18th-Century (Costume) Historians React to "HAMILTON" (ft. some mild roasting)
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- Опубликовано: 3 окт 2024
- Hold on to your breeches y'all! I invited Nicole over to sit down and watch Hamilton with me for the first time, and, woah, do we have some feelings about the costumes. We both have years of experience in 18th-Century clothing reconstruction and history, as well as both of us, being theatre kids (Nicole's degree was focused in technical theatre). So if you're curious to know if the costumes in Hamilton are accurate, we've got you covered (but not in King George's spit!)
🎉Keep Watching:
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Answering Your Questions from "I Wore 18th-Century Clothing for 5 Years..." • Answering Your Questio...
Becoming an 18TH-CENTURY MEME LORD | Recreating the Joseph Ducreux Archaic Rap Meme as a *~LADY~*! • Becoming an 18TH-CENTU...
Theatrical costuming is different than historical costuming, but when you're watching a movie or production that takes place in the past, it is always fun to see what they did right, wrong, and also to discuss what you would have done differently. With Nicole's experience in 18th-century men's tailoring and clothing, she helps bring an additional perspective to Hamilton - things that I wouldn't have thought of (because my focus is in 18th-century women's fashion - not men!) If you wanted to know how accurate the suits are for Hamilton (some are 100% reproductions of portraiture and some are...weird...) or more about what the Schuyler sisters are wearing - this video should answer those questions!
📚Further Reading:
The American Duchess Guide to 18th Century Dressmaking: amzn.to/2YAets3
The American Duchess Guide to 18th Century Beauty: amzn.to/2BKUY6W
Hamilton: The Revolution: amzn.to/38KNpdb
Alexander Hamilton: amzn.to/2Drc9LK
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🖼Images Used
Photo of Mike McCarty by Fred Blystone / about
The queen's arms, a night's amusement / Maucourt invt. et fecit. England, 1764. Photograph. www.loc.gov/it....
Stays, 1740-60, Metropolitan Museum of Art www.metmuseum....
Peach Smooth Covered Stays, late 18th-Century, Metropolitan Museum of Art, www.metmuseum....
Blue Smooth Covered Stays, late 18th Century, The Metropolitan Museum of Art www.metmuseum....
Maternity Jacket, 1780-95, The Colonial Williamsburg Foundation, emuseum.histor...
Portrait of Marquis de Lafayette, 1834, Versailles, www.pop.cultur...
The Ham House Roman Conversation Piece (Gentlemen on the Grand Tour), attributed to John Brown, 1773, Ham House National Trust, NT 1139726 www.nationaltru...
Elijah Boardman, by Ralph Earl, 1789, The Metropolitan Museum of Art, www.metmuseum....
George Washington before the battle of Trenton, Jonathan Trumbull, 1792-94, The Metropolitan Museum of Art www.metmuseum....
Man’s suit, 1790s, LACMA collections.la...
Antoine Laurent Lavoisier (1743-1794) and His Wife (Marie Anne Pierrette Paulze, 1758-1836), Jacques Louis David (French, Paris 1748-1825 Brussels), 1788, The Metropolitan Museum of Art www.metmuseum....
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The Jack is the smaller cup (2 oz) and the Gill is the larger one (4 oz). The Gill is what a soldier would get a daily ration of rum, whiskey, or brandy in.
THANK YOU I WAS LIKE "JENNY I HAVE FORGOTTEN" (I probably should have texted you when we were doing this 😂)
LOL! You should have! “Quick! To the Bat Phone!!”
Jack and Gill?.......... Is the nursery rhyme a pun about getting drunk?
Also known as a tot
@@Cityweaver what a plot twist!
Your reaction to that veil is a Real Mood™
I was hoping you had watched this too, lool
No one explained why though :-(( someone pls educate me
@@elizabethbarrera3267 veils are not 18th century style. (Unless, maybe, you were a nun, I'm not a hundred percent sure, I'm not a historian just an enthusiast) And especially not that super 20th century veil they chucked on her head.
@@elizabethbarrera3267, in the time this Musical Story is set "Bridal veils" weren't really a thing in fashion in North America or Europe. With brides choosing from many other options instead. But the bridal veil returned to popularity after Queen Victoria wore a veil in her wedding to Prince Albert in 1840. It's suggested that Queen Victoria also "introduced" the White Wedding Gown, fashionable with those that could afford such a luxury✌🏻.
In an interview the costume designer for Hamilton said that the outfits from the neck down were historical and the neck up was modern. Except for King George of course. So this was probably why the veil was used.
The veil is an easy shortcut in theatre to say now we are at a wedding without having to create a whole new costume as well as indicating we have jumped forward a bit in time. I’ve used it many times even though it’s not historically accurate it is at that point a story telling tool.
Exactly. It's there to evoke a feeling in the audience.
I think a bouquet would have done the same thing. (But idk, maybe that wouldn't have been accurate either? I don't know anything about the period)
It's not even wrong, just 'out of fashion'... So it's still possible. There was REALLY no reason to carry on like that over a veil.
By the 17th and 18th century, bridal veils were occasionally worn, but were generally out of fashion in Britain and North America, with brides choosing from many other options instead. However, the bridal veil returned to popularity after Queen Victoria wore a veil in her wedding to Prince Albert in 1840.
^THIS, also with the time travel effect in Satisfied, it's an easy tell for the audience that we have gone back in time to review Angelica's mind, and then forwards back to the same moment in the wedding. At least they kept her in the same colour dress and didn't put a white sheet over it
Couldn't they have just used a bouquet?
Apparently the crown that King George (aka Kristoff from Frozen) wears weighed 8lbs. His posture and stage movements are all about keeping the crown on his head.
Yes! And you can absolutely see that - what he did with that character was *incredible* - loved every minute he was on stage!
@@AbbyCox I keep replaying his 3 songs
At one point someone broke it and they had to replace it and he said he was really happy because the new crown was like half the weight of the old one
Oh I also wanted to say that the excessive spit is done on purpose. He would take a big mouthful of water before going on stage. King Gerorge was "mad" so he wanted to channel that rabid dog look lol
@Bio Kimistry I thought he was called Groffsauce so people could ship him with Lin (Linguine)
The thing about Maria Reynolds outfit in this play is the fact we are supposed to see all of this from Hamilton's perspective (Burr even says that "I'll let (Alexander) tell it") Cus from what I remember from my Hamilton phase, there isn't a lot of information about the Hamilton-Reynolds affair from her perspective. So in this play, the story is over dramatized by Hamilton himself to make him seem like a victim in the affair, (dressing Maria in red, implying that she's a homewrecker, and the that fact that Hamilton "how can I say no to this?" etc) Where as in Burn, Eliza never blames Maria for the affair, she rightfully blames Hamilton for sleeping with Maria, cus He is a privileged man in the power dynamic. However, based on People's reaction to this song and Maria I've seen online (spoilers: not that good), I don't think many people got that the song is meant to have unreliable narrator, sadly.
I found the song kind of difficult to listen to (too much going on), but what you bring up is interesting and helps a *little* bit in explaining the weird outfit she was wearing (it was just..weird in multiple ways) - I do wish that they had dressed her in something like a chemise gown to really show a stark visual difference in her character vs. Peggy and the other sisters.
Even though my understanding of the actual history of the affair is murky - wasn't it actually a plot that the Reynold's had come up with to essentially blackmail Hamilton - or was it a "real" affair that her husband decided to take advantage of? Anyways, it was clearly a boatload of terrible decisions that Hamilton decided to air publicly (which was the biggest offense, in my opinion, affairs within the elite social classes were pretty normal, but you never wanted it to become public - so embarrassing Eliza like that and bringing that much scandal to her family was just...woah.)
Abby Cox the fact that Hamilton took more offense to being accused of extorting money vs having an affair is all the cringe.
How dare you question my honor! I used my own money to pay for my adulterous affair!!!!
@@amiejo LOL
Amie Joseph “I may have mortally wounded my prospects but my papers are orderly”. “Yes I have reasons for shame but I ave not committed treason and sullied my good name”.
I’m reasonably sure the 18th century would consider this to be sullying your good name.
@@AbbyCox From what I heard, James Reynolds was the true mastermind and actually threatened their daughter Susan so Maria would go along with it.
Theatrical Costume vs. Historical Costume are two different things. Some things stay for effect and reveal - the reason Mulligan's coat is long is to reveal his pants as mentioned in the song - the movement and him stomping his foot on the bench indicates to the audience up in the nose bleed section what is going on in the fast lyrics so that everyone "gets it." Same with Jefferson - he needed to be differentiated from Lafayette in the biggest way and when he moves in the song it makes the correct impact to do that - along with color and fabric choice. The piping that you reference is to highlight the seam details from 40+ feet away. Ok commentary overall, I learned a lot - I know it's hard to separate historical accuracy and theatrical impact and practicality for dancers and actors. Hamilton did better than most - the stays shocked me and the fact that they progressed the silhouettes to show the passing of time was impressive - most plays would have just put them in generic george washington costumes with velcro closures for all 2.5 hours even if it spanned the same 20-30yrs of time lol
I'm confused by the Mulligan thing, so I would love better clarification - the length of his coat hides his breeches, and doesn't reveal them? Is that what you meant? Like, I would love to know exactly what you meant by this, because if it helps clarify it - I'm all about it. With that being said - there are 18th-century garments that would have been perfect for his character as a tailor and also kept at that long length - like a wrapping gown or banyan robe. As the tailor of the group, I also felt that his coat being the weirdest proportion was odd... (this weird mix of he's supposed to know the most about tailoring and fit, but also being an apprentice he wouldn't have had money to get new clothes unless the master tailor paid for it...might have also been why? I dunno...)So, yeah, I would really love to know what you meant, because I'm genuinely curious (Mulligan is my favorite of the group, so I have a special spot for him in my heart).
As for Jefferson - absolutely they needed to separate him from Lafayette, but what Nicole and I wanted was for them to *really* push it with his costuming. There are extant garments of Jefferson's that show how ott he was with his clothing, and Jefferson just being..Jefferson...and having just arrived from France I wanted more than purple crushed velvet! (even though the purple and green between him and Hamilton was gorgeous on stage). ❤️
@@AbbyCox Hercules in the song My Shot-
"Yo, I'm a tailor's apprentice
And I got y'all knuckleheads in loco parentis (loco parentis)
I'm joining the rebellion 'cause I know it's my chance
To socially advance, instead of sewin' some pants (woo)
I'm gonna take a shot"
When he says "sewin' the pants' he stomps his leg out and whips his jacket back to reveal his pants. The jacket is used as a visual to help interpret the lyrics to the audience.
sabell31 exactly, it’s just for effect
Also when Ham says "I think your pants look hot" Herc put his leg up on the bench and whipped his coat back to show his pants
But fr I didn't know a lot of this stuff thanks for the video!
The coat is also a nod to the long fur coats worn by rappers in the 1990s. It's definitely more a not to the musical inspirations than the historical times.
I think the veil works as a story-telling device, especially when time is being "re-wound" during Satisfied. It makes understandung the timing much simpler, I think, even if it isn't accurate to the time period.
I like the concept of helping with the "rewind" section (which from what I've been told from those who have seen it in person, we missed out on a lot on-screen) - I can totally agree on how that would help really show what is happening more clearly than just everyone moving backward. (I really wish we would have had a wide shot of the whole stage for that whole sequence, I've heard it is incredible in person...)
@@AbbyCox Yes, the gaudy veil was helpful in the timeline, as I'm Sure I'm not the only one who didn't realize till I watched a video regarding it, that the turntables go opposite ways, dependent on whether time in marching forward or turning backward.
And, well, normal people don't know it's not accurate and it helps the audience understand what is going on in a quick way.
I would imagine that if they used glass decanters and glasses, they would actually have to pour liquid in them. For a stage performance this is not practical unless the visualization of the liquid is key to the story.
At 1:31 in ruclips.net/video/3D7xNAsi0uo/видео.html we see that in the wedding scene, they actually do have glasses and to make it look like there's champagne in them, they use epoxy and glitter.
yeah, but they were physically pouring the liquid in that scene so they wouldn't be able to do that
@@doritobandito_1323 Oh, ok that makes sense now.
Abby: bawling her eyes out
Nicole:...we can talk about her sleeves
She’s just crying her eyes out and then pauses like “*sniff* …they’re way too big…”
Stage costumes, particularly in musicals, are never going to be historically correct because everything has to be visible way off in the back row. Everything is exaggerated to the extreme including movement. All the costumes are either stretchy or have an insane amount of ease. The colors are so bold they will slap you in the face. In theater more is always more. Then there is the subliminal thing. It's hard to fit in everything that needs to be said so ideas are often implied. White veils and red lights have underlying meanings even if logically they make no sense. One thing that is sometimes hard to get across is social class differences. There's financially well off and then there is posh. I think that may have been why some of the costumes were too forward in time and some of the coats were way too long. Even today in street clothes we see this. For most of us a winter coat comes no lower than the knees because that's all we need but every once in a while you see someone in a designer coat that comes below the calf or even down to the ankles. It's not very practical but it does say I can afford to buy a coat like this. From what I've seen of Hamilton I don't think anyone that wasn't in the highest level of society wore an absurdly long coat. But the suede coat I have no answer. Stage lights are hot. I can't imagine wearing suede on stage. I'd have a heat stroke.
Nicole and I both studied theatre/costume design in university (I also was an acting major) so we *get* the theatrical decisions - like elastic and such (the use of lighting was something Nicole commented on, but I edited out for time - we both liked how lightening was used to tell the story and add humor to the show) - we weren't knocking that (the bubble-butt is a running joke for *all tv/film/theatre* it is never expected 😂) BUT we could see some incredible design choices made by Tazewell that were 100% based on historic research - which was *awesome* but then there were very weird decisions being made that were like...but why? For example - Eliza's pregnancy outfit was 100% based off of one in the Colonial Williamsburg Collection, Angelica's brunswick/riding habit was also based off of an original, but Mulligan's long not-great-great coat was random. Maria Reynold's was just...weird.
Not that it really matters, the show is incredible and I've already watched it 3 times...so even if I hate that they don't give Eliza a good outfit change in Act 2 and Jefferson's dead couch coat, I still love the show. 😂
@@AbbyCox I felt like Mulligan's coat was supposed to add a modern trenchcoat rap vibe (if that makes sense).
@@bisakhadasi that is exactly what it was for, just like Jefferson's purple velvet was supposed to imply a "pimp" attitude, which Daveed Diggs accentuated with his walk. The non-historically accurate choices were absolutely a nod to uban/hip hop fashion of the 90's. it was Tazewell's way of paying homage to the musical aesthetics that Miranda drew from.
@@AbbyCox If you 'get it' why don't you get it? Maria Reynolds' dress conveyed Exactly what it needed to. Not 'weird'.
@@nixhixx because she’d rather be condescending and pedantic.
Abby and Nicole: *Screams*
Pupper: *Pops up* What's happening????
Opens video: (historians screaming)
...perfect
Also, when Abby started crying, I started crying. There are tears on my walking skirt 😭
Some would say the spit is actually correct for his costume, as George was supposedly reported to foam at the mouth after he started to go mad
Great video but what bothers me is that in every “historians review Hamilton costumes” type of video they always talk about the fitting of the sleeves. These performers are doing CRAZY dance moves and jumping and running around that they need to be able to move their arms every possible way. That is why the costume designer(s) changed the fit of the sleeves.
You'd enjoy Bernadette Banner's review. She's incredibly fair with her analysis.
I'd actually commented on this, as well, but edited when I realized these two Did offer a way in which the sleeves could have been both better fitted And fully maneuverable.
If that bothers you, why are you watching a hi or iCal costuming you tubers video??? I am watching this especially to learn what is and is not historically accurate, yes we know that there are needs of the stage but so many people was period plays and movies and series where the costumes are sooo off and not that accurate at all. So the ones taking issues with how a historically accurate way of critiquing this should go find another RUclips channel. This is for the historical nerds.
Danielle Dolipas
Thanks for suggesting that! It was a wonderful video!
Charity Thomas
I was curious about this video and it was a really good one, I was just sharing my opinion, there is nothing wrong with that
No need to be rude
I enjoyed hearing a more detailed and historical breakdown of what Hamilton technically got right and wrong, but I do think it's important to acknowledge that the show wasn't going for perfect historical accuracy. Things like the length of Hercules Mulligan coat was probably chosen as a story telling reason to give him more "swagger" to a modern eye. As Bernadette Banner mentioned in her video, the costumes do a great job at keeping the modern audience in the time period via silhouettes while taking needed liberties for story telling reasons. I also think it's important to acknowledge that these costumes were never meant to be viewed this closely. I just graduated with a degree in technical theatre (focusing on costumes) and one thing our professors always reminded us of was the "6ft rule," that the closest the audience would ever be seeing things is 6 ft away. Therefore things like how the back of the Schuyler Sister's bodices were laced wouldn't be noticed by the audience but certain lacing styles would make quick changes A LOT easier. It doesn't make sense to pick a more historically accurate detail that the audience won't see but can incredibly complicate a quick change. As mentioned, I really enjoyed getting to learn more about what Hamilton got wrong and right, but I do think it's important to acknowledge the reasons why concessions are made as opposed to making it seem like the designer was lazy. DISCLAIMER: I haven't finished this video so they may touch on these reasons later.
Oh we know all of this - so a lot of the gorgeous details were fascinating (like how Washington has a moire ribbon sash on instead of a plain sash - that’s pulled directly from the original sash).
Nicole and i disagreed on the back lacing - that didn’t bother me at all and I totally saw what Tazewell was doing with that - it made sense BUT spiral lacing is the historic way of doing things and is actually faster and can be quick rigged for fast changes. (I cut it out for time, but Nicole had devised a way to do just that for a show she was in that involved zip ties). We are absolutely viewing this through the lens of history, but we are also discussing it from a “what would we do instead” and also a “I wish that this garment would have been used instead because 1. It’s more period correct and 2. Would have conveyed a similar emotion/character development/plot device. This is also 100% initial reactions and thoughts - so it’s very raw.
Regardless, it’s all in good fun! Tazewell is a great designer and you can see how thoroughly he does his research. ❤️
@@KristenK78 whoa neat!
Did you catch the flowers on the front of Angelica’s gown in Helpless? They filmed two performances and it’s obvious she wore two different gowns- one with flowers in the décolletage and one without. Fun to watch.
In fact, three performances were taped on three consecutive days in 2016, once the three performances with cameras in the audience boxes and with public were taped, Certain scenes were performed again in those days after each performances with cameras on stage without an audience.
And it was the same gown, just with the boutonnière missing in the close shots
Ha! As a lesbian who does historical costuming, can confirm that Nicole’s outfit is great.
As a bi woman, I would totally not mind going on a date with her if her and my marriage don't work out. I'd love me a woman who can teach me how to finally get that damn bubble butt correct.
Bellaen omg I’m bisexual also
Guessing that they might have used "pewter" looking glasses instead of actual glass to not break and also to not show that there was no actual liquid (if it was clear glass or plastic).
Exactly, it’s easier to hide the liquid (if there is any in there) and fake how much time has passed/how much has been drunk when the audience can’t see the actual amount of liquid left in the decanter or glass.
They could have easily used clear plastic containers to avoid the possible breakage worry. Looks like crystal/glass from audience. But then they would have to use liquids - worrying about levels, spills, etc
There were "filled" glasses in the wedding scene for the toast that were obviously not liquid. The pewter used elsewhere was to allow the appearance of drinking without liquid onstage with period flair.
100% agree - liquid as a prop is the biggest fat pain in the world. Pewter - HEY! Can't see what's in there. It's the sippy-top coffee cup of the 18th cent. drama. Except - they gave the vessels some heft. I hate the OBVIOUSLY empty coffee cups.
*Super sad moment*
Abby: *crying*
Nicole: S L E E V E S
To be fair, I did the same as nicole when I watched it the first time 😂
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
Meantime I think I cried more watching Abby break down than I did watching it myself. 😭
@@KristenK78 oof, valid
I heard that the costume designer was trying to keep everything from the neck down pretty historically accurate and everything from the neck up, like hairstyles and hats, modern.
Have you reacted to old movie called “Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart” from 1984. It would be fun to hear your opinion about the costumes 😊
That movie is such a guilty pleasure.... 😂
Yes! Please do an Amadeus video!
I love that movie! Hehehehe
YES!!!
Please react to this one!! 😂😂
Can we talk for a moment though at how visually stunning it was to have everyone in cream at the opening except for Burr?
It’s interesting seeing her perspective of things as a dress historian vs when I watched Bernadette Banner’s reaction video knowing she came from a theater background. I appreciate Abby’s reaction here because we get to see her genuine reaction to the play and her hilarious diatribe about the artistic license taken with some of the costumes.
So remember Abby’s reaction and criticism come from a first time audience member and dress historian. She’s not necessarily taking into account how the actors need to move in those clothes. So y’all stop coming for her in the comments
Can this be a series where you guys react and critique films/plays/tv shows period clothing???
Seeing as how she lives right next to me, I don't think Nicole would mind. 😂
@@AbbyCox I second this!!
I vote in favor!
ABBY PLEASE
I would watch this!
Fun fact: Eliza gasps at the end after "who lives, who dies, who tells your story" because the audience are the people who tell Hamilton's story
Actually, Eliza's gasp is supposed to be portrayed as many things. It was never wrote in the script for the play and was added later. Anything the fans want to say it's for can go. Lin wanted it to be left up to the Eliza's and fans.
Griff popping up when they screamed at the veil. Loved this
It was the highlight of my editing life, because I had *no idea* that he had done that 😂
It is the reason I came back to watch a 2nd time. That and your cocovid comment about this awesome video saddens me and I came to kick some troll bums
Jonathan Groff ( A local hometown Lancaster County Pa Dude ) is known as a spitter when he sings - saw about it the other day
At least he doesn't spit on other people like Hayley Williams (Paramore) does. No wonder the band members keep replacing themselves.
@@ThemisMorze he has in musicals he's been in in the past.
“He was a fancy man from Virginia” yes, yes he was😂😂
"Can we get a musical about Mrs. Adams next."
me: Which one?
I saw an interview with Jonathan Groff where he states he’s a spitter when he sings live. King George III is probably my favorite character!
I was wondering why Mulligan’s costume bothered me. It was his coat! I also couldn’t stand the veil, not really the baby blue baby doll dress. To me, it made no sense. They should have kept her in the green.
Loved this show and have already watched it multiple times. I’d love to see y’all react to other period movies, musicals, etc.
Bernadette Banner did a video talking about the costumes. Very informative.
And also, after watching Hamilton, I need to see more men (of all colours but mostly in shades of brown), in 18th century clothing...YUMMY!!! 😍
Agreed! The 18th Century was a FANTASTIC era for men!!
That moment when Abby is wiping away tears and says “yyep they’re way to big” just super casually. Killed me. Lol
The pewter cups and jug were purely for the actors to fake drink "one last time, have a drink with me". Glass would need liquid and for the actors to drink, which wouldn't be ideal. Note the glasses used during the wedding had solid resin 'Champaign' in, no one drank, just raised them for toasts.
They were probably using the pewter glasses to hide the fact that they weren't pouring anything? XD
When you both scream about the veil and your dog pops up and is like "What? WHAT?". I can't. I just cant!
Many other people have commented on the practicality of using opaque vessels onstage when characters must appear to be pouring and drinking. I also think that the choice of pewter enabled several percussive accents, e.g. the slamming of the shot glasses on the table in "My Shot" and the toast in "The Room Where it Happens." As for the design of the "shot glasses," which are necessary because of the lyrics in "My Shot," here's the prop designer explaining his choice: stage-directions.com/all/news/theatre-buzz/hamilton-prop-fact-a-tot-of-rum/
If I have to put up with the Wagner wedding march, you have to put up with the veil. ;)
Me: lol I’m gonna make a Hamilton costume video for my channel; mostly fangirling; records voiceover at midnight and produces actual trash
Abby: creates an amazing video
I’m not even mad.
🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰🥰
I'm always very interested in your discussions about time periods, I know I've got clothes I've had for 10+ years in my wardrobe. How often did people change their styles in the 1800's? Did they keep up with fashion so hard and fast, or might they blur an expensive but older coat (for example) with newer style shirt and collar? Would someone have an expensive dress reworked to update the sleeve style leaving other older style details in place? Did it just depend how much money/social status you had, or was a milkmaid keeping up with fashion as much as the rich and mighty? Xx
Bernadette actually goes into this in some of her historical costuming review videos. It's fine for a historical representation like a play or a movie; to have a character that is wearing things considerably older. Or the characters in general not changing their styles for 5 to 8 years at a stretch. But specially for High Society people even during the Revolutionary War they wouldn't have kept something for more than 8 years.
the problem comes in when a particular character jumps forward in their clothing choices and literally no one else does. It becomes too contrasting for narrative reasons.
As Abby correctly mention George Washington married into money and he had no problem spending it. It should also be noted though that George Washington through a series of weird inheritance happenstances in his own family, he actually ended up with the families largest and Main estate because his older surviving brothers didn't want it. So he was not exactly a slouch either on the social scale. But he definitely married significantly above even what Mount Vernon would have allowed him to reasonably go after. By being willing to marry a widow, it wasn't such a big deal socially. But yes he did have a taste for the Finer Things in life.
I’m betting that ‘leather’ coat was straight up toss in the wash faux suede polyester - breathes, stretches and moves! No way they laced them into those bodices...had to have been in/under seam zips with a Velcro over panel for quick changes. Your reaction to that veil was priceless! Dead puppets in crushed velvet! LOL...this was a total hoot! Thanks for giving the credit that was due for the costumes and perhaps when it’s remounted (as it surely will be) the costume folks will watch your video, get those guys in bubble butts, cut the armscyes correctly and fix the later costumes...yeah, that preraphaelite thing...uhhhh 🙄Thank you!❤️❤️
❤️❤️ I think - despite my annoyances with the large coats and the veil 😂 - my biggest requests would be to change Maria's costume to something else that really helps differentiate her from the other women other than the color red, and giving Eliza one more outfit change. To me, the last quarter of the show is actually about her, and that woman deserves to step out in something strong, empowered, and gorgeous at the end.
If I'm remembering correctly, if you look very closely at the front of Angelica's dress in Schuyler Sisters you can see the hint of a zipper.
I don't think historically accurate armscyes would work for the kind of dancing they are doing.
I always get the 'fee-fees' when young phil dies but MAJOR feels when 'its quiet uptown' plays T_T *pours one out from a pewter decanter*
My emotional reaction to this comment: *feefees activated...feefees increasing...BAHAHAHAHAHAHAH* 😂😂😂
I watched/listened to Hamilton for the first time last week. I got bored during the middle and then cried my eyes out while holding my sleeping 6 month old during the duel and death of Phillip.
King George was my favorite character! Also Eliza was too good for Hamilton.
The clothes are also really inspired by hip hop artists and R&B/ Pop artists as well. (I heard that Jefferson's outfit is inspired by Prince and Mulligan's jacket length is inspired by 90-s hip hop artists (don't quote me but it reminds me of Biggie's ICONIC super long fur coat lol.)). So while they were supposed to be historically accurate, a lot of the elements that just seem awkward are because they're inspired by a person/ fashion trend from another time period.
If u have a look at the behind the scenes video about props and costumes you will find that alot of these things like the shots and the mens sleeve placements were purposely done that way xx
Let’s remember, this is not a documentary, it’s a fictional retelling of history made for entertainment :)
Let's also remember, this is a channel about historical costuming.
Drew clearly not from around here. Maybe you got lost ? You should go point things out on reddit,
Charity Thomas Hm I got 85 likes on here so I think I’m in the right place.
@@DrewAnthonys The point is not how many people agree with you but you're criticizing their pointing out historical inaccuracies in a constructive way like they said they would do in the title of the video. Let's remember, This is not an attack on hamilton video rather a youtube video made for entertainment:)
I mean, I'm a history nerd about things other than clothing, so I enjoyed the second act immensely- didn't get bored at all. Kinda surprised someone can get bored... Also, like the immensity of the choice of George Washington to step down from the presidency willingly? King George himself commented that he must of been "the greatest man in the world" to let go of such power. So the fact that you guys were actively like, commenting on your boredom during the number that covered such an important decision historically just shook me XD
Same here XD
I thought they said more that the clothes were boring, not the actual play :-)
So I am realizing that I need an 18th century men's shirt for summer wear. Does anyone have any patterns or resources for how to make one? It seems like it's the perfect summer-in-the-desert garment.
The pup's comments at the end... "I'm going to poop in your shoes!"
Our cat threatens that on a regular basis. Particularly if we don't give her treats on demand.
Glad we're not the only ones! 😆
Might just be me but I wonder if they decided to put shorter sleeves on Elizas night dress because of her having to set things on fire during Burn and maybe they were slightly worried that she could’ve.. ya know.. caught on fire 💀💀
"THAT'S RICH COMING FROM YOU CRUSHED VELVET!" I fucking can't XD
Did I started to cry when Abby cried. hell yes.
I am, not surprisingly, HERE for an Abigail Adams musical!
The reaction to the veil made me want a video about wedding gowns
I think Liza’s Pre-Raphaelite number is supposed to scream “bathrobe” to the cheap seats. But her wedding veil 🙄🤢
13:30 placing the time period of that song is difficult because it jumps around.
Hamilton became Secretary of the Treasury in 1789 (and that happens at the end of the song), but the trial (which happens earlier in the song) didn't actually happen until 1800.
ive heard in an interview they made the costumes to be light and easy to move about. also that the lower portions stays more 1800 while the upper more modern to enforce the, retelling an old story through modern actors and music style
They probably didn’t use glass for the decanter because if it falls it won’t break, unlike glass which would cause the show to stop while it can be cleaned up to make the stage safe for the actors
Fun little fact! Jefferson´s first coat was brown... Digs, and Kail discused about it (Miranda says) and nobody knew about what was the talk. The next day (or play, or whatever), they put this pink coat, wich fitted perfect to the "outdated" idea that they give to Jefferson, and the song (what did I miss) exploded!
There´s some video in some interview wich shows one of the first performances with the brown one. (the "Public´s Theater ones)
1776 isn't fully Abigail Adams' story, but she plays a very big part. Highly recommended.
I believe the reason some of the head gear is out of period is because the costume designer wanted the characters to be “more relatable to 21st century standards” from the neck up. It’s why no ones hair is styled particularly to the period, explains the veil and the not 18th century knit cap. They’re used to help the audience relate. Hercules Mulligan is supposed to be relatable to any person on the street, Eliza’s veil is to relate to the modern bride. The modern hair I think is actually more for the comfort and ease of the actors and ensemble so they’re not worrying about heavy wigs and powder etc. during their performance. Loved hearing you guys react though!!!
I don't know that theater makes decisions for comfort of the actors. There are plenty of shows with awful wigs and the actors deal.
Very true of other shows! Even as a dancer myself, there are awful headpieces that sometimes the choreographer doesn’t even care about the weight of on our heads. But the costume designer specifically wanted to allow for the actors and dancers to be able to execute the choreography without issue in the case of Hamilton. The only exception in the show is the crown and wig for King George, because they wanted his movement to be an extreme contrast to the other characters and his costume to be as accurate to the portraiture as they could get. His crown, wig, and mic pac are all pretty heavy on his head.
I love your guys’ reactions! Priceless. Have you ever thought about doing this with an Outlander episode?
If there's a bug in your drink, I think that means it's tequila? ;-)
Congratulations, Abby,. You've been officially added to the list of people I can't handle seeing cry...because then I cry. Hugs, lots of mental hugs, okay?
Ok I just had to pause to laugh at that opening for a solid 2 minutes. Oh Gryff you adorable noodle you. Will now continue and comment again probably. LOL
When I was reviewing the footage and I saw that, I died. 😂😂😂 I ended up exporting just that clip as its own video so i can just send it whenever hilarious screaming is required. 😂
@@AbbyCox My brain will now recall that double "noooooooo" during moments of historical costume horror now.
Just WATCHING Abby cry is making me cry 😭😭
Also Nicole @ Subi: "Ya gotta buy me a drink first before you get to that base" DYING
OMG Gryff in the background at the end and how he popped up when you guys exclaimed really loud. It had me rolling!!! 🤣😂
LOL your dogs popping when you screamed was hilarious.
It was the "They're too big.." about Eliza's sleeves, through the tears for me.
Abby: Openly Weeping
Nicole: (Softly) We can talk about her sleeves later.
Mood
Me: having no idea the costumes were off and they seemed perfect.
Also me watching this video: oh yeah I see that. Ohhh definitely.
Lmao but for real this is a really cool reaction because it focuses on something I have no knowledge of so you learn. I also think it's great when people talk about something they are passionate about and knowledgeable about:)
Don’t get me wrong - the costumes overall were great (I think some people are not realizing that overall we thought the costumes were great) - there were just a few things that really didn’t sit well, and that the costumes in act 1 felt more thought through than act 2.
When griff popped up when you both screamed at the veil 🤣
He's such a precious goofball. I love him so...even though he chewed a hole in my wall the other day....
Them:**intense screaming**
Dog: What?
Loved the commentary, and I'll watch Hamilton as soon as I can.
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As for the pewter drinkware, I thought they made the right choice if only for practical reasons. A glass may have been dropped (because accidents happen) and there would have been a mess to clean up, can't have shards of glass on the stage! Another big reason would have been that pewter is visible, especially from a distance. Look at your own video: even brightly lit, the steel cup was far more visible than the water glass.
Have you watched it??????
I hadn't gotten around to watching this until after the Cocovid panel where you said people didn't like this video and I just don't get that. It might just be the sass is right up my alley but I felt like I was watching the same reactions that my friend and I had at Little Women in the theater
Awwww Abby, when you cried I wanted to hug you soooo badly!
Hugs and greetings from Germany 🤗🤗💕
I see a reaction video.
I multiply this by Abby's great sense of humour and great ability to describe things.
Pretty much this result in me almost falling off the couch of laughing.
^^
lol, the caftan snark at the end...but my lord you two look so damned comfy in those outfits, though. I really need to make that caftan.
You do. It's amazing.
Awwwww Abby cried!! 😖 that made me get a little teary. I agree about that VEIL. UGGGH 🤢
This video was just so fun and completely right. And you both seem like so much fun to be around. Just awesome!!! 😁
Oh yeah. I lost it. I also cried (I always do) at Dear Theodosia, but that is more like one lone tear...not ugly crying 😂
Abby I hard ugly cried at the same part. I bawled like a child it’s so heartbreaking to watch 😭😭❤️❤️❤️
It was so beautifully done. So gut-wrenching...I teared up when I was editing this video..
Abby Cox so beautifully heartbreaking!
Fellow crier here (does anybody else also cry at happy endings, or is that just me?) I am so excited to watch Hamilton, but I just know that I'm going to be a mess during that scene if Abby's reaction is anything to go by. Tell me it's worth the emotional turmoil?
@@manikpixi Haven't watched Hamilton yet, I just know I'll bawl my eyes out, have to stop the video, and move on whenever I cleaned my glasses and can finally see again. Also, fellow happy cryer here! No matter the emotion, if it's strong, I'll cry.
manikpixi it is just be ready lol an emotional roller coasters for sure
the entire show is a poetic interlection of the eighteenth century. not everything should be as it was. theater is free to do so. I don't know why you are so angry. it is clear, with the use of rap music, the contemporary hair and other details that at no time do they intend to copy as it was at that time.
Daniela Franklin welcome to a Historical costumers RUclips channel. Perhaps you should go watch Abbys other videos wherein she examines how extant garments were made. She is all about the historical accuracy. It is the only reason I watched anything about Hamilton. The reason I love this gang of yotubers is because they explain what is historical and what is “creative license”. Or rather. Fiction when it comes to period dramas and theatre. People thing that theatre and period dramas are historically accurate and a lot of the time they are not. This is how a historical costumer watches these things,and we love her for it .
I know nothing of historical fashion. I have layman high school knowledge of history. Even I thought Eliza's veil looked very strange and out of place. I also hated the costume they chose for Maria Reynolds.
Katherine Marie 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
I love your after reel. You two would be right at home in my circle. I met my best friend when she corrected a professor in a medieval studies class that picture was miss dated because there was no way that they would’ve had those bell sleeves at that time. She was right.
An interesting thing on the suede coat, but it may be used to mimic velvet or another fabric for stage lighting, as a professional dancer, and a daughter of a theatrical costume designer, a lot of fabrics don't actually look like the fabrics or read as very flat when they are far away and under stage lighting, so there are a lot of tricks that exist to make a costume read as one fabric on stage, but be made in another fabric, either for cost, movability/breathability or because some fabrics just don't read well under stage lighting. In these up-close theatrical shots, you would notice the fabric, but from far away you probably wouldn't. I've never personally seen suede used to combat these issues, but maybe that's it, or it could also be a character choice, but I thought this was interesting info either way.
The veil scream and the dogs reaction to your reaction!!😂🤣
I want a video from a French dialect coach talking about Daveed rapping in a French accent
@9:54 when the dog popped up to your screams hahaha 😂 sew funny!
I love your commentary AND that you included real captions so that I can share this with my hard-of-hearing friend!
My first goal with my patreon was to cover the cost of having my videos transcribed for closed-captions! I haven’t done it on all my backlog (just all the popular videos) but I am doing it for all new videos now too! ❤️
@@AbbyCox Thank you so much! This makes me so happy! There are lots of videos from big creators with over a million subscribers that do not bother adding real captions so that D/deaf and HOH people can enjoy their videos so it makes me so happy that it was your first patreon goal!
@@AbbyCox As a hearing-impaired individual, I hugely appreciate it. All of mine are for class (all two so far--I've hidden older ones because there's no rhyme or reason to my earlier choices), so I end up reading from a pre-written essay, which makes adding the CC super-easy with YT's feature that matches the transcript timing with voice recognition, and with my speech impediment, that saves my viewers from seeing CC that is nothing like what I was trying to say. I'm not deaf, so I can usually get around the misinterpreted autocaptioning, but it can get really distracting when I'm watching a video of someone whose enunciation isn't 150% clear.
For future... we want to KNOW WHY!!!! e.g. why the veil is wrong (they weren't used - but tell us what you woulda' done). Part of what I love about these reaction videos is when what would have been right is explained.
I am 100% team "comfortable actors who can do acrobatic dance moves". but I still love the "how this is wrong/different"
I learned something new. I had no idea Washington traveled with crystal-ware during the war.
You hit it right on the head! The veil was atrocious. I can only assume that it was included (how do I put this kindly?) for people who know absolutely nothing about history. The “scarlet harlot” got an eye roll, for sure, and Eliza’s Regency dress embodies what I so dislike about the period...women dressed as baby-dolls. That being said, I loved it and will watch it repeatedly! King George was a favorite of mine, too, despite the spittle.
Bisexuals and lesbians everywhere will be all about Nicole’s outfit. She’s looking fine!! And I love the caftan and it’s extra-comfy, weather appropriate, linen goodness. Love, light, and blessings to you and yours.
Thank you! I'm glad our review made sense - I love Regency, when it's done correctly, it can be incredibly flattering and sophisticated, but the outfit that they put Eliza in for that last half was just...not good....
(also, yeah Nicole looked freaking fantastic when she walked into the house. I was like "damn girl. snap!" 😂)
I assume the veil was a prostume (prop+costume) and was asked for by outside forces to "clarify" the moment. Bane of costume dept. existance: if the concept isn't landing, give them a costume piece!
I read, somewhere, that King George's spittle was deliberate to make him look as insane as possible. Jonathan Groff purposely drank water right before going onstage.
"atrocious"? A bit over the top, don't you think?
Enjoyed the hell our of this. You two should do more together!
Jon Groff spitting was a totally organic moment. When you attend of musicals or more intimate concert environments, many of the singers will just spit, and if you are in the front couple of rows, you are in the splash zone. Liza Minnelli was an infamous spitter. lol At least Maria's costume was spiral laced on the bodice, though the scarlet red is way too on the nose. I guess those that know the history going in, it is supposed to immediately signal who this character is, as she steps out of the shadows. I would have loved to hear your take on the performances as well, since your self-described theater geeks. Also I took the carafe and glasses in the One Last Time scene to be silver, not pewter, but highly polished silver would be to shiny on stage, so then had to make it a brushed surface.
Hamilton is my 4/5 great grandfather - I was in awe walking around Williamsburg because I knew he walked and fought for our country there- I've also been to Montpelier and worked in their barns for the Hunt Cup Races for the last 10 years - love my country
I'm some kind of distant cousin of Aaron Burr.
Sorry 'bout that whole duel thing.
I’m related to both Thomas Paine and Patrick Henry somehow-kind of cool, I think
Julie Henry hey, my parents are from Montpelier and I go there often but I don’t know it as well as I’d want to. What are the Hunt Cup Races?
@@bareabopopera3091 they are horse races where they either jump over brush fences or do flat racing on that course or the regular race course - they have a tailgate contest ( which originated when they had hunting parties riding with the hounds and that would pull the tailgate of the carriage down and have a luncheon from the tailgate ) as well as Jack Russell Terrier races and some women riding side saddle- they also have vendors there
My moms spongebob
Opening moment, you vocalize shock and Griff pops up in the back “uh, what’s wrong, are you okay?”
When I saw Eliza's viel I just thought:
Wait something's not looking right here.
Chéeriø & Mîlk right?!?!!
This was a fun watch! Granted, I think to watch a rap/R&B musical about the 1800's is to accept a few anachronisms. Still, you gals offered some interesting insights.
Also, fun fact: Maria Reynolds was a cousin to the Schuyler sisters.
I saw Jonathan Groff (the spitting king) in Spring Awakening and treated myself to second row tickets…I remember the spit vividly…it was illuminated by the stage lights as it flew
“That’s rich coming from you, crushed velvet”
Just wanted to say I thought this video was great. ❤ As someone who's pretty new to historical costuming it was really cool to hear more well-informed commentary, it's not a criticism of the production, it's helping people understand the difference between historical accuracy and creative license. I grew up not having any idea about what people in history actually wore or how to tell the difference between time periods. Disney movies in particular really messed me up, as gorgeous as those gowns are! And it was hilarious to see you lose your minds over certain parts. 🤣 Also, bawling over the sad parts - feels! Glad I'm not the only one! Please don't ever take this down. ❤❤
That was a beautiful moment when Nicole embraced you. Needed that today!