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The Hard Truth: What NATO Had Really Promised Moscow About Expansion After the USSR Collapsed
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- Опубликовано: 17 авг 2024
- Russia has cited NATO expansion as being one of the key reasons that invading Ukraine was “necessary” - to preserve Russia’s national security interests.
Gary Tabach @garyyuritabach9560, who was NATO’s man in Moscow, lays out why Russia is repeating a lie: There was never not only not an agreement to not expand NATO during the post-Soviet period. Rather, NATO was struggling to find reasons to not close-up shop - as Russia had ceased to be a threat.
In fact, it is thanks to Putin that NATO has continued to expand.
Gary Tabach was born in Moscow, USSR and lived there until 1976 when his family immigrated to the USA where he went on to become the first Soviet born citizen commissioned as an officer in the US Armed Forces.
Among many roles in the Navy, Tabach was assigned to the Department of State as Adviser to US Ambassador and Special Presidential Envoy to the USSR and later at the US Embassy Moscow.
He organized hostage releases in Georgia before being assigned to the US Embassy Almaty, before being sent back to the American Embassy in Moscow.
Finally, Tabach was Dean of International Staff, Center of Excellence - Defense Against Terrorism, Ankara, Turkey before taking over as Chief of Staff, NATO Military Liaison Mission Moscow, Russia.
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Russia, Britain and US signed an agreement insuring the security of Ukraine when Ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons post Soviet Union; Britain and America has an obligation to defend Ukraine from Russian aggression.
The Budapest Memorandum. It guaranteed Ukraine’s political independence, sovereignty and territorial integrity. US and UK I’m pleased to see are upholding their part of the bargain.
People that have believed even a single excuse from Putin for this war are simpletons. They cannot think for themselves and usually have some type of imagined grudge against the USA so they open their ignorant mouths and preach the Pooty line. Simpletons.
@@marymarlow3646 Bill Clinton has apologized to Ukraine formally for his part in the Budapest Memorandum because he saw what happened next and worse over time. My suggestion is that you do some research but you'll have to dig deep because the US has appeased Putin and used Ukraine to do it and they don't want it widely known. Even prior to 2014 the US has used its power to demilitarize Ukraine. Former President Barack Obama's successful efforts to disarm Ukraine in 2005 gave him foreign relations credentials because his ultimate goal was always to run for president. As a new member of the Senate he and Senator Nunn in 2005 extended the Cooperative Threat Reduction Act to include artillery, small arms, anti-aircraft weapons, and conventional munitions. Obama secured $48 million to destroy 400,000 small arms, 1,000 anti aircraft missiles and more than 15 thousand tons of ammunition. Yushchenko, Ukraine's President at the time, not being a fool, sold it all rather than melt it down.
Then came 2014, the annexation of Crimea and the war in the Donbas and the US's biggest concern was the fact that Ukraine had a successful $1.9 Billion dollar defense industry. The combined west but mostly the US, working in partnership with Russia of all countries, who used to be a customer of Ukraine to the tune of 30%, agreed that the industry could lead Ukraine to be a rogue state and forced them to give up their arms industry in favor of more peaceful pursuits. Guess who their two biggest customers were, Pakistan and India were on the list and guess who then sold arms to these two countries the US of course. That tanked the Ukrainian economy because it put 250,000 scientists and engineers, not even counting the grunts who packaged the outgoing munitions, into unemployment. The US and the West has been appeasing Putin and sacrificing Ukraine just like the British did with Czechoslovakia in WW ll. That is what the US, Britain, the EU and NATO did to Ukraine. I keep telling the Ukrainians in their own language to NOT TRUST THE US. Although I don't think they need any reminders.
Absolutely!
NATO does not expand, NATO attracts.
*NATO does not expand, NATO decomposed.
@@hermanndercherusker4074 NATO attracts naive and idiot leftists.
An extraordinary post! I've never seen so few words express so much. Well done!
Superb observation on NATO...!
@@hermanndercherusker4074 Far from the truth - thats what stupid Trump wanted.
Futile discussion about promises. Russia also promised not to invade Ukraine. Russia has also invaded Poland, Finland, Moldova, Georgia, Chechnya etc. nato wasn’t created in order to invade Russia, but to defend Europe from further Russian invasions.
Russophobia is no substitute for diplomacy. I will tell you this for certain: if Russia doesn't get what it wants there WILL be nuclear war. That is what will happen unless ethnic Russians in the Donbas are protected and unless Ukraine stays out of NATO.
There is a difference between the understanding that Nato should not actively search for new members - an understanding, not a treaty - and not refusing applicants that come on their own initiative. An issue to consider is also that Russia has created frozen conflicts so as to make nations ineligible for Nato membership as soon as they started applying, example: Geordia.
@@digilyd Russia is not a secial need baby. It is not a super power. It is cheap gas station and its time of glory is over. World moved on. Russia is stucked in the past and loves playing the victim card. Russia must look in the mirror.
@@johnwebster5005 Russian nukes are as poor as russian army in Ukraine and Russia is neither super power nor a special need baby to demand anything. Putin uses bs excuses simply to annex.
I get your the guy to read history lessons then become that paranoid type constantly talking about how the commies will rise and take away our freedom. Get a grip man..
The problem has never really been about NATO expansion for Russia. The problem is that NATO represents democratic governments with respect for its own people and their rights, and that’s what the Russian regime fears. Once surrounded by democratic countries, there is a real possibility that the people of Russia might actually demand that for themselves…..we live in hope on that one though
This is so true! Head of FSB in Moscow said exactaly that. And they are so arrogant; Ukraine isnt a country for them. Despite the corruption and arrogance they really believed in their own lies.
People in Donbass really belives, they are liberating, they fail to see that the invasion bring this to them at 2014
Nato expansion is only bs excuse for Putin to do the same thng as always in Russia's history. Russia loves invading and annexing its smaller and powerless neighbours just because it can and everytime it can. If Russia was a good neighbour, many former Warsaw pact countries would have no need to join Nato to be secured. Being Warsaw act memeber was made by force. Eastern Euroeans did not ask for it. utin knows he can not face article 5 of Nato. Putin does not consider Ukraine to be a real state, he calls Ukrainians "little Russians", he does not want Ukraine to exist. If Ukraine had been in Nato, he would have never invaded it. If Baltic States had not been in Nato, he would have inveded them as well. It is about Putin's ego. Nato is bs excuse. Who is Russia to demand anything from Eastern Europeans? Eastern Euroe is not soviet backyard anymore. Russia is cheap gas station which can not stand its time of glory is over? Russia had no reason. Putin is paranoid sick mind. Putin needs excuses.
Russians are too thick for democracy.......they need Politburo instructions to use their sad-arsed outdoor toilet.
It's also about power. The Russian oligarchy holds sway in Eastern Europe through corruption. EU membership means that corruption will be curtailed. NATO membership means an invasion is no longer an option. Russia sees Eastern Europe as their colonies, that's the real problem.
@@ventsyv Eastern Europe moved on long time ago. Russians are the only one not to undestand it yet. Many former Warsaw pact countries are both EU and Nato members today. if Baltic States had not been in Nato, Putin would have invaded them as well. Latvia, Lithiania and Estonia were once smalle pieces of USSR. These were soviet republics, the same as Ukraine or Belarus. I am sure Putin would use "protecting Russians" excuse to invade and annex. He wants USSR glory back.
Expansion or not, each country have rights to their sovergnity .. that’s problem! Russia need to be educated about respect each country of their own sovergnity !!
Russia's fears of NATO's so-called "expansion" are mostly due to their mentality of primitive revengism and actual memory of what they have done to us east Europeans, Balts, and Finns. Their logic is: "I attacked you and colonized you many times in history, brutalized your people, tried to destroy your culture, therefore, if and when you get stronger, you will certainly try to attack and colonize me as a revenge. The only way for me to prevent it is to ensure that you are always weaker than me and have no support guarantees from anyone stronger than me, and, best if you always remain directly or indirectly in my sphere of influence". This is a mentality of a hitman always looking behind his back, scared that the children of those he murdered will get him. The point is, we don't really want to do anything to him, just keep him in a cage, disarmed, without his weapons. And we will not rest until this happens. Especially, after Putin's excesses.
The Kremlin reminds me of a Columbian Drug Cartel 😂
With nukes
That’s exactly what Kremlin is. And mix that with a terrorist group and you are getting close to the truth of Putin & co.
They are much much worse.
Because the government try to tell you that there sanctions against them works, while they running great business? 😅 That is true.
@@hermanndercherusker4074 what great business are they running? Lol
Then again, sovereign countries should be allowed to dictate their own direction for the future.
Sovereign countries cannot singlehandedly decide to be a member of the NATO, EU or other trade blocks for example. They need to be accepted.
finally someone where i see myself 100%...yep...lets see the papers.
@@Pierluigi_Di_LorenzoTrue. But that being said you can’t blame all of these countries for wanting to be a part of NATO considering how Russian’s Iron Curtain was like, and how they have a history of invading of their neighbors: Finland, Georgia, Chechnya, and now Ukraine.
@@Pierluigi_Di_Lorenzo You mean that some countries should accept to play the role as a buffert between the imperiums? 🤔 Or in other words: we have the right to use them as such?
@@mattias5157 No, I mean countries that don't fit the requirements (e. g. corruption, democracy, rule of law, product standards, subsidies) can be as sovereign as they like, but they will not be accepted.
Very interesting interview thank you👍. Slava Ukraine🇺🇦💪🇺🇦💯🇺🇦
"Slava Nazi 🇺🇦💪🇺🇦💯🇺🇦 "... ?
This guy make one good point - russia works in EU favor (+and vice versa). The money flows and the only one who suffer are common ppl. Wake up.
Promises aren't worth the paper they are not written on.
It was not even written down. It was bs small tak behind the scene and is is only bs excuse for utin to invade and annex Ukraine. Putin blames Russia's victims for calling the police.
Unfortunately the Real truth can be a fickle bitch for Russian truth!! Slava Ukraine
🇺🇸🌎🌍❤️🇺🇦
Gorbachev said there was no such agreement.
That is correct. If Gorby said it didn’t happen it didn’t happy.
God bless Ukrainian ❤
and Bandera? I think Melnyk would agree with it 🤔
Go Ukraine-beat Russia. I am an American of Polish descent.
Nah, you do not have understand it yet. Russia had to defeat Ukraine, until they merge with Poland and become Ukropol. That is the way; good polish ppl know that 😜It is a half serious joke, because in fact there are rumors about those plans. This way poland get undeserved even more land, like always. Futur will tell us, if I just troll you or if I am a clairvoyant.
Ukraine beat the poles instead
Very impressive interview.
Gary Tabach is full of knowledge.
100 % RIGHT ON!!!
Support Kaliningrad's independence and entry into NATO.
If the Russian Federation breaks up I’m sure Kaliningrad/Koingsburg will join the west. Kind of a big IF, but here’s hoping.
Kaliningrad is pain in the ass. We do not need it.
While there still is a large part of the population that still feels connected to Russia and it's political scene, I doubt they can even hope to become part of the EU or NATO.
We have seen the problems in the Baltic states with Russia alligned citizens.
@@xFD2x I agree but wouldn't it be a nice and fitting end to Putin and his gangsters.
Yes, this was a thought until Poopin invaded Ukraine
Thank you for a very interesting programmes, busting another Russian lie.
Slava Ukraine
Thanks for clarifying this sir 🙏🏾🇺🇦
@KyivPost
Excellent interview. I agree with the Navyman, fellow Vet (US Army) on most of what he said. Obviously, he has more information, experience on, about the former Soviet Union (Thank God it is gone) and the current Russia and future Russia under more and more Soviet Style government. Again, nonetheless, excellent interview.
It was never promised , because we never thought the USSR would break up ...
It never happened 🇬🇧
Nato expansion is bs excuse for Putin. Russia loves annexing its neighbours just because it can.
The 1994 Budapest Memorandum gave Ukraine security assurances whereby the signatory countries committed to respect the independence and sovereignty and the existing borders of Ukraine for giving up the third-largest nuclear stock pile in the world. Ukraine got railroaded by the ambiguity of the term assurances since it was not defined in detail. Putler has exploited this and reacted on the outcome of the 2014 election in Ukraine by testing the waters on how far the US, UK, France and China are willing to commit to those assurances by annexing Crimea and instigating aggressions in eastern Ukraine. As calculated by Putin, the lackluster of response by the four signatories for fear of getting dragged into a direct confrontation with Russia was limited to endless diplomacy talk, financing, small military aid and training but excluded a no-fly zone which eventually led to the downing of the Dutch passenger plane by a Russian missile over the Donbass region. In addition, Putin had managed to manipulated the views on Putin's Russia and garnered pro-Russian sympathies by politicians in Germany, France Italy and the UK and key Republican political actors in the US such as, to name a few, Rudy Gulliani, Gen. Flynn, Paul Manaford and presidential candidate and russophile Donald Trump as another important election for 2016 was gearing up. It was Putin's highest of importance that Hillary Clinton will not be elected. I still like to know what was talked about behind closed doors in Helsinki.
Another aspect often left out in the conversation is that Russia did not only violate it's own international signed treaties but also threaten the Nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty by continuously blackmailing the world with nuclear war if his demands are not met and risking the possibility of rearmament of Belarus and Kazakhstan with nuclear arms. Both countries where part of the Budapest Memorandum as well, but ended up as vassal states to Russia.
Thanks to the Kyiv Post for a great series of interviews and Gary Tabach for his service and expertise.
Sláva Ukrayíni! Heróyam sláva! 🇺🇦
Very accurately told contemporary history. One small note: MH17 was a Malaysian airliner. Of the 298 victims there were 196 Dutch passengers.
Absolutely agree! Ukraine got screwed by the term "assurance" instead of "guaranteed".
I saw Clinton expressing his remorse that they didn't guarantee security. Russia was one of the promises.
@@Calligraphybooster Thanks for the correction. I didn't do the research on it but remember a 60 Minute episode on the Dutch investigation on this matter.
Two Russian Errors:
1. Russia (as per Lavrov) claims that the 2013 uprising invalidated the Budapest Memorandum. They do not understand the definition of "sovereignty". What happens politically within Ukraine is none of Russia's business. Russia does not get to select who is president.
2. Putin claims that Ukraine does not exist. But in 1994 when it was to Russia's advantage to disarm a neighboring country of it nuclear weapons, Russia signed an international agreement recognizing the sovereignty of that country along with the borders that existed at that time.
Thank you so much for the thorough explanation. I knew this but these details made it a lot clearer
What a nice voice he has and interesting points made
1976? Governments change. Therefore the commitments change over time
International agreements are usually public and are available for anyone to see.
Even if that where true, the broke the security guarantees that they promised Ukraine when they gave up nukes
I understood American diplomats promised this to Russian diplomats, when discussing the unification of Germany but this promise never made it into the final agreement
Putin just don’t want us to let ru
Ssian people know there is a thing called freedom of press lol,people can think for them self.
Because of that scared little boy
I think governments only keep agreements if there is some benefit for them. Once that benefit is no longer useful good bye agreement.
Interestingly there is this here guarantee for Ukraines safety and borders that was issued as recompense when Ukraine gave all the nukes on their turf to the Russian Federation. It tends to elude attention, but the arms support now is simply to stand by it and deliver on the promises made. And interesting, while Russia is quite good at using frozen conflicts as a tool to keep nations out of Nato, there is the open point to consider that a Nato membership for Ukraine may also just constitute delivering security as promised, which is to say that it is beyond reproach by anybody.
👍👍👍
Ukraine will be inspirational for many countries I think and a very good EU. member, once the war is over and Ukraine has managed to re-build it will become quite prosperous, and a very strong member of NATO. like Poland is today.
Slava Ukraine! 💙💛 Glory to the heroes🎖
Great segment, but the idea that NATO needs Ukraine more than Ukraine needs NATO at 7:00 is pure silliness.
The U.S. created the European Deterrence Initiative in 2014 and became the supplier of 90% of all foreign defense, intelligence, and security aid, as well as becoming the number one military trainer for Ukraine since that time.
NATO, the U.S. and Ukraine stand strong together -- but they aren't relative equals by any measure.
Gorbachev himself said there was no such agreement not to expand Nato beyond the 1990 borders. Only informal discussion. Any decision to join Nato was based on individual countries and their security concerns, of which there were obviously many.
So much better than Alexander Vindman!
Geaorgetown National Archives.
Every country who feel scared of being invaded by Russia should join NATO , that’s why NATO is created.
The more countries united the stronger NATO become.
🇺🇦🇺🇦🇺🇦✌🇺🇦🇺🇦🇺🇦
Well it did not help invading Ukraine, but having the brain located beneath the hips it is not strange if Putin acted this way.
I think NATO should join Ukraine soon too!! :-) Slava Ukraini!!!
At time 2:20 "in 2008, there was a question, 'What is the use of NATO, russia is not aggressive'"
Unfortunately that did not last. There is an expectation that more armed conflict into Poland if nothing stopped the dictator in russia from marching across Ukraine to Poland.
The MOST IMPORTANT quality in any stable, civilized country is *_THE ABILITY TO FIRE THE LEADER_* and russia LOST THAT ability.
As soon as that was lost, russia began a new nosedive into irrelevancy and doom. It will be 20, 30 years before that country will be trusted.
They need to FIRMLY, permanently restore the ability TO FIRE THE LEADER.
The rest of the world calls "firing the leader" two things:
1) free and fair elections
2) term limits
Right now, having their latest dictator has ruined russia and hundreds of thousands of people have perished because of that dictator and his desire to steal the property of the neighbor
.
Another aspect which makes Putin's claim unrealistic is that NATO member would never UNILATERALLY give Russia such a large concession.
At a minimum, NATO members would curtail expansion PROVIDING that Russia adhere to some specified conditions, such as not attempting to annex territories, agreeing to arms reduction, pulling forces back from borders, allowing for inspections, etc.
See it on paper
Russia’s security needs have been met ever since they tested their first atomic weapon in 1949. Despite their many invasions of neighboring countries, not a single nation has invaded them in the last 74 years. Their invasion of Ukraine was never about NATO or Russia’s security, it was always about Russia’s ego and grandiosity.
Russia's ego!!Of course it was,and,still is. In fact, the ego in question, is like the ego of a school yard bully,who in reality is a devout coward. i.e. Putin.🟦🟨🟦🟨
Please don't confuse NATO with any of their member-states.
All my life I was taught Ukraine (by my Ukrainian family) sought freedom and independence from ALL imperial powers . Now Ukraine wants to join EU and NATO???? If Ukrainians were allowed to nuclear arm, allowed to travel to Europe visa free and its workers invited to work, this war would never have started. Ukraine had to wait 6 months to vote Yanukovich out!!!
Those out of control hand gestures are so distracting.
He should practice by sitting on his hands during interviews until he can get them under control.
What is the number of square meters of Putinstan that NATO has invaded? Hint: the number is less than one.
It was an understanding or more accurately a mis-understanding. Real problem is autocracy can't compete with democracy even when the democracy is dire. Trump will always beat a Putin.
The same Trump that wants to end democracy in the US?
Yes maybe Ukraine can protect NATO.
😅 ...
Even if so, nato didn’t expand to the east, even if Ukraine were a member, nato would still not have expanded to east. The most eastern part of nato would still be the east of Turkey. The same as before this so-called promise was made… 🤡😜
There is no treaty or written agreement. But there were intentions. See 'NATO did not keep its word - Deceived the Russians' on YT. BTW, I don't agree with the title of that video.
What about Russian-Ukrainian Friendship Treaty signed 1997 and Budapest Memorandum, they were more than intentions, still did not stop Russia to breach them violently?
@@joeordinary209 Absolutely.
NATO is not an entity that decides to not expand. It accepts applications from sovereign nations that desire protection from countries such as Russia. If Russia did not threaten others, NATO would not exist. The only deception is from Russia
Why should we always care what Russia wants? Is Russia a secial need baby or Eastern Europe's master? Bs small talk did not matter. What did matter was Eastern Europeans and their will to be secured. Cheap gas station of Russia is not the one to decide about other country's pact choices.
31 cowardly camps gathered because they are afraid of Russia.
It is called own experience, don't you think?
@@Blanka1100 what experience? 30 NATO countries bombed the Yugoslavs. 30 NATO countries bombed Iraq. 30 NATO countries bombed a wedding in Afghanistan ... Libya and Syria were bathed in kroi.
@@russischruslan4497 I am not even sorry for Talibs or Milosevic. Nato is not annexing. Besides, what kind of whatboutism, what kind of logic is that? Is 300 years of lackof freedom, geocine, rapes and communism s not enough for Eastern Europeans? Stop looking for fake justification for Russia's crimes.
With good reason to be afraid.
@@robertmiskey5502 why weren't you afraid when america bombed the peaceful cities of kosovo and iraq or when they bombed peaceful weddings in afghanistan? or was there a reason?
Bull$hit
Why usa complain when russia was in cuba 1962 cuba can do what ever want 7:29
So, you dont keep your word (you lie) ?
This expert gets his reports from mass media
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In 2008 the relationship was not good between Russia and the West, so much so that Putin had had enough of NATO pushing eastward to go to war in Georgia that year. To the Russians the statements of James Baker to Gorbachev and subsequently conversations between Yeltsin and Clinton further muddied the waters. This is a point of contention between scholars as well as politicians to this day so I don’t know how to take this guy. It is clear that there was a time when the EU, NATO and Russia could have been United with the help of true statesmanship which unfortunately was and is sorely lacking. This is a political failure clearly. Monday morning quarterbacking by guys like this continues to ignore substantive issues that would be helpful if properly addressed.
Congratulations, you've been played. NATO never was and is not a threat to Russia as long as it stays in its own borders. But Russia's very clear desire to expand those borders is why those neighboring countries were desperate to have NATO's protection. There was NEVER a formal agreement to limit NATO's expansion. But do you have enough time to discuss all the formal agreements Russia has violated?
@@kkpenney444 I do have time. You’ve definitely drunk the Kool-Aid. Pointing out Russia’s failure to live by international agreements and not stay within it’s borders is about as pointless as pointing out the United States, (My Country), not living up to those same standards in invasions in places like, say ohhh, Iraq for weapons of Imaginary destruction. This, of course, is and was a violation of the U.N. Charter or maybe you never thought it strange that 17 Saudis and 3 Moroccans attacked the World Trade Center and Pentagon and so logically we of course attacked Iraq. Or maybe we should be arguing about using mercenary groups such as Wagner to that of Blackwater…I could go on but I get the feeling that would be pointless with you. And thank you for the congratulations! Right back at ya
Did you ask yourself why so many Russia's neighbours and former satelite states, Warsaw pact members joined Nato with their own free will as quicly as they could? I will give you a clue. It s called own experience with criminal state of Russia over the centuries. Russia is not a special need baby to demand anything. Nato expansion is bs excuse. Russia simlu has always been invading and annexing its neighbours just because it could. Eastern Euroeans are free eople, they moved on long time ago. Russia is not their master. It was never about Nato. Putin has always wanted Ukraine to be a part of Russia. He blames his victims for calling the police.
How smart is Gari.
Ukraine is a perfect partner to join NATO compared to Turkey or Hungary.
Hungary joined Nato in 1999, together with Poland and Chech Reublic
@@Blanka1100 Yes I realize that. But I think Ukraine will be more trustworthy as a parter in Nato than Hungary or Turkey.
@@johndon7384
If it needs be, we can always form a NATO-2 without Hungary and Turkey.
Can be done in just a few weeks.
Gorbachev continued that “The agreement on a final settlement with Germany said that no new military structures would be created in the eastern part of the country; no additional troops would be deployed; no weapons of mass destruction would be placed there. It has been obeyed all these years.” To be sure, the former Soviet president criticized NATO enlargement and called it a violation of the spirit of the assurances given Moscow in 1990, but he made clear there was no promise regarding broader enlargement.
Let’s be clear NATO requires interoperability, this bluntly means everyone must buy USA weapons. I worry Ukraine has to spend its budget on weapons it may never had needed to buy IF it remained neutral and independent but the EU bullied them by saying it’s people can travel or work in the EU unless Ukraine joined the EU and USA knew that a revolution in Ukraine would cause instability that would then require Ukraine to join NATO
@@buddyrojek9417 If your country bordrs Russia, neutrality is pure utopia and invitation for Russia to invade you.
@@buddyrojek9417 clearly you have no idea what1s going on in Ukraine... im from Hungary, i gave my flat to refugees.... there is no way to be neutral against ruSSia... You are a slave of them or you going to be killed just like, Georgie, Chechya etc..
@@buddyrojek9417 Ukraine had a referendum in 2013. they said they wants to join the EU. That's when all started...90% of the population wanted to join the EU...You can check this very easily
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