We want to do another soil experiment - what should we test next? P.S. YES we know this isn't a scientifically valid and super-controlled study. There are a lot of variables we couldn't control for, like variation in plant vigor, etc.
Kiss, roots organic, build-a-soil and other high end mixes that came from the cannabis industry! The cannabis industry has the best soils due to the medicinal nature with high regulations. Build-a-soil is the best of the best. True living soil, true super soil. You could do a whole video just testing the various build a soil mixes, recipes, processes. I'd be happy to help with some experimenting on that or JADAM!
Some test to see the moisture retentive properties? Like, which soil to choose, or what’s the best amendment (besides mulch) if you know you might go a while between watering occasionally
So buy the cheaper mix and add your own fertilizer. I lucked out last fall and was at Walmart when they put their parking lot inventory on sale for $1. So peat moss, potting soil, mulch, paving stones, gravel, sand, everything $1 each. I spent $140, and probably saved $1400. I have a small car and had to make 4 trips but it was so worth it!
*Feed your Soil. > I Think > Most 'bagged' Soil does Not have everything in it...that will Feed your Vegetables for the Entire growing season! > ADD a well rounded Organic / slow-release / all purpose granular fertilizer. > And/Or Water with a mild liquid Fert. (like Fish & Kelp) I use an Organic / All Purpose Plant-- Flower-Vegetable Fertilizer with Over 70 trace mineral micronutrients and beneficial bacteria and fungi! (Everything in it) The benefits are Amazing! You can buy....just about any Organic Soil....but if you don't feed your Soil....then don't expect much.
I have 44 years experience doing raised beds and every bag you buy will change slightly from year to year. My latest project was I purchased 6 pallets of sta-green potting mix. 3,000 lbs. of river bottom sandy loam, 6 lbs. of azomite, 60 lbs. of worm castings and 40 lbs. of perlite along with 10 lbs. of bone meal and blend it all. My customer has peppers 5 feet tall right now and loaded. However at the end of the season the beds will decompose about 15% and will need topdressing for the following year. Great video!
I built a compost bed 8 x 16 that would get 3-4 ft tall and after 6 years, I sifted it, then added it to the garden. 9 inch wide tomatoes, 5 ft Basil bushels, 14 ft tall sunflowers, 6 ft marigolds. I won’t do it any other way anymore.
I saw an article testing several commonly available bagged soils 40 years ago. They got the best result from soil that had been sitting around since the previous year, the lesson being that soil needs time, moisture, and not being physically disturbed in order to develop beneficial biological activity.
I buy my soil for the next season the year before or at least in the off season then let it sit until the following year. Do the same thing with my Black Kow.
I was wondering about that the other day when I opened up a bag of organic compost I'd had laying around for like 5 or 6 months for one of my plants. I opened it up and went "holy crap this stuff is fresher than my compost bin" the plants only been going a few days since I switched it to that soil, mixed with my compost, and it's going crazy.
@@epicgardening I wonder if you'd almost have to start over as the first 4 would have to have a ton of Nitro added just to get them growing, overcome the huge amount of wood, and are obviously stressed. 1)Maybe a comparison list of the amounts of n-p-k and micronutrients listed on the individual bags. (calcium, magnesium, manganese, boron, etc) Compare it to the results of your current results. We can all compare that right in the store. Not sure how you'd even them up nutrition wise, equally. 2)Sieve all of them to get the wood chunks, stones, and other debris out. 3)Add perlite to the ones that obviously don't have any for drainage and aeration.
Lol, it works... source I'm the idiot who did a 40% mix of kellogs in his plant out and I shifted the trash out. It still under preformed when mixed with mushroom compost. I had to start hitting it with everyone's favorite blue juice and they're finally growing.
@@GetFitEatRight Haha, I'm the Second idiot that did just what you did. The Kellog stuff was "supposed" to be so great but it sucks. I'm not a happy camper.
@@ricklarsen852 Yeah... I'm just going to start buying the MGPM when it goes on sale in the fall from now on. I'm tired of fighting it, and this video was damning.
@@iwanttobelieve5970 I mean, yeah it is because it means you have to pay more and do more work for the same decent results as if you'd just bought, say vigro or the 420
You guys mentioned the fast growth of the miracle gro but the later tapering off. I think that's why Miracle Gro is great for annuals, since it can basically cover you for almost the entire season. For perennials I go with something closer to the recipe 420 for long term health & sustained slow release.
Pepper Geek did a very similar experiment except he went full season & weighed every fruit for the whole season. Happy Frog had a similar showing at about the same point in the season but ended up crushing everyone based on the weight of the peppers for the entire season.
I used Kellogg last year and it's trash. I used your top pick Miracle Gro in my raised garden bed this year and the difference is astronomical! I'll never go back. I spent under $60 and so far my garden is thriving way better than I expected. Thanks for sharing your experiment. I learned a lot!
Since I had a couple bags of the Kelloggs this year for my containers - I'd also like to see how to fix it. I throw either Bio-tone or Garden-tone in and stir it around before putting the plant in.
@@bellepfeiffer3630add your fertilizer and organic matter preferably high quality compost. The biggest concern is those large wood chunks are tying up nitrogen
Would love a video about what to do if this year’s containers are all filled with one of those first four brands without having to replace all the soil.
Start using Miracle Gro water soluble fertilizer 😊 Or the generic equivalent, it’s basically the same. I don’t really get all the hate for MG. Containers really depend on steady nutrients being added since they can’t support a microbial community in the same way that in ground or raised beds can. They also need frequent watering which further washes out nutrients.
Add a layer of compost, organic fertilizers (I use a custom mix of bone meal, tomato-tone and veg-tone). Every 7 to 14 days water with Alaskan fish fertilizer and Jacks 20-20-20 (if you are ok with a synthetic fertilizer).
Since the problem originally was the wood was not broken down or decomposed enough, after a year or so, the wood in the soil will have broken down or "composted" a lot and will not have as great a binding effect with the nitrogen, so it will actually be much more ready to use than it was the year before. You could sift the soil to remove any sizeable woody pieces, but really, the only thing needed is to replace the fertilizer or organic nutrients used up in the previous seasons. And for good measure, perhaps add in some vermiculite or perlite or both to increase water holding capacity and aeration. Improve the soil, and add some good stuff, but don't replace it.
Hi 12 years of experience Organic gardener here. If youre looking for cost effectiveness and you dont have a truck. Show up to your local soil sellers yard and ask if you can fill up buckets. Either choose fancy potting mix or just compost and amend it at home. Buying bags can be really expensive.
That’s true, it’s usually way cheaper. Also most people have a neighbor with a pickup. Bake them some banana bread and I bet they would pick you up some dirt.
What he said... I now use droppings from my meat rabbits and amend... havent have better results. Rabbit droppings I use IMMEDIATELY... find a rabbit farmer.
@@GiarkReleosthat’s an ignorant statement. It’s a false statement. It’s not helpful to new gardeners that don’t know what they’re doing because they’re already intimated in many ways. Just because you may have years of experience you can be a snob. I used to do organic gardening for 15+ years. Miracle Gro, and some gypsum added yearly is more than good enough for new gardeners. Many people are on a budget so don’t knock them by belittling them. I’d tell people using the blue is to use it at half dose or less. I use liquid blue to get my stuff off to a faster start in the northland. Miracle gro is fine as long as people don’t overdo it.
This video was SO helpful! I know there are variables you couldn’t control for, but you guys did a great job and kept it entertaining. It would be fun to see something similar when used to start seeds.
Man, I'm really glad I stayed away from that Kelloggs stuff, almost ordered 15 bgs of it. I then read the reviews & decided to go with some foxfarm mixed with the regular miracle grow potting mix. Plants are growing super fast & healthy looking. Excellent video guys! 😎 👍 👊 🍻
Luckily I have a medium size koi pond with about 18 koi. When the filters ( swamp cooler pads) are flushed out, that water ( semi liquid muck) is saved/diluted and added as a nutrient booster for the plants.Cheap/bio/ecological friendly…
Absolutely love the topic selections lately. It makes for great inspiration for summertime activities with the kiddos. We’re doing a “soil test” this weekend with my son. He’s having a blast collecting supplies and creating the rules. We are going to use sugar baby watermelon seeds. The entire family is excited! Thanks for keeping the garden exciting.
I did so much research this year, as it’s my first year. I used Kellogg and avoided Miracle Grow, and my peppers are consistent with your results. Oh well! I’m learning every day.
miracle grow has been a consistant for me since my parents used it but I did not think it would out preform even in its organic variety cool to see but I think they are right about just using a lil of your own fertilizer after a 2 or 3 months
I use Kellogg raised bed mix and just add fertilizer. My plants do fantastic every year. Miracle grow has fertilizer already. I bet that if they redid this and fertilized all the plants, they would all do similarly. It is cheaper to use Kellogg and fertilizer than to buy the more expensive mixes.
Try adding fertilizer. I'm using the same Kellogg soil with water soluble fertilizer and my plants are doing great. I suspect this combo is cheaper than paying more for Miracle Grow, especially if you plan on reusing the soil anyways.
One of the best videos yet! Next add the same amendments to all the different fresh potting mixes and plants to see if that evens them out. Looking forward to what’s next
Makes so much sense! We bought Kellogs only the 1st year. I thought I was a failure gardener. So many people were getting those, I thought it had to be me.
Same! I didn't read the reviews or do research. I just went to home depot.... I've finally got it working by amending a few times but I wouldn't buy it again.
i bought Kelloggs during the infamous pandemic summer of 2020 hands down my worst gardening season ever. Barely got anything. Switched to promix for 2021-2023 and got better results they stopped selling promix at my local store though which stunk. switched to a new brand and i'm not super happy with it so far (weather has also been frustratingly cold)
I read so many reviews of potting mix. Kellogg sounded great while Miracle Gro was generally all bad, esp the moisture control kind. So I tried Kellogg this year for the first time and have been way behind even though I started indoors earlier. Such a waste. Thankfully, I amended and transplanted some survivors into better raised bed soil. This video confirmed my suspicion that maybe Kellogg was the problem.
@jthomas1408 same here.......somehow I heard that Kelloggs was the best, so I got a lot..........what a terrible mistake, poor to no germination, and stunted growth in the ones that did grow.........
one of the best pieces of advice i ever got from a more experienced gardener was if you treat your soil well, your plants will treat you well lol. Feed the soil 100% the worst year i ever had as a gardener was the very first year of gardening...and that was because all i did was dump a bunch of soil into three pots. Didn't mulch didn't compost. and as you can imagine i got terrible results lol
Just filled 2 30" raised beds with 34 bags of Kelloggs... So would love a video of how you would amend lesser quality soil, or what you would do to fix it by growing specific plants.
So I used 12 bags and had terrible luck till I amended a few times. If you have access to good gardening compost I would add that in. Additionally, I would add some organic granular fertilizer and for the first few weeks maybe even use a good organic liquid fertilizer. What I did after everything died when I replanted. I added a good amount of bone meal and worm castings right under each plant when I planted, and then also mixed around in the garden. I also gave them a good dose of organic liquid fertilizer. I didn't have access to compost or I would have done that before replanting.
@@Hugadognowsame. I decided to fill up one of my beds this year with this soil and everything in it looks so sad. Even my squash which normally is out of control is still at this late date only about 4 inches tall with like 6 or so mini leaves on it. I think I saw one male flower once, and haven't even seen a female flower pop up on the thing
Same. Kelloggs and a couple others but in reality just diff dresses on the pig. Container gardening. It is as pathetic as it gets here. It never dawned on me that a bag labeled soil would have virtually no soil in it. It’s dirt with or without compost and maybe some peat and long acting fertilizers. Idk why i didn’t dream that I wouldn’t find assholes in the dirt industry but yeah, I naively thought I’d just buy organic products and I’d be ok. I amended with worm castings, box store composted manure and some mycorrhizae. Knowing what I know now, I was way too stingy with those amendments. I need to anoint them with oil and pray for miracles or just stop watering and give it up, go to the soil yard and pick up good stuff and come overhaul my containers for the next round.
Would have loved to see the Espoma potting soil used. Laura at Garden Answer uses it exclusively and gets phenomenal results. Of course she also fertilizes like crazy, too, lol. I've been using it for the last couple of years and have seen some wonderful results.
She also has a very good base soil, being in the desert, and ENDLESS WELL WATER ! I can't even imagine what their water bill would be if they had to pay by the gallon! (Like I do.) Plus, also bcuz of being in the desert, the air temps cool off at night giving all plants a nice break. It's basically gardening Disneyland over there! Anyway, it's no surprise they can grow just about anything. I don't think it's fair to compare their conditions to most other places. I do watch them every day, I am just careful to keep from comparing what they can do with what I can do. Just my 2 cents.
Miracle-Gro mixes use mostly synthetically-derived fertilizers that are immediately available to plants and will naturally perform better in a short-term grow bag experiment. Fox Farms Ocean Harvest has organic, slow release bat guano/crab meal/fish emulsion which require some biological activity before available.
This was so cool to see! This kinda explains my first year gardening using Kelloggs soil in grow bags back in 2019... my peppers were sad and stunted like those on the left. Been using Fox Farm for almost 2 years on indoor and outdoor plants and love it! Thanks for adding the graphics in there too! Great work, guys! 🫡💚💚💚
Something that Charles Dowding mentioned which was a lightbulb for me was that the actual components and grade of the mixes even from the same companies/bags will likely vary year by year, so its good to inspect them like you guys did here and test them for yourself, and perhaps stock up on a specific one which proves to have favorable qualities.
i personally like to use promix but Menards stopped carrying them, at least the ones near me. I went with their local company called Master Garden instead and it has had mixed results unfortunately
ProMix is very consistent and is marketed for experienced growers, that's including making sure the pH of the mix is in a desired ranged. What this test does is show which potting mix has the most pre-added fertilizer, it doesn't tell the quality of the mix. ProMix is still one of the top choice for pro growers who know what they're doing. Also if you're buying those MiracleGro bags which hardware store usually put outdoor and get rained on, you will get fungus gnats galore, which also happens to be a key feature of MiracleGro. @@skippythealien9627 They replaced ProMix with SunGro Sunshine Mix #4. I am testing it out and I think it's pretty good. It seems to be formulated as a high porosity mix and have a lot of perlite added, so it will be faster drying. I mixed it with peat moss and fine sized aged pine bark, which reduced the porosity but still is a very good texture for typical potting mix, and saves a bit of money for the resulting volume.
@@skippythealien9627 All the Menard's stopped selling it, which is a shame. They were the only local store that carried the large bags of ProMix (or any other large bags of potting soil) as early as February, and it was so well priced. I do winter sowing, so I need potting mix while there's still snow on the ground. My winter sowing costs are going to double, triple, or more next year without Menard's selling those large ProMix bags. Thanks for the heads up on the Master Garden quality.
I can confirm the kellogs. I bought that and some Coast of Maine soil. The plants in the Kellogs just stalled out entirely. The ones in Coast of Maine are doing fantastic! That Kellogs stuff might as well be a bag of sterile sand. I repotted most of the stalled plants into Coast of Maine, and those recovered pretty well. The ones I left in Kellogs even another 10 days are permanently stunted, even after getting them out of that garbage. Thank you for this fantastic experiment!! Really educational. (Edited to add that I had added liquid and granular fert to both, but no compost or anything like that. I don't expect to have to add that to pre-bagged potting soil right away)
seconding Coast of Maine, i've had great results with the Bar Harbor blend for the past two years! it's pricey, but a cheaper option than Fox Farms at least.
Yes I’ve only been using coast of Maine for the past two years with good results. I don’t really see any RUclips channels using it, maybe it is a regional thing?
@@JB28057 It could be regional. I'm in Maine itself. I know you can find it in some garden centers as far away as the Virginias, but I suspect it's really only distributed around the NE or may east coast.
@@JB28057 Not exactly. Hooked and Rooted here on youtube uses it all the time. Her channel is great and she is the one who put me on to it as this is my first year truly gardening.
Using a thin layer of maricle grow, laid over last year's potting soil, laid over sand and plant scraps, with a thin mulch cover has always worked wonders for me. Potting soil is mostly about mixing and amending like you said.
I remember listening to the owner of malibu compost on in search of soil. He seemed so high and mighty and acted like his product was so amazing. Funny to see his product in the bottom four while being the most expensive. Just goes to show that price isnt everything and the best soil is the one you build yourself over many years.
@@JD91909 The product they used is being sold as a potting soil, not a compost. Baby Bu's product description on their own website even says "ready to use straight out of the bag" and as an "all in one mix"
@@JD91909 Compost, by definition, is a decomposed and stable soil amendment. Any compost is dependent on the bulk materials that went into their creation. The term "hot" means that there is a lot of soluble NPK in a soil, a characteristic which good compost does not have. The Miracle-Gro product have soluble fertilizers that work really well in short term grows like in this experiment. This experiment should really have explained the nutrient sources of each bag of soil.
I used the Fox Farms Strawberry Fields in my Greenstalk planter this year and amended with bone meal and a balanced organic fertilizer. So far it has been great for my strawberries. Container gardening can be tricky and I'm not surprised that the soil mixes with added fertilizer outperformed the others. I find regular fertilizing of my container plants makes all the difference.
I've only recent gotten into gardening and am growing 2 types of pepper plants with miracle gro potting mix. A lot of people talk badly about the brand but my parents used it consistently with good results and it's nice to see that it gives good results! Will continue using it and fertilize after 2-3 months
I just use Happy Frog putting soil in my greenstalk all I do is container gardening. Start seeds in Vermont compost. Amend with bone meal and fish emulsion as needed every two weeks, two weeks after final planting. Brilliant stuff. Huge returns. I'm happy.
Stones instead of sticks. Just put it in my Green Stalks w strawberries. Did Not love weeding out a handful or more of stones as i filled each tier. Will see how strawberries grow over summer. $13/ bag on sale -2cuft.
By far, my favorite video!! I was wondering about this. I used Fox Farms soil in cloth pots last year & every single plant did not do that good. I threw them in the ground with no prep, nothing added where I took out some bushes & my Serrano pepper grew almost 5 feet tall. It was mind blowing. I put some plants in the same grow bags with that same soil over a month ago & the plants haven’t done anything or grown. Interestingly enough, I had 4 other bags, same Fox soil from last year and one tomato is amazing & producing, the other is stunted. Same tomato bought the same day. The other two bags have cucumbers & they’re doing great. So same bags, same old soil from last year and different results. It’s crazy. Fun to see though. Sometimes you just never know.
Owww...I have some stunted plants in my containers too and I used Fox Farms happy Frog and the Ocean one. Hm...I thought I was investing in superb soil, not subpar...
I set up so many beds this year, so I've been buying the 2 cheapest varieties at a regional Big Box Store (neither of which are represented here). The biggest difference seems to be the amount of perlite. I'm hoping amending with liquid fertilizer, worm compost, and composted manure will get me some decent looking plants. This year is all about experimenting though.
What a great video! I have noticed similar results across my various grow bags so far this year and last year! The more wood has increased the need for worm castings and fertilizer. Everything I do is 100% organic, so the more dark and rich a soil is, the more likely I am to buy it moving forward 👊🏻🌻👊🏻
You can get fox farm ocean forest for $11ish a bag at hydro stores. Cheapest hydro in riverside ca is where I got mine. I think for a better test you should take cuttings so they are all from the same plant.
LOVED this video! Thank you for taking the time to do this test on soil mix for gardening! Would also love to see a similar test (separately for soil, fertilizers & compost) using Espoma, Proven Winners, and Soil3 (Southeastern US) brands!
I phoned White Flower Farm (owned by Miracle Grow) 2 months ago after reading about all the foreign material found in their products (nails, glass, etc). They confirmed this is possible as they source their compost from landfills. When I asked them if used diapers could also be in that compost their phone rep replied "it's possible." This is supposed to be their "ORGANIC" mix. I'm currently using Back To The Roots Organic Potting Mix and Organic Raised Bed Garden Mix. They confirmed by phone that they do NOT source from landfills. However, I am getting LOTS of bindweed sprouting from their mix, even in closed bottom grow bags. JUST MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCES that I'm sharing.
This explains alot. I always bought my soil from local company when I had huge beds, moved to new place and smaller beds so bought Kellogg’s last two years and my garden has sucked and thought at first it was plants, then thought it was the organic straw I used for mulch. Lesson learned.
This was exactly what I wanted to see. I have used the MiracleGro Moisture Control in my flowering plant pots for years and love it. I’ve also used their Performance Organic mix for veggies and that’s been great too. I’ve used Happy Frog but haven’t felt it’s enough better for the price difference. This year I got the cube of ProMix Premium Organic at Walmart and it’s done well too but I also added worm castings. It feels very peaty and does dry out fast but in my drought prone area I feel more comfortable with better moisture retention. I used it for some seed starting and really had to be on top of the watering. The main thing I hate is mixes that are woody so I’m running around trying to see if I can feel it though the bag, unless I run across one that’s torn open to actually see. I did find the Kellogg mixes to be far too woody. My veggies move into raised beds amended seasonally with bagged compost and I’ve also had to shop the same way. A lot of that is rushed to market not totally broken down and can be woody. This was great though because it showed the most expensive isn’t necessarily always the best.
I am not at all surprised on the Kellogg's results! I bought some for my cucurbits seed starts this year even though I knew it was a crap soil because my go to options were out of stock. I went from a 99% success rate normally to less than 50%, which was terrible knowing people were depending on me for plants! I loved the breakdown you two did at the end of why some soils did so well and how they is likely to taper off, it's great info for those just starting out.
I've been using the 420 soil, since I grow organically, and was looking to save some money over the fox farm soils. This experiment has confirmed for me that I made the right choice. I'm also glad I started using it instead of the Kellogg potting soil I was using originally.
I did a few experiments with potting soils myself, but what I found, that is large factor is genetics of individual plants. Even if it's the same variety seed to seed will yield slightly different results in the exact same conditions. You need cloned plants for this experiment to be more unbiased. (Edit) yea you did mentioned genetics, nvm. Nice work👍
The thesis of the experiment is wrong to start with. It's not testing the various quality of the potting mix but how much fertilizer is available in each brand and automatically assume MiracleGro is best since it has most added fertilizer, probably slow release. For people growing specific type of plant, this pre-added fertilizer could interfere with the result, especially if there is too much slow release nitrogen.
I absolutely loved the experiment with the do nothing straight out of the bag. Great information for the beginning gardeners as well as the experienced folks who know how to amend their mix. Wonderful comments from people who garden. I also enjoyed people sharing their opinions on what is working or didn't work for them with the results they have. Personally, I always wondered about the different mixes, and now I know. Thank you.
Im surprised with the Vigoro being #2, could easily add some compost and/or granular fertilizer to that and round it out for a much better price! I may try this next time I need to refresh :D TY
Actually this might be a good time to ask. We had the yellow Pro-Mix potting soil leftover from last year that would have definitely frozen solid in our climate over the winter. How much does that effect the soil quality?
These longitudinal studies are cool! You guys are really stepping it up with the long-term planning for videos. We dont have to wait for the results and forget to follow up later… its in the same video! Perfect.
Woof, I have Kellogg in my beds right now, and I can confirm my peppers look sad just like your experiment. Thank you for putting this video together! I will be changing some of my setup going forward!
I did Kellogg and my peppers failed for 2 years 😂 and then I had to experiment with amendments and then I got a pepper. Then I decided to stop growing peppers 🥲.
I have it in my pots too😮, I'm feeling optimistic though. I'm just going to supplement throughout the summer with fish fertilizer. I mostly go for Kellogg soil due to the fact they don't use peat moss. Which is incredibly slow growing and isn't a renewable resource. Harvesting it is harmful to the environment
i think that's what's annoying though. a lot of people are starting gardening or are still relatively inexperienced. they don't know all the science and work that goes into gardening yet. i can imagine they buy these soil products (which are everywhere at home depot) and then get terrible results and think they are terrible gardeners
The raised bed is pretty good soil. At least not full of wood chips made from wood left over from construction sites. I'm sure I could find a cheaper alternative since HD sells it for 9 bucks a bag. Thing is I just mix in all the good stuff my garden needs. This way I control the show. You can't find sterilized dirt in a bag these days, ( real dirt that is).
I sift potting mixes through a 1/4" screen mesh (hardware cloth) and that gets out all of the bigger pieces of wood and other junk. Whatever is left I feel is broken down enough that it won't matter especially because I'm going to add fertilizer because I'm going into the ground for growing. The only thing the potting mix is going to do is get me to the point of getting the plant into the ground. And even if I'm using a good quality mix I still use a water soluble fertilizer that makes nutrients available, and I do that at the beginning of growth (so it's not much being added) and if I re-pot I'll do it a couple days before I re-pot, and here I use a little more than I did after initial growth. With the leftover wood chips you can toss them into soil that isn't next to something you're growing and they'll finish breaking down.
I am blown away by the differences. Thank you for doing this. I bought a generic organic mix, thinking I was doing the right thing and have been wondering about the results I’ve been seeing in my own garden. Guess I should switch back to the miracle grow!
You guys are the BEST!! I'm only halfway through the video and I am shocked at how much the success of my container garden depends on the soil. I feel so much better about my past failures because I have soil that was so wood chippy I had itchy splinters after working in it. Thank you so much for constantly making me a more successful gardener!
I always pull out the chunks of wood & put them in the bottoms of containers or raised beds to be filled. An easy way is to sift it through hardware cloth framed over a container. The scrap that stays on top goes in the bottom.
A big part of this video was the top performers had a slow release fertilizer added that some of the others didn't. If the others had nutrients added then it could have upped the competition considerably.
By the way, this is perfectly valid science. You have controls, hypotheses, testing, and results. There is bias in every experiment, but you should not have the disclaimer that this is backyard science. This is completely legitimate science and interesting.
It’s legit but not totally. For totally, you need more data- more repetition to offset the effects of diuferences between seedlings and other random events. It would be more expensive, but to be better, they needed like three pots of each soil mix, and a control of some kind-like native soil, unamended.
Bought a bag of compost and a bag of perlite for my balcony garden and it’s been great. Plants really took off when I also added organic microryzal fertilizer too! For my indoor plants I use the same compost + perlite mix and sometimes add orchid bark as needed. Water them with my fish tank water or just tap and they do amazing.
This is absolutely amazing! Thank you so much for taking the time to do experiments that reveal truths! I think experiments like this really elevate this channel above the rest!
Please re-use the soil/pots and run another batch of pepper plants. Does the plant health and bounty change? Gary suggests that compost breaks down and will poison plants after 5 months.
What do you mean the broken down compost poisons the plants? ETA: Perhaps you mean that as the wood in some composts break down, they pull the nitrogen away from the plants??? That can be compensated for by adding additional nitrogen.
@@kaylakitty3814 ruclips.net/video/KHZHy3_7PPE/видео.html This expert says that decomposing wood products that are the bulk of our mulch and compost break down, consuming available nitrogen and oxygen while producing sewer gases that poison the plant roots.
Personally, I like the Pro-Mix because I don't want to be using a bunch of animal products and synthetics if I can help it. Pro-Mix is really just clean and I can amend with whatever I want then. I've also just straight up made my own mix from coir, perlite, and compost, and that always does fantastic in the raised beds, soooooooooooo fluffy.
Ugh, I wish this had been around a few months ago. I got the Kellogg brand for my new raised beds and everything is yellowed and stunted. I truly hope that you extend the experiment with the amendments, as it will definitely help us get things back on track!!
I ALWAYS amend my soil. I always add a manure (this year I went with chicken) and mix in a general "vegetable fertilizer". My local nursery stocks EB Stone and since I was doing raised beds, I used the raised bed variant. But I mixed it with another company's potting soil, GreenAll. My veggies are all slow, but they're also getting more shade than they should. The city's trees behind us give great shade! And lots of leaves. We did leave some leaves to decompose under the added soil in one of the raised beds. We also burned the driest of them. Old dirt, wet leaves, burned leaf ash, then the mix. The "old dirt" was what we raised veggies in several years ago. We scooped it all out and let it be in garbage cans for a few years. We used that to fill the raised beds we put in when we re-landscaped. One side of that raised bed has plants that have grown like gangbusters. The other side not so much....but also that's the side that our dog kept eating though the drip lines! Overall I'm pretty pleased. But I did amend! I didn't pay strict attention, but I'd say probably about 25% manure to 75% potting soil. I know that they just need more hours of sun!
Happy Frog and Ocean Forest, yes. I have had good luck with those. But where is Coast of Maine? Also one of my favorites! Good vid. I think you should trade hats too🤣
Definitely need a cheap recipe to make my own. I can't keep buying foxfarm. I'd live to make my own compost but no chickens or cows allowed in my hood. Might need a chipper.
If you want a recommendation, I just got a cheap chipper from Harbor Freight. Under $150 and it worked amazingly well. I was surprised at the quality and strength.
Just buying single ingredient fertilizers and amending it yourself can save you a few bucks. Give it a shot. Initially you might spend more buying bulk amendments but it'll save you money in the long run.
I’ve been researching worm composting and it seems inexpensive. I have an Amazon 15 page shredder that I use to shred all my Amazon boxes to make the browns for compost since I don’t have dried leaves.
One variable that was not discussed (I may have missed it) are the pepper plants, conventional or Organic. Conventional plants are conditioned to have soluble nutrients added for growth, while Organic plants are conditioned to extract nutrients from the soil. The old Organic saying, feed the soil not the plat, explains the different reaction to the various potting soils. There is also the subject of "seed memory" where the seed remembers under what conditions the host plant was grown, conventional or Organic. Conventionally grown plants do poorly in an Organic soil, as do Organic plants in a conventional soils. Thanks for this demonstration, look forward to more in the future
I have not found this to be the case at all, and highly doubt that this would be true if tested. Especially because, while yes synthetic fertilizers are much different - growing conventionally doesn't mean that you're using synthetics. "Organic" growing can have a pretty wide range of how far you are from organic methods. I do not grow organically, but I do have a lot of compost from my own pile in my soil and use organic fertilizers like kelp and fish emulsion. I assure you that the plants care more about micro and macro nutrients than where the source of those nutrients comes from. And as we see here, the 'organic' soils were actually mostly un-composted wood product.....but hey, it's oganic.
I use kelloggs patio plus as a base 2 mix w peat n then add amendments like worm castings n bloodmeal, etc to plants. Just add more nutrients to ur present stuff.
Also be interested in a season 2 follow-up. Miracle-Gro has a rep for great initial growth but poor lasting results. I always freshen up and re-use my container soil every year (with some new soil and compost) to save money overall. I'm not so interested in what's going to work as a one-off.
We want to do another soil experiment - what should we test next? P.S. YES we know this isn't a scientifically valid and super-controlled study. There are a lot of variables we couldn't control for, like variation in plant vigor, etc.
How about the best soil with the highest microbiology life
Roots organic, kiss organics, build a soil. Build a soil is the greatest soil mix ever concocted. Promise.
What about fertilizer experiments, including diy & store bought?
Kiss, roots organic, build-a-soil and other high end mixes that came from the cannabis industry! The cannabis industry has the best soils due to the medicinal nature with high regulations. Build-a-soil is the best of the best. True living soil, true super soil. You could do a whole video just testing the various build a soil mixes, recipes, processes. I'd be happy to help with some experimenting on that or JADAM!
Some test to see the moisture retentive properties? Like, which soil to choose, or what’s the best amendment (besides mulch) if you know you might go a while between watering occasionally
So buy the cheaper mix and add your own fertilizer. I lucked out last fall and was at Walmart when they put their parking lot inventory on sale for $1. So peat moss, potting soil, mulch, paving stones, gravel, sand, everything $1 each. I spent $140, and probably saved $1400. I have a small car and had to make 4 trips but it was so worth it!
I’m so jealous!!! Lol
wow, do you remember what month that was? i need to look out for those deals
@@Big-Government-Is-The-Problem mid September
@@Gardeningchristine thanks
@@Big-Government-Is-The-Problem no problem. It only lasted an hour or two and everything was gone.
now do fertilizers. Use a blank medium like Pro-Mix HP, then each container feed with different products both synthetics and dry amendments
Ooo do a fish tank water option as well.
Promix isnt blank it has tons of organic and added nutrients... i buy and use it alot... coco coir would be a better Clean Slate sort of mix!
@@SARDronic Pro-Mix HP is different. The bale instructs to use fertilizer.
Great idea! Use the worst performing potting mix (14) and test the fertilizers on that one.
*Feed your Soil. > I Think > Most 'bagged' Soil
does Not have everything in it...that will Feed your Vegetables for the Entire growing season!
> ADD a well rounded Organic / slow-release /
all purpose granular fertilizer.
> And/Or Water with a mild liquid Fert. (like Fish & Kelp)
I use an Organic / All Purpose Plant-- Flower-Vegetable Fertilizer with Over 70 trace mineral micronutrients and beneficial bacteria and fungi! (Everything in it)
The benefits are Amazing!
You can buy....just about any Organic Soil....but if you don't feed your Soil....then don't expect much.
I have 44 years experience doing raised beds and every bag you buy will change slightly from year to year. My latest project was I purchased 6 pallets of sta-green potting mix. 3,000 lbs. of river bottom sandy loam, 6 lbs. of azomite, 60 lbs. of worm castings and 40 lbs. of perlite along with 10 lbs. of bone meal and blend it all. My customer has peppers 5 feet tall right now and loaded. However at the end of the season the beds will decompose about 15% and will need topdressing for the following year. Great video!
The sandy loam is key. That little bit of clay vastly improves water retention.
Best to mix your own.
50% garden soil
30% peat moss
20% compost
Per _David Pavlis’_ suggestion.
I built a compost bed 8 x 16 that would get 3-4 ft tall and after 6 years, I sifted it, then added it to the garden.
9 inch wide tomatoes, 5 ft Basil bushels, 14 ft tall sunflowers, 6 ft marigolds.
I won’t do it any other way anymore.
I saw an article testing several commonly available bagged soils 40 years ago. They got the best result from soil that had been sitting around since the previous year, the lesson being that soil needs time, moisture, and not being physically disturbed in order to develop beneficial biological activity.
This is not true today, I bought on sale and used next yr and none of my plants would bloom
I buy my soil for the next season the year before or at least in the off season then let it sit until the following year. Do the same thing with my Black Kow.
I was wondering about that the other day when I opened up a bag of organic compost I'd had laying around for like 5 or 6 months for one of my plants. I opened it up and went "holy crap this stuff is fresher than my compost bin" the plants only been going a few days since I switched it to that soil, mixed with my compost, and it's going crazy.
@@imaflyinturkey9775 You noticed your plants went crazy after a few days?
@@MelissaR784 yeah
Now THIS is truly an epic video!!! Well done, this is seriously great content and valuable information!
I'm a scientist. I love this kind of video. Please do more!
I'd be curious if you dosed the lowest four with a liquid fertilizer if they perked up.
That's probably our next test!
@@epicgardening I wonder if you'd almost have to start over as the first
4 would have to have a ton of Nitro added just to get them growing, overcome the huge amount of wood, and are obviously stressed.
1)Maybe a comparison list of the amounts of n-p-k and micronutrients listed
on the individual bags. (calcium, magnesium, manganese, boron, etc)
Compare it to the results of your current results.
We can all compare that right in the store.
Not sure how you'd even them up nutrition wise, equally.
2)Sieve all of them to get the wood chunks, stones, and other debris out.
3)Add perlite to the ones that obviously don't have any for drainage and
aeration.
Lol, it works... source I'm the idiot who did a 40% mix of kellogs in his plant out and I shifted the trash out. It still under preformed when mixed with mushroom compost. I had to start hitting it with everyone's favorite blue juice and they're finally growing.
@@GetFitEatRight Haha, I'm the Second idiot that did just what you did. The Kellog stuff was "supposed" to be so great but it sucks. I'm not a happy camper.
@@ricklarsen852 Yeah... I'm just going to start buying the MGPM when it goes on sale in the fall from now on. I'm tired of fighting it, and this video was damning.
Ammending is definitely key. I've had great success with Kellogs patio. I just add stuff like earthworm castings and slow release fertilizer.
I love Kelloggs too. You have to add amendments to it for certain. But that’s not a problem.
@@iwanttobelieve5970 I mean, yeah it is because it means you have to pay more and do more work for the same decent results as if you'd just bought, say vigro or the 420
@Ingi-Natura-Renovatur-Integra I have a huge comfrey plant in my garden. Just starting to learn all the benefits. So exciting!
Yes. I amended the kellogs and my garden is doing amazing.
Same here. I pretty much never use it straight out of the bag.
Completely off-topic but I want Kevin and Jacques to switch hats for one video 😎🧢👒
HAHA
On topic; no black kow?
Off topic - you said you are Filipino, are there any good Filipino restaurants or food trucks in so.cal?
this
I want to see if the viewer would notice.
@@jjudijo oh come on, Kevin's impressive dome is too much for Jaques hat, he's gonna blow that Thang out 😂
I use vigaro potting mix and it was nice to see I haven't wasted money and have been getting one of the better mixes for so cheap.
You guys mentioned the fast growth of the miracle gro but the later tapering off. I think that's why Miracle Gro is great for annuals, since it can basically cover you for almost the entire season. For perennials I go with something closer to the recipe 420 for long term health & sustained slow release.
Pepper Geek did a very similar experiment except he went full season & weighed every fruit for the whole season. Happy Frog had a similar showing at about the same point in the season but ended up crushing everyone based on the weight of the peppers for the entire season.
I used Kellogg last year and it's trash. I used your top pick Miracle Gro in my raised garden bed this year and the difference is astronomical! I'll never go back. I spent under $60 and so far my garden is thriving way better than I expected.
Thanks for sharing your experiment. I learned a lot!
You bet!
Kelloggs literally has trash in it.
@@lemonyskunkketts7781 I've found plastic trash in Miracle Gro soil also
Oh gosh I just bought Kellogg after finishing up my bag of miracle gro 😭 I’m stressed
I noticed the same from last year’s Kellogg to this year Miracle Gro!
The most beautiful things in the world cannot be seen or even touched. They must be felt with the heart.
I'm stealing that from you, and saying it to my girlfriend. Thanks.
I would maintain that thanks are the highest form of thought, and that gratitude is happiness doubled by wonder.
But for real, when are we going to see our Kevin and Jacques Garden Gnomes hit the Epic store? I need some good vibes in my garden
Garden gnome will be awesome also bobbleheads or funkopop😂
This is what I didn't know I needed.
That would be super fun!
Yes! I'd love gnomes of them! They can guard my plants!
Yeah!!!!!
This is great. I'd love to see how to "fix" the struggling ones and how they all are later in the season
yea that was my thought as well
Since I had a couple bags of the Kelloggs this year for my containers - I'd also like to see how to fix it. I throw either Bio-tone or Garden-tone in and stir it around before putting the plant in.
@@bellepfeiffer3630add your fertilizer and organic matter preferably high quality compost. The biggest concern is those large wood chunks are tying up nitrogen
Would love a video about what to do if this year’s containers are all filled with one of those first four brands without having to replace all the soil.
Amend w fast n slow fertilizers.
Start using Miracle Gro water soluble fertilizer 😊 Or the generic equivalent, it’s basically the same. I don’t really get all the hate for MG. Containers really depend on steady nutrients being added since they can’t support a microbial community in the same way that in ground or raised beds can. They also need frequent watering which further washes out nutrients.
Add a layer of compost, organic fertilizers (I use a custom mix of bone meal, tomato-tone and veg-tone). Every 7 to 14 days water with Alaskan fish fertilizer and Jacks 20-20-20 (if you are ok with a synthetic fertilizer).
Since the problem originally was the wood was not broken down or decomposed enough, after a year or so, the wood in the soil will have broken down or "composted" a lot and will not have as great a binding effect with the nitrogen, so it will actually be much more ready to use than it was the year before. You could sift the soil to remove any sizeable woody pieces, but really, the only thing needed is to replace the fertilizer or organic nutrients used up in the previous seasons. And for good measure, perhaps add in some vermiculite or perlite or both to increase water holding capacity and aeration. Improve the soil, and add some good stuff, but don't replace it.
@@mrwormtestermg doesn't feed any natural microbes in the soil and is poison 😢 Please don't put that in your soil or body ❤
Just bought my first ever botanical interests seeds at my local nursery! So happy to be able to support the channel and try something new😊
Hi 12 years of experience Organic gardener here. If youre looking for cost effectiveness and you dont have a truck. Show up to your local soil sellers yard and ask if you can fill up buckets. Either choose fancy potting mix or just compost and amend it at home. Buying bags can be really expensive.
Where do you summon a local soil wizard?
That’s true, it’s usually way cheaper. Also most people have a neighbor with a pickup. Bake them some banana bread and I bet they would pick you up some dirt.
What he said... I now use droppings from my meat rabbits and amend... havent have better results. Rabbit droppings I use IMMEDIATELY... find a rabbit farmer.
@@school5730I saw a sign in a yard down the street, the sign read, "durt 4 sail." I'm going down there today.....gotta be legit.
@@kantemirovskaya1lightninga30 for a moment I read drippings not droppings and was confused as to why you were adding bunny grease to soil
The Miracle Gro Performance Organics is also the soil that the Ed Currie uses for his Carolina Reapers. It's expensive, but works well.
miracle gro is poison
@@GiarkReleos what poison?
@@GiarkReleosthat’s an ignorant statement. It’s a false statement. It’s not helpful to new gardeners that don’t know what they’re doing because they’re already intimated in many ways. Just because you may have years of experience you can be a snob. I used to do organic gardening for 15+ years. Miracle Gro, and some gypsum added yearly is more than good enough for new gardeners. Many people are on a budget so don’t knock them by belittling them.
I’d tell people using the blue is to use it at half dose or less.
I use liquid blue to get my stuff off to a faster start in the northland. Miracle gro is fine as long as people don’t overdo it.
@@NorthlanderMNwhat is the "blue"?
@@GiarkReleos You missed the Organics bit didn't you.
This video was SO helpful! I know there are variables you couldn’t control for, but you guys did a great job and kept it entertaining. It would be fun to see something similar when used to start seeds.
Man, I'm really glad I stayed away from that Kelloggs stuff, almost ordered 15 bgs of it. I then read the reviews & decided to go with some foxfarm mixed with the regular miracle grow potting mix. Plants are growing super fast & healthy looking.
Excellent video guys! 😎 👍 👊 🍻
Luckily I have a medium size koi pond with about 18 koi. When the filters ( swamp cooler pads) are flushed out, that water ( semi liquid muck) is saved/diluted and added as a nutrient booster for the plants.Cheap/bio/ecological friendly…
We have a small pond but when we backwash the filter, I put that hose in a flower bed.
You can do that with any organic material.
@@johnniekuykendall2696
Everyone’s a winner..
Absolutely love the topic selections lately. It makes for great inspiration for summertime activities with the kiddos. We’re doing a “soil test” this weekend with my son. He’s having a blast collecting supplies and creating the rules. We are going to use sugar baby watermelon seeds. The entire family is excited! Thanks for keeping the garden exciting.
I did so much research this year, as it’s my first year. I used Kellogg and avoided Miracle Grow, and my peppers are consistent with your results. Oh well! I’m learning every day.
I'm on my 5th year. We learn always. It is a lifetime of fun and knowledge. ❤
miracle grow has been a consistant for me since my parents used it but I did not think it would out preform even in its organic variety cool to see but I think they are right about just using a lil of your own fertilizer after a 2 or 3 months
I use Kellogg raised bed mix and just add fertilizer. My plants do fantastic every year. Miracle grow has fertilizer already.
I bet that if they redid this and fertilized all the plants, they would all do similarly. It is cheaper to use Kellogg and fertilizer than to buy the more expensive mixes.
Try adding fertilizer. I'm using the same Kellogg soil with water soluble fertilizer and my plants are doing great. I suspect this combo is cheaper than paying more for Miracle Grow, especially if you plan on reusing the soil anyways.
One of the best videos yet! Next add the same amendments to all the different fresh potting mixes and plants to see if that evens them out. Looking forward to what’s next
Who puts an Ikea and Lowe's together!!!! Heaven! I would stay broke!
There's a Costco across from both of them too 😂
😂😂😂
It’s a weird area, mostly apartments w/ in 3-4 mi radius. Also, it’s just west of the old chargers stadium.
Why do they call it 420? 🤔🌬️
It’s my favorite area to shop
Makes so much sense! We bought Kellogs only the 1st year. I thought I was a failure gardener. So many people were getting those, I thought it had to be me.
Same! I didn't read the reviews or do research. I just went to home depot.... I've finally got it working by amending a few times but I wouldn't buy it again.
i bought Kelloggs during the infamous pandemic summer of 2020
hands down my worst gardening season ever. Barely got anything. Switched to promix for 2021-2023 and got better results
they stopped selling promix at my local store though which stunk. switched to a new brand and i'm not super happy with it so far (weather has also been frustratingly cold)
I read so many reviews of potting mix. Kellogg sounded great while Miracle Gro was generally all bad, esp the moisture control kind. So I tried Kellogg this year for the first time and have been way behind even though I started indoors earlier. Such a waste. Thankfully, I amended and transplanted some survivors into better raised bed soil. This video confirmed my suspicion that maybe Kellogg was the problem.
@jthomas1408 same here.......somehow I heard that Kelloggs was the best, so I got a lot..........what a terrible mistake, poor to no germination, and stunted growth in the ones that did grow.........
This was excellent...because soil is to gardening as water is to life! Big surprises!!
one of the best pieces of advice i ever got from a more experienced gardener was if you treat your soil well, your plants will treat you well lol. Feed the soil 100%
the worst year i ever had as a gardener was the very first year of gardening...and that was because all i did was dump a bunch of soil into three pots. Didn't mulch didn't compost. and as you can imagine i got terrible results lol
Just filled 2 30" raised beds with 34 bags of Kelloggs... So would love a video of how you would amend lesser quality soil, or what you would do to fix it by growing specific plants.
100%
Absolutely, me too, with horrible garden due to this soil. I feel like I wasted my whole season, not to mention $$$$.
So I used 12 bags and had terrible luck till I amended a few times. If you have access to good gardening compost I would add that in. Additionally, I would add some organic granular fertilizer and for the first few weeks maybe even use a good organic liquid fertilizer.
What I did after everything died when I replanted. I added a good amount of bone meal and worm castings right under each plant when I planted, and then also mixed around in the garden. I also gave them a good dose of organic liquid fertilizer. I didn't have access to compost or I would have done that before replanting.
@@Hugadognowsame. I decided to fill up one of my beds this year with this soil and everything in it looks so sad. Even my squash which normally is out of control is still at this late date only about 4 inches tall with like 6 or so mini leaves on it. I think I saw one male flower once, and haven't even seen a female flower pop up on the thing
Same. Kelloggs and a couple others but in reality just diff dresses on the pig. Container gardening. It is as pathetic as it gets here. It never dawned on me that a bag labeled soil would have virtually no soil in it. It’s dirt with or without compost and maybe some peat and long acting fertilizers. Idk why i didn’t dream that I wouldn’t find assholes in the dirt industry but yeah, I naively thought I’d just buy organic products and I’d be ok. I amended with worm castings, box store composted manure and some mycorrhizae. Knowing what I know now, I was way too stingy with those amendments. I need to anoint them with oil and pray for miracles or just stop watering and give it up, go to the soil yard and pick up good stuff and come overhaul my containers for the next round.
Would have loved to see the Espoma potting soil used. Laura at Garden Answer uses it exclusively and gets phenomenal results. Of course she also fertilizes like crazy, too, lol. I've been using it for the last couple of years and have seen some wonderful results.
Used to use them a lot and liked it!
She also has a very good base soil, being in the desert,
and ENDLESS WELL WATER !
I can't even imagine what their water bill would be if they had to pay by the gallon!
(Like I do.)
Plus, also bcuz of being in the desert, the air temps cool off at night giving all plants a nice break.
It's basically gardening Disneyland over there!
Anyway, it's no surprise they can grow just about anything.
I don't think it's fair to compare their conditions to most other places.
I do watch them every day, I am just careful to keep from comparing what they can do with what I can do.
Just my 2 cents.
@@gardengatesopen Very good points. It just adds to her appeal that she's over there in Garden Disneyland though! Love Laura! 💚
@olympiabee yesss, we all love to visit Disneyland don't we!
Espoma is my go-to as well!
I mix my own: 3 cu ft of peat moss, 3 of topsoil and 3 of compost, all as off brand as they sell. It has worked wonders for me and costs about $40.
Whats the sand content of the topsoil? For veggies going mostly soil-less is fine but for trees you want a higher soil to organic matter content
No perlite?
Yeah that definitely needs something for more drainage unless it's super sandy topsoil mixed in.@@Dave_the_Dave
Miracle-Gro mixes use mostly synthetically-derived fertilizers that are immediately available to plants and will naturally perform better in a short-term grow bag experiment. Fox Farms Ocean Harvest has organic, slow release bat guano/crab meal/fish emulsion which require some biological activity before available.
Can probably be reused for multiple grows as well, whereas the performance of the miracle gro regular one at least would probably drop off
They said that in the video
Most people who are growing peppers and tomatoes will almost always change out their soil yearly and $8-$9 per bag for vigoro is best
This was so cool to see! This kinda explains my first year gardening using Kelloggs soil in grow bags back in 2019... my peppers were sad and stunted like those on the left. Been using Fox Farm for almost 2 years on indoor and outdoor plants and love it!
Thanks for adding the graphics in there too! Great work, guys! 🫡💚💚💚
Something that Charles Dowding mentioned which was a lightbulb for me was that the actual components and grade of the mixes even from the same companies/bags will likely vary year by year, so its good to inspect them like you guys did here and test them for yourself, and perhaps stock up on a specific one which proves to have favorable qualities.
Agree I see a 100% huge variation in the same varieties each year
Agreed! Used Kellogg's three years ago and it was fabulous. Last year it was junk.
i personally like to use promix
but Menards stopped carrying them, at least the ones near me. I went with their local company called Master Garden instead and it has had mixed results unfortunately
ProMix is very consistent and is marketed for experienced growers, that's including making sure the pH of the mix is in a desired ranged. What this test does is show which potting mix has the most pre-added fertilizer, it doesn't tell the quality of the mix. ProMix is still one of the top choice for pro growers who know what they're doing. Also if you're buying those MiracleGro bags which hardware store usually put outdoor and get rained on, you will get fungus gnats galore, which also happens to be a key feature of MiracleGro.
@@skippythealien9627 They replaced ProMix with SunGro Sunshine Mix #4. I am testing it out and I think it's pretty good. It seems to be formulated as a high porosity mix and have a lot of perlite added, so it will be faster drying. I mixed it with peat moss and fine sized aged pine bark, which reduced the porosity but still is a very good texture for typical potting mix, and saves a bit of money for the resulting volume.
@@skippythealien9627 All the Menard's stopped selling it, which is a shame. They were the only local store that carried the large bags of ProMix (or any other large bags of potting soil) as early as February, and it was so well priced. I do winter sowing, so I need potting mix while there's still snow on the ground. My winter sowing costs are going to double, triple, or more next year without Menard's selling those large ProMix bags. Thanks for the heads up on the Master Garden quality.
I can confirm the kellogs. I bought that and some Coast of Maine soil. The plants in the Kellogs just stalled out entirely. The ones in Coast of Maine are doing fantastic! That Kellogs stuff might as well be a bag of sterile sand.
I repotted most of the stalled plants into Coast of Maine, and those recovered pretty well. The ones I left in Kellogs even another 10 days are permanently stunted, even after getting them out of that garbage.
Thank you for this fantastic experiment!! Really educational.
(Edited to add that I had added liquid and granular fert to both, but no compost or anything like that. I don't expect to have to add that to pre-bagged potting soil right away)
seconding Coast of Maine, i've had great results with the Bar Harbor blend for the past two years! it's pricey, but a cheaper option than Fox Farms at least.
Yes I’ve only been using coast of Maine for the past two years with good results. I don’t really see any RUclips channels using it, maybe it is a regional thing?
@@JB28057 It could be regional. I'm in Maine itself. I know you can find it in some garden centers as far away as the Virginias, but I suspect it's really only distributed around the NE or may east coast.
@@Sendarya yes that’s what I’m thinking, I am in NJ
@@JB28057 Not exactly. Hooked and Rooted here on youtube uses it all the time. Her channel is great and she is the one who put me on to it as this is my first year truly gardening.
Thanks for doing this video over a span of time. The progression is as interesting as the results.
Using a thin layer of maricle grow, laid over last year's potting soil, laid over sand and plant scraps, with a thin mulch cover has always worked wonders for me. Potting soil is mostly about mixing and amending like you said.
I love this experiment! Please do more of these kind of tests - especially with self-amending of the soil. Thank you. Greetings from Berlin.
I remember listening to the owner of malibu compost on in search of soil. He seemed so high and mighty and acted like his product was so amazing. Funny to see his product in the bottom four while being the most expensive.
Just goes to show that price isnt everything and the best soil is the one you build yourself over many years.
It's a compost not a stand alone soil. U can't use malibu as a straight growing soil it's too hot. It's compost!!!
@@JD91909 The product they used is being sold as a potting soil, not a compost. Baby Bu's product description on their own website even says "ready to use straight out of the bag" and as an "all in one mix"
@@JD91909 Compost, by definition, is a decomposed and stable soil amendment. Any compost is dependent on the bulk materials that went into their creation. The term "hot" means that there is a lot of soluble NPK in a soil, a characteristic which good compost does not have. The Miracle-Gro product have soluble fertilizers that work really well in short term grows like in this experiment. This experiment should really have explained the nutrient sources of each bag of soil.
@@JD91909 that makes so much sense! Was confused why you couldn't use compost as soil
@@JD91909 It says Potting Soil on the bag
I used the Fox Farms Strawberry Fields in my Greenstalk planter this year and amended with bone meal and a balanced organic fertilizer. So far it has been great for my strawberries. Container gardening can be tricky and I'm not surprised that the soil mixes with added fertilizer outperformed the others. I find regular fertilizing of my container plants makes all the difference.
The epic universe has been pumping out videos lately! Thanks for doing the lords work 😅
Glad you like them!
I’ve had great success with Coast of Maine so far this season
Yes! I tried it for the first time this year and love it. I usually use Espoma, but I like the Coast of Maine even better.
I've only recent gotten into gardening and am growing 2 types of pepper plants with miracle gro potting mix. A lot of people talk badly about the brand but my parents used it consistently with good results and it's nice to see that it gives good results! Will continue using it and fertilize after 2-3 months
I just use Happy Frog putting soil in my greenstalk all I do is container gardening. Start seeds in Vermont compost. Amend with bone meal and fish emulsion as needed every two weeks, two weeks after final planting. Brilliant stuff. Huge returns. I'm happy.
I agree. I love it
Stones instead of sticks. Just put it in my Green Stalks w strawberries. Did Not love weeding out a handful or more of stones as i filled each tier. Will see how strawberries grow over summer. $13/ bag on sale -2cuft.
By far, my favorite video!! I was wondering about this. I used Fox Farms soil in cloth pots last year & every single plant did not do that good. I threw them in the ground with no prep, nothing added where I took out some bushes & my Serrano pepper grew almost 5 feet tall. It was mind blowing. I put some plants in the same grow bags with that same soil over a month ago & the plants haven’t done anything or grown. Interestingly enough, I had 4 other bags, same Fox soil from last year and one tomato is amazing & producing, the other is stunted. Same tomato bought the same day. The other two bags have cucumbers & they’re doing great. So same bags, same old soil from last year and different results. It’s crazy. Fun to see though. Sometimes you just never know.
Owww...I have some stunted plants in my containers too and I used Fox Farms happy Frog and the Ocean one. Hm...I thought I was investing in superb soil, not subpar...
@@aiai-j7i it all grows better in the ground for me. My worms are happy.
I set up so many beds this year, so I've been buying the 2 cheapest varieties at a regional Big Box Store (neither of which are represented here). The biggest difference seems to be the amount of perlite. I'm hoping amending with liquid fertilizer, worm compost, and composted manure will get me some decent looking plants. This year is all about experimenting though.
What a great video! I have noticed similar results across my various grow bags so far this year and last year! The more wood has increased the need for worm castings and fertilizer. Everything I do is 100% organic, so the more dark and rich a soil is, the more likely I am to buy it moving forward 👊🏻🌻👊🏻
We've settled on the Sta-Green Potting Mix Plus Fertilizer version. Seeing fantastic growth wherever used.
You can get fox farm ocean forest for $11ish a bag at hydro stores. Cheapest hydro in riverside ca is where I got mine. I think for a better test you should take cuttings so they are all from the same plant.
Spectrum hydroponics in Santa Fe springs sells fox farm for $12 😊
@@tatiana.alexiss right by my parents. I’ll have to pick up a couple more bags to level off the beds.
Yall are amazing for doing these long form vids that require so much time, effort, and research!!!
Glad you like them!
Love this! Fascinating. Would love to see another video on what you guys add to amend soils and for which plants.
I agree was facinating
I use a shallow boot tray under my grow bags so they don't dry out or make a mess... works great!
yay i LOVE your experiment videos! they're so interesting and helpful!
Nice Star Trek moment in the editing. I appreciate this experiment.
LOVED this video! Thank you for taking the time to do this test on soil mix for gardening! Would also love to see a similar test (separately for soil, fertilizers & compost) using Espoma, Proven Winners, and Soil3 (Southeastern US) brands!
I phoned White Flower Farm (owned by Miracle Grow) 2 months ago after reading about all the foreign material found in their products (nails, glass, etc). They confirmed this is possible as they source their compost from landfills. When I asked them if used diapers could also be in that compost their phone rep replied "it's possible." This is supposed to be their "ORGANIC" mix. I'm currently using Back To The Roots Organic Potting Mix and Organic Raised Bed Garden Mix. They confirmed by phone that they do NOT source from landfills. However, I am getting LOTS of bindweed sprouting from their mix, even in closed bottom grow bags. JUST MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCES that I'm sharing.
Exactly
Oof! Not great
Thank you for that mention. I'm going to go Google this 😅
@@CWorgen5732 What mention?
wouldn't it just be from green bin programs if anything?
This explains alot. I always bought my soil from local company when I had huge beds, moved to new place and smaller beds so bought Kellogg’s last two years and my garden has sucked and thought at first it was plants, then thought it was the organic straw I used for mulch. Lesson learned.
This was exactly what I wanted to see. I have used the MiracleGro Moisture Control in my flowering plant pots for years and love it. I’ve also used their Performance Organic mix for veggies and that’s been great too. I’ve used Happy Frog but haven’t felt it’s enough better for the price difference. This year I got the cube of ProMix Premium Organic at Walmart and it’s done well too but I also added worm castings. It feels very peaty and does dry out fast but in my drought prone area I feel more comfortable with better moisture retention. I used it for some seed starting and really had to be on top of the watering. The main thing I hate is mixes that are woody so I’m running around trying to see if I can feel it though the bag, unless I run across one that’s torn open to actually see. I did find the Kellogg mixes to be far too woody. My veggies move into raised beds amended seasonally with bagged compost and I’ve also had to shop the same way. A lot of that is rushed to market not totally broken down and can be woody. This was great though because it showed the most expensive isn’t necessarily always the best.
Very surprising results. Great job, gentlemen!
I did this with 4 brands and Vigoro came out on top, and it's price is great.
I am not at all surprised on the Kellogg's results! I bought some for my cucurbits seed starts this year even though I knew it was a crap soil because my go to options were out of stock. I went from a 99% success rate normally to less than 50%, which was terrible knowing people were depending on me for plants! I loved the breakdown you two did at the end of why some soils did so well and how they is likely to taper off, it's great info for those just starting out.
This was a really cool and fun experiment!! Can’t wait to see the amending experiment! Dr. Jacque 👏🏻 🤘🏻🤙🏼
The conditions of conquest are always easy. We have but to toil awhile, endure awhile, believe always, and never turn back.
Epic's experiment vids are my personal favorite
I've been using the 420 soil, since I grow organically, and was looking to save some money over the fox farm soils. This experiment has confirmed for me that I made the right choice. I'm also glad I started using it instead of the Kellogg potting soil I was using originally.
I did a few experiments with potting soils myself, but what I found, that is large factor is genetics of individual plants. Even if it's the same variety seed to seed will yield slightly different results in the exact same conditions. You need cloned plants for this experiment to be more unbiased.
(Edit) yea you did mentioned genetics, nvm. Nice work👍
The thesis of the experiment is wrong to start with. It's not testing the various quality of the potting mix but how much fertilizer is available in each brand and automatically assume MiracleGro is best since it has most added fertilizer, probably slow release. For people growing specific type of plant, this pre-added fertilizer could interfere with the result, especially if there is too much slow release nitrogen.
I absolutely loved the experiment with the do nothing straight out of the bag. Great information for the beginning gardeners as well as the experienced folks who know how to amend their mix.
Wonderful comments from people who garden. I also enjoyed people sharing their opinions on what is working or didn't work for them with the results they have. Personally, I always wondered about the different mixes, and now I know. Thank you.
I love science, and I'm glad their are channels out there that can shed some light on things most of us waste money trying to discover.
Im surprised with the Vigoro being #2, could easily add some compost and/or granular fertilizer to that and round it out for a much better price! I may try this next time I need to refresh :D TY
I work at Big Box Store #2 and I am quite familiar with what Jacques picked up. I have replenished many pallets of it this season.
Actually this might be a good time to ask. We had the yellow Pro-Mix potting soil leftover from last year that would have definitely frozen solid in our climate over the winter. How much does that effect the soil quality?
Oh.... we sell so much of that Kellogg's Raised Bed...
@@dustbusta It doesn't hurt potting soil at all to freeze over the winter.
Love the experiments keep doing these!!!
I LOVE these garden experiments so MUCH! Thank you for creating content that SHOWS RESULTS as well as information and demonstrations
These longitudinal studies are cool! You guys are really stepping it up with the long-term planning for videos. We dont have to wait for the results and forget to follow up later… its in the same video! Perfect.
Fun experiment! It would have been cool to see a grow bag with epic soil from the garden.
Next time!
It would but we can’t get our hands on it. I appreciate they bought widely available soil those of us who aren’t homesteaders
Woof, I have Kellogg in my beds right now, and I can confirm my peppers look sad just like your experiment. Thank you for putting this video together! I will be changing some of my setup going forward!
Welk, you can water them with miracle gro…..
I did Kellogg and my peppers failed for 2 years 😂 and then I had to experiment with amendments and then I got a pepper. Then I decided to stop growing peppers 🥲.
I have it in my pots too😮, I'm feeling optimistic though. I'm just going to supplement throughout the summer with fish fertilizer. I mostly go for Kellogg soil due to the fact they don't use peat moss. Which is incredibly slow growing and isn't a renewable resource. Harvesting it is harmful to the environment
Not last! Kellogg raised bed user here lol I amend with compost/manure and slow release organic fertilizer.
i think that's what's annoying though. a lot of people are starting gardening or are still relatively inexperienced. they don't know all the science and work that goes into gardening yet. i can imagine they buy these soil products (which are everywhere at home depot) and then get terrible results and think they are terrible gardeners
The raised bed is pretty good soil. At least not full of wood chips made from wood left over from construction sites. I'm sure I could find a cheaper alternative since HD sells it for 9 bucks a bag. Thing is I just mix in all the good stuff my garden needs. This way I control the show. You can't find sterilized dirt in a bag these days, ( real dirt that is).
I sift potting mixes through a 1/4" screen mesh (hardware cloth) and that gets out all of the bigger pieces of wood and other junk. Whatever is left I feel is broken down enough that it won't matter especially because I'm going to add fertilizer because I'm going into the ground for growing. The only thing the potting mix is going to do is get me to the point of getting the plant into the ground. And even if I'm using a good quality mix I still use a water soluble fertilizer that makes nutrients available, and I do that at the beginning of growth (so it's not much being added) and if I re-pot I'll do it a couple days before I re-pot, and here I use a little more than I did after initial growth.
With the leftover wood chips you can toss them into soil that isn't next to something you're growing and they'll finish breaking down.
Thank You Jacque and Kevin. I enjoy your test they are extremely helpful.
I am blown away by the differences. Thank you for doing this. I bought a generic organic mix, thinking I was doing the right thing and have been wondering about the results I’ve been seeing in my own garden. Guess I should switch back to the miracle grow!
You guys are the BEST!! I'm only halfway through the video and I am shocked at how much the success of my container garden depends on the soil. I feel so much better about my past failures because I have soil that was so wood chippy I had itchy splinters after working in it. Thank you so much for constantly making me a more successful gardener!
I always pull out the chunks of wood & put them in the bottoms of containers or raised beds to be filled. An easy way is to sift it through hardware cloth framed over a container. The scrap that stays on top goes in the bottom.
I didn’t get it was the soil but the fertilizer in the soil
I also sift but I use the woody bits as mulch on top. @@irony11
The soil is everything. It's life.
A big part of this video was the top performers had a slow release fertilizer added that some of the others didn't. If the others had nutrients added then it could have upped the competition considerably.
By the way, this is perfectly valid science. You have controls, hypotheses, testing, and results. There is bias in every experiment, but you should not have the disclaimer that this is backyard science. This is completely legitimate science and interesting.
It’s legit but not totally. For totally, you need more data- more repetition to offset the effects of diuferences between seedlings and other random events. It would be more expensive, but to be better, they needed like three pots of each soil mix, and a control of some kind-like native soil, unamended.
With n=1 it proves nothing.
Maybe one day in the future we will figure out how to bring them all to the same moisture content before beginning.
Nope most bagged MixeS ARE NIT FIR consumption....
Plain black dirt is best for 🌶
All peppers
@@ephemerics ope just in the ground peppers like to be with their buddies like a patch in the ground the video is hilarious
I really like the idea behind this video, more videos like this would be great.
Bought a bag of compost and a bag of perlite for my balcony garden and it’s been great. Plants really took off when I also added organic microryzal fertilizer too!
For my indoor plants I use the same compost + perlite mix and sometimes add orchid bark as needed. Water them with my fish tank water or just tap and they do amazing.
This is absolutely amazing! Thank you so much for taking the time to do experiments that reveal truths! I think experiments like this really elevate this channel above the rest!
Please re-use the soil/pots and run another batch of pepper plants. Does the plant health and bounty change? Gary suggests that compost breaks down and will poison plants after 5 months.
What do you mean the broken down compost poisons the plants?
ETA: Perhaps you mean that as the wood in some composts break down, they pull the nitrogen away from the plants??? That can be compensated for by adding additional nitrogen.
@@kaylakitty3814 ruclips.net/video/KHZHy3_7PPE/видео.html This expert says that decomposing wood products that are the bulk of our mulch and compost break down, consuming available nitrogen and oxygen while producing sewer gases that poison the plant roots.
Thanks for sharing. I wonder how the nutrition in the fruits compare..... that would be really interesting info to go along with.
Interesting results, I have a raised bed right now filled with Kellogg raised bed mix and I’m getting pretty good results so far
Personally, I like the Pro-Mix because I don't want to be using a bunch of animal products and synthetics if I can help it. Pro-Mix is really just clean and I can amend with whatever I want then. I've also just straight up made my own mix from coir, perlite, and compost, and that always does fantastic in the raised beds, soooooooooooo fluffy.
I do Mels Mix. Expensive but my plants love it
I I am want to be like Jacques when I grow up.😊
Dont we all!
Ugh, I wish this had been around a few months ago. I got the Kellogg brand for my new raised beds and everything is yellowed and stunted. I truly hope that you extend the experiment with the amendments, as it will definitely help us get things back on track!!
I ALWAYS amend my soil. I always add a manure (this year I went with chicken) and mix in a general "vegetable fertilizer". My local nursery stocks EB Stone and since I was doing raised beds, I used the raised bed variant. But I mixed it with another company's potting soil, GreenAll. My veggies are all slow, but they're also getting more shade than they should. The city's trees behind us give great shade! And lots of leaves. We did leave some leaves to decompose under the added soil in one of the raised beds. We also burned the driest of them. Old dirt, wet leaves, burned leaf ash, then the mix. The "old dirt" was what we raised veggies in several years ago. We scooped it all out and let it be in garbage cans for a few years. We used that to fill the raised beds we put in when we re-landscaped. One side of that raised bed has plants that have grown like gangbusters. The other side not so much....but also that's the side that our dog kept eating though the drip lines! Overall I'm pretty pleased. But I did amend! I didn't pay strict attention, but I'd say probably about 25% manure to 75% potting soil. I know that they just need more hours of sun!
Happy Frog and Ocean Forest, yes. I have had good luck with those. But where is Coast of Maine? Also one of my favorites!
Good vid. I think you should trade hats too🤣
Definitely need a cheap recipe to make my own. I can't keep buying foxfarm. I'd live to make my own compost but no chickens or cows allowed in my hood. Might need a chipper.
Good call
If you want a recommendation, I just got a cheap chipper from Harbor Freight. Under $150 and it worked amazingly well. I was surprised at the quality and strength.
Just buying single ingredient fertilizers and amending it yourself can save you a few bucks. Give it a shot. Initially you might spend more buying bulk amendments but it'll save you money in the long run.
I’ve been researching worm composting and it seems inexpensive. I have an Amazon 15 page shredder that I use to shred all my Amazon boxes to make the browns for compost since I don’t have dried leaves.
Ask for a discount on broken bags at box stores. That’s all I buy, plus maybe some amendments to mix in.
One variable that was not discussed (I may have missed it) are the pepper plants, conventional or Organic. Conventional plants are conditioned to have soluble nutrients added for growth, while Organic plants are conditioned to extract nutrients from the soil. The old Organic saying, feed the soil not the plat, explains the different reaction to the various potting soils.
There is also the subject of "seed memory" where the seed remembers under what conditions the host plant was grown, conventional or Organic. Conventionally grown plants do poorly in an Organic soil, as do Organic plants in a conventional soils.
Thanks for this demonstration, look forward to more in the future
I have not found this to be the case at all, and highly doubt that this would be true if tested. Especially because, while yes synthetic fertilizers are much different - growing conventionally doesn't mean that you're using synthetics. "Organic" growing can have a pretty wide range of how far you are from organic methods. I do not grow organically, but I do have a lot of compost from my own pile in my soil and use organic fertilizers like kelp and fish emulsion. I assure you that the plants care more about micro and macro nutrients than where the source of those nutrients comes from. And as we see here, the 'organic' soils were actually mostly un-composted wood product.....but hey, it's oganic.
EPIC...I was so bummed to hear Kellogs organic plus was in 12th place... my entire garden is made up of it!!!
I use kelloggs patio plus as a base 2 mix w peat n then add amendments like worm castings n bloodmeal, etc to plants. Just add more nutrients to ur present stuff.
I’m blown away by the fact that the cheaper miracle grow soil out did some of the ones that cost double or tripple per cubic ft of dirt.
Would love to see Coast of Maine tested. It's what we use and obviously it's New England company, but we stand by their stuff.
i'm just very interested in seeing which one produces the best plant!
Coming soon!
Also be interested in a season 2 follow-up. Miracle-Gro has a rep for great initial growth but poor lasting results. I always freshen up and re-use my container soil every year (with some new soil and compost) to save money overall. I'm not so interested in what's going to work as a one-off.