Well, you built your own software because you wanted to stay away from WordPress, but you also made it open source. Thank you very much for that. Payload is mind-blowing! The flexibility, customization, extendibility, and scalability... it's like having superpowers to build anything you want.
A video to share your frustrations with WordPress 😄 I also wanted to find a replacement to never see WordPress again and I'm very glad I found Payload. Thanks for all your hard work!
Thank you for showing that. I've been looking for WordPress alternatives to recommend to my clients and Payload is quite powerful from a developer perspective. One thing I'd like to see more before I can fully recommend it is the editor experience. Clients love WordPress because it's easy to manage content. I can see that you can do anything WP can do in Payload but I'm concerned about user friendliness, particularly because clients are not always the most savvy.
Good catch! It’s been a while since we’ve paid for the pro version but we appreciate you pointing that out. We'd just note that with Payload, it's free. :)
You mentioned your frustration with the import/export side of wordpress/acf. I am starting to build a project using payload and wanted to have some import/export or batch archiving/collection moving paths setup: do you have some examples for this functionality on payload side?
Looks promising. WP became popular not just because of it being open source, but also how easy it is to install. I love Ghost, but only for my own projects and never for clients.
Superrrr excited to build my payload site and recommending to clients. I love acf and writing my own wordpress themes so this seems to be a perfect match for me.
WordPress has many faults but I still find it to be an okay CMS for some of my clients. With this behaviour from its cocreator however, it really makes me want to get away from this ecosystem completely. Looking forward to try out Payload in some commercial projects soon
Creating CPTs and updating labels is very easy in core. ACF/SCF is not required. I've a billion complaints about WP development, but that isn't one of them. And I've never found a compelling reason to use ACF/SCF for anything. With that said, I've been following Payload for a while and would love the right project to come along so I can dig in and use it. Great job, guys!
but cpt's is just a bonus feature of acf. we all know why acf is widely adopted by us the developers. i would like someday the wordpress team release a set of tools (a package or a plugin) to replace the acf pro functionality, for those who doesn't want to use visual builders. i really like payload (and strapi too) paired with astro or nextjs, but the decoupled back and front architecture is not suitable for all projects, and it could be a piece of overengineering for 'standard' / simple websites.
I think the only thing that kept WP alive over the last few years are the 3rd party Page Builders and their ecosystems. While I do follow Payload development I really think that if you could replicate any of the big WP Page Builder functionality ( Shittenberg excluded ) you would have a better adoption rate.
We have already have page builder capability with live preview, and you can add blocks using our rich-text editor (Lexical). Visual editing coming soon.
Great idea, does it have plugin / theme ecosystem yet? I understand the vision here is code first, but do i have a flexiblity of transfering theme or plugin from one payload project into another without alot of configuration and setup from scratch? If so, I think this has a potential of killing WP and taking over marketshare of open source web.
I've used Ghost in the past personally for simple blogs and it's great out of the box, however it's more limited in the power it gives you as you can't easily customise field schema and build complex backends or multi-tenant apps or ecommerce kind of apps with it. I suggest you try both and take our website template as a reference for how it could come together!
Each system has their strengths. We see a lot of people moving from Drupal to Payload. We'll try to get to a full comparison for these systems, but we do have some others available here: payloadcms.com/compare/
Payload looks super cool, but I got sold on Directus. Thanks for making making it louder that devs need to look at alternatives. WordPress is probably not going anywhere but...
I'm a new web developer using nextjs and react. I was inspired to do this because of my shock how bad wordpress is and the web devs that saturate the market using this stuff. Just come to the point of using my first headless CMS and came across you guys, hope i'm on the right tracks.
That is exactly why I choose Payload (u r speaking my thoughts outloud) BUT The Special thing in WP IMO is the live editor + the free ready to use templates
I really do want to see something for those people who just do the basics, WordPress is painfully slow and feels ancient, I am just starting to learn Next so I'm prob gonna end up using payload at some point... looks awesome
I have to use elementor for my agency job, and I’m so sick of it. Tired of having to force it to do what I want and writing all my own plugins for the functionality I want. Excited for the full release of Payload 3.0, trying to find a way to switch our stack over as soon as possible.
I had a lot of in-agency clients that wanted WordPress and it was frustrating for me to develop custom solutions cause it felt like a patch work all the way through! Wordpress is a coding anti-pattern mess, backend-wise and database-wise. But the community grew, money was involved and then mass adoption
Payload's Docs lay out a step-by-step (and multiple how-to videos across RUclips), and we have multiple templates available with an out of box theme. That said, yes, you have to know code (or a developer) if you want to truly customize the look and feel.
I'm always baffled at how Wordpress structure and db is organised, why don't they just rebuild the core to make more sense, with separate tables and a native acf equivalent. Really wish i could move to payload but most of our team rely on page builders (and then call me when something goes awfully wrong)
We have Lexical as an editor alongside page building blocks, with live preview as well. You should have them give the demo a whirl. Enterprise visual editing coming soon.
Since it's open source, Payload is free to self-host. npx create-payload-app. Though you'll also be able to one-click deploy soon on Vercel's free tier.
@payloadcms Nice. I'll take a look. I came from the same path that you describe from Wordpress. I have developed my own framework at the time because wordpress became a mess and outdated in good pratices. Specially in DB architecture.
We understand how fast js frameworks are but DO NOT under rate wordpress!!! It still exist and still a king. plz dont collect hatred just focus on your work and make it awesome.
drama queens. don't forget the millions of plugins for wordpress. i have no intention of writing another woocommerce if i want a webshop. for some simple portfolio website? yeah sure. but i would leave wordpress it will be for drupal. also i see your code is next.js. good luck convincing all the php coders to switch to js and ts.
This dude obviously knows very little about wordpress. Im sure payload is great, but poking fun of wordpresses database structure makes him seem ignorant.
just curious - what did I say that was incorrect or gave you that impression? I have used and built large websites on WP for 10 years + and I absolutely despise the WP database in many, many ways
core WP contributors themselves will agree that WP db structure is atrocious. And some of the more honest ones will even add the reason: Matt's ignorance coupled with Matt's arrogance.
Euh listing WP Events in WP dashboard....that would be the most logical thing to promote, you are instantly untrustworthy. Not siding with Matt here, he has lost his marbles, but I don't trust you either
I love payload and what you are doing. But just cant watch the video when you speak. You just remind me of kendall roy and no i am not goint to learn tech from him.
Just waiting on the full release of Payload 3.0 :) Let's go!
I think they said it will come out soon after Next 15. Which should be soon.
Same.. hurry up Next 15
can't come soon enough, the local API is great
@@michaelfrieze so today?
@@chrisewers looks like Next 15 is here so yeah, maybe we will get Payload 3.0 soon. Not sure if they want to wait for React or not.
Well, you built your own software because you wanted to stay away from WordPress, but you also made it open source. Thank you very much for that. Payload is mind-blowing! The flexibility, customization, extendibility, and scalability... it's like having superpowers to build anything you want.
Thanks for the love! If you're build anything, let us know.
I really feel it's a moment where people will think twice about the services they're using, payload is in a really good spot right now
🙌
😅😢😮😂 0:31
@@shafaqatali7207 😆
I love Payload CMS for its code first approach. I am excited to see you guys continue grow and innovate as time goes on.
Keep up the excellent work 😁!
A video to share your frustrations with WordPress 😄 I also wanted to find a replacement to never see WordPress again and I'm very glad I found Payload. Thanks for all your hard work!
Thanks for the love!
Great, GREAT tool! I just started using it a couple of days ago and I have to say I'm thrilled. Excellent job!
Currently using Payload 3.0 Beta for my client, absolutely killing it!
No issues so far? Me and my boss have wondered wether to take the plunge using beta with clients
@@DanielNG-w4i Hello sorry late reply, at this point of time in my reply they have finally released 3.0 stable, you should check it out thanks!
Thank you for showing that. I've been looking for WordPress alternatives to recommend to my clients and Payload is quite powerful from a developer perspective. One thing I'd like to see more before I can fully recommend it is the editor experience. Clients love WordPress because it's easy to manage content. I can see that you can do anything WP can do in Payload but I'm concerned about user friendliness, particularly because clients are not always the most savvy.
all this drama is a dream scenario for Payload
It sucks for those who are caught in the middle of this battle, but if some want to evaluate other options, we'll gladly oblige.
ACF does have bidirectional fields. It’s in the pro version. Also, you have to click the regenerate labels button to fix the MOvie.
exactly, this was one of a couple of lies about WP & ACF in this video imo
Good catch! It’s been a while since we’ve paid for the pro version but we appreciate you pointing that out. We'd just note that with Payload, it's free. :)
my bad - it's been years since i used ACF. thanks for the correction
You mentioned your frustration with the import/export side of wordpress/acf. I am starting to build a project using payload and wanted to have some import/export or batch archiving/collection moving paths setup: do you have some examples for this functionality on payload side?
First time I try Payload. Looks really powerful. Great job!
Looks promising. WP became popular not just because of it being open source, but also how easy it is to install. I love Ghost, but only for my own projects and never for clients.
You should be pushing this pitch hard. Big market opportunity, and you’re darn right in what you say.
Superrrr excited to build my payload site and recommending to clients. I love acf and writing my own wordpress themes so this seems to be a perfect match for me.
We love to hear it! Keep us updated and join our Discord if you need any support along the way!
We need a comparison with Directus and Strapi please. Thank you!
WordPress has many faults but I still find it to be an okay CMS for some of my clients. With this behaviour from its cocreator however, it really makes me want to get away from this ecosystem completely. Looking forward to try out Payload in some commercial projects soon
How the hell do I work with this team??? My lord is this vision amazing.
🙌 Get involved in our Discord!
Creating CPTs and updating labels is very easy in core. ACF/SCF is not required. I've a billion complaints about WP development, but that isn't one of them. And I've never found a compelling reason to use ACF/SCF for anything. With that said, I've been following Payload for a while and would love the right project to come along so I can dig in and use it. Great job, guys!
but cpt's is just a bonus feature of acf. we all know why acf is widely adopted by us the developers. i would like someday the wordpress team release a set of tools (a package or a plugin) to replace the acf pro functionality, for those who doesn't want to use visual builders. i really like payload (and strapi too) paired with astro or nextjs, but the decoupled back and front architecture is not suitable for all projects, and it could be a piece of overengineering for 'standard' / simple websites.
@@vosyasabesquien I'm a bit ignorant with ACF - I haven't really used (or found a compelling use for) it.
ACF Pro does have bi-directional relationships, just FYI.
Here we are! :)
You can do bi directional with ACF
Yes. Bidirectional is available in Payload 3.0 beta. 3.0 stable within two weeks.
Aaahh, is there a full list of what features require a Next.js frontend? Or is it just the live preview?
Wait, where was this solution for like forever ago, and when can we start taking the fullest use of Payload?!
npx create-payload-app or payloadcms.com/cloud for a hosted version. Get building. 💪
I think the only thing that kept WP alive over the last few years are the 3rd party Page Builders and their ecosystems. While I do follow Payload development I really think that if you could replicate any of the big WP Page Builder functionality ( Shittenberg excluded ) you would have a better adoption rate.
We have already have page builder capability with live preview, and you can add blocks using our rich-text editor (Lexical). Visual editing coming soon.
@@payloadcms indeed I was referring to a visual editor, glad to hear it’s coming!
@@payloadcms how long we have to wait?
Do you guys have API access to install payload as an IDE
Finally breaking out of the WP hell 🤟 btw. I'm already using Payload 3.0 in production and very happy about it 😊
Love to hear it. 🖤
Great idea, does it have plugin / theme ecosystem yet? I understand the vision here is code first, but do i have a flexiblity of transfering theme or plugin from one payload project into another without alot of configuration and setup from scratch? If so, I think this has a potential of killing WP and taking over marketshare of open source web.
Thank you so much, Team Payload. Its truly a disruption.
Really good work!!!
I've been looking at Payload, Ghost as well as Drupal as alternatives to WordPress. I'd like to see a comparison by you of those.
I've used Ghost in the past personally for simple blogs and it's great out of the box, however it's more limited in the power it gives you as you can't easily customise field schema and build complex backends or multi-tenant apps or ecommerce kind of apps with it. I suggest you try both and take our website template as a reference for how it could come together!
Each system has their strengths. We see a lot of people moving from Drupal to Payload. We'll try to get to a full comparison for these systems, but we do have some others available here: payloadcms.com/compare/
Payload looks super cool, but I got sold on Directus. Thanks for making making it louder that devs need to look at alternatives. WordPress is probably not going anywhere but...
I'm a new web developer using nextjs and react. I was inspired to do this because of my shock how bad wordpress is and the web devs that saturate the market using this stuff. Just come to the point of using my first headless CMS and came across you guys, hope i'm on the right tracks.
That is exactly why I choose Payload (u r speaking my thoughts outloud) BUT The Special thing in WP IMO is the live editor + the free ready to use templates
We have ready-to-use templates, and live preview. More on the way.
Just reiterating what @payloadcms said about the live preview feature. It is a thing and it works.
@@payloadcms YES PLEAAASE
Is the Discord link broken?
Redirects is collection? Why not global?
I really do want to see something for those people who just do the basics, WordPress is painfully slow and feels ancient, I am just starting to learn Next so I'm prob gonna end up using payload at some point... looks awesome
that looks awesome...
I have to use elementor for my agency job, and I’m so sick of it. Tired of having to force it to do what I want and writing all my own plugins for the functionality I want. Excited for the full release of Payload 3.0, trying to find a way to switch our stack over as soon as possible.
We know your pain. Good news coming soon ...
ACF Pro has the bi-directional relationship.
Please do a start to finish tutorial on payload, mongodb and vercel. I can not grt it to work! Thank you.
I had a lot of in-agency clients that wanted WordPress and it was frustrating for me to develop custom solutions cause it felt like a patch work all the way through! Wordpress is a coding anti-pattern mess, backend-wise and database-wise. But the community grew, money was involved and then mass adoption
Payload lacks a step-by-step tutorial. It also lacks a theme.
Payload's Docs lay out a step-by-step (and multiple how-to videos across RUclips), and we have multiple templates available with an out of box theme. That said, yes, you have to know code (or a developer) if you want to truly customize the look and feel.
Are the 3.0 docs up?
This is so fucking dope
🖤
Kirby CMS is kind of the same as well. It can even run without database if needed.
I'm always baffled at how Wordpress structure and db is organised, why don't they just rebuild the core to make more sense, with separate tables and a native acf equivalent. Really wish i could move to payload but most of our team rely on page builders (and then call me when something goes awfully wrong)
because they are trying to keep all versions of Wordpress backwards compatible while simultaneously updating it..
We have Lexical as an editor alongside page building blocks, with live preview as well. You should have them give the demo a whirl. Enterprise visual editing coming soon.
@@payloadcms awesome, will check that out !
I wish Payload had a free tier for playing around and small projects.
Since it's open source, Payload is free to self-host. npx create-payload-app. Though you'll also be able to one-click deploy soon on Vercel's free tier.
What do you mean? It is open source and free.
Would this work with Astro ?
You still have control over the Payload APIs, so you can use any frontend you want, including Astro.
wen stable payload 3.0 plsss ser
In 2 weeks', time, I actually got this from a reply comment by James.
plugin devs should be really worried..
I wish Payload support Svelte
You can! You control the Payload APIs, so you can use whatever frontend framework you want.
@payloadcms Nice. I'll take a look. I came from the same path that you describe from Wordpress. I have developed my own framework at the time because wordpress became a mess and outdated in good pratices. Specially in DB architecture.
@@payloadcms but with the live preview?
liked payload and saying goodbye to wordpress
We understand how fast js frameworks are but DO NOT under rate wordpress!!! It still exist and still a king. plz dont collect hatred just focus on your work and make it awesome.
drama queens.
don't forget the millions of plugins for wordpress. i have no intention of writing another woocommerce if i want a webshop.
for some simple portfolio website? yeah sure.
but i would leave wordpress it will be for drupal.
also i see your code is next.js. good luck convincing all the php coders to switch to js and ts.
real WordPress programmers don't use ACF/SCF in the first place. Post types and custom fields can be registered without it.
you want Wordpress users but you haven't created a migrate plugin for wordpress yet... Don't understand this video
He stated well that it is not for elementor users. You need to be able to code in order to use payload.
This dude obviously knows very little about wordpress. Im sure payload is great, but poking fun of wordpresses database structure makes him seem ignorant.
just curious - what did I say that was incorrect or gave you that impression? I have used and built large websites on WP for 10 years + and I absolutely despise the WP database in many, many ways
core WP contributors themselves will agree that WP db structure is atrocious. And some of the more honest ones will even add the reason: Matt's ignorance coupled with Matt's arrogance.
Euh listing WP Events in WP dashboard....that would be the most logical thing to promote, you are instantly untrustworthy. Not siding with Matt here, he has lost his marbles, but I don't trust you either
I love payload and what you are doing. But just cant watch the video when you speak. You just remind me of kendall roy and no i am not goint to learn tech from him.
James, just now: "that actor is great in the big short."
Payload made different choices, we freeload off NPM for plugins. Cool story bro, I hope net negative people, decide use your awful platform.
You're not the first comment
please show seveltekit love i know we are small buth now there literally dozens of us