of women and men actually being raped who come forward. And before you imply that I'm being ignorant to men's struggle just remember that the discourse of men affected by false rape allegations, no matter how insignificant the actual number of such cases, only comes out when silencing victims who come forward. For every false rape allegation there are piles of cases of actually raped women who never get justice. With objective statistics like these if people are still afraid that a piece of fiction will skew the argument, it just proves that it is based on serving possibilities and not reality and those quoting them do not have any intention other than taking the platform away from victims of rape and sexual violence.
@Christopher Reynolds Apologies, will ask the victim to broadcast it while it's happening next time for you to believe anything
It's not based on "what ifs". There are real consequences.
It's not that a character lies about being raped but that the character also gets away with it. I think that frames the behavior poorly.
So Just say to woman stop lying lmao,that's the effects of feminism,like your privileges
.... i mean...Rights,Lmao.
You completely delfected from it lmao. Classic Feminist move
There aren't that many objective facts when it comes to false allegations or convictions. We can rarely be 100% certain that a rape victim is a rape victim or that someone acquitted of rape is actually innocent. Rape is also a very hard crime to prove in many cases.
It probably is the case that the vast majority of people who say they have been raped, male or female, are telling the truth but we can't base convictions on that. Each case has to be judged on what evidence there is not on statistical probabilities.
Finally, a take on Gone Girl! This was the movie that made me fall in love with Rosamund Pike. I actively seek out anything that Rosamund Pike has been in, and so far I've not been disappointed. This is one of my all-time favorite movies.
this is an amazing movie showing how both men and women are expected to put on a mask for their entire lives. they're both caricatures of how we treat relationships and eventually marriage. Neither of them is right, but I sympathize with both of them cause they're products of a society shoveling us shit down our throats of what happiness is supposed to be