When setting a compressors attack and release, try watching how the gain reduction meter moves with the singers singing. You should SEE the meter moving more where you HEAR the singer gets louder and release at the same rate as the singer gets softer. In other words, your setting the compressor to react to the singer instead of guess on the milliseconds. Using your ear, you will get a more organic and transparent sounding compression. Think of of compressor as a time-based effect and then you can begin to understand how it can be used for tone control, and just volume, when used in conjunction with an EQ. So, with that said, do you EQ first or compress…. It really depends what you are trying to accomplish.
In my experience, compressor boosts back the EQ bands that you have already cut, or overly boosts the bands you have raised. Most of the time, I do compression first, then EQ
@@ayoutubecommenter3031 it is true that compressors can boost volume. But if you a compressor that has a high or low pass filter, you can tell the compressor to ignore the low muddy frequencies and have the compressor “boost” the upper harmonic frequencies. So really the idea is your working your compressor and EQ together to achieve a fuller clearer sound that fits better in the mix. As far as EQing first or last, the answer is, it depends. Though it wouldn’t be a bad idea to use a high pass filter (which is like a kind of EQ) before hitting the compressor 🙃
Heads up that all languages highlight diffrent syllables increasing pop and instruiment interference. Spanish worship music tends to have less room noise feedback but more pops and sits right in guitar and piano sweet spots.
Great content. In all honesty, I was looking for a video like this (applied to a DAW) but didn't so grateful to have found it. Simple, concise but also complete!
Great video for beginners. It is really easy to understand. I would recommend to experiment with some settings if you feel comfortable with the workflow he mentioned. 1. Try up to 3 frequencies to clean up the vocal. 2. Try out different attack settings for the compressor. 10 ms is really just a starting point. Try going up to 40 ms and see how it changes the sound. 3. Experiment a lot
Hey Kade, I think it’s important to mix in high resolution by having your fader set at 0. Volume of the overall mix should be controllers from the volume knobs on your speaker to reach the desired spl. If you set gain while your fader for the channel is somewhere at the bottom and then set your volume on speakers, your gain set across the signal chain might not be best optimised for the venue. Great job🙂
Great and simple tips - thanks for posting! Very useful even for an atheist like myself, who will be using these tips in the rehearsal room and at gigs - often far away from the nearest church... :)
Great explanation in simple terms. I am a newbie to this and so many other RUclipsrs use advanced terms without defining them. So Thank you. We have an SQ5 with slink going to our stem box. Is preamp the same as the input gain?
This is really good I learn every day more and more. We have to work also to develop our Skill to control all this Sounds, because there´s a lot of Factors that we have to think= Do We have really good Microphones? Who is singing? Professional or just Amateur? Place, etc.Today I was lerning just more. Thank you for this Video! It was wonderful!
As a soloist male singer with a baritone voice, I'll often put low cut at 80 or even 70hz. I can play around my lower vocal now without muddying them up. If I was in a full band I get 100 or 120 Hz cut off. If I'm also using a condensor or better quality microphone, I'll get the clearest and less distorted signal if I sing at least 1 or 2 inches from that mike. If I didn't know how to control my voice enough, I'd definitely get that low cut happening or reduced lower frequencies, if I'm mixing for a girl singer, I'll often boost certain lower frequencies to give their voice a warm rich tone. Not saying anything against your video or ideas, just how it best works for me in live setting.
A lot of that depends on the instrumentation.. If it's just vocals and guitar (or other not-bassy instrument), I leave a little more low end in the vocals for richness. If there's other instruments competing for, or demanding, low end, that's when I take it out of the vocals so they lay on top of the mix.
Only in a vocal booth where there are no other sources of audio behind your vocalist would you match your make-up gain to the amount of gain reduction. Doing so in a live environment only amplifies everything in between vocal phrases by your make-up gain. Those things can be guitar amps, drums, cymbals, and essentially everything else behind your vocalist/s. Since the days of tube compressors, the industry standard rule of thumb is to only apply HALF the amount of your gain reduction as make-up gain. In other words, if you need 4db of gain reduction to level out your vocalist, you only apply 2db of make-up gain as your initial starting point. Yes, you may end up needing a little more make-up, or a little less, but initially matching things up is a recipe for a considerably noisier mix.
In reference to setting gain, I have a keyboard input, and the gain setting is going to vary based on the volume knob setting on the keyboard. So the question arises, what should be the setting of the keyboard volume knob? On experimenting volume setting on the keyboard with respect to gain setting on the mixer (XR-18), with a piano with strings sound, I find that too low a volume setting while tweaking gain, produces a thin sound, and too high volume setting clips the sound. What should be a sweet spot?
Experiment with the low cut. You probably don't want to set it lower than 120hz though, as it will start coming through the subs at that point. Do you have any instruments carrying bass frequencies already (Bass, keyboard...)?
I cannot agree on applying HPF on every mic channel. It would be ideal in quick live mixing without rehearsal, but applying it in such high frequency above 120Hz will definitely lose warmth and volume of the vocal. When I am in a situation where I have no time to rehearse, I would put between 110Hz-130Hz, but less filter, better the sound. I put pop filters on mic first, and use HPF to its minimum.
Vocals don't need to occupy those frequencies in a live setting. Also don't need those frequencies bleeding into the mic from your instruments. We use these suggested settings on our vocals and they still have plenty of warmth.
Well, with such high-tech mixers, it may be easy. I'd like to see it done with a Yamaha mg10xu, for example, which is what we mortals on a budget have at home.
Thanks bro for the video.My voice is not very bass heavy & a bit thin & I usually try to boos more lows on it to get it punchier & deep.So by using a low cut filter will I not loose all the bass depth that I want? What do you say?
Thank you! I am taking this to our Sanctuary Mixer, however, will this improve our Live Stream sound? Actually the Live mix in the Sanctuary sounds really good but live stream is flat and lacks life.
It will, but there are probably other things that need fixing for a dull live stream. Check out some of our other live stream videos: ruclips.net/p/PLucKudksNlhYJH185Usil-PcxhJSUrJQJ&si=gg-HXwd8qee8uEzm Or check out our course that helps you dial in both in-person and live stream: collaborateworship.com/church-sound-made-simple/
boss, i know the basic of audio mixing and can manage a small band of event upto 200 people. i lack understanding of advanced concepts like gates and compression. would you offer a 1-1 on coaching?
Hi, I want to learn on vocal mastering. Got a Mackie mixer, 4 ch Berringer compressor/limiter, Berringer voice processor analog devices setup and a Audacity software installed in a laptop with a analog sound card. Will it work?
I agree and disagree of the first point. Firstly I agree as it is right what you mentioned. Secondly, I disagree as it is not compulsory to have it an inch away from your mouth. It clearly depends on the texture. People with boxy or muddy sound usually stand a little further, even 6 inches away depending on how you want the texture to sound. Going further away clearly means more gain to have a healthy signal beforehand.
In a studio setting, yes. Keep the mic a little further away to get the best tone from it. In a live scenario, it's usually best to keep it as close as possible to lower gain and reduce stage noise and potential feedback.
Pause, it should also never be any closer than an inch from the mouth. 3" is fine as long as it's pointed at the back of the throat. If you're too close, especially with a booming voice, you will overdrive the diaphragm and lose dynamic range.
It's a give and take with live sound. The reason we recommend no more than an inch is to reduce stage noise (by being able to lower gain) and to keep mic distance consistent when you're dealing with amateur musicians. Does a mic sound it's best a little further away? Yes. But it doesn't really matter if you are battling stage noise, feedback, and inconsistent placement.
I have a question and I hope you can answer it and I understand if you’re too busy and cannot; I have the Yamaha 5014X board- it has on board compression and EQ for a girls voice what would be comparable to ratio with the onboard system I have so she doesn’t squeal?
It's a give and take with live sound. The reason we recommend no more than an inch is to reduce stage noise (by being able to lower gain) and to keep mic distance consistent when you're dealing with amateur musicians. Does a mic sound it's best a little further away? Yes. But it doesn't really matter if you are battling stage noise, feedback, and inconsistent placement.
I present cheesy karaoke in pubs. the perfect environment for feedback because of drunks holding the microphone incorrectly and wondering around in front of the speakers. What ive found works best is finding the feedback point for the gain on the powered speaker, then racking it back a little. that stops most of the feedback loop between mic and speaker.
First of all thank you for the information. I'm sure this would make a night and day difference for our worship, but I have a concern and would appreciate your help. So, in my opinion, it would be difficult for me to make such adjustments live while they are rehearsing. I see that you are playing a recording and fixing their settings post performance. How do you do the recording?
You just need a computer that can run a DAW (Digital Audio Workspace), like Logic Pro, Pro Tools, Ableton Live, etc... You connect your mixer to the computer via the USB cable and record into the DAW and then send the recorded tracks back to the mixer. Another option is to set up a rehearsal on a day that isn't Sunday, so you can work on this stuff.
Strip it down to 1 thing on the stage, and what's the most important part (when it comes to music that an audience participates in, like worship)? Vocals. Drums are undoubtedly an important part of a "good mix" with a full band, but not the most important. You can have a song without them. Can't have a song without vocals. And people can't sing along very easily if they can't hear them. That's why we say vocals are most important.
Thanks, good and helpful comments for beginners. Every time I see someone using the X32 though I am so happy I got the Soundcraft Ui24R for our church some years ago. The interface is so much more intuitive and easier to use. Way more flexible, too. Some of our sound techs like to use their own tablets or tablet PCs and they can do that without even installing any software.
Thanks for a great video! I'd add a 3rd point for mic placement: "Don't place your hand over the antenna". It shouldn't have that much of an effect if the receivers are well-placed or in an interference-free area, but its worth considering.
Keeping the mic no more than an inch from the mouth will definitely help (overall gain will be lower). You can also use a mic/capsule with a tighter pickup pattern than a standard cardioid. Do everything you can physically to limit the amount of drum noise making it to the mic. Otherwise, you will have to reduce gain until there isn't feedback (Not optimal).
@@collabworship Thanks man! got a gig coming up and don't have a in house sound engineer so I'm watching your videos. I'm the drummer and dont have a lot of chances to adjust the mix while playing. might be a rough one lol
What do you do if you set the gain in the right level, but your fader won’t reach 0db, and is much lower than 0? Do you leave the fader where it is? Or do you reduce the gain to bring the fader to close to 0db?
There's no need for the fader to be at 0 (also referred to as unity). Zero is just your mark for the volume at baseline, not being cut or boosted (based on the gain level). Cutting the volume from zero is ok. It doesn't have to be at 0.
By and large achieving a proper level using gain is far more important than where your fader is set. However, fader position isn’t entirely arbitrary either. Because the dB scale on faders is logarithmic (meaning the level of adjustment over a given span is not the same throughout the entire range of the fader) having faders close to 0 is still preferable. Just not at the expense of gain/signal level. Being around 0 allows for finer adjustments to your levels than if your fader is down around, say -40 dB. If ALL of your faders are very low with proper gain settings, it likely means you have “too much PA” for your room.
On most analogue mixers you have at least an adjustable mid frequency. To sweep you turn the lvl of the mids up and then change the frequency of the mids. Depending on the console, you might be able to do this also with the lows and highs, but if you're unlucky you might not be able to do it at all, if you have fixed frequencies for each region. Then you would try to find the sweet spot with what you're given.
Some of my best recordings have been with mic input gain 60-70% increasing clarity and about 5 inches away from mouth I sure hope your expertise doesn’t come from 10 minutes of mastering vocals 🤔
Co I am confused about your mic placement tip. I never have my mic that close to a singer (1inch). Also don’t have the singer holding the mic. I use a condenser mic with a pop screen at 6 inches. I do this to avoid the low end buildup from proximity effect. What am I missing here?
I get that the mic should be no further than 1 inch, but what if i have a small group of live 5 or 6 people singing next to each other? I gave a condenser mic and the distance fron the singers to the mic is about 60-70 cm, i think aroud 27 inches. What should i do?
If you're using condenser mics, that might be your problem. They are typically more sensitive than dynamic mics and pick up more of their surroundings. You probably want to go for a dynamic microphone with a super-cardioid pattern (as long as you don't have floor wedges right in front of the vocalists).
@@collabworship Ive got an analog mixer and we know microphones produce weak electrical signals, and one of the reasons I purchased a mic preamplifier is that I wanted that signal level coming from the microphone to boost it up. So, dont think a compressor may be necessary here because we dont want to limit that signal from the microphone, right?
@@237311 Less of a "limiting the signal gain" and more of "limiting dynamic range" Do you ever struggle getting enough volume with vocals without it getting too loud on their loudest notes?
hello i have a question... in my church the part of drum like cymbals and the tom is in different channel... the cymbals sound always change in every song... sometimes its too sharp, sometimes it doesnt have the loud sound... why is that happening? is that because of the drummer change itself? or else?y'all are allowed to give your opinion .thank you in advanced....
You need to use some makeup gain but it's usually all about what flavour do you want, just play around with it and search tutorials for compressor applications in live sound reinforcement ✌️I for one would recommend more of an 3-4 db makeup gain
There are no real hard and fast rules. What you’re hearing in this video are just recommendations. But the reason he chose 6 dB of gain on the compressor is because he was targeting 6 dB of gain reduction with the compressor. So what’s happening overall is that you’re reducing the loudest portions of the audio signal by 6 dB, and then boosting the compressed signal by the 6 dB you’ve lost. The result is that your signal is just as loud, but the volume difference between the quietest and loudest sounds is reduced.
Could I do half of the make up gain and use the fader to adjust for the rest of it? or is the point to never move my vocal fader in the mix ever?@@rhinobart
@@caleconrad2332 well, you’re kind of talking about two different things. So you COULD push your fader up to get an equivalent volume increase, but gain (and make up gain on the compressor) are different, mostly because of where they occur in the signal chain internally. The idea is to get a nominal gain level as early in the signal chain as possible, as it impacts everything later in the chain (EQ, FX, other dynamics processing depending on exactly what you’re talking about, and even things like monitors, streams, or recording if you’re running those off the same console). So you want to send the fullest, cleanest signal possible to those later stages. However the fader occurs essentially at the end of the signal chain. So ultimately, while you may again get an equivalent increase in volume, you’re negatively impacting everything between the compressor and the fader. Now that’s not to say that you absolutely have to apply the same amount of makeup gain as the level of compression. You don’t absolutely have to do anything. But that’s a pretty good target to be around as a general rule of thumb.
For compressing singing mics on an X32 I'm using attack 28 ms, release 450 ms, peak, with high pass side chain at 250 Hz ... Anything faster than that and the sound of the vocals can become harsh because of how the attack stage is shaping the waveform, and it generally just sounds over processed. I'll often bring up the soft knee to 3. This also greatly reduces the proximity effect. For speech mics, same settings, with release at 750 ms, and sometimes soft knee at 5, and ratio at 5:1. This allows the board operator to rarely need to touch the faders between someone cupping the microphone at their belly button, and someone eating the mic. Of course you also need a high pass at 170 Hz or so, and if you have wedges with that much gain potential, you gotta ring em out and nothing wrong with active feedback mitigation for them. Try it out, and see what you think. The lack of harshness at more intense parts is stunning. This is part of the key to great sound on a large system. The other is dynamic EQ on everything, and well... That's another big reason people own DiGiCo boards, and why they sound great. Relaxed compression, and dynamic EQs. Free plugins on a computer can solve this with an X32.
Exactly this slower attack and release will mimic the smooth opto vibe and sounds way better than the settings this guy recommends. only do the fast settings he uses if you have the ability to use two compressors so you can use the faster settings for gentle peak limiting
The 6db that Kade talked about in the video isn’t for make up gain. It’s for gain reduction; the amount by which the compressor reduces the signal when it’s at its loudest.
@@vaundelbrackin7548 Actually, at 7:55 Kade does set the make-up gain to +6db, before he goes into setting the threshold (where he talks about reducing the gain by around 6db). @pswim62 I'm an amateur on this stuff as well, but I agree that a constant 6db of make-up gain might be a bit much. Considering you're reducing by a maximum of 6db in the loudest parts, I find I often add around 3db back in, if any. I regularly just ride the faders as needed. But as I said, I'm an amateur and don't know if using make-up gain has other benefits.
The make up gain isn't that important. It doesn't change the sound. It just makes sure that you have enough signal after the compression. Depending on what you are compressing, you will need that make up gain. Or you can use it when you are compressing different things differently so your faders all behave the same way. But it's totally up to you.
You can set makeup gain to whatever works for your situation. In my case, adding 6dB of makeup gain gets the level back to where I want it. If gain and amps are set correctly, this will put your lead vocal fader at about 0dB.
Makeup gain is making up for the gain reduction so it should be set to bring the level back up to where it was before compression. If the target is 6db of gain reduction, 6db makeup gain should be close. Don’t use the makeup gain to boost the signal much more though, if you need to do that, you probably need to go back and adjust your input gain on the preamp. I’ve seen improper use of the gate and compressor gains by untrained users causing feedback issues. Proper gain structure is important.
You're in luck! We have all kinds of resources for the X32! When you look around our RUclips content, you'll find that nearly all of our past video are demonstrated on an X32. We also have a mastery course on the X32 that you can check out here: collaborateworship.com/x32-mastery/
When setting a compressors attack and release, try watching how the gain reduction meter moves with the singers singing. You should SEE the meter moving more where you HEAR the singer gets louder and release at the same rate as the singer gets softer. In other words, your setting the compressor to react to the singer instead of guess on the milliseconds. Using your ear, you will get a more organic and transparent sounding compression. Think of of compressor as a time-based effect and then you can begin to understand how it can be used for tone control, and just volume, when used in conjunction with an EQ.
So, with that said, do you EQ first or compress…. It really depends what you are trying to accomplish.
In my experience, compressor boosts back the EQ bands that you have already cut, or overly boosts the bands you have raised. Most of the time, I do compression first, then EQ
@@ayoutubecommenter3031 it is true that compressors can boost volume. But if you a compressor that has a high or low pass filter, you can tell the compressor to ignore the low muddy frequencies and have the compressor “boost” the upper harmonic frequencies. So really the idea is your working your compressor and EQ together to achieve a fuller clearer sound that fits better in the mix.
As far as EQing first or last, the answer is, it depends. Though it wouldn’t be a bad idea to use a high pass filter (which is like a kind of EQ) before hitting the compressor 🙃
Speaking of vocal mixes, your voice sounds impeccable in this video
Sennheiser MKH 50 👌🏻
I was just about to write that there is an upleasant low resonance in his voice, which is ironic given the topic of the video :)
@@ekredel Stuffy nose unfortunately...
This content in Spanish would be great for Hispanic churches, God bless you
Ask the brother permission to make a review video in Spanish and you can do it yourself :) GBY
You could open the "settings" of this video and turn on sub titles in Spanish
Heads up that all languages highlight diffrent syllables increasing pop and instruiment interference. Spanish worship music tends to have less room noise feedback but more pops and sits right in guitar and piano sweet spots.
Great content. In all honesty, I was looking for a video like this (applied to a DAW) but didn't so grateful to have found it. Simple, concise but also complete!
One of the rare videos explained easy, clearly and understandable... Kudos!!!
Thank you...understanding the difference between gain, volume and compression is hugely important. Your explanation is clear, simple and concise.
Great to hear!
Love the symplicity.
Great video for beginners. It is really easy to understand.
I would recommend to experiment with some settings if you feel comfortable with the workflow he mentioned.
1. Try up to 3 frequencies to clean up the vocal.
2. Try out different attack settings for the compressor. 10 ms is really just a starting point. Try going up to 40 ms and see how it changes the sound.
3. Experiment a lot
Agreed! Experimentation (during rehearsal, not live) is the best way to train your ear.
@@collabworshipis the only way to experiment. Please do not practice during service guys.
Thank you so much. I’m learning a lot from you. Today sounds was much better at our church.
🙌
Thank you. Everyone needs to see this. Can’t stand a “bassy” mic. So easy to fix
Simplicity is the key...you are blessed...thanks for your simple explanation
Hey Kade, I think it’s important to mix in high resolution by having your fader set at 0. Volume of the overall mix should be controllers from the volume knobs on your speaker to reach the desired spl. If you set gain while your fader for the channel is somewhere at the bottom and then set your volume on speakers, your gain set across the signal chain might not be best optimised for the venue. Great job🙂
Great vid. Im not a sound tech but the principles you touched on is whats helped me with vocals in the past. Im Glad i wasnt to far off.
You definitely got my bro because they made me the engineer/Drummer
There are some really useful ideas here. I don’t have a console or need for mixing live but every tip will help when mixing in my DAW. THX
Thanks lot 🎤😎 pozdrav iz Bosne
Great and simple tips - thanks for posting! Very useful even for an atheist like myself, who will be using these tips in the rehearsal room and at gigs - often far away from the nearest church... :)
Glad it helped!
Great explanation in simple terms. I am a newbie to this and so many other RUclipsrs use advanced terms without defining them. So Thank you. We have an SQ5 with slink going to our stem box. Is preamp the same as the input gain?
This is really good I learn every day more and more. We have to work also to develop our Skill to control all this Sounds, because there´s a lot of Factors that we have to think= Do We have really good Microphones? Who is singing? Professional or just Amateur? Place, etc.Today I was lerning just more. Thank you for this Video! It was wonderful!
Thamks for the subtitle in spanish😅😅❤Gracias por los Subtitulo en Español😂
Thanks. clear and concise without the usual verbiage.
As a soloist male singer with a baritone voice, I'll often put low cut at 80 or even 70hz. I can play around my lower vocal now without muddying them up. If I was in a full band I get 100 or 120 Hz cut off. If I'm also using a condensor or better quality microphone, I'll get the clearest and less distorted signal if I sing at least 1 or 2 inches from that mike. If I didn't know how to control my voice enough, I'd definitely get that low cut happening or reduced lower frequencies, if I'm mixing for a girl singer, I'll often boost certain lower frequencies to give their voice a warm rich tone. Not saying anything against your video or ideas, just how it best works for me in live setting.
A lot of that depends on the instrumentation.. If it's just vocals and guitar (or other not-bassy instrument), I leave a little more low end in the vocals for richness. If there's other instruments competing for, or demanding, low end, that's when I take it out of the vocals so they lay on top of the mix.
Agree on the “at least” 1-2 inches away from the mic.
Merci beaucoup pour vos vidéos
love you brother thanks for the lesson, i appreciate your calm video, clean video and fast tip
Hi there,
What about the high frequencies in the EQ? How should they be set?
Nice video!
All the best
For simplicity, bless you back🙏🏼
Only in a vocal booth where there are no other sources of audio behind your vocalist would you match your make-up gain to the amount of gain reduction. Doing so in a live environment only amplifies everything in between vocal phrases by your make-up gain. Those things can be guitar amps, drums, cymbals, and essentially everything else behind your vocalist/s. Since the days of tube compressors, the industry standard rule of thumb is to only apply HALF the amount of your gain reduction as make-up gain. In other words, if you need 4db of gain reduction to level out your vocalist, you only apply 2db of make-up gain as your initial starting point. Yes, you may end up needing a little more make-up, or a little less, but initially matching things up is a recipe for a considerably noisier mix.
In reference to setting gain, I have a keyboard input, and the gain setting is going to vary based on the volume knob setting on the keyboard. So the question arises, what should be the setting of the keyboard volume knob? On experimenting volume setting on the keyboard with respect to gain setting on the mixer (XR-18), with a piano with strings sound, I find that too low a volume setting while tweaking gain, produces a thin sound, and too high volume setting clips the sound. What should be a sweet spot?
Thank you! Very clear and easy to use method! 🎶😎
One of the best recording videos I've seen!
Um... Its about live sound.
Nice video tnx
Question, for a bass male vocal, the low cut is the same?? And the eq??FX??
Experiment with the low cut. You probably don't want to set it lower than 120hz though, as it will start coming through the subs at that point. Do you have any instruments carrying bass frequencies already (Bass, keyboard...)?
I cannot agree on applying HPF on every mic channel. It would be ideal in quick live mixing without rehearsal, but applying it in such high frequency above 120Hz will definitely lose warmth and volume of the vocal. When I am in a situation where I have no time to rehearse, I would put between 110Hz-130Hz, but less filter, better the sound. I put pop filters on mic first, and use HPF to its minimum.
Vocals don't need to occupy those frequencies in a live setting. Also don't need those frequencies bleeding into the mic from your instruments.
We use these suggested settings on our vocals and they still have plenty of warmth.
You're one awesome, humble dude. Thanks for all you do
Happy to help!
Well, with such high-tech mixers, it may be easy. I'd like to see it done with a Yamaha mg10xu, for example, which is what we mortals on a budget have at home.
Thanks bro for the video.My voice is not very bass heavy & a bit thin & I usually try to boos more lows on it to get it punchier & deep.So by using a low cut filter will I not loose all the bass depth that I want? What do you say?
The deep voice behind YOUR voice is scary
Thank you! I am taking this to our Sanctuary Mixer, however, will this improve our Live Stream sound? Actually the Live mix in the Sanctuary sounds really good but live stream is flat and lacks life.
It will, but there are probably other things that need fixing for a dull live stream. Check out some of our other live stream videos: ruclips.net/p/PLucKudksNlhYJH185Usil-PcxhJSUrJQJ&si=gg-HXwd8qee8uEzm
Or check out our course that helps you dial in both in-person and live stream: collaborateworship.com/church-sound-made-simple/
Always great videos! Thanks man
this is all great when you have a digital desk.. but what about a simple analogue desk which has a simple compressor knob and 3 band eq...
You would need outboard gear to accomplish the same thing.
I have a Studiolive 16 series 3. What would be the equivalent of the PEQ button? Would it just be one of the 4 eq gain knobs on the fat channel?
Hi sir I'm from South India.
We are using behringer XR16 mixer at my Church.
Where I'm lern proper mixing.
Check out our other content! We have a lot of videos that you can apply to any mixer. Even the XR16.
Very concise explanation ! ❤💯👍🏾
Great to hear!
boss, i know the basic of audio mixing and can manage a small band of event upto 200 people. i lack understanding of advanced concepts like gates and compression. would you offer a 1-1 on coaching?
Check out our course content. Has everything your looking for with premium support included: collaborateworship.com/church-sound-made-simple/
Great video. For beginners or pros
Hi, I want to learn on vocal mastering. Got a Mackie mixer, 4 ch Berringer compressor/limiter, Berringer voice processor analog devices setup and a Audacity software installed in a laptop with a analog sound card. Will it work?
Thanks for the Compression Settings 🙏🏾🙏🏾🙏🏾🫡🫡🫡
I agree and disagree of the first point.
Firstly I agree as it is right what you mentioned.
Secondly, I disagree as it is not compulsory to have it an inch away from your mouth. It clearly depends on the texture. People with boxy or muddy sound usually stand a little further, even 6 inches away depending on how you want the texture to sound.
Going further away clearly means more gain to have a healthy signal beforehand.
In a studio setting, yes. Keep the mic a little further away to get the best tone from it. In a live scenario, it's usually best to keep it as close as possible to lower gain and reduce stage noise and potential feedback.
Pause, it should also never be any closer than an inch from the mouth. 3" is fine as long as it's pointed at the back of the throat. If you're too close, especially with a booming voice, you will overdrive the diaphragm and lose dynamic range.
It's a give and take with live sound. The reason we recommend no more than an inch is to reduce stage noise (by being able to lower gain) and to keep mic distance consistent when you're dealing with amateur musicians.
Does a mic sound it's best a little further away? Yes. But it doesn't really matter if you are battling stage noise, feedback, and inconsistent placement.
Awesome video! Great job 👏🏼
thank you for this advice, ill use it bro...
Thank you!!!
Thank you,
Many blessings sir
Simple and easy to follow
Thank you
I have a question and I hope you can answer it and I understand if you’re too busy and cannot; I have the Yamaha 5014X board- it has on board compression and EQ for a girls voice what would be comparable to ratio with the onboard system I have so she doesn’t squeal?
shure beta58 recommended placement length is 15cm
It's a give and take with live sound. The reason we recommend no more than an inch is to reduce stage noise (by being able to lower gain) and to keep mic distance consistent when you're dealing with amateur musicians.
Does a mic sound it's best a little further away? Yes. But it doesn't really matter if you are battling stage noise, feedback, and inconsistent placement.
I present cheesy karaoke in pubs. the perfect environment for feedback because of drunks holding the microphone incorrectly and wondering around in front of the speakers.
What ive found works best is finding the feedback point for the gain on the powered speaker, then racking it back a little. that stops most of the feedback loop between mic and speaker.
Thank you, sir.
How can I increase gain for proper structure without getting feedback?
Thanks a lot👍👍👍🙏
First of all thank you for the information. I'm sure this would make a night and day difference for our worship, but I have a concern and would appreciate your help.
So, in my opinion, it would be difficult for me to make such adjustments live while they are rehearsing. I see that you are playing a recording and fixing their settings post performance. How do you do the recording?
You just need a computer that can run a DAW (Digital Audio Workspace), like Logic Pro, Pro Tools, Ableton Live, etc... You connect your mixer to the computer via the USB cable and record into the DAW and then send the recorded tracks back to the mixer.
Another option is to set up a rehearsal on a day that isn't Sunday, so you can work on this stuff.
Regarding eq, I can’t hear a difference after the eq was applied. What did it fix exactly?
The EQ shown in the video is cutting out mids that sound "nasally". It's subtle change. You're more likely to hear with headphones or decent speakers.
Drums are most important
Strip it down to 1 thing on the stage, and what's the most important part (when it comes to music that an audience participates in, like worship)? Vocals.
Drums are undoubtedly an important part of a "good mix" with a full band, but not the most important. You can have a song without them. Can't have a song without vocals. And people can't sing along very easily if they can't hear them.
That's why we say vocals are most important.
Quick disclaimer.Not all mics needs HPP.Some have already build one mechanical or electronical in it😅
Thank you 🙏
Would these principles work with recording as well or would this be separate entirely?
These principles don't translate over to studio work very well.
In the compressor why is the reason to set HOLD to low?
Thanks, good and helpful comments for beginners. Every time I see someone using the X32 though I am so happy I got the Soundcraft Ui24R for our church some years ago. The interface is so much more intuitive and easier to use. Way more flexible, too. Some of our sound techs like to use their own tablets or tablet PCs and they can do that without even installing any software.
Thanks for a great video!
I'd add a 3rd point for mic placement: "Don't place your hand over the antenna". It shouldn't have that much of an effect if the receivers are well-placed or in an interference-free area, but its worth considering.
For sure! Great tip.
I need PERFECT vocals
How do you avoid Feedback when introducing the makeup gain on the Compressor if say you are playing in a small venue with a loud drummer?
Keeping the mic no more than an inch from the mouth will definitely help (overall gain will be lower). You can also use a mic/capsule with a tighter pickup pattern than a standard cardioid.
Do everything you can physically to limit the amount of drum noise making it to the mic. Otherwise, you will have to reduce gain until there isn't feedback (Not optimal).
@@collabworship Thanks man! got a gig coming up and don't have a in house sound engineer so I'm watching your videos. I'm the drummer and dont have a lot of chances to adjust the mix while playing. might be a rough one lol
@@NateStice You got this! 💪🏻
What do you do if you set the gain in the right level, but your fader won’t reach 0db, and is much lower than 0? Do you leave the fader where it is? Or do you reduce the gain to bring the fader to close to 0db?
There's no need for the fader to be at 0 (also referred to as unity). Zero is just your mark for the volume at baseline, not being cut or boosted (based on the gain level). Cutting the volume from zero is ok. It doesn't have to be at 0.
By and large achieving a proper level using gain is far more important than where your fader is set. However, fader position isn’t entirely arbitrary either.
Because the dB scale on faders is logarithmic (meaning the level of adjustment over a given span is not the same throughout the entire range of the fader) having faders close to 0 is still preferable. Just not at the expense of gain/signal level. Being around 0 allows for finer adjustments to your levels than if your fader is down around, say -40 dB.
If ALL of your faders are very low with proper gain settings, it likely means you have “too much PA” for your room.
I always assume if you can't make out the words- you have nothing to say
Hi kade good day😊
Can you just tell me how to do frequency sweeping in an analogue mixer?
Thanks.
On most analogue mixers you have at least an adjustable mid frequency. To sweep you turn the lvl of the mids up and then change the frequency of the mids. Depending on the console, you might be able to do this also with the lows and highs, but if you're unlucky you might not be able to do it at all, if you have fixed frequencies for each region. Then you would try to find the sweet spot with what you're given.
What @buelow123 said!
Hmmm ! Better just read the manual before regarding vu representation ! Each mixer is different! 😅
Some of my best recordings have been with mic input gain 60-70% increasing clarity and about 5 inches away from mouth I sure hope your expertise doesn’t come from 10 minutes of mastering vocals 🤔
This is about "LIVE" sound.
I have the Behringer xr18 and compression setup is different, do you have a video for that?
It looks different, but all the principles are the same.
Using the PC software, all these things are very easy rather than the phone/ipod software.
Co I am confused about your mic placement tip. I never have my mic that close to a singer (1inch). Also don’t have the singer holding the mic. I use a condenser mic with a pop screen at 6 inches. I do this to avoid the low end buildup from proximity effect. What am I missing here?
This is in reference to live sound.
I get that the mic should be no further than 1 inch, but what if i have a small group of live 5 or 6 people singing next to each other? I gave a condenser mic and the distance fron the singers to the mic is about 60-70 cm, i think aroud 27 inches. What should i do?
If you're using condenser mics, that might be your problem. They are typically more sensitive than dynamic mics and pick up more of their surroundings. You probably want to go for a dynamic microphone with a super-cardioid pattern (as long as you don't have floor wedges right in front of the vocalists).
Nice...but where the hell is my reverb??? I sound so dry.
Is the compressor suitable for live vocal performances such as band or karaoke?
This video is in regards to live vocals, so yes!
@@collabworship Can you explain more in detail how a compressor is helping in that regard?
@@237311 It's basically just limiting how loud the vocal can get so that you can push it's level higher without loud parts becoming overwhelming.
@@collabworship Ive got an analog mixer and we know microphones produce weak electrical signals, and one of the reasons I purchased a mic preamplifier is that I wanted that signal level coming from the microphone to boost it up. So, dont think a compressor may be necessary here because we dont want to limit that signal from the microphone, right?
@@237311 Less of a "limiting the signal gain" and more of "limiting dynamic range"
Do you ever struggle getting enough volume with vocals without it getting too loud on their loudest notes?
Can you do some work on an analog mixer please
Sorry, we don’t have plans for any analog mixer content at the moment.
On your compression cheat sheet you have the hold at 20ms? why do you set it to nothing on this video?
You are not going to notice a difference between 0 and 20ms. Recommended settings are not a hard and fast rule. Just a starting point.
hello i have a question... in my church the part of drum like cymbals and the tom is in different channel... the cymbals sound always change in every song... sometimes its too sharp, sometimes it doesnt have the loud sound... why is that happening? is that because of the drummer change itself? or else?y'all are allowed to give your opinion .thank you in advanced....
An electronic drum kit I'm guessing? Sounds like the drummer is changing sounds. Have you asked them?
What's up with joy? Sounds like there's a brick wall there... Receiver clipping?
We need someone to do this or translate this for the presonus series iii
We might have some Presonus content coming out next year.
Awesome
excellent
is there a benefit to putting the "gain" to +6? or using that gain setting at all?
You need to use some makeup gain but it's usually all about what flavour do you want, just play around with it and search tutorials for compressor applications in live sound reinforcement ✌️I for one would recommend more of an 3-4 db makeup gain
There are no real hard and fast rules. What you’re hearing in this video are just recommendations. But the reason he chose 6 dB of gain on the compressor is because he was targeting 6 dB of gain reduction with the compressor.
So what’s happening overall is that you’re reducing the loudest portions of the audio signal by 6 dB, and then boosting the compressed signal by the 6 dB you’ve lost. The result is that your signal is just as loud, but the volume difference between the quietest and loudest sounds is reduced.
Could I do half of the make up gain and use the fader to adjust for the rest of it? or is the point to never move my vocal fader in the mix ever?@@rhinobart
@@caleconrad2332 well, you’re kind of talking about two different things. So you COULD push your fader up to get an equivalent volume increase, but gain (and make up gain on the compressor) are different, mostly because of where they occur in the signal chain internally.
The idea is to get a nominal gain level as early in the signal chain as possible, as it impacts everything later in the chain (EQ, FX, other dynamics processing depending on exactly what you’re talking about, and even things like monitors, streams, or recording if you’re running those off the same console). So you want to send the fullest, cleanest signal possible to those later stages. However the fader occurs essentially at the end of the signal chain. So ultimately, while you may again get an equivalent increase in volume, you’re negatively impacting everything between the compressor and the fader.
Now that’s not to say that you absolutely have to apply the same amount of makeup gain as the level of compression. You don’t absolutely have to do anything. But that’s a pretty good target to be around as a general rule of thumb.
Just use a studio track and have the "artist " pantomime
For compressing singing mics on an X32 I'm using attack 28 ms, release 450 ms, peak, with high pass side chain at 250 Hz ... Anything faster than that and the sound of the vocals can become harsh because of how the attack stage is shaping the waveform, and it generally just sounds over processed. I'll often bring up the soft knee to 3. This also greatly reduces the proximity effect.
For speech mics, same settings, with release at 750 ms, and sometimes soft knee at 5, and ratio at 5:1. This allows the board operator to rarely need to touch the faders between someone cupping the microphone at their belly button, and someone eating the mic. Of course you also need a high pass at 170 Hz or so, and if you have wedges with that much gain potential, you gotta ring em out and nothing wrong with active feedback mitigation for them.
Try it out, and see what you think. The lack of harshness at more intense parts is stunning. This is part of the key to great sound on a large system. The other is dynamic EQ on everything, and well... That's another big reason people own DiGiCo boards, and why they sound great. Relaxed compression, and dynamic EQs. Free plugins on a computer can solve this with an X32.
Exactly this slower attack and release will mimic the smooth opto vibe and sounds way better than the settings this guy recommends. only do the fast settings he uses if you have the ability to use two compressors so you can use the faster settings for gentle peak limiting
What mic did you use to record this?thanks for sharing.
I think it was a Sennheiser e835.
Were you talking about for the talking head stuff, or the singing example? The talking head mic is a Sennheiser MKH50.
I’m sure it’s the Sennheiser MKH 50. Sounds great.
It's a killer microphone. Worth every penny.@@PointFortinSDAChurch
Awesome
Very cool looking mixer!
So if I don't have a digital board what the 4main free on vocal to cut ur boost?
Cut 200-400 Hz, 5-800 Hz, 1-3kz depending on the room
And boost over 5-8kz
I'm an amateur for sure, so I don't really understand the 6dB output gain in the compressor. Just seems hot for makeup gain...
The 6db that Kade talked about in the video isn’t for make up gain. It’s for gain reduction; the amount by which the compressor reduces the signal when it’s at its loudest.
@@vaundelbrackin7548 Actually, at 7:55 Kade does set the make-up gain to +6db, before he goes into setting the threshold (where he talks about reducing the gain by around 6db).
@pswim62 I'm an amateur on this stuff as well, but I agree that a constant 6db of make-up gain might be a bit much. Considering you're reducing by a maximum of 6db in the loudest parts, I find I often add around 3db back in, if any. I regularly just ride the faders as needed. But as I said, I'm an amateur and don't know if using make-up gain has other benefits.
The make up gain isn't that important. It doesn't change the sound. It just makes sure that you have enough signal after the compression. Depending on what you are compressing, you will need that make up gain. Or you can use it when you are compressing different things differently so your faders all behave the same way. But it's totally up to you.
You can set makeup gain to whatever works for your situation. In my case, adding 6dB of makeup gain gets the level back to where I want it. If gain and amps are set correctly, this will put your lead vocal fader at about 0dB.
Makeup gain is making up for the gain reduction so it should be set to bring the level back up to where it was before compression. If the target is 6db of gain reduction, 6db makeup gain should be close. Don’t use the makeup gain to boost the signal much more though, if you need to do that, you probably need to go back and adjust your input gain on the preamp. I’ve seen improper use of the gate and compressor gains by untrained users causing feedback issues. Proper gain structure is important.
i am from africa and i need this course how can u help me sir
collaborateworship.com/contact/
Shoot us an email and we can work on a currency conversion for you.
I just purchased a x32. And can’t find help
You're in luck! We have all kinds of resources for the X32! When you look around our RUclips content, you'll find that nearly all of our past video are demonstrated on an X32. We also have a mastery course on the X32 that you can check out here: collaborateworship.com/x32-mastery/
Eq fist or compressor fist?
Eq🫣
Wireless mic sentivity
What those of us who don’t know these digital boards?
Principles still apply, you're just going to have to use outboard gear to accomplish it.