Ups & Downs From Star Trek: Strange New Worlds 1.2 - Children of the Comet
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- Опубликовано: 2 окт 2024
- The Uhura and Spock band are back together.
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To quote Captain Janeway when she was talking about the 23rd Century, “they were a little slower to invoke the Prime Directive… and a little quicker to pull their phasers.”
“And it would be a fun time to live in “from Incense Harry Kim.
Yeah it didn’t feel out of step with TOS era prime directive interpretations.
Janeway over ruled the Prime Directive in the Omega Molecule episode.
Yeah, I see it as Pike's very cavelier attitude about it all. It'll be interesting to see if James Kirk is a green stickler for the rules in his appearance and it's his interactions with Pike that lead to his more cavelier attitude as well.
Love Janeway in this scene! “Of course, the whole bunch of them would be booted out of Starfleet today.” 😂
Honestly felt this was an almost perfect episode for startrek. How could you not give an up for Spock laughing. It was so unexpected and perfect.
Yeah disappointed in Sean for not acknowledging this at all.
Nurse Chapel as a character in this new series slapped me across the face. I was immediately mesmerized by her, and after one episode she's one character I'm looking forward to seeing a lot more about her.
😒
Chapel is hot 😍
@@stevedergamer5322 And she can throw down while being super chill. Even hotter!
She is bringing this really engaging charisma to the character!
I love her too, but I hope her involvement doesn't come at the expense of Dr. M'Benga, who we don't see in this episode at all.
No one, Majel Barrett especially, thought Chapel was a well-developed character by modern standards, even during the Seventies. She was much happier playing Luwuxana Troi on TNG, and would no doubt be delighted (and maybe a little envious) with how Chapel has been re-envisioned in this show.
The fact that chapel in strange new worlds makes chapel in the original look bad to me was a bad creative decision because of the discontinuity it creates. That being said the new character in strange new worlds is fantastic, I just think that they should have named the character after a famous geneticist, something like Crick which would be just like the naming of Stemets in discovery after a notable mycologist. But overall thus far I am liking the scripting and the episodic nature of the show.
The producers didn't like that she was on the show at all which is why it was hard to get her things to do.
@@kanaric No. She was sleeping with the producer, i.e. Gene Roddenberry, which is why the Chapel character was on the show at all. It was the network that didn’t want her around.
@@michaelhall2709 Wasn't it Lucille Ball (the owner of the studio that make TOS) who didn't want MB around? For the reason that mentioned - MB was sleeping with Roddenberry, who was married to someone else at the time. Ball was extra-sensitive to that kind of thing after her divorce from Desi Arnez just a couple of years before.
Majel Barrett was, sadly, a recipient of the prejudices of her era.
I disagree with the down for "breaking the prime directive." The Paradise Syndrome saw the Enterprise dispatched on a very similar mission- to deflect an asteroid that was on a collision course with a planet that housed a primitive culture. Since that was an actual mission objective and took place after this, it must be established that they can intervene in such situations. Pike actually offers that distinction when he speaks to the shepherds. (As a side note, the planet in The Paradise Syndrome was equipped with a means by which to save itself- placed there by a race that was shepherding it. This creates another parallel to this story. )
Agree
Was gonna mention this but you beat me too it! :)
Also, its more "General Order 1" and not prime directive yet (as stated in the first episode). What actually constitutes "interfering with the evolution" has never been really defined (if i remember correctly) so their actions might very well been within established guidelines of Starfleet
Agree
Exactly sorry Sean that's an UP!
What I liked about Uhuru’s journey in this episode was near the end when she was strongly discouraged from leaving Starfleet, just like Nichelle Nichols was discouraged - by MLK - from leaving TOS.
That crossed my mind as well!
Regarding Spock's butting into Uhura's conversation with Hemmer, I suggest a new piece of jargon for Star Trek: "Spocksplaining."
Prime Director issue:
Data convinced Picard to interfere to save a world in the episode "Pen Pals"...
The point is that a nonspace-faring species with a space based threat can be saved as long as the population doesn't know about it.
Also, The Preservers have been known to leave devices to protect worlds.
I think the issue is too messy to not have at least had a line in there from Number 1 about "hey Cap, is this a Prime Directive issue?". Moving a comet that was clearly visible to the native population, are we going to create another visible bright light in the sky situation, what if we push the comet to a new orbit that crashes into another planet 100 years from now that it would never had along its current trajectory... yada yada. It warrants at least a mention of the PD instead of sheer silence.
@@erasure25 "moving" the comet is probably not too noticeable from the planet surface - only a small change in trajectory would be needed.
Now, the rockets firing might have been a different matter...
Picard's behavior in that episode still appalls me. He's content to let a species die that they could save without interfering, and it takes an android to get him to do the humane thing.
What I enjoy so far in this series: I love that they melded the episodic nature of TOS and TNG but have actual character development (which said series didn't do too well). Now it's only 2 episodes in but I'm liking what I see so far.
Completely disagree with the second down. The whole point is that the Prime Directive shouldn't mean letting civilizations die, even though that was shown several times in Berman-era Trek. This is one of those tweaks to canon that I really appreciate. Up from me for the same point.
Absolutely. The PD was handled horribly in the TNG era.
I get what you're saying but meddling is meddling.
I think when it comes to things that happen off planet should be exempt from the prime directive because from the civilisations point of view they probably won’t notice the influence until they reach warp capability. Unlike Into Darkness where there was a very clear exposure of the crew. They’re two vastly different scenarios. Going by the logic that has been applied for that down starfleet should have assisted Agnes’ collective at the end of picard because there’s the potential they are altering the course of undeveloped worlds in that sector
I point to TOS Season 3 Episode 3 "The Paradise Syndrome". The same premise set several years later. Starfleet's non-intervention policy will remain much more flexible for quite some time after this point in Federation.
To be fair, Pike did tell the alien commander that Starfleet does not interfere with natural development but they don't allow them to die either. Right or wrong, that was his reasoning. Regarding the torpedo hits: the simple answer is that they hit different shield faces, giving the other ones time to recharge.
Also, after the first few hits, where the Enterprise wasn't really moving, most of the hits were glancing ones - they didn't really take a full-on, square impact with the shields, so presumably less energy was used deflecting the explosion. It's a bit of an inconsistency, but one I certainly can live with.
If only Picard remembered that during Pen Pals.
I think it would have worked if they were debating it and then they found the alien structure. Not a natural occurrence, we can intervene no problem, rest of the episode goes off like normal.
Well Piccard was all for saving them... But then data informed him that his own pal was a child - the arch enemy of early season TNG Piccard. XD
@@katherineberger6329 very true, not all torpedo hits are going to hit in the same way. A glancing hit is obviously going to drain less energy than a direct hit.
Is it my imagination or have we learned more about Uhura in just 2 episodes of Strange New Worlds than we did during the entirety of the original series and all of its follow up movies?
My understanding of those “9 hits” is that they were fragments of the comet colliding with the Enterprise.
They didn’t glow like torpedoes.
It was debris from the comet tail as they were flying behind it
Exactly. I also would say that after that 50% hit more power from non-essential systems was used to reinforce the shields.
Chunks like that pose no threat to the shields any way. Even if shields were down the navigational deflectors would break those up as they hit.
The acting from Anson Mount during the dinner...the amount of emotion he expressed THEN SWALLOWED when he said 'where do you see yourself in 10 years' was brilliant. It deserves another up, honestly. I verbally 'oofed', which happened again when he named the cadets he saves in the future.
As to Chapel flirting with Spock, we see them hanging out in the trailers, and I think this is a DELIBERATE and purposeful nod to the Naked Time and even Spock boarding the Enterprise in The Motion Picture (and I'm sure other scenes I'm not thinking of at the moment) where Chapel expresses affection or even love for Spock. Like, if she legitimately has a thing for him in this show (provided they also address the super creepy mentor she is engaged who is the 'villain' of What Little Girls are Made Of), it just adds context not only to her admission in The Naked Time but Spock's reaction (where he was also sick, and trying to resist likely latent feelings, all the more complicated as he was still engaged to T'Pring in that scene in TOS, and obviously has stronger feelings for his fiance now).
They and them are a group of people. Him her are singular
@@ljs2274 incorrect but good to know we have transphobes watching this channel.
@@ljs2274 'Thon' is the singular of 'they' and is useful where 'they' would cause ambiguity.
@@jamesfoster9613 There may be several things going on here:
It’s not uncommon to use they/them until clarification can be made.
As Gooding’s Uhura hasn’t self-identified to my knowledge, and most of us don’t have the ability to just ask the *character*, Seán might be choosing to avoid making the assumption.
Why would he do that? Well, Gooding’s pronouns are she/they, and quite frankly, because *many* Trek fans often speak of a character and their actor simultaneously and/or interchangeably, it remains possible that Seán was speaking of Gooding and not Uhura, or speaking of actor and role together.
Contextually, it might not be any more complicated than Seán referring to a group rather than a single person.
IDK. It worked for me.
I'm afraid I disagree with the Prime Directive when it comes to preserving life. I mean you don't have to reveal yourself to people who aren't ready for space travel. However, stopping a comet and saving lives really isn't interfering with their evolution. They cannot evolve if they are dead. Besides, why are they even out exploring space if they aren't motivated to help other species and/or gain mutual benefits from them. If humans have figured out how to get rid of disease, poverty, and war on Earth, wouldn't they want to tell the universe how they did it? Also, correct me if I'm wrong, they never mention if a malevolent or concurring race like the Klingons ever follow the Prime Directive. That would be a good idea for an episode or two. Cleaning up a disaster first contact from some bad guys. But I guess the first episode kinda did that.
"They cannot evolve if they are dead." Exactly.
To be fair, the Prime Directive is a story device to provide opportunities for thought provoking debate of rule based principles vs humanist principles, at least IMO. There should possibly have been a discussion in the conference room (which is vast BTW) though.
@@susanscott8653 And here we are discussing it. :) You make a good point about discussing the issue. That is one thing I've noticed throughout Trek: A very small group of people (bridge crew), make huge world impacting decisions. Kirk didn't even consult Starfleet when he decided to deposite Kahn on an uninhabited planet. no jury, no committee. lol! In the real world this would be debated and over analyzed by very large committee. But you can't take it too seriously.
If an alien race had stopped the KT event we would not be here. T-rex would be president of Earth, and a alligator would be VP (;
OTOH, maybe a alien race SENT that rock to wipe out the dinos just so little mammals could grow up to become a space traveling species.
On the gripping hand... There is the 'fermi paradox' we seem to be totally alone... So spreading our own life throughout the universe is probably a good idea O_o
@@cozmothemagician7243 The KT was a mother fucker. But technically that's part of the planets evolution. And now we're using the internet and sipping on congac..
Imagine if Athea didnt hit Earth, but instead, it just side swiped earth, creating rotation and, well if you're smart enough to watch ST all your life. You should have a pretty good idea of Gen 1/PD.
This might be a kind of macabre reference, but after Uhura talked about her parents dying, she said, "And my older brother."
In 1997, Nichelle Nicholls' brother Thomas was part of the Heaven's Gate cult that believed an angel in the tail of the Hale-Bopp Comet would rapture them away. He died in their mass suicide. They even referred to themselves as "Children of the Comet."
That would make this episode even MORE pathetic:
Oh wow- that sent me down a rabbit hole. It was her younger brother per wikipedia but still …
Heavens Gate cult members even referred to the mission to the Hale Bop Comet as an 'away mission.'
That’s some weird and spooky shit that will be on some sharp retro RUclipsrs review video in 20 years, inspiring conspiracy theories.
@@greggstrasser5791 How so?
There appears to be a problem with the design of the bridge - how do the consoles function without being filled with exploding rocks?
The rocks were all used up in Disco
The rocks don’t get installed until Tuesday.
Well see the problem is when you hire engineers that don't feel the need to place explosives in the console and sparklers in the ceilings then the rock unions and sparkle producers all end up out of work and that is a down from me, how dare you cause unemployment in the Star Trek universe.
@@joermnyc I was actually going to say that. Great minds think alike!
Those are safety rocks.
14:00 The subsequent hits to the shields after those 3 torpedoes were ICE from the comet trail, that's why the shields held up, the Aliens stopped firing for fear they'd hit their god-comet
and the fact they were re-routing power to the shields between hits.
Exactly, they're just showing the ice hitting the shields which are no threat to the shields at all.
I was going to point that out.
Agreed. There's a lot more to shields and torpedo hits than the percentages. A stationary Enterprise receiving 3 direct hits gets a hefty knock to the shields, that immediately begin to regenerate. Every torpedo strike after is a glancing blow, with lesser drops in shield integrity accordingly. And the ice hits wouldn't even mildly reduce shield integrity.
Incorrect. If you watch it again, right after Ortegas goes into her maneuver, the ship gets hit 8 or 9 times by torpedoes directly from the other ship, along with a few rocks, before getting in front of the comet and then the other ship stops firing.
Can we take a moment to appreciate Ethan Peck's Spock? The dude comes in and has instant chemistry with whoever he's sharing the scene with.
Instant chemistry even though he has to present such a reserved front.
@@kaicreech7336 He's Vulcan.
@@pglanville that's my point: he has a remarkably difficult role that he's making look very easy
He has definitely developed more like Nimoy Spock in this series than in Discovery. In his spirit that is. His mannerisms aren't quite like Nimoy's, but that's okay. I was a little worried about his performance then. I feel better about it now.
Right? He is not only nailing his own character, but he constantly feeds his scene partners.
Massive up from me was (and I actually cried out with "YES!" when it happened!) - The sustained phaser BEAM instead of the "Pew Pew Pew" style of phasers.
Didn't you miss that from the last episode via Discovery Season 2 when both the Enterprise and Discovery faced off against the unmanned Section 31 ships under CONTROL? Seeing the Constitution Class firing at multiple targets while I'm stationary position was one of the highlights of the episode. It put a huge grin on my face kinda like Doctor Pholx.
Yeah the beam phasers are appropriate to the ship at the time this takes place so also an up from me. It's not until Wrath of Khan era, aka the Enterprise Class refit that the pew pews are installed.
UP to the special effects team, as usual, but especially for that amazing sequence of shots of the Big-E navigating through the asteroid field. I don't think we have ever seen the Enterprise do anywhere near as much actual on-screen evading. And it did not go unnoticed that collisions with the rocks produced shields shimmers, just like weapons fire would. Great stuff!
“Watch the planet go boom” over an asteroid is a dumb ass interpretation of the prime directive that never sat well with me in TNG/DS9/VOY trek. Honestly, I am 100% okay with retconning this. Plus TOS played much more fast and lose with with the prime directive and makes sense with this era’s interpretation of it anyway. Definitely not deserving of a down.
Discovery, as much as some complain about it, did begin with Burnham and Georgiou covertly saving a pre-warp civilization from a would-be fatal drought. I admired that.
I get what you're saying, but it makes playing god part of Starfleet's charter, and it most certainly should not be. The Voyager episode about aligning with the Borg to defeat Species 8472 meant that the Borg was able to destroy another civilization because the Borg was no longer preoccupied with its war with Species 8472. That episode, while not a Prime Directive episode, is illustrative of what can happen when Starfleet chooses who lives and who dies.
@@erasure25 That could be said of anything though really. I don't see life as black and white and I don't think these types of situations should be viewed that way either. You will always have some consequence in making decisions or even not making a decision. It's still a choice. I personally would have the senior crew come to a consensus but I wouldn't just draw a line and say nope we can't do anything period.
@@Thaleios I get what you're saying but to me the PD is also away of keeping Starfleet or the UFP out of constant ramifications of making choices. Because making choices have consequences good or bad. Even Picard pointed out that no matter how good the intentions, things will often go bad. Ie the road to hell is paved with good intentions.
@@Optimistprime. Yeah, if I was a captain, I'd be more like Picard but not to the point that I would blindly follow orders. It would be on a case by case basis, at least imo. 🙂
Ok I want to know what Sean called the millennium falcon that caused the the Kris edit save (you still have his back)
Boba Fett
And...shooting down your 3rd "down". As to the Shields vs the Shepards...
How about the idea that the security officer was actually good at her job and was making modifications to the shield modulation based upon her analysis of each weapon hit, thus tuning them to be progressively more effective against each subsequent attack?
This was actually shown (to some degree) in the fact that the first hit took "50%" from the shields while each subsequent hit that was declared had progressively less impact upon them.
I like this new ST. Has the format I remember. Episodic with a good moral message and family friendly. Good stuff!
"Family friendly" indeed. 😒 OK, you can have that, but I still prefer DIS and PIC, like my Star Trek a little bit spicier.
@@Donnagata1409 I like those too but it is nice to see a return to form. I like the episodic format. I feel like I am watching STTNG again just updated effects and a bitttttt more sex. But the sex isn't extreme so your kids can still watch it just close their eyes if needed for a sec.
We get the challenge of the week, 50 minutes goes by at a brisk pace, Problem solved, Learn a lesson, bag em, tag em and move on to the next adventure. I love it! You can watch this with the kids! They should have done this in the first place. What were they thinking? Star Trek is back!
Not mincing words here, I genuinely loved this episode of SNW. After the pilot, which left me with a very sour taste in my mouth for a number of reasons, I was a bit wary of this one. Glad I gave it a chance though, because this was undoubtedly the most truly Star Trek episode we have had since the days of Enterprise. That said, there was a bit of a down for me early in the episode, and that was Uhura's comment of "I've been raised to help those with sensory impairments," or something to that effect. I'm blind, and to be honest, I find it immensely frustrating when people automatically assume I need help because of my lack of sight. Now of course, I'm not saying that I don't hesitate to ask for help if I need it, and I'm sure there are people out there with different impairments that may need more or less help than me in any given situations. My point, however, is that if we need help, we ask for it. Assuming that we need assistance purely because of a sensory impairment is a persistent and rather frustrating societal tick in our times, and one which I would hope would have been corrected by the 23rd century. Aside from this though, I thoroughly enjoyed the episode, and really hope SNW continues to boldly take Star Trek toward a future that seemed largely lost in the last five years.
I have sight but drop things (like a micro USB) that seem to fall into a void in the floor and can't be found.
It is interesting that this character has white hair. My sister has albinism and is legally blind since birth.
I liked Uhura's humming. I think at the Captain's dinner it was a bit forced, but was needed for the comet scenes. Actually later than that. Uhura breaking into song...I mean humming, relates directly back to TOS, but also allows the Away Team to communicate with the Comet. But more importantly, allows the Comet to communicate with Enterprise. I believe this was 2 fold. It contacted Enterprise as if to say, I know you are OK; and to assure Enterprise that the Away Team was OK, all encapsulated in Uhura's folk song she kept humming.
As someone who hums incessantly all the time, often without even realizing it (and have had people remark on it in public) it didn't sound forced to me :) What DID sound forced was her laughing at Pike's story. I got the impression that was the intention though.
I would have liked to hear her hum "The Moon is a Window to Heaven" from ST:V
@@charlesajones77 Go point on the humming, and I thought the same on the laughing.
I love the fact that in this series that they give Pike something to deal with in his heart. He is still the same character that we fell in love with during Disco season 2, but haunted by those experiences and his foreknowledge of his fate. It has shades of Babylon 5 too. The themes of fate, determinism, and inevitability. I have HIGH hopes for this show!
I'm in love with this show. Getting better and better!
The actors who portray the original series characters have nailed it. It's hard to step into roles that people love. These actors are amazing. Ethan Peck as Spock blows me away.
The Prime Directive does not mean they cannot interfere at all. There are several episodes in TOS where they interfere in such a manner. The issue is interfering with the development of the culture.
That's an interesting point - and it does beg the question whether the Federation interfered with the natural evolution of Klingon culture when it initiated as massive aid effort to mitigate the environmental effects of the Praxis disaster on Qo'noS. I guess the most obvious response is that it certainly caused less social harm than that of an apocalyptic war between the Federation and a massively destabilized and desperate Klingon Empire.
Capt Janeway over ruled the Prime Directive in the Omega Molecule episode.
@@balung The Omega Directive overrules everything. The Omega molecule can destroy subspace making warp drive useless. That is why she tossed the Prime Directive to the side.
Until the 24th century when the federation went insane.
Two notes here:
1. No doubt in my mind that the Captain's dinner is something Anson would do IRL.
2. The writer for this episode must be a fan of Clerks to have Uhura (a) utter the phrase "I'm not even supposed to be here today!" and (b) brag about speaking 37 languages (this one needs no explanation).
Try not to learn any languages on the way to the parking lot
@@attrition0 Hey you, get back here!
@@attrition0 Also, what poor language is the Dante of languages?
What I really like about Pike's character arc dealing with an accepting his fate, and knowing he will save the lives of those future cadets, makes it even more heartbreaking when it inevitably happens and why in TOS, Spock knowing Pike's fate as well, will do everything including risking his Starfleet career and betraying Kirk, to help a crippled Pike return to the Telosian planet to live his final days in happy well deserved respite
Talosians, but the sentiment is true.
It’s kind of wild that this remake of an episode with a thrown together kind of idea is now the bases for what looks to be Star Treks comeback.
My only issues with this episode were the scenes of the Enterprise zipping around as if it were a shuttle craft. For me I like how older Trek made the ships feel like they had more heft to them. It just made the Enterprise feel wrong somehow. For me the Enterprise is not the Millenium Falcon nor should it ever be the Falcon. It should be like a Battle ship. You can't just make quick split second turns. You have to think ahead. Sure it can move very fast moving in a straight forward line. But it should not be able to do what it did during this episode. Other than that I am still loving this and I already love all the characters, unlike Discovery and Picard where I could care less about any of those characters, even after 4 seasons of Discovery.
The '60's Enterprise was meant to reflect the cruiser model of ship, with the weight and the size limitations that entails. Slower turning than a shuttle, but faster than say a colony ship. This Enterprise reflects the modern idea of sleek/fast/hairpin action no matter what physics would say.
Absolutely loving Uhura, the whole show is fantastic.
It is possible to adhere to canon and tell new stories. A lot of stuff happened before, in between and after TOS episodes. That is a rich mine to explore. Canon is not an obstacle, it is a guide. Why people can't see that...can't embrace that (looking at you Shives....) is beyond me.
@@josecarrales2842 They have not really strayed that far from canon with Uhura as there is a lot we don't know about her past or the years before Kirks captaincy. She does portray her well though, as a cadet and greenhorn learning where she fits in.
She's great in the role.
I'm really happy that they gave us a Cadet Uhura as the point-of-view character. She's showing the excitement, fear, doubt, and triumph that we would all feel in those situations. (Also, in the original series Lieutenant Uhura and Spock have a close and respectful friendship and we get to see that develop.)
@@andrewjohnson6716 It never occurred to me or just didn’t yet that she was the point of view character.
For the Captain's table dinner... honestly if you wanted to have another first , a canon Star Trek show on the Food Network, I would sit and watch these folks do exactly this and only this for a few seasons. In character, making dishes and telling stories from the Trek universe... with this crew, I could make that work :)
So, about General Order 1/The Prime Directive. It hadn't really taken shape completely at this point. Memory Alpha says: A complicated order, the Prime Directive had 47 sub-orders by the latter part of the 24th century. (VOY: "Infinite Regress") However, a high-level summary was "no identification of self or mission; no interference with the social development of said planet; no references to space, other worlds, or advanced civilizations."
I would say saving a whole planet whose inhabitants weren't aware of Starfleet or other civilizations, and wouldn't know that the comet's path had been changed, is justifiable.
Plus, we all know everyone disobeys GO1/TPD all the time! I think people have to make decisions they can live with, and watching a whole civilization perish would not be one any leader should be able to live with.
Also, this wasn't just on the level of nuclear war or even the disaster that killed the dinosaurs, based on the simulation shown, this would exterminate effectively all life on the planet. It wouldn't leave anything left to "evolve"
Yes, for the purposes of the plot, of course the captain *should* interfere. But, it was done without contemplation. Any time Janeway, Picard, etc. violated GO1, they did so with a heavy heart. The issue didn't even come up here.
Also, the Order isn't worded such that interference is ok so long as nobody on the planet notices. It's about interference, period. Furthermore, while the 'Prime Directive' wasn't codified until later, General Order 1 still existed at that time.
@@loganmiller2344 And what about any civilizations that this civilization might have an effect on? What if they end up being responsible for wiping out another race, but they weren't 'supposed to' because they would have themselves been wiped out by the comet?
@@loganmiller2344 God, I wish that would happen to Earth....
Agreed social development isn’t the same thing as survival.
I know for a true trekkie it's maybe to obvious, but I think you could have pointed out the fact that uhura solving the problem by singing is a nice nod to the TOS episode "The Conscience of the King", where Uhura shows of her musical abilities by singing "beyond Antaras" and playing the lute.
How did you miss the GOLDEN EASTER EGG that Uhura is the FIRST REDSHIRT to survive an away mission?!
Yeah, usually red shirts are goners within minutes of appearance.
Sean has really dropped the ball on this episode on many things. They even had to "fix in post" him calling the Millennium Falcon something different when he recorded it.
@@billkeithchannel Millennium Falcon. Not Millennial.
@@katrose5179 Stupid spell check changed it.
Spock interceding for Uhura is because she knows and trusts him, she's not yet met the new chief engineer
"That's very reminiscent of the way -Boba Fett- the _Millennium Falcon_ hides behind the Star Destroyer in _The Empire Strikes Back_ ." 🤣Whoops! Nice recovery, though. I'm sure _no one_ noticed. 😉
That accidental/on purpose error gave me a good laugh.
Thanks I was wondering what Sean said. How can he not remember the Millennium Falcon the ship that did the Kessel Run in 12 Parsecs 😀
18:19 that dub over has sent me to Vulcan and back lmao, also Burnham uses that manuever when she flees from Sction 31 with Spock
I totally hate the take on the PD that a crew must let millions of people die needlessly when there is a way to save them. I think the PD is best used as a *guideline* and not a dogmatic rule. It's the same reason I DESPISE "Dear Doctor"; not just because of the PD, but also how they utterly butchered the science of Evolution... but that is a different problem for a different time.
Id love to see pike go up against 24th century admirals with a "how stupid are you" argument.
Agreed. Rules are never fully absolute. Only a Sith deals in absolutes :P
Agreed.
SFdebris was right, by the 24th century the PD kinda became dogma.
Check out his review for "Dear Doctor," he has a few... interesting theories.
@@The0mega79 Oh yes, I've seen that review a number of times. I agree with his views greatly on the PD and many other Trek topics. I love his channel, so much great content.
Just my two cents, but when Kirk gets demoted in Star Trek - Into Darkness, I was under the impression that it was because he broke the prime directive by exposing the ship to the primitive people of Nibiru (which he did in order to save Spock) and for falsifying the mission report, but not for saving the people from the volcano. Otherwise, I think there would have been a lot more clamor from the crew from the very start about breaking the prime directive, and there wasn't.
Well to be fair they took the first salvo head-on, most of the others were partial hits taken during evasive maneuvers. Also maybe someone put emergency power to the shields, reversed the polarity, set SCE to AUX or something else ;-)
They were also running on impulse power. Warp power could be diverted to the shields
I was thinking the same thing. Also, someone pointed out elsewhere in the comments that some of those hits might have been chunks of the comet's tail and not weapon's fire.
Set SCE to AUX: nice 👍
@@illyth63 Outstanding Apollo 12 reference!
Only just getting round to watching strange new worlds..gotta say I'm liking your breakdowns more than the episodes..you are hilarious my friend 😂🖖
you missed the nod to the episode in which Kirk tries to get into the obelisk that repels the asteroids and gets zapped. Later they figured out that it was the music of him calling the ship that opened the door
I don’t know if anyone commented this already, but I loved how Spock encouraged Uhura to stay in Starfleet and on the Enterprise. It reminded me of the story Nichelle Nichols told of Martin Luther King encouraging her to stay on the show when she was considering leaving. It made me wonder if that scene was meant to reflect on the MLK history.
The tone and cadence of Ethan Peck's voice sounds very much like his granddaddy Gregory Kudos to him. I hope it brings him as much success
I didn't know that until reading your comment - that's pretty cool
Spock is related to Gregory Peck?
That's pretty cool.
I seriously doubt that it will bring him an Oscar though! Lol
If only it sounded very much like Spock, the character he's supposed to be playing.
@@Scipio488 I think Leonard Nimoy sounded more like Gregory Peck than his grandson does.
One observation I made was after the initial hit on the Enterprise. Number one says damage to the port nacelle. Yet on her display, the starboard nacelle and small section of the saucer on that side were showing red. ;)
I do disagree with that this very particular instance breaks the Prime Directive and will compare with the similar Into Darkness moment which does: Exposure. Kirk and crew directly expose not themselves but the Enterprise to the native inhabitants, that is the violation of the Prime Directive. Pike's and the crew actions initially don't and (and importantly don't ever regarding the planet.) The Prime Directive concerns itself with the *cultural* contamination of pre-warp (and to a lesser extant, *all*) cultures. Natural Occurrences can be avoided, if and only if, they avoid directly influence to the developing world. That is achieved within the context of the planet. (The comet and it's Shepherds are a bit looser in this regard but are highly advanced enough that clause of the Prime Directive wouldn't apply.)
Gordon Malloy: Now that is how you _Hug the Donkey._
Ortegas: Oh, yeah? Hold my Romulan Ale. Computer _Evasive Plan Ortegas 1._
I just love this show is being the Trek we asked for, downs included. Oh and can we talk about the phaser being A PHASER and not pew pew pew? Also wow I couldn't even see those models! Which as far as ups and downs . . . has TrekCulture done ups and downs for older shows? If not I'd love a Retro Ups and Downs.
I agree about the lighting of the ships in space, love the look of the enterprise, but it's hard to see.
@@MikeDuff63 Oh no I was referring to the NX-01 model Sean pointed out. It's as white as the background that you can't even properly make the shape out.
The notes Uhura hummed was similar but not exact to the notes used in Close Encounters and parodied in Moonraker. But the same concept of using notes to communicate with alien life.
It's also how the alien in the book Project Hail Mary communicated, but after the first chapter or so of his deciphering the notes, it was just taken for granted rather than explained repeatedly.
External threats to a prewarp civilization are often treated differently from internal threats, especially when the civilization in question has no way of detecting the interference. For example, the Prime Directive as written would allow interference such as diverting a comet, but typically not allow diverting a hurricane, as the first action does not violate any part of General Order 1, section 1, which is the relevant statute, and only applies to direct or tangential contact with the society, though not even applicable when the existence of the Federation can be logically deduced from the actions taken if no direct contact is made. Starfleet JAG Corps, here I come! I would watch the heck out of Law & Order: Starfleet!
The prime directive is to prevent kidnapping.
Aliens not part of the federation ending up on federation ships and planets writing that aliens took their life stock or themselves were taken by aliens. Or changing a specie evolution that they become xenophobes or end up changing by the presence of humanity that they adapted to it like example domestic dogs evolved hanging ears. Eradication of species because they saw one nature killing the other is messing up with the ecosystem as it rely on a diversity and result is a change of planet ecosystem in which the intelligent carnivore creature was killed to save the prey specie who result the death of both. A comet is not part of the ecosystem, a dying sun is not part of the planet life cycle. An alien interaction resulting into involvement of natives is not a violation as the federation is responsible for its jurisdiction. The prime directive is that planets and its species are to be kept as they are unless the federation want to permanent settle the planet. There must be hierarchies and ability to negotiate and the interaction to be temporary if not met with the prime directive. Crew not part of the federation are considered permanent crew of the ship and violation of the prime directive as the federation permanent presence can't be denied.
I was glad to see another assign numbers to music notes plot. they did it in the last season of Battlestar Galactica, I loved it then, I love it now!
I love this show, it's a warm hug from star trek that's been missing for a while. That being said, just did a rewatch, the initial hit by the shepherd's dropped the shields to 70%. That being said, love you guys keep up the great work!
So far SNW has felt not just more like Star Trek, but more like TOS/TNG than anything we've gotten recently, and I'm so here for it. Its nice to see a group of professionals who work well with and respect each other but are able to avoid the drama bullshit.
I had another problem, and that was in the beginning, that Uhura said, she was just a few miles from that place Pike visited. Kenia uses metric, the Federation uses metric, Starfleet uses metric, it's KILOMETERS!
But regardless of a country's measurement system, if it's English-speaking, there's a chance that 'miles from' is still a common phrase, due to cultural ancestry from the British Commonwealth. For example, in Canada, miles are not used for measuring long distances (except for railways), but you'll commonly hear 'miles away', 'miles from', 'a couple of miles', etc., but in every other situation we use kilometers. So, since this crew are speaking English, they will have British-isms baked into their lingo, so it's perfectly plausible she would use such a phrase.
Are you serious with this comment?
Well, since Uhura is an expert on alien languages, maybe she also knows both standard and metric measures.
@@johnbockelie3899 You definitely need to be an expert in alien measurement systems to be able to handle the imperial units.
@@anlumo1 how about English weight systems , instead of pounds, as in weight , they say stones or something like that. " I'm cadet Uhura, sir. I know thirty seven alien languages, and all the distances , and weights and measures across the galaxy."
" Great, cadet, welcome aboard the Enterprise !!".
With some slight alterations, this episode felt like a rehash of Fight or Flight from ST Enterprise. It was still great, but I couldnt quite help but notice the similarities.
-Communications officer is moody over trying to fit in on her first assignment.
-She tries to strike up a conversation with an alien she doesn't understand, only for it to backfire on her a little.
-The Enterprise comes across something involving another alien species.
-They try and do something about it, only to have that attempt fail.
-The communications officer is sent on her first away mission in an EV suit with others to this place.
-She notices a language on it and is having trouble deciphering it.
-Something happens during this away mission that causes the Communications officer to freak out.
-It's found out that something with this thing is caused by some other alien species intent on harming the first aliens.
-Communications officer is concerned that if she can't decipher the language presented that they're all going to die, bringing up that she doesn't feel she's Starfleet material.
-Communications officer manages to figure out how to communicate through sheer willpower.
-Aliens attack because of misunderstanding at first, but then stop once they finally reach an understanding.
The camera moved through the comet tail like it does in the DS9 opening credits how did you not see this right away!
That moment was incredible. They definitely put it there for a reason
And part of the name, Quentin reminded me of Quinn from Voy.
My big down was that Uhura didn't play a role in the solution to the comment. She should have partially decoded the message from the comment and said "I think the comment is telling us to burn off a bit of ice so it moves out of the way". They still could have had the bit at the end where the comment perfectly predicted the shape of the ice block that fell off. Other then that I really enjoyed it. Definitely one of the best Star Trek episodes of the last ten years.
I'd put a down for Uhura using imperial "miles" instead of SI units "km" hehehe
Remember in the novel Federation (again?) Kirk's plan to retrieve the hostages from the Klingon ships? Where everyone got something big to do? Seems like the idea was lifted from here as well. If there is an influence in the series from the novel Federation, it's a good thing!
Two episodes in and I already want 7 seasons of this show. Absolutely brilliant and the feeling of ST that's been missing, for me, since Enterprise. Love it!
Just a nice show, calm and easy going. No massive stakes or chances for disappointment in legacy characters. In saying that Picard hugging Q was lovely.
So...two good episodes so far. I hope the rest of the season can keep the momentum going. I like the mix of self-contained plots-of-the-week and ongoing character development.
12:35 - I think you nailed one of the biggest issues I have with Discovery. It pretty much boils down to the same 2 or 3 characters solving the problem in every episode, and the rest are set dressing 90% of the time. Until they need an episode where they deep dive into a character, then they pick one and you're supposed to care about them but don't even remember their name.
I don't think SNW is going to get everything perfect but it's refreshing to see them taking these things into consideration
I love what they're doing with Uhura and how Celia is portraying the character. It's well deserved and sadly much of it just wouldn't have been socially acceptable to have on screen in TOS.
She's been awesome in every second on screen so far.
I'm wondering how they'll reconcile Cadet Uhura with the TOS Lt. Uhura.
@@jamisonedwards8162 I'm sure we'll see her as an Ensign before too long.
Really enjoying the crew interaction. Reminds me of TNG later years when the crew were really coming together as a family.
I don't hate Discovery or Picard by any means, but Strange New Worlds is really demonstrating what those shows are lacking. To me, DIS and PIC feel like fan fictions or drafts of ideas rather than fleshed out professionally made series. They are full of so many macguffins (and for Star Trek that's saying something), lack of world building, and plot contrivances and feel like something off-brand or unofficial. SNW feels like an actual thought out Star Trek show so far. It's refreshing.
Yeah, I agree with the down on prime directive breaking. That tng episode when data was talking to the little girl on the doomed planet comes to mind. Even when picard broke it, he did it very very reluctantly. This series is turning into Star Trek: Strange New Interpretations of the Prime Directive
The comet already predetermined that the Enterprise would “interfere” with the comet thus making General Order 1/Prime Directive inconsequential.
Cha-CHING!
"No fate but what we make" is also a Leo Varadkar quote Seán 😉
I assumed the torpedoes were hitting different shield sections. TNG would often say forward shields down to 70% and aft shields down to 85%. Plus maybe Pike's crew is smart enough to "divert power to shields" to give them a boost without the Captain telling them.
My thing with shields is, I don't think their "strength" is at a 1:1 ratio with the damage they have taken, we see that even though shields are at 70%, the hull took SOME damage, what if the percentage of their strength is not only "are they up" but also related to damage "bleedthrough"?
Not saying that at, say 50% strength, they only negate 50% of the damage, but it's feasable that the weaker a shield is, the less damage it can block at that time. Also, who says the first hit that took them down to 70% was the same type of torpedos they fire later?
There were a few scenes in the episode that were probably inadvertent callbacks to early Trek with actors being in different poses in the background between shots, the mysteriously venting gas where there wasn't any seconds ago, or the whispering when the communications channel isn't open....
Second episode of the series and I'm getting the distinct impression that I'm supposed to know who some of the other named characters are, but I have no clue who they are or why I should care about them. I know a few of the names from the older era, but trying to figure out how this ship and this crew eventually become the 60's version is a bit more interesting than some of the actual script so far.
That moment Spock was holding the tricorder, kneeled beside Kirk. Turned aroud and looked at La'an. Who else said aloud " He's dead Jim" ?
Haha. I did exactly that! But then I realized Sam Kirk can't die until Operation Annihilate. I also loved the joke about, how do like the mustache? Knowing that Sam in TOS was just Shatner with a mustache.
Thanks again.
Absolutely loving this series.
I haven’t felt any ‘downs’ at all so far, but your points are fair. Except for your 1st down - that was a bit mean imo.
The examples you give of letting people die for the Prime Directive refer to evolutionary events in progress--species decline and massive ecological disaster. Redirecting the comet would not violate the Prime Directive, the Federation has been known to be far more hands-on to save the lives of sentient species without revealing themselves or their technology.
Like in "This Side of Paradise".
Anyone else notice that the only red shirt in the away team did not die but saved them all.
I have to voice my disagreement regarding the Prime Directive stretching in this episode. First, they literally just invented it (or codified it) last episode, prior to that it was General Order 1. All it said was you can't interfere with the natural development of a pre-warp society.
You mentioned the Kelvin timeline, but that's a different situation. They were reprimanded only because the natives actually saw the Enterprise. Spock even brings up while they're being reprimanded that there would have been no issue if the natives hadn't seen the ship. Pike calls that a technicality, and Spock says he's a Vulcan, and they embrace technicality. That implies that if they'd saved the planet without being seen, it would have stretched but not broken the Prime Directive.
In Next Generation, the episode we met Worf's brother, the issue there was that the only way to save that culture was to literally move them to another planet, which was done without their knowledge or permission. That's clearly breaking the rules.
In Enterprise, the episode I can remember that involved breaking the Prime Directive (or the Vulcan policy of non-interference) involved a culture that had already been exposed to other warp capable races, and so they were able to meet them. But then it's Doctor Phlox, not the T'Pol, who objects to helping them.
Rummaging through my memory, I don't recall any specific instances in any of the Star Trek series that prohibit something like, say, diverting a comet that's about to impact a planet, so long as doing so would not involve giving a pre-warp culture knowledge of space travel. The Prime Directive only applies to influencing the natural development of a culture, not with preventing the extinction of one. I can't find any on screen canon instances where the Prime Directive was invoked in order to stop them from preventing a natural catastrophe, so long as preventing that natural catastrophe would not expose that culture, even indirectly, to knowledge of aliens or technology beyond their own capabilities. I could definitely be wrong, as my knowledge is not total, but I did some spot checking on the Trek sites, and still couldn't find any.
Agreed. That's one thing that even Discovery got right in its first season, when Burnham and Georgiou were on a pre-warp planet, making sure that the local inhabitants received access to enough water to survive. Non-interference is one thing, but simply letting an entire species die when you have the means to help without revealing yourself is quite another. I was really happy to see that SNW went down that road, as well.
Development doesn't mean forward progress. Development of a population/species/civilization simply means how it changes over time, so it unfortunately includes extinction. So if GO1 says you can't interfere with the natural development of a pre-warp civilization...if it's heading for extinction (naturally), then it's heading for extinction.
I would just add that Picard twice was willing to let an entire planet die because of the Prime Directive before he was ultimately talked (forced?) out of it: Sarjenka's planet and Worf's brother's planet.
@@williamlim9066 Both those incidents were cases where the catastrophe couldn't be averted without Starfleet revealing themselves. I already mention the one about Worf's brother. The incident with Sarjenka, they did eventually figure out how to save them without revealing themselves, but the contamination had already occurred because Data broke the Prime Directive by talking to her over radio. They erased her memory in order to keep it as a stretch of the PD instead of a break. It was a very different situation than this episode. I think there's more canon that says what happened in SNW is allowed than there is that says it's not.
TNG treated the Prime Directive like a religious doctrine.
"Oh we can't interfere, what if we change things...no no, far better the noble savages die pure and innocent like slightly retarded children than get sullied."
But kinda hard to keep their culture 'surviving' if they all up and die, innit.
If there was a big fire in the Amazon, we wouldn't just sit back and go, "No no, let the indigs burn." We'd go in, god-sky-chariots and all and save their asses.
they might bitch about it, and complain about it. But they'd be _alive_ to do so. Would their culture change? No doubt.
But it would adapt. A culture is not a static unchanging thing afterall.
As Britons changed after each successive invasion, going from woad-wearing druid-worshipppers, to Roman citizens, to Norman vassals to a gallant Empire of it's own wit a spiffing navy, wot.
They kept things, tossed some things aside, lost things. But they continued onward.
You missed one major cetacean observation. Did you notice that one of the colonies listed on pikes screen was the same colony were Annika Hanson a.k.a. 7 of 9 was born
My review is this this episode was a little average after the incredible first episode. I love that we got some important and well crafted backstory on Uhura and the actress playing her is quite brilliant. This cadet version of Uhura is fantastic. I just didn't like how they stumbled on to the solution and she just seemed to sing random melodies to try and communicate with the comet. There wasn't any logic or anything behind it. Why not somehow tie the melodies to famous mathematical formulas or something....at least something more than just humming a tune and suddenly the thing opens up. Spock could have worked with her on that. I enjoyed the episode overall but I dislike the somewhat arbitrary nature of the solution. They called her a genius or whatever, but all she did was nervously sing a song from her native land. That is called luck, not genius. They also never really solved "what is this comet?," Which I find slightly annoying. Love this version of Pike and Number one. I would say more ups than downs but the downs were big ones.
One thing you missed: Uhura talking about not being sure if she's going to stay in Starfleet is very reminiscent of Nichelle Nichols wanting to quit Star Trek: TOS after the first season until she met Dr Martin Luther King and he convinced her to stay in it.
I far as I remember the shields have several separate generators and Ortega was moving the ship to avoid being hit in the main saucer section. They were losing the forward shields, but the shields were at full capacity for the other parts of the ship. I am assuming that tis is the case.
That is the case in most depictions of the shields. They're deployed in arcs around the ship which can have differing strengths/levels.
You are correct. There's shield emitters embedded across the ship and moving the way she had the Enterprise moving, Ortegas spread out the damage to the shield.
Agreed. She's trying to spread the damage out over as many emitter arcs as possible. On that note, I love how as soon as Pike takes the reins off Ortega she shows how to use 360 degree space.
I "mostly" agree with the spirit of the prime directive but I also think that if you have the ability to prevent a sentient species from being wiped out without them knowing about it, it's probably a good thing. The prime directive could be taken to one extreme or the other but I feel that each has to be evaluated on a case by case basis. just my 2c.
I don't think altering the comet's course would violate General Order One. That doesn't seem to interfere with the natural evolution of the people on Persephone, at least as long as they don't know who did it.
Loved the ep! Loved that the Shepherds were less baddies as they were Space Dicks! What the hell is going on with Spock's sideburns?? Someone get a deal on Sharpie pens? Anyway... so far, great!
Completely disagree with that second down, they break the prime directive or reveal themselves to pre-warp cultures all the time if it's that or extinction.
Agreed. They had this exact situation in the original series, a comet about to hit a planet with a primitive culture, and they explained how it was not a violation of the Prime Directive.
Pike: "The Federation doesn't interfere in the development of species, but we also don't just let them die"
Yes they do, they absolutely do. The Prime Directive is pretty damn explicit when it comes to non-interference.
...... also very handy that the 5 people that Pike will save are the only 5 people with those names in the Federation. The computer knows exactly who he's talking about.
I sometimes wonder if Sean has ever watched Star trek. I can't count how many times a star fleet captain has disregarded the prime directive. It's like they took a page from captain Barbosa's book. "The prime directive is more of what you would say more guidelines than actual rules".
I have another UP for you from this episode:
Sam Kirk recklessly approaching and touching the comet control 'egg' even after being cautioned not to do so. I guess that sort of behaviour just runs in the family? 😁 🖖🏻
Overall this was a good episode, but I would give a small down to when the Shepherds first appear literally out of nowhere and none of the Enterprise's sensors go off. But that's just me. I get it was done for dramatic purposes but still.
Otherwise, overall a good episode.
They were probably cloaked and watching and immediately decloaked as Enterprise fired the torpedoes. The crew did notice the ship as soon it became visible.
Something noticed and got the shields up. They were doing exploration and a rescue operation, no reason to have shields up. The bad ship appears and fires, and magically the shields stop the incoming fire. Maybe the navigator chick got the shields up before telling the captain, hey maybe it was those guys shooing at us... Not liking how snarky the navigator is, bordering on disrespectful.
@@jeffs6090 In the TOS episode "Balance of Terror" there's a big to do over cloaking technology existing, so this would be a little early for cloaking to bit so everyday of a thing. I feel like shouting "Neerrrd!" at myself for that.
the subplot throughout the season is hidden in plain sight, how high will Pike's hair get??? I'm so excited to find out, this will truly be an exciting show.
Pretty sure the Prime Directive was more about not interfering with the development of a species... in this case the species won't develop at all if it's destroyed. Plus they can do it without being seen or interacting with the species. It's ok to save entire planets but just not be observed doing it.
Actually, interfering does include keeping them from being destroyed. TNG episode with Worf’s brother illegally saving people who would have been was all about violations of prime directive.
@@katrose5179 yep
@@katrose5179 That was TNG, in TOS it was far less restrictive. And better for it. Interfering with a planets culture or exploiting them is far different than saving a planet from destruction without them ever knowing you were there. The reasoning that starfleet does not want to play god is bull. If you have the power to save a planet and choose not to you are still playing god.
I had to restrain myself from watching this yesterday because I hadn't yet seen the episode, but I must say it was a damned good delight.
I would like to make a couple observations myself for your consideration: in last week's episode, Pike is speaking with Spock in his quarters and offers him a Saurian brandy...from a square bottle. Yet this week, we see the classic bottle design in the background. Granted, we have all kinds of liquor bottle designs here on earth, and each kind of liquor has plenty of different bottle designs available, so who's to say all Saurian brandy has to come in the classic powderhorn bottle? That being said, I really think it would have been more fitting to use the classic bottle last week.
Secondly, I'm surprised that you didn't make mention of the environmental suits worn by the away team being a visual callback to the suits worn in The Tholian Web (minus the birdcage helmets). And I love the sensible forethought to include medical equipment built into the suits like the defibrillator used on Samuel.
I can't believe how much I'm enjoying this iteration of Star Trek, so far so Great!
I had the same thoughts about the 'hits'. I figured that maybe in between the first initial hits, and them evading, that the engineering (if that's the right Dept) repaired and maybe, reinforced some how, the shields. Since they knew they were going to be shot at. Maybe concentrated more energy to the rear. Idk Something like that . And also, between the two events, the enterprise did fire and hit the other ships weapons (or whatever it was that temporarily disable them), which obviously got repaired as well.
It just wasnt depicted on screen. Just like how right after the away team was beamed up, and all but Kirk are back on the bridge in a scene that i assumed was to happen right after that. They don't show them running to get back to the bridge, yet they are there.
That's my theory at least.
I was waiting to hear “Close Encounters of the Third Kind” when Uhura was singing to the Alien object.
Me too. Just rewatched it today on DVD and as before that was the very first thing that popped into my head.
I love these deep dives into the materiel, but platinum up! Your comment 'There is no fate but what we make...' just got me...
It's the layers and psychology of it as well. For someone suffering from P.T.S.D. do you actually create what you see - is it kind of a self fulfilling prophecy ( or confirmation bias cranked up to 10,000...). It also goes deeper - what if 'time' is malleable, etc...