Blackie: There's a lot of buzz at my gun club about your videos on BP revolvers. The Civil War shooters are now often quoting you as the authority, and the range officer has recommended your videos to new black powder shooting members. Thank you and please keep up the good work. Hopefully we can see you shooting a Starr or maybe a Lemat soon.
i have quite a few videos left to do..thank you for the kind words..i spent many yrs learning the ways of the percussion revolver..and hope to share my knowledge ..safe journeys
I read Mike Venturino's account of that Colt blowing up years ago in American Handgunner. If I remember correctly it was made in 1914 and given to him sometime in the 1980's by Hank Williams Jr. I was almost sick just reading that. And in the pictures it looked like a nicely patina'd and well taken-care-of piece too. As someone who is foaming at the mouth to purchase a '61 Navy, I found this here video as another sobering reminder of why loading or reloading has to have one's absolute attention. Thanks for the great videos and stay safe, Blackie!
depends on the situation..normal woods time i carry a short .20 ga..i also carry a navy arms henry rifle in 44-40 for deer hunting ..a .50 cal flintlock ..a 03"a3 30-06 for long range deer/hog..and a lever .22 on occasion for small game..really just what i am in the mood for at the time..thanks for the comment safe journeys
This was raw knowledge that could potentially save someones life and limb, and something that every honest shooter knows they have probably done when loading in a hurry or having attention diverted elsewhere, this is why I don't think gals in daisy dukes should be anywhere near the loading area, but then again I sure as heck ain't going to chase them off. Concentration and safety are one in the same, you cant have one without the other. Excellent video Blackie thanks for posting this. I hope someday you place all of your B.P. Revolver videos on a DVD and sell it, I have learned more watching you than in the 30 plus years I have been shooting reading about this, if someone watches one of your videos and don't learn something they did not watch or just cant or wont learn other than the hard way.
Great video again. I follow Cap & Ball as well as Duelist1954 videos, both of which are excellent, but yours are by far the most comprehensive. Keep em' coming!
Good video. I've never seen a detonation in person, or know anybody that has has had one. The only ones I'm aware of have used smokeless powder by mistake. The one thing that does come to mind however, is just how thin the 1860 army is at the lock notch. From what I understand, the original colt 1860's had a stepped chamber, the repos are pretty much straight down, so the lock notch is paper thin. I'd bet on metal fatigue or micro crack in the metal around the notch. The 90 deg. cut doesn't help matters as it's a stress riser. Add a little corrosion on the inside of the chamber from improper or lack of cleaning, or maybe they milled just a bit too much metal off that one cylinder. Add in mystery soft steel the repos use (I've done some mill work on a few and they cut like mild steel) and it very easily can happen. One interesting note about the 1860 cartridge conversion is that it wasn't uncommon for the lock bolt to chip out in use, still had a brass case but it became very hard to remove. In fact, I'm surprised detonations don't happen more often. That said, I plan to keep shooting mine as long as I'm able.
very true..for a detonation to happen some rule had to have been broken..wrong powder../ air load..metal flaw..ect..all of then can be avoided with a little attention to detail..thanks for posting..safe journeys
Thanks Blackie . I am a Cowboy Action Shooter . I have loaded BP in Cartridge's. for years . In the last year I have really got in to Cap and Ball guns . I have a Gen 2 Colt 1860 . and two Pietta Colt 1860 done by Coffinmaker. and one Colt 1849 done by Goons . Brother is addictive to shoot Cap guns . I dont know what took me so long. But I am in love with Open Top Cap Guns. God Bless Brother . Rooster .
Blacky, you're my new hobby.? all these guns I have a 45 years I've been doing what you said to do.!" with the Remington I gut the notch in the cylinder pen " with my dragoon t cut the notch in the back on the nipples so the release the gas!" you been keeping me up late at night busy.? thank you sir
Blackie, thank you for sharing your valuable knowledge of percussion revolvers. I am new to percussion revolvers so I am watching all your videos on the subject before I start shooting. I bought a Uberti 1851 London model and I am looking forward to shooting it. Thanks again!
After shooting many cylinders in a dirty gun even the inside of the cylinders gum up. I've poured in powder and it looks like you've got a full cylinder but it is sticking to the walls of the cylinder. It makes it look full or you are over filling the cylinder but you aren't. I've gotten in the habit of a light tap down with the rammer on the powder then patch, ram the patch down a little, then going to full pack down with the rammer over the ball. I have the Sheriffs with a stubby ram rod so a little extra shoulder needs to be put into it anyway to seat the ball. Reloading Cap and Ball guns is like fishing. Take the entire day and enjoy it. No need to see how fast you can drop lead down range if you make time for it.
Hi Blackie, thanks for the video, this subject was very interesting I have to admit I never gave detonation a thought until now. Shooters must pay attention to what there doing every step of loading, thankfully my worst sin to date has just been dry balling. Thanks again and looking forward to more.
Some years ago a contributor to the "Cowboy Chronicle" or "SHOOT!" magazine wrote an article that suggested that using a progressive press, a bullet stayed stuck to the seating stem of the seating die and managed to load two bullets into a case with x grains of powder. When fired, it blows the cylinder and cracks the barrel. That makes more sense than powder positioned near the base of the bullet.
Detonation in internal combustion engines is exactly how you explained it. I can see it happening! As far as looking I reloaded for 45 Colt in a Uberti SAA I had. Smokeless powder and that case DEMAND looking every time! Double charge is too simple to do! Also I always tilted the gun back EVERY TIME before shooting! I considered this MANDATORY! So your warning of looking is not lost on me.
The locking notch weak point is why high pressure cartridge revolvers like the .454 Casull have 5 chambers. An odd number makes the locking notch be between the chambers instead of on them
Both of my old BP Revolvers I remember back when I was loading them (1851 36cal and 1851 Sheriff 44cal) I always got the "pop" and then I slowly pressed in until I could not press any more. The Sheriff was harder because it had that stubby rammer. 1st I got the ball into the cylinder which was hard then crushed it down using my shoulders which wasn't as difficult. I believe you can compress a large volume of powder too much where you will not get a good burn and blow that what wasn't burned out the barrel wasting energy and powder. I never thought about detonation. Used Pyrodex because that was all that was available and it was kept inside before going into a flask. Flasks did not sit in the sun. I always used too much powder due to ignorance (I was a kid with no reference back in the mid 80's). If anyone was going to hit the lottery and lose big time I had a pretty good chance at the time. I was also lucky I never got a squib load in the barrels. I shot a lot of rounds and was lucky.
Hows it going blackie, finally got me a batch of powder made last week and about 200 balls cast, got to go shoot it for the first time Wednesday, I'm definitely hooked
Ok Blackie, thats it. I'm a long time follower and I think I suggested you have your own tv show, but now I really think it's time. We all think your great and that you really know your Stuff.You have a lot to offer for the pro shooter and the Novice. Think about it. Safe Jurnies my Friend. Scotty
I have a '51 Navy in Army caliber and one time i was out shooting it, practicing with it cause it's my carry gun (I'm under 21). I load 30 grains 3F Pyrodex with CCI number 11 caps which I've had inconsistencies with. I pulled the trigger and no *Bang* but a weird fizzle and a strange zinging noise. Man, I was scared! I took the thing apart and that ball was just there in the forcing cone. I think the powder got wet somehow but there was none left in the chamber so i assume it burned. But why didn't the ball even get into the barrel? Very weird.
I like your BP videos very much, but I think you missed the mark with this one. BP will not burn any hotter/faster/more powerfully because there is "extra oxygen" in a chamber. Assuming a properly prepared mixture, BP is a carefully balanced chemical compound containing a precise mixture of fuel and oxidizer. It has enough oxidizer to enable the fuel to burn. This is why you could fire a gun in outer space or a vacuum on Earth, or in a container of inert gas. The fuel and oxidizer are bound together in the proper proportion, and adding more oxidizer cannot burn more fuel, or make it burn faster, because the chemical reaction would be out of balance. Pressure within a given volume is not directional. It is evenly distributed. A partially filled chamber will experience equal pressure at all points within the chamber, not some massive unidirectional pressure spike in one direction. A chamber that is less than full will effectively be a larger volume for the gas to expand into than a similar chamber that is packed full because the relative volume for the gas to expand into is greater. Imagine lighting one fire cracker in a soda can and one in a gallon can (made of the same material as the sida can.) Which one is more likely to burst? The one with the lesser volume for the gases to expand into. Also, BP produces a fixed volume of gas for a given amount of powder. A smaller charge will produce less gas than a larger one, which means that it cannot physically produce as much pressure in the same sized chamber. Which makes the bigger bang, a firecracker or a cherry bomb (assume BP is the active ingredient in both.) The cherry bomb, because there is more of it. I have heard other people also claim that there are "documented cases" of the explosions you describe, but, like you, they do not provide any documentation of these incidents. They seem more likely to be "documented" anecdotes. In fact, in many of your comments about these documented cases" you say, "I don't know" with regard to what happened. If a laboratory cannot recreate the events no matter how hard they try, there is probably a simple reason; although, as with the "documented cases," no one presents any documentation of such efforts. Surely, a real laboratory would produce copius documentation of such experiments, and surely its results would be published for all to see. You do mention two possible causes of such catastrophic failure that are within the realm of possibility: smokeless powder, and mechanical flaws.
I inherited a 44 Navy&new to black powder ball&cap been looking at your BP videos..glad your running them again my question is can u load the powder place the patch&pack it Then place the ball&pack it down to the patch to help keep it from having air pocket&blowing up? Thanx for all ya do man👍🤠
Can you tell me how is the front sight on a Pietta 1851 Navy attached to the barrel. Is it threaded, glued, or pressed to the barrel? Thanks in advance for any help. By the way, it is a 2021 made revolver. I love you site and would love to meet you. Thanks again. Roger Helmers, East Berlin, Pa
I know of a guy that was down loading 35 rem for his contender, bullet stuck in the barrel and blew. I saw the gun, from the chamber end it split like a banana peel, even bent the scope tube.
I do not know, Detonation, chain fire, flask grenade I have never had one, seen one I do not doubt all those before me, Blackie it is a hard, bitter pill to swallow or wrap the head around. Knock on wood it has never paid me a visit I`d prefer it kept that way, Thanks to the videos I`ll have the knowledge on how to deal with when it happens. I am a Yeti I have a lot of yets to happen. I`d still prefer the unknown to me.
Come to yhink of it. Last summer i had a ruger blackhawk of all things blow up on me . It eas 45 colt and it all of a sudden let go and i was blessed i didnt loose any body parts or even minor injury.
Blackie, is there a safe way to unload a bp revolver with out shooting it? Especially interested in a method that may have been used in the 1800s. Cool vid by the way.
that will work...but what i usually do is un cap and screw a self-tapping screw in and pull the ball that way so i can save powder and cap and wads..the balls go into my remelt pile to be recycled as well..i will do a video on my way of pulling a ball very soon and post thanks for the comments and question..safe journeys
I m obsessed with bp, had a ball stuck at the mouth of the cylinder, didn't know how dangerous it can be, but something told inside my mind that the ball has to be seated on the powder, so I pushed it inside the cylinder with force, had I not done that....
There are differances between the truth and modern thought on most things ! It is almost unreal to think men carried a powderhorn tied around their neck ! Modern thought would equate that to carring a bomb around ! But in truth there is not a real problem ! Worse case scenario if the powder inside the powderhorn were somhow ignited you would have a event more akin to a fire than be blown to bits :) But in todays world you could not beat that fact into anyones brain ! There are good reasons why people are evolving backwards intellectually but that is a different story :)
Yes, I agree. And that's how I carry my powder is around my neck. Lol! I tried to explain why a cigarette that falls into gasoline. Only gets put out. And does not ignit the gas . Kids now days can't wrap there head around it. Once, or twice I had to show someone.
Thanks! The detonation going so fast and the bullet have no the time for accelartion from the cylinder and barrel. Rigth you say 2grain its more dangeros and 40 grain.🤠
As a kid I lit a black cat fire cracker. Y'all know the type that come strung to go off like a machine gun. I had undone them as Like a young boy. You can blow up alot of Hot Wheels Fire Ant beds and other things once you run-out of M80s Right I got to play with the 80s not the 60s. Course my best friend's Dad was a well digger and stump remover. So we played with blasting caps too lol. Anyhow I had ran out of the big bangs So I lit that itty bitty black cat. And dropped it into a empty coke can. It had a quick run fuse and before I could back away. It went off. That small charge lifted that can up and forced the rolled edge of the top into the bridge of my nose. Broke the hell out of it. Black powder is the thing that helped move mountains for the Rail Roads. Iv worked with it to remove stumps. I got lazy and bored one fall and split a truck load of wood with it and a half inch auger bit. And alot of fuse. Pack it lose and it'll fair up making smoke and noise Ffffffffffttt. Pack it tight and it'll take a Anvil and throw it across the yard. I'm older now and still have all my hands and fingers but I got a buddy who's past on now. He lost most of his left hand and his left eye to it. And to much Jack Daniels. The best thing to always use with it. In any amount. Is RESPECT. Like a motorcycle. Its setting there whispering. I'm gonna kill you if you let me.
@@BLACKIETHOMAS Hello Sir. I opted to not go with a Walker for the moment. I had the Remington New Army. Though I liked it. It just don't have the lines them Colts do. Now I got the Never Was Model 1851 Navy in 44. F.P. In Kit from Dixie Gun Works. Lord I sanded on that Brass so much. My arm thought I was hitting a second puberty. Sorry for the lewdness. But Im doing all the little tips you showed. The site window. Tore it down and addressed any burs. Even marked the The trigger springs screws position. I really want to thank you. You don't know how much I and I'm sure everyone else appreciate the videos you make. Your commitment to sharing what you know in Black Powder alone really shows how much you must love the subject. Then there's all the other subjects you show the same dedication in helping others out in those fields. Im a If I can't make it I may not need it kinda fellow. So I took a pair of old Ga Boots and made me a low slung holster that looks like the one the main actor in Hell On Wheels. Kept his Griswald in. It hangs well. And with the antique job I did on the pistol that's ageing nicely. I had to use Apple cider vinegar but it worked well. . The holster looks just as broke in and worn and will compliment the aged look of the Hog leg when it finishes it's getting old. That vinager method is to that pistol as a nagging wife is to a man. Both start looking worn and old long before they should. Idk if you have done this. But I made the nipple wrench. As per your video. But starting them by finger to insure I don't cross thread them is a bit of a pain. Then It struck me. The same thing you can do with a 1/4 inch fuel line to start Spark plugs and not cross thread them. Can be done with the nipples. Using a two or three inch length of either medical Oxygen line or the air line used in fish aquariums. The nipples cone slips in tight enough to start screwing it in. But lose enough if it's off and not starting right the tube just spins on the cone. I know you probably already figured this out years ago. But it's a both a Time saver and Pain in the tail end reliever. HAVE A GOODUN BROTHER
If you leave a space in the chamber it might cause a detonation. There is nothing in the chemistry of black powder that can become unstable. I am presently shooting some DuPont FFFg with a lot number back in the early '70's with no problems. To keep powder from clumping I would keep a drying agent in the keg of powder. Sorry Blackie I don't want to start a pi$$ing contest with you but I have shot DuPont, Custis and Harvey, Hodgdon, and a couple of odds and ends of European powders with never any problems. My first BP gun was an original Colt 1851 Navy (before Uberti) and I burned a lot of DuPont in it with no problem. Since BP is an explosive, not a flammable solid I will accept the small charge, big air space and ball scenario as perhaps a possible problem but I will keep on shooting my Gun Powder and making smoke and fire. Sir Elmer destroyed a .45 Colt single action by grinding powder as fine as flour and filling a case topped with a bullet "to see what would happen". He found out. Yr' Obt' Svt' Bunk Stagner
i have shot goex..dupont..red elephant..and homemade for 40yrs..i am fully in agreement with you..it is not the powders fault..the statement of it becoming more touchy due to heat ect..like i said..who knows..i only bring it up for those who do not seem to think twice about leaving powder of what ever make in a hot car trunk for weeks..dynamite left in hot for too long become touchy..to be safe i follow the ideas put forth by the manufacture..and to my knowledge none say its ok to store in such heat...thank you for the comment..safe journeys
i have had 15 pounds for nearly 20 as long as they are stored properly they are fine..but at 150 deg. in a hot trunk in the alabama sun...not a good idea
I'm new to cap and ball revolvers I bought a Uberti colt /walker .44. heard I can load max 60. But was told to use 50 grains what do you use to fill the gap up with?
Let me help with the link: ruclips.net/video/M3cHmmjct8U/видео.html // Also, wow, did you see his gun? Man, it just screams quality. Pedersoli, huh? Never heard of it before. I'm used to Pietta or Uberti. Hate to say it, but the look of the Pedersoli puts those to shame. They need to be sold in the USA more. However, from scrounging around a little, they seem pricy but I guess that's to be expected.
Thanks again for reply. ok then i understand longer gun barrel pressure etc better performance. but then now lol ill throw in a clip 1911 then no cylinder. im just not getting it im sorry. if you drilled through the cylinder different hammer. why seams the 1860 is higher quality the modern arm
Non uniform powder mixture. One round fizzles , another blows up. Sulphur charcoal and nitrate. Under the wrong conditions can leach nitro glicerein. we know what that does. I don't know where the glicerein comes from but it does.
hey blacky, before i got my new wedge, i had something happen that i'm now very curious about. when i loaded up my last cylinder at the gun range a few years ago, i slowly loaded less and less powder into each one till there was almost no powder in the last chamber. i didn't realize this, i wasn't paying attention, and it felt like only the cap fired on the last shot. now i can't be sure how much powder grains i really did have in the chamber, but it wasn't much, and it got me wondering if the caps are powerfull enough to push the ball all the way out the gun. what do u think? i thought about doing a field experiment with it.
with only cap you may get ball into barrel..with a few grains you run a risk of the airspace /detonation i have spoke of..if you want to see how little powder will propell a ball add..say 5 grains..then fill chamber with cream of wheat and load ball as normal..the cream of wheat will compress..and no dead air space..BUT!!!!! be prepared to drive a stuck ball out of the barrel..i would suggest loading only one chamber and then fire..repeat..leass chance a second shot would hit a stuck ball
I bought a pound of 777 about a month ago and I’m almost out of it already I’ve been shooting it a lot I got a 1851 navy 36 caliber 7.5 inch barrel made by pietta I like it a lot I want to get a 36 cal griswold but can’t find one so I’m gonna try to get a 1847 walker next
read the warning label on the can of powder..it states to avoid impact..the powder grains must be coated to avoid this..but over time and loose handling the grains can crack and crumble..and make dust that is
Hmmm, I hope the stars never line up right for me in this case. My guess would be smokeless and the folks it happened to would never admit it in a million years. At least not to witnesses at the range.
Thank you for reply. can you make a video though of bp vs conventional gp. my ? is still why can a brass cartridge then be fired no gun. Im not understanding. so cylinder is the cartridge. which is made of steal not brass. what am i missing? And what other period items where there. cause i been soldering since kid and the powder loader would of been easy cartridge conversion
yes in a black powder revolver the cyl..is the cartridge..a brass cartridge can be fired outside a gun but without the cyl to hold the pressure..the cartridge will go bang like a firecracker..the bullet will not go far
In my uneducated view, I believe when something lets go because of a week link like a bolt notch in the cylinder it's caused an explosion. I see a detonation as a shock wave caused by the murphy's law whatever, is a completely different situation. Two totally different things not to be confused with each other.Just my 2cents worth.
Black powder law. NEVER have an airspace when loading. You wind up with a pipe bomb. I loaded 4 boxes of 45 Long Colt ammo. First time loading with bp. Needless to say, after a few rounds, new I had a problem. I studied on this. I load 45 LC and 577/450 with black powder. Follow the rules kids.
in my exp. bp only gives good results when uniform compression is used..if you vary how hard you compress..the pressures vary too much and thus you get flyers
blackoracle69 would you recommend a compression gauge? I try to be consistent with my pressures. I go by feel. I want compression but not a total force of pressing the powder too hard. I've had good results. Now I have used Trail Boss on my 45's in my 44cal replacement cylinder. You know, to shoot long colt thru an 1860 Army repro. It works well but is pricy compared to the black powder.
i use a set of marks on my loadin rammer to get a repeatable seating of the balli have mentioned it before but i will do a video on it very soon..thanks for the question..safe journeys
blackoracle69 thanks man. Great idea. I will have to try that. Could you do a video on adjusting the hammer nose for height sighting? All these revolvers shoot way high. You may have already done this. I watch so much on BP shooting I loose track. I Dremel the notch a little at a time. Works great. I know you change the front sights out. I've seen you do that.
blackoracle69 oh, forgot. I reload for my Martini Henry hence the 577/450 rounds. They take 85 grains of BP and a lube cookie or I use 45cal lubed cork. You can pull them apart to get the size you want. Also use dry veggie wads and wax coated cardboard wads. To keep the powder dryer from the grease.
Nice idea. They are a little fragile and go to pieces easy so you need a good way to carry them. If pristine pellets it would help with consistency. Ram them down good if you use them just like BP.
It's a mystery because if the shooter KNEW that he had an obstruction in the gun, he wouldn't have fired it. See? And when he tries a charge of smokeless powder, because he just can't resist the temptation, and it blows up the gun, what are the chances that he'll admit his stupidity in violating ALL the rules, compared to the chances that he'll say, "Well there it is, the big mystery"?!! And if you can't cite a controlled demonstration of dropping the powder six inches and having it "detonate", and tell me how to set up the same experiment to get the same results, then stop bloody saying it.
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Blackie: There's a lot of buzz at my gun club about your videos on BP revolvers. The Civil War shooters are now often quoting you as the authority, and the range officer has recommended your videos to new black powder shooting members. Thank you and please keep up the good work. Hopefully we can see you shooting a Starr or maybe a Lemat soon.
i have quite a few videos left to do..thank you for the kind words..i spent many yrs learning the ways of the percussion revolver..and hope to share my knowledge ..safe journeys
I read Mike Venturino's account of that Colt blowing up years ago in American Handgunner. If I remember correctly it was made in 1914 and given to him sometime in the 1980's by Hank Williams Jr. I was almost sick just reading that. And in the pictures it looked like a nicely patina'd and well taken-care-of piece too. As someone who is foaming at the mouth to purchase a '61 Navy, I found this here video as another sobering reminder of why loading or reloading has to have one's absolute attention. Thanks for the great videos and stay safe, Blackie!
GLAD YOU FOUND IT OF USE
Thanks Blackie. You are the MAN on black powder revolver.
thank you..more videos to come..safe journeys
What kind of rifle do you carry.
depends on the situation..normal woods time i carry a short .20 ga..i also carry a navy arms henry rifle in 44-40 for deer hunting ..a .50 cal flintlock ..a 03"a3 30-06 for long range deer/hog..and a lever .22 on occasion for small game..really just what i am in the mood for at the time..thanks for the comment safe journeys
This was raw knowledge that could potentially save someones life and limb, and something that every honest shooter knows they have probably done when loading in a hurry or having attention diverted elsewhere, this is why I don't think gals in daisy dukes should be anywhere near the loading area, but then again I sure as heck ain't going to chase them off. Concentration and safety are one in the same, you cant have one without the other. Excellent video Blackie thanks for posting this. I hope someday you place all of your B.P. Revolver videos on a DVD and sell it, I have learned more watching you than in the 30 plus years I have been shooting reading about this, if someone watches one of your videos and don't learn something they did not watch or just cant or wont learn other than the hard way.
thank you sir..
Great video again. I follow Cap & Ball as well as Duelist1954 videos, both of which are excellent, but yours are by far the most comprehensive. Keep em' coming!
Good video. I've never seen a detonation in person, or know anybody that has has had one. The only ones I'm aware of have used smokeless powder by mistake. The one thing that does come to mind however, is just how thin the 1860 army is at the lock notch. From what I understand, the original colt 1860's had a stepped chamber, the repos are pretty much straight down, so the lock notch is paper thin. I'd bet on metal fatigue or micro crack in the metal around the notch. The 90 deg. cut doesn't help matters as it's a stress riser. Add a little corrosion on the inside of the chamber from improper or lack of cleaning, or maybe they milled just a bit too much metal off that one cylinder. Add in mystery soft steel the repos use (I've done some mill work on a few and they cut like mild steel) and it very easily can happen. One interesting note about the 1860 cartridge conversion is that it wasn't uncommon for the lock bolt to chip out in use, still had a brass case but it became very hard to remove. In fact, I'm surprised detonations don't happen more often. That said, I plan to keep shooting mine as long as I'm able.
very true..for a detonation to happen some rule had to have been broken..wrong powder../ air load..metal flaw..ect..all of then can be avoided with a little attention to detail..thanks for posting..safe journeys
Thanks Blackie .
I am a Cowboy Action Shooter .
I have loaded BP in Cartridge's. for years .
In the last year I have really got in to Cap and Ball guns .
I have a Gen 2 Colt 1860 .
and two Pietta Colt 1860 done by Coffinmaker.
and one Colt 1849 done by Goons .
Brother is addictive to shoot Cap guns .
I dont know what took me so long.
But I am in love with Open Top Cap Guns.
God Bless Brother .
Rooster .
i had a early repro of a cold 72 open top in .44 colt..loved it sad to say i had to let it go ..
Blacky, you're my new hobby.? all these guns I have a 45 years I've been doing what you said to do.!" with the Remington I gut the notch in the cylinder pen " with my dragoon t cut the notch in the back on the nipples so the release the gas!" you been keeping me up late at night busy.? thank you sir
glad you found it of use
Blackie, thank you for sharing your valuable knowledge of percussion revolvers. I am new to percussion revolvers so I am watching all your videos on the subject before I start shooting. I bought a Uberti 1851 London model and I am looking forward to shooting it.
Thanks again!
best of luck to you
A micro crack from manufacturing may take some time before it lets loose.
Alright. Another revolver video. I love these Blackie. Keep em coming man.
Thank you, Blackie.
After shooting many cylinders in a dirty gun even the inside of the cylinders gum up. I've poured in powder and it looks like you've got a full cylinder but it is sticking to the walls of the cylinder. It makes it look full or you are over filling the cylinder but you aren't. I've gotten in the habit of a light tap down with the rammer on the powder then patch, ram the patch down a little, then going to full pack down with the rammer over the ball. I have the Sheriffs with a stubby ram rod so a little extra shoulder needs to be put into it anyway to seat the ball. Reloading Cap and Ball guns is like fishing. Take the entire day and enjoy it. No need to see how fast you can drop lead down range if you make time for it.
Really enjoy your videos Blackie, seen 'em all👍🏼
Very educational!
Hi Blackie, thanks for the video, this subject was very interesting I have to admit I never gave detonation a thought until now.
Shooters must pay attention to what there doing every step of loading, thankfully my worst sin to date has just been dry balling.
Thanks again and looking forward to more.
"It can where you can drop it six inches and it will detonate." Citation needed.
Some years ago a contributor to the "Cowboy Chronicle" or "SHOOT!" magazine wrote an article that suggested that using a progressive press, a bullet stayed stuck to the seating stem of the seating die and managed to load two bullets into a case with x grains of powder. When fired, it blows the cylinder and cracks the barrel. That makes more sense than powder positioned near the base of the bullet.
Detonation in internal combustion engines is exactly how you explained it. I can see it happening! As far as looking I reloaded for 45 Colt in a Uberti SAA I had. Smokeless powder and that case DEMAND looking every time! Double charge is too simple to do! Also I always tilted the gun back EVERY TIME before shooting! I considered this MANDATORY! So your warning of looking is not lost on me.
The locking notch weak point is why high pressure cartridge revolvers like the .454 Casull have 5 chambers. An odd number makes the locking notch be between the chambers instead of on them
thank you a lots Blackie! a lots of informations❤
Both of my old BP Revolvers I remember back when I was loading them (1851 36cal and 1851 Sheriff 44cal) I always got the "pop" and then I slowly pressed in until I could not press any more. The Sheriff was harder because it had that stubby rammer. 1st I got the ball into the cylinder which was hard then crushed it down using my shoulders which wasn't as difficult. I believe you can compress a large volume of powder too much where you will not get a good burn and blow that what wasn't burned out the barrel wasting energy and powder.
I never thought about detonation. Used Pyrodex because that was all that was available and it was kept inside before going into a flask. Flasks did not sit in the sun. I always used too much powder due to ignorance (I was a kid with no reference back in the mid 80's). If anyone was going to hit the lottery and lose big time I had a pretty good chance at the time. I was also lucky I never got a squib load in the barrels. I shot a lot of rounds and was lucky.
IIRC, original BP 22lr was supposed to hold 4gr under the bullet. So filled to top of the case, it's probably got a 5gr volume.
Hows it going blackie, finally got me a batch of powder made last week and about 200 balls cast, got to go shoot it for the first time Wednesday, I'm definitely hooked
welcome to the club brother..safe journeys
Ok Blackie, thats it. I'm a long time follower and I think I suggested you have your own tv show,
but now I really think it's time. We all think your great and that you really know your Stuff.You have a lot to offer for the pro shooter and the Novice. Think about it. Safe Jurnies my Friend.
Scotty
thank you for your kind words
Great point! Use a separate powder measure is my rule.
Yes! Thank you!
I have a '51 Navy in Army caliber and one time i was out shooting it, practicing with it cause it's my carry gun (I'm under 21). I load 30 grains 3F Pyrodex with CCI number 11 caps which I've had inconsistencies with. I pulled the trigger and no *Bang* but a weird fizzle and a strange zinging noise. Man, I was scared! I took the thing apart and that ball was just there in the forcing cone. I think the powder got wet somehow but there was none left in the chamber so i assume it burned. But why didn't the ball even get into the barrel? Very weird.
I like your BP videos very much, but I think you missed the mark with this one.
BP will not burn any hotter/faster/more powerfully because there is "extra oxygen" in a chamber. Assuming a properly prepared mixture, BP is a carefully balanced chemical compound containing a precise mixture of fuel and oxidizer. It has enough oxidizer to enable the fuel to burn. This is why you could fire a gun in outer space or a vacuum on Earth, or in a container of inert gas. The fuel and oxidizer are bound together in the proper proportion, and adding more oxidizer cannot burn more fuel, or make it burn faster, because the chemical reaction would be out of balance.
Pressure within a given volume is not directional. It is evenly distributed. A partially filled chamber will experience equal pressure at all points within the chamber, not some massive unidirectional pressure spike in one direction.
A chamber that is less than full will effectively be a larger volume for the gas to expand into than a similar chamber that is packed full because the relative volume for the gas to expand into is greater. Imagine lighting one fire cracker in a soda can and one in a gallon can (made of the same material as the sida can.) Which one is more likely to burst? The one with the lesser volume for the gases to expand into.
Also, BP produces a fixed volume of gas for a given amount of powder. A smaller charge will produce less gas than a larger one, which means that it cannot physically produce as much pressure in the same sized chamber. Which makes the bigger bang, a firecracker or a cherry bomb (assume BP is the active ingredient in both.) The cherry bomb, because there is more of it.
I have heard other people also claim that there are "documented cases" of the explosions you describe, but, like you, they do not provide any documentation of these incidents. They seem more likely to be "documented" anecdotes. In fact, in many of your comments about these documented cases" you say, "I don't know" with regard to what happened.
If a laboratory cannot recreate the events no matter how hard they try, there is probably a simple reason; although, as with the "documented cases," no one presents any documentation of such efforts. Surely, a real laboratory would produce copius documentation of such experiments, and surely its results would be published for all to see.
You do mention two possible causes of such catastrophic failure that are within the realm of possibility: smokeless powder, and mechanical flaws.
I inherited a 44 Navy&new to black powder ball&cap been looking at your BP videos..glad your running them again my question is can u load the powder place the patch&pack it Then place the ball&pack it down to the patch to help keep it from having air pocket&blowing up? Thanx for all ya do man👍🤠
Great video. Thanks Blackie!
man that must be a mess the pants situation !!had a 38 go off just rupture that was bad enough stay safe brother
Can you tell me how is the front sight on a Pietta 1851 Navy attached to the barrel. Is it threaded, glued, or pressed to the barrel? Thanks in advance for any help. By the way, it is a 2021 made revolver. I love you site and would love to meet you. Thanks again. Roger Helmers, East Berlin, Pa
I've always believed the detonations in a percussion pistol come from the nipple end of the cylinder.
50 grain cubes and cut them down works good no hassle
I know of a guy that was down loading 35 rem for his contender, bullet stuck in the barrel and blew. I saw the gun, from the chamber end it split like a banana peel, even bent the scope tube.
Blackie would that mean that a percussion cap alone would send that ball 25 yards down range?
I do not know, Detonation, chain fire, flask grenade I have never had one, seen one I do not doubt all those before me, Blackie it is a hard, bitter pill to swallow or wrap the head around. Knock on wood it has never paid me a visit I`d prefer it kept that way, Thanks to the videos I`ll have the knowledge on how to deal with when it happens. I am a Yeti I have a lot of yets to happen. I`d still prefer the unknown to me.
Come to yhink of it. Last summer i had a ruger blackhawk of all things blow up on me . It eas 45 colt and it all of a sudden let go and i was blessed i didnt loose any body parts or even minor injury.
Blackie, is there a safe way to unload a bp revolver with out shooting it? Especially interested in a method that may have been used in the 1800s. Cool vid by the way.
that will work...but what i usually do is un cap and screw a self-tapping screw in and pull the ball that way so i can save powder and cap and wads..the balls go into my remelt pile to be recycled as well..i will do a video on my way of pulling a ball very soon and post thanks for the comments and question..safe journeys
i have a walker series filmed just got to edit it and post
i'll be watching. thanks.
If cannot pull the bullet, de-cap remove nipples, dump out powder and push wad and ball out from behind.
Outstanding
Now it makes sense why some shooters I know weigh each round of factory ammo 👍 Thanks for sharing 🙏🐺
I m obsessed with bp, had a ball stuck at the mouth of the cylinder, didn't know how dangerous it can be, but something told inside my mind that the ball has to be seated on the powder, so I pushed it inside the cylinder with force, had I not done that....
There are differances between the truth and modern thought on most things ! It is almost unreal to think men carried a powderhorn tied around their neck ! Modern thought would equate that to carring a bomb around ! But in truth there is not a real problem ! Worse case scenario if the powder inside the powderhorn were somhow ignited you would have a event more akin to a fire than be blown to bits :) But in todays world you could not beat that fact into anyones brain ! There are good reasons why people are evolving backwards intellectually but that is a different story :)
Yes, I agree. And that's how I carry my powder is around my neck. Lol!
I tried to explain why a cigarette that falls into gasoline. Only gets put out. And does not ignit the gas . Kids now days can't wrap there head around it. Once, or twice I had to show someone.
Thanks! The detonation going so fast and the bullet have no the time for accelartion from the cylinder and barrel.
Rigth you say 2grain its more dangeros and 40 grain.🤠
As a kid I lit a black cat fire cracker. Y'all know the type that come strung to go off like a machine gun. I had undone them as Like a young boy. You can blow up alot of Hot Wheels Fire Ant beds and other things once you run-out of M80s Right I got to play with the 80s not the 60s. Course my best friend's Dad was a well digger and stump remover. So we played with blasting caps too lol. Anyhow I had ran out of the big bangs So I lit that itty bitty black cat. And dropped it into a empty coke can. It had a quick run fuse and before I could back away. It went off. That small charge lifted that can up and forced the rolled edge of the top into the bridge of my nose. Broke the hell out of it. Black powder is the thing that helped move mountains for the Rail Roads. Iv worked with it to remove stumps. I got lazy and bored one fall and split a truck load of wood with it and a half inch auger bit. And alot of fuse. Pack it lose and it'll fair up making smoke and noise Ffffffffffttt. Pack it tight and it'll take a Anvil and throw it across the yard. I'm older now and still have all my hands and fingers but I got a buddy who's past on now. He lost most of his left hand and his left eye to it. And to much Jack Daniels. The best thing to always use with it. In any amount. Is RESPECT. Like a motorcycle. Its setting there whispering. I'm gonna kill you if you let me.
very true it will bite ya if it gets the chance
@@BLACKIETHOMAS Hello Sir. I opted to not go with a Walker for the moment. I had the Remington New Army. Though I liked it. It just don't have the lines them Colts do. Now I got the Never Was Model 1851 Navy in 44. F.P. In Kit from Dixie Gun Works. Lord I sanded on that Brass so much. My arm thought I was hitting a second puberty. Sorry for the lewdness. But Im doing all the little tips you showed. The site window. Tore it down and addressed any burs. Even marked the The trigger springs screws position. I really want to thank you. You don't know how much I and I'm sure everyone else appreciate the videos you make. Your commitment to sharing what you know in Black Powder alone really shows how much you must love the subject. Then there's all the other subjects you show the same dedication in helping others out in those fields. Im a If I can't make it I may not need it kinda fellow. So I took a pair of old Ga Boots and made me a low slung holster that looks like the one the main actor in Hell On Wheels. Kept his Griswald in. It hangs well. And with the antique job I did on the pistol that's ageing nicely. I had to use Apple cider vinegar but it worked well. . The holster looks just as broke in and worn and will compliment the aged look of the Hog leg when it finishes it's getting old. That vinager method is to that pistol as a nagging wife is to a man. Both start looking worn and old long before they should. Idk if you have done this. But I made the nipple wrench. As per your video. But starting them by finger to insure I don't cross thread them is a bit of a pain. Then It struck me. The same thing you can do with a 1/4 inch fuel line to start Spark plugs and not cross thread them. Can be done with the nipples. Using a two or three inch length of either medical Oxygen line or the air line used in fish aquariums. The nipples cone slips in tight enough to start screwing it in. But lose enough if it's off and not starting right the tube just spins on the cone. I know you probably already figured this out years ago. But it's a both a Time saver and Pain in the tail end reliever. HAVE A GOODUN BROTHER
If you leave a space in the chamber it might cause a detonation. There is nothing in the chemistry of black powder that can become unstable. I am presently shooting some DuPont FFFg with a lot number back in the early '70's with no problems. To keep powder from clumping I would keep a drying agent in the keg of powder. Sorry Blackie I don't want to start a pi$$ing contest with you but I have shot DuPont, Custis and Harvey, Hodgdon, and a couple of odds and ends of European powders with never any problems. My first BP gun was an original Colt 1851 Navy (before Uberti) and I burned a lot of DuPont in it with no problem. Since BP is an explosive, not a flammable solid I will accept the small charge, big air space and ball scenario as perhaps a possible problem but I will keep on shooting my Gun Powder and making smoke and fire. Sir Elmer destroyed a .45 Colt single action by grinding powder as fine as flour and filling a case topped with a bullet "to see what would happen". He found out.
Yr' Obt' Svt'
Bunk Stagner
i have shot goex..dupont..red elephant..and homemade for 40yrs..i am fully in agreement with you..it is not the powders fault..the statement of it becoming more touchy due to heat ect..like i said..who knows..i only bring it up for those who do not seem to think twice about leaving powder of what ever make in a hot car trunk for weeks..dynamite left in hot for too long become touchy..to be safe i follow the ideas put forth by the manufacture..and to my knowledge none say its ok to store in such heat...thank you for the comment..safe journeys
Holy cow. I've had pounds of powder for at least 5 years. I order a minimum of 5 pounds for the shipping costs.
i have had 15 pounds for nearly 20 as long as they are stored properly they are fine..but at 150 deg. in a hot trunk in the alabama sun...not a good idea
I'm new to cap and ball revolvers I bought a Uberti colt /walker .44. heard I can load max 60. But was told to use 50 grains what do you use to fill the gap up with?
Let me help with the link: ruclips.net/video/M3cHmmjct8U/видео.html // Also, wow, did you see his gun? Man, it just screams quality. Pedersoli, huh? Never heard of it before. I'm used to Pietta or Uberti. Hate to say it, but the look of the Pedersoli puts those to shame. They need to be sold in the USA more. However, from scrounging around a little, they seem pricy but I guess that's to be expected.
Thanks again for reply. ok then i understand longer gun barrel pressure etc better performance. but then now lol ill throw in a clip 1911 then no cylinder. im just not getting it im sorry. if you drilled through the cylinder different hammer. why seams the 1860 is higher quality the modern arm
Imma try out them low power loads :D
Im on 15gr now :3
Non uniform powder mixture.
One round fizzles , another blows up. Sulphur charcoal and nitrate. Under the wrong conditions can leach nitro glicerein. we know what that does. I don't know where the glicerein comes from but it does.
hey blacky, before i got my new wedge, i had something happen that i'm now very curious about. when i loaded up my last cylinder at the gun range a few years ago, i slowly loaded less and less powder into each one till there was almost no powder in the last chamber. i didn't realize this, i wasn't paying attention, and it felt like only the cap fired on the last shot. now i can't be sure how much powder grains i really did have in the chamber, but it wasn't much, and it got me wondering if the caps are powerfull enough to push the ball all the way out the gun. what do u think? i thought about doing a field experiment with it.
with only cap you may get ball into barrel..with a few grains you run a risk of the airspace /detonation i have spoke of..if you want to see how little powder will propell a ball add..say 5 grains..then fill chamber with cream of wheat and load ball as normal..the cream of wheat will compress..and no dead air space..BUT!!!!! be prepared to drive a stuck ball out of the barrel..i would suggest loading only one chamber and then fire..repeat..leass chance a second shot would hit a stuck ball
I bought a pound of 777 about a month ago and I’m almost out of it already I’ve been shooting it a lot I got a 1851 navy 36 caliber 7.5 inch barrel made by pietta I like it a lot I want to get a 36 cal griswold but can’t find one so I’m gonna try to get a 1847 walker next
Sounds like you went from 9mm to 454 Casull. LOL! Why was a Walker a cavalry gun? Because you needed a horse to carry it.
black powder isn't impact sensitive!do you know what black powder is composed of?
read the warning label on the can of powder..it states to avoid impact..the powder grains must be coated to avoid this..but over time and loose handling the grains can crack and crumble..and make dust that is
Ive watched videos time and again so please forgive me if its been addressed. A bullet goes goes in the barrel of modern gun when fired ?
Hi again Blackie. You forgot the link to cap&ball (the 2grain shot)
here ya go its 12 min into the video..safe journeys ruclips.net/video/M3cHmmjct8U/видео.html
Hmmm, I hope the stars never line up right for me in this case. My guess would be smokeless and the folks it happened to would never admit it in a million years. At least not to witnesses at the range.
Smart guy
In so many words ...it just happened
👍
Thank you for reply. can you make a video though of bp vs conventional gp. my ? is still why can a brass cartridge then be fired no gun. Im not understanding. so cylinder is the cartridge. which is made of steal not brass. what am i missing? And what other period items where there. cause i been soldering since kid and the powder loader would of been easy cartridge conversion
yes in a black powder revolver the cyl..is the cartridge..a brass cartridge can be fired outside a gun but without the cyl to hold the pressure..the cartridge will go bang like a firecracker..the bullet will not go far
In my uneducated view, I believe when something lets go because of a week link like a bolt notch in the cylinder it's caused an explosion. I see a detonation as a shock wave caused by the murphy's law whatever, is a completely different situation. Two totally different things not to be confused with each other.Just my 2cents worth.
true but if you look up the u s army studies on why artillery guns would blow themselves to bits with low charges..the term they used was detonation
Black powder law. NEVER have an airspace when loading. You wind up with a pipe bomb. I loaded 4 boxes of 45 Long Colt ammo. First time loading with bp. Needless to say, after a few rounds, new I had a problem. I studied on this. I load 45 LC and 577/450 with black powder. Follow the rules kids.
in my exp. bp only gives good results when uniform compression is used..if you vary how hard you compress..the pressures vary too much and thus you get flyers
blackoracle69 would you recommend a compression gauge? I try to be consistent with my pressures. I go by feel. I want compression but not a total force of pressing the powder too hard. I've had good results. Now I have used Trail Boss on my 45's in my 44cal replacement cylinder. You know, to shoot long colt thru an 1860 Army repro. It works well but is pricy compared to the black powder.
i use a set of marks on my loadin rammer to get a repeatable seating of the balli have mentioned it before but i will do a video on it very soon..thanks for the question..safe journeys
blackoracle69 thanks man. Great idea. I will have to try that. Could you do a video on adjusting the hammer nose for height sighting? All these revolvers shoot way high. You may have already done this. I watch so much on BP shooting I loose track. I Dremel the notch a little at a time. Works great. I know you change the front sights out. I've seen you do that.
blackoracle69 oh, forgot. I reload for my Martini Henry hence the 577/450 rounds. They take 85 grains of BP and a lube cookie or I use 45cal lubed cork. You can pull them apart to get the size you want. Also use dry veggie wads and wax coated cardboard wads. To keep the powder dryer from the grease.
A .22 Lr holds 5 grns
thank you i will make a note of it
What do you think of pyrodex pellets?
Nice idea. They are a little fragile and go to pieces easy so you need a good way to carry them. If pristine pellets it would help with consistency. Ram them down good if you use them just like BP.
Where's the link?
It's a mystery because if the shooter KNEW that he had an obstruction in the gun, he wouldn't have fired it. See?
And when he tries a charge of smokeless powder, because he just can't resist the temptation, and it blows up the gun, what are the chances that he'll admit his stupidity in violating ALL the rules, compared to the chances that he'll say, "Well there it is, the big mystery"?!!
And if you can't cite a controlled demonstration of dropping the powder six inches and having it "detonate", and tell me how to set up the same experiment to get the same results, then stop bloody saying it.
RULE NUMB 1 DON:T BE A DUMB ASS! I LUV MY 50SHARPS BLK SINGLE SHOT! BEEN POPPING BAD ASS ROUNDS SINCE 1980 BUFFS HOGS YA RABBITS MY FAV VAPORIZED OVERKILL PISS ME OFF EVERYTIME
hi, does having a brass trigger guard and brass grip frame make a gun less durable?
actually it makes it more since back in the day a steel triggerguard and back strap might rust and weaken
thanks
I personally think its people double charging and not realizing it or they have a squib and don't realize it
I think the squib scenario happens A LOT