It's about getting people interested in coming to the movies. Wolverine is your #1 draw. If you don't put him in it, you're sabotaging the writers and the producers would have totally failed. It isn't the writers job to get people to go to the movies. It's their job to write the best script possible.
@Gus_Magnus John is not concerned about real fans, he's worried about normies with shit taste who think wolverine is hot shit when he's an insect among the xmen roster. My solution to this problem is to include wolverine but sideline him like xmen 97, and at the end, show the audience his place, a twig among gods.
I believe the actual question should be will wolverine be the main character as opposed to having wolverine or not in xmen. Obviously u have to have wolverine.
Whether or not Wolverine is in it should depend COMPLETELY on the story being told. The beauty of the Xmen comics were that no one character was ever the main focus. They used to come in and out, some characters were more essential to certain stories and that’s what made Xmen beautiful to me growing up.
I think if they come with Wolverine upfront then the lead-in to the movie will be completely dominated by the 'new Wolverine actor' discourse, so I could see them taking some time to establish the X-Men first before getting to Wolverine for that reason. Plus, if you establish the MCU approach to X-Men first then a Wolverine that is different from Jackman might go over better too. But yeah, if it was my money I'd start with Wolverine as well.
I think it’s fine if Wolverine there from the beginning. But, just like 97, he should be relegated to a supporting role for the MCU. The focus should be on Cyclops and Jean. Primarily Scott since he’s the team leader, he believes in Xavier’s dream. He’s the Captain America of the X-Men. But, equal focus should be on Storm, Beast, Rogue and Gambit. Characters who have appeared, but have rarely gotten a chance to shine. Not just in with their powers, but storytelling as well.
I'd do a little bait and switch. Cyclops solo movie, then a Weapon+ and Weapon× introduction in another project. Hint at/introduce Wolverine as a plot arc in X-Men film/other project, no solo, no main focus but a 'Hulk-like' secondary character. Put the emotional and character weight on Scott. Would work for the rising tension with Sinister.
i love comparing the mcu to pro wrestling because that’s the perfect example of how to keep the storylines fresh and interesting as it evolves over time. kevin feige should look at what is being done in the wwe right now as the way to balance their characters.
For the last 10 plus years I don’t think marvels MCU has put much focus on popular characters and they been putting more focus on characters people might not know much about so I can see the doing the first X-men team and do a solo Wolverine movie like the comics did maybe by the second X-men movie Wolverine will join the X-men team
The X men name will make it a billion dollar movie with or without Wolverine. I would consider the 2nd X men movie to be perfect for either a solo Wolverine movie or perhaps make him the villain before he join them. Maybe even start with a Wolverine movie. They are going to put out multiple movies a year ... There will be time Remember this is a UNIVERSE.... you're supposed to build towards large group movies. I say they should start Storm off in her own movie prior to joining. They didn't just start with the AVENGERS. They started with Iron Man and Thor and Cap. B and C level marvel characters. Starting the x men with them all together limits the franchise from being able to grow into a universe. That's part of the problem with the first X-Men movies.
Having Wolverine there or not was never the problem. They just need to allow other characters to shine the way they should. Fox were so stuck on putting him front and centre it started to frustrate me personally. In the comics and cartoons he actually adds a good dynamic to the team especially when he butts heads with Cyclops and Gambit.
I say hell yeah you can start X-Men without Wolverine! That's the route they went with First Class and it worked regardless of how the franchise turned out. He's not even the leader of the team and works just as well in a solo story. Not that he isn't important because he certainly is, but Wolverine does not have to be front and center of the X-Men.
The first X-men team in the 60s never had Wolverine...Of course they could start the new team off without Logan. The X-Men is a team book/movie. Yes, they center on certain characters every now and then, and some are more popular than others, but over all it's about the team, not any individual.
In my opinion you don't need Wolverine to have a successful X-Men movie, but with the exception of Deadpool, I believe Wolverine is the only X-Man that can have a successful standalone film. I'm not saying they can't be good to great. I'm saying they can't be successful. None of them are close to as big of a name as Wolverine
I think the MCU X-men can and should start without Wolverine. While the character is a huge draw with the fans i think the heart and soul of the group starts with Prof X and Magneto. Just like the Infinity Saga revolved mainly aroind Tony and Cap. It would be fun to see a series of films lead up to 'the big good guy' instead of a 'big bad guy' for a change.
the mcu could reestablish what the x men are to main universe, and they could focus on Scott and jean relationship. the first x men movie could have professor x, cyclops, marvel girl, beast, angel, storm, jubilee, and rouge. the problem is wolverine has stolen the spotlight from the other members of the team for 25 years so let's see him avoided for 3 movies. the mainstream audience has for the most part seen the fox movies so wolverine would be the most popular but the people who watch the animated shows or comics love the whole team. Mr. sinister could be build up in the trilogy as the main villain obsessed with jean and Scott. x men 2 could introduce gambit and ice man. x men 2 could have the x men go to the savage lands to recruit ka Sar and zebu with Mr. sinister using Sauron as the villain to fight the x men. gambit could be introduced as a villain sent by Mr. sinister to destroy the x men from the inside in x men 2. iceman could be a new member introduced in x men 2. gambit could change sides in the end of the movie joining the x men. angel could be turned into arch angel in the third movie by Mr. sinister to fight against the x men. apocalypse could be teased in x men 2 and x men 3. beast could leave to join Soward in the end of x men 3. jubilee could have turned 18 by the end of x men 3 and leave to be a hero own term. angel could be on a journey of redemption at the end of x men 3 not under Mr. sinsters influence anymore leaving the x men as arch angel. x men 4 could introduce wolverine, colossus, and shadow cat with magneto possibly being the main villain. idk still would not put wolverine in the first movie but if Kevin Fiege could make it work ok .
I think they will start the X-Men with Wolverine because Kevin Fiege doesnt like doing whats been done before & the first X-Men movie startednwith him not in it, they found him
They can start without wolverine but I’d advise they don’t as you said John he is the most popular character I’d say he doesn’t have to be the main character tho
They could perfectly start WITHOUT Wolverine, it's totally possible. BUT in the road of the new xmen movies they can slowly introduce him similar to what they did with Vision. Maybe in second or third movie they can put some supporting plot that eventually leads to the discovery of something called WEAPON X but for the surprise of Charles and the students it turns out to be a man, a man with adamantium claws. Both xmen and villian want this "weapon" to be in their team but in a third act wolverine ultimately joins the xmen and from there we can see the beginning of the love triangle with jean and Cyclops, and also this "rivalry" between him and Cyclops
imo rn the only characters you can’t start an x men franchise without would be magneto/prof x. there have been great x men comics, games, and even a movie without wolverine. he’s a great character and should be at the forefront of marvel but the x men have never needed him to thrive. for the sports people im basically saying he’s michael jordan and the x men are phil jackson
Wolverine is not the most popular x men character. He’s the most famous and known among general audiences because the fox films chose to put him Front and centre. But if you ask anyone who is not a general audience member, wolverine is way down the list terms of favourites. He’s cool, but he’s also one dimensional. Marvel would do well to understand why x-97 is doing so well. They have the dynamic and balance of the team nailed.
"Wolverine is way down the list in terms of favorites." Comic book sales and constantly being voted and popping up in a lot of people's top ten favorites would say otherwise. It's not just the Fox audience he's popular with. He's been constantly popular since the mid to late 90's 😂
For sure you COULD start X-Men off without Wolverine. You can also start FF4 with Shalla Ball as Silver Surfer instead of Norin Radd. I don't recommend either of those particularly, but sure... You could.
I personally am not a big X-men fan but my family is. To share my own general audience insight, even my own immigrant parents who know NOTHING about comics love the Wolverine, when they did X-men First Class they didn't show up but the absolutely went to watch Days of Future Past. I even had friends watch Days of Futures past without watching First Class, which funnily enough made them go back to watch the old X-men films that had Wolverine in it. That being said, they could start without him lol
Regarding the Mando movie casting you mentioned... There's reports now of Sigourney Weaver being in talks to join. Could this be the casting you implied? 🤔
They should do the original x-men team in the first movie with cyclops being front and center. Make sure they get the team dynamic right and a good story. Sort of like the first avengers movie. Maybe they would do a solo wolverine movie (maybe) in between the first two x men movie and have wolverine show up in the second and completely mess up the team dynamic right away trying to take Jean from cyclops 😂
Everyone says that Marvel needs to get back to making great movies, yet they shouldn't put Wolverine in the first movie to maximize the movie's potential? That is not smart movie business.
Right!? What is the infatuation with this one, specific great character, amongst the pantheon of other great characters in the X-men? Making Wolverine the focus AGAIN, has the huuuge potential to bore people. Like... maybe I would start to think... "does this genre, or even team, not have any other characters of note they can focus on?" That's sort of sad.
I could see wolverine coming into the second movie because right now we're dealing with Deadpool and wolverine. So maybe around the second movie a new wolverine will come into the group. And whoever's going to play him. Good luck. I mean it. Very good luck. In filling those boots.
John, i love ya dawg but i think u just love wolverine, cuz any TRUE x-men fan would kno & agree tht the fox-men were wolverine centric movies & everyother fan favorite x-man (storm, cyclops) literally got kno development or screen time & was barely in the action. I really dnt believe u think wolverine makes other people shine more at 10:33 lol cuz wolverine has been innnnn 6 x-men team movies??? annnnnd i would like to kno in which of those 6 films did the other main x-men shine around wolverine & didnt get legit shafted with screentime, power display, lines & action. I have no problem if they keep wolverine in the upcoming MCU if they do it like x-men 97 where ALL the characters are focused on instead of just one..... Thts not x-men.... tht shits just triflin lol
Wolverine wasn't even in the original X-Men in the comics, so yes. Also keep in mind Iron Man wasn't a popular Marvel super hero in the comics either, yet they headline him in the movies and it worked
Every X-men movie except dark phoenix has had wolverine, and only one X-men movie has flopped with the audience and box office, dark pheonix. I'm not counting new mutants cause that didn't have the x-men name on it.
I think since they did the avengers saga they should do the same with x men and have professor x in the nick fury role and at the end of every mutants movie who's gonna be the primary team of the xmen but he's bringing them to Westchester mansion then have the x men movie with them all
Yes they can. Would they though? Probably not. He's one of their hottest properties and one of their top cash cows. That would be like starting a new Avengers show without Iron Man or Hulk. Or doing a new Justice League show without Batman.
Wolverine (and Fassbender/Mckellan) carried the other films. But that's because everything else was pretty bad probably from being undeveloped. Keep Singer and Kinberg out of it and only hire fans who also have a record of good filmmaking both.
I don't want wolverine in the first X-Men MCU movie. Instead I want him in verses imagine seeing a poster of hulk on one side and wolverine on the other. I mean why wouldn't MCU do that? That's how he started in the comics
![Method Writing: The First Four Concepts - Jack Grapes [FULL INTERVIEW]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/ba9jAVzADY0/mqdefault.jpg)
X-Men: First Class did not have Wolverine, aside from the cameo.
I said the same exact thing. He does not have to be front and center of the X-Men
Yes and FC was a desperately needed fresh start to the X-Men franchise at the time.
Damn that's a good point cause I thought first class was good and you are able to watch it again
If an Xmen film CANNOT survive one or two films without Wolverine the writers have totally failed
It's about getting people interested in coming to the movies. Wolverine is your #1 draw. If you don't put him in it, you're sabotaging the writers and the producers would have totally failed. It isn't the writers job to get people to go to the movies. It's their job to write the best script possible.
@Gus_Magnus John is not concerned about real fans, he's worried about normies with shit taste who think wolverine is hot shit when he's an insect among the xmen roster.
My solution to this problem is to include wolverine but sideline him like xmen 97, and at the end, show the audience his place, a twig among gods.
@Gus_Magnus
I agree as a person who tired of Wolverine. I think First Class proves you can have a X-Men movie without Wolverine.
It needs to be an X-Men movie. And Cyclops needs to be “The X-Man”. As long as Wolverine can play in that formula there shouldn’t be a problem.
I believe the actual question should be will wolverine be the main character as opposed to having wolverine or not in xmen. Obviously u have to have wolverine.
Xmen 97 has done a great job focusing on other characters besides Wolverine. I hope the writers for the show can work on the movie.
They should properly adapt Cyclops as priority anyway
As a huge Wolverine fan I'd prefer that they start without him they need to do Cyclops justice first.
35 minute X men 97 is amazingggggggg
I would say that he would be a great side character for the new films.
Whether or not Wolverine is in it should depend COMPLETELY on the story being told. The beauty of the Xmen comics were that no one character was ever the main focus. They used to come in and out, some characters were more essential to certain stories and that’s what made Xmen beautiful to me growing up.
I think if they come with Wolverine upfront then the lead-in to the movie will be completely dominated by the 'new Wolverine actor' discourse, so I could see them taking some time to establish the X-Men first before getting to Wolverine for that reason. Plus, if you establish the MCU approach to X-Men first then a Wolverine that is different from Jackman might go over better too.
But yeah, if it was my money I'd start with Wolverine as well.
I think it’s fine if Wolverine there from the beginning. But, just like 97, he should be relegated to a supporting role for the MCU.
The focus should be on Cyclops and Jean. Primarily Scott since he’s the team leader, he believes in Xavier’s dream. He’s the Captain America of the X-Men.
But, equal focus should be on Storm, Beast, Rogue and Gambit. Characters who have appeared, but have rarely gotten a chance to shine. Not just in with their powers, but storytelling as well.
Cyclops is _the_ X-Man!
Not in the Fox Movie Universe !
I'd do a little bait and switch.
Cyclops solo movie, then a Weapon+ and Weapon× introduction in another project. Hint at/introduce Wolverine as a plot arc in X-Men film/other project, no solo, no main focus but a 'Hulk-like' secondary character. Put the emotional and character weight on Scott.
Would work for the rising tension with Sinister.
Bale's Batman already had a Joker, and his name was Heath Ledger. There is nothing to be gained from having him square off with Phoenix's Joker.
i love comparing the mcu to pro wrestling because that’s the perfect example of how to keep the storylines fresh and interesting as it evolves over time. kevin feige should look at what is being done in the wwe right now as the way to balance their characters.
For the last 10 plus years I don’t think marvels MCU has put much focus on popular characters and they been putting more focus on characters people might not know much about so I can see the doing the first X-men team and do a solo Wolverine movie like the comics did maybe by the second X-men movie Wolverine will join the X-men team
Speaking as an xmen movie fan id just want wolverine in a supporting role for the next xmen movies.
At the same time im sure he will get solo movies
“What yall wanna talk about wanna talk about X-men” Campea Show Boat 😂
The X men name will make it a billion dollar movie with or without Wolverine. I would consider the 2nd X men movie to be perfect for either a solo Wolverine movie or perhaps make him the villain before he join them.
Maybe even start with a Wolverine movie. They are going to put out multiple movies a year
... There will be time
Remember this is a UNIVERSE.... you're supposed to build towards large group movies. I say they should start Storm off in her own movie prior to joining.
They didn't just start with the AVENGERS. They started with Iron Man and Thor and Cap. B and C level marvel characters.
Starting the x men with them all together limits the franchise from being able to grow into a universe. That's part of the problem with the first X-Men movies.
Having Wolverine there or not was never the problem. They just need to allow other characters to shine the way they should. Fox were so stuck on putting him front and centre it started to frustrate me personally. In the comics and cartoons he actually adds a good dynamic to the team especially when he butts heads with Cyclops and Gambit.
I say hell yeah you can start X-Men without Wolverine! That's the route they went with First Class and it worked regardless of how the franchise turned out. He's not even the leader of the team and works just as well in a solo story. Not that he isn't important because he certainly is, but Wolverine does not have to be front and center of the X-Men.
But X-Men First Class was like the 5th movie in the franchise.
@@johncampea yea, but still First Class was basically a reboot of X-Men and there was no Wolverine
The first X-men team in the 60s never had Wolverine...Of course they could start the new team off without Logan. The X-Men is a team book/movie. Yes, they center on certain characters every now and then, and some are more popular than others, but over all it's about the team, not any individual.
Sigourney Weaver is reportedly in talks to join 'THE MANDALORIAN & GROGU' movie
In my opinion you don't need Wolverine to have a successful X-Men movie, but with the exception of Deadpool, I believe Wolverine is the only X-Man that can have a successful standalone film. I'm not saying they can't be good to great. I'm saying they can't be successful. None of them are close to as big of a name as Wolverine
dude! ngl, that tjcs cruise sounds awesome!
I think the MCU X-men can and should start without Wolverine. While the character is a huge draw with the fans i think the heart and soul of the group starts with Prof X and Magneto.
Just like the Infinity Saga revolved mainly aroind Tony and Cap.
It would be fun to see a series of films lead up to 'the big good guy' instead of a 'big bad guy' for a change.
Wolverine didn’t appear until 11 years after The X Men debuted in the comics
That is true but X-Men did not become popular until the next wave of members were introduced.
Introduction has nothing to do with it tho, there isn’t a single character in the X-men gallery that is as popular as Wolverine is
the mcu could reestablish what the x men are to main universe, and they could focus on Scott and jean relationship.
the first x men movie could have professor x, cyclops, marvel girl, beast, angel, storm, jubilee, and rouge.
the problem is wolverine has stolen the spotlight from the other members of the team for 25 years so let's see him avoided for 3 movies.
the mainstream audience has for the most part seen the fox movies so wolverine would be the most popular but the people who watch the animated shows or comics love the whole team.
Mr. sinister could be build up in the trilogy as the main villain obsessed with jean and Scott.
x men 2 could introduce gambit and ice man.
x men 2 could have the x men go to the savage lands to recruit ka Sar and zebu with Mr. sinister using Sauron as the villain to fight the x men.
gambit could be introduced as a villain sent by Mr. sinister to destroy the x men from the inside in x men 2.
iceman could be a new member introduced in x men 2.
gambit could change sides in the end of the movie joining the x men.
angel could be turned into arch angel in the third movie by Mr. sinister to fight against the x men.
apocalypse could be teased in x men 2 and x men 3.
beast could leave to join Soward in the end of x men 3.
jubilee could have turned 18 by the end of x men 3 and leave to be a hero own term.
angel could be on a journey of redemption at the end of x men 3 not under Mr. sinsters influence anymore leaving the x men as arch angel.
x men 4 could introduce wolverine, colossus, and shadow cat with magneto possibly being the main villain.
idk still would not put wolverine in the first movie but if Kevin Fiege could make it work ok .
I think they will start the X-Men with Wolverine because Kevin Fiege doesnt like doing whats been done before & the first X-Men movie startednwith him not in it, they found him
Should they stick closer to the comics in that Wolverine is not 6’3”… he’s 5’3”.
Please host an open mic discussion on what gunn's story plan for the DCU is he slowly building up for a justice league movie or what
They can start without wolverine but I’d advise they don’t as you said John he is the most popular character I’d say he doesn’t have to be the main character tho
They could perfectly start WITHOUT Wolverine, it's totally possible. BUT in the road of the new xmen movies they can slowly introduce him similar to what they did with Vision. Maybe in second or third movie they can put some supporting plot that eventually leads to the discovery of something called WEAPON X but for the surprise of Charles and the students it turns out to be a man, a man with adamantium claws. Both xmen and villian want this "weapon" to be in their team but in a third act wolverine ultimately joins the xmen and from there we can see the beginning of the love triangle with jean and Cyclops, and also this "rivalry" between him and Cyclops
imo rn the only characters you can’t start an x men franchise without would be magneto/prof x. there have been great x men comics, games, and even a movie without wolverine. he’s a great character and should be at the forefront of marvel but the x men have never needed him to thrive. for the sports people im basically saying he’s michael jordan and the x men are phil jackson
Wolverine is not the most popular x men character. He’s the most famous and known among general audiences because the fox films chose to put him
Front and centre.
But if you ask anyone who is not a general audience member, wolverine is way down the list terms of favourites. He’s cool, but he’s also one dimensional. Marvel would do well to understand why x-97 is doing so well. They have the dynamic and balance of the team nailed.
i would say he’s the most popular character that is in the x men but he is not the most popular x man.
"Wolverine is way down the list in terms of favorites." Comic book sales and constantly being voted and popping up in a lot of people's top ten favorites would say otherwise. It's not just the Fox audience he's popular with. He's been constantly popular since the mid to late 90's 😂
For sure you COULD start X-Men off without Wolverine. You can also start FF4 with Shalla Ball as Silver Surfer instead of Norin Radd. I don't recommend either of those particularly, but sure... You could.
I personally am not a big X-men fan but my family is. To share my own general audience insight, even my own immigrant parents who know NOTHING about comics love the Wolverine, when they did X-men First Class they didn't show up but the absolutely went to watch Days of Future Past. I even had friends watch Days of Futures past without watching First Class, which funnily enough made them go back to watch the old X-men films that had Wolverine in it. That being said, they could start without him lol
They can start with Wolverine, just don't push him in everyone's face, like fox did and deminish the rolls of the other members
Ok, John was way too nice, Bale's batman vs Joaquin's Joker is an epic mismatch. It wouldnt even make sense
Regarding the Mando movie casting you mentioned... There's reports now of Sigourney Weaver being in talks to join. Could this be the casting you implied? 🤔
They should do the original x-men team in the first movie with cyclops being front and center. Make sure they get the team dynamic right and a good story. Sort of like the first avengers movie. Maybe they would do a solo wolverine movie (maybe) in between the first two x men movie and have wolverine show up in the second and completely mess up the team dynamic right away trying to take Jean from cyclops 😂
Wolverine is to the X-men as Hulk is to the Avengers. You have to start strong with them…and then you can move them to a side character.
Everyone says that Marvel needs to get back to making great movies, yet they shouldn't put Wolverine in the first movie to maximize the movie's potential? That is not smart movie business.
Wolverine's a great character, but he's not the be all end all of the X-Men.
Right!? What is the infatuation with this one, specific great character, amongst the pantheon of other great characters in the X-men? Making Wolverine the focus AGAIN, has the huuuge potential to bore people.
Like... maybe I would start to think... "does this genre, or even team, not have any other characters of note they can focus on?" That's sort of sad.
John who would u like to see in the Avengers line up
I could see wolverine coming into the second movie because right now we're dealing with Deadpool and wolverine. So maybe around the second movie a new wolverine will come into the group. And whoever's going to play him. Good luck. I mean it. Very good luck. In filling those boots.
i hope they hold on wolverine personally
My parents are also really into these travel/food shows. I don't care for them.
even when wolverine does show. up in the Bryan singers x-men, the school already has other mutants there...
Start it without wolverine… add him to the team in the future
John, i love ya dawg but i think u just love wolverine, cuz any TRUE x-men fan would kno & agree tht the fox-men were wolverine centric movies & everyother fan favorite x-man (storm, cyclops) literally got kno development or screen time & was barely in the action. I really dnt believe u think wolverine makes other people shine more at 10:33 lol cuz wolverine has been innnnn 6 x-men team movies??? annnnnd i would like to kno in which of those 6 films did the other main x-men shine around wolverine & didnt get legit shafted with screentime, power display, lines & action.
I have no problem if they keep wolverine in the upcoming MCU if they do it like x-men 97 where ALL the characters are focused on instead of just one.....
Thts not x-men.... tht shits just triflin lol
Wolverine wasn't even in the original X-Men in the comics, so yes. Also keep in mind Iron Man wasn't a popular Marvel super hero in the comics either, yet they headline him in the movies and it worked
Every X-men movie except dark phoenix has had wolverine, and only one X-men movie has flopped with the audience and box office, dark pheonix.
I'm not counting new mutants cause that didn't have the x-men name on it.
I think since they did the avengers saga they should do the same with x men and have professor x in the nick fury role and at the end of every mutants movie who's gonna be the primary team of the xmen but he's bringing them to Westchester mansion then have the x men movie with them all
Kang they though?😉
You and Ryan Reynolds are on a texting basis, eh?
The girl from Civil War needs to be in more stuff. Same with girl from barbie and the girl from Witcher.
Yes they can. Would they though? Probably not. He's one of their hottest properties and one of their top cash cows. That would be like starting a new Avengers show without Iron Man or Hulk. Or doing a new Justice League show without Batman.
They can
Wolverine (and Fassbender/Mckellan) carried the other films. But that's because everything else was pretty bad probably from being undeveloped. Keep Singer and Kinberg out of it and only hire fans who also have a record of good filmmaking both.
I would love to have John do a podcast during his retirement regarding Theology and his views on the church. I always love his views on the topic.
Because he is the most popular, is why you don't
They couldn’t do married with children today
I don't want wolverine in the first X-Men MCU movie. Instead I want him in verses imagine seeing a poster of hulk on one side and wolverine on the other. I mean why wouldn't MCU do that? That's how he started in the comics
I'm kind of in a fuck Disney kinda mood. In this point of my life 😅😂
Sign me up for the John Campea cruise 🛳!