I don't want your damn iron ore, what the hell am I supposed to do with these? Demand to see Nauvis's manager! Make Nauvis rue the day it thought it could give the Engineer iron ore!
If you want to make a big number, calculate the cost of a piece of blue belt (bonus points if underground) with foundries and without them. difference is astronomical.
With normal processing, making a blue underground belt costs, with max prodmod 3s, 78.125 iron ore and 47.337 crude oil With foundries, it costs 10.396 iron ore and 31.558 crude oil Okay and 0.208 calcite
There is an additional factor to making LDS: productivity _research._ Steel, plastic, and LDS all have "infinite" research to increase their productivity. Due too the +300% productivity cap, it's possible to reach a point where the foundry doesn't actually add _any_ additional productivity to the recipe. This is also true for steel, so an postgame LDS build could honestly have casting iron into iron plates, smelting the iron in a furnace into steel, and then crafting the steel into LDS in an assembler. You just exploded a 1-step recipe into a 3-step recipe.
Electric furnaces deal with the same productivity cap, right? I don’t understand why we’d cast iron plates then smelt iron into steel in an electric furnace. Is it to ‘proc’ the 300% productivity twice and then a third time with the LDS? Just trying to follow along, pretend I’m dumb (cause I am)
@@TheSweetSpirit Only twice overall, plus 50-150% from the casting of iron plates, for a total of up to 27x the LDS per unit molten iron compared to casting LDS directly with no prod.
@@TheSweetSpiritcasting steel uses 30 molten iron to make 4 steel with 300% productivity, but that 30 molten iron could make up to 2.5x3 or 7.5 iron at 150% with four legendary modules, which could then make 6 steel at 300% productivity. Technically it still comes out ahead as long as you add at least 20% to the foundries productivity, though you do need to have spent an obscene amount of resources to get steel to 300% without foundries and high quality production modules.
True, but if you're not working on those researches (which you should, why the hell wouldn't you?!) for whatever reason, this is a pretty good setup if you can manage it. I would likely do this pre-300% prod bonus and just cut out the extra steps once they don't make a difference anymore.
If you are trying to make a base that uses the least resources from the ground to make the most science - yes, that would be better. If you are trying to make a base that uses the fewest buildings and in turn is the cheapest, smallest and most UPS efficient - it is much better to just mine more and use more molten metal, the recipes for melting ores is very fast. Copper and iron is basically free when you have so much productivity everywhere.
Another interesting application with molten metals on Nauvis is the sheer efficiency of just having a train network that uses molten iron/copper fluid wagons. A fluid wagon can carry 50000 units of molten iron and a cargo wagon can carry 4000 Iron plates. You'll notice that, with each Iron plate costing 10 molten iron, you get 5000 Iron plates per fluid wagon (with the 50% productivity bonus from foundries, it goes up to 7500!!!). This increases transport efficiency by 87.5%!!!! Not even mentioning that throughput in pipes was overhauled in 2.0 and has almost no bottlenecks compared to belts! Overall, this thing is busted, it certainly invites alot of people to visit vulcanus first, which is a good choice! However I will always prefer Gleba due to the Bio Labs.
Another advantage of using the foundry on Nauvis is the greatly increased throughput (for the same cost) of transporting liquid iron or copper vs transporting plates. Even if you use the worst-case for the foundry (20 units of liquid=3 plates), a pipe using just single sets of normal pumps, with 1200 liquid/s throughput, is effectively 180 plates/s, equivalent to a fully stacked blue belt, at far lower cost. And when we look at long-range transport, a fluid wagon with 50k molten iron or copper is equivalent to 7.5k plates, nearly twice the 4k plates that fit into a cargo wagon, and this just gets better for the molten metal transport if you are using the other more efficient recipes, or are using productivity modules.
...and then there are the big miners! One important point you didn't mention is that, once you've upgraded your resource tech on Nauvis, you can completely ignore it for *MUCH* longer, as the deposits take exponentially longer to deplete. (I just plaster each deposit with big miners bolstered with prod mods and 10 speedy-boi beacons each and let them do their thing. Bliss!)
in regards to foundries and LDS: use circuit networks to track buffer chests of your ores and plastics, and use control logic to select which system gets used on the fly, just like oil cracking, except for LDS being made from two different highly productive methods.
Ore patches barely run out later in the game - you already get 2x the resources with big miners (and 12.5x with legendary big miners). Mining productivity research is so cheap that you can strech out ore patches for a long time.
@@deadstones1depends on at which point you make the platform. It is damn cheap if you get steel with foundries. Of course it won't be on par with proper resource patch, but given how each platform can harvest many different resources and can have many, it could be a decent enough strategy on something like ultra deathworld or something
@@viperforty8450 This. Space platforms produce zero pollution so it saves on having to micro manage that (if you're worried about it) and also allows players to focus less on finding new ore patches to set a new mining facility up on, defend, transport, maintain, etc. It allows them to simply copy/paste a new platform when they can afford to build it to increase the output.
Fanatstic video as always! I knew foundaries were amazing but seeing the numbers laid out like this makes it obvious how absolutely nuts they are haha. (no wonder Biochambers are the black sheep lol) Hope the 10x science run is going well!
You missed that, just like LDS and copper cables, steel plates and iron sticks can _also_ be made more efficiently by first casting iron plates then putting those into a furnace or assembler to make the final item. For iron, this is only more efficient if you have quality Prod3 modules and some Steel Productivity research, while for iron sticks, putting *any* productivity on the assembler will be better.
My main reason to use the foundry is simplified layout and logistics. it's just so much simpler to manage molten iron and copper than huge swaths of plates to make steel and cables
At a certain point, i just move all production that can be done on vulcanus to vulcanus. All the nauvis science packs can be made there then shipped to nauvis to take advantage of biolabs. The only thing youre really missing that i can think of is biters and uranium.
I keep red, green and blue on Nauvis. The first two because they need so little resources anyway, blue because sulfur can only be done via coal liquefaction.
I built all of my science on vulcanus except for utility which goes on fulgora, because you only need to make electric engines which is very simple, and i have a ship that transports all the sciences except gleba's to nauvis. Then i deconstruct my entire nauvis base and remake it into a space platform construction hub and also biter egg production. On vulcanus i have a huge liquid bus that carries all the liquids i need and some belts for plastic and circuits, and the rest of the intermediates i make on site using molten copper and iron in foundries. This makes my bus incredibly small and i don't need to worry about iron or copper production because i can always slap down more molten production onto the same pipe. With infinite local resources, no expanding enemies and an easy planet science vulcanus is easily the best planet for science.
search for a mod "Visible Planets in Space" by Nauviax this mod will add an image of each planet when in orbit. then... because this original mod has a bad quality of image rendering, just search for "visible planets" and look for some add-on mod that upgrades the original with HD images. there is a lot of them to choose from... so you can experiment until you find one you like ;)
search for a mod "Visible Planets in Space" by Nauviax this mod will add an image of each planet when in orbit. then... because this original mod has a bad quality of image rendering, just search for "visible planets" and look for some add-on mod that upgrades the original with HD images. there is a lot of them to choose from... so you can experiment until you find one you like ;)
@@gasparliboreiro4572 I can only see the one I'm complaining about censorship. can you see the comment where I explain how to get the planets in the background?
Foundries are op. I set up quick 3600spm of the sciences required for mining and steel productivity on vulcanus. And yeah, even on nauvis I can easily output a fully stacked green belt using three foundries. With soooo much productivity, too... Molten metal bus is the way for the future
Note that just because something goes through fewer raw resources doesn’t mean that it is strictly better. If your goal is to use the fewest resources from the ground - sure, getting more productivity with electromagnetic plants and using assembling machines for LDS is better. But if your goal is to use the fewest buildings to get a certain amount of output - just mining more will use fewer buildings and resources to build.
one would think the devs balanced the game around using as few buildings as possible to save ups, though with all the optimizations maybe theres plenty of headroom
Therea not only the big buildings help tbh we have a lot of separeted power networks now too i have drops to 47 ups from time to time i use like 10k bots total and like 10 trains more or less
I have a small question, do more asteroids orbit on other planets? I mean just the safe starting area in the space without traveling. how does nauvis compare to the others?
This video was another amazing banger of the video :)) Also is the planets being in the background a mod? I've been looking for what does that and it looks super cool to look at
not op because you would have had to have gotten to a point where you can ship 5 capacity rockets of foundries back to other planets. same w EM plants. my first goal and planets are now fulgora and vulcanus for plants and foundries to export, before science even really. makes me get rockets goin too
also gotta factor in power costs to sustain multiple beaconed foundry lines at sustained consumption, thats a BEAST of a demand, something most players dont actually get to in their worlds imo
@AVADIIStrategy Build big factory on Navius isn't necessary, because it bad planet for mass production, Vulcan is superior. I think iron/cooper processing on Navius useless, easier way transfer all production and produce on base planet only biters eggs and labs.
With pipes 2.0 it’s more easier than ever making nuclear plants, I already boxes upon boxes of unused nuclear reactor and fuel cells anyways, power in Nauvis ain’t really a problem even if you don’t update your energy production with heating towers and of course, fission.
I agree... not only that it's inefficient but also you would need one for each planet. While at the same time you need to produce water on every ship anyway. Just make calcite as a byproduct and drop it (as needed) to every planet you pass by.
You didn't even have to specify "on Nauvis" in the title because the foundry is brutally op anywhere you go. 50% inbuilt prod? Nah it's 50% compounding prod because it also broke up the recipe into 2 steps. 4 belts of ore turn into 9 belts of plates before you add any modules thanks to this 1 tiny detail, you WILL feel the throughput limitations of belts until you get your ass to Gleba as soon as you place foundries anywhere because 60 items per second is just not enough for these beasts, it is easily the best building from any planet and it's not even close.
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Seeing the planet in space is a mod! -> mods.factorio.com/mod/visible-planets
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At the enrichment center we cast plates from liquid metal. Thats 261% more iron per iron!
I don't want your damn iron ore, what the hell am I supposed to do with these? Demand to see Nauvis's manager! Make Nauvis rue the day it thought it could give the Engineer iron ore!
"That's 65% more bullet per bullet" is all I can think of.
If you want to make a big number, calculate the cost of a piece of blue belt (bonus points if underground) with foundries and without them. difference is astronomical.
With normal processing, making a blue underground belt costs, with max prodmod 3s, 78.125 iron ore and 47.337 crude oil
With foundries, it costs 10.396 iron ore and 31.558 crude oil
Okay and 0.208 calcite
There is an additional factor to making LDS: productivity _research._ Steel, plastic, and LDS all have "infinite" research to increase their productivity. Due too the +300% productivity cap, it's possible to reach a point where the foundry doesn't actually add _any_ additional productivity to the recipe. This is also true for steel, so an postgame LDS build could honestly have casting iron into iron plates, smelting the iron in a furnace into steel, and then crafting the steel into LDS in an assembler. You just exploded a 1-step recipe into a 3-step recipe.
Electric furnaces deal with the same productivity cap, right? I don’t understand why we’d cast iron plates then smelt iron into steel in an electric furnace. Is it to ‘proc’ the 300% productivity twice and then a third time with the LDS? Just trying to follow along, pretend I’m dumb (cause I am)
@@TheSweetSpirit Only twice overall, plus 50-150% from the casting of iron plates, for a total of up to 27x the LDS per unit molten iron compared to casting LDS directly with no prod.
@@TheSweetSpiritcasting steel uses 30 molten iron to make 4 steel with 300% productivity, but that 30 molten iron could make up to 2.5x3 or 7.5 iron at 150% with four legendary modules, which could then make 6 steel at 300% productivity. Technically it still comes out ahead as long as you add at least 20% to the foundries productivity, though you do need to have spent an obscene amount of resources to get steel to 300% without foundries and high quality production modules.
True, but if you're not working on those researches (which you should, why the hell wouldn't you?!) for whatever reason, this is a pretty good setup if you can manage it. I would likely do this pre-300% prod bonus and just cut out the extra steps once they don't make a difference anymore.
If you are trying to make a base that uses the least resources from the ground to make the most science - yes, that would be better. If you are trying to make a base that uses the fewest buildings and in turn is the cheapest, smallest and most UPS efficient - it is much better to just mine more and use more molten metal, the recipes for melting ores is very fast. Copper and iron is basically free when you have so much productivity everywhere.
Another interesting application with molten metals on Nauvis is the sheer efficiency of just having a train network that uses molten iron/copper fluid wagons.
A fluid wagon can carry 50000 units of molten iron and a cargo wagon can carry 4000 Iron plates.
You'll notice that, with each Iron plate costing 10 molten iron, you get 5000 Iron plates per fluid wagon (with the 50% productivity bonus from foundries, it goes up to 7500!!!). This increases transport efficiency by 87.5%!!!! Not even mentioning that throughput in pipes was overhauled in 2.0 and has almost no bottlenecks compared to belts!
Overall, this thing is busted, it certainly invites alot of people to visit vulcanus first, which is a good choice! However I will always prefer Gleba due to the Bio Labs.
Another advantage of using the foundry on Nauvis is the greatly increased throughput (for the same cost) of transporting liquid iron or copper vs transporting plates. Even if you use the worst-case for the foundry (20 units of liquid=3 plates), a pipe using just single sets of normal pumps, with 1200 liquid/s throughput, is effectively 180 plates/s, equivalent to a fully stacked blue belt, at far lower cost. And when we look at long-range transport, a fluid wagon with 50k molten iron or copper is equivalent to 7.5k plates, nearly twice the 4k plates that fit into a cargo wagon, and this just gets better for the molten metal transport if you are using the other more efficient recipes, or are using productivity modules.
Lets gooo, another AVADII video!
...and then there are the big miners! One important point you didn't mention is that, once you've upgraded your resource tech on Nauvis, you can completely ignore it for *MUCH* longer, as the deposits take exponentially longer to deplete. (I just plaster each deposit with big miners bolstered with prod mods and 10 speedy-boi beacons each and let them do their thing. Bliss!)
Video not short, me happy
in regards to foundries and LDS: use circuit networks to track buffer chests of your ores and plastics, and use control logic to select which system gets used on the fly, just like oil cracking, except for LDS being made from two different highly productive methods.
I do this for a few different resources, especially in my on the fly builds for new surfaces
Those satellites are also an easy infinite source of iron ore, even if they are slower than mining.
Ore patches barely run out later in the game - you already get 2x the resources with big miners (and 12.5x with legendary big miners). Mining productivity research is so cheap that you can strech out ore patches for a long time.
platforms take like 250 iron per tile though. Surely a platform like that would take dozens of hours to pay off, no?
@@deadstones1depends on at which point you make the platform. It is damn cheap if you get steel with foundries. Of course it won't be on par with proper resource patch, but given how each platform can harvest many different resources and can have many, it could be a decent enough strategy on something like ultra deathworld or something
Making a self expanding platform is not hard.
@@viperforty8450 This. Space platforms produce zero pollution so it saves on having to micro manage that (if you're worried about it) and also allows players to focus less on finding new ore patches to set a new mining facility up on, defend, transport, maintain, etc. It allows them to simply copy/paste a new platform when they can afford to build it to increase the output.
Fanatstic video as always! I knew foundaries were amazing but seeing the numbers laid out like this makes it obvious how absolutely nuts they are haha. (no wonder Biochambers are the black sheep lol) Hope the 10x science run is going well!
You missed that, just like LDS and copper cables, steel plates and iron sticks can _also_ be made more efficiently by first casting iron plates then putting those into a furnace or assembler to make the final item. For iron, this is only more efficient if you have quality Prod3 modules and some Steel Productivity research, while for iron sticks, putting *any* productivity on the assembler will be better.
It's also way easier to pipe liquid metals all around your base, and on trains :)
Love these videos! Keep them coming!
My main reason to use the foundry is simplified layout and logistics. it's just so much simpler to manage molten iron and copper than huge swaths of plates to make steel and cables
My Nauvis bus had 4x iron and 2x for steel and Concrete,was condensed to a singular pipe in when I went to Vulcanus. damn
At a certain point, i just move all production that can be done on vulcanus to vulcanus. All the nauvis science packs can be made there then shipped to nauvis to take advantage of biolabs. The only thing youre really missing that i can think of is biters and uranium.
I keep red, green and blue on Nauvis. The first two because they need so little resources anyway, blue because sulfur can only be done via coal liquefaction.
I built all of my science on vulcanus except for utility which goes on fulgora, because you only need to make electric engines which is very simple, and i have a ship that transports all the sciences except gleba's to nauvis. Then i deconstruct my entire nauvis base and remake it into a space platform construction hub and also biter egg production. On vulcanus i have a huge liquid bus that carries all the liquids i need and some belts for plastic and circuits, and the rest of the intermediates i make on site using molten copper and iron in foundries. This makes my bus incredibly small and i don't need to worry about iron or copper production because i can always slap down more molten production onto the same pipe. With infinite local resources, no expanding enemies and an easy planet science vulcanus is easily the best planet for science.
0:25 why does nauvis display in the background????? that looks so cool!!
search for a mod "Visible Planets in Space" by Nauviax
this mod will add an image of each planet when in orbit.
then...
because this original mod has a bad quality of image rendering,
just search for "visible planets" and look for some add-on mod that upgrades the original with HD images.
there is a lot of them to choose from... so you can experiment until you find one you like ;)
search for a mod "Visible Planets in Space" by Nauviax
this mod will add an image of each planet when in orbit.
then...
because this original mod has a bad quality of image rendering,
just search for "visible planets" and look for some add-on mod that upgrades the original with HD images.
there is a lot of them to choose from... so you can experiment until you find one you like ;)
why is youtube deleting my comments?
@lastmanstanding5423 this one didn't
@@gasparliboreiro4572 I can only see the one I'm complaining about censorship.
can you see the comment where I explain how to get the planets in the background?
what's that mod that makes the planet you're orbitting around appear behind the space platform? its sooo pretty! 4:19
Visible planets.
@@Liwet. oh my gawd! so fast, thanks 💋
Foundries are op. I set up quick 3600spm of the sciences required for mining and steel productivity on vulcanus. And yeah, even on nauvis I can easily output a fully stacked green belt using three foundries. With soooo much productivity, too... Molten metal bus is the way for the future
You are the best factorio youtuber 🙏
Note that just because something goes through fewer raw resources doesn’t mean that it is strictly better. If your goal is to use the fewest resources from the ground - sure, getting more productivity with electromagnetic plants and using assembling machines for LDS is better. But if your goal is to use the fewest buildings to get a certain amount of output - just mining more will use fewer buildings and resources to build.
one would think the devs balanced the game around using as few buildings as possible to save ups, though with all the optimizations maybe theres plenty of headroom
Therea not only the big buildings help tbh we have a lot of separeted power networks now too i have drops to 47 ups from time to time i use like 10k bots total and like 10 trains more or less
Compared to fyrbaces, foundries in Nauvis are amazing. But if you conpare it to foubdries on Volcanus, its pretty pedestrian.
I have a small question, do more asteroids orbit on other planets? I mean just the safe starting area in the space without traveling. how does nauvis compare to the others?
This video was another amazing banger of the video :)) Also is the planets being in the background a mod? I've been looking for what does that and it looks super cool to look at
mod: 'visible planets' + 'valerian's planets'
Linear programming was invented for solving similar problems: When there are multiple ways for getting the same result, which is more economical.
Now include bringing iron and copper down from space vs mining and having to expand out to new mines.
Sir can you make train network guide ? You have best explanations I've seen so far!
what do you use to show the planet in the background
Im missing something... how many copper cable can you get from one chunk of copper in different configuration?
How do you have the planet in background of platform
Make video about electromagnetic plants!
You could use Linus Tech Tips style performance bar graphs to make things more clear
Hello! How did you turn on the display of planets on the background of space platforms? Is this a mod? Or is this a special version of the game?
it's a mod
@@DrewsOnFirst Can you give me name or link to this mod?
It's a mod called 'visible planets'
@AVADIIStrategy Thank you very much!
The only question is why would I do anything on Nauvis if I can do the same 10 times faster on Vulcanus with just a fraction of trains and miners.
not op because you would have had to have gotten to a point where you can ship 5 capacity rockets of foundries back to other planets. same w EM plants. my first goal and planets are now fulgora and vulcanus for plants and foundries to export, before science even really. makes me get rockets goin too
also gotta factor in power costs to sustain multiple beaconed foundry lines at sustained consumption, thats a BEAST of a demand, something most players dont actually get to in their worlds imo
Using foundries with -80% energy consumption is easily sustainable imho.
But yeah once you start using prod modules energy demand skyrockets.
@AVADIIStrategy Build big factory on Navius isn't necessary, because it bad planet for mass production, Vulcan is superior. I think iron/cooper processing on Navius useless, easier way transfer all production and produce on base planet only biters eggs and labs.
I mean, you need some /nu/power production. But at least on nauvis, the path is /clear/!
so overpowered you didnt even need to mention the basically infinite throughput of metals with pipes
Rip energy 💀
Nauvis = Fission power heaven. Just go nuts!
Nuclear has never been easier
With pipes 2.0 it’s more easier than ever making nuclear plants, I already boxes upon boxes of unused nuclear reactor and fuel cells anyways, power in Nauvis ain’t really a problem even if you don’t update your energy production with heating towers and of course, fission.
Thise giant calcite ships are a huge waste. Make a moving ship, you can collect 10x as much for 1/10th the materials and UPS cost.
I agree... not only that it's inefficient but also you would need one for each planet.
While at the same time you need to produce water on every ship anyway.
Just make calcite as a byproduct and drop it (as needed) to every planet you pass by.
Im gonna use these fo de-bottlenecking quality ore miners.
Anyone else going to make some Chaos Star / Black Fortress space stations now?
1 min ago is crazy
You didn't even have to specify "on Nauvis" in the title because the foundry is brutally op anywhere you go. 50% inbuilt prod? Nah it's 50% compounding prod because it also broke up the recipe into 2 steps. 4 belts of ore turn into 9 belts of plates before you add any modules thanks to this 1 tiny detail, you WILL feel the throughput limitations of belts until you get your ass to Gleba as soon as you place foundries anywhere because 60 items per second is just not enough for these beasts, it is easily the best building from any planet and it's not even close.
🥰