@@TDDPhoto I use a Jupiter 12 with no issues, i belive it is only the silver one that can cause an issue, although soviet poor QC should be something to note
@@wubbadubnub Which Rangefinder to you have? Canon RF or Contax or Kiev RF due to that I have the Jupiter for the Contax Mount that has No Problems but placing it on the LTM that a possible scratching along the Rear Rim lens mount, and possible shutter rubbing on the curtains... And FYI I have Both Canon 7 and the VT, with a 35mm, 50mm, and 135mm Canon lens. Along in also have the Contax II, and III with a 50mm, 35mm. and 85mm with 105mm. and 135mm NIKKOR S-C for Contax Mount..
@@alexcarrillo5510 I have the Canon 7 and a Canon VL on the way, my jupiter 12 copy does not touch the metal curtains, although it is relatively close. If it concerns you I'd recommend sending it to bulb and then installing it while keeping the shutter open and checking for clearance. I have the later black model jupiter 12
@@alexcarrillo5510 Also you can't use the Contax rf mount on the LTM cameras, I have a Kiev 4 and the jupiter 12 design for the Contax mount is slightly different than the LTM one, mount aside. At one point I had both the LTM and RF jupiter 12 on my Kiev and 7 and they are slightly different
Thanks for this video comparisons, I just picked up on one thing, you don’t need to press the film speed indicator button on the canon 7 whenever you want to change the shutter speed, only time you will need to do this is when you set your ISO and DIN for the built in light meter. Cheers!
Minor error correction concerning the accessory which adds a cold shoe to the Canon 7. It does not attach to the lens bayonet as indicated here. There is a PC flash connection socket on the end of the camera body for the flash cord. There is a small bayonet fitting around the PC socket, which the cold shoe locks into with an arm which reaches acress the top plate of the body and suspends a cold shoe on top of the camera. When I started collecting Canon RF in the early 1980s, they were moderately uncommon but available on ebay often, at a silly price. By 2000, they were almost non-existent, and if found, the price was ridiculous. So, I do not have one for my Canon 7. For some reason, the P model got very expensive, more than $300 commonly, in the late 1980-90s, and being a "cheap" model, it didn't get added to my collection at that time. In the 2000s, the bottom fell out of P pricing, and near-mint copies could be regularly found for $125 or less. Today, Oct 2021, they are ebay pricing around $200-225 plus shipping without lens, probably in part for being YT hyped to death in the last 2 years. The Canon 7 has two distinct advantages over the P: (1) A far better viewfinder (larger and more clear; less cluttered) and (2) a much more accurate rangefinder, having a longer optical base. (This was required to focus the 50mm 0.95 lens introduced with the Canon 7.) One factor re both the P and 7 (and 7s) if purchased as a user. The shutter is the same for all models, and uses stainless steel foil as a curtain, compared to the cloth shutter curtains used on Leicas of the period and their copies. This additional mass required higher spring tensions to operate, and those shutter are (1)more prone to getting off speed - slower, and (2) those shutters are not repairable (for that problem) for lack of parts and repairmen with the needed skills. My 7 is victim to this, with a 1/1000 indicated speed which after the best repair possible (Bald Mountain/Ken Ruth) runs nearly a stop slow. Speeds of 1/125 and slower are fine, but there you have it. When I use my Canon RF equipment, I much prefer my VIT, which has an easily maintained cloth shutter.
i own the 7 and the P and i enjoyed hearing your take on both. i have seen a couple different types of hot shoe attachments for the 7 and own the pc sync type ... it basically covers the top and has a little cutout so you can still see the light meter. i dont use mine much because it seems when i take it on and off i cannot help but scratch the camera up a bit in the process, unfortunately.
The Canon P is Canon's Version of the Leica M3, and also that on the Canon 7 as the Lens Flange is for the Canon Lens 50mm 0.98 aperture as it needs the Bayonet Flange to hold the lens in place to the body. And also that Canon did sell a Flash Bracket that is connected to the PC Shoe Socket on the Left side via a Bayonet style flange as it went over where it saids Canon7 as I bought one in Japan in 2017. And also that the RF Window on the Canon 7 is abit longer in length that the Canon P so you can place a 135mm lens properly.
Couple of nice examples. Still waiting on lens to be delivered so I can run a roll through my 7. Can you believe I got it for $85 with a working light meter and original case? Fingers crossed that the shutter is Ok. I'll need to replace the light seals, but some tape will work until I get around to doing that.
I stand corrected. Thank you for the info. I was remembering info from casual camera conversation. One simple google search proves you are 100% correct. This might be the wrench that derails my entire RUclips career! Thanks again for the correction internet friend.
Very well done. I like these cameras, but I don't use the 7 much due to it;s size. The P seems to whipsaw in price form monyh to month, mine was given to me when I bought a lens.
I have a 7 and a dreams lens. Somehow, no matter how many times I adjust the rangefinder system, I wind up with no images that are in focus. Have a favorite person to do a CLA on these cameras?
Hey Dave, nice video! I recently got a Canon P and noticed no light seal foams anywhere. Is this supposed to be the case or do I have to install some light seal foam?
Both cameras are wonderful and the Canon lens produces awesome and sharp images! But the Canon P is beautiful though Canon & was more features. I have both cameras too!
Probably a better comparison would be the the Canon VI-L with the Canon 7, since both have adjustable focal length viewfinders. The P, or Populaire, was a budget version of the VI-L. Since the selenium meter is usually dead or grossly inaccurate having a cold shoe is really handy for a modern shoe mount meter.
Hey so do you think its a good idea to get the canon vi-l over the p? From what I've researched its pretty much the same as p but has individual framelines for different focal lengths? There ain't much talk online about the vi-l as much as the p or the 7 I wonder why!?
I’d always choose individual frame lines over multiple if I can. My guess it’s prettier than the 7 for most people and it’s easier to identify. VI-L, VI-T, IV and so on are harder to differentiate without looking each one up. Canon P is simple and pretty. Only my guess. I always forget the differences between the Roman numeral bodies.
@@DaveMontejano Hey appreciate the reply! Also could you please clarify something for me, so the viewfinder on the canon 7 is it a 1:1 magnification across all focal lengths?
If your Russian lenses are made to the LTM standard, there should be no reason to re calibrate your Leica or Canon camera's rangefinder. If your non-Russian lenses focus okay, then the problem is the focusing cam on the lens(es). Given the care and build quality of Japanese versus Russian camera equipment, with no other information, Id guess the problem is in the lens. If you modify the rangefinder in your camera to fit the one-off lens, then no other lenses will focus properly on your camera. Do not be so gullible over what your hear or read on the internet.
The P is like the Fuji 100v, an overprice cult camera. The 7 is a steal. Almost as cheap as a Soviet piece of junk with much better build quality. It's the intelligent person's Leica.
Хобби
Important to remember that a few LTM lenses come dangerously close or even hit the shutter curtain so make sure to look out for that
Jupiter 12 springs to mind.
I seriously want one but I'm too scared because of that rear element
@@TDDPhoto I use a Jupiter 12 with no issues, i belive it is only the silver one that can cause an issue, although soviet poor QC should be something to note
@@wubbadubnub Which Rangefinder to you have? Canon RF or Contax or Kiev RF due to that I have the Jupiter for the Contax Mount that has No Problems but placing it on the LTM that a possible scratching along the Rear Rim lens mount, and possible shutter rubbing on the curtains... And FYI I have Both Canon 7 and the VT, with a 35mm, 50mm, and 135mm Canon lens. Along in also have the Contax II, and III with a 50mm, 35mm. and 85mm with 105mm. and 135mm NIKKOR S-C for Contax Mount..
@@alexcarrillo5510 I have the Canon 7 and a Canon VL on the way, my jupiter 12 copy does not touch the metal curtains, although it is relatively close. If it concerns you I'd recommend sending it to bulb and then installing it while keeping the shutter open and checking for clearance. I have the later black model jupiter 12
@@alexcarrillo5510 Also you can't use the Contax rf mount on the LTM cameras, I have a Kiev 4 and the jupiter 12 design for the Contax mount is slightly different than the LTM one, mount aside. At one point I had both the LTM and RF jupiter 12 on my Kiev and 7 and they are slightly different
Thanks for this video comparisons, I just picked up on one thing, you don’t need to press the film speed indicator button on the canon 7 whenever you want to change the shutter speed, only time you will need to do this is when you set your ISO and DIN for the built in light meter. Cheers!
Thank you for the super informative video. Great explanation, yet still hard to choose
Love these videos. Keep them up.
Minor error correction concerning the accessory which adds a cold shoe to the Canon 7. It does not attach to the lens bayonet as indicated here. There is a PC flash connection socket on the end of the camera body for the flash cord. There is a small bayonet fitting around the PC socket, which the cold shoe locks into with an arm which reaches acress the top plate of the body and suspends a cold shoe on top of the camera. When I started collecting Canon RF in the early 1980s, they were moderately uncommon but available on ebay often, at a silly price. By 2000, they were almost non-existent, and if found, the price was ridiculous. So, I do not have one for my Canon 7.
For some reason, the P model got very expensive, more than $300 commonly, in the late 1980-90s, and being a "cheap" model, it didn't get added to my collection at that time. In the 2000s, the bottom fell out of P pricing, and near-mint copies could be regularly found for $125 or less. Today, Oct 2021, they are ebay pricing around $200-225 plus shipping without lens, probably in part for being YT hyped to death in the last 2 years. The Canon 7 has two distinct advantages over the P: (1) A far better viewfinder (larger and more clear; less cluttered) and (2) a much more accurate rangefinder, having a longer optical base. (This was required to focus the 50mm 0.95 lens introduced with the Canon 7.)
One factor re both the P and 7 (and 7s) if purchased as a user. The shutter is the same for all models, and uses stainless steel foil as a curtain, compared to the cloth shutter curtains used on Leicas of the period and their copies. This additional mass required higher spring tensions to operate, and those shutter are (1)more prone to getting off speed - slower, and (2) those shutters are not repairable (for that problem) for lack of parts and repairmen with the needed skills. My 7 is victim to this, with a 1/1000 indicated speed which after the best repair possible (Bald Mountain/Ken Ruth) runs nearly a stop slow. Speeds of 1/125 and slower are fine, but there you have it. When I use my Canon RF equipment, I much prefer my VIT, which has an easily maintained cloth shutter.
Super review. I have both, and agree with what you shared here.
i own the 7 and the P and i enjoyed hearing your take on both. i have seen a couple different types of hot shoe attachments for the 7 and own the pc sync type ... it basically covers the top and has a little cutout so you can still see the light meter. i dont use mine much because it seems when i take it on and off i cannot help but scratch the camera up a bit in the process, unfortunately.
Thanks for the video! Very informative
The Canon P is Canon's Version of the Leica M3, and also that on the Canon 7 as the Lens Flange is for the Canon Lens 50mm 0.98 aperture as it needs the Bayonet Flange to hold the lens in place to the body. And also that Canon did sell a Flash Bracket that is connected to the PC Shoe Socket on the Left side via a Bayonet style flange as it went over where it saids Canon7 as I bought one in Japan in 2017. And also that the RF Window on the Canon 7 is abit longer in length that the Canon P so you can place a 135mm lens properly.
Couple of nice examples. Still waiting on lens to be delivered so I can run a roll through my 7. Can you believe I got it for $85 with a working light meter and original case? Fingers crossed that the shutter is Ok. I'll need to replace the light seals, but some tape will work until I get around to doing that.
I love my Canon P. Just a simple, pretty camera. It's the camera that taught me how to meter by eye.
The Canon 7 cold shoe accessory is not mounted by the front lens bayonet mount. It is mounted on the side instead on where the flash sync socket is.
I stand corrected. Thank you for the info. I was remembering info from casual camera conversation. One simple google search proves you are 100% correct. This might be the wrench that derails my entire RUclips career! Thanks again for the correction internet friend.
Canon 7 all the way, but hey it' good that most people get the P and keep the better camera's price down unti i pick another one up 😂
.
Can you see the 35mm frame lines on the Canon 7 with glasses? I can't see them on the P
I go for canon 7, I couldn't decide, but after watching your review, I go for 7! it not a Leica, pay less and has more function. :)
I've always enjoyed shooting with a quality built, classic Rangefinder camera!
Generally smaller/quieter then an slr. And thus less obtrusive.
Very well done. I like these cameras, but I don't use the 7 much due to it;s size. The P seems to whipsaw in price form monyh to month, mine was given to me when I bought a lens.
Totally agree about the P prices.
I have a 7 and a dreams lens. Somehow, no matter how many times I adjust the rangefinder system, I wind up with no images that are in focus. Have a favorite person to do a CLA on these cameras?
How do you set the camera ISO base on film?
Hey Dave, nice video! I recently got a Canon P and noticed no light seal foams anywhere. Is this supposed to be the case or do I have to install some light seal foam?
Normal they have no light seals
Between VL1 and VL2, what are the points or differences that you need to look at when buying a camera?
I wonder if its possible to remove the Canon 7's bayonet mount and replace the P's with it so you could mount the Canon dream lens on the P. think so?
Now the price of Canon 7 will go up as well.
Both cameras are wonderful and the Canon lens produces awesome and sharp images! But the Canon P is beautiful though Canon & was more features. I have both cameras too!
thats a nice, elegant video
Thank you!
Great video! Do you have any info on the VT-Deluxe?
These two cameras are the extent of my hands on knowledge of Canon rangefinder cameras.
Do you have an idea how big the whole rangefinder ist, Like 28mm or 25mm?
How do these compare to the Keiv’s and Jorki’s
Great comparison video! So the 7 is not much bigger or heavier than the P. How about the 7s/7sz?
Love the ewoks....
Probably a better comparison would be the the Canon VI-L with the Canon 7, since both have adjustable focal length viewfinders. The P, or Populaire, was a budget version of the VI-L. Since the selenium meter is usually dead or grossly inaccurate having a cold shoe is really handy for a modern shoe mount meter.
Hey so do you think its a good idea to get the canon vi-l over the p? From what I've researched its pretty much the same as p but has individual framelines for different focal lengths? There ain't much talk online about the vi-l as much as the p or the 7 I wonder why!?
I’d always choose individual frame lines over multiple if I can.
My guess it’s prettier than the 7 for most people and it’s easier to identify. VI-L, VI-T, IV and so on are harder to differentiate without looking each one up. Canon P is simple and pretty. Only my guess. I always forget the differences between the Roman numeral bodies.
Also they made and sold way more Ps than any of the other cameras.
@@DaveMontejano Hey appreciate the reply! Also could you please clarify something for me, so the viewfinder on the canon 7 is it a 1:1 magnification across all focal lengths?
@@siddhantmogaveera Canon 7 is .8 magnification. Canon P is 1:1. Either one stays the same no matter which focal length/frame lines you use.
Same here Bro, way too many cameras in my office.😁
where did you get that camera strap?
From Amazon. I just search rope camera strap.
Do I really need to recalibrate my finder if I'm using russian lenses? Because I read bunch of threads on the internet and they said the same thing.
Im using canon 7 by the way
I honestly don’t know. I’ve only used Canon or Leica.
If your Russian lenses are made to the LTM standard, there should be no reason to re calibrate your Leica or Canon camera's rangefinder. If your non-Russian lenses focus okay, then the problem is the focusing cam on the lens(es). Given the care and build quality of Japanese versus Russian camera equipment, with no other information, Id guess the problem is in the lens. If you modify the rangefinder in your camera to fit the one-off lens, then no other lenses will focus properly on your camera. Do not be so gullible over what your hear or read on the internet.
Is one viewfinder brighter than the other, or are they same?
I don’t see a difference between either cameras frame lines. Equally bright.
Other than eBay, where is a good place to find one of these?
Se vira maluco
@@Zecamilleo lol Calma campeão, há que chegue para todos.
7 seems to have a larger rangefinder base.
I don't care if it's an ugly duckling. gimmie the Canon 7
Canon 7 better but not ergonomic of the P .
I don’t know, I think the canon 7 is far nicer looking
Buster photos
Buster Douglas.
@@DaveMontejano ❤️
The P is like the Fuji 100v, an overprice cult camera. The 7 is a steal. Almost as cheap as a Soviet piece of junk with much better build quality. It's the intelligent person's Leica.