Is This the DEATH of the US Regional Airlines?!
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- Опубликовано: 26 май 2024
- Ground News is a data-driven news platform developed by a former NASA engineer. Try Ground News for free 👉🏻 ground.news/mentournow
Are we seeing the beginning of the end of he Regional Airlines in the United States? In this video I will lay down the reasons I think this might be happening, including strange Union deals, pilot shortage and the use of outdated aircraft.
I would love to hear what YOU think about my theory. Let me know in the comments below.
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Below you will find the links to videos and sources used in this episode. Enjoy checking them out!
videos
• Why US Airports Are So...
• Delta Celebrates 10 Ye...
• The U.S. Airlines That...
• Expert on airline mergers
• More New Planes Than A...
• LAX Terminal Move
• British Airways fleet ...
• Around the Network - R...
• Air Serbia ATR-72 repaint
• Delta Connection | Sav...
• KLM first Embraer E195...
• E190-E2 Production Tim...
• Honoring a Legacy of F...
• Introducing Delta's Fi...
• Below the Wing as a De...
Articles
theaircurrent.com/dispatches/...
theaircurrent.com/analysis/us...
www.businessinsider.com/pilot...
www.avweb.com/aviation-news/p...
edition.cnn.com/2022/08/26/te...
chapters:
00:00 Intro
00:27 What is a regional Airline
02:12 Mentours Observation
02:40 Reason 1
04:18 Reason 2
06:50 Reason 3
08:10 Scope Clause
09:40 What is the reason?
11:25 Oh, the absurdity!
12:47 A change is coming
13:39 So, what does it mean?
Ground News is a data-driven news platform developed by a former NASA engineer. Try Ground News for free 👉🏻 ground.news/mentournow
Another great, informative video, Mentour Now!
Thanks for helping share our mission. For those who want to be better informed, compare news and spot media bias, check out the link in the description.
@@ground_news Awesome, you guys really do a great job.
Hello, could you please describe how the "trimming" of the airplane is technically solved and why some civil aircraft use depleted U238 (DU) for trimming?
Dear "Mr. Mentour Pilot". Thank you so much for your most eloquent and accurately detailed explanations and analyses of tragedies and their causes, that might "normally" not be very interesting to females who are not "flyers." After watching two of them, I , myself became so enamored by them , I forgot to go back to my BBC Crime and Retribution show! And I love those types of shows so much, because I enjoy trying to figure out why, who, and what is going on that "doesn't make sense.!" Ha good way to ruin a good movie, I suppose, but it seems to be my habit. I've known many aerospace inventors and pilots, personally, and some worked as insurance agent "trouble shooters." (that's what they termed themselves as being) and YOUR show reminds me so much of some of the things the uncovered. It was one of them who taught ME, to "look for" things that "were not there" in order to find what "was there," i.e, "the truth"....and I never forgot that.
The sad tragedy I "experienced" or "was spared from" experiencing, was a childhood friend of mine who 'd invited me to go along with her on a flight from LA to Salt Lake City, Utah years ago. I couldn't find a babysitter for my young son, so I wasn't able to go with her and her fiancée-who was piloting their Piper plane. (Karen Jean Olsen's obituary is on line if you read this far ?) The plane crashed into a 10,000 foot mountain. Being a songwriter and a "dreamer", I wasn't surprised the next morning when Karen came to me in a Dream. She said, exactly, this..." Don't worry about me, I've been flyin' all along" That's exactly what she said...the rest of my story can be verified by her church bishop, the LDS Church and the Coordinator of their wedding at the Utah main church.
The song, I thought you might enjoy it ---to me, was hopeful and positive; perhaps others might perceive it as being just too darn sad. But after having watched several of your extremely well coordinated videos, I'm inclined to believe that you and your family might really enjoy it. Karen and I sort of "etched" out a song together, that she kept saying she thought would make a great wedding song; but, of course WE were never able to finish it. I did, recently, and dedicated it to the memory of one of the most intelligent, and sweetest, friend I've every had . I kept asking, " Why her, and not me?" I guess that's a pretty normal reaction, actually, that you've probably heard before.
I have a question for you in regard to a video of yours, in which a British pilot , who survived or warrent off, a crash.... I can't find it again, but maybe you know which one it was ? He said he "did not want to lower the landing gear to land on the water." My little pea brained creative mind kept asking, and I rewound it and listened several times to his explanation. WHAT makes "landing " on the water with landing gear lowered , a problem? EAsy one for you, just hard for me to 'fathom" the answer/ or the defense for that opinion..(pardon the pun!) the girl can't FATHOM who would "care" that the "landing gears" were going to enter WATER ?
I'll look for it again and struggle with that some more later.
I hope you enjoy MY songs rearranged from Karen's and my DREAM.
THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR ALL OF THE HARD WORK YOU DO!
Sincerely,
Lynda Faye
You Tubes: "Flyin' in the Mornin' on a High Flyin' Bird" (from the album at CDBaby as a folk song) and
"He Was Only Seventeen" ( when he went off to war, etc.,) the rearranged version.
( "I Need a Miracle"-Karen's and my Wedding Song!) I'm sure she and her fiancée are up there married by now!)
Always spot on and informative! Shout out to you guys from Pittsburgh @MentourNow
Two very crucial facts that you did not touch on Petter, are 1) the tremendous size difference between the United States and Europe and 2) our total lack of a national public rail system. It is a much used reference point, but it needs repeating - all of France would fit comfortably inside of Texas with room to spare. Speaking as a business traveler who has spent time in the EU, our regional airlines essentially operate as your business class rail service.
Is it the most effective or efficient way to do things? Not going to try to defend it one way or another. It evolved organically - in fact, there was a great advertisement by Delta back in the 1980's (using a stranded motorist) with their "We're ready when you are." campaign that captures it perfectly.
In addition, for business travelers, who still make up the majority of the revenue on US flights, wasted time sitting in an airport hub is wasted money.
Consolidating five regional flights/day to two large body jets does not well service this market. Point-to-point service in a country with 51 government centers plus the terratorial centers and the major financial hubs and every other city with manufacturing? I am not going to go there. Would the market "deal with" a loss of flight frequency because it has no other option? For a time. Until it finds more cost advantageous options which possibly will not involve flying at all. It is always good to remember who your customer is.
Runway length and "international" in a name is not sufficient research to assess an airport. Runways are often built long in the expectation of growth or other reasons. Harrisburg, PA, and Tallahassee, FL, are both state capitals, and, accordingly, cities with much business travel. Respective populations and airport terminal gates: ~550,000 with 12 gates, and ~150,000 with 14 gates. Those really are not large markets. (My apologies to my Western sisters and brothers but my miles have been mostly east of the Big River. Please add your thoughts.)
Net, net, I believe there are several more variables involved in why the regional system works for the NA market. I agree with you that financials are certainly a major aspect of it but there are other sides of those financials - if people stop flying, no one wins. My money is still on the regional system for the foreseeable future, especially now that the airlines are beginning to pay their crews more correctly.
I apologize for the long response, but you put so much great effort into all of your videos, which i enjoy and look forward to every week, that I felt you deserved more than just a terse one sentence response that might be misconstrued.
With Best Regards Lisa
contiguous US - 8 million sq km
Europe - 10.5 sq km ( there is more to Europe than what's in the minds of the typical American tourist)
Rail systems in Europe are ok within individual countries. Not so much for international travel.
@@jeffn8218 so shall we include Canada and Mexico? LoL No the point is, why would Air France have a large set of regional aircraft when their country is small. I always find it odd how Europeans don’t want to be lumped together unless it fits their argument.
@@jeffn8218 does that number include Greenland? Because I know it probably includes Iceland and Greenland is politically part of Europe even though it is geographically part of North America. A rather enormous chunk of Europe is also included in Eastern Russia and while I'm sure it's somewhat different from the days of the USSR I'd be willing to guess that air service in Russia is still significantly behind what is found in Western Europe or even the less populated western parts of the US. When you start throwing these numbers around you have to compare apples to apples.
@@jeffn8218 I have had no difficulty using rail for business travel across multiple international borders in Western EU. I cant speak for farther east. The worst I have experienced on rail Europe far exceeds our best which would be New England/northest corridor.
Excellent points, as a regional employee you explained excellent points.
Frequency of services has a lot to do with it. Who wants to spend half a day at a hub airport because your only connection was at zero dark thirty?
True that
If it commercially makes sense to do what Petter is saying, then the frequency will not be a concern to the majors, as if they all follow suit, the passengers will not have a choice
Well if there were no split mainline & regional fleets, maybe there would be more direct flights between small airports. And THAT is probably where the market will be headed, if/when the regionals bite the dust.
@@danielmosey6203 Passengers always have a choice, that's the entire premise of the Western World is a free and competitive market
@@danielmosey6203 There is always a choice because all airlines don’t have the same exact schedule, so people will book whatever is more convenient to them. An airline will happily add a cheap CRJ flight just to kill their competitor in a market.
Native Texan here: I used to LOVE flying in those turbojet "puddlejumpers" from small regional airports to larger airports. I thought it was much more fun that a 'boring' big jet. 🙂
Definitely, and they need to come back. That's my idea of regional air travel.
Agred I'm flying an ATR between Helsinki and Tallinn, Estonia in January and I'm really looking forward to it.
@@schalitz1 it's fun, and feels surprisingly like a jet! (it is turboprop)
Same. I flew on a CRJ. They feel like a sports car compared to the Airbus or Boeing. I like them better than the others
Had a few years making frequent trips to the US and favourite part was the 1-2 hour regional connections in little twin turboprops like the A340. Love the sound, especially in rain.
The basis of competition in the US is often flight frequency. If you can fly smaller aircraft to a regional airport several times a day versus one large jet once a day, it will impact your market share significantly. Having a cheaper pilot salary scale doesn't hurt, but the main reason is to keep the feeder flights full so that the hubs can operate near capacity, especially if those are international hubs launching the highly profitable long-haul flights.
Good point, but one big reason for planes like the A220, is to enable flying between small airports that are far apart. So ultimately, folding the regionals into the mainline carrier could (?) lead to more point-to-point flights between smaller airports. Kinda like Southwest, but in a wider scale, network-wise.
In Euro you can just drive from region to region.
It's the same reason for limited applications for public transportation.
Canada & US are huge.There are a lot of regional aircrafts.
Absolutely correct!
European airlines have far less domestic passengers to fly than the US because most countries have a main domestic carrier, but are small. In the US a carrier must fly people into and out of hubs that cover very large areas.
As such, it takes a lot of frequency to many airports to keep those feeds going.
I’m glad he used PIT as an example. There just wasn’t enough demand there to keep a hub going and airlines use a mix of mainline and express planes flying to keep the load factors up. There’s no sense in flying a 738 three times when there’s only a need for ~250 passengers, so they fly a 738 in the morning and then two CRJs in the afternoon/evening.
They are clogging up our airports!
@@afcgeo882 plus European countries have functioning railway systems which will absorb some of the traffic which is carried by planes in the US.
Short security lines are nice at small airports.
"There is no worker shortage, there is only pay shortage"
YES, thank you for bringing that up. Doesn't just apply to pilots and aircrews, but literally every industry ever. Teachers, service industry, even manufacturing.
Definitely in the healthcare sector as well
Greed, nothing else!
@Wiryan Tirta: that shortage is resumed by the awkward "talent shortage". I personally tend to read "talent" as a misspelled "slave".
@@lahodal you misspelled too: it's growth. Having greedy board members is another thing. Donella Meadows see that coming 50 years ago: put simply if it can no longer extend upward, it has to extend downward...
@@carlvincent12 Yes here nurses are holding patients hostage in a war on salary, A war where they have taken half time jobs in two hospitals to bypass the rules. Already earning allot more than equal jobs/educations. but opportunities like covid lead them down the path of blackmail. Why should a nurse earn more than a policeofficer, or a medical engineer with a far longer education and 20 years more exp.. Greed and entitlement is growing in the EU/west. I would rather be treated by a kind immigrant philippino nurse than a Danish that feel they are better than their job.
One of the big differences between US and Europe is that for the most part there is an efficient passenger rail network in Europe to feed the airports. There is poor rail feeder service in the US so the feeder service is by more frequent service to smaller (market not necessarily physical) airports.
It seems to be the case that the regionals here in the US mainly serve the purpose of connecting less-popular (not necessarily smaller) airports to central hubs, rather than providing service between small airports that can’t support larger aircraft. I live in Albuquerque, and even though we have an airport with 3 large, long runways and consistent wide-body cargo traffic, nearly every passenger flight is on a regional jet (aside from southwest’s 737s and Delta’s a320 connection to Atlanta). Seems to be true at other airports that aren’t major passenger hubs too.
American flies 737’s into ABQ all the time while Delta uses Airbus to do the same.
FWIW 737s and A320s fly internationally between New Zealand and Australia, usually a 3 and a half hour plus flight. "Regional" planes in New Zealand add ATR72s and de Havilland Q300s flown by the national carrier to the jets and then even smaller planes flown by true regional air lines e.g. C208s
Also for carriers flying into another dominant carrier's hub. People residing in Houston may fly United to Dallas, while people residing in Dallas may fly American to Houston. They both want enough frequency so people don't choose the other airline based on schedule, so some of those planes will be regionals. They both also want to support their international operations from their home airports.
My US town of ~50k population has fairly new "regional" flights twice a day operated by Envoy. The are *definitely* feeder flights by American Airlines - going only between KSWO and KDFW.
Gotta say they we *love* it. As a long-time business flyer, I have driven many, many miles and paid thousands of dollars for airport parking just to get between home and KOKC or KTUL. Now having a local connection to AA is completely awesome change.
Having worked for a US mid-sized corporation for over 30 years, I found that expecting logic to be the reason for business decisions was almost never an expectation that became a reality, especially if $ were part of the decision (and $ were always part of the decision).
In Canada, regional 'Air Canada Jazz' flies 3 hours route such as Vancouver-Chicago, or Calgary-Chicago, or Edmonton-San Francisco. It was always told that the pay at Jazz is much lower than at mainline Air Canada, and moving flights to Jazz is in part a way to keep labour costs down.
I don't think regionals are going away. Honestly, you only looked at
The biggest issue with Breeze is that they’re trying to grow with infrequent services. I don’t care how cheap you claim to be if I have to plan my vacation around a twice weekly flight. Until they get up to daily on their routes, I’m going to wait and see.
That model has worked for allegiant airlines . Pretty good some would say. It may not be a bad plan
@@ljthirtyfiver Allegiant has more of a niche than Breeze does. Allegiant enters really small markets and induce demand by offering cheap direct flights to popular leisure destinations like Orlando or Vegas. Breeze also starts new point-to-point routes, but they're often between 2 mid-sized airports, and then they have to try to attract demand to more "off-the-beaten-path" destinations like Charleston or Norfolk. They also add and cut routes so fast it's hard to keep up with what they're offering and when.
The regional airlines you mentioned in Scandinavia remind me of the daily milk run route that Alaska does from Seattle to Anchorage via the Southern Alaska Inner Passage. Which is both to serve small Alaskan town for cargo shipments and residents getting to Anchorage, Juneau, or the lower 48.
Probably this is no coincidence: Both - Norway and Sweden - are large in size but only sparsely populated with only a few larger cities. The northern parts of the Countries are Arctic Regions with very long and very harsh winters. Both Countries have an Airline doing all the necessary stuff in this remote areas and connecting them with the few larger cities: Wideroe in Norway and Bra in Sweden.
I am looking at SkyWest’s route map. They do routes for the big four (you left out Alaska Air) major US airlines. Most of the routes are from a hub to a small airport.
GoJet also flies between hubs and a lot of small airports, but are only working with one major. Endeavor does the same with Delta.
The US does not have the rail network that Europe has. Look at the combined route maps of Skywest, GoJet, and Endeavor to see how many more small airports are served by air here that would be served by rail in Europe.
I have been flying long enough that I have seen some of these regional airlines switch between which major they worked with or new regional become the airline serving the route for the major.
LOL alaska air.
Skywest is able to cover more airlines (UA, AA, DL, AS) because they're an independent regional airline (the largest in the world actually). I believe most, if not all, the other regional airlines are owned (wholly and in part) by the previous mentioned airlines.
LMAO Alaska is not part of any Big Four 😂. Their presence is pretty minimal everywhere else except the West Coast.
Just started at a US regional airline last week. Great timing!
Congratulations! I hope you enjoy your work and have a meaningful career!
As someone who works as an aircraft dispatcher for CommuteAir, an airline you mentioned in this video, I could give some additional insight into this conversation. There are some additional factors that also effect our operations and why regional airlines won’t go away in the US anytime soon. Passengers in America want convenience, and regional airlines can provide this with higher frequency of flights. In addition, passengers want comfort in their regional flights and thus why props have mostly gone extinct in regional operations here, and also resulting in lower passengers density in the cabins with more legroom and wider seats. In addition the United States government offers indentures to smeller cities with Essential Services Flights which have to be at or below certain requirements, which by chance happen to be just slightly above the Scope Clauses for most US regionals. While regionals have been paying pilots and many other crew members better than ever, these rates are still well below mainline as the majors have had to increase wages as well. Honestly, the worker shortage at airlines will probably continue for the next couple of years, and will probably result in pay continuing to go up.
EXACTLY!!!
Finally, someone mentions the _tellement démodé_ props, icon of outdated aircraft technology and of, um, yeah, aero economy.
I assume "smeller cities" would include Cedar Rapids, Iowa?
@@MendTheWorld That is correct.
You still need to give passengers more options in feeder airlines, if a regional cuts by half its flights it’s extremely difficult to make decent connections
I live in the US and I had no clue what pilots meant when they say they started at regional but now I have a lot better understanding of it.
You never once looked it up? Wow.
It’s kinda complicated in America. Everyone flies from pretty much everywhere over here. We have so many airports. Even smaller “cities” have airports and airlines. Like where I live near Knoxville, TN, our airport basically serves just to get you to a bigger airport for your main flight. We do have some direct flights to big cities now (like to Las Vegas), but even then it’s limited to a couple of times a week, and doesn’t always schedule for someone’s needs. Most of the fleet at McGhee Tyson are smaller regional jets, for that reason. We don’t have 300 people wanting to fly to Chicago twice a week, but certainly might have 70 per day wanting to make that flight
I worked for US Airways for 36 years. The first 24 years were in Cleveland, Ohio. We were a smaller mostly mainline station with some regional flights. After 9/11 airline traffic had dropped across the industry. In 2003 we were informed that our station was being turned into a regional station with no mainline flights. My options were to either transfer to a station with mainline flights or stay in Cleveland and go to work for the regional airline at a 50% pay cut. I packed my family up and transferred. After they announced the closure of the station US Airways sent in a group of people to explain our options and the process . They also sent in a VP to explain why our station was closing. He said that regional jets were more cost effective and the airline was planning on buying many more. I asked him what the plan was when the passengers returned to flying and all we had left were small regional jets. This genius's answer was "We don't expect the passengers to ever return in the numbers before 9/11." I often wonder what happened to that moron. I retired in 2016 from American Airlines.
Got that same "traffic will never return" trope in 2020 from our HQ.
Fast forward to today and we are up the proverbial creek with labor & supply shortages. It's that kind of bean counting reactionary decision making to appease Wall Street that keeps the industry in a circle of chaos.
Probably got promoted for his "genius" ideas
@mwilk - let's look at it from the other perspective. In the immediate aftermath of 9/11, we knew who the bad guy was. We spent tons of money, rewrote procedues, upgraded security, etc. Turned air travel inside out in an effort to keep people safe AND to ensure they felt safe. It is a basic idea: if people were using a thing at rate X before it broke, they will return to generally the same use rate when it is repaired.
But that didn't happen. I remember the predictions of "air travel should be back to previous levels by the 3rd qtr 2002". Nope. Nor 3rd qtr 2003. It was almost 2005 before passenger numbers returned to pre-2001 levels; and it took a major shift downward in ticket fares to get people moving. So much of a shift down, that it was the 2007 time frame before the airlines' revenue returned to pre-2001 levels - just in time for the 2008 recession. Which took revenues to the pre 9/11 range again.
So, it is 2003. Ticket sales have been abysmal since 9/11 despite all the safety measures. Business travel that had been "essential" only two years before had vanished. Companies are promoting home offices and telecommuting as the way forward. And THEN we invaded Iraq. All the color coded risk level stuff - just the thing to put people in the flying mood. Not. It looked really bleak.
@@lisanadinebaker5179 You can blame the TSA for making flying miserable. No wonder the Flying numbers took years to go back up. There was no upgraded security. It's just a bunch of theatrics. TSA agents are bunch on inept security guard rejects, who shouldn't be qualified to hold a flashlight.
What happened to that moron? Seems like he was in charge of decisions about pilot staffing during Covid. Airline leaders have the foresight of a bat.
We had a lot of ATRs in the US in the regional fleet. Then the whole 'ice up and fall out of the sky' issue happened and people started to not feel comfortable on turboprops.
I fly a lot of ATRs... in between the tropics.🌴
Oddly enough it was DHC-8s that were icing up and ATRs were moved South. Meanwhile, Dash-8s still ply the polar skies.
An accident usually doesn´t sort out a whole type of aircrafts if there´s no other issue supporting their out-fleeting. And yes, the ATR are known since that accident to be sensible for icing - but there were and are other types of Turboprops in the market. So there´s more behind it.
Personally I really miss the 340's.
Perhaps look up what aircraft British Antarctic Survey uses :-)!
You mention Miami and Charleston as part of a single regional route. That's 788km. From Paris CDG, that would get you to anywhere in France, Belgium, the Netherlands, Switzerland, the vast majority of Germany, the whole of England and Wales (but not Scotland), and much of northern Italy, plus parts of Austria and Czechia, and enough of Ireland to include Dublin, and the very north of Spain (maybe enough to include Barcelona and Pamplona).
Would that be a regional flight in Europe?
Im sitting on a regional airline… Avelo, waiting to take off in 19 mins from New Haven to Fort Myers.
HVN - is the plane full?
Enjoy your flight!
@@alyonapetrova694 about 8 open seats. I flew the same route the Monday prior and it was 100% full.
@@blakebarone1809 GREAT to here that HVN may have found their “niche”. Soon, I understand that a new Terminal is being built. Thanks!
I've noticed this year that a lot of routes i fly that used to be CRJ-700 and/or CRJ-900, are now being serviced by 737's a lot of the time. And i was told by a pilot (for Delta airlines) that it was because of the pilot shortage. They don't have enough pilots for the flight deck positions they have.
Things sure have changed. One of my first regional flights was out of somewhere in South Carolina 45 years ago. The guy at the check in counter loaded the luggage, then was the pilot. I was the last passenger on, and all the seats were full, so I ended up sitting in the front right seat. The pilot asked me not to touch any of the instruments.
ah, the golden age of flying
That still happens, hop on a Cape Air flight sometime.
I agree with the Flight Frequency argument. I take assignments with my company that require travel to numerous cities about a 1 or 2 hour flight away. Fewer flights /choices mean more overnights, and a much higher cost. Plus the added time for me, and time away from my home and family, which is the most valuable commodity of all.
One thing that I think is relevant here is that (at least in the US) the major carriers' primary revenue source is not aircraft operations. They're basically banks. The airline operations are essentially rebate programs for their credit cards and loyalty programs. They need to offer whatever those customers want to keep them using their credit cards. If the miles I earn on my credit cards are not convenient to redeem, I'll find a different reward program.
Here in Dallas Fort Worth we had the Wright amendment which was a law passed to prevent Southwest from competing against the big boys. It also was to protect DFW airport from losing income to Love Field. That kept them regional, but the law has expired. I’m pretty sure Southwest still doesn’t fly out of DFW. For a while, the big three were buying up gates at Love Field to keep Southwest from expanding.
They also have a strong Lobby to prevent high speed rail from DFW to Houston.
Checker Cab fought the rail connection from ORD to Chicago for years.
Southwest is expected to start occupying DFW in 2024. The contract states they have to operate only out of love field until 2024. So they can start buying gates at DFW if they wanted (and they might)
At skywest we had a nearly 97% pay increase from around $46 first year FO pay to $90 first year FO pay
David Needleman also assisted in the Founding of Westjet in Canada and Assul in South America.
He's a smart cookie, been around the block a few times!
I’m a Republic Flight Attendant and I actually worked ON that airplane 422 on the day you mentioned, Oct 20! Cool! I’m in Pittsburgh. I’m about to hit 22 years seniority. I hope my airline is around a long time, but for selfish reasons, at least 20 more years, til I can retire, that is. My pilots all just got a huge raise. Some of our seniors pilots have been scaring me lately with predictions exactly to the point of this video. I hope I don’t lose my job. :( Thanks for this video. You make perfect sense, unfortunately for me, and my colleagues.
My son is midway through his training to become a commercial pilot at a flight school in Utah. This video had a lot of interesting information I was unaware of, so I passed it on to him. Love your videos!!
Sounds like he picked a career that will definitely be in demand! (And extremely cool, too!)
Cool, what school is he going to? I'm a flight instructor in Utah haha
I'm an airline pilot in Utah. The local regional airline of choice will definitely want him!
@@genxer74 haha yes we will
As a passenger, i prefer lots of small flights a day rather than 1 bigger flight because i most likely will be home much sooner. Waiting 6 hours at the Las Vegas airport is horrendous.
The congestion all those small flights create doesn't matter until bad weather effects ripple through the whole system and you end up sitting on a plane for hours during a ground stop.
@@jeffn8218 LoL.
@Alex Wyler - waiting six hours in any airport is horrendous, but I think I would prefer LV to Green Bay. There has to at least be more than two places to eat in LV.
As an American, I realize the model used by Most airlines here is pretty strange (my preferred domestic carrier SWA is the exception). But Europe with its wet leases and naked planes and business class being 3 economy seats with a table over the middle seat, is pretty strange to me. Once I flew a LOT codeshare from WAW-STR that had a long tarmac delay. The pilots and cabin crew made all the announcements in English (which was fine for me) but none of them understood any Polish or German. As it turns out their first language was Spanish.
Hey @Mentour Now!
One of the big factors of having regional airlines is frequency of flights and that was discussed by many in the comments.
Another reason I haven’t seen mention is the legal and logistic isolation from the big three businesses. You mentioned fleet sizes and that is a big factor that drives their existence.
For example, Delta doesn’t want to create the infrastructure required to house, maintain, and operate all fo those regional jets. Most importantly it doesn’t want to have the legal and regulatory liability of operating them.
There are several excellent videos documenting the controversy of “are regional airlines actually different companies?” This was highlighted as a part of the Colgan Air tragedy and the accompanying lawsuits levied by the victims families.
For now, Delta, United, and American Airlines are allowed to reap the full business benefits of these smaller regional airlines within assuming any financial, logistical, legal, or regulatory liability.
It’s a huge win for the big 3 that they continue to exist.
With jets like the CSeries/A220 emerging as a class of airplane that is smaller, regional size but has the efficiency to fly farther point to point route, it will be interesting to see if the big three start operating more direct flights because the economics start to make sense with those planes.
Consumers pay more for direct flights and want a direct flight but not too much. The CSeries/A220 and future similar aircraft could make the need/shift away from regional operators possible.
Don’t forget the embraer E2 (175, 190 and 195)
I don’t think the regional airlines are dying, but they’re definitely being regrouped. There’s a lot of small airports, especially in Texas, that see regional service to DFW. A lot of these locations can’t sustain service and are losing service all together.
services to EAS airports are definitely going through an adjustment period. My airline cut travel to at least 29 EAS cities this year, mainly due to not having enough pilots.
I think it’s a problem of not having aircraft that can serve them any more. Not one of the aircraft that served the fields in my state (save the three majors) are manufactured any more, nor is any airline still flying them. Southern is stepping in, and it’s a godsend, but they’re still working out the kinks. Seems also that the milkrun flights are gone, not sure why.
I guess I'm repeating what others are saying. My airport is Portland International Jetport, PWM. I remember when regionals started and it was to provide more flights per day to like Boston, Newy Your, Philly, etc. These were supposed to help business travelers to get to meeting and back home sooner. They also allowed us to get to a major hub faster and cheaper.
I'm a 32 year retired US major airline mechanic. When I first started the commuters were only turbo props and the regional aircraft were flown & maintained by the main line carriers. As the years went by the turbo props were taken out of service and the major airlines established their own wholly owned regional service. The reason is simple as the main line carriers pay their wholly owned subsidiary carriers less, and the aircraft don't burn as much fuel or pay as much in landing fees. If the US ever had dependable high speed rail service this would be a problem for regional airlines. FLY NAVY!!!
I may or may not have flown one of those tail numbers you stated probably 100 times. Awesome coverage! Amazing grasp on scope clauses and their potential harmful effects that many here are unable to explain so easily.
Envoy also operates international flights from Miami into the Caribbean using the E175s. These flights are up to three hours long.
Heard one leaving Dominican Republic over the radio few days ago . I was surprised
Good video overall, but you're overlooking a key piece: Southwest. You repeatedly pointed out that regional partner airlines don't fly to smaller airports as much as their European equivalents do. That is because Southwest focuses on these smaller regional flights. And it has a very successful business model by focusing on shorter flights between smaller airports in smaller planes.
Small 737 planes.
Better yet, the A220 was designed to fly between smaller airports on LONG flights, if necessary. That's probably where things are headed.
Southwest has NOTHING to do with this conversation. It has no regional partnership. It’s a low cost carrier.
Southwest flies anything between 40 min to 5 hour+ flights. Flights are almost always full. All 737s. It can be done and they’ve proved it. They run an efficient model.
@@spyrosg3172 Not much demand for smaller airport to smaller airport flights though. Most people want to fly to a big hub.
A truly interesting insight of the inherent complexity of the Airline business. Didn’t know about this Scope clause. Thank you!
that was an interesting look into it as I have never flown regional, My last regional trip was Philadelphia to Boston and I took the Acela train for that.
One thing that you’re missing is stocks. My husband works for a regional carrier. All 3 of the legacy carriers own stock in his company. Not small percentages either. SO even though they’re paying another airline to operate these flights, they’re still getting money from it. Essentially giving themself a discount from the agreed upon price per flight.
I used to be a Comair/Delta Connection regional airline employee and we were a wholly owned subsidiary of Delta Airlines. Your take is credible, however, there is also an aspect you didn't cover...frequency. The US market demands frequency over plane size. Yes, you can put an A321 in place of 3 EMB175s, thus savings the additional crew, fuel, etc...but at the expense of the demand by the pax demand to have (sometimes) hourly flights between local airports and hubs...or point to point flights.
For example, at my local airport, we have 4-5 rotations to the various hubs for the Legacy3 as well as our RONs throughout the day. Yeah, you could cut that in half and use A321s or 757s, but we get regionals and mainline combinations depending on the legacy carrier. Then add in the other rotations to places like DCA and EWR as well, plus WN, G4 and F9 service as well. So it is about frequency that, in many cases dictates the multiple trips between hub/outstation daily. And the regional feed allows for the 76 seats and fewer during the hours that don't require 150+ seats, but pax still demand the convenience of timing of flights.
@D Peters - hey, glad to know there are still some Comair folks around! We miss you guys here in the Tristate. I loved that little airline - bounced all over the eastern part of the country, never having to deal with the hassles of a mega airport. I hope you were able to land a good position elsewhere.
Great video. Living here I see it very differently. I believe the planes you chose to monitor was a small sample and maybe not representative of the majority of the regional jets patterns and the airport sizes they fly into. A lot of smaller cities rely on these regional jets to get to bigger hubs. Some places might be 4-8 hour drives to a big hub. These jets fill the gap and in my experience are always full. Not to mention the gating at the smaller airports would cost a fortune to get them equipped to handle a bigger plane.
as I understood it, he's not saying the regional flights won't be happening, he's saying the airlines might change their business structure.
And the reason that the major airlines don’t just fly smaller jets to those places are because they’ve realized that they can rip off pilots by this artificial division. Hopefully, this scam is coming to an end.
@@rynovoski agreed its like the pilots have to pay the airlines to fly at this point
Not sure if this has been pointed out, but in comparing US airlines to airlines in other countries, airlines in other countries are often subsidized by the governments of those countries. In the US, they are not. They are a business, needing to turn a profit.
Some small airport in the Essential Air program do pay the Regionals for service.
As @enat66 pointed out the Essential Air Service Program is 100% a government subsidy.
There are tax implications and subsidies that are attached to these flights, as well.
Yes, true
The US congressmen/congresswomen need those votes from small towns. It's like "Hey look I got this airline to service your small town. Can I have your vote? You won't be inconvenced by taking a slow ass bus ride to an airport far away."
Very often, hopping on an American Eagle flight you will only see a half to 3/4 full flight. The “regional” routes don’t have very many people flying the routes. Also, Republic Airways is based in my hometown and they just built a massive flight school, building a huge headquarters, a fairly large sim training facility and just bought land to build a new flight school down south. I don’t think Republic is going anywhere anytime soon
Our regional airline here in Scotland is thankfully pretty simple, run by Logan Air, they use turbo props to fly from my northern city, Aberdeen, to the islands, so Orkney and Shetland. On Orkney there’s a very small airline that goes from island to island where one of those flights is a 2 minute flight and the craft doesn’t go above 1,000 feet (mostly used by locals who need to travel between islands, and plane enthusiasts!). The small Orkney craft is essentially treated like a bus, it’s pretty cheap (I could get tickets from £10-£15) and it’s a LOT faster than waiting for a small ferry. Apparently it’s also the Guinness World Record for the shortest flight in the world!
So over here they’re desperately needed to connect the islands to mainland Scotland, especially Orkney, Shetland, the Hebredian Islands, there’s even a regular small craft that takes pregnant women to Aberdeen’s hospital to give birth (Gama Aviation), and there’s even smaller locations that are subsidised by our government because they’re isolated communities (Tiree, Barra, Campbeltown) because they just aren’t financially viable by themselves but Scottish government recognises they’re needed services, also run by Logan Air.
There aren’t insane waits tho, it’s a regular service to be relied on, and the flights don’t generally last more than 1 hour unless there’s some issue (mechanical, weather, weather mostly being the issue because hey, this is Scotland!). It’s mostly the ATR-72 used here, the Orcadian small craft is a lovely “aerodynamic brick” (as described by her pilot!) the BN-2!
So there’s some random regional aircraft facts for northern Scotland/Scottish islands, our regional airline is seen as a super important lifeline and used regularly by the oil industry, there’s multiple flights to/from Sumburgh (Shetland) every day, get to see them all the time from my house as I’m very close to the flight path!
These days they’re flying more ERJs, rescued from FlyBMI. And GAMA provide all of the flight services for the Scottish Ambulance Service, typically in the SAS colours, but occasionally in unmarked relief planes when the core aircraft are unavailable
Eyyy, Scottish people in the house! Unfortunately, I'm boring. I just see Easyjet, Aer Lingus and the occasional United flight landing RWY 24 at Edinburgh through my kitchen window.
@@fnnhh that makes sense, I assume it’s cheaper getting the ERJs that way? I know Aberdeen just has a lot of ATRs for Aberdeen-Sumburgh/Kirkwall
As a American from the United States that Impressive
I believe the Shetland flights are also subsidised by the local authorities. The UK government also fund flights between London city and Dundee, by Logan air.
My wife travels a lot for work and we deliberately chose to live in a city with a big regional airport rather than a major hub. She has many more flight choices from here than she might at a major hub airport. With her preferred airline, there are 5 hubs she can connect through to get to her various destinations. She has never missed a meeting or appointment due to weather or equipment, while some of her major hub based colleagues have. Also, drop off or parking, car rental, check in and security are much easier than at a major hub. Yes, there is connection time added, but the ease of use of our home airport makes up for the connections.
@BK Binj - having worked high travel jobs for the majority of my career, some to the tune of 80% on the road, I also evolved to using this strategy, both for my home Port and chosen destination airports. Logan or Providence? No brainer - PVD everytime. Stress minimization has a value.
That’s a fair point. Thank you
Tickets are cheaper aswell
That's why they're more considered "commuter" airlines. It helps add the frequencies in certain markets.
Indeed. The European model are indeed Regional Airlines = flying routes on which not enough customers are to fill a Boeing or an Airbus - or connecting minor airports to the bigger net. So many Major Carrier are owning their Regional Airlines as part of their Group: Lufthansa => Lufthansa Cityline and Air Dolomiti; KLM => KLM Cityhopper; Air France => Air France Hop; British Airways => BA Cityflyer; TAP Air Portugal => Portugallia; Aer Lingus => Aer Lingus Express; Finnair => NORRA; Aegean Airlines => Olympic Air. Only two Major Carrier are using the system to operate with "independent" Regional Airlines in this function: SAS (Scandinavia) with Cityjet (from Ireland) and Xfly (from Estonia) and Iberia with Air Nostrum (both in Spain). And there´re a couple of really independent Regional Airlines in Europe as Petter mentioned, doing there business on their own risk without supporting a Major Carrier: Bra in Sweden, Wideroe in Norway, Binter on the Canary Islands in Spain, Loganair in the UK, Amelia International and Chalair in France; Sprintair in Poland. Helvetic Airways in Switzerland is a mixed Regional Airline, being independent while doing with the half of their fleet Regional Services for Swiss and with the other half on their own risk.
That´s indeed a whole other system as the Commuter Airlines in the US! And I doubt that it will disappear.
I really like the frequency that you are making videos now. Keep it up. Thanks!!
As someone who’s worked their way through regionals to work for a major US airline, I appreciate this video. It’s often hard to explain all these issues when asked. You’ve done a great job condensing these issues into a digestible video.
Keep making great content!
I think you are missing one key thing in your equation. The regional airport in my area is 50% passenger/50% cargo. We have two key cargo deployments here, pharmaceutical and air feeder service for major package express integrators. The airport is quite a busy place despite it being small.
But that is just one airport.
As others have said, a big part of going more often with fewer people is that provide a more convenient schedule, and schedule is a big factor in choosing one airline over another. I think this model will continue for some time, but hopefully the pay gap is addressed.
Interesting video! I have flown BUF-BOS route many times to visit family. Normally I fly JetBlue, but the couple times I flew Delta, the route was flown by Envoy under Delta Connection. I also once had to fly from Florence, SC (FLO) to Charlotte, NC. That was on an ER145 operated by Piedmont under American Eagle (it is the only commercial route to and from FLO). On all of these flights, every seat was occupied, even on the ER145, and that route is flown multiple times per day. I hope pilots on these regional airlines continue to be compensated fairly and properly because these shorter, regional routes are the ones many of us fly when we do fly.
Thank you so much for this Captain Petter, you have answered a few of my questions I had. I'm in agreement with you on this video also as an outsider. When explaining anything, you make it so very clear & understandable, like piloting an aircraft on a clear day, good viduals & no overcast, just perfect. Thank you so much for sharing. ❤️✈️❤️✈️❤️
I appreciate your time that it took to make this video..... I can firmly attests that it would seem like a very unusual environment here in the US in regard to air travel.... just a few key points (from someone who's been doing this many years :) )
1) Regional airlines are not "Controlled" by the mainlines.... they BID for contract routes that the Mainlines simply don't want to use their own equipment to fly - this means that if Mesa (for example) bids on a contract route and states they can operate the route for AA (American Airlines) for $100 per person, and AA wants the route covered with the lowest bidder who in this case would be Mesa, then Mesa would most likely get the route for a specified amount of years or based on performance matrix ..... because Mesa does not sell directly to the AA Customer, AA will then decide on the ticket price, taking into account the bid package from Mesa, and then determine a fare to charge, of which $100 is passed onto Mesa... The mainline and Regional also have agreed upon "performance practices" that usually are dictated in a contract of operation at the time the route bid is awarded.
2) All Regional carriers compete with each other in this "bidding of routes". They are also partly responsible for bidding and contracting for gate space, bases for operations, maintenance, etc. Having a Regional do this saves Mainline Carriers Millions of dollars a year for NOT having to deal with such things as they already have their own network established with the more economical aircraft (as you mentioned in your video)
3) Regional pay - Mesa in 2019 would start a newly hired First Officer at $36 per hour.... with a 76 hour per month guarantee.... as of a few months ago, that number is now $100 per hour..... yeah way more than 50% increase - this is due mostly to trying to attract helicopter pilots who are looking to transition from Rotorcraft to Fixed wing flying as well as Part 135 Pilots who also might want to consider moving into a Part 121 Carrier.
4) because a 1500 hour Cessna pilot would qualify to obtain their ATP MEL License in the US (Airline Transport Pilot Multi-Engine Land) - only Part 121 carriers with approved training programs can "Train and Test the pilot candidate for the ATP MEL" - the cost for this was low and the process quick for the Regional Carriers to get FAA approval for these programs... therefore, new pilots who want their ATP MEL license to operate in the US will most always have to go through a Regional carrier to obtain this. This was something that the airlines lobbies our law makers in 2011 and 2012, and in 2014 the amended rules were implemented by the FAA.
5) Every Mainline is represented by various unions..... American Airlines has the Allied Pilots Association, where as Envoy (owned by American) has ALPA (Airline Pilots Association) - nether of these groups intend to merge, and rightfully so mostly due to the Scope Clause that you very clearly explained. Mainline pilots want to feel like their jobs are protected, and it can take years to earn the spot or obtain employment with a Mainline because of the strict criteria that the Unions have help to establish.
6) Regional Airlines have been "upgrading" (or a better term would be "migrating") to the E-175 based on customer satisfaction surveys - the traveling US customer base prefers a aircraft that is a bit larger than the Q400 (and even the CRJ 900) and looks for "comfort" features that the E-175 in the 76 seat configuration provides.... yes the regional could certainly go to E-190's, but would really take the hit for not being able to outfit them with 90 or more seats to make the plane profitable.... also some regional airlines have hardware acquisition agreements in place with the mainlines, where the mainline will purchase an aircraft (such as an E-175) and then lease it to a Regional for operations.
I agree that the term "Regional" is really no longer one that applies here, but to indicate that the Regionals that are still in operation today (Envoy, PSA, Piedmont, Skywest, Republic, Air Wisconsin) could potentially be in danger of no longer existing just doesn't seem to be the case..... during the pandemic, we did see a few carriers fold, and those routes were quickly taken by other carriers.... but this "folding" was purely of financial means.... something you also addressed in your video.
Having the regional airlines "look" like they are part of the Mainline operation is also key to the customer, who in many ways is already fed up with the hassles that air travel can impose... there is a aire of convenience to purchasing a round trip ticket on AA.COM knowing the whole route is serviced by AA or an affiliate.... Breeze is going to have an up hill battle to win over customers in that fashion as many US Travelers who reside in smaller communities serviced by "what looks to be AMERICAN OR UNITED" and are traveling from say Austin TX to New York City, NY, won't want to have to check in for a flight, go through security, get the gate, board the plane, get to DFW, go out to baggage claim, check in to a different carrier's flight, go through security (again), and then get to the gate just to head to NYC.... Breeze and the network they will provide would most likely be more a competitor to the likes of Southwest, Jet Suite X, and XO Jet.
overall some great content.... thank you for sharing your thoughts!
I don’t live in the US but Higher frequency is sometimes nice because if there is a missed connection etc ... and it offers more options for connections. That is also likely why Cathay Pacific used to operate 5 777s with some flights leaving 1hr after another, and around 20 flights to Beijing per day in 320/330s.
I live in Gainesville, so I'm quite familiar with our "little" regional airport (though it has grown a bit in recent years - they recently added two new gates in addition). While most of the flights out of GNV are regional flights (mostly to Atlanta, Charlotte, and Miami), we do also see a bit of mainline flights too. Delta has started using the 717 on the Atlanta service, for example, and there are also a lot of charter flights for UF athletic events.
We have seen some turboprop services over the years - most recently Silver flew Beechcraft 1900s and Saab 340s on a few short-haul flights, and American Eagle had an ATR-72 for its Miami service before it switched over to ERJs, and I think people prefer to fly in the larger and more "modern" jets.
Fantastic video. Keep up the good work.
Having more flights means more flexibility for passengers. This can be especially important when transferring to a different airline.
I've chosen one airline over another several times just because of their additional flights that give me a bigger buffer between flights or allow me to catch ground transportation. Even if it was more expensive to do so. I can't imagine having only one flight a day to choose from, or even one every two days.
The regionals that I'm used to here in the U.S. are often at airports that could support heavier aircraft, but don't due to economics. Much of that is based on the percentage of fill that a plane has; if it's too empty, flights get cancelled here. I'm not certain, but I suspect that there are laws on the books in Europe that doesn't allow for cancelling flights as easily as they do in the U.S., which is why it might have a different result.
Yeah, european companies and foreign ones that depart from Europe have to pay the customers and in some cases offer food and a place to stay if flights are delayed for more than a few hours (I think 2 or 3), and if the flight is cancelled (on top of the free ticket on a different flight or the money back).
They don’t cancel them because they don’t fly to them. European airlines only serve main cities. Trains then serve the outliers. Europe has a much higher population density.
@@h-0058 I wish I, here in the US would get money back if my flights were delayed. Sometime can't even get peanuts without paying and arm and a leg. Also, I think like people have been mentioning in previous posts, US is accustomed to flying and don't have the rail infrastructure that make trains a viable competitor to 'cheap' flights.
@@h-0058 I wish I, here in the US would get money back if my flights were delayed. Sometime can't even get peanuts without paying and arm and a leg. Also, I think like people have been mentioning in previous posts, US is accustomed to flying and don't have the rail infrastructure that make trains a viable competitor to 'cheap' flights.
Actually, here in the US we have the Essential Air Service program that was part of the airline deregulation act that passed in 1978. The federal government has a number of routes that no passengers or airlines would ever expect to have a use for airline travel, but Congress makes the FAA put the routes out for bids and the lowest bidder gets to fly a scheduled service according to the contract requirements without caring if there is a single passenger on board. The government is paying enough to provide the service and a profit on these routes knowing that most flights don't have any paying passengers.
I understand your perspective Mentour. I grew up on farm and originally from a small town in rural Southwest Minnesota. I currently live and work in Denver, CO. I am extremely lucky to be able to fly from DIA (DEN) Denver International Airport into ATY or Watertown Regional Airport. SkyWest used to provide EAS (Essential Air Service) into Watertown from DIA via United Branding. The contract recently was then awarded to Denver Air Connection (Headquartered right across Arapahoe Road at Centennial Airport from where I work at US. Foods) I cherish the EAS service provided for passengers flying from DIA into Watertown, SD. The farm I grew up on which is in the middle of nowhere is only a half hour from Watertown, SD or ATY. It is absolutely amazing that I can get from Denver to the middle of nowhere USA in an hour. I feel I am very fortunate and will ALWAYS advocate EAS into Watertown, SD. Also a couple of fun facts: ATY just built a brand new terminal that is now open. Barack Obama when he was President of the United States visited Watertown, SD not once, but twice during his presidency, which is very astonishing. They flew a modified Boeing 757 into this airport as Air Force one. Watertown, SD is a very rural town and is considered a very small town by major city standards. I cannot say enough great things about Denver Air Connection and ATY for keeping EAS. Normally what would be a 12 hour drive, I can arrive home to visit my family and hometown within an hour. I state all of this as each EAS situation is very circumstantial and can have vast difference in model from route to route in the United States. Currently Denver Air Connection uses Embraer 145 50 seat jets from DIA into ATY. It is also very cool to work at US. Foods in Centennial and see these very same jets land at their home base for maintenance at APA in Centennial. I share all this, as this is a very specific example of a very small regional airline in the United States thriving while connecting very rural America to major United States Airports. Love your videos Mentour and wanted to shed some light on my experience flying recently in the United States using a very small regional airline.
Why doesn't US Foods fly you home in a private jet!? Just kidding. But Seneca Foods in Penn Yan NY has three jets and they operate the airport, too.
JetBlue avoided this scope trap by not having regional contract carriers (except for Cape Air flying Cessna 402s in a few niche markets). They bought E-190s to operate their entire own system with their own equipment.
JetBlue uses Silver airways for their intraflorida connections. I’ve flown a connection from FLL to MCO in one of them it was very strange lol.
Feels like you've looked into the dominant east coast airlines and sort of bizarrely ignored the other half of the country? Western states tend to be more sparsely populated and have regional airline models more akin to the European style described. Horizon Air (regional for Alaska Air) even runs a whole fleet of turboprops. Alaskan regional air travel is such a complicated mess of tiny airports and puddle jumpers there's been at least one entire TV series about it. And Hawaii has its own complex thing going on with inter-island travel.
Overall the video is an interesting look at one part of the US but definitely gives off serious "European doesn't quite grasp how big the US is" vibe. A followup about western regional models (and perhaps how they intersect with the more east-biased "big three", since that's often an interesting mess) would be appreciated. If only to make it feel less silly that you didn't mention Alaska a single time when discussing US regional air travel. You know the capital city of Alaska can only be accessed by air or boat, right?
17:51 "Breeze Airways... are the only US airline with E-190s and E-195s." Actually one other airline has E-190s - JetBlue operates 60 of them. JetBlue has begun replacing their E-190s with A220s, and anticipates the entire fleet will have been replaced with A220s by 2025. The A220 has markedly better fuel economy - despite having 40 more seats than the E-190, it uses less fuel.
Well Petter says "the only US airline with E-190s AND E-195s"... which is correct. And strictly-speaking, Breeze would quite like to have only E-195s, but couldn't find enough of them, so Petter's point of maximizing regional jet size, stands.
Interesting. A lot to unpack here. I flew back and forth from GNV to SBN numerous times last year for business. American and Delta regionals service GNV with a half-dozen departures per day. I don't see the demand for a larger aircraft than the Bomber regionals in use. As an aside, having flown a new A220 I asked an attendant if we would ever see something like that serving GNV. His response was priceless: "When I'm asleep. That'll only happen in my dreams."
Hi, been watching your videos on both your channels for some time now. Very informative and educational as well. May i know which type of air crafts your fly and your usual routes ? Btw Im from Sri Lanka. Looking forward to more videos.
Well.. legacy airlines operate hub to hub flights. As you already know these hub airports are already at their full capacity. In other words, it is impossible to increase flight numbers at these hub airports. That’s why multiple operations from midsize airports to hub airports are still existing. Therefore, legacy airlines could divide the passenger demands effectively. By doing so, the each legacy airlines can tie their passengers within their operation networks. Even though this strategy would cost more than operating one big aircraft, in a bigger pictures, the legacy airlines get more benefits from this type of operations. Also regional airline companies are still profitable. So at this point, I don’t think regional airlines will be disappeared anytime soon in the US.
I found it interesting that due to Dallas-Fort Worth being a hub (as well as Phoenix) that I flew from Phoenix, Arizona to Daytona Beach, Florida and both legs were on a CRJ-900. Probably happens frequently but it's the first time I flew nearly all the way across the USA in only regional jets.
i find that we're doing that more often. I know there are a lot of unbid (ie vacant) slots at mainline right now. The need is real.
@@genxer74 In all reality I didn't mind the 2 legs cross country on a CRJ--I kind of prefer them due to 2-2 seating and much faster boarding and deplaning.
One other thing to consider is that 1 flight a day to a destination vs 2-3 is less convenient both for flight connections and for day businesses trips. Hence flights will sell better if there is higher frequency on a smaller aircraft.
I work for a regional airline (piedmont airlines) based in the USA, operating regional routes for American Airlines. The demand is huge and flights are in extremely high demand. Regional airlines(PSA, piedmont, mesa) 😮were responsible for keeping the airlines in business during the pandemic. No one expected for the demand to shoot through the roof like it did. We can’t keep enough pilots staffed to support all these routes. They’re giving great bonuses right now for pilots looking for a career.
Surely it’s also more convenient for travelers when more flights are offered.
Yes it is, and don’t call me Shirley.
One issue not mentioned is that N/A has very poor rail/bus service. The log distance between major airports means that the regions may still be necessary to get people to the major airports.
There´re in fact two very different systems in Europe and in the US: The relevant US Carrier are Commuter Airlines, not Regional Airlines. They´ve a different role in different Business Models.
The European Model is indeed that the relevant Carrier are operating as Regional Airlines either in flying routes on which are not enough customers to fill a Boeing or an Airbus or in flying routes to minor airports to connect them. So in Europe either the Major Carrier are owning their Regional Airlines as part of their Group (Lufthansa => Lufthansa Cityline and Air Dolomiti; KLM => KLM Cityhopper; Air France => Air France Hop; British Airways => BA Cityflyer; TAP Air Portugal => Portugallia; Finnair => NORRA; Aegean Airlines => Olympic Air) or they´re really independent Airlines operating on their own risk (Bra in Sweden; Wideroe in Norway; Loganair in the UK; Binter and Canarias Airlines on the Canary Islands in Spain; Amelia International and Chalair in France; Sprintair in Poland - Helvetic Airways in Switzerland is a mixed Regional Airline, being independent but operating with one half of their fleet for Swiss, with the other half on their own risk). Only in two cases there´re "independent" Regional Airlines operating for a Major Carrier: SAS (Scandinavia) => Cityjet (Ireland) and Xfly (Estonia); Iberia => Air Nostrum (both from Spain). But both cases are still Regional Airlines in the European sense.
Therefore they own a wide range of Aircrafts, depending on their specific and often very different operations, different fleet policies and of course financial backgrounds: Lufthansa Cityline A 319-100, E 190 and CRJ 900; Air Dolomiti E 195; KLM Cityhopper E 175 (yes!), E 190 and E 195-E2; Air France Hop E 170 (yes!), E 190 and CRJ 1000; BA Cityflyer E 190; Portugallia E 190 and E 195; NORRA E 190 and ATR 72; Olympic Air ATR 42, ATR 72, Dash 8-100 and Dash 8-400; Bra ATR 72; Wideroe E 190E-2, Dash 8-100, Dash 8-200, Dash 8-300 and Dash 8-400; Loganair ERJ 135, ERJ 145, ATR 42, ATR 72, Saab 340, Twin Otter and even Britten-Norman Islander; Binter E 195E-2 and ATR 72; Canarias ATR 72; Amelia A 319-100, ERJ 135, ERJ 145, ATR 42, ATR 72 and Beechcraft 1900C; Chalair ATR 42 and ATR 72; Sprintair ATR 72 and Saab 340; Helvetic E 190, E 190-E2 and E 195 -E2; Cityjet CRJ 900; Xfly CRJ 900 and ATR 72; Air Nostrum CRJ 1000, CRJ 200 and ATR 72.
That´s a whole other story in the US and I doubt the Commuter System will disappear there in the foreseeable Future.
I finally watched this video & I subscribed. I'm sorry that it took me so long!
Gosh this is a well-timed video for me. My father moved earlier this year and I flew out to visit him in the middle of October, which was the first time I'd flown in quite a few years because all my family was just a short drive away. I've been an aviation geek all my life because my dad is a pilot, and regional airlines in the US have always been just as common to see as the Major airlines, especially out of Charlotte, NC where I live. The flight I took was rather short, just 30 minutes spent in the air, and I fully expected it to be via American Eagle on a smaller regional jet since Charlotte is an American hub. I was shocked to find that this short flight was not only flown on A320-series jets, but they were both American Airlines and not a regional carrier. When I arrived at Myrtle Beach, SC, I expected to be on the one "big" jet at the airport but that was also not the case! In my two visits at Myrtle Beach for arrival and departure, I saw ONE regional jet: A CRJ via Delta Express. All the other jets were American, Spirit, or Southwest. I thought this was so strange, because I've just grown accustomed to seeing regional jets at smaller airports and I've assumed that short, 1-hour or less flights would be on a regional jet but that's not the case! All that considered, it does seem like the US market has seen a huge uptick in low-cost carriers like Southwest, JetBlue, and Frontier, and maybe that could be impacting the regional stuff as well, perhaps? I certainly don't know, but it would be sad to see all the smaller jets vanish from the skies in the future.
First off, regionals can’t fly A320s. Second, the size of plane they get depends on the passenger demand of the airplane and not the size of the city. Myrtle Beach is very popular in the summer and fills mid-sized jets easily. Winter schedules are much more scaled down though.
Myrtle Beach is a bit of an exception - maybe because it is a beach/conference destination? I fly in and out there quite a bit and see the same thing you did. I used to fly out of Manchester, NH (MHT) and that is closer to what I think you are thinking of - lots of RJ's. The only larger passenger planes are Southwest flying 737's. When Continental was around, they had one daily 737, but eventually swapped it for an RJ because passenger load didn't support it. MHT airport can support Air Force 1, and Fedex/UPS DC10's fly in and out daily.
I would also imagine that culture plays a large role. Turboprop planes are viewed as antiqued technology by the US general public. Even 25 years ago, it was very rare to see a turboprop passenger plane.
No it wasn't. Turbo props were everywhere in the late 90s early 2000s
And they are loud and slow.
They still exist alaska horizon still operate a bunch of q400s
Good video... but I'm not sure about that. I fly from a small regional airport (COU) typically on Embraer 175s... with flights are typically full or almost full. Schedules are very accommodating - with flights in and out from 6 AM, 9 AM, 5 PM and 9 PM... going to Chicago, Dallas, and Denver. A 737 would either be underutilized or the flights would be limited to just once or twice a day... greatly diminishing its usefulness for frequent business flyers. I love flying from my regional... it's convenient, parking is free, very little wait time, and I really like the 2-by-2 seating of the Embraers! So I hope you're wrong... 🙂
You comp,Evelyn forgot a West Coast airline that is shifting to local jets and expanding into eastern markets: Alaska Airlines. Their regional subsidiary, Horizon, is in the process of upgrading from Q-400s to the Embraer E-175. Alaska also has a strong presence in the trans-Pacific markets.
Nice video. Couple things I would like to add.
Most of the regionals here in the US are based on a “fee for departure” model. In other words the regional airline is getting its cut in money based on the departure of the plane and not the seat sale. So technically i regional could takeoff with no passengers and still see the same revenue compared that same aircraft fully loaded. With that said, the regional is unable to cover its increase in payroll by simple increasing its ticket costs, they have no control over that.
I won’t name companies but some are threatening bankruptcy, while not confirmed, due to this issue. This is only furthering the idea that regional airlines might be out the door sooner than later.
One thin to also keep in mind, while as of now the regional pay rates and major pay rates are close, and in even some cases better, the majors always have the option to raise the pay scale on that side. Maybe in the near future we will see that regional airlines all of a sudden are still a cheaper alternative simply because the major airlines are offering even higher pay than regionals once more. This seems to be the road we are going down considering the Alaskan airline deal and multiple airlines are threatening strikes. Time will tell.
The most charming aspect of flying on a regional jet here is being stuck on an old CRJ with a/c condensation dripping on you from the ceiling panels.
United's new CRJ550 layout is has been a nice surprise, but there is still a huge room for improved service quality.
I'm hoping the Breeze's of the world and new planes like Embraer's turboprop will provide another option on these routes.
It will sure be interesting to see!
The CRJ550 is a CRJ700 with 50 seats. The first 550s WERE 700s, that were re-certified.
@@spyrosg3172 Yes, and?
@@eheis5 And it kind of demonstrates the problem here. The only reason the 550 exists, is to satisfy the letter of the 50-seat segment of the scope clause (sort of -- there's an MTOW waiver). There are no 550s outside the US. These jets only make sense because there is no true modern 50-seater out there. Unless Embraer's planned turboprop covers it... sometime, maybe.
Sir I'm enjoying your detail analysis on aviation industry for quite a while now ! and certainly the videos are so intense and greatly made that I watch them even if an hour long !
I've a request can you please cover and give your expert analysis on the tragedy of PIA flight PK8303 on your channel Mentour pilot.
Thank you. 👍
The biggest open secret in the industry is that the A220-300 and Embraer E2-195 have similar (if not better) fuel burn per seat to a 737MAX7 or A319neo, and they are much nicer to fly in the cabin. Airlines like KLM, Air Canada, Air Baltic, Qantas and Air France have figured this out. So have Breeze and Delta.
Yea they'd be much more popular in the US, it's Pilot Union contract stipulations that keep them out "weight requirements".
Great episode as always. Very interesting. I live near Seattle and do most of my travel on the west coast. I looked up my last trip: Delta 3551 Operated by SkyWest DBA Delta Connection. I'm definitely seeing a trend of using E175 where we'd normally see A320 family or B737
Edit: My last trip, Seattle to Denver on E75L, 2.5 hours, huge airport to huge airport
I work in the operations department for a Regional Airline in Europe, Blue islands, we currently have a fleet of 5 ATR72-500. As much as we are looking as expanding our fleet and modernising it. We find the ATR are perfect for what we need around the UK and Europe
Great video! PBS frontline did a great documentary on regional airlines a while ago. Back when colgan air had that crash in NY. I recommend. Flying cheap. Is the name of the video. You can find it here on RUclips
Breeze Airlines just voted to unionize in August of this year, so they're probably also heading for the same situation.
It is also a stepping latter! You start out and do your time in the regionals and the you get bumped up to main !
A good friend of mine flew many years as captain on a crj900 for american eagle and then got hired by American as a first officer on the airbus.
Yes, but it is an artificial step. There is nothing really stopping the majors from employing the pilots to start with like they do in Europe.
Doesn’t need to be a stepping stone. I make 100 a hour already. Just merge me with delta keep the pay and fence me on the 900 for 3-5 years once I make captain. Attrition problem solved. I would have no reason to leave I’m already at delta and they get a steady amount of 900 captains
@@MentourNow The mindset in the US is regional, trunkline, then trunkline international (the BIG bucks). Also, the trunklines (AA, UA, DL, & AS) own regionals. Why alienate a well running regional flight deck crew by skipping over them. This would only provide discord and rancor among regional crews.
@@MentourNow I do agree with a lot of your observations... other than the system in the US is a creation of Congress to keep the taxpayer money spigot flowing. I do need to point out that you are making a very unusual argument by being selective in what European aviation practices you mention in contrast to the flaws in the US.
You claim that the EU airlines use the aircraft that are most efficient for the mission and pilots don't have the divide between regional and majors for compensation and quality of life. Doesn't the EU have a system for pilots to live as independent contractors for airlines and operate without the job security and benefits that the majors offer their employees? It just seems like in this one video where the thesis of the video is to criticize the US system, you seem to paint the EU as some kind of pilots Utopia.
@@hewhohasnoidentity4377 From what ive heard there’s one airline that does that. The big irish one with only 737’s !
Thank you for this explanation. I live in the largest city in my state, but still many times when I fly places the option is a regional jet. This makes more sense now. It is nice to have more frequent, but smaller, point-to-point flights, but as a tall person I do value being able to fully stand up in the aisle of the plane. The Embraer E-jets are OK, but I don’t love the CRJs.
Gainesville airport may have a long runway due to the university in that town, but the airport is absolutely tiny. Regional is an aspiration for that airport
I used to fly on a small Embraer “United Express” from Modesto to San Francisco, and then on to a bigger plane from San Francisco to wherever. The flight from Modesto to SF took 15-20 minutes. The drive from Modesto to SF took… depending on traffic, which is always horrible, 2.5-3 h.
I loved that short flight in the small plane, (maybe 50 seats or thereabouts), you always got such good views, since the smaller plane was flying much lower than the big jets. It was very noisy, it had propellers. But hey, it saved time and traffic headaches. One year they suddenly stopped the service from the Modesto Airport, it was some years before the pandemic. That was a sad day for me. Back into the road traffic I went!
Yes, somebody here mentioned the smaller plane is more fun, and that’s often the case. You really feel like you’re flying. In a big jet you often don’t even feel like you’re in the air, if you didn’t see clouds you might just think you’re on a train. That’s probably just fine with most passengers, but I always enjoy a bit of rocking and rolling!
Roller coaster without having to wait in line!
@@AndrewSteitz you do wait in line… the TSA line. But after that… pure joy! 🙃
I think there were some missed opportunities to focus on flights that are in the Midwest or mountain west to actually see that there are many routes that do not warrant a 76 seater, or even a 50 seater sometimes. Horizon also operates turboprops, and companies like Ravn exist in basically just one state.
There are MANY routes that have minuscule needs but long runways which make it seamless to operate a CRJ (even a 200). There’s also really weird routes out there.
From having lived in some of these communities that maybe have one destination to a larger hub, regionals fill that role wonderfully. Why they aren’t actual parts of the larger company is perhaps the real question.
I do wish more research was done in this case.
Well, I did mention that there still will be a need for smaller regionals in some cases. This video looks at the broad view.
Horizon Air is phasing out the turboprops in favor of E175s. One knock-on effect this is having, is that small communities are announcing that their airports are getting "jet service".
@@stephancox9105 Right, no one wants to fly on those slow and loud turboprops.
@@johnp139 Not that regional jets are much better. They're still worked and crewed by neophytes who do more work for less money.
Alot of "regional airports" in the US may be larger size airports (longer runways) because many US regional airports were at one time WWII airfields.
im in a smaller town in northern US. a few hours away from any large population zone. we still have some turbo props still and you can request them for a puddle jumper to the larger metro. i really enjoy them. our airport is only two runways but they are large, air force one lands here during the campaigns and we have a very large active air guard unit here that is CONSTANTLY flying over my house.
I recall American Airlines stating that its customers wanted multiple flights per day, in order to get home sooner after business.
I always thought that the majors wanted to keep the smaller plane flights, which have lower pilot training requirements, at arm's length, for reputation and maybe liability. They don't brand the flights with their own name exactly, but rather American Eagle, Delta Connection, etc.
I always suspected that Breeze's eventual goal was to fly nonstop from major city suburban airports, which are less slot limited, avoiding connections and crowded larger airports. For instance, HPN and ISP.
Shhh don't let anyone know about ISP... Best airport no one knows about!
Oh dear ..Islip;)