I'm glad you talked about the gas generators. As you know, we, personally, had a lot of issues with this a year ago. Maybe we were one of the first customers, truly off-grid with no option to grid AC charge, attempting to recharge with a gas generator. We initially tried with 120V inverter...nope...then we bumped up to a 240V inverter....nope, initially, but finally success after a lot of back and forth with Hysolis and our electrician. What was finally "discovered" is that you have to wire things up so that the 240V power from the gas/propane generator is charging each Hysolis unit (2 set-up in 240V spilt phase) "out of phase". I'm not an electrician so I'm really still not sure what all that entails but it required some creative rewiring of the generator inlet from outside to inside to work. Once that was done, only then could we charge both Hysolis units at the same time while also running the house. Additionally....you cannot recharge in this manner AND have solar charging at the same time, despite what their literature says. That will not work. You have to flip the solat breakers to "off" to recharge via. generator. As you can imagine, all this took quite a while to figure out. I'm still unsure if that depends on how much solar is incoming or if it's just that it won't work if any is incoming at all. We just turn solar off and recharge. Maybe this new device will help? We spent a lot of $ on gas/propane generator backup. It might be worth making a video JUST on recharging options. It's not as straight forward as it should be and there is 0 guidance on how to do this in their manuals. It's all trial and error which is a little scary with how much these cost. Despite all if this, I still feel it's the best out there. The amount of solar you CAN charge with is amazing. And being able to recharge with a generator can be the difference in surviving off-grid. That's no joke. It's real. Also, I 100% agree with the customer service. I had 1 bad unit that ended up destroying ,2 other units before destroying itself. They've sent me 3 new units and never charged me a thing. They paid all shipping costs and replaced the units.
Thanks for the info/preview. My gas generator does have a THD on under 3% and charges the Apollo fine. Even so the stand alone Hysolis battery charger sounds like a bonus during an outage, I look forward to finding out more.
So, Hysolis is coming out with a Chargeverter, years after EG4 did? The Apollo is an impressive product, but for the insane premium they charge, they had better be a great product! They allow you to set up a microgrid, but it's still kinda-sorta mobile. There are definitely some use cases for that, but not many. For stationary use cases, there are far more cost-effective options.
I mean i just looked at the price of a hysolis on their website and it's about the same price as a Delta Pro Ultra. That being the case I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that there really is no comparison between the two the hysolis seems to be the way better option. Yes the DPU is prettier but I think the hysolis has way more capabilities. If I had to do it over I should of got the hysolis.
@@lanceboudreau3630 - The DPU has the same basic challenge, though; it's a HUGE system that can only be called "portable" in the academic sense of the word. I guess if you have a sizable off-grid cabin and a need for home backup power, something like the hysolis or DPU could be moved back n' forth, but they're both right at the upper limit of what even young, healthy folks are going to want to hassle with. For stationary needs, there are far less expensive, and more capable/scalable, open architecture solutions. If you already bought the DPU, what was your specific use case? Is it just for home backup power, in a single location?
@jasonbroom7147 agreed neither are really portable. With the complexities of setting them up and the weight , moving these won't be something you'll find yourself doing more then a couple times before you say to heck with it.i was just pointing out if you had to choose between the two for 5k$ I'd choose the Hysolis. More PV input as well as 3 phase power, and I'm pretty sure the out put can be expanded much larger too. Plus all the other stuff he said in the video.
Great video Ben. It was great to see you at CES again. It's intersting I brought up the topic of the Hysolis at the dinner line up not realizing you had already created this video before going to CES. Hysolis really do seem very robust. The solar input capabilities are very attractive. Adding the built in 5000 watt SMPS capability is a game changer also.
Agreed! The one thing this unit does that no other portable product can do is load sharing. Two apollos will share power with each other and drain batteries evenly. These units are rock solid in my opinion and that's why I bought 2 with expansion batteries for 240 support and load sharing.
I’ll be anxiously waiting to see what Hysolis comes out with. I’ve had difficulties charging my Apollos and expansion batteries from a less than 3% THD generator. I’ve had several days of cloudy days and live 100% off grid. So plugging them into a wall outlet is not an option. I can get my generator to charge the units, but it is not a straight forward task. To do a “fast charge” I need to remove the battery cable and communion cables from the back of the units and change settings on the control panel. Talking customer support I was sent a link for a golf cart battery charger (converts to dc) and a battery cable to charge the Apollo batteries. This bypasses the electronics so even a non THD generator will work. Ben mentioned something coming out that will charge the batteries around 5,000 watts. The solution customer service sent me is 800 watts.
I love my Apollo so far, my only complaint is that they don't have an API available for integration with home automation. I'm happy I got it, just wish I could connect it to Home Assistant for tracking input/output and ideally even for automating changes. Local API via the wifi would be great, cloud based would be an ok alternative. All the capability is already there, even just published specs on how the display communicates with the base unit would be enough to make the Apollo perfect. I've used it camping for my RV, during the summer for AC where I didn't have a circuit that could run it in my office room, and to run the fridge, freezer and furnace during a couple of brief power outages. It charges great from my trucks inverter when solar isn't available too.
EG4 already has a 5,120 watt battery charger called the Chargeverter $465.00. i can buy right now a 16 kilowatt battery for $1,932 and a EG4 6000XP inverter/charger $1,399. So, for $3,796 i can have 16 kilowatts of battery storage and 6 kilowatts of inverter with chargeverter for $4,894 less than a 5 kilowatt Apollo 5K and one expansion 5k battery.
Yes that is true. I have nothing against that, I'm all for it. Not everyone wants to build their unit which is why solar generators exist. I love EG4 equipment.
So just to confirm - My Ecoflow Delta Pro 3 won't charge from my 7500w Westinghouse non inverter genny? Haven't tried yet but that's a basic staple of my backup plan. Please assist.
All depends on what features you need. Having to link two main units together to get split phase is at this point outdated tech. Having just one model is also limiting. They need to catch more of the entry level market so that when people are ready to upgrade the larger unit becomes more appealing. Otherwise I’m sure it works well.
I AM NOT IMPRESSED.-You can achieve the same thing with two Delta pros and the Delta pro generator. If you connect the Delta pro generator to one of the Delta pros and then connect that Delta pro DC output to the DC input of the second Delta pro. Then set the parameters that it charges if the Delta gets below 30%. The generator will charge the first deal the pro if it gets below 30%, and The first deal the pro that’s hooked up to the generator will charge the second Delta pro if it gets below 30% through the DC to DC connection. The Delta pro gas generator charges in DC so there’s no power loss. In theory you could daisy Chan three Delta pros together through the DC ports using this method. And run three phase.
Fair enough, but I like the better solar input, no need for firmware updates, and better dark start as well as better charge sharing. That doesn't make the DP3 or DPU obsolete in anyway, it's just a different option.
@@eabizzarro Yes they call it AC Always On. And mine doesn't work consistently as well as others that I've asked which is why I don't consider it full dark start. I've had to manually restart mine multiple times.
So will this EMP Shield work on other solar generators as well? For those of us that can’t afford a huge hysolis set up like yours, still want to EMP proof what we do have. Thanks so much.
My only gripe on the Apollo is the cost. If the pricing was more online with Ecoflow, Anker, Jackery etc; I think the Hysolis would sell lots of Apollos. However, the EMP shielding of an Apollo perks my interest 🤔
Yes they are a bit pricey as a single unit. But if you look at them as a kit compared to the other same sized kits, you'll find they are more affordable than the other options. poweredportablesolar.com/shop/
When connected to SHP2 multiple DPUs have SOC sharing. It's pretty limited but technically one unit can charge another if you have imbalanced solar/DC inputs. Haven't heard if DP3 can do that or not
Thanks Ben for another great, informative video. I'm really learning a lot from this series. I'm trying to accumulate enough funds to put in a backup power system for the essentials in my house during a power outage and I know there are lots of great options for free standing homes. But what about apartments and town homes? Do you have any thoughts on backup power for apartment/town home living? I'm thinking solar is going to be very limited depending on the availability of sunlight to some of these units. Assuming a unit has some exposure to solar at some point during the day. Are there viable options for solar panels hung in windows or placed on balconies that can recharge a solar generator, sized for the smaller essential power demands of an apartment/town home? I realize running the heat pump(which is what every apartment I've been exposed to heats and cools with) is out. But just to be able to run a small ceramic heater or room a/c, the frig, and smaller loads(recharge phones, laptops, and a fan) would be great. Thanks for any help and keep up the great content.
Thanks for watching. Great question. The problem with apartments is you have no space for solar panels. I think the best option is to get a high output inverter generator that can recharge the power station quickly. That way you exchange 4 hours of gas for 24 hours of battery.
I have an off grid system with 4 apollos with a combiner box along with 2 expansion batteries. I also have a 17.6kw array. On consecutive cloudy days, I'm able to recharge from less than 50% to 100% in less than 2 hours using AC fast charge at 20A/Apollo with a 22kw Generac generator, while also running the house. I tried ACFC set to 25A/Apollo but it tripped the inverters so I backed off. Seems stable so far. May not remain stable though. I may have to limit other heavy loads during ACFC and/or back off the ACFC more. Looking forward to looking into the new charging unit.
*Hysolis would seem to even beat EcoFlow in reliability and features, and this is something worth pointing out. I don't like to screw around with my power stations. I have longed to have a solution which you take out of the box, plug it in, and it just works. This is all I want ! I don't want it to constantly require firmware updates, because there's nothing in the unit that needs a patch, repair, or improvement. Imagine a power station that is ready when you take it out of the box ? You just plug the product in, and there's nothing HALF-BAKED ABOUT THE PRODUCT'S READINESS TO FUNCTION ! IT JUST WORKS ! ARE YOU LISTENING ECOFLOW ?*
i thought i heard you talking about the F3800 sharing battery charge between two units when using their hub...... I like the Apollo but i just cant see my way to buy a Lamborghini as a day to day driver........i can own several fords for less and use the extra money for other projects.
Yes I did get one kind of sharing between the two F3800s but I can't recall exactly what it was. But it wasn't full sharing like the Apollo, only partial. I was able at one point to drain one F3800 lower than the other and then somehow balanced it later. I'll have to test that again.
Everyone keeps saying eco flow is more affordable . If you really compare apple to apple ( Apollo 5k vs Delta Pro Ultra ) they are almost the same price so if your gonna spend 5k on a unit then go Apollo.
Correct. Go look on my website, PoweredPortableSolar.com/shop/ and compare the kits between the Apollo and DPU and you'll see that the Apollo is actually cheaper in most cases, WHEN in a kit.
Here's a question you most likely don't get very often, what type of RF noise is generated by these units? I am a ham radio operator and have been reluctant to go with solar because of most solar charge controllers produce God awful interference on the amateur radio HF frequencies. Maybe while reviewing these various systems you could comment on this. That or comment on how to mitigate this interference.
I was referring to having two Delta Pros using the dual voltage hub. When leg/phase 1 goes out, the voltage hub turns off because there's only one leg of power. So you lose all power output from that.
adding emp direct to inverter plus the adapter to use any other generator to charge is kinda a game changer. makes me consider not building a diy system.
This is making me worried about the Anker... suspense is killing me! I wanted to go hysolis but the amount of units to get the same power from 2 Ankers sold me
@@ralphpezda6523we are talking about the unbalance between phase he claims is exclusive to Hysolis. Not true. Anker allows 2400W solar per unit. It’s far more portable , costs less , and expandable to 56kwh. I own 2 units with a power hub. 12,000w 50amp 240vac. With articulating arrays of 1200w I have no problem topping off the batteries with 4800w. Not sure why anyone needs more than that. My only complaint is how much these units draw when they are on and idle. I’m thinking I might move my second unit to another property or mobile application as the power hub is Power hungry, and 6kw with 26kwh per property should suffice. I don’t plan on charging off the grid with either. No additional inverter needed.
@@ralphpezda6523why? Maybe I should wait for solid state? Calculate costs for initial purchase and compare them? Hysolis LiPo’s have more cycles? 3000 cycles is 8 plus years of FREE solar charging . Do They have a deal on cost per KW off the grid? Calculating that depends on wether you have peak hr pricing and where you live. In 8 years the tech will be Completely different. I’m confused about your off topic point. Original comments were addressing the alleged lack of balanced batteries in multiple units. What is your point exactly. Care to elaborate?
But both the EcoFlow Delta pro 3 and Delta pro Ultra already have split phase and you just add batteries to them. So are you saying that EcoFlow is doing something in those two units that they don't supply power equally to each phase??? Also G4 Chargverter will allow you to use any Generator.
I was referring to the Delta Pro and other units that use two units to get 240v, like the Apollo, but don't share the loads. Additionally, you can have two DPUs together on the 50a hub, but if unit 1 has no solar input and unit 2 has solar input, unit 2 will not share power to unit 1, eventually reaching an imbalance. The Apollos can have no solar on unit 1 but have solar on unit 2 and unit 2 will send power over to unit 1 to keep them the same.
This doesn't really sound special, there is a whole market segment that does these things. Most residential hybrid inverters can gang their output and share the same battery bank. And generally speaking I dislike having to gang units just to get split-phase... I'd rather each individual unit output split-phase and then gang the units that way to increase the output. It comes down to redundancies. It's a lot easier to add redundancy piecemeal when you can do it one unit at a time, instead of having to add in pairs. I'm sure the vendors are happier if you buy more of their stuff, but it just pads their profits. It's not a good solution for the consumer. In terms of generators... there is already a solution on the market. Actually numerous solutions but the easiest is the EG4 Chargeverter. You plug the generator into that and charge the (48V) battery bank directly. Problem solved. Which is what this Hysolis thing is doing too... just in a more proprietary format. Generally speaking it isn't battery charging that suffers from dirty generator power, instead its the fact that most hybrid inverters have to run in pass-through mode in order to use the inverter circuitry to charge the battery which means the dirty generator output is being fed into the house. Having an independent AC battery charger such as the Chargeverter solves this problem. (This is because the inverter cicuitry in these units is dual-purposed to reduce costs and share the beefy heat sinks and other circuitry). The problem with trying to use power stations to run a house is the proprietary vendor lock-in and the difficulty of scaling just the bits and pieces that you need to scale. People who want to feed their whole house really need to stop messing with power stations entirely and go with more discrete systems such as a Victron Multiplus II or an EG4 18K or a Sol-Ark and discrete battery banks with server-rack 48V batteries. Etc. For a big system you want to use standard bits and pieces that are generic and cross-vendor compatible. Otherwise you wind up spending an arm and a leg when stuff begins to fail years down the line because the vendors no longer sell those products or remain compatible with their 10-year-old gear. So many people buying these things now are going to be tearing their hair out in a couple of years when they realize the rabbit hole they went down. -Matt
So EcoFlow ultra is about $5k for 6k wh and $2700 for extra battery. This unit is $5k for 5k wh and $3700 for 5k extra battery. How is that better??? Because you get more solar input? The typical homeowner doesn’t live on a cornfield with 5k watts of solar panels spread out. And rooftop installations are guaranteed leaks. Not to mention the units are huge and unsightly with wires everywhere. Just go generac propane back up if you can and if you want portability get EcoFlow with some solar and a EcoFlow auto start generator or a Honda 2000.
Fair enough. The differnce comes in when you put it together as a kit. The Apollo kits tend to be slightly more affordable than DPU kits for similar specs.
Well I wasn't paid in any way shape or form to make the video just like I wasn't for the ecoflow or bluetti videos I just did on the exact same subject. I'm reviewing all the major brands simply sharing my opinion.
Free Solar Generator Comparison Chart: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1pUgG1ldofSyOaz6EMD3WDhw80cQlcCvKsU58EEgbBjE/edit?usp=sharing
Solar Kits: poweredportablesolar.com/shop/
Hysolis: hysolis.com/?ref=poweredportablesolar
I'm glad you talked about the gas generators. As you know, we, personally, had a lot of issues with this a year ago. Maybe we were one of the first customers, truly off-grid with no option to grid AC charge, attempting to recharge with a gas generator. We initially tried with 120V inverter...nope...then we bumped up to a 240V inverter....nope, initially, but finally success after a lot of back and forth with Hysolis and our electrician. What was finally "discovered" is that you have to wire things up so that the 240V power from the gas/propane generator is charging each Hysolis unit (2 set-up in 240V spilt phase) "out of phase". I'm not an electrician so I'm really still not sure what all that entails but it required some creative rewiring of the generator inlet from outside to inside to work. Once that was done, only then could we charge both Hysolis units at the same time while also running the house. Additionally....you cannot recharge in this manner AND have solar charging at the same time, despite what their literature says. That will not work. You have to flip the solat breakers to "off" to recharge via. generator. As you can imagine, all this took quite a while to figure out. I'm still unsure if that depends on how much solar is incoming or if it's just that it won't work if any is incoming at all. We just turn solar off and recharge.
Maybe this new device will help? We spent a lot of $ on gas/propane generator backup. It might be worth making a video JUST on recharging options. It's not as straight forward as it should be and there is 0 guidance on how to do this in their manuals. It's all trial and error which is a little scary with how much these cost.
Despite all if this, I still feel it's the best out there. The amount of solar you CAN charge with is amazing. And being able to recharge with a generator can be the difference in surviving off-grid. That's no joke. It's real.
Also, I 100% agree with the customer service. I had 1 bad unit that ended up destroying ,2 other units before destroying itself. They've sent me 3 new units and never charged me a thing. They paid all shipping costs and replaced the units.
What kind of generator do you have?
@kevinshriver7589 We ended up buying (2) Pulsar 7250W 240V Duel Fuel Inverter Generators. We have 2 cabins with exactly the same setup.
Ya it's a bit tricky with the gas generators. I am working a solution video to make things easier for people.
Thanks for the info/preview. My gas generator does have a THD on under 3% and charges the Apollo fine. Even so the stand alone Hysolis battery charger sounds like a bonus during an outage, I look forward to finding out more.
Awesome, thanks for sharing, that's helpful.
So, Hysolis is coming out with a Chargeverter, years after EG4 did? The Apollo is an impressive product, but for the insane premium they charge, they had better be a great product! They allow you to set up a microgrid, but it's still kinda-sorta mobile. There are definitely some use cases for that, but not many. For stationary use cases, there are far more cost-effective options.
I mean i just looked at the price of a hysolis on their website and it's about the same price as a Delta Pro Ultra. That being the case I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that there really is no comparison between the two the hysolis seems to be the way better option. Yes the DPU is prettier but I think the hysolis has way more capabilities. If I had to do it over I should of got the hysolis.
@@lanceboudreau3630 - The DPU has the same basic challenge, though; it's a HUGE system that can only be called "portable" in the academic sense of the word. I guess if you have a sizable off-grid cabin and a need for home backup power, something like the hysolis or DPU could be moved back n' forth, but they're both right at the upper limit of what even young, healthy folks are going to want to hassle with. For stationary needs, there are far less expensive, and more capable/scalable, open architecture solutions. If you already bought the DPU, what was your specific use case? Is it just for home backup power, in a single location?
@jasonbroom7147 agreed neither are really portable. With the complexities of setting them up and the weight , moving these won't be something you'll find yourself doing more then a couple times before you say to heck with it.i was just pointing out if you had to choose between the two for 5k$ I'd choose the Hysolis. More PV input as well as 3 phase power, and I'm pretty sure the out put can be expanded much larger too. Plus all the other stuff he said in the video.
Great video Ben.
It was great to see you at CES again.
It's intersting I brought up the topic of the Hysolis at the dinner line up not realizing you had already created this video before going to CES.
Hysolis really do seem very robust.
The solar input capabilities are very attractive.
Adding the built in 5000 watt SMPS capability is a game changer also.
Thanks! It was good to see you this year too.
Liked what you mentioned...not so much what you didn't. Cost, Wh, warranty, retailers, weight, included supplies and discount codes to name a few
Good to know, thanks for sharing.
Agreed! The one thing this unit does that no other portable product can do is load sharing. Two apollos will share power with each other and drain batteries evenly. These units are rock solid in my opinion and that's why I bought 2 with expansion batteries for 240 support and load sharing.
thanks for sharing!
I’ll be anxiously waiting to see what Hysolis comes out with. I’ve had difficulties charging my Apollos and expansion batteries from a less than 3% THD generator. I’ve had several days of cloudy days and live 100% off grid. So plugging them into a wall outlet is not an option. I can get my generator to charge the units, but it is not a straight forward task. To do a “fast charge” I need to remove the battery cable and communion cables from the back of the units and change settings on the control panel. Talking customer support I was sent a link for a golf cart battery charger (converts to dc) and a battery cable to charge the Apollo batteries. This bypasses the electronics so even a non THD generator will work. Ben mentioned something coming out that will charge the batteries around 5,000 watts. The solution customer service sent me is 800 watts.
I know it's hard going through all of that so I appreciate your patience. The device will be available asap for fast charging.
Hysolis and solar input makes them really appealing! Add the leg 1 and 2 power sharing capability and that is the deciding factor for me.
100% agreed, I love the power sharing.
I love my Apollo so far, my only complaint is that they don't have an API available for integration with home automation. I'm happy I got it, just wish I could connect it to Home Assistant for tracking input/output and ideally even for automating changes. Local API via the wifi would be great, cloud based would be an ok alternative. All the capability is already there, even just published specs on how the display communicates with the base unit would be enough to make the Apollo perfect.
I've used it camping for my RV, during the summer for AC where I didn't have a circuit that could run it in my office room, and to run the fridge, freezer and furnace during a couple of brief power outages.
It charges great from my trucks inverter when solar isn't available too.
Agree, auto transfer power would be incredible.
EG4 already has a 5,120 watt battery charger called the Chargeverter $465.00. i can buy right now a 16 kilowatt battery for $1,932 and a EG4 6000XP inverter/charger $1,399. So, for $3,796 i can have 16 kilowatts of battery storage and 6 kilowatts of inverter with chargeverter for $4,894 less than a 5 kilowatt Apollo 5K and one expansion 5k battery.
Could you share the details on that 16kw battery? Also where’s can I purchase?
Yes that is true. I have nothing against that, I'm all for it. Not everyone wants to build their unit which is why solar generators exist. I love EG4 equipment.
So just to confirm - My Ecoflow Delta Pro 3 won't charge from my 7500w Westinghouse non inverter genny? Haven't tried yet but that's a basic staple of my backup plan. Please assist.
Correct, unless the THD is clean enough and the DP3 will allow power in. They won't charge off of dirty power.
Great overview, the emp shield is a great idea, I will bexwatching for that video.
Thanks. I'll get that video out asap. lots of videos in the works.
What are those little gray boxes you’re using you have in the front of each apollo. What is there purpose
Those are the DC input (solar) breakers. They allow you to turn solar input off easily at the unit.
Great reviews as always. Problem for us in Hawaii, is the shipping cost.
Yes shipping to Hawaii is tough, but we do ship there quite often if you ever need a system.
All depends on what features you need. Having to link two main units together to get split phase is at this point outdated tech.
Having just one model is also limiting. They need to catch more of the entry level market so that when people are ready to upgrade the larger unit becomes more appealing.
Otherwise I’m sure it works well.
Fair enough. Thanks for commenting.
I AM NOT IMPRESSED.-You can achieve the same thing with two Delta pros and the Delta pro generator. If you connect the Delta pro generator to one of the Delta pros and then connect that Delta pro DC output to the DC input of the second Delta pro. Then set the parameters that it charges if the Delta gets below 30%. The generator will charge the first deal the pro if it gets below 30%, and The first deal the pro that’s hooked up to the generator will charge the second Delta pro if it gets below 30% through the DC to DC connection. The Delta pro gas generator charges in DC so there’s no power loss. In theory you could daisy Chan three Delta pros together through the DC ports using this method. And run three phase.
Fair enough, but I like the better solar input, no need for firmware updates, and better dark start as well as better charge sharing. That doesn't make the DP3 or DPU obsolete in anyway, it's just a different option.
@@minutemanprepjust lots of cables between the units. I’m pretty sure the DP can dark start at a user set percentage of charge
@@eabizzarro Yes they call it AC Always On. And mine doesn't work consistently as well as others that I've asked which is why I don't consider it full dark start. I've had to manually restart mine multiple times.
Very interesting How expensive?
So will this EMP Shield work on other solar generators as well? For those of us that can’t afford a huge hysolis set up like yours, still want to EMP proof what we do have. Thanks so much.
Not yet, it will only work with the Apollo according to EMP Shield.
My only gripe on the Apollo is the cost. If the pricing was more online with Ecoflow, Anker, Jackery etc; I think the Hysolis would sell lots of Apollos.
However, the EMP shielding of an Apollo perks my interest 🤔
Yes they are a bit pricey as a single unit. But if you look at them as a kit compared to the other same sized kits, you'll find they are more affordable than the other options. poweredportablesolar.com/shop/
When connected to SHP2 multiple DPUs have SOC sharing. It's pretty limited but technically one unit can charge another if you have imbalanced solar/DC inputs. Haven't heard if DP3 can do that or not
Thanks for sharing =)
Thanks for sharing your research and spreadsheet so we the consumer can make the best choices for our application.
You're welcome. Thanks for watching.
I’m going to be looking for a chargeverter soon. Thanks for the update
You're welcome and thanks for watching and commenting =)
Ben, what do you think about the Enron "egg?" Have you seen this story yet?
Haha yes I have. Be aware, it's a prank.
Thanks Ben for another great, informative video. I'm really learning a lot from this series. I'm trying to accumulate enough funds to put in a backup power system for the essentials in my house during a power outage and I know there are lots of great options for free standing homes. But what about apartments and town homes? Do you have any thoughts on backup power for apartment/town home living? I'm thinking solar is going to be very limited depending on the availability of sunlight to some of these units. Assuming a unit has some exposure to solar at some point during the day. Are there viable options for solar panels hung in windows or placed on balconies that can recharge a solar generator, sized for the smaller essential power demands of an apartment/town home? I realize running the heat pump(which is what every apartment I've been exposed to heats and cools with) is out. But just to be able to run a small ceramic heater or room a/c, the frig, and smaller loads(recharge phones, laptops, and a fan) would be great. Thanks for any help and keep up the great content.
Thanks for watching. Great question. The problem with apartments is you have no space for solar panels. I think the best option is to get a high output inverter generator that can recharge the power station quickly. That way you exchange 4 hours of gas for 24 hours of battery.
I have an off grid system with 4 apollos with a combiner box along with 2 expansion batteries. I also have a 17.6kw array. On consecutive cloudy days, I'm able to recharge from less than 50% to 100% in less than 2 hours using AC fast charge at 20A/Apollo with a 22kw Generac generator, while also running the house. I tried ACFC set to 25A/Apollo but it tripped the inverters so I backed off. Seems stable so far. May not remain stable though. I may have to limit other heavy loads during ACFC and/or back off the ACFC more. Looking forward to looking into the new charging unit.
I saw Prouse's review on this, he was impressed as well.
Yup, they're good units. Thanks for watching.
Thank you for always being honest..I enjoy your channel.
Thanks for watching and commenting =)
*Hysolis would seem to even beat EcoFlow in reliability and features, and this is something worth pointing out. I don't like to screw around with my power stations. I have longed to have a solution which you take out of the box, plug it in, and it just works. This is all I want ! I don't want it to constantly require firmware updates, because there's nothing in the unit that needs a patch, repair, or improvement. Imagine a power station that is ready when you take it out of the box ? You just plug the product in, and there's nothing HALF-BAKED ABOUT THE PRODUCT'S READINESS TO FUNCTION ! IT JUST WORKS ! ARE YOU LISTENING ECOFLOW ?*
Exactly! Thanks for sharing =)
i thought i heard you talking about the F3800 sharing battery charge between two units when using their hub...... I like the Apollo but i just cant see my way to buy a Lamborghini as a day to day driver........i can own several fords for less and use the extra money for other projects.
Yes I did get one kind of sharing between the two F3800s but I can't recall exactly what it was. But it wasn't full sharing like the Apollo, only partial. I was able at one point to drain one F3800 lower than the other and then somehow balanced it later. I'll have to test that again.
Everyone keeps saying eco flow is more affordable . If you really compare apple to apple ( Apollo 5k vs Delta Pro Ultra ) they are almost the same price so if your gonna spend 5k on a unit then go Apollo.
Correct. Go look on my website, PoweredPortableSolar.com/shop/ and compare the kits between the Apollo and DPU and you'll see that the Apollo is actually cheaper in most cases, WHEN in a kit.
Here's a question you most likely don't get very often, what type of RF noise is generated by these units? I am a ham radio operator and have been reluctant to go with solar because of most solar charge controllers produce God awful interference on the amateur radio HF frequencies. Maybe while reviewing these various systems you could comment on this. That or comment on how to mitigate this interference.
Great question. I am a HAM radio operator as well. I don't know the exact RF coming off of the units but it hasn't interfered with my radios.
@3:55 thats kinda misleading imo. any 240v inverter wont drop a leg if a battery dies on a 2nd unit.
I was referring to having two Delta Pros using the dual voltage hub. When leg/phase 1 goes out, the voltage hub turns off because there's only one leg of power. So you lose all power output from that.
Have you done videos on how you hook the Hysolis system to your electrical system?
This video may help: ruclips.net/video/25nAilHE1Lk/видео.htmlsi=ca_kcUeas4jt3LMz
adding emp direct to inverter plus the adapter to use any other generator to charge is kinda a game changer. makes me consider not building a diy system.
It is really cool. I like EMP Shields.
Very helpful. Thank you!
Thanks for watching.
Ac to dc is called a rectifier
Thanks for sharing. That is helpful.
This is making me worried about the Anker... suspense is killing me! I wanted to go hysolis but the amount of units to get the same power from 2 Ankers sold me
Price is defintely a factor.
The imbalanced leg problem does not apply to the DELTA Pro Ultra.
Or the Anker f3800, split phase 240 in one unit. Add 6 batteries for 26kwh. What am I missing?
@@rikwashburn827 Capital cost per charge cycle.
@@ralphpezda6523we are talking about the unbalance between phase he claims is exclusive to Hysolis. Not true. Anker allows 2400W solar per unit. It’s far more portable , costs less , and expandable to 56kwh. I own 2 units with a power hub. 12,000w 50amp 240vac. With articulating arrays of 1200w I have no problem topping off the batteries with 4800w. Not sure why anyone needs more than that. My only complaint is how much these units draw when they are on and idle. I’m thinking I might move my second unit to another property or mobile application as the power hub is Power hungry, and 6kw with 26kwh per property should suffice. I don’t plan on charging off the grid with either. No additional inverter needed.
@rikwashburn827 That's nice. Do the math on capital costs per charge cycle.
@@ralphpezda6523why? Maybe I should wait for solid state? Calculate costs for initial purchase and compare them? Hysolis LiPo’s have more cycles? 3000 cycles is 8 plus years of FREE solar charging . Do They have a deal on cost per KW off the grid? Calculating that depends on wether you have peak hr pricing and where you live. In 8 years the tech will be Completely different. I’m confused about your off topic point. Original comments were addressing the alleged lack of balanced batteries in multiple units. What is your point exactly. Care to elaborate?
Thank you!
Thanks for watching.
Sure would like to see a video on how to charge an expansion battery from the hysolis apollo with a charge controller.
EMP shield intrigues me.
Stay tuned =)
Thank you
Thanks for watching and commenting =)
These units are not "GENERATORS!!!" they store power from solar panels, from A/C input or a gas/diesel generator input.
Better name might be converters.
@@arthurhammeke8296 I think the name that most use is "Power Banks"...
@@crosleyfiver000destruct0 That does sound more accurate
Yes, solar input
Thanks for watching and commenting
Or just buy a system that connects to one battery and not need two separate units?
Correct. This isn't to say no other system should be considered.
@minutemanprep I'm just saying a better system
But both the EcoFlow Delta pro 3 and Delta pro Ultra already have split phase and you just add batteries to them. So are you saying that EcoFlow is doing something in those two units that they don't supply power equally to each phase??? Also G4 Chargverter will allow you to use any Generator.
The capital cost per charge for one Ultra is more than the capital cost per charge for two Apollos.
I was referring to the Delta Pro and other units that use two units to get 240v, like the Apollo, but don't share the loads. Additionally, you can have two DPUs together on the 50a hub, but if unit 1 has no solar input and unit 2 has solar input, unit 2 will not share power to unit 1, eventually reaching an imbalance. The Apollos can have no solar on unit 1 but have solar on unit 2 and unit 2 will send power over to unit 1 to keep them the same.
This doesn't really sound special, there is a whole market segment that does these things. Most residential hybrid inverters can gang their output and share the same battery bank. And generally speaking I dislike having to gang units just to get split-phase... I'd rather each individual unit output split-phase and then gang the units that way to increase the output.
It comes down to redundancies. It's a lot easier to add redundancy piecemeal when you can do it one unit at a time, instead of having to add in pairs. I'm sure the vendors are happier if you buy more of their stuff, but it just pads their profits. It's not a good solution for the consumer.
In terms of generators... there is already a solution on the market. Actually numerous solutions but the easiest is the EG4 Chargeverter. You plug the generator into that and charge the (48V) battery bank directly. Problem solved. Which is what this Hysolis thing is doing too... just in a more proprietary format.
Generally speaking it isn't battery charging that suffers from dirty generator power, instead its the fact that most hybrid inverters have to run in pass-through mode in order to use the inverter circuitry to charge the battery which means the dirty generator output is being fed into the house. Having an independent AC battery charger such as the Chargeverter solves this problem. (This is because the inverter cicuitry in these units is dual-purposed to reduce costs and share the beefy heat sinks and other circuitry).
The problem with trying to use power stations to run a house is the proprietary vendor lock-in and the difficulty of scaling just the bits and pieces that you need to scale. People who want to feed their whole house really need to stop messing with power stations entirely and go with more discrete systems such as a Victron Multiplus II or an EG4 18K or a Sol-Ark and discrete battery banks with server-rack 48V batteries. Etc.
For a big system you want to use standard bits and pieces that are generic and cross-vendor compatible. Otherwise you wind up spending an arm and a leg when stuff begins to fail years down the line because the vendors no longer sell those products or remain compatible with their 10-year-old gear. So many people buying these things now are going to be tearing their hair out in a couple of years when they realize the rabbit hole they went down.
-Matt
Sound logic.
Fair enough, thanks for sharing.
Short summary : if you do not have this crazy split phase system, skip this video.....
So EcoFlow ultra is about $5k for 6k wh and $2700 for extra battery. This unit is $5k for 5k wh and $3700 for 5k extra battery. How is that better??? Because you get more solar input? The typical homeowner doesn’t live on a cornfield with 5k watts of solar panels spread out. And rooftop installations are guaranteed leaks.
Not to mention the units are huge and unsightly with wires everywhere. Just go generac propane back up if you can and if you want portability get EcoFlow with some solar and a EcoFlow auto start generator or a Honda 2000.
Fair enough. The differnce comes in when you put it together as a kit. The Apollo kits tend to be slightly more affordable than DPU kits for similar specs.
It's called load balancing, it's not rocket science. You can't tell at all that this is a paid promotion 😂
Well I wasn't paid in any way shape or form to make the video just like I wasn't for the ecoflow or bluetti videos I just did on the exact same subject. I'm reviewing all the major brands simply sharing my opinion.